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New Articles (June 13 to July 3)

Main page: Wikipedia:WikiProject Video games/New article announcements
 A listing of all articles newly added to the Video Games Wikiproject (regardless of creation date). Generated by v3.12 of the RecentVGArticles script and posted by PresN. Bug reports and feature requests are appreciated. --PresN 15:26, 6 July 2022 (UTC)
Like, literally 100+ categories, mostly old ones tagged by Ser Amantio di Nicolao on June 19

Video games set in 1951 by Dimadick, CrossFire (video game series) by Zxcvbnm, Guild (video game series) by Zxcvbnm, World Video Game Hall of Fame by Oknazevad, Games with GameCube-GBA connectivity by (Oinkers42), Screenshots of Xbox Series X/S games by Rhain (newly tagged - originally created 8 months ago), Video games written by Kotaro Uchikoshi by Mika1h, Esports teams disestablished in 2022 by Pbrks, Simon & Schuster Interactive games by Zxcvbnm, Simulation video games by series by Mika1h, Video games written by Chris Metzen by Mika1h, Esports teams disestablished in 2020 by Pbrks (newly tagged - originally created 16 days ago), 1955 video games by Phediuk (newly tagged - originally created 11 months ago), 1970s interactive fiction by EmphasisMine (newly tagged - originally created 7 years ago), 1980s interactive fiction by EmphasisMine (newly tagged - originally created 7 years ago), 1990s interactive fiction by EmphasisMine (newly tagged - originally created 7 years ago), 2.5D fighting games by UKER (newly tagged - originally created 5 months ago), 2000s interactive fiction by EmphasisMine (newly tagged - originally created 7 years ago), 2010s interactive fiction by EmphasisMine (newly tagged - originally created 7 years ago), 2011 multiplayer online battle arena tournaments by Hugo999 (newly tagged - originally created 1 year ago), 2012 multiplayer online battle arena tournaments by Hugo999 (newly tagged - originally created 1 year ago), 2013 multiplayer online battle arena tournaments by Hugo999 (newly tagged - originally created 1 year ago), 2014 multiplayer online battle arena tournaments by Hugo999 (newly tagged - originally created 1 year ago), 2015 multiplayer online battle arena tournaments by Hugo999 (newly tagged - originally created 1 year ago), 2016 multiplayer online battle arena tournaments by Hugo999 (newly tagged - originally created 1 year ago), 2017 fighting game tournaments by BrownHairedGirl (newly tagged - originally created 5 years ago), 2018 Overwatch League season by Pbrks (newly tagged - originally created 3 years ago), 2018 fighting game tournaments by Spiderjerky (newly tagged - originally created 4 years ago), 2018 first-person shooter tournaments by Afrogindahood (newly tagged - originally created 4 years ago), 2019 Overwatch League season by Pbrks (newly tagged - originally created 3 years ago), 2019 fighting game tournaments by S-1-5-7 (newly tagged - originally created 3 years ago), 2019 first-person shooter tournaments by Pichpich (newly tagged - originally created 3 years ago), 2019 multiplayer online battle arena tournaments by Spiderjerky (newly tagged - originally created 2 years ago), 2020 Overwatch League season by Pbrks (newly tagged - originally created 2 years ago), 2020 first-person shooter tournaments by Pbrks (newly tagged - originally created 2 years ago), 2020 multiplayer online battle arena tournaments by Yue (newly tagged - originally created 2 years ago), 2021 Overwatch League season by Pbrks (newly tagged - originally created 1 year ago), 2021 first-person shooter tournaments by Betseg (newly tagged - originally created 1 year ago), 2021 multiplayer online battle arena tournaments by Yue (newly tagged - originally created 1 year ago), 2022 Overwatch League season by Pbrks (newly tagged - originally created 4 months ago), 2022 first-person shooter tournaments by Alyo (newly tagged - originally created 2 months ago), 2022 multiplayer online battle arena tournaments by Pbrks (newly tagged - originally created 5 months ago), 2023 in video gaming by Mirela63 (newly tagged - originally created 5 months ago), 2023 video games by Mirela63 (newly tagged - originally created 5 months ago), 2K (company) by Ridwan97 (newly tagged - originally created 1 month ago), 4Kings by Prisencolin (newly tagged - originally created 6 years ago), ATV Offroad Fury by Ariel el pleb (newly tagged - originally created 3 years ago), Activision competitions by Pbrks (newly tagged - originally created 2 years ago), Against All authority players by Prisencolin (newly tagged - originally created 5 years ago), Alien (franchise) game images by StarTrekker (newly tagged - originally created 4 years ago), Alien Breed by Cacodemon90 (newly tagged - originally created 1 year ago), Alliance of Valiant Arms teams by Prisencolin (newly tagged - originally created 6 years ago), Android-based video game consoles by Mbrickn (newly tagged - originally created 1 month ago), Apex Legends by Pbrks (newly tagged - originally created 26 days ago), Apex Legends competitions by Pbrks (newly tagged - originally created 25 days ago), Apex Legends teams by Pbrks (newly tagged - originally created 6 months ago), Arcade video games with multi-monitor setups by Pointless Filler (newly tagged - originally created 12 months ago), Arena of Valor teams by Yue (newly tagged - originally created 3 years ago), Atlanta Reign by Pbrks (newly tagged - originally created 2 years ago), Aura (video game series) by Ariel el pleb (newly tagged - originally created 4 years ago), Auto battler video games by EchoBlu (newly tagged - originally created 2 years ago), Bandai Namco Holdings subsidiaries by Ariel el pleb (newly tagged - originally created 2 years ago), Belgian esports players by Lankyant (newly tagged - originally created 3 months ago), Black Butler by Ariel el pleb (newly tagged - originally created 3 years ago), Blizzard Entertainment competitions by Pbrks (newly tagged - originally created 2 years ago), Blockchain games by Audacity (newly tagged - originally created 3 years ago), Bongfish games by Madmarioni (newly tagged - originally created 8 months ago), Boston Uprising by Pbrks (newly tagged - originally created 2 years ago), Browser-only games by CoolingGibbon (newly tagged - originally created 1 month ago), Browser game developers by Thisisarealusername (newly tagged - originally created 11 months ago), Bulgarian male video game actors by 20SS00 (newly tagged - originally created 11 months ago), Bulgarian people in the video game industry by 20SS00 (newly tagged - originally created 11 months ago), Bulgarian video game actors by 20SS00 (newly tagged - originally created 11 months ago), Bullet hell video games by ExplorerX19 (newly tagged - originally created 2 years ago), CDV Software Entertainment games by Waxworker (newly tagged - originally created 17 days ago), Call of Duty League by Pbrks (newly tagged - originally created 2 years ago), Call of Duty League seasons by Brandon Downes (newly tagged - originally created 1 year ago), Call of Duty League seasons by team by Brandon Downes (newly tagged - originally created 1 year ago), Call of Duty League teams by Pbrks (newly tagged - originally created 2 years ago), Campeonato Brasileiro de League of Legends teams by Yue (newly tagged - originally created 2 years ago), Cancelled browser games by CoolingGibbon (newly tagged - originally created 10 months ago), Capcom arcade system boards by Mbrickn (newly tagged - originally created 1 month ago), Catan by ArmbrustBot (newly tagged - originally created 8 years ago), Championship Gaming Series by Prisencolin (newly tagged - originally created 6 years ago), Chengdu Hunters by Pbrks (newly tagged - originally created 2 years ago), Chiptune musical groups by AdamBMorgan (newly tagged - originally created 7 years ago), Clay animation video games by Americanfreedom (newly tagged - originally created 1 year ago), Clutch Gaming players by Yue (newly tagged - originally created 2 years ago), Codename: Panzers by Ariel el pleb (newly tagged - originally created 4 years ago), Coffee Stain Studios games by Ariel el pleb (newly tagged - originally created 3 years ago), College esports in the United States by Pbrks (newly tagged - originally created 2 years ago), Cotton (series) by 这个那 (newly tagged - originally created 6 months ago), Counter-Strike coaches by Pbrks (newly tagged - originally created 1 month ago), Croc (series) by Nall (newly tagged - originally created 6 months ago), Crossover beat 'em ups by Sc2353 (newly tagged - originally created 19 days ago), Crossover fighting games by Mclay1 (newly tagged - originally created 7 months ago), Crystal Key by Ariel el pleb (newly tagged - originally created 3 years ago), Cute 'em ups by ExplorerX19 (newly tagged - originally created 2 years ago), Cute 'em ups by series by ExplorerX19 (newly tagged - originally created 2 years ago), Cyberathlete Professional League by Prisencolin (newly tagged - originally created 6 years ago), DRX (esports) players by Intolerable situation (newly tagged - originally created 6 months ago), Dallas Fuel by Pbrks (newly tagged - originally created 2 years ago), Dark Fall by Ariel el pleb (newly tagged - originally created 4 years ago), DeNA franchises by Ariel el pleb (newly tagged - originally created 3 years ago), De Blob by Ariel el pleb (newly tagged - originally created 4 years ago), Defunct Activision subsidiaries by Ridwan97 (newly tagged - originally created 3 years ago), Defunct and inactive Gears of War teams by KuHEJx3LCb (newly tagged - originally created 3 years ago), Defunct and inactive Halo (franchise) teams by KuHEJx3LCb (newly tagged - originally created 3 years ago), Defunct and inactive Hearthstone teams by Prisencolin (newly tagged - originally created 5 years ago), Defunct and inactive Heroes of Newerth teams by Prisencolin (newly tagged - originally created 5 years ago), Defunct and inactive PlayerUnknown's Battlegrounds teams by Yue (newly tagged - originally created 3 years ago), Defunct and inactive Tom Clancy's Rainbow Six Siege teams by Yue (newly tagged - originally created 7 months ago), Defunct and inactive esports teams by Prisencolin (newly tagged - originally created 6 years ago), Defunct and inactive fighting game player sponsors by UltraDark (newly tagged - originally created 5 years ago), Defunct esports competitions by Pbrks (newly tagged - originally created 2 years ago), Defunct esports governing bodies by Pbrks (newly tagged - originally created 2 years ago), Desperados (video game series) by Ariel el pleb (newly tagged - originally created 4 years ago), Digital Millennium Copyright Act case law by Lquilter (newly tagged - originally created 8 years ago), Digital rights management for macOS by Glenn (newly tagged - originally created 8 years ago), Dignitas (esports) players by Yue (newly tagged - originally created 2 years ago), Dissociative identity disorder in video games by Gilgamesh~enwiki (newly tagged - originally created 11 months ago), Dontnod Entertainment by Nice Stories (newly tagged - originally created 1 month ago), Dota coaches by Pbrks (newly tagged - originally created 1 month ago), Double Fine games by Kanghuitari (newly tagged - originally created 9 months ago), DreamHack events by Pbrks (newly tagged - originally created 2 years ago), ELeague competitions by Pbrks (newly tagged - originally created 2 years ago), ESL (company) competitions by Pbrks (newly tagged - originally created 2 years ago), ESL One Counter-Strike competitions by Pbrks (newly tagged - originally created 2 years ago), ESL One Dota 2 competitions by Pbrks (newly tagged - originally created 2 years ago), ESL Pro League by Pbrks (newly tagged - originally created 2 years ago), Echo Fox by Prisencolin (newly tagged - originally created 6 years ago), Elements (esports) players by Yue (newly tagged - originally created 2 years ago), Envy Gaming by Pbrks (newly tagged - originally created 2 years ago), Esports at multi-sport events by Pbrks (newly tagged - originally created 2 years ago), Esports at the 2021 Southeast Asian Games by Vinhson27 (newly tagged - originally created 2 months ago), Esports at the Asian Games by Sports2021 (newly tagged - originally created 8 months ago), Esports at the Asian Indoor and Martial Arts Games by Sports2021 (newly tagged - originally created 8 months ago), Esports businesspeople by Pbrks (newly tagged - originally created 1 year ago), Esports by country by Cydebot (newly tagged - originally created 6 years ago), Esports competitions by organizer by Pbrks (newly tagged - originally created 2 years ago), Esports competitions in India by Pbrks (newly tagged - originally created 2 years ago), Esports competitions in Ukraine by Afrogindahood (newly tagged - originally created 4 years ago), Esports competitions in the Philippines by Hariboneagle927 (newly tagged - originally created 4 years ago), Esports competitions in the United States by Cydebot (newly tagged - originally created 6 years ago), Esports executives and administrators by Pbrks (newly tagged - originally created 1 year ago), Esports governing bodies by Pbrks (newly tagged - originally created 2 years ago), Esports in France by Pbrks (newly tagged - originally created 2 years ago), Esports in Kenya by Davykamanzi (newly tagged - originally created 7 months ago), Esports in Vietnam by Alphama (newly tagged - originally created 1 year ago), Esports in the United Kingdom by Pbrks (newly tagged - originally created 2 years ago), Esports in the United States by Cydebot (newly tagged - originally created 6 years ago), Esports leagues by Pbrks (newly tagged - originally created 2 years ago), Esports mass media by Pbrks (newly tagged - originally created 2 years ago), Esports teams based in Argentina by Yue (newly tagged - originally created 2 years ago), Esports teams based in Australia by Yue (newly tagged - originally created 3 years ago), Esports teams based in Belgium by Yue (newly tagged - originally created 2 years ago), Esports teams based in Canada by Yue (newly tagged - originally created 3 years ago), Esports teams based in Europe by Prisencolin (newly tagged - originally created 5 years ago), Esports teams based in Hong Kong by Yue (newly tagged - originally created 3 years ago), Esports teams based in India by Yue (newly tagged - originally created 1 year ago), Esports teams based in Indonesia by Yue (newly tagged - originally created 3 years ago), Esports teams based in Italy by Nehme1499 (newly tagged - originally created 5 months ago), Esports teams based in Los Angeles by Laurel Wreath of Victors (newly tagged - originally created 3 years ago), Esports teams based in Peru by Azurex120 (newly tagged - originally created 2 years ago), Esports teams based in South Africa by Yue (newly tagged - originally created 3 years ago), Esports teams based in South America by Azurex120 (newly tagged - originally created 2 years ago), Esports teams based in Spain by MrCheese76 (newly tagged - originally created 2 years ago), Esports teams based in Uruguay by Onwa (newly tagged - originally created 2 months ago), Esports teams based in Vietnam by Yue (newly tagged - originally created 3 years ago), Esports teams disestablished in 2021 by Pbrks (newly tagged - originally created 1 year ago), Esports teams established in 2012 by Yue (newly tagged - originally created 3 years ago), Esports teams established in 2013 by Years of Establishments (newly tagged - originally created 3 years ago), Esports teams established in 2014 by Years of Establishments (newly tagged - originally created 3 years ago), Esports teams established in 2015 by Years of Establishments (newly tagged - originally created 3 years ago), Esports teams established in 2016 by Years of Establishments (newly tagged - originally created 3 years ago), Esports teams established in 2017 by Years of Establishments (newly tagged - originally created 3 years ago), Esports teams established in 2018 by Gjs238 (newly tagged - originally created 3 years ago), Esports teams established in 2019 by Pbrks (newly tagged - originally created 2 years ago), Esports teams established in 2020 by Yue (newly tagged - originally created 2 years ago), Esports teams established in 2021 by Yue (newly tagged - originally created 1 year ago), Esports tournaments by Pbrks (newly tagged - originally created 2 years ago), Esports venues by Pbrks (newly tagged - originally created 2 years ago), Esports venues by country by Pbrks (newly tagged - originally created 2 years ago), Esports venues in Canada by Pbrks (newly tagged - originally created 2 years ago), Esports venues in China by Pbrks (newly tagged - originally created 2 years ago), Esports venues in France by Pbrks (newly tagged - originally created 2 years ago), Esports venues in Germany by Pbrks (newly tagged - originally created 2 years ago), Esports venues in South Korea by Pbrks (newly tagged - originally created 2 years ago), Esports venues in Washington, D.C. by Pbrks (newly tagged - originally created 2 years ago), Esports venues in the United Kingdom by Pbrks (newly tagged - originally created 2 years ago), Esports venues in the United States by Pbrks (newly tagged - originally created 2 years ago), Esports venues in the United States by state by Pbrks (newly tagged - originally created 2 years ago), Eve Online battles by 3family6 (newly tagged - originally created 2 years ago), Evil Geniuses by Prisencolin (newly tagged - originally created 6 years ago), Existentialist video games by ReneeWrites (newly tagged - originally created 30 days ago), Fictional English people in video games by Shih Ming-teh (newly tagged - originally created 4 months ago), Fighting game player sponsors by Prisencolin (newly tagged - originally created 6 years ago), First-person shooter tournaments by Pbrks (newly tagged - originally created 5 months ago), Florida Mayhem by Pbrks (newly tagged - originally created 2 years ago), Fnatic by Prisencolin (newly tagged - originally created 6 years ago), Fnatic coaches by Yue (newly tagged - originally created 2 years ago), Former Activision subsidiaries by Ridwan97 (newly tagged - originally created 3 years ago), Formula 1 (board game) by Arb (newly tagged - originally created 7 years ago), Fortnite teams by Pbrks (newly tagged - originally created 6 months ago), Game designer stubs by The Banner (newly tagged - originally created 1 month ago), Gaming computers by Kattimattinen (newly tagged - originally created 1 month ago), Gaming laptops by Kattimattinen (newly tagged - originally created 1 month ago), Golden Guardians players by Yue (newly tagged - originally created 2 years ago), Good-Feel games by Pointless Filler (newly tagged - originally created 2 months ago), Granblue Fantasy by Ariel el pleb (newly tagged - originally created 3 years ago), Grand Theft Auto mods by CoolingGibbon (newly tagged - originally created 2 months ago), Guangzhou Charge by Pbrks (newly tagged - originally created 2 years ago), Halfbrick Studios games by G-Toasty (newly tagged - originally created 3 months ago), Halo (franchise) element redirects to lists by TAnthony (newly tagged - originally created 4 years ago), Hangzhou Spark by Pbrks (newly tagged - originally created 2 years ago), Hegemony (video game series) by KR777 (newly tagged - originally created 1 month ago), Heroes of Newerth teams by Prisencolin (newly tagged - originally created 6 years ago), Horizon Zero Dawn by Gonnym (newly tagged - originally created 1 year ago), Houston Outlaws by Pbrks (newly tagged - originally created 2 years ago), IOS jailbreaks by Feminist (newly tagged - originally created 2 years ago), Immersive sims by OceanHok (newly tagged - originally created 8 months ago), Immortals Gaming Club by Pbrks (newly tagged - originally created 2 years ago), Imperium Galactica by Ariel el pleb (newly tagged - originally created 4 years ago), Indian esports players by Bamyers99 (newly tagged - originally created 3 years ago), Insomniac Games games by Kanghuitari (newly tagged - originally created 9 months ago), International esports competitions by host by BrownHairedGirl (newly tagged - originally created 3 years ago), International esports competitions hosted by Malaysia by BrownHairedGirl (newly tagged - originally created 3 years ago), International esports competitions hosted by South Korea by Gjs238 (newly tagged - originally created 3 years ago), International esports competitions hosted by Ukraine by Afrogindahood (newly tagged - originally created 4 years ago), International esports competitions hosted by the United States by Afrogindahood (newly tagged - originally created 4 years ago), Internet shogi servers by Ish ishwar (newly tagged - originally created 4 years ago), Irem arcade system boards by Mbrickn (newly tagged - originally created 1 month ago), Italian male video game actors by User No. 99 (newly tagged - originally created 3 years ago), KT Rolster by Intolerable situation (newly tagged - originally created 6 months ago), Kenyan esports players by Davykamanzi (newly tagged - originally created 7 months ago), Kenyan people in the video game industry by Davykamanzi (newly tagged - originally created 7 months ago), Keywords Studios by Ridwan97 (newly tagged - originally created 10 months ago), Kingdom Hearts original characters by Nigoyyakot (newly tagged - originally created 5 months ago), Konami arcade system boards by Mbrickn (newly tagged - originally created 1 month ago), LGBT-related controversies in video games by Jgp1999 (newly tagged - originally created 11 months ago), League of Legends: Wild Rift teams by Dwaynex18 (newly tagged - originally created 11 months ago), League of Legends Champions Korea by Nidaloove (newly tagged - originally created 2 years ago), League of Legends Continental League teams by Yue (newly tagged - originally created 3 years ago), League of Legends Japan League teams by Yue (newly tagged - originally created 3 years ago), League of Legends competitions by seasons by Punfixmoscero (newly tagged - originally created 4 years ago), Lego Legends of Chima by Dennis Fry (newly tagged - originally created 4 years ago), Lips (video game) by StarTrekker (newly tagged - originally created 1 month ago), Lists of songs in music video games by StarTrekker (newly tagged - originally created 1 month ago), London Spitfire by Pbrks (newly tagged - originally created 2 years ago), Los Angeles Gladiators by Pbrks (newly tagged - originally created 2 years ago), Los Angeles Valiant by Pbrks (newly tagged - originally created 2 years ago), Luigi by Kanghuitari (newly tagged - originally created 2 years ago), MacSoft games by Kanghuitari (newly tagged - originally created 9 months ago), Major League Gaming by Pbrks (newly tagged - originally created 2 years ago), Major League Gaming competitions by Pbrks (newly tagged - originally created 2 years ago), Mario (franchise) character redirects to lists by UnitedStatesian (newly tagged - originally created 1 year ago), MeetYourMakers by Prisencolin (newly tagged - originally created 6 years ago), MiHoYo by Easterlies (newly tagged - originally created 3 months ago), Microdigital Eletrônica by Paraguassuu (newly tagged - originally created 2 months ago), Mid-Season Invitational by Gultejp (newly tagged - originally created 1 year ago), Middle-earth (film franchise) video games by StarTrekker (newly tagged - originally created 1 month ago), Midway pinball machines by Tochni (newly tagged - originally created 6 years ago), Minecraft in popular culture by SWinxy (newly tagged - originally created 8 months ago), Misfits Gaming players by Yue (newly tagged - originally created 1 year ago), Mobile Legends: Bang Bang teams by Dwaynex18 (newly tagged - originally created 2 years ago), Morteshka games by Betakiller (newly tagged - originally created 6 months ago), Multiplayer online battle arena tournaments by Pbrks (newly tagged - originally created 5 months ago), Music by video game franchise by StarTrekker (newly tagged - originally created 1 month ago), Mysterious Journey by Ariel el pleb (newly tagged - originally created 4 years ago), NBA 2K League by DylanFaraci98 (newly tagged - originally created 3 years ago), NRG Esports by Prisencolin (newly tagged - originally created 5 years ago), NYXL by Pbrks (newly tagged - originally created 3 months ago), Nacon by Ridwan97 (newly tagged - originally created 1 month ago), Neighbours from Hell by Ariel el pleb (newly tagged - originally created 4 years ago), New York Excelsior by Pbrks (newly tagged - originally created 2 years ago), Nijisanji by Daiichi1 (newly tagged - originally created 1 year ago), Nvidia products by Ushkin N (newly tagged - originally created 5 years ago), Oculus Quest by Martin Kraus (newly tagged - originally created 3 years ago), Oculus Quest games by Martin Kraus (newly tagged - originally created 3 years ago), Overwatch (video game) character redirects to lists by Gonnym (newly tagged - originally created 1 year ago), Overwatch (video game) coaches by Pbrks (newly tagged - originally created 1 month ago), Overwatch League lists by Pbrks (newly tagged - originally created 2 years ago), Overwatch League players by team by Pbrks (newly tagged - originally created 2 years ago), Overwatch League seasons by Edo-biscuit (newly tagged - originally created 3 years ago), Overwatch League seasons by team by Pbrks (newly tagged - originally created 3 years ago), Overwatch League uniforms by Pbrks (newly tagged - originally created 3 years ago), PC games that use GTK by ScotXW (newly tagged - originally created 8 years ago), Pacific Championship Series by Yue (newly tagged - originally created 2 years ago), Pacific Championship Series teams by Yue (newly tagged - originally created 2 years ago), Panathinaikos eSports players by Green13gr (newly tagged - originally created 2 years ago), Panzer Elite by Ariel el pleb (newly tagged - originally created 4 years ago), Paradox Interactive by Yeahimaboss413 (newly tagged - originally created 4 months ago), Paris Eternal by Pbrks (newly tagged - originally created 2 years ago), Parodies of video games by Kjell Knudde (newly tagged - originally created 11 months ago), Perfect World competitions by Pbrks (newly tagged - originally created 2 years ago), Persona 5 characters by Abryn (newly tagged - originally created 12 months ago), Philadelphia Fusion by Pbrks (newly tagged - originally created 2 years ago), PlayStation 5 enhanced games by Ctrice21 (newly tagged - originally created 10 months ago), PlayStation 5 software by Shockingman173223 (newly tagged - originally created 2 months ago), PlayStation Now games by Luis9595 (newly tagged - originally created 2 years ago), PlayStation VR by Martin Kraus (newly tagged - originally created 3 years ago), Player-owned esports teams by UltraDark (newly tagged - originally created 5 years ago), PlayerUnknown's Battlegrounds teams by Green13gr (newly tagged - originally created 3 years ago), Pokémon species redirected to lists by 505noscope (newly tagged - originally created 4 months ago), Pretty Rhythm by Tokyowaterfront (newly tagged - originally created 4 years ago), Pripara by Tokyowaterfront (newly tagged - originally created 4 years ago), Professional Gamers League competitions by Pbrks (newly tagged - originally created 2 years ago), Professor Layton character redirects to lists by Moondragon21 (newly tagged - originally created 3 months ago), Project M players by The Squirrel Conspiracy (newly tagged - originally created 2 years ago), Qene Technology video games by The Supermind (newly tagged - originally created 28 days ago), Race-related controversies in video games by Renzo487 (newly tagged - originally created 11 months ago), Rage of Bahamut by Ariel el pleb (newly tagged - originally created 3 years ago), Rail shooters by series by ExplorerX19 (newly tagged - originally created 2 years ago), Raw Fury games by MainlyTwelve (newly tagged - originally created 2 months ago), Realistic space simulators by 4throck (newly tagged - originally created 8 years ago), Red vs. Blue episode redirects to lists by DZEI3101 (newly tagged - originally created 1 year ago), Renegades (esports) players by Prisencolin (newly tagged - originally created 5 years ago), Return to Mysterious Island (video game series) by Ariel el pleb (newly tagged - originally created 4 years ago), Riddle of the Sphinx by Ariel el pleb (newly tagged - originally created 4 years ago), Riot Games competitions by Pbrks (newly tagged - originally created 2 years ago), Rocket League players by The Squirrel Conspiracy (newly tagged - originally created 1 year ago), Rocket League teams by Prisencolin (newly tagged - originally created 6 years ago), Rockstar Games games by Kanghuitari (newly tagged - originally created 9 months ago), Rockstar Games subsidiaries by Kanghuitari (newly tagged - originally created 9 months ago), Run and gun games by series by ExplorerX19 (newly tagged - originally created 2 years ago), Science fiction horror video games by Mochgamen1 (newly tagged - originally created 5 months ago), Seoul Dynasty by Pbrks (newly tagged - originally created 2 years ago), Shanghai Dragons by Pbrks (newly tagged - originally created 2 years ago), Shogi YouTubers by Ish ishwar (newly tagged - originally created 1 year ago), Sierra Discovery games by Spiderjerky (newly tagged - originally created 2 years ago), Smite (video game) competitions by Pbrks (newly tagged - originally created 2 years ago), Songs about Minecraft by TheFattyClan (newly tagged - originally created 1 month ago), Songs about video games by TheFattyClan (newly tagged - originally created 1 month ago), Soulcalibur players by Cwf97 (newly tagged - originally created 3 years ago), Spring 2018 in League of Legends competitions by Punfixmoscero (newly tagged - originally created 4 years ago), StarCraft II World Championship Series by Pbrks (newly tagged - originally created 2 years ago), StarCraft coaches by Pbrks (newly tagged - originally created 1 month ago), Star Wars: Knights of the Old Republic characters by Xynoyfinu (newly tagged - originally created 19 days ago), Still Life (video game series) by Ariel el pleb (newly tagged - originally created 4 years ago), Street Fighter character redirects to lists by Haleth (newly tagged - originally created 1 year ago), Street Fighter players by Cwf97 (newly tagged - originally created 3 years ago), Sumo Group by Ridwan97 (newly tagged - originally created 5 months ago), Super Smash Bros. 64 players by The Squirrel Conspiracy (newly tagged - originally created 2 years ago), Super Smash Bros. Brawl players by The Squirrel Conspiracy (newly tagged - originally created 2 years ago), Super Smash Bros. Melee players by The Squirrel Conspiracy (newly tagged - originally created 2 years ago), Super Smash Bros. Ultimate players by The Squirrel Conspiracy (newly tagged - originally created 2 years ago), Super Smash Bros. for Wii U players by The Squirrel Conspiracy (newly tagged - originally created 2 years ago), Superheroine video games by Corey2003 (newly tagged - originally created 1 year ago), Supreme Commander (video game) by UserTwoSix (newly tagged - originally created 12 months ago), Suspense-fiction Adventure by Ariel el pleb (newly tagged - originally created 3 years ago), Symbian software games by Falcon King1 (newly tagged - originally created 3 years ago), T1 (esports) by Intolerable situation (newly tagged - originally created 6 months ago), T1 (esports) players by Intolerable situation (newly tagged - originally created 6 months ago), THQ Nordic divisions and subsidiaries by Ariel el pleb (newly tagged - originally created 3 years ago), Taito video game compilations by Richie765 (newly tagged - originally created 4 months ago), Tamsoft video games by Snowballgamers (newly tagged - originally created 1 year ago), Tekken players by Cwf97 (newly tagged - originally created 3 years ago), Television shows based on Arsène Lupin by Kanghuitari (newly tagged - originally created 6 months ago), The Behemoth games by Kanghuitari (newly tagged - originally created 9 months ago), The Cameron Files by Ariel el pleb (newly tagged - originally created 4 years ago), The Dark Pictures Anthology logos by Troubled.elias (newly tagged - originally created 4 months ago), The Guild by Ariel el pleb (newly tagged - originally created 4 years ago), The Nationals (esports) by Hariboneagle927 (newly tagged - originally created 3 years ago), The Sims images by Gonnym (newly tagged - originally created 1 year ago), This Is Football by Ariel el pleb (newly tagged - originally created 3 years ago), Tom Clancy's Rainbow Six Siege teams by Prisencolin (newly tagged - originally created 5 years ago), Top Chess Engine Championship by Banedon (newly tagged - originally created 2 years ago), Toronto Defiant by Pbrks (newly tagged - originally created 2 years ago), Tougeki – Super Battle Opera by Pbrks (newly tagged - originally created 2 years ago), Transport business simulation games by Sm8900 (newly tagged - originally created 1 year ago), Turkish Championship League teams by Yue (newly tagged - originally created 3 years ago), Twitch (service) by Soulbust (newly tagged - originally created 4 years ago), Unified Extensible Firmware Interface by CyberSkull (newly tagged - originally created 8 years ago), Valorant competitions by Gjs238 (newly tagged - originally created 7 months ago), Valorant teams by Gyan.Know (newly tagged - originally created 9 months ago), Valve Corporation competitions by Pbrks (newly tagged - originally created 2 years ago), Vancouver Titans by Pbrks (newly tagged - originally created 2 years ago), Venture capital-funded esports teams by UltraDark (newly tagged - originally created 5 years ago), Vici Gaming by Prisencolin (newly tagged - originally created 5 years ago), Video game characters introduced in 1982 by Mochgamen1 (newly tagged - 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originally created 1 year ago), Video games by type of adaptation by Swpb (newly tagged - originally created 3 years ago), Video games designed by Alec Holowka by Nice Stories (newly tagged - originally created 3 months ago), Video games designed by Ben Esposito by Nice Stories (newly tagged - originally created 6 months ago), Video games designed by Brenda Romero by Nice Stories (newly tagged - originally created 1 month ago), Video games designed by Daniel Mullins by Nice Stories (newly tagged - originally created 3 months ago), Video games designed by Derek Yu by Nice Stories (newly tagged - originally created 3 months ago), Video games designed by Edmund McMillen by Nice Stories (newly tagged - originally created 1 month ago), Video games designed by Greg Lobanov by Nice Stories (newly tagged - originally created 3 months ago), Video games designed by Harvey Smith by Nice Stories (newly tagged - originally created 1 month ago), Video games designed by Keita Takahashi by Nice Stories (newly tagged - 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And I'm back! I was expecting to post a giant 3-week catchup here, but wow was it larger than I expected- world-famous category tagger Ser Amantio di Nicolao apparently also does category talk page tags, because he blitzed through a hundred untagged categories a couple weeks ago (my guess is the criteria was "untagged talk page where there's a tagged parent category"). In any case, we're now back up to date, and regular weekly updates will resume on Monday now that I'm back at home. --PresN 15:26, 6 July 2022 (UTC)

Chibi-Robo! Zip Lash Peer Review

As I haven't heard much back from my first peer reviewer, I humbly request for more comments to the Chibi-Robo! Zip Lash peer review if applicable. Thank you for the help! CaptainGalaxy 15:40, 6 July 2022 (UTC)

Draft:Cuphead: The Delicious Last Course

Hello. i have been working on a draft for the new Cuphead DLC. can anyone help? TheSecondComing10 (talk) 16:46, 6 July 2022 (UTC)

That bit of DLC doesn't seem to be the type pf content that would likely need a separate article from the main game. --Masem (t) 16:51, 6 July 2022 (UTC)

GA reassessment on Tifa Lockhart

Tifa Lockhart has been nominated for a community good article reassessment. If you are interested in the discussion, please participate by adding your comments to the reassessment page. If concerns are not addressed during the review period, the good article status may be removed from the article. (Oinkers42) (talk) 12:25, 10 July 2022 (UTC)

Mega Man X (character) move

See Talk:Mega Man X (character)#Move page to "X (Mega Man)" for the move proposal. Cheers.Tintor2 (talk) 20:47, 10 July 2022 (UTC)

New Articles (July 4 to July 10)

Main page: Wikipedia:WikiProject Video games/New article announcements
 A listing of all articles newly added to the Video Games Wikiproject (regardless of creation date). Generated by v3.12 of the RecentVGArticles script and posted by PresN. Bug reports and feature requests are appreciated. --PresN 17:59, 11 July 2022 (UTC)

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PresN 17:59, 11 July 2022 (UTC)

Amazon Luna release dates

I have started editing in Amazon Luna release dates into several pages as, but many of these games were made available during the Luna's own "early access" phase before its complete launch to the general public in March 2022. Can I still write in the days/months they were made available for the platform in the infobox? Most of them only specify the month and not the day, and publications don't cover release dates. Release dates for Luna games are exclusively covered by the official Amazon Luna Twitter account. Venky64 (talk) 15:19, 14 July 2022 (UTC)

Even if the service was in early access, if the games remained available i'd use the games release date on luna Masem (t) 16:21, 14 July 2022 (UTC)

Christopher Weaver, software developer article updates

I made a few suggestions to help improve the article for Christopher Weaver, who created Elder Scrolls, but I have a conflict of interest and was hoping someone from WikiProject Video Games could review the requests for me? They can be found here on the Talk page:Talk:Christopher_Weaver#Help_with_Updates. Thanks. Ringside44 (talk) 14:21, 15 July 2022 (UTC)

I think @IceWelder would be the right person here. Timur9008 (talk) 21:20, 15 July 2022 (UTC)

Oculus Quest & Quest 2 in video game infoboxes

Hi, articles such as Blair Witch include a listing of Oculus Quest and Quest 2 platforms and release dates. The Quest, unlike the Rift, doesn't need to conform to the "Windows, not Steam or Oculus Rift" infobox video game rule because it doesn't require a Windows system in order to be played. Should the listings for Quest & Quest 2 be kept in the infobox or should they be removed in favor of Windows? Venky64 (talk) 15:17, 14 July 2022 (UTC)

I have used the wording "Android (Oculus Quest 2)" in the past, since OQ runs on Android, but I don't know if this is the ideal way of handling it.--AlexandraIDV 09:47, 16 July 2022 (UTC)

Congrats all!

Congrats everyone on the Paper Mario: Color Splash and Ur-Quan becoming Today's_featured_article/recent_TFAs! Andrevan@ 00:25, 17 July 2022 (UTC)

Merger discussion for Wii Menu

An article which may be of interest to members of this project—Wii Menu—has been proposed for merging with Wii system software. If you are interested, please participate in the merger discussion. Thank you. SmartAn01 (talk) 08:27, 19 July 2022 (UTC)

Merger proposal

Received a request to merge Advergame and In-game advertising (a B grade article) into the Advertising in video games article on 2 July 2022. Reason: All wikipedia pages refers to same(or mostly same) things, it could be merged under one title. Otherwise they will mainly means same things and eventually at least one of them will become directly duplicate page. ZeusAmmon1. Discuss it >>>HERE<<<. GenQuest "scribble" 02:58, 20 July 2022 (UTC)
Having written on those articles, they are slightly different topics. Advergames are those wholly centered around including an advertizing gimmick, rather than simply in-game advertizing like signs on billboard. --Masem (t) 03:50, 20 July 2022 (UTC)

Merger discussion for Twin Famicom , Famicom Titler , Sharp Nintendo Television , and others[a]

Articles that you have been involved in editing—Twin Famicom , Famicom Titler , Sharp Nintendo Television , and others—have been proposed for merging with Nintendo Entertainment System models. If you are interested, please participate in the merger discussion. Thank you. SmartAn01 (talk) 04:15, 21 July 2022 (UTC)

  1. ^ New-Style NES , PlayChoice-10

New Articles (July 11 to July 17)

Main page: Wikipedia:WikiProject Video games/New article announcements
 A listing of all articles newly added to the Video Games Wikiproject (regardless of creation date). Generated by v3.12 of the RecentVGArticles script and posted by PresN. Bug reports and feature requests are appreciated. --PresN 18:44, 19 July 2022 (UTC)

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PresN 18:44, 19 July 2022 (UTC)
  • Proto Man does not really seem to meet the notability guidelines. There is barely any information about concept/creation, and it relies entirely on listicles for the reception section. I am not too familiar with the Mega Man franchise though, but maybe it should be merged to List of Mega Man characters instead. OceanHok (talk) 05:22, 22 July 2022 (UTC)
    Moonjet again. I think a few people have mentioned in recent "de-merge" discussions that Moonjet may possibly require a AN discussion regarding their application of GNG to fictional characters. -- ferret (talk) 12:40, 22 July 2022 (UTC)
For context, I was the one who boldly merged the page more then a week ago, and it's been in mainspace for a long time as opposed to being a recent creation. After MoonJet reverted me, I can see that they went to work right away to find sources which could serve as evidence that the character warrants a standalone page, so it is done in good faith. The merits of their editing efforts in this instance and whether there is objectively enough significant coverage about the character from reliable and independent sources are up to debate in an AfD or merge discussion, but I don't think MoonJet's actions in this particular instance is disruptive or warrants a drama board discussion. Haleth (talk) 17:14, 22 July 2022 (UTC)

Copies or Units

Something I wanted to bring up ever since an editor changed this at Sierra Pro Pilot 98: The Complete Flight Simulator. [1]. I changed it back to units since that's what it said in the source. Which should we use Copies or Units in Sales sections? or what is stated in the source? Sorry if this feels as a unnecessary topic. Timur9008 (talk) 16:06, 23 July 2022 (UTC)

I personally go with “copies” since it’s easier to understand. “Units” is industry jargon that may not make sense to readers IMO. JOEBRO64 16:32, 23 July 2022 (UTC)
I also prefer "copies", because 1) I think it's the more plain-English approach 2) "units" sounds like it just means physical copies 3) it's consistent with other media, like copies of novels. Popcornfud (talk) 16:37, 23 July 2022 (UTC)
Copies. Units just sound like you're reading off an investor's relations document. ~ Dissident93 (talk) 19:26, 23 July 2022 (UTC)
I prefer "units" for the same reason that some are preferring "copies": it's truer to the standard business lingo which analysts, accountants, etc use, which will make it closer to the source. "Copies" sounds more colloquial, but not in a good way IMHO. Also I think "copies" has more currency in the era of physical copies versus digital downloads. Andrevan@ 19:36, 23 July 2022 (UTC)
You think "unit" fits better for download sales than "copy"? Even though people make copies of digital stuff all the time? Popcornfud (talk) 19:55, 23 July 2022 (UTC)
I think "units" is more general for encompassing "downloads" as well as "physical copies." Technically a download is a copy of a file, so I guess it's not wrong either. Andrevan@ 19:58, 23 July 2022 (UTC)

Stray: Good Article Nomination

A user by the name of Rhain has gone ahead and added a substantial amount of quality information to Stray's page. I'm not sure how to nominate it for a good article; can someone review it and ensure it fulfills this criteria? Venky64 (talk) 14:04, 23 July 2022 (UTC)

It should easily meet the criteria but a GAN should only be done by you if you are willing to fix any issues; otherwise Rhain themselves should nominate the article. The instructions are at WP:GAN/I#N2. ᴢxᴄᴠʙɴᴍ (ᴛ) 14:52, 23 July 2022 (UTC)
@Venky64: I plan to nominate it in due time. For now, I feel it's still a little too unstable, considering the game's recent release, and therefore doesn't sufficiently meet the GA criteria. – Rhain ☔ 14:57, 23 July 2022 (UTC)
You also seem to use many of the citations from the original reception table in the article, but the table itself has been shortened for some reason. Would it be okay to reinsert them back into the page? Venky64 (talk) 17:41, 23 July 2022 (UTC)
More than ten is excessive and unnecessary. This discussion should be taking place on the article’s talk page. – Rhain ☔ 00:00, 24 July 2022 (UTC)

Merger discussion for Wii Fit Plus

An article which may be of interest to members of this project—Wii Fit Plus—has been proposed for merging with Wii Fit. If you are interested, please participate in the merger discussion. Thank you. SmartAn01 (talk) 06:10, 24 July 2022 (UTC)

Deletion review of Tender Claws and notability for game developers

The entry for the indie game development company Tender Claws was recently deleted, and I have initiated a deletion review as I think they're clearly notable - but the person leading the deletion review argues that the company is not notable as there is not enough coverage, only of the apps (games, interactive experiences etc) that they have created. Here is the original AfP discussion and the last version of the article before it was deleted.

Are there any guidelines specifically about notability for game developers? I would imagine most developers have little coverage about the company as such as most coverage would be about their games? I would really appreciate people with knowledge of games and wikipedia weighing in on the deletion review and whether or not Tender Claws should have an entry. --Lijil (talk) 13:18, 25 July 2022 (UTC)

There's only NCORP. It's not really appropriate IMO to shop around about a DELREV. -- ferret (talk) 13:21, 25 July 2022 (UTC)
Sorry, I wasn't meaning to shop around, I am genuinely trying to learn the rules here which are not clear to me. Is there any info about what makes a game developer notable per Wikipedia? Lijil (talk) 13:34, 25 July 2022 (UTC)
.... WP:NCORP. This AFD ran the proper course. -- ferret (talk) 13:37, 25 July 2022 (UTC)

When to move draft articles

Has the VG community formed any sort of consensus on when it might be appropriate to move a draft article for an upcoming game? I've been working on Draft:Kingdom Hearts IV since it was formally announced in April 2022, and I think it passes WP:GNG by the sourcing alone, but it still is undated and has no indicated platforms of release. Don't want to make a move out of the draft space if someone would come back around and move it back. - Favre1fan93 (talk) 16:07, 18 June 2022 (UTC)

If you feel (as an experienced editor here) that it's good enough for mainspace, you can move it yourself. And I would tend to agree KHIV's page is sufficient for mainspace. --Masem (t) 16:16, 18 June 2022 (UTC)
You can also submit it to AfC. There are a number of people who are AfC reviewers and have a better idea of when an article is ready for mainspace. ᴢxᴄᴠʙɴᴍ (ᴛ) 16:40, 18 June 2022 (UTC)
I should clarify, I have a host of experience judging/evaluating drafts and moving them, particularly for TV series and films, so no AfC necessary, I can make a move myself. The crux of my question was if VG community had set any parameters for allowing upcoming games (because I know every E3/State of Play/Game Awards/Nintendo Direct there are posts cautioning on article creations for newly announced games) in the same way TV and Film have WP:NFTV and WP:NFF respectively, using the start of filming as a guidance for moving. But it sounds like there really isn't and I appreciate Masem's comment, so I may move the article in the coming days. - Favre1fan93 (talk) 17:42, 18 June 2022 (UTC)
No, nothing more than the usual "does it meet the GNG" and "can it be merged to a series or earlier entry if there's little to be said" standards. Your KH4 draft easily clears that standard in my opinion. Sergecross73 msg me 17:49, 18 June 2022 (UTC)
As long as it is more than "the game was announced...", ideally with a decent development start, in addition to the GNG factors, then it should be fine. This is definitely the case with the KH article you have. --Masem (t) 17:52, 18 June 2022 (UTC)
Thanks all. - Favre1fan93 (talk) 17:46, 20 June 2022 (UTC)
  • Pinging Masem Favre1fan93 Sergecross73 Zxcvbnm. I undid the archiving of this discussion, as I'd like to hear all of your thoughts using a very recent example which I discovered just a couple of days ago.
I refer to the page history for Citizen Sleeper. The entirety of its contents are two infoboxes, a one-sentence long lede, and two sentences for the reception. It does have an extensive list of references, all of it unused but placed under "Further reading", put in by the article's original creator, who appears to be unable or unwilling to make further contributions to flesh out its prose. After I became aware of the article's existence from the Wikiproject's weekly lists, I decided to move it into draftspace. My reasoning is that while the sourcing does indicate that the topic has the potential to be a standalone article, the actual article that was created is a very bare bones stub and to be blunt, I expected a better effort from another experienced editor. Other editors could also contribute to a public draftspace article too, if they have the time or motivation to do so.
Two weeks later, it was moved back into mainspace from draftspace, with zero improvements being made to expand it into a proper short article at the bare minimum. The rationale I provided for the draftspace move was noted but not accepted, with the list of unused sources under further reading referred to as a justification. So, what are all of your thoughts on this, within the context of the expectations and norms of the Wikipedia community? Anyone who consider themselves part of the editor "community" can and probably should take the initiative by doing their part to expand subpar articles whether in draftspace or mainspace, even if they are not personally interested in the topic, but at the same time I can't help but feel that some editors just expect others to clean up after them? Should it be sent back into draftspace again? Subjected to AfD? Merged into a tangentially related topic? Nothing to see here? Haleth (talk) 10:51, 10 July 2022 (UTC)
Why would you not ping @Czar to this? The only real bar to accepting a draft should be whether the topic is demonstratably notable with reliable secondary sources. Some consideration to whether or not it's clear UPE/COI/SPAM or COPYVIO as well. Unless, seeing this in mainspace, you would still considering PRODing or AFDing it as failing GNG, there's no point in draftspacing it. Draftspace hides articles from interested editors, as it doesn't pop up in normal searches, and also removes the ability to attract editor views through links, etc. I often have difference of opinion with Czar about notability (As do you and me), but "It's a stub" is not valid rationale for draft moves. "expect others to clean up".... Yes, to a degree. It's a collaborative project. Finding dozens of sources was work already, putting that work to paper for others to continue is valid. -- ferret (talk) 14:26, 10 July 2022 (UTC)
There is a good reason why I wanted to reopen the discussion, because of situations like these. Take, for instance, this diff here with @Sergecross73's decision to draftify Sign of the Sun because it was not ready to be published, due to the fact that there's hardly any content and the game was barely defined, but do note that no concerns about its notability was ever raised. While there were more sources listed for Citizen Sleeper, that still doesn't change the fact that it reads like an unfinished draft. The difference here is that Sign of the Sun was slightly expanded by its creator following draftication, and was later reintroduced back into mainspace after going through an AfC reviewer, whereas the original creator of Citizen Sleeper boldly moved it back into mainspace without making any improvements. I didn't ping Czar because I was preoccupied with getting the attention of specific editors who previously participated in said discussion and he was not one of them, but that is irrelevant anyway since no one else besides yourself have bothered to leave a comment and continue the discussion. Haleth (talk) 16:58, 22 July 2022 (UTC)
To be clear, when I did that, the article looked like this. There was no meaningful content present, and the sole review presented, a hastily copy/pasted quote from a review - was rendered meaningless because they hadn't hardly even been defined to begin with. It was "This is a video game and one reviewer didn't like it", without even defining what the game was. No description of gameplay. Not even a vague note on genre. I don't do this much - mostly the extremely short articles created by a couple editors around here - but these sorts of articles are pointless. No one is informed by stuff like that. And they're incredibly obscure, so there's no reasonable suspicion it'll get better naturally either. Sergecross73 msg me 17:28, 22 July 2022 (UTC)
To be clear, I'm not particularly supportive of the article created by Czar, and I'm kind of surprised he is too, with the high standards he usually has. But at least that article was for a game released a couple months ago with a ton more modern, readily available sources. Something like that is more likely to garner attention from others and get better naturally over time, unlike a game that has managed to go multiple decades without ever event attempting to be created. Sergecross73 msg me 17:37, 22 July 2022 (UTC)
To clarify, I didn't restart the discussion to specifically scrutinize Czar's approach to article creation, but rather the issue of when is it appropriate to draftify an article that is in its present state clearly lack meaningful content for mainspace, and when it is appropriate to be moved back to mainspace by the original creator or AfC reviewer. I am sensing that your opinion on whether an article that is rushed or unfinished should remain in mainspace, hinges on whether the subject could be objectively assessed as obscure or otherwise? Haleth (talk) 04:00, 23 July 2022 (UTC)
Czar's draft had 21 reliable secondary sources, which we can probably safely assume had probably been vetted by Czar. Despite the stub content, this clearly sets a passing score for GNG, and leaves tons for other editors to work on. Is it short? Is it a stub? Unquestionably, but a lot of research and effort is completed and there's almost no chance whatsoever it will go to AFD.
Sign of the Sun had 3 sources, and no further reading or content. This would be the bare minimum to maybe pass GNG, so the idea that it belonged back in draft for longer isn't that far of a stretch. Even now, after the attention brought to it due to this section, it only has 5 sources, which is unlikely to be deleted at AFD but honestly is less than I prefer to see.
The primary bar for an article is GNG. If notability can be demonstrated, a stub is fine. Would it be nice if it's more? Sure. But if the sourcing is there for the rest of us, that's half the battle. -- ferret (talk) 15:11, 23 July 2022 (UTC)
I will add that I did Sign of the Sun because it was on the Request page. (and will be working on reducing the backlog there) Timur9008 (talk) 18:26 ,23 July 2022 (UTC)
Yes, but it's much more important to write coherent articles than it is to reduce that backlog of these super obscure games of little consequence. Sergecross73 msg me 15:29, 23 July 2022 (UTC)
I think I'm with SergeCross here. I'll reiterate that it still isn't about whether an article about the subject should be written in the first place because notability was never the issue here. It's whether draftspace is the best course of action in dealing with incoherent articles, and if editors like Czar are well within their rights to resist calls from other editors to at least improve their creations beyond a bare minimum stub length that is devoid of meaningful content, then I question why we even have a draftspace system or guideline procedures in place for articles to "incubate" in draftspace to begin with? Hence, "when to move draft articles", or should articles ever be moved into draftspace on any grounds at all? Haleth (talk) 17:05, 23 July 2022 (UTC)
Pretty much all of my draftspace moves are related to WP:N and WP:V calls. I guess I have nothing else to add here. It's certainly not really a WP:VG level question, you're asking why we have draftspace at all while forgetting WP:ACPERM. -- ferret (talk) 17:14, 23 July 2022 (UTC)
I don't see the issue here. WP:DRAFTIFY is quite clear about when to move to draftspace and what kinds of stubs are inadequate. czar 06:52, 27 July 2022 (UTC)

Console and Handheld separation in Video game series templates

I do not think it is a good idea to keep console games and handheld games separate in video game series templates, especially with hybrid consoles like the Nintendo Switch. For an example, look at how Template:Donkey Kong is currently set up:

It has the main series divided by platform, regardless on their playstyle. What I propose is division more dependent on the series itself, and how it is generally viewed. A good example would be Template:Metroid with its division more there to separate out the Prime subseries. An idea for Donkey Kong is to either separate out the Arcade style games (Donkey Kong (video game), Donkey Kong Jr., Donkey Kong 3, and Donkey Kong (1994 video game)) into a Classic or Arcade-Style group. Another potential idea is to do separate the games by eras (Arcade, Rare, Post-Rare). I just really want to avoid future conflicts, especially if the console game system and handheld game system continue to merge together. @TheJoebro64: @ArmosNights: (Oinkers42) (talk) 14:26, 26 July 2022 (UTC)

It likely depends on a per series basis. Masem (t) 14:32, 26 July 2022 (UTC)
Yeah, and that is what I am encouraging, but the console/handheld division seems almost unusable nowadays. (Oinkers42) (talk) 14:35, 26 July 2022 (UTC)
I really don't see what the issue here is. There were arcade Donkey Kong games, console Donkey Kong games, and handheld Donkey Kong games. Splitting them up both makes sense and aids navigation. The Metroid comparison doesn't work because there was never a concrete division between the handheld and console games as there is with something like Donkey Kong or Sonic, and the Switch being hybrid is irrelevant because it's still primarily considered a home console and you wouldn't call a game that's playable on Steam Deck a "handheld game". (There isn't even an exclusive Donkey Kong game on Switch!) Your central argument - that Donkey Kong '94 is different from the other handheld games and thus should be grouped with those released in a different format - falls apart considering that Donkey Kong 64 is totally different from the Country games but you aren't questioning that at all. As I've repeatedly stated, this is trying to find a solution to a problem that no one is having. JOEBRO64 16:01, 26 July 2022 (UTC)
Which is why I proposed the idea of the era separation. Also, future proofing is not really a bad idea. (Oinkers42) (talk) 17:06, 26 July 2022 (UTC)
"Future proofing" is WP:CRYSTALBALLing, and "era separation" strikes me as WP:OR (not to mention that the "eras" aren't really distinct; Donkey Kong '94 and Country came out the exact same year). JOEBRO64 20:46, 26 July 2022 (UTC)
It is not really WP:OR when they are distinct and objective, Arcade era is pre-Donkey Kong Country, Rare's era is the games made by Rare (company), Post-Rare is simply everything made after Rare was acquired by Microsoft in 2002. Also, future-proofing is not really WP:CRYSTALBALL, it is just being prepared so a debate like this does not have to happen again. (Oinkers42) (talk) 21:10, 26 July 2022 (UTC)
I think it makes sense depending on what the series is. It's not something I'd start up for a modern game series, but for ones that started in the 80s and 90s - Sonic, Mario, Donkey Kong - there was a very big difference in perception when it came to their console and handheld games. The Sega Genesis Sonic games are very often discussed together, and both visually and conceptually, I don't think it would be helpful to blend all the Sonic Triple Trouble's and Sonic and Tails entries in between the major Genesis ones. Same goes for all the handheld minor Land entries of Super Mario and Donkey Kong on handhelds being amongst their major SNES entries. Sergecross73 msg me 16:46, 26 July 2022 (UTC)
Definitely. For many series that began in the '80s/'90s, like Mario, Sonic, Donkey Kong, Kirby, and Zelda, there's a clear distinction between the console and handheld installments. It doesn't make sense to group the smaller handheld games like Sonic Chaos or Donkey Kong Land alongside the big budget games like Sonic 3 and Donkey Kong Country. For navigational purposes, it makes far more sense to separate them. JOEBRO64 20:30, 26 July 2022 (UTC)
I've sort of resolved that, for now, some series will be fine as console and handheld and some make more sense to reorient now. I'd argue some of the earlier series (Mario/Zelda) actually work better under different organizations than "console" and "handheld", which we can say that the Switch is "primarily considered a home console" except that we don't even truly treat it that way on Wikipedia (the Switch article is written purely as if it is a hybrid console that straddles the two, the Switch is listed in the "hybrid" section on the Nintendo consoles and ninth gen templates, the Switch Lite is under "handheld" on both as well). This is increasingly a random distinction for some series, and will probably make less sense over time, but I can see why we'd leave some as is for now. I do not believe the navigational argument holds for Mario or Zelda, where its just as logical to split them by game type, which I could go find many articles off of Wikipedia that discuss and separate them this way. ArmosNights (talk) 13:47, 27 July 2022 (UTC)
Then how do you handle bigger budget handheld games like New Super Mario Bros. and Super Mario 3D Land, also the distinction makes it seem like the handheld games are lesser. (Oinkers42) (talk) 20:40, 26 July 2022 (UTC)
There are also cases where separation of console and handheld games wouldn’t make sense in the case of Metroid two of the dedicated handheld games are actually part of the mainline series (2, and Fusion).--67.70.24.37 (talk) 21:05, 26 July 2022 (UTC)
May I ask how you stumbled upon this discussion with only 11 prior edits, none of them related to templates or WP:VG? JOEBRO64 21:18, 26 July 2022 (UTC)
I mean they make a good point, especially when you consider franchises like Kirby that are primarily handheld. (Oinkers42) (talk) 21:27, 26 July 2022 (UTC)
To answer the question above I recently had a power outage so my IP was reset. As to how I found this, I am a video game fan and found this page some time ago so I often keep an eye on discussions here out of interest and sometimes chine in on ones that interest me.--67.70.24.37 (talk) 21:38, 26 July 2022 (UTC)

New Articles (July 18 to July 24)

Main page: Wikipedia:WikiProject Video games/New article announcements
 A listing of all articles newly added to the Video Games Wikiproject (regardless of creation date). Generated by v3.12 of the RecentVGArticles script and posted by PresN. Bug reports and feature requests are appreciated. --PresN 18:11, 25 July 2022 (UTC)

July 18

July 19

July 20

July 21

July 22

July 23

July 24

PresN 18:11, 25 July 2022 (UTC)
  • I doubt anyone was concerned, but just to explain in case anyone was concerned about the relatively low-quality Vectorman 2 article I created: The Vectorman article was previously some sort of messy series type article, so I decided to split them into 2 separate articles. I split them right away, because its poor organization was one of the worst aspects of the article. I'm working on Vectorman 1 now, and then moving on to a proper creation of 2 next. So it will look better soon. Sergecross73 msg me 17:48, 26 July 2022 (UTC)
    I agree with this, I am not sure if I'd call 2 games that came out back to back a "series", especially with nothing was done with them afterwards. ᴢxᴄᴠʙɴᴍ (ᴛ) 07:08, 27 July 2022 (UTC)
    Wow, I was just planning to propose splitting the Vectorman series article into articles about the individual games, and here someone has already gone ahead and done just that. Thanks, Sergecross. Martin IIIa (talk) 12:01, 27 July 2022 (UTC)
    No problem! Thank you both! Yeah, both are easily independently notable, they just needed someone to write them out separately. There's plenty of sources out there since they were both popular in their time, and have been re-released a ton of times.
    I'm hoping to wrap up my efforts on the first entry today, and then start right up on the sequel. Sergecross73 msg me 13:57, 27 July 2022 (UTC)

Temperature check: Categorizing video games by creator

This came up in the WP:DISCORD a few days ago (not raised by me!), but wanted to have the discussion on-wiki for transparency, plus I think Discord has disproportionately more category-hostile types that can fuzz a sense of consensus. Are Category:Video game characters by creator and its subcategories valid categories?

The argument in favor of the category is that as long as Template:Infobox character has a value for "creator", we might as well stick it in a category, too. Plus, there's already Category:Fictional characters by creator, so might as well have this for consistency.

I'm not so sure, however. Category:Literary characters by writer is about characters that indisputably flowed from the mind of one person: Agatha Christie wrote Hercule Poiroit, full stop. This is very rare in video games - even Miyamoto had a team when making Super Mario Bros. 1. While gaming media will sometimes discuss the "creator" of a character, this is simply shorthand, and it doesn't have the same implication the literary sense has. Matsuno did not "create" Vaan (Final Fantasy) in the same way that Arthur Conan Doyle created Sherlock Holmes - Matsuno had ideas and an entire team created Vaan. Other writers and artists were involved. Vaan might be unambiguously a Square Enix character and a Final Fantasy character, but he's not 100% a Matsuno character. And that's a "strong" case where Matsuno clearly did have quite a bit of influence; Category:Characters created by Shigeru Miyamoto includes plenty of characters that I would wager to bet that Miyamoto did like 0.5% of the work on, essentially playing the role of "Executive Producer" where he is just signing off on the team's work. Basically, I think this category might be valid for characters from true indie games with one person driving them: Creeper (Minecraft) was made by Notch, Sans (Undertale) was made by Toby Fox, etc. It's not valid for wider projects. For example, we currently have Mortal Kombat characters in Category:Characters created by John Tobias and Category:Characters created by Ed Boon (with many characters in both), but is that accurate? Did Ed Boon really refuse to touch Johnny Cage and made Tobias do all the work on him? Seems doubtful. (And heck, that infobox creator credits the martial artist who originally portrayed Johnny Cage too, Daniel Pesina - correctly, in my opinion, the actor was clearly a huge part of the role, it wasn't just the producer.) And that's a case where the development staff was just 4 people on the first game, which you'd expect to be an "easy" case, but it isn't.

Anyway, categories have (well, should have) a much stricter criteria than just any infobox value. What makes a good infobox mention doesn't always make for a good category: categories should be defining, and categories should be unambiguous. I'm not convinced this is so important as to be defining, and it's often ambiguous as to how much "creation" should be credited to any one person. Just credit the company (Category:Sony Interactive Entertainment characters, etc.) instead, only crediting individuals when they are the company, and make Category:Video game characters by company the replacement subcategory of Category:Fictional characters by creator if there's a desire to have a replacement.

I would be particularly interested in hearing from editors who voted to keep the "categorization by fictional location", as that might clarify whether this case is sufficiently different as to be worth nominating at CFD, since Discord (mostly?) agreed that category was sketchy, but see above about how Discord's consensus doesn't always line up with on-wiki consensus. SnowFire (talk) 20:38, 23 July 2022 (UTC)

I find crediting a video game character to a singular person to be utterly pointless. In your Poirot example, Agatha Christie came up with the concept of who he was, decided what he looked like, and wrote every thought, speech, and action that he took. Which part of that was the "creation"? Because for most video games, that process involves at least three distinct people - the character designer, the artist, and the game's script writer - and as you note, any one of those three is possibly (probably) a team of people instead, if not all three. Vaan was "created" by Matsuno - except that Akihiko Yoshida actually designed what he looked like, and even our own article notes that he designed him differently than Matsuno had envisioned him. And the story was written by Miwa Shoda based on Matsuno's concept, but the actual script (including all of Vaan's dialogue!) was written by Daisuke Watanabe... and then after it was all written the character design was changed again because Kouhei Takeda did the voice acting and motion capture differently then the design and they decided they liked it enough to keep. Sooo... who created him? Which singular person gets the honor of having Vaan in a "Characters created by X" category?
Well, given that our current fiction-by-x and fiction-about-x category schemes are a morass of strung out nonsense that no humans would (or could) reasonably use because Wikimedia tried to use categories instead of more complex tags, I suppose the only consistent thing to do is to actually stick him in five categories, one for each person that I named. (/s)
Tl;dr: we should delete the entire Category:Fictional characters by creator tree. And then start chop down several other useless trees in the same vein. --PresN 23:56, 23 July 2022 (UTC)
I agree with you both for reasons already well articulated above. The list of characters to whom one single creator can be attributed to their creation is vanishingly small and would likely not be enough to support categories. Auteur theory as it applies to video games is generally discredited at this point. There is no need to reproduce it in category form on Wikipedia. Axem Titanium (talk) 02:42, 24 July 2022 (UTC)
Also agree with this. ~ Dissident93 (talk) 12:17, 25 July 2022 (UTC)

I've nominated this category and its subcategories for deletion. Please weigh in at Wikipedia:Categories for discussion/Log/2022 July 31#Video game characters by creator. Pinging all discussion participants @PresN, Axem Titanium, and Dissident93: for visibility. SnowFire (talk) 23:56, 31 July 2022 (UTC)

USgamer going offline soon

"[...]some but not all of the content being migrated to VG247." [2]. Ensure your sources are backed up. « Ryūkotsusei » 15:31, 29 July 2022 (UTC)

That's a bummer, I generally enjoyed their content. I see the focus is more that the website is going down rather than that they're closing down as a publisher, so I imagine that they've already been inactive and I missed that one...? Sergecross73 msg me 16:19, 29 July 2022 (UTC)
Thanks for the heads-up. Is there any way to see all the times it's been linked/cited across Wikipedia articles? I thought there was a tool for that but it's not coming to mind. The website as a whole seems to be well archived on Internet Archive but it will be more challenging to mine new sources from it without a live website for search engines to trawl. Axem Titanium (talk) 16:40, 29 July 2022 (UTC)
@Axem Titanium, yep, here and you can find pages like this in the future via Special:SpecialPages (in the left-hand sidebar) czar 18:29, 29 July 2022 (UTC)
Ah cool! Just under 1k links though is too much to archive by hand. According to WP:PLRT, there's a bot that automatically adds archive links that are dead. You can submit jobs to the bot to run on specific pages (or a large list of pages) but I don't see a way to proactively run it on a specific website's links. Any ideas? Axem Titanium (talk) 20:03, 29 July 2022 (UTC)
I've been checking through some of the links, and they've all got archives stretching back to when any article was first published. A bot should be able to do a lot of the work with ease. --ProtoDrake (talk) 21:12, 29 July 2022 (UTC)
Has the entire website been archived? (Oinkers42) (talk) 18:36, 29 July 2022 (UTC)
I saw someone on Twitter say that they had gone through the entire website and archived everything through the Wayback Machine somehow, so that's good news ^_^ ~Maplestrip/Mable (chat) 11:34, 2 August 2022 (UTC)

Amy Rose

Please see the lengthy discussions and consensus regarding Amy Rose at Talk:List_of_Sonic_the_Hedgehog_characters#Proposal_to_de-merge_Amy_Rose_from_here. MoonJet has once again un-redirected the character after a discussion just three months ago that established a rather clear consensus. -- ferret (talk) 01:29, 31 July 2022 (UTC)

The consensus was based on what was available at the time. I have uncovered more sources, including non-Valnet ones and some academic sources since the last discussion. Articles that are deleted or redirected are brought back all the time once new sources are uncovered and improvements are made. I was sitting on the draft I had for a while, and I thought it was time to give it a go. This was merely a bold move with no disruption intended. Look at the 2019 merge discussion. Everything proposed there has been addressed now. I admit that the de-merge discussion from a few months back was rushed, as I should have done more work first. But I only opened the discussion up because when someone else tried restoring it, (with no improvements, by the way) it was contested. Maybe I could have waited for a while and bring it back later instead of opening that discussion. But to say I "once again" un-redirected it is inaccurate. Another editor was repeatedly un-redirecting it, not me, while I was merely making some edits to it. This was the first time I've actually un-redirected it. MoonJet (talk) 01:47, 31 July 2022 (UTC)
Wow, feels like unilateral editing against an almost unanimous consensus! Sergecross73 msg me 02:13, 31 July 2022 (UTC)
I haven't looked at the article yet, but given the multiple consensuses to merge in the past, I think BOLD is not the proper way to de-merge the article, regardless of how sterling it is. Consensus can change but never by the bold assertion of one editor. If you think your new draft addresses the concerns of the previous discussion, I would submit it to WP:AFC or start a new de-merge discussion BEFORE rushing it to mainspace. I would also be prepared for the possibility that the answer might still be no. Personally, I think it's ok for well-developed drafts to stick around for extended periods of time as they gather high quality sources, some of which may not exist yet. Axem Titanium (talk) 03:13, 31 July 2022 (UTC)
For the record, it had been proposed for a merge twice. The first time was in 2014, where the consensus was a snow keep (and she had way less sourcing than she does now, should I add). The second time was in 2019, where the previous keep consensus was changed to a redirect. Then I suggested a de-merge some months back, to no avail. But like I said, I think I was too hasty with that discussion. I admit I should have spent more time looking for sources back then, and then either do the bold restoration like I just did, or open up a new discussion. Because after that discussion, I really did some more searching around, which I should had done before.
I understand the consensus for a merge and maintaining the merge a few months back. But these have no bearing on improvements made after the fact. Had I not uncovered these sources, I wouldn't have restored the article. MoonJet (talk) 04:45, 31 July 2022 (UTC)
Standards are higher now for independent articles than in 2014. Given the extensive merge/unmerge discussion history for this article in particular, I think a lot of people would be more willing to reexamine it if you went through the proper channels instead of going straight to a bold unmerge to mainspace. Editors involved in previous discussions who spent considerable effort coming to the prior consensus would be understandably annoyed if one editor could just blow up all that discussion under the guise of being "bold". Axem Titanium (talk) 21:05, 1 August 2022 (UTC)
I understand that standards aren't the same now as in 2014, but at the same time, how much higher is too much? Notability standards have, for most part, been unchanged since 2014 on most other areas on Wikipedia, (at least from my experience) and even back then, standards for video game character articles weren't exactly lax. Should I have opened another discussion first? Probably, to be honest. But I went with a bold unmerge, because I felt that the issues in previous discussions have been addressed now. But hey, the unmerge was contested, so here we are. MoonJet (talk) 23:24, 1 August 2022 (UTC)
I don't have an answer to that question. My allegiance has always been to clear communication and good prose, not to independent articles. If a well-written entry in a list is the best place to convey information about a thing, that's fine with me. I think there are occasions where independently notable things are better covered in a single semantically meaningful summary page than fractured across multiple articles. My point about the origin of this discussion is merely about setting the tone for the discussion. It's a collaborative project and you'll likely encounter these editors again in other contexts. It pays to not burn bridges or good will. You may even garner a more sympathetic audience for your proposal. We live in a society, after all. Axem Titanium (talk) 07:00, 2 August 2022 (UTC)

Diff of the changes. If I understand this correctly, the substantive new sources are a Screenrant article ("Sonic's Amy Rose Never Had to Be The Series' Most Worthless Character") and passing mention in some other articles, like two paragraphs in a "Gaming's unrequited loves that were never meant to be" listicle? I don't have an opinion on the article's previous merits, but I will say that if these are the main additions, it's not enough. Screenrant is a bottom-tier source (honestly should have been just ruled out entirely) and the other mentions seem to be passing mentions. Are there any other substantive sources you'd like to highlight as elevating the topic to a separate article? (Insert usual reminder that a longer section at the list article is perfectly fine if you do find genuine more sources.) SnowFire (talk) 05:48, 31 July 2022 (UTC)

@SnowFire Those are not the new sources, actually. These are some of the new sources. That second one is a listicle, but it does discuss why Amy Rose should be part of the Super Smash Bros. series, rather than just a short blurb of her. The second-to-last one is a listicle too, but it does discuss why she should be in the third Sonic film. Either way, there's a few academic sources covering her, and discusses politics surrounding her character, giving a good indication for notability (which were cited in the restored article). In addition, there's a couple books sources on her that I didn't cite in there. While I don't have access to it, Sonic: The Ultimate Character Guide seems to have a whole page on Amy Rose, possibly two pages.
Also, I would like to note that I have removed some of the sources from the reception section I had in my draft previously like the "Gaming's unrequited loves that were never meant to be," precisely because it was a trivial mention, and wouldn't have helped the article's standing, even though I kept it to verify one of her personality traits. Screen Rant is appropriate for non-BLPs, which is what Wikipedia:Reliable sources/Perennial sources notes. Even so, the article doesn't rely on Valnet properties as much as it did previously. MoonJet (talk) 09:49, 31 July 2022 (UTC)
What's the assertion of reliability for the Russian article? What about Indian Express? The first academic paper does not appear to be published in a peer-reviewed journal and the second academic paper definitely isn't because it's a Master's thesis. Axem Titanium (talk) 21:05, 1 August 2022 (UTC)
The Russian source, while it looks like a fan wiki, is written by Anna Myklina, a staff member on the site. And the site is a news portal site with editorial policies and all that, not just some random fan site. Maybe some input should be asked over at WP:RSN. Indian Express is a news site, which are presumed to be reliable, unless proven otherwise (like Daily Mail).
I'm not as familiar with academic sources. What indicates that these are peer-reviewed journals? MoonJet (talk) 23:42, 1 August 2022 (UTC)
Well the problem is that they don't seem to be published in peer-reviewed journals. I can't find the journal for one of them and the other isn't published at all. Unpublished work is broadly not considered reliable. Axem Titanium (talk) 07:00, 2 August 2022 (UTC)
I'm sure; I just wanted to answer Axem's question about the source. I have nothing to add to the actual discussion. – Rhain ☔ 02:01, 2 August 2022 (UTC)
  • I've just reviewed the un-redirected article, and I still have to stand by my previous stance that there is no significant coverage presented. The in-universe cruft has been cut down for the most part, but the article still is only built upon passing mentions in listicles and articles not primarily about Amy. The current effort suffers from pretty heavy REFBOMBing designed to puff the article up. I think it's safe to say at this point that the sourcing required to warrant a separate article for Amy plain and simple doesn't exist. (Not to mention, unilaterally un-redirecting against what was essentially a unanimous consensus is the type of behavior that gets people dragged to WP:ANI.) JOEBRO64 14:30, 31 July 2022 (UTC)
    And this has been told to Moonjet every step of the way too. They simply refuse to hear it. Sergecross73 msg me 14:49, 31 July 2022 (UTC)
    To say the article is built on passing mentions is listicles is not accurate. I had several sources in the reception that were not listicles, and even some of the listicles I do have do discuss why she is an entry there, rather than a short blurb on the character. And WP:GNG does not require articles solely or even primarily about the subject. And even if it was built on passing mentions from listicles, that doesn't mean there's no potential to change that. MoonJet (talk) 01:45, 1 August 2022 (UTC)
  • I'm sorry MoonJet, but I have to agree with these folks above that Amy simply isn't a plausible article. I don't want your quality writing and source checking to go to waste, though; I'm certain there are plenty of notable Sonic-related articles that could use some rewriting and sourcing, or you could even broaden your scope and slowly pick away at List of Sonic the Hedgehog characters. In this case, consensus is clearly against your opinion and WP:STICK applies. Please don't take these opinions or this essay personally though. I think we all just need a nap. Panini! • 🥪 19:05, 31 July 2022 (UTC)
    Unfortunately having a high quality of writing makes it even less likely that the editor will listen to policy, because they already know and yet continue to attempt to will the article into existing. FANDOM is the place for obsessive fans, but bringing that logic to Wikipedia results in WP:NOTHERE behavior. I'd love to be proven wrong but I think it is pretty clear when an editor has a general interest in video games versus a highly targeted and narrow goal that is incompatible with Wikipedia's aims. ᴢxᴄᴠʙɴᴍ (ᴛ) 21:04, 31 July 2022 (UTC)
  • Okay, I am giving this one a shot as there are some good sources here, anyone else is free to contribute at User:(Oinkers42)/sandbox/Amy Rose, just do not blank the page or WP:TNT without discussing it first. Also, remember to WP:AGF and WP:AAGF. (Oinkers42) (talk) 01:38, 1 August 2022 (UTC)
    The problem isn't the content or what's written. It's the sourcing itself. -- ferret (talk) 02:19, 1 August 2022 (UTC)
    But he said that he thinks there's good enough sourcing for her to potentially get the article back. MoonJet (talk) 02:41, 1 August 2022 (UTC)
    Read the discussion as a whole. Oinker's stance is very clearly in the minority, and not the consensus so far. Sergecross73 msg me 16:47, 1 August 2022 (UTC)
    I know, but Ferret was implying that Oinkers46 made no mention of the sourcing, when he said that there's some good sources in there. MoonJet (talk) 23:29, 1 August 2022 (UTC)
    I implied no such thing. Oinkers said there are "some good sources", implying that the issue was the content instead. I refuted that. I am starting to wonder if you deliberately misrepresent my statements, as it keeps happening. -- ferret (talk) 00:55, 2 August 2022 (UTC)
    Actually, ferret, I thought that's what you were implying, too. No need to stop assuming good faith. Martin IIIa (talk) 01:03, 3 August 2022 (UTC)
    ...Why would someone blank your own user space draft...? Sergecross73 msg me 02:49, 1 August 2022 (UTC)
    Just putting this as a precautionary, especially if someone angerly tries to WP:TNT this. (Oinkers42) (talk) 20:19, 1 August 2022 (UTC)
    No one should be doing that to a draft really, let alone a userspace sandbox draft. You have a lot of leeway there. Unless you violate WP:U5 no one should be blanking it. Sergecross73 msg me 21:08, 1 August 2022 (UTC)

Eh, I don't care about bold unmerges. The worst thing that happens is that it has to be undone with a single button click. Consensus, meanwhile, can get super bogged down in bureaucracy, and we hate that don't we folks - Whadup, it's ya girl, Dusa (talk) 05:16, 3 August 2022 (UTC)

@MsDusa:, it seems the concern wasn't the bold unmerge itself, but rather the fact that I had unmerge it just a few months after consensus was established. But the reason I did that was because I felt I had addressed the issues brought up the last discussion, but most people here hasn't agreed with that so far. MoonJet (talk) 05:50, 3 August 2022 (UTC)

Licensed games as series

I've noticed lately that in articles on licensed video games, editors have been using the "series" field in the infobox for the game's license, e.g. Alien Trilogy and Alien Resurrection are identified as part of the Alien series, The Amazing Spider-Man: Web of Fire and The Amazing Spider-Man 2 are identified as part of the Spider-Man series, The Lost World: Jurassic Park and Trespasser are identified as part of the Jurassic Park series. In many cases the article prose even says the game is a sequel to the previous game which used the license, even when that game has a different developer, different publisher, completely different gameplay, and no storyline connection. Is this correct? I realize that a subset of games using a license can also be a series, such as Top Gun with Top Gun: The Second Mission and Madden NFL, but in many cases the only thing the game in question has its common with the rest of its "series" is that is uses a license from the same IP, and my understanding was that the consensus among reliable sources is that there's more to being a series than that. Am I wrong? Martin IIIa (talk) 13:31, 30 July 2022 (UTC)

The "series" should only be for the video game series, not a licensed series. Those usages you give are incorrect. --Masem (t) 13:44, 30 July 2022 (UTC)
Alright, I'll go ahead and remove those when I encounter them. Martin IIIa (talk) 14:09, 31 July 2022 (UTC)
I'd also remove any mention of a game being a sequel simply because it uses the same licensed IP unless it actually shares some sort of continuity to the previous game, such as developer, gameplay, or obviously plot. ~ Dissident93 (talk) 07:40, 4 August 2022 (UTC)

New Articles (July 25 to July 31)

Main page: Wikipedia:WikiProject Video games/New article announcements
 A listing of all articles newly added to the Video Games Wikiproject (regardless of creation date). Generated by v3.12 of the RecentVGArticles script and posted by PresN. Bug reports and feature requests are appreciated. --PresN 00:01, 3 August 2022 (UTC)

July 25

July 26

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PresN 00:01, 3 August 2022 (UTC)

How are we feeling about List of Limited Run Games releases? They used to be a tiny boutique publisher where each release felt like a big deal but they've exploded over the past few years and now they're publishing dozens of games per year. It doesn't seem like they're slowing down anytime soon. Is Wikipedia still the appropriate venue for this information? Axem Titanium (talk) 16:52, 4 August 2022 (UTC)

I don't mind it - it doesn't seem so different from our other "list of games from (publisher)" type articles. But I don't think it should be cleaned up and trimmed down. A bunch of those columns could either be eliminated or combined in function. Might help with the INDISCRIMINATE vibes its giving off as is. Just my two cents though, not pushing hard either way if this is one of those random things that opens up to a lot of discourse... Sergecross73 msg me 17:15, 4 August 2022 (UTC)
The biggest thing, I think, is that the list is simply too long for each row to get more than a single line of text. Right now they're often 3-5, which is just too much. --PresN 19:27, 4 August 2022 (UTC)
Yeah that's probably it. I think the run size column is what's giving me buyers' guide vibes. Strikes me as info that exists only for owners to flex how rare their purchase was. Axem Titanium (talk) 20:31, 4 August 2022 (UTC)
slices and dices WP:NOT purge of columns done. I'm not yet convinced the list should exist at all though. This is less publishing and more... distributing. A topic we've purged from many articles and the infobox. -- ferret (talk) 20:47, 4 August 2022 (UTC)
Yeah, that's the sort of trimming I was talking about, though I'd probably even trim out the genre field too. Sergecross73 msg me 21:03, 4 August 2022 (UTC)
Agree with binning Genre, its not needed for lists like this. Also, the Original Release Date field is labelled as one thing but is actually doing another. That field appears to be denoting the version of the game that was used for the release, which doesn't really tie in with the the column title. - X201 (talk) 08:26, 5 August 2022 (UTC)

Retro Gamer UK magazines are gone forever from Internet Archive

It seems that all of the Retro Gamer UK magazines are forever removed from Internet Archive, as shown on this link here. Now all we have left are only Retro Gamer Spain magazines, which is no fun at all. This stinks. --Angeldeb82 (talk) 23:34, 1 August 2022 (UTC)

Oh that's too bad. Hopefully someone kept the archive. Andrevan@ 00:13, 3 August 2022 (UTC)
@Angeldeb82:Have you tried Issuu? That site has most of the Retro Gamer issues that were hosted at Internet Archive. Roberth Martinez (talk) 22:49, 5 August 2022 (UTC)
That's great! And I was able to find Issue 30 of Retro Gamer! Thanks. I'll keep that in mind. Angeldeb82 (talk) 22:57, 5 August 2022 (UTC)
I still have one package with issues 1--140 and a few more. Unfortunately, Retro Gamer doesn't sell digital back issues (else I would just buy the magazines I need). A very handy topic index can be found here. IceWelder [✉] 23:02, 5 August 2022 (UTC)
@IceWelder:That's one of the things that royally bothers me a lot about magazine publishers: Why they can't host their old magazine catalog on their website? Look at both Game Developer magazine and Game Machine magazine as examples. They stopped publishing their magazines a long time ago after moving to web but they host their old issues at their official websites for free for educative purposes. I really wish more magazine publishers follow their footsteps in the future... Roberth Martinez (talk) 04:06, 6 August 2022 (UTC)

High Impact Images in Templates

Hello,

I noticed that there were images in the high impact templates Template:Mario franchise, Template:Pokémon video games series, Template:Activision Blizzard (Recurs due to nesting?), Template:Super Smash Bros., and Template:Overwatch.

As I understand it the consensus when this was brought up recently at Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Video games/Archive 162#Images in templates was that such images should generally be removed. Normally for something like this I would just change it myself, however due to their substantial impact, I'm a bit hesitant to do so without first consulting the community. Thus I am asking here if it is ok for me to remove them.

Thank you for your time! Mbrickn (talk) 00:58, 8 August 2022 (UTC)

Personally, I feel as if images can contribute greatly to navboxes, as long as they are easily understandable and visible (think more Template:Super Smash Bros., less Template:Pokémon video games series). Generally, I believe symbols work way better than text logos in this regard. It is what looks the best and is the most presentable. Also, the templates have an image parameter for a reason generally. (Oinkers42) (talk) 01:12, 8 August 2022 (UTC)
I removed them. The consensus at the linked discussion is overwhelming and recent. The Activision/Blizzard template was actually breaking itself by the presence of the images. All of them had whitespace issues and did not justify themselves under MOS:DECORATION in my opinion. Thanks for bringing these to WPVG's attention. Axem Titanium (talk) 06:10, 8 August 2022 (UTC)
Some of them had very little, if no white space issues. I have reverted both of them to their prior form. (Oinkers42) (talk) 12:16, 8 August 2022 (UTC)
Reverted. Still failed MOS:DECOR, still has white space at various widths. -- ferret (talk) 13:58, 8 August 2022 (UTC)
(ec) The linked discussion made no special consideration for white space or for text vs. image-based logos. You were the only one in the previous discussion who was broadly in support of logo images in navboxes under the reasoning that they were free images. Setting aside the fact that I think many editors on Commons have a ludicrously high threshold of originality, you do not address the point that the logos would be purely decorative. Either they're hidden by default in their current position because they'd be collapsed when there are multiple navboxes, or there's so few navboxes that there would be no differentiation issue. Axem Titanium (talk) 14:00, 8 August 2022 (UTC)
Agreed. We just had a conversation on this with a pretty strong consensus. No need to re-litigate this now. Sergecross73 msg me 14:49, 8 August 2022 (UTC)

Article title question

Earlier this week a the previously Japanese exclusive Neo Geo Pocket Color game Rockman Battle & Fighters was stealth dropped on the Nintendo Switch as Mega Man Battle & Fighters so I was wondering of we should keep the old name since the original game came out over 22 years ago or if we should use the new title since the series is far better known as Mega Man in the West? 67.70.24.37 (talk) 20:17, 7 August 2022 (UTC)

As long as the Mega Man title name redirects to the Rockman page, I would keep the romanized Japanese name (Rockman) for now. Masem (t) 20:26, 7 August 2022 (UTC)
IMO it should be moved to the "Mega Man" name per WP:USEENGLISH. ᴢxᴄᴠʙɴᴍ (ᴛ) 20:27, 7 August 2022 (UTC)
If it's finally localized under the Mega Man name, I'd move it to the Mega Man name. Sergecross73 msg me 20:27, 7 August 2022 (UTC)
It depends on what sources are using for the title, as per WP:COMMONNAME. (Oinkers42) (talk) 20:43, 7 August 2022 (UTC)
I quickly looked through the reliable sources on Google News (Escapist, Silicon Era, Gematsu, Nintendo Life), and most of them don't even mention the Rockman name. Probably because it's just the name of the main character. Seems like this will be a non-controversial move. Polygon does specify the distinction as a rename, but it seems alone in it. ~Maplestrip/Mable (chat) 09:11, 8 August 2022 (UTC)
Yes. Oinkers is correct conceptually, and what you're saying is exactly what I would expect to happen - the 2022 localization will bring a new wave of coverage that will almost certainly change the COMMONNAME tides, if it hasn't already. Sergecross73 msg me 14:53, 8 August 2022 (UTC)

Bridget (Guilty Gear) edit activity

There looks to be a lot of editing regarding Bridget's gender, so it may be worthwhile to look into semi-protection if edit wars keep up. - Whadup, it's ya girl, Dusa (talk) 22:03, 8 August 2022 (UTC)

Protected. See what you can do about getting some better sourcing though (I assume this'll be hitting the IGNs and Polygons soon if it hasn't already.) Sergecross73 msg me 22:08, 8 August 2022 (UTC)
Done, appreciated. - Whadup, it's ya girl, Dusa (talk) 22:16, 8 August 2022 (UTC)

Luna games

Luna is available in mainland US only, so would it be fair to edit articles such as Far Cry 6 and Riders Republic (games that launched on day one with Luna versions) in a way that separates them in a way that displays something along the lines of
Windows, PS4, PS5, Xbox One, Xbox Series X/S
  • WW: October 6, 2021
Luna
  • US: October 6, 2021

Venky64 (talk) 14:14, 2 August 2022 (UTC)

No, it likely isn't necessary, given the implicit availability of luna. Masem (t) 14:15, 2 August 2022 (UTC)
What does implicit availability mean in this context? Venky64 (talk) 14:21, 2 August 2022 (UTC)
This would actually add confusion, in my view, as it suggests it's on Luna, but that Luna deliberately only released it in the US. That may be technically true, but the reality is that it was "released on Luna", and Luna as a whole just happens to be restricted to the US. Luna did not release "to the US", if that makes sense. Until/unless Luna is available elsewhere and actually has regional differences, we don't need to point it out. -- ferret (talk) 14:21, 2 August 2022 (UTC)
Oh. What if the infobox already has regional differences in its release dates, like Yakuza: Like a Dragon, which launched in Japan first? The whole infobox would then have to adhere to specifying releases on a regional basis, right? What happens to the {{vgrelease}} format then? Venky64 (talk) 14:29, 2 August 2022 (UTC)
If there was say, a JP release followed by a later WW release, it's still fine to do JP then WW. "WW" indicates a broad release, and regional differences can be denoted separately. -- ferret (talk) 14:58, 2 August 2022 (UTC)
I cited this article in particular because the title is available for Luna now. Regional differences would be specified for Luna as well, so would you mark it as a US release when regional differences do have to be specified? Or should I write worldwide for that as well? (sorry! last question, I think) Venky64 (talk) 15:21, 2 August 2022 (UTC)
Since when is Luna considered a platform viable for the infobox? WP:VG/PLATFORMS says the only exception to subscription or streaming services is Stadia. ~ Dissident93 (talk) 07:38, 4 August 2022 (UTC)
Based on my reading of Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Video games/Archive 152#Amazon Luna - also a platform like Stadia?, developers have to configure Luna games so they'll specifically work on the AWS services. So it's far more similar to something like Stadia than OnLive because it can't really be classified as an extension of existing platforms, it's its own thing. JOEBRO64 12:30, 7 August 2022 (UTC)
Seems inconclusive to me, perhaps another discussion is needed? ~ Dissident93 (talk) 17:43, 9 August 2022 (UTC)

New Articles (August 1 to August 7)

Main page: Wikipedia:WikiProject Video games/New article announcements
 A listing of all articles newly added to the Video Games Wikiproject (regardless of creation date). Generated by v3.13 of the RecentVGArticles script and posted by PresN. Bug reports and feature requests are appreciated. --PresN 03:32, 10 August 2022 (UTC)

August 1

August 2

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  • None

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Discussion about Zork merger

Hi all, I recently overhauled the Zork article, and as part of that merged in the subarticles on its three episodes. Another user is questioning about the consensus on this change, so I'm inviting interested editors to the discussion at Talk:Zork#Discussion of recent merger/overhaul of this article in order to get one in either direction. Thanks! --PresN 14:19, 10 August 2022 (UTC)

Jagged 85 cleanup

Just an FYI—Maestro2016 (talk · contribs · deleted contribs · nuke contribs · logs · filter log · block user · block log), a prolific editor who frequently edited WPVG-covered topics, has been blocked ([3]) as a sock of Jagged 85 (talk · contribs · deleted contribs · nuke contribs · logs · filter log · block user · block log). For those unaware, Jagged 85 was a user who was banned "for long-term and systematic misrepresentation of sources, despite a previous RFC/U on the same problem". See Wikipedia:Requests for comment/Jagged 85, more specifically Wikipedia:Requests for comment/Jagged 85/Computer Games Evidence and Wikipedia:Requests for comment/Jagged 85/Video Game Genres Evidence for more information.

Given how active and prolific Maestro2016 was, we've likely got a lot of cleanup on our hands. Also be on the lookout for editing flurries from anonymous IP addresses, potential block evasion. JOEBRO64 18:51, 25 June 2022 (UTC)

One area in which Jagged/Maestro/whatever-sock-they're-using-now is extremely active is sales numbers, often synthesizing figures by combining disparate sources, many of them non-official or just estimates that someone pulled out of their butt. List of highest-grossing media franchises is a particularly egregious case, being about 99% Maestro's work; I attempted to clean it up back in January 2021, but Maestro resisted every edit and added seemingly everything back. At a certain point it just didn't seem worth it to keep fighting him. Phediuk (talk) 23:30, 25 June 2022 (UTC)
@Phediuk: I've tagged list of highest-grossing media franchises for cleanup. Also pinging @Indrian and Merlinme: who appear to have been involved with previous WPVG-related Jagged cleanup. JOEBRO64 12:22, 26 June 2022 (UTC)
Thank you. Another thing to keep in mind is that that list has also been susceptible to citogenesis, with mainstream news outlets repeating its dubious, cobbled-together numbers as fact, so any sources reporting franchise revenue numbers that don't themselves refer to a definitive source (e.g., a press release from a company stating a single, definitive number) should be regarded with suspicion. Phediuk (talk) 14:14, 26 June 2022 (UTC)
Actually, that page is closer to 85% or 90% of Maestro's work. The sources that I added are all accurate. But yeah the numbers that are false should be removed. I would do it myself since I initially created that page but It would be a headache. Timur9008 (talk) 17:47 ,26 June 2022 (UTC)
It might be a good idea to compile a list of all of the articles, so that we don't duplicate effort while cleaning this up? Sideswipe9th (talk) 01:39, 26 June 2022 (UTC)
For guidance, it's best to look up for arcade games, especially those from 1985-1995, as that's where Jagged did his edits back when all those issues of RePlay magazine were available at Internet Archive before being taken down by the publisher. Roberth Martinez (talk) 01:12, 27 June 2022 (UTC)
I've also tagged List of fastest-selling products, the video game section of which Jagged/Maestro appears to have edited a lot with little oversight from others. The "best-selling video games" sections of our "[year] in video games" articles also appear to be common targets of Jagged/Maestro editing. JOEBRO64 12:21, 27 June 2022 (UTC)
Also tagged Battle royale game#Impact. Since I didn't make it clear in my initial post, for those who aren't familiar with Jagged/Maestro's WPVG contributions, his most common practice was to inflate sales numbers for his favored games through synthesis of sources, including using preorder reports, improperly combining different estimates, or quoting sources out of context. Most of these edits went through unnoticed, since Jagged/Maestro's edits usually seem reasonable and are backed up with sources. Check check check to make sure the sources cited actually back up what is claimed or are actually accessible (the last point being that Jagged/Maestro frequently cite obscure sources that are locked behind a paywall, which makes them difficult to verify). JOEBRO64 12:32, 27 June 2022 (UTC)
Adding List of highest-grossing mobile games as another page tagged. JOEBRO64 14:16, 27 June 2022 (UTC)

The one thing I've noticed Maestro2016 doing a lot is changing KGRAMR's statements "In Japan, Game Machine listed [Game X] on their [date] issue as being the [rank]th most-successful arcade unit of the year." to "... of the month." I let these edits be because (1)I don't have access to the cited sources and can't read Japanese anyway, (2)no one else was reverting any of these edits, (3)WP:Assume good faith, and (4)in some cases it did seem much more plausible that Game X was the second best-selling arcade game of the month than the second best-selling arcade game of the year. In light of Maestro2016's misrepresentation of sources, though, I now have to ask if anyone can confirm whether month or year is accurate.--Martin IIIa (talk) 19:55, 10 July 2022 (UTC)

@Martin IIIa: I've discussed this with @KGRAMR: in the past (User_talk:KGRAMR/Archive_2#Game_Machine). It's actually of a two-week period because the magazine was published every two weeks and (I think) it was published in every issue. What they did was poll arcade operators on which games were the most popular. It's just a vague popularity ranking, not the most "successful" by any measurement. TarkusABtalk/contrib 20:41, 10 July 2022 (UTC)
Yeah, i owe that screw up due to my lack of knowledge regarding the Japanese language. By the way, that section of Game Machine started on November 15, 1983 and lasted until the magazine's final year (2002). (P.S.: by searching "Game Machine's Best Hit Games 25" on Wikipedia, it will show the articles with this source listed, which i'm going to rectify soon after i finish a draft i was working on...) Roberth Martinez (talk) 21:02, 10 July 2022 (UTC)
Cool, thanks so much for the clarification, guys. Martin IIIa (talk) 23:31, 11 July 2022 (UTC)

Bumping—tagged 1992 in video games. We're going to need to look through all the "[year] in video games" articles as these also appear to have been Jagged/Maestro targets. JOEBRO64 11:19, 28 July 2022 (UTC)

Dammit, I'm looking through a lot of our "[year] in video games" articles and it seems like many of them are almost entirely the work of Jagged/Maestro. Anyone here have any familiarity with these topics in particular? I don't, all I can really do is tag them as requiring Jagged 85 cleanup. JOEBRO64 12:34, 7 August 2022 (UTC)
I'm not too practiced in editing "[year] in video games" articles, but I'll do what I can to help. Glancing over them, I have questions about two particular sections. First, what are the standards for inclusion on the game releases lists? They're clearly not comprehensive, but I see a lot of rather obscure games on these lists.
Next, the top game rentals in the United States. Are Blockbuster's lists actually reliable for this? GamePro (which is where all the listings for these sections are sourced to) gives no indication that Blockbuster's lists are ranked, or even that they represent the most popular rentals at all. If Blockbuster's lists are supposed to be the most popular rentals for the month, then they're clearly not very accurate; for both May and June, they list Myst at number one on Sega CD rentals, even though the Sega CD version of Myst was never even released. My assumption was always that the Blockbuster list simply represented which games Blockbuster was most trying to hype. Martin IIIa (talk) 02:52, 10 August 2022 (UTC)
Pinging Cat's Tuxedo since it looks like he added most of the top game rental sections.--Martin IIIa (talk) 22:30, 10 August 2022 (UTC)
Yeah, that was me. Though my approach was different from what we have now, I concede that sticking to the #1s was the right call, to play devil's advocate. I should point out that the lists are clearly titled "Top Ten Video Game Rentals" (at least in 1992's case) and the entries are numerically ordered, so the insinuation that they "give no indication that Blockbuster's lists are ranked, or even that they represent the most popular rentals at all" is rather baffling. Cat's Tuxedo (talk) 22:57, 10 August 2022 (UTC)
All the ones I've seen, covering three years of GamePro issues, just say "Hot Sheet!" or "Hot Rentals". I find your assertion that all numbered lists by definition must be ranked much more baffling. At any rate, you haven't addressed my actual question: Are Blockbuster's lists a reliable indicator of the top rentals for each month? In addition to the issues already mentioned, it's now struck me that the month each list is labeled with is that of the magazine's cover date, which means that even if the lists are reliable (in which case, I'd love to know how all these people were renting games that were never released), we have no way of knowing what month they apply to, only a best guess. Martin IIIa (talk) 22:26, 11 August 2022 (UTC)

Another category change that totally changes the meaning for the category

Just like the Games set in a fictional location problems that arose from that CFD, theres another CFD that's gone through that does the same. The Category:Origami in fiction CFD has resulted in games like Heavy Rain and L.A Noire which feature origami as a plot device, but not a main theme, moved from Category:Origami in fiction to Category:Fiction about origami, which is a totally different meaning. Time for another clean up. - X201 (talk) 20:41, 12 August 2022 (UTC)

Reminds me of Special:Diff/1104082766 I saw today. Yes, the game has a kidnapping. No, the game is not about kidnapping. -- ferret (talk) 21:44, 12 August 2022 (UTC)
We should keep in mind that these types of categories should be defining, which I can sorta see where the problem with "X in fiction" categories sit, since they will draw in any work that has X in it, but not necessarily featured, and thus why its not a defining category. For example, nearly all the mainline Mario games have Bowser kidnapping Peach, so "games about kidnapping" is totally appropriate for that, as it would be the case of "kidnapping in fiction". but if the kidnapping is a minor plot element, it shouldn't be in "games about kidnapping" or any category related to kidnapping since that's not a defining aspect of the game. Masem (t) 21:56, 12 August 2022 (UTC)
I'm not even sure I'd put Mario in "games about kidnapping". Mario features a kidnapping. It isn't otherwise about kidnapping, themed around kidnappings, or any sort of commentary on kidnapping. It is simply the barest plot device. -- ferret (talk) 22:31, 12 August 2022 (UTC)
As Masem stated, if the work is not about origami, it shouldn't be part of an origami-related category, plain and simple. Otherwise, it violates NONDEF. ᴢxᴄᴠʙɴᴍ (ᴛ) 22:40, 12 August 2022 (UTC)
That would be logical too. There's been a lot of stuff over the last year of editors looking at WP:DEFCAT, and simply because a game may include X doesn't mean it should be included in "Games about X", "X in fiction", or whatever its named. It should be part of the essential aspect of the plot that you cannot ignore, as to make it a defining category. To that end, at least as I recall for both Heavy Rain and LA Noire, while origima features into many plot elements, it is not a work defined by being about origami. Masem (t) 23:51, 12 August 2022 (UTC)
Yeah, I try not to waste too much time on categories because I don't think readers at large even know of them, let alone use them, but that issue happens all the time. People add the category "Games about milk" to a 100 JRPG where a side character drinks milk in a 5 second scene. It's a constant problem. Sergecross73 msg me 23:59, 12 August 2022 (UTC)

Looking for GA review swaps

We currently have a lengthy GAN backlog reaching all the way back to May. I have slowly started reviewing the oldest nominations but I have several short (<1,700 words) GANs open for review myself. If you have an active GAN/FAC and are interested in trading reviews, please let me know. IceWelder [✉] 00:13, 15 August 2022 (UTC)

We might need a new Review Thread at this time. GamerPro64 06:43, 15 August 2022 (UTC)

New Articles (August 8 to August 14)

Main page: Wikipedia:WikiProject Video games/New article announcements
 A listing of all articles newly added to the Video Games Wikiproject (regardless of creation date). Generated by v3.13 of the RecentVGArticles script and posted by PresN. Bug reports and feature requests are appreciated. --PresN 00:37, 16 August 2022 (UTC)

August 8

August 9

August 10

August 11

August 12

August 13

August 14

PresN 00:37, 16 August 2022 (UTC)
The Master (Fallout) needs a histmerge to Master (Fallout). Haven't had time to look at it myself. -- ferret (talk) 00:55, 16 August 2022 (UTC)

Heads up

Blocked IP user adding unsourced dates and other general rubbish to articles. - X201 (talk) 19:54, 16 August 2022 (UTC)

IP has been blocked, and I reverted all edits. IceWelder [✉] 23:36, 17 August 2022 (UTC)

Genshin Impact character articles

The WikiProject Video games in Chinese Wikipedia strives to write articles in par with English WikiProject Video games, despite being influenced by Japanese Wikipedia. Recent months, on Chinese Wikipedia, an editor (User:Nostalgiacn) has been consistently writing articles for characters from Genshin Impact. This brings me to a question: when and how should we create a separate article for video game characters. The contents of these articles varies, from Amber whose article simply contains her backstory, appearance in the game, how she battles, how MiHoYo promotes her, how fans cosplay her, and the corresponding receptions; to Yun Jin whose article in addition details how her character design draws inspiration from Peking opera and how this character promotes Chinese culture to the world. Nostalgiacn has created 19 articles for characters (mostly female) for this game and I really wonder: how is that possible?

The articles seem properly sourced though. First-hand sources for stuff like development and promotion, second-hand sources like Kotaku and Screen Rant and Famitsu and Rock Paper Shotgun for reception, etc. I really refuse to believe that this game could have more character articles than Mario characters (that seems the game is more successful, huh?). Some articles have been promoted to good articles, like Yun Jin above.

Conflict of interest disclaimer: I hate this game.

MilkyDefer 03:19, 16 August 2022 (UTC)

You would have a better sense for standards on Chinese Wikipedia than most of us here. I can only speak to my experience on EN Wikipedia, which has generally strict standards for standalone video game character articles. Out-of-universe design/development info and a demonstrable reception are non-negotiable here. The availability of local language sources probably matters. It would be a lot harder to write a Yun Jin Good Article on EN wikipedia without a dedicated translator, and vice versa for Mario on CN wikipedia. That's a practical consideration though, not a notability concern. It would be strictly speaking possible to write a Yun Jin GA in English if the sources on the equivalent CN article are as good as you say. Someone just has to have the initiative to do it (and do it well enough to fend off suggestions to merge it into a character list). Axem Titanium (talk) 05:24, 16 August 2022 (UTC)
I am dubious that the very high bar for fictional content in English Wikipedia would merit that many individual character articles being made. From what English sources I can see, a lot of them are "geeky" type articles about minutia that would probably fail in AfD when a lack of wider context is not proven. (I've had some video game location articles I tried to write quickly shot down using similar sourcing). A list is all I can see being allowed for most if not all of them. ᴢxᴄᴠʙɴᴍ (ᴛ) 06:38, 16 August 2022 (UTC)
There is definitely enough sourcing to start a list, and if over time any one character can stand out as a result of further coverage, then a standalone can be made. Masem (t) 20:46, 16 August 2022 (UTC)
Such list already exists.
  • List of Genshin Impact characters was created.
  • The list soon became too clumsy and full of fancruft.
  • After discussion we decided to remove some fancruft and move some characters to their own articles.
  • After some initial success, editors began to directly create articles, and leave a stub (correction: summary) in the list. <- we are here.
I am not a very good debater. People do not understand such "geeky" and "wider context" terms, and believe that is double standard against character articles. MilkyDefer 03:15, 17 August 2022 (UTC)
Here is a survey I conducted on this subject, where you can find a lot of video game editors' thoughts on the subject and my general interpretation of them. Panini! • 🥪 11:16, 17 August 2022 (UTC)
Thanks, I wanted to point to that, but couldn't remember where it was located at. Sergecross73 msg me 13:14, 17 August 2022 (UTC)
In general, the different language wikipedias have different standards for standalone articles. En.wiki is more strict as we generally require that topics are shown to be notable via secondary, in-depth sourcing, rather than just that they can be verified. Most video game characters overall fail this easily, but we obviously have some like Mario and Sonic. Masem (t) 12:07, 17 August 2022 (UTC)
I have noticed on English Wikipedia too, that "lists of characters" tend to attract a lot of crufty in-universe information. This might be due to the lack of subsections for the characters? Regardless, the best way to go about this is to try to write an article with the sources available to you and see what happens. If you can write a solid article without doing any original research, citing everything to secondary sources, then that's a good sign. Of course, Chinese Wikipedia has different content criteria and that's absolutely fine. Best of luck, Milky :) ~Maplestrip/Mable (chat) 12:17, 17 August 2022 (UTC)
I think the issue is that if you're sticking with just what secondary sources say, there's obviously very little that can be said for many characters in the list, and they inevitably get filled out with primary source information and accumulate cruft. I'm rather down on character lists as a whole, since it's very easy for them to get sprawling with very little actually useful information for a layreader (as opposed to a fan, who is already better served by going to another wiki, anyhow.) List of Halo characters is something I've intermittently worked on, but even with an extremely narrow scope of significant recurring characters in a franchise that's "only" 20 years old there's dozens of characters who cannot really have any useful verified information besides a stray line in a book review somewhere. Even just "he appears in these works" is beyond easy sourcing, and I imagine it's much the same for many franchises. I don't really know what purpose they really do serve since they're not particularly useful to any audience. Der Wohltemperierte Fuchs talk 16:06, 17 August 2022 (UTC)
This is exactly my experience. Sometimes, a fanwiki is just more suitable than Wikipedia, especially when it comes to lists of pop-culture characters. ~Maplestrip/Mable (chat) 06:09, 18 August 2022 (UTC)
That list article on Chinese wiki is quite substantial, no way is it a stub. Anyway, there is a longstanding draft for Genshin Impact characters, but so far no one has shown a motivation or interest in developing the article properly into a respectable one for mainspace. I agree that the characters as a whole warrants discussion, particularly the commentary and reception on some of the character designs as well as the way the microtransaction system is handled with some of these characters. Cruft is always a problem in every article. Someone just needs to stand their ground and be diligent with pruning them, like here. Supporting every addition with a cited secondary source (and insisting on such standards) usually helps, because as per WP:NOR we are supposed to follow the discussions of reliable independent sources from a real world perspective anyway, which determines what is important or relevant for inclusion and what isn't. Haleth (talk) 12:24, 17 August 2022 (UTC)
Sorry for your confusion. A actually meant the summary you would normally leave in the original article after splitting to a new one. I did not mean that "stub". MilkyDefer 01:16, 18 August 2022 (UTC)
I'm late to the party, but here's my two cents.
Information considered too crufty for an edition of Wikipedia may find adoption on another wiki. (Some versions of Wikibooks permit video game story analysis, or strategy guides.) Otherwise there are fan wikis or wiki farms to contribute to.
Fancruft is incredibly subjective, and even distinctions of what fans vs non-fans care about is often misleading. For example I'm not an architect, nor do I typically care for architecture, but sometimes I do want to know everything I can about a particular building just on a whim. If you can account for quality I think it is better to record quality information then not. Context and location are thus key. Should that info be on Wikipedia? If not, should it be on Wikimedia, If not, a fan-wiki? Mbrickn (talk) 00:19, 18 August 2022 (UTC)
Couldn't have said it better, especially the subjectivity of what is or isn't "fancruft". Haleth (talk) 13:26, 18 August 2022 (UTC)

Help needed

Hi. I've been doing an expansion/rewrite for Arc Rise Fantasia, and I've just finished with the plot section. And...I'd really really really appreciate someone else having a look to perhaps trim and tidy it, but I've completely reached my limit with how bonkers and needlessly convoluted it is. If it ends up being a top-down rewrite, that's fine I don't care. This plot can just go die in a hole. ProtoDrake (talk) 22:42, 6 August 2022 (UTC)

@ProtoDrake: Yeah... I would recommend you trimming it down, if it's causing you so much trouble. Roberth Martinez (talk) 23:09, 6 August 2022 (UTC)
Remind me if it looks like I forget, but I can help with this article next week. Sergecross73 msg me 00:21, 7 August 2022 (UTC)
@Sergecross73:Hey there! Are you going to help with the plot section of Arc Rise Fantasia? Just a reminder :) Roberth Martinez (talk) 21:17, 19 August 2022 (UTC)

Resident Evil Damnation

After its copyedit, a user, Nyxaros, suddenly reverted most of the edits. Please see Talk:Resident Evil: Damnation#Reception for the discussion. Tintor2 (talk) 15:09, 20 August 2022 (UTC)

Romancing SaGa: Minstrel Song

It's happened again. I know this is bringing up an issue that happened previously, but an article for the Minstrel Song remake of Romancing SaGa was split into its own article. AKA, the information was copy-pasted into an article that looks like a Wikia. Also, the "move disucssion" wasn't a discussion at all as there was no proper proposal that we could interact with here, and the user who proposed/made the split and the two who supported it all came into existence at the same time. I'm calling shenanigans. Opinions/help appreciated. ProtoDrake (talk) 12:29, 21 August 2022 (UTC)

The article was also formerly split by a banned sock from 2021 by the way. It seems almost certainly like ban evasion and sockpuppetry so I don't think any action is necessary besides reporting it and waiting for the ensuing ban. ᴢxᴄᴠʙɴᴍ (ᴛ) 13:49, 21 August 2022 (UTC)
I agree. It's almost certainly Suriwashi block evading. ferret, you blocked them last time. Do you agree? Sergecross73 msg me 14:23, 21 August 2022 (UTC)
A report would be good, but I've no idea how to do this properly. I looked at the instructions and just got nervous. --ProtoDrake (talk) 14:25, 21 August 2022 (UTC)
Don't worry about it. Unless ferret tells me I'm way off base, I'll probably just WP:DUCK block him. It's a rather specific scenario. It's hard to believe two relatively newbie editors would have the same interest of doing this the same way... Sergecross73 msg me 14:38, 21 August 2022 (UTC)
Feel free to revert this, @ProtoDrake. I'm still working through the CU but over 7-8 blocks are incoming, this guy is everywhere. Confirmed as AquilaXIII. -- ferret (talk) 15:18, 21 August 2022 (UTC)
Sweeping complete, all of Category:Wikipedia sockpuppets of AquilaXIII needs reviewed really. -- ferret (talk) 15:37, 21 August 2022 (UTC)

Blockbuster rental lists

I haven't been getting answers to the two questions I posed in the Jagged 85 cleanup thread, so I'm turning one of them into a proposal: I propose deleting the Blockbuster Video rental lists from all the "[year] in video games" articles. Cat's Tuxedo, who added all these listings, indicated in the Jagged 85 thread that the only reason he has for thinking Blockbuster's lists represent the most popular rentals of the time is that initially they used the heading "Top Ten Video Game Rentals". While it's understandable that one might jump to the conclusion that these are store rental records from that heading, it hardly contradicts the more natural interpretation that these are just lists of the games Blockbuster was hyping at the time. Said interpretation is also supported by the following:

  1. The lists routinely include games that hadn't been released yet, and in some cases were never released.
  2. The "Top Ten Video Game Rentals" heading was dropped in favor of "Hot Sheet!" or "Hot Rentals".
  3. The lists offer no figures or other data. They're just bare lists of ten games for each platform.
  4. The lists were typically published at the beginning of the advertising section which ends each issue of GamePro.
  5. The month each list is labeled with is the cover date of that issue of GamePro.

Moreover, even if we pretend that it's possible that thousands of people rented unreleased games through Blockbuster, and that Blockbuster would publish formal rental figures under magazine cover dates with garish headings like "Hot Sheet!" and no indication that these are rental figures, these lists still seem rather useless. The fact that they are labeled with the cover date means we don't even have any idea what month they were really compiled, just a best guess.

Pinging Cat's Tuxedo and TheJoebro64 as possibly interested due to their participation in the Jagged 85 thread. Martin IIIa (talk) 23:23, 17 August 2022 (UTC)

In light of the points raised, I have no objection to the lists being deleted. Cat's Tuxedo (talk) 23:55, 17 August 2022 (UTC)
I would even posit that the rental figures of one specific company – even one as major as Blockbuster – might not be suitable for our year lists? That's subjective, though, and I think the points raised are enough reason to remove them. It sounds like advertising to me. ~Maplestrip/Mable (chat) 06:14, 18 August 2022 (UTC)
That would align with the music content area's stance though, which documents things like national album/song charts, but not company-specific charts like iTunes or Spotify charts/stats. Sergecross73 msg me 12:05, 18 August 2022 (UTC)
Okay, I'll go ahead and remove them. Thanks for the responses, everyone. Martin IIIa (talk) 15:22, 21 August 2022 (UTC)
Agree with BB excluding the lists if that's the only source. But in following from music articles, if secondary sources had reported a game as a top rental from BB, that can be mentioned but to the secondary source. Masem (t) 15:29, 21 August 2022 (UTC)
Apparently there is, better yet, a list of top rentals for all rental chains compiled by the Video Software Dealers Association. Unfortunately at the moment we only have that info sourced for four months of 1996 in video games. I'll try to keep an eye out for any coverage of that info in reliable sources. Martin IIIa (talk) 15:38, 21 August 2022 (UTC)

Sega Retro resource

I'm sure many of you already know about this resource and/or have contributed to it, but I wanted to ping Sega Retro as it helped immensely with a recent article. The site contains in-depth information about any number of obscure Sega games and has done the grind to collate a bunch of useful sources (with handy PDFs attached to the page you want). E.g. see here the entry on a paint program called Art Alive! which includes 21 reviews plus a couple of manuals and print ads.--Coin945 (talk) 11:42, 23 August 2022 (UTC)

Sega Retro is one of a family of "Retro" projects, the others are Sonic Retro and NEC Retro, though NEC appears sort of neglected. They all pull from the Retro CDN scan depository which if you aren't browsing already, you are missing out. TarkusABtalk/contrib 15:29, 23 August 2022 (UTC)

Should we mention Nine Hours, Nine Persons, Nine Doors in Rupert Sheldrake?

Talk:Rupert_Sheldrake#Popular_Culture_section, for the interested. Gråbergs Gråa Sång (talk) 18:08, 18 August 2022 (UTC)

Sheldrake is important to 999 and the rest of the Zero Escape games, but I don't think the reverse necessarily would be true - we can find some sources that are about ZE and mention Sheldrake, but could we find good RSs that bring up ZE while discussing Sheldrake?--AlexandraIDV 20:12, 18 August 2022 (UTC)
Sounds like it would be WP:TRIVIA. Wikipedia is not TVTropes and does not need to list every instance of someone being mentioned in media, unless it made a vast impact, and I'm not sure that was the case with Zero Escape. ᴢxᴄᴠʙɴᴍ (ᴛ) 20:15, 23 August 2022 (UTC)

Source question

Hi. I recently saw a source called TheGamer being used on Space Channel 5 to source the recently-announced movie adaptation. I did assume it was, but my edit was effectively reverted without actually using the undo button. Quite aside from all the problems SC5 faces with questionable representation of sources I've seen happening, is TheGamer actually usable as a source? I also saw it being used for Panzer Dragoon II Zwei. TheGamer don't seem to use anything original, and seem to me more like TheExaminer or N4G than anything reliable. I couldn't find anything on the project source page about it. Opinions? ProtoDrake (talk) 14:48, 23 August 2022 (UTC)

It is on the page, you must have missed it. It says "News posts and original content after August 2020 are considered generally reliable." ᴢxᴄᴠʙɴᴍ (ᴛ) 14:58, 23 August 2022 (UTC)
Current consensus is reliable as ZXCVBNM notes, though I disagree. I believe all Valnet properties should be treated situational at best, i.e. ScreenRant and GameRant. My personal recommendation to anyone who's working on sourcing for GNG is to give up if Valnet appears in their primary 3-5 sources. -- ferret (talk) 16:19, 23 August 2022 (UTC)
I'm in the same boat. I use them sparingly only when I have to. They churn out a lot of garbage and clickbait through those outlets. Sergecross73 msg me 17:16, 23 August 2022 (UTC)
It's on my list of sources of last resort. Other outlets will do a higher quality job in virtually all cases. Axem Titanium (talk) 18:26, 23 August 2022 (UTC)
Thanks for all the input all. It's good to know. Don't think I'll do anything about SC5, because I don't want to find myself in disputes with fellow editors over ultimately trivial details (Lord of Fantasy and Haleth seem gifted at pushing my buttons). But I'll be able to judge my responses better with future occurrences. --ProtoDrake (talk) 18:48, 23 August 2022 (UTC)
But you still can't help but be passive aggressive about it, in a discussion that is unrelated to the grievance you took up with me on my talk page. I've fixed my mistake, so you can calm down now. I was simply interested in salvaging whatever viable content that is unused from the bold redirected article as per WP:ATD. Also, I was not the one who added the citation for "TheGamer", so don't lump me together with an editor who clearly has competence issues. If you still have a problem with using that source, just find an alternative RS that also reported the same thing. Haleth (talk) 17:21, 24 August 2022 (UTC)

New Articles (August 15 to August 21)

Main page: Wikipedia:WikiProject Video games/New article announcements
 A listing of all articles newly added to the Video Games Wikiproject (regardless of creation date). Generated by v3.13 of the RecentVGArticles script and posted by PresN. Bug reports and feature requests are appreciated. --PresN 20:41, 23 August 2022 (UTC)

August 15

August 16

August 17

August 18

August 19

August 20

August 21

PresN 20:41, 23 August 2022 (UTC)

Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Soda Popinski (2nd nomination) was relisted at DRV. Please comment to generate a more thorough consensus. Axem Titanium (talk) 21:45, 24 August 2022 (UTC)

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