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Hmmm

I think this was part of my vent earlier Julius Peppers. The last edit there is just for All-Pro. There's also an editor doing an awful lot for All-America teams now. I don't want to look, but I wouldn't have the heart to say AP only, lol. I'm not going to touch anything until there's consensus #7,233. P.S. You know what? I really like adding U.S. to the pages. Bringingthewood (talk) 20:41, 29 February 2024 (UTC)

@Bringingthewood: I get that. But at the same time, nothing revolutionary ever happens by waiting on the sidelines. But then we circle back to WP:NOTCOMPULSORY. Then comes, "Do you feel lucky?". Decisions. There's fewer cooks in the kitchen with basketball, so the All-NBA and All-American selections there are more defined.—Bagumba (talk) 00:59, 1 March 2024 (UTC)
Sidelines work at times. Myself, I don't need a three-month ban from the sport. Too bad the AP was anointed as the honor of choice. After the DPOY vote this year, they can go and .... well, you know the rest. Since I joined there have been editors going back and forth on selectors. At one time I wished consensus was AP only, that's it. Now, after this year ... refer to above. I really didn't care about that edit, just wanted to show you that my brain was in that rant the other day, lol. Bringingthewood (talk) 01:19, 1 March 2024 (UTC)
@Bringingthewood: Last discussion was at Wikipedia talk:WikiProject National Football League/Archive 22 § All-Pro for Associated Press only. My guess is if someone championed the non-AP case, consensus can be reached to make WP:NFLINFOBOX more definitive (Though its already implied at When listing All-American and All-Pro selections, there is no need to list the selector. If a player is selected to both the first and second team, whether by the same or different selectors, the player is listed as a first-team selection. List it as "First-team All-XXXX (19XX)".) The next battle would be with drive-by editors and regulars that are "slow" to adapt. —Bagumba (talk) 01:43, 1 March 2024 (UTC)
You want the job, lol. Maybe the All-American guy can do it. Last month I tried to get to an editor with let's just try to keep the sacks in the infobox to official total only. I get .. who said the infobox is for official only? Can't do it. Too much flip-flop, strong opinions, being bold and consensus dying on the vine. I made my peace with my time here. I came from an answers site that I really liked, it wasn't better than Wikipedia, not saying that at all, that ended. You have my word, when I find something that I truly believe in .. I will start a conversation over there. I bet you would never believe that I was the one who was removing U.S. from player pages. Another editor chimed in and look what happened. One day I'll find something to talk about. Bringingthewood (talk) 02:00, 1 March 2024 (UTC)
@Bringingthewood: U.S.: Kudos for textbook WP:DROPTHESTICK. Likewise, I was peaved when non-NBA editor made an issue with "nationality" in the infobox. Oh well, so busy work to remove "American" just to put "U.S." instead. At last NBA rosters are smaller than NFL. Such is life with crowdsourced editing. —Bagumba (talk) 02:13, 1 March 2024 (UTC)
I just saw what you added. You must have seen my edits, I did dozens with removing selectors. But when someone does their homework with All-Pro, they see other than AP given the credit. List them all, that's fine with me. But .. it makes every player look like a Hall of Famer. 9x first-team and 8x second-team, that does take away from the so-called leader, AP only == 3x All-Pro. A person who has no knowledge of the sport would see that and say that guy was better than that guy. Bringingthewood (talk) 02:00, 1 March 2024 (UTC)
I like that title! I knew you were (if it's the same editor who removed your NFL Americans), and I know who it is from our project. Every time I add American to an MLB player -- it's for you. :) You know what, you're right, who the hell wants in on this project? Truth be told, I wanted you to join up when I saw American being removed. that user may not like admins, but you have being a member behind you when arguing, lol. P.S. He does like his HS state abbreviations. Bringingthewood (talk) 02:20, 1 March 2024 (UTC)
@Bringingthewood: Maybe we're talking about something different. I was referring to this and the basketball infobox. —Bagumba (talk) 03:13, 1 March 2024 (UTC)
I'll need time to read that. One name I saw SCB -- the boxing fan was the one who reverted my removing U.S. We started speaking .. got along .. consensus .. and here we are. Not naming names regarding the NFL, like you must have, I've seen a certain editor multiple times remove the American wording you added to NFL leads. Same person likes HS state abbreviations. You went through a lot more regarding nationality in the NBA. Not sure if some find it redundant. Country in the infobox and nationality in the lead. I don't mind adding it. The NFL is tough, that's why I don't play with it. It'll take me too long to add American and pipe American football etc. We went through this with Super Bowl linking already, lol. Baseball and basketball are much easier. P.S. Sid Luckman Rev.hist. 12/7/23. Bringingthewood (talk) 03:53, 1 March 2024 (UTC)
@Bringingthewood: Not sure if some find it redundant: Infoboxes, by design, are repeating information in the page. Per MOS:INFOBOXPURPOSE:

...keep in mind the purpose of an infobox: to summarize (and not supplant) key facts that appear in the article. (That is, an article should remain complete with its summary infobox ignored, with exceptions noted below.)

The art is deciding what is a "key" fact. —Bagumba (talk) 07:37, 1 March 2024 (UTC)
I agree with all you just said and your addition of a nationality in the lead. Like I said earlier, I do it for MLB players. I'm just trying to guess why someone wouldn't want it there. I once asked a page creator why did he put the date of birth in the lead and again in early years, and it's also in the infobox. He said that's the way he does it. This is the Word of the Lord. Now the editor I showed in the revision history .. while opinionated, would have probably given a reason for his dozen removals of 'American'. Oh yeah, the state abbreviation on the Dick Butkus page now, this was the reason given for that edit: (It was decided at WT:NFL several years ago when the city name is in the high school name to just provide the state). Prior to nowrap, I would remove city and state. Never knew about an abbreviation decision. Bringingthewood (talk) 08:17, 1 March 2024 (UTC)
@Bringingthewood: It's clear now presumably.—Bagumba (talk) 08:45, 1 March 2024 (UTC)
Oh my God, I remember that. I didn't think it was decided. We had an abbreviation, a nowrap and a delete all (that was me). After I deleted everything I received that same abbrev. message and an abbreviation was put there. P.S. Sorry to say some of your nowrap's are being changed to
by yet another editor. But that's for another day. Believe it or not, I try not to piss you off on purpose. I'll stick with nowrap. Bringingthewood (talk) 21:59, 1 March 2024 (UTC)
Okay, what do you say? Leave it alone? Revert .. AP only? No consensus? This just came over on my watchlist Trey Hendrickson. Watt and Garrett were supposedly the real first-team All-Pro's. Bringingthewood (talk) 22:14, 1 March 2024 (UTC)
Personally, I'm leaving Hendrickson. It seems WP:DUE in that PFWA selections are referred to in other indy reliable sources, and on a minor note, even the NFL's own record book lists more than AP selections. What's your take? —Bagumba (talk) 01:44, 2 March 2024 (UTC)
@Bringingthewood Forgot the ping. —Bagumba (talk) 01:47, 2 March 2024 (UTC)
Lol, I would have looked anyway. Some editors don't ping, so it got me in the habit of checking. I'll leave it alone also. If the whole site adapts that format, fine with me. I do see that on the All-Pro Wikipedia pages they list AP, PFWA and The Sporting News. No need to go crazy with PFF etc. When I was an IP I added everything and some were removed in place of AP only. When I joined I kept that mentality. Not that it's correct. What bothers me is that you know I'm a big T. J. Watt fan and soon he may fall to a second team AP All-Pro. Let's say he gets that honor along with a PFWA or SN first team All-Pro that same season. I never felt right adding so many honors to a page. Hypothetically, Garrett gets 8x PFWA All-Pro .. Watt gets 6x AP All-Pro ..... I vote Watt, lol. It may cheapen the infobox in the long run. They deserve those honors, no doubt, but I love that Josh put an awards section on Watt's page to add the lesser things let's say. Question for you. Why is just the AP DPOY listed in the infobox? If Watt won the PFWA DPOY this year, would it be fair to Garrett to add that also? When Donald won the AP DPOY in 2017, Calais Campbell won it for the PFWA. No mention of that in Campbell's infobox. See what I mean? It starts yet another ball rolling. Bringingthewood (talk) 02:16, 2 March 2024 (UTC)
@Bringingthewood AP: Some editors/fans are beholden to the billionaire owners' and league office's perceived preferences, as opposed to independent sources. This edit summary was classic. —Bagumba (talk) 02:26, 2 March 2024 (UTC)
Funny, my message was like a foreign language that you interpreted in one sentence, lol. Does that mean the AP shouldn't rule the roost? If so, I agree, and maybe Watt's continuous crying will open their eyes for the future. It's stats -- black and white. Not who gets there the quickest!! It's a shame the NFL Awards night is an AP event. Not many people remember 1A and 1B. Bringingthewood (talk) 02:36, 2 March 2024 (UTC)
Do you know who added Garrett to the DPOY award page here? ME! I used it as therapy, lol! Bringingthewood (talk) 02:39, 2 March 2024 (UTC)
@Bringingthewood: Wikipedia creates its own problem here. If AP is "the" award, then the National Football League Defensive Player of the Year Award page should only be about the AP award. But instead, it's not the WP:PRIMARYTOPIC, and is at a separate Associated Press NFL Defensive Player of the Year Award. —Bagumba (talk) 04:58, 2 March 2024 (UTC)
I agree 100%. It's to the point where (I wish this was done years ago) it could have been voted on that 'only' the AP for DPOY, MVP, All-Pro and All-American will be allowed in the infobox. Or .... maybe just add selectors to each and every honor and award that's allowed in the infobox. It would have been simple, honestly to have one or the other. The problem we have at the present time is that someone assumes that a player is 4x All-Pro, but another editor looks at let's say, PFR and says nope, he was only a 2x AP All-Pro. Now we have to let pages like Trey Hendrickson go no matter what the edit is. Too many players and awards to change now. It's a real sin. Bringingthewood (talk) 05:34, 2 March 2024 (UTC)
@Bringingthewood: As long as I've noticed, I don't think there's ever been any consistency on WP. Prior to getting involved on WP, I was probably under the impression that AP was "the" All-Pro. But in early days of PFR, it listed a slew of selectors, and didn't highlight AP, like it doesn now. Then I think fans who felt "their" player was slighted would put other selectors if it was more favorable than AP's picks. —Bagumba (talk) 07:05, 2 March 2024 (UTC)
That's why I meant 'Charlie Brown' in a good way. ;) -- Right on the money! That's what I believed. Every year I hope that 'my' player gets the AP honor for everything. Again, right on the head with someone feeling slighted. Myself, I can cry, hold a grudge, bitch and moan all year ... but I would not have put Watt as a PFWA or SN DPOY in the infobox. Those mooks must have followed the AP's lead this year anyway. It would kill me, but that's why we have an awards/accomplishment section on the page. P.S. Thanks for that PFR tidbit, I always thought they singled out the AP. I did see that they have all the All-Pro teams listed year-by-year towards the bottom of the player page. Bringingthewood (talk) 07:16, 2 March 2024 (UTC)
@Bringingthewood: Maybe PFR made AP more prominent earlier than I thought, but they were simply calling Fouts a "6-time All-Pro" at the top of his page in 2008. —Bagumba (talk) 07:52, 2 March 2024 (UTC)
Yep, that looks like the Wikipedia way. He WAS a 6-time All-Pro ... now he's a 2-time All-Pro. That's what probably led to all the edits here. IT WAS PFR, lol! Going out on a limb here ... Fouts PFR page, we met on the Fouts page .. you told me about the 'Big Hands' Johnson nickname .. you're a Chargers fan? Bringingthewood (talk) 07:59, 2 March 2024 (UTC)
@Bringingthewood: If I had to pick, I guess. The move didn't turn me off too much as I wasn't in the area anymore. Lifetime of shoddy owners. Up your alley, All-Pro was added to Bradshaw's ibx in 2007[1] For reference, 1975 was actually just an All-AFC selection, and 1979 was All-Pro from NEA.[2] —Bagumba (talk) 08:05, 2 March 2024 (UTC)
If owners cared as much as the fans, that would be something. Like myself rooting for an out of state team, you might actually be from the West Coast rooting for a home team (I did notice you said not in the area anymore). I was going to ask if you're on EST. Just so when I don't respond, no offense, I just went to sleep. After 3AM here. Wow, look at Terry's page .. few edits there, All-Pro above Pro Bowl, remove 'selection', fix the 3'x'. Move the MVP's up. Page looks much better today, lol. Bringingthewood (talk) 08:16, 2 March 2024 (UTC)
And he's a citizen again. —Bagumba (talk) 08:42, 2 March 2024 (UTC)
That sounds like coming back from another country to stay. While I may confuse this whole situation, and maybe a 3-hour difference, I should call it a night. Until tomorrow ........ Bringingthewood (talk) 08:58, 2 March 2024 (UTC)
Just keeping it here. I think you'll agree with my latest Steve Garvey edit. I'm not big on the grammar thing, sorry to say, but I think you did many like this. It wasn't a revert, but it was directed towards the editor prior to the IP. Sound okay? Bringingthewood (talk) 04:28, 6 March 2024 (UTC)
@Bringingthewood: I'd do what you did. I think he'd be disqualified from the Senate as a former American. —Bagumba (talk) 04:36, 6 March 2024 (UTC)
LOL! Plus I'd have to revert all the nice work you've been doing. Glad I'm not a grammar expert. Thanks for the response. Bringingthewood (talk) 04:46, 6 March 2024 (UTC)
@Bringingthewood Come over to the dark side: https://slate.com/culture/2014/08/the-study-of-adjective-order-and-gsssacpm.html —Bagumba (talk) 04:49, 6 March 2024 (UTC)
Dark indeed. I'm saving that article to read at a later date and an earlier hour. Seeing that page brought me back to why I dropped out of college in the first place. Call me stupid but I would have said 'a big brown dog'. Bringingthewood (talk) 05:00, 6 March 2024 (UTC)
If Mr. Marx was a professor at my school I would have graduated: One morning I shot an elephant in my pajamas. How he got in my pajamas, I don't know. Bringingthewood (talk) 05:05, 6 March 2024 (UTC)
Looks like you have a fan Lawrence Taylor. Unless it's really .... 'Incognito Bagumba Guy'. @@ Bringingthewood (talk) 23:18, 6 March 2024 (UTC)
I knew it wouldn't take long for our friend to remove American. I think it explains where a player is from, but I'm not in the mood to get blocked tonight. Maybe we can all play this ridiculous game in 2024. Bringingthewood (talk) 01:02, 7 March 2024 (UTC)
Btw, I just received a thank you for the Steve Garvey edit. I'm thinking of asking for consensus to keep the thank you. :/ Bringingthewood (talk) 01:05, 7 March 2024 (UTC)
@Bringingthewood But everyone is our friend. Have a good night. —Bagumba (talk) 01:24, 7 March 2024 (UTC)

List of National Basketball Association general managers

Bagumba, FYI I tried to move List of National Basketball Association general managers to the short-form but I am getting an error message. - BeFriendlyGoodSir (talk) 20:58, 6 March 2024 (UTC)

Resolved. Went through WP:RMTR, thanks. - BeFriendlyGoodSir (talk) 22:09, 6 March 2024 (UTC)
Hello, Bagumba,
Have you noticed that on List of NBA scoring leaders, all of the links are redirects to other articles? There are also dozens of redirects to all of these pages. Liz Read! Talk! 07:46, 7 March 2024 (UTC)
@Liz: Thanks. Due to a recent RM. I'll clean that page.—Bagumba (talk) 07:48, 7 March 2024 (UTC)

Question

Not stalking. I just saw that you welcomed the user in question. Isn't this redundant since USC is already in the table? The user is going through every QB and adding this header (that I've been intentionally removing when I see the team already listed in the table). I'm not going to undo them though, enforcing style is too much work for what it's worth. I'm not going to add every player in the world to my watchlist, lol. I already have 14,700 pages on it (not all articles though). I think I'm going to start removing stuff from my watchlist. ~WikiOriginal-9~ (talk) 20:51, 5 March 2024 (UTC)

@WikiOriginal-9: There's a related discussion at Wikipedia talk:WikiProject College football § Team colors on stats tables —Bagumba (talk) 20:59, 5 March 2024 (UTC)
I have WT:CFB on my watchlist but I must have missed it since Cbl posted that navbox thing, lol. Just more proof my watchlist is too big. ~WikiOriginal-9~ (talk) 21:05, 5 March 2024 (UTC)
@WikiOriginal-9 Did you want me to mention or paste your comment over there? Or did you prefer to stay on the sidelines? —Bagumba (talk) 03:12, 6 March 2024 (UTC)
I'll just stay on the sidelines. ~WikiOriginal-9~ (talk) 13:17, 6 March 2024 (UTC)
Like really? Look at this that just came through. Some good-faith random just changed the standard × to X. Not really worth my time...lol ~WikiOriginal-9~ (talk) 21:21, 5 March 2024 (UTC)
@WikiOriginal-9: Seem like a one-off. Maybe they did some test edit, thought better of it, then didn't know how to type the actual "x" back (like me now, it's not on this handy-dandy reply editor) —Bagumba (talk) 04:42, 6 March 2024 (UTC)
I know, I always copy-paste that x. I've never known how to type it, lol. ~WikiOriginal-9~ (talk) 13:15, 6 March 2024 (UTC)
Now we have an IP going wild doing tons of stuff I'll have to fix. Hey man im josh didn't even revert it all. ugh lol. ~WikiOriginal-9~ (talk) 16:04, 6 March 2024 (UTC)
Brilliant Also, that's my last msg, sry for spamming you. ~WikiOriginal-9~ (talk) 17:08, 6 March 2024 (UTC)
That IP is back at it again. ~WikiOriginal-9~ (talk) 23:24, 7 March 2024 (UTC)
@WikiOriginal-9: Blocked 1 wk based on their history. —Bagumba (talk) 03:50, 8 March 2024 (UTC)

@WikiOriginal-9: Never a dull moment.—Bagumba (talk) 17:25, 6 March 2024 (UTC)

Ok, I know I said that was the last msg so sry but, lol. The first sentence of quarterback just says gridiron football (which isn't actually a real sport). So no, it should link to American football. ~WikiOriginal-9~ (talk) 23:07, 6 March 2024 (UTC)
@WikiOriginal-9: MOS:SEAOFBLUE haha. —Bagumba (talk) 00:45, 7 March 2024 (UTC)

I'd rather not

Hello. I'd rather not say something over there that might be taken the wrong way. I'm agreeing with you. First I thought the RC proposal was a good one to remove professional. You showed me MOS and I get it. I agreed with nationality and now with professional, being that other bios have it. May main concern now would be not to remove professional, specifically due to American players. You need that word as a break/buffer. To have he is an American football or American -piped - football, it doesn't matter you need he is an American professional football. Or was an American professional football. American is like no other nationality that would fit perfectly. Maybe we have a chess player among us, but if professional WAS removed ... how do you compose a sentence to look the right way? You need the word there, right? Looks like checkmate if we did remove professional. Do you get what I mean? Please say yes, lol. (No need to ping, I'll check my contribution page) Bringingthewood (talk) 07:13, 10 March 2024 (UTC)

@Bringingthewood: Technically perhaps, but I wanted it to be clear that professional is not a unique thing concocted just for football players. —Bagumba (talk) 07:20, 10 March 2024 (UTC)
I knew what you meant from the beginning, even though you seem to want to drill it into me. That's why I left the other page. I can't agree anymore without donating blood. What I was thinking was that if someone says my vote might harp on removing professional, and being that it's the NFL with American football, and I believe the percent of non-American players are in the minority. You see where I'm going with this? A 'no' should be posted there and we vote on the above that was presented originally by GF. PLAYER NAME (BIRTHDATE – DEATHDATE) is a[n] NATIONALITY former professional football player in the National Football League (NFL). That's it, done! Bringingthewood (talk) 07:31, 10 March 2024 (UTC)

Admin of the Year

YOU should get that award! User_talk:Muboshgu#Helton_again Bringingthewood (talk) 00:04, 11 March 2024 (UTC)

@Bringingthewood: Sorry, I dont get the comment. —Bagumba (talk) 01:39, 11 March 2024 (UTC)
Just that I think you are one of the better admins here. Not sure what the rules are, but if you read that message, it looks like turn the other cheek to me. At least you helped out with Rod Martin, you said not to edit war, but you at least intervened. I appreciated that. Unlike others .. you would get the award if one was given, lol. Bringingthewood (talk) 01:58, 11 March 2024 (UTC)
@Bringingthewood: Muboshgu is one of the more active admins on baseball, and even Helton's page, and I've generally found their work to be spot-on. You have fair follow-ups, so I'd just wait for the response. —Bagumba (talk) 02:09, 11 March 2024 (UTC)
I will. Very active in baseball, so is @Yankees10, is it fair that he asked first and gets that response? That's like you adding 'professional', and an idiot vandal reverts it 17 times and I say, welllll, **** it, let it go. You would have every right to punch me in the ******* face. What the hell are we waiting for? Between so-called edit wars and feeding the trolls ... I'm sorry, I was never good at walking on eggshells. If we let it go now, we'll always let it go. Like you said, I'll wait for a response. Bringingthewood (talk) 02:22, 11 March 2024 (UTC)
To be fair, they don't seem to have made any edits since your response, so it's likely they haven't seen it yet. And then WP:VOLUNTEER, they'll get to it when they get to it (even if they have seen it). To some extent WP:THEREISNODEADLINE. Again, not to downplay your concern or the desire for us all to get it right (now), but keep it in perspective too. —Bagumba (talk) 02:30, 11 March 2024 (UTC)
I agree with what you just said. But my perspective is right on the money. As far as I'm concerned it's part of the lead, it's correct and it's like someone removing 'professional' from other pages. It's wrong, a warning could be given if they continue, they get warned again. We could always throw a 'MOS' there way to cover our ass. Then they get the boot! That's it. About four editors reverted this, two IP's used and I hear 'edit war', I try to help the vandal understand, I hear 'feeding the troll'. Maybe a response will come. It's the principle of it, and Google shows the meaning in black and white: Basically, it means doing the right thing, at the right time, for the right reasons, every time. Bringingthewood (talk) 02:53, 11 March 2024 (UTC)
P.S. Nothing fair about it, they got what they wanted. They beat six people. The way Helton's page was left now, as we speak, the IP won't return, because his garbage was left there. The lead has no 'former' added. We were told to leave it alone. They won. Even another editor tried to put in retired American and they were reverted. Wrong IP's don't win. It might take me a year, but I'll get former back in there, lol. Bringingthewood (talk) 02:58, 11 March 2024 (UTC)
Just wanted you to know why I asked him if it was a personal thing. A couple of months ago there was a discussion going on and a response was given. Not sure who it was directed at. I laughed it off .. but I didn't forget about it. The remark I gave in return was never substantiated.Talk:Jim_Brown#Infobox_photo_edit_war. Bringingthewood (talk) 03:18, 11 March 2024 (UTC)
@Bringingthewood: I see the "right" photo is still up. LOL. Seriously, "war" can be taken the wrong way, so I think it was just good faith advice. Winslow II called himself a "soldier", look where he went. To me, it gets too toxic worrying if everyone's got an agenda, even if a few unfortunately do. Not to sound like a broken record, but just wait...—Bagumba (talk) 03:58, 11 March 2024 (UTC)
@Bringingthewood: And only now do I maybe get what you meant about "remark I gave in return was never substantiated", but the misaligned WP:INDENTation can make it unclear what you were responding to. —Bagumba (talk) 04:05, 11 March 2024 (UTC)
LOL, I knew you liked that one. I swore people would have liked to see him smile, lol. Yeah, that's true. I'll wait, but it looks like our mutual friend just came to my rescue. Now the clock starts on Mr. IP ... hope he stays away. Ha, I just threw the indentation around not to fly off the page. I'm good for screwing up a neat thing. I knew a certain editor would hate a linked city so I was kidding around, using the word 'war' due to the title heading we were on. When I saw that response, you know I don't take things the right way .. right away, lol. Still believe he thought I was looking to pick a fight with someone. I honestly meant pun towards the title heading. Ooooo, let me go check Helton's page. Hee. Bringingthewood (talk) 04:18, 11 March 2024 (UTC)
Todd Helton You see, I'll be a son of a *****! C'mon go get a revert in there yourself, lol. Blame it on principle! Bringingthewood (talk) 04:22, 11 March 2024 (UTC)
@Bringingthewood: I'm already on UL Washington patrol. —Bagumba (talk) 04:32, 11 March 2024 (UTC)
LOL! Okay, you have fun with that. Have a good week. Bringingthewood (talk) 04:36, 11 March 2024 (UTC)
So far we're doing good. Ohnoitsjamie blocked the three IP's for 2 years (which you mentioned). What a day, I sent a message to PhilKnight yesterday and seven of eight IP's I sent over were blocked! That maniac was making up IP's for a couple of months. I better go play the lottery. Have a nice day! Bringingthewood (talk) 22:35, 11 March 2024 (UTC)
@Bringingthewood: Some editor's IPs can change without them having much control over it (save for registering an account, but that's another story). Others may intentionally do it to deceive or evade. The moral is that different IPs by same user is not in itself necessarily socking. —Bagumba (talk) 02:21, 12 March 2024 (UTC)
Moving the line here. I know what you mean, not all people are bad. I'm talking about someone like the three last night, ironic .. don't think so. The Pakistan page vandal from December, no way. Hitting the same pages and reverting the same Materialscientist and Escape Orbit's edits. Nobody was blamed for edit warring, so I chimed in. Still wondering how all I did was contact PhilKnight and bang .. all were blocked. Smarter people than myself could have done that last month. I reverted at least 300 of those. I also know that IP's can be multi-shared, so I can't blame every edit that comes from there. I did do a little vandal patrol at Answers.com, not a total idiot figuring out who is a game player.Bringingthewood (talk) 02:37, 12 March 2024 (UTC)
One more thing. The reason I let up a little yesterday was because I had a funny feeling that something might not have been easy to do on their side. Being swept under the rug .. or let's not worry about it now raised a flag in my tiny brain and I became nice. The best way to shut me up would have been to say right away, I can't range block, so I'll find someone who will, this way BTW will go away, lol! Sometimes I have a moment of clarity. Bringingthewood (talk) 02:56, 12 March 2024 (UTC)
Here's one Mongoose. Several IP's recently like the word Mungoon? Hmmmm. Do they think when it's reverted, we then think it's another person? Wow. Bringingthewood (talk) 03:49, 12 March 2024 (UTC)
@Bringingthewood: I took the bait. It just came out of 1yr protection, so I reapplied for 2 yrs. You can also request at WP:RPP. —Bagumba (talk) 04:09, 12 March 2024 (UTC)
LOL, I wasn't fishing, just wanted you to take a look at the second coming of Helton. Protection? Now those are strong words, lol. Never thought of asking for page protection, just to get rid of the person causing the problem. I've seen people move on to several others pages as protections were being applied. I do like the 'recent changes' section, find all kinds over there, lol. Bringingthewood (talk) 04:25, 12 March 2024 (UTC)
@Bringingthewood: Sometimes it can be hard to consider as an option something you generally don't use. I know people where I think, "Why don't you just Google it instead of asking?" But they can use other phone features. —Bagumba (talk) 04:14, 12 March 2024 (UTC)
I hear you. And please don't start using big words like ... phone features. I'm a two-year old in that department. Forgive me, a two-year old knows more. Funny you mentioned the IP geolocation earlier. I believe I had some sort of link to a page at the other place that showed a zip code for an IP I entered. That was cool, but I was told there also by vandal patrol not to block right away, it's not always the guilty party. A blocked user always came back as a sneaky IP over there, lol. Bringingthewood (talk) 04:25, 12 March 2024 (UTC)
Oh yeah, I almost forgot .. STOP FILLING UP MY WATCHLIST WITH ALL THE DRAFT ****!!!! :) Bringingthewood (talk) 04:33, 12 March 2024 (UTC)
@Bringingthewood: And Im usually not the gnomey type ("former professional" being a big exception). I wiped out the HOFers, so likely many had on their list. Blame the people who originally capitalized it lol. My evil plan to plant a seed and inspire others to take over. —Bagumba (talk) 04:42, 12 March 2024 (UTC)
I have a big jug of Roundup here!! ;) Bringingthewood (talk) 04:54, 12 March 2024 (UTC)
@Bringingthewood: At the bottom of an IP's contribution page, there's links to WHOIS and Geolocate for convenience [3] Typically, I expect users, IP or not, to have receieved fair warnings before resorting to a block. There's less concern of innocent parties with static IPs. Honestly don't see many cases of say an office sharing a connection and 10 IP users, but only one vandal among them. Mostly pretty obvious its just one user. —Bagumba (talk) 04:37, 12 March 2024 (UTC)
Cool. It's big world over here at WP, we didn't have that over there. With the size of Wikipedia, the vandal percentage is probably pretty low. The number would probably look high .. but look at the size of this place, lol. I wish I had a block option just for the main idiot. The other day myself and another editor were rapidly reverting a user who added 'Yankees10 is a clown' to many pages. He said it wasn't the first time either. Stopping the insanity right then and there would be have been nice, then I could explain myself later. Take it away if I abuse it, block me ... treat me like Sir William Wallace if it makes you happy, lol. Bringingthewood (talk) 04:52, 12 March 2024 (UTC)

Blinky bill fan 2

The user you just blocked is still at it on their talkpage. Can you pull the plug on them? CRBoyer 05:27, 14 March 2024 (UTC)

+1 - requested global lock. Schrödinger's jellyfish ✉ 05:34, 14 March 2024 (UTC)
They've been glocked, thank you. – 2804:F14:80C6:A301:BDB5:2E3E:64E9:12A8 (talk) 05:35, 14 March 2024 (UTC)
ed. Schrödinger's jellyfish ✉ 05:37, 14 March 2024 (UTC)
Thank you all. —Bagumba (talk) 07:02, 14 March 2024 (UTC)

Magic Johnson

Why the Magic Johnson revert, mate? I understand policy, I was merely including a quote from the review and a reference to the review itself. Found it worthwhile. --Ouro (blah blah) 07:53, 14 March 2024 (UTC)

@Ouro: Hi there. Sorry if the edit summary was unclear, but thanks for following up here. The NYT review had a sentence next to that one quoted in the article: "There aren’t any major revelations in WHEN THE GAME WAS OURS (Houghton Mifflin Harcourt, $26). Still, greatness commands our attention." Per WP:NPOV, it seems that 2nd sentence would need to be included as well. But then it seems imbalanced for the article to put reviews of this specific work, but not others. Nuetrality and balance is my main concern. Regards. —Bagumba (talk) 08:02, 14 March 2024 (UTC)
Heh. All right, I see Your point. Well, it wasn't my intention to bring any sort of POV, one or another, into the article, other than just preserving the reference to a review of the work thus lending it some gravity (I basically didn't want to lose a useful reference, I just believe it or no stumbled upon the article accidentally because the name 'Larry Bird' sort of came to my mind mid-breakfast and I followed on from there; I don't have anything in common with basketball whatsoever). If You feel this should be left out that's fine with me. --Ouro (blah blah) 08:27, 14 March 2024 (UTC)

DYK nomination of Wayne Cook (American football)

Hello! Your submission of Wayne Cook (American football) at the Did You Know nominations page has been reviewed, and some issues with it may need to be clarified. Please review the comment(s) at your nomination's entry and respond there at your earliest convenience. Thank you for contributing to Did You Know! Hawkeye7 (discuss) 19:11, 15 March 2024 (UTC)

"Name, image, and likeness" listed at Redirects for discussion

The redirect Name, image, and likeness has been listed at redirects for discussion to determine whether its use and function meets the redirect guidelines. Anyone, including you, is welcome to comment on this redirect at Wikipedia:Redirects for discussion/Log/2024 March 16 § Name, image, and likeness until a consensus is reached. BD2412 T 02:42, 16 March 2024 (UTC)

Appreciate the good faith nod

When on an NFL page I won't use this one anymore either, Australian Football League (AFL). I have to laugh, I thought about it and did it anyway. I'm figuring .. well, unless Helen Keller was reading the article .. maybe they'll see 'Austrian' typed there. When I saw Wikipedia adding (AFL) on the main pages of Austrian, Australian, and American football, somehow I knew there would be trouble. I know what you mean, believe me I do. I just find it comical with the way we have to guide a reader away from stupidity. OR .. I could just stay away from those pesky Charger pages, lol! Bringingthewood (talk) 03:21, 16 March 2024 (UTC)

Now I feel like Helen Keller. Can you find the disambiguation links I added on a Myles Garrett revert? Bringingthewood (talk) 03:35, 16 March 2024 (UTC)
You should be so lucky. You could be a good Samaritan and report the bug somewhere (dont ask me where). —Bagumba (talk) 03:45, 16 March 2024 (UTC)
@Bringingthewood: (forgot prior ping) If it wasn't AFL, Id say whatever. I probably add CFL lots of times in lead w/o see if it's really used again. But how much can be written about Austrian football that would require reusing "AFL" in a bio. Haha. —Bagumba (talk) 03:51, 16 March 2024 (UTC)
No ping needed, I was just about to send this anyway. That's true. I did lots of CFL and some WFL and WLAF also. Leaving the AFL to American football only from now on. --- prior response --- I'm not blaming WP, it's probably my computer. The only other time today it happened was a revert on Portugal. But I believe there was a disam. link on top when I put some blanking back to the page. Figured that one out all by myself! You can send the medal to my home address. Thanks for looking and for the revert, it looks like I removed an 'f' that you had to put back anyway. Sorry about that. Enjoy your Sunday!! Bringingthewood (talk) 03:57, 16 March 2024 (UTC)
And how did I forget the AFL that I added to over 100 pages .. the Arena Football League! That one seems safe enough to continue doing. Now I'll leave you alone. Bringingthewood (talk) 19:55, 16 March 2024 (UTC)

JWB followups

Thanks for the nearly 1000 follow-up edits on NFL Draft. I think you might find about 4000 more needed (see Wikipedia:Database reports/Linked miscapitalizations). I was planning to appeal my indef JWB ban at some point, so I could work on those, but it might go better if the bulk of stuff to work on was not the NFL Draft things. So I really appreciate you doing that. I'm busily fixing things from that report manually, but not the ones with big numbers of links where JWB would be the way to go. It's hard to keep up though. Dicklyon (talk) 05:40, 15 March 2024 (UTC)

@Dicklyon: Gnomey work is not usually my thing, so no guarantees on how long the urge lasts. It was more a fun exercise to fiddle around with regular expressions. —Bagumba (talk) 07:52, 15 March 2024 (UTC)
Ah, yes, who doesn't enjoy a little self-flagellation now and then? Dicklyon (talk) 09:33, 15 March 2024 (UTC)
I was wrong. I forgot to account for the fact that your edits each fixed multiple links (maybe 4 on average). So the total left at Wikipedia:Database reports/Linked miscapitalizations looks like fewer than 1000 across all leagues, not just NFL. Dicklyon (talk) 18:38, 15 March 2024 (UTC)
@Dicklyon: I think most of the NFL Draft redirs have not been tagged as miscaps, so are not on the report. —Bagumba (talk) 18:56, 15 March 2024 (UTC)
Good point. That's another thing I was hoping to do with JWB eventually. Dicklyon (talk) 19:02, 15 March 2024 (UTC)
Looks like over 800 in Template:. Dicklyon (talk) 02:48, 16 March 2024 (UTC)
I went ahead and tagged the <year> NFL Draft redirects by hand. Now about 30,000 more links are showing up in the report (probably not requiring nearly so many edits to fix, but definitely begging for JWB help). Are you feeling good about the regular expressions you're able to do to work on such? I'm no expert, but have some experience in those. We could do a bot request if we had solid patterns that would fix most of them without false positives. Dicklyon (talk) 20:58, 16 March 2024 (UTC)
@Dicklyon: I've never done a bot request. Can volunteers figure out the details, or proposals needs to spell out the nuances, like avoiding citations. What about direct quotes? Others to leave alone? The ones I'm using are a hack. It misses things like {{main|2020 NFL Draft}} and other instances that are not direct wikilinks, or just plain text usage of "NFL Draft". —Bagumba (talk) 01:38, 17 March 2024 (UTC)
I haven't done it myself, but bot requests typically get approved for a test run of 50 or 100 edits to just verify that it's going OK. Being careful not to have false positives is key, which means it's hard to fix "NFL Draft" in sentences, since it's not so easy to eliminate quote and ref titles and filenames (though I think these are mostly possible to some extent). But adding patterns for the main and see also templates is straightforward. A good way to do this is to make a bot request (for someone else to craft and run the bot) and start them off with what you've got in JWB. See WP:BOTREQ and WP:BRFA. Dicklyon (talk) 01:57, 17 March 2024 (UTC)
@Dicklyon: I don't see myself applying to run my own bot any time soon. Feel free to make a bot request for someone else to volunteer. If you do, let me know, and I can chime in if I have anything helpful to add. Or feel free to bounce off drafts with me. In the mean time, I'll continue with low hanging fruit and semi-inefficient "save" clicks (semi-therapeutic like weeding).—Bagumba (talk) 04:50, 17 March 2024 (UTC)
OK, I submitted Wikipedia:Bot requests#NFL Draft move downcasing cleanup. Dicklyon (talk) 05:06, 17 March 2024 (UTC)

Hello B. Some of your edits are missing the 'e' in teams Chase Hansen. I'll check and fix, but I didn't want you to go all night like that, lol. Bringingthewood (talk) 06:11, 21 March 2024 (UTC)

@Bringingthewood: Arghh. I'll clean them up. —Bagumba (talk) 06:13, 21 March 2024 (UTC)
I was hoping you had a quick fix. I'll stop now. Any help, I'm here. See you later. Bringingthewood (talk) 06:15, 21 March 2024 (UTC)

JWB edit on 2022 Conference USA football season

Hi Bagumba, was this JWB edit on 2022 Conference USA football season a mistake? You removed a very large chunk of the article, including all of the end matter. I would've just reverted, but I'm not sure if there was something specific that you wanted to do there. Liu1126 (talk) 23:52, 24 March 2024 (UTC)

@Liu1126: Thanks for the heads up. I fixed it. Intention was only to downcase draft links to "NFL draft". —Bagumba (talk) 00:30, 25 March 2024 (UTC)

WP:NOTHERE?

Was patrolling the abuse log and came across a brand new user (Goatedkid678 (talk · contribs · deleted contribs · nuke contribs · logs · filter log · block user · block log)) making an odd rant related to the NBA. I don't see how this has any value for the encyclopedia; are blocks and deletions necessary? Left guide (talk) 23:54, 24 March 2024 (UTC)

@Left guide: Hi there. Another admin has gotten to it. Thanks for being on the lookout. —Bagumba (talk) 00:36, 25 March 2024 (UTC)
No problem, and by the way thanks again for helping to save Sweet spot (sports) from deletion at both the AfD and article, it's extremely appreciated. :) Left guide (talk) 05:13, 25 March 2024 (UTC)

Ethics Workshop Participation Request

Hi! We're conducting a series of participatory workshops with Wikipedia editors, administrators, researchers, and Wikimedia employees to discuss, and hopefully improve, Wikipedia's structures for online research (see meta research page). In an effort to get the right people in the room to discuss these topics, I'm reaching out here to see if you are interested in participating as an active administrator. We'd work with you to ensure this workshop can fit into your schedule, but are targeting end of April/early May. I'm happy to discuss any of these topics further here or on our talk page. Zentavious (talk) 14:04, 29 March 2024 (UTC)

DYK for Keith "End Zone" Jones

On 30 March 2024, Did you know was updated with a fact from the article Keith "End Zone" Jones, which you recently created, substantially expanded, or brought to good article status. The fact was ... that "End Zone" Jones ran for a career high in his final regular season game with Nebraska to finish third in the school's history in career rushing yards? The nomination discussion and review may be seen at Template:Did you know nominations/Keith "End Zone" Jones. You are welcome to check how many pageviews the nominated article or articles got while on the front page (here's how, Keith "End Zone" Jones), and the hook may be added to the statistics page after its run on the Main Page has completed. Finally, if you know of an interesting fact from another recently created article, then please feel free to suggest it on the Did you know talk page.

—Ganesha811 (talk) 00:02, 30 March 2024 (UTC)

Can you block this IP?

They are actively vandalizing athlete articles. Left guide (talk) 11:01, 30 March 2024 (UTC)

@Left guide: Done, 31h. I'd usually say to leave a warning first, but this seemed to deserve an exception. —Bagumba (talk) 11:08, 30 March 2024 (UTC)
Agreed, I was actually thinking of warning at first, but more live vandalism kept occurring. Thanks for assisting. Left guide (talk) 11:15, 30 March 2024 (UTC)

Vandal is back

That IP you blocked earlier is back. ~WikiOriginal-9~ (talk) 21:15, 31 March 2024 (UTC)

@WikiOriginal-9: Thanks. Blocked for 1 mo. —Bagumba (talk) 04:10, 1 April 2024 (UTC)

Another vandal is back?

An account you recently blocked appears to have returned. Note the username similarity and the continued vandalism at the Mac McClung article. (the cited source says nothing about the player) Left guide (talk) 23:10, 31 March 2024 (UTC)

@Left guide: Thanks for the thorough links. Sock blocked. Go ahead and at least revert next time. Best. —Bagumba (talk) 04:17, 1 April 2024 (UTC)

Administrators' newsletter – April 2024

News and updates for administrators from the past month (March 2024).

Administrator changes

removed

Guideline and policy news

Technical news

  • The Toolforge Grid Engine services have been shut down after the final migration process from Grid Engine to Kubernetes. (T313405)

Arbitration

Miscellaneous

  • Editors are invited to sign up for The Core Contest, an initiative running from April 15 to May 31, which aims to improve vital and other core articles on Wikipedia.
Sent by MediaWiki message delivery (talk) 16:47, 1 April 2024 (UTC)

Jeremy Bloom

Thoughts? Different accounts keep trying to revise the page. I don't really feel like checking all of that... It's hard to tell on the diffs what they are actually changing without reading it line-by-line. I suspect they have some sort of COI. I didn't wanna revert forever since they're trying... but still. On their user talk page, they're claiming to be a fan of skiing, sure... ~WikiOriginal-9~ (talk) 14:15, 3 April 2024 (UTC)

@WikiOriginal-9: Not an area I've dealt with much. WP:COICOIN looks like a good reference. Those two new accounts might be fair game for a CU request. Good luck. —Bagumba (talk) 14:39, 3 April 2024 (UTC)

DYK for Wayne Cook (American football)

On 4 April 2024, Did you know was updated with a fact from the article Wayne Cook (American football), which you recently created, substantially expanded, or brought to good article status. The fact was ... that Wayne Cook tied the UCLA single-game record for touchdown passes in consecutive weeks en route to their first Rose Bowl in eight years? The nomination discussion and review may be seen at Template:Did you know nominations/Wayne Cook (American football). You are welcome to check how many pageviews the nominated article or articles got while on the front page (here's how, Wayne Cook (American football)), and the hook may be added to the statistics page after its run on the Main Page has completed. Finally, if you know of an interesting fact from another recently created article, then please feel free to suggest it on the Did you know talk page.

Z1720 (talk) 00:37, 4 April 2024 (UTC)

DYK for Darius Durham

On 6 April 2024, Did you know was updated with a fact from the article Darius Durham, which you recently created, substantially expanded, or brought to good article status. The fact was ... that a San Diego State coach called Darius Durham "the best high school guy we've ever signed"? The nomination discussion and review may be seen at Template:Did you know nominations/Darius Durham. You are welcome to check how many pageviews the nominated article or articles got while on the front page (here's how, Darius Durham), and the hook may be added to the statistics page after its run on the Main Page has completed. Finally, if you know of an interesting fact from another recently created article, then please feel free to suggest it on the Did you know talk page.

♠PMC♠ (talk) 12:03, 6 April 2024 (UTC)

DYK for Johnny Buss

On 8 April 2024, Did you know was updated with a fact from the article Johnny Buss, which you recently created, substantially expanded, or brought to good article status. The fact was ... that U.S. presidential candidate Johnny Buss owns one of the oldest comedy clubs in the country? The nomination discussion and review may be seen at Template:Did you know nominations/Johnny Buss. You are welcome to check how many pageviews the nominated article or articles got while on the front page (here's how, Johnny Buss), and the hook may be added to the statistics page after its run on the Main Page has completed. Finally, if you know of an interesting fact from another recently created article, then please feel free to suggest it on the Did you know talk page.

 — Amakuru (talk) 00:03, 8 April 2024 (UTC)

Semi for Jason Terry

Hey. I submitted a request for semi protection for Jason Terry. It got declined here with an odd reason. I'm not sure if that admin even checked the page history but it's not one user doing the edits in which warning is achievable. As it has always been with Terry's page, whenever semi expires, drive-by IPs wreck havoc. Is indefinite semi something you can consider? Thanks. DaHuzyBru (talk) 03:01, 10 April 2024 (UTC)

I assume it was just an oversight. Doesn't seem like the type that should need indefinite, but vandals don't always make sense. I made it 2 years, but would probably wave the flag and do indef if this still continues. —Bagumba (talk) 06:11, 10 April 2024 (UTC)
Vandals will never let this moment down. Thanks for actioning. DaHuzyBru (talk) 06:38, 10 April 2024 (UTC)


Too subtle?

In relation to this post of yours, if it's of any interest to you, I initially set out to write a message which would convey the point gently. When I read through the message before saving it, however, I decided I'd overdone my attempt to make it gentle, and the editor would be likely to miss the point. For some reason, though, I went ahead and saved it anyway. I think I found it slightly amusing, and also thought it didn't really much matter what I wrote, as the editor wasn't going to get the point anyway, no matter what was said to them. Subsequent events have tended to confirm that impression. I confess that posting the message probably was a bit naughty, but I'm not going to lose any sleep over it. JBW (talk) 10:13, 10 April 2024 (UTC)

@JBW: Thanks for following up. I hope my comment did not come off as a criticism of you, as that was not my intent. It's always difficult whether to be (overly) diplomatic or blunt in those situations, and everyone reacts differently. Given the wall of text, I admittedly had to do a double take to be sure I wasn't misreading the situation. Best.—Bagumba (talk) 11:23, 10 April 2024 (UTC)
No, it didn't come off as a criticism at all. I also think this editor may be a contender for the world champion at one or both of WP:IDHT and WP:STICK. JBW (talk) 12:01, 10 April 2024 (UTC)

Protect Dan Hurley?

Lots of IPs changing his team to Kentucky. Thx Rikster2 (talk) 15:09, 10 April 2024 (UTC)

Done. 3 days.—Bagumba (talk) 15:45, 10 April 2024 (UTC)

Editor persistently adding large amounts of unsourced material to NBA team articles

So an editor has been persistently adding large amounts of unsourced material to NBA team articles. Upon noticing this, I left a message on their talk page on April 9 to which there has been no response, and now today they've continued this behavior. Please advise or assist, thank you. Left guide (talk) 21:12, 11 April 2024 (UTC)

I didn't look too much into their history. Generally, I'd suggest following up with them a few more times, either continuing with personalized messages or escalating template warnings. Is the content verifiable? If it is, you could look to WP:PRESERVE it too. Hopefully they come around. Otherwise, refer to WP:CONTENTDISPUTE. Good luck. —Bagumba (talk) 05:22, 12 April 2024 (UTC)
@Left guide: Forgot to ping you.—Bagumba (talk) 05:23, 12 April 2024 (UTC)

Does this violate username/account policy?

Hi again Bagumba, I recently noticed NHLNetwork (talk · contribs), an account with a userpage that claims to be the official account for the NHL and its television channel, NHL Network. Is this allowed? Curious to know your opinion about this and how to proceed; of course feel free to take administrative action if it's within your best judgment, thanks. Left guide (talk) 09:55, 13 April 2024 (UTC)

@Left guide: The name is counter to WP:ORGNAME. I've requested that they create a new account or request a name change. Regards.—Bagumba (talk) 15:41, 13 April 2024 (UTC)

ITN recognition for Eric Sievers

On 14 April 2024, In the news was updated with an item that involved the article Eric Sievers, which you nominated and updated. If you know of another recently created or updated article suitable for inclusion in ITN, please suggest it on the candidates page. PFHLai (talk) 05:46, 14 April 2024 (UTC)

It's a Guadagno ditto!

No need to respond, B. You're still "the Man", Charlie Brown. Always in a good way. Enjoy your upcoming weekend! Regards, Bringingthewood (talk) 23:37, 18 April 2024 (UTC)

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