Talk:Attempted assassination of Donald Trump (disambiguation)

This page was proposed for deletion by Neveselbert (talk · contribs) on 10 October 2024.

While the biographies of living persons policy does not apply directly to the subject of this article, it may contain material that relates to living persons, such as friends and family of persons no longer living, or living persons involved in the subject matter. Unsourced or poorly sourced contentious material about living persons must be removed immediately. If such material is re-inserted repeatedly, or if there are other concerns related to this policy, please see this noticeboard.

Biography: Politics and Government

	Biography portal This redirect is within the scope of WikiProject Biography, a collaborative effort to create, develop and organize Wikipedia's articles about people. All interested editors are invited to join the project and contribute to the discussion. For instructions on how to use this banner, please refer to the documentation.BiographyWikipedia:WikiProject BiographyTemplate:WikiProject Biographybiography
	This redirect is supported by the politics and government work group (assessed as Low-importance).

Disambiguation

This redirect is within the scope of WikiProject Disambiguation, an attempt to structure and organize all disambiguation pages on Wikipedia. If you wish to help, you can edit the page attached to this talk page, or visit the project page, where you can join the project or contribute to the discussion.DisambiguationWikipedia:WikiProject DisambiguationTemplate:WikiProject DisambiguationDisambiguation

Crime and Criminal Biography: Terrorism

	This redirect is within the scope of WikiProject Crime and Criminal Biography, a collaborative effort to improve the coverage of Crime and Criminal Biography articles on Wikipedia. If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join the discussion and see a list of open tasks.Crime and Criminal BiographyWikipedia:WikiProject Crime and Criminal BiographyTemplate:WikiProject Crime and Criminal BiographyCrime-related
	This redirect is supported by the Terrorism task force.

Politics: American

	Politics portal This redirect is within the scope of WikiProject Politics, a collaborative effort to improve the coverage of politics on Wikipedia. If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join the discussion and see a list of open tasks.PoliticsWikipedia:WikiProject PoliticsTemplate:WikiProject Politicspolitics
	This redirect is supported by American politics task force.

United States: Presidential elections / Presidents

	United States portal This redirect is within the scope of WikiProject United States, a collaborative effort to improve the coverage of topics relating to the United States of America on Wikipedia. If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join the ongoing discussions. Template Usage Articles Requested! Become a Member Project Talk Alerts United StatesWikipedia:WikiProject United StatesTemplate:WikiProject United StatesUnited States
	This redirect is supported by WikiProject U.S. presidential elections.
	This redirect is supported by WikiProject United States Presidents.

On 11 October 2024, it was proposed that this article be moved to Attempted assassination of Donald Trump. The result of the discussion was redirect to Security incidents involving Donald Trump.

Attempted assassination of Donald Trump

i want to know who did it what happened where did it happened when did it happened and why did it happened 2600:4809:98F1:2900:C97D:EED6:54B2:136C (talk) 22:19, 18 September 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Somebody moved the page (I am assuming you are talking about the Trump rally shooting) and turned this page into a disambiguation page. :) Sir MemeGod  22:21, 18 September 2024 (UTC)[reply]

"Second attempted assassination of Donald Trump" listed at Redirects for discussion

The redirect Second attempted assassination of Donald Trump has been listed at redirects for discussion to determine whether its use and function meets the redirect guidelines. Readers of this page are welcome to comment on this redirect at Wikipedia:Redirects for discussion/Log/2024 September 16 § Second attempted assassination of Donald Trump until a consensus is reached. 64.229.88.34 (talk) 23:30, 18 September 2024 (UTC)[reply]

"Donald Trump shooting" listed at Redirects for discussion

The redirect Donald Trump shooting has been listed at redirects for discussion to determine whether its use and function meets the redirect guidelines. Readers of this page are welcome to comment on this redirect at Wikipedia:Redirects for discussion/Log/2024 September 16 § Donald Trump shooting until a consensus is reached. 64.229.88.34 (talk) 22:56, 18 September 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Edit request

This edit request has been answered. Set the |answered= or |ans= parameter to no to reactivate your request.

Please add the dates to the incidents.

(13 July 2024)
(15 September 2024)
(18 June 2016)

It would help in later additions to the page when needing date-sorting. And to those who are unfamiliar with the locations. -- 64.229.88.34 (talk) 22:46, 18 September 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Partly done: At least the month and year have been added for each attempt in Special:Diff/1249696252 by Wikishovel. There is no need to show the exact day of the month. GTrang (talk) 16:43, 8 October 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Requested move 11 October 2024

The following is a closed discussion of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. Editors desiring to contest the closing decision should consider a move review after discussing it on the closer's talk page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

The result of the move request was: redirect to Security incidents involving Donald Trump. Numerically, there is a narrow plurality (about 2, counting the Ivanvector-esque opposes per "Support the move in principle otherwise") in favor of moving, meaning there is no consensus around moving the page, especially as there was little to no engagement around arguments of there being a PrimaryTopic. Meanwhile, arguments of redirecting the page to the set index article that features incidents describable as assassination attempts went entirely unopposed. (non-admin closure) Aaron Liu (talk) 16:35, 29 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Attempted assassination of Donald Trump (disambiguation) → Attempted assassination of Donald Trump – The fact that the Pennsylvania article is located at Attempted assassination of Donald Trump in Pennsylvania rather than Attempted assassination of Donald Trump suggests that there is no primary topic. This will hopefully resolve the confusion raised at User talk:SilverLocust#Attempted assassination of Donald Trump (disambiguation). GTrang (talk) 14:01, 11 October 2024 (UTC) — Relisting. estar8806 (talk) ★ 18:48, 30 October 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Support a disambiguation page. Attempted assassination of Donald Trump could refer to both the PA and FL attempts (although some may argue the PA attempt is PT because the former president was actually wounded in that attempt). cookie monster 755 15:25, 11 October 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Weak oppose – upon further consideration, I do think that Attempted assassination of Donald Trump should redirect to Attempted assassination of Donald Trump in Pennsylvania, as former president Trump was actually wounded in this attempt but unharmed in the Florida attempt. It is not comparable to the Attempted assassination of Gerald Ford in San Francisco / Sacramento because Ford was not wounded in either of the attempts. cookie monster 755 15:34, 11 October 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Support: per nom. C F A 💬 15:28, 11 October 2024 (UTC)[reply]
oppose this doesn't need a dab per WP:ONEOTHER and vegas thing isn't called an 'attempted assassination' in the article—blindlynx 16:08, 11 October 2024 (UTC)[reply]
That's a different question than what is being asked. If it isn't moved, then I do agree that it should be deleted per WP:ONEOTHER, but that's not really relevant to the move. C F A 💬 03:35, 12 October 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Weak oppose. Per WP:NCWWW, including "when", "where", or "what" in a descriptive title for an event does not actually mean there is no primary topic for the same title with some of that information removed, provided the information is a "useful identifier". And the discussion in the requested move that this arose out of didn't really provide any convincing justification for there being WP:NOPRIMARY. That the page has been moved to a strictly longer title doesn't change whether there is a primary topic, so I still think that it satisfies both WP:PT1 (per CFA) and WP:PT2 (per CFA). SilverLocust 💬 16:19, 11 October 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Support that there is WP:NOPRIMARYTOPIC. – Muboshgu (talk) 16:30, 11 October 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Support WP:NOPRIMARYTOPIC. JeffSpaceman (talk) 13:39, 12 October 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Support WP:NOPRIMARYTOPIC.LM2000 (talk) 01:50, 16 October 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Neutral point Would like to point out that this article/list exists and appears to be a better location to put all security related incidents without needing to have a disambiguation list that contains only security incidents classified as "assassination attempts"

Security incidents involving Donald Trump Armeym (talk) 23:27, 16 October 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Support per nom. We can't have Attempted assassination of Donald Trump redirecting to Attempted assassination of Donald Trump in Pennsylvania because that would indicate "in Pennsylvania" was unnecessary disambiguation. Shhhnotsoloud (talk) 14:57, 18 October 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Oppose in favour of having both "attempted assassination" titles (with and without disambiguation) redirect to Security incidents involving Donald Trump, a set index article summarizing several security incidents which have been or could be described as assassination attempts. There is no utility to readers in having one list with all security incidents alongside another list with only some of the same incidents. Per the language in WP:G14, the set index would "perform a disambiguation-like function" even though it is not technically a disambiguation page. Support the move in principle otherwise. Ivanvector (^Talk/_Edits) 15:10, 18 October 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Oppose per Ivanvector. * Pppery * _{it has begun...} 22:37, 19 October 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Support in principle. There is No Primary Topic, but I do agree with Pppery and Ivanvector that this list could be better merged into the security incidents article. I think it is best for two separate discussions though to avoid this one losing focus, but consider this as a pre-eminent vote to support merging Security incidents involving Donald Trump and this article into one, if such discussion comes to pass. InvadingInvader (userpage, talk) 13:50, 24 October 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Oppose per SilverLocust above. The rename of the WP:PRIMARYTOPIC was only to be more consistent after the rename of the other assassination attempt. That doesn’t mean that it isn’t still the primary topic and is only naturally disambiguating two events that could be easily confused with each other. The way it is now with a hatnote to the DAB page is the least confusing way of conveying information and directing readers to the correct article. cyberdog958^Talk 19:10, 24 October 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Support as WP:NOPRIMARYTOPIC; we don't have enough long-term data to determine what will become the primary topic (I can assume it'll be the Pennsylvania incident but WP:CRYSTAL and all.) Move it and we can re-evaluate in 6 months to a year and see what the data supports as the primary topic. RachelTensions (talk) 17:03, 26 October 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Oppose. Here in Australia, the Pennsylvania incident was all over the news, and heaps of people were talking about it. (As an immigrant from the US, I got plenty of questions about it from indigenous-born people.) On the other hand, I don't remember the Florida incident ever coming up in our news or in face-to-face conversations; all I saw was a few social media posts by Trump fans, questioning whether it were a real assassination attempt or a Democratic conspiracy. I just now looked for all of this because I was wondering if the Florida incident even had a Wikipedia article, or if it had been a minor enough incident that it would just be redirected somewhere. Nyttend (talk) 05:25, 27 October 2024 (UTC)[reply]
This isn't a proper rationale to assert a primary topic (WP:BUTIKNOWABOUTIT) RachelTensions (talk) 08:16, 27 October 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Did you read my rationale? It wasn't the subject of coverage in our news here, except maybe as a minor note that most people would have overlooked. As noted by the page you link, certain groups naturally see certain things as significant that are otherwise less significant, e.g. Birmingham covering the UK city despite many Americans being more familiar with Birmingham, Alabama. Maybe many American publishers covered both of these incidents equally, but judging by the Australian press, the Pennsylvania incident was easily the primary topic in international news coverage. Nyttend (talk) 19:39, 27 October 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Refactor. "Attempted assassination of Donald Trump" isn't an ambiguous name, but a generic descriptive phrase. As such, I can see three possibilities:
1. Move the content to an "Assassination attempts" section on Donald Trump.
2. Move to the title "Attempted assassinations of Donald Trump" and format it as a list/set index article.
3. Move to the title "Attempted assassinations of Donald Trump" and restructure it giving a summary of each, with links to the main articles, maybe taking text from Donald Trump and/or the individual instance articles.
Maybe we could do 2, with a view to expanding it to the effect of 3 later.... — Smjg (talk) 15:23, 9 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Support. WP:NOPRIMARYTOPIC. Theparties (talk) 00:26, 11 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Oppose The primary topic in terms of attempted Trump assassinations is obviously going to be the one where he was injured. The attempt in Florida was negligible and was unlikely to kill him, and the Las Vegas incident even more so. 2A02:C7C:2DCE:1F00:A17E:B543:281:C2BF (talk) 20:16, 15 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]

The primary topic guidelines leave open many criteria, but those ones that you are suggesting (the fact of his injury and the actual risk to his life) are new to me and don't seem directly relevant here. They may make the topic more newsworthy, and that might make the topic fit the existing main criteria of likelihood to be sought and of long-term significance, but that's an effect and doesn't make them useful criteria per se. And there's no evidence that they have had that effect in this case. Andrewa (talk) 03:56, 26 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Support. No evidence that there is a primary topic. Andrewa (talk) 03:56, 26 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]

The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.