Talk:Kylie Minogue/Archive 5

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Dead external links to Allmusic website – December 2010

Since Allmusic have changed the syntax of their URLs, 1 link(s) used in the article do not work anymore and can't be migrated automatically. Please use the search option on http://www.allmusic.com to find the new location of the linked Allmusic article(s) and fix the link(s) accordingly. If a new location cannot be found, the link(s) should be removed. This applies to the following external links:

• http://www.allmusic.com/cg/amg.dll?p=amg&sql=10:7u0qoarawij9~T1

--CactusBot (talk) 13:16, 31 December 2010 (UTC)  Fixed--Cactus26 (talk) 10:00, 9 January 2011 (UTC)

iPhone Game

See here --Cprice1000talk2me 06:00, 11 January 2011 (UTC)

Reliable source? --BwB (talk) 09:36, 11 January 2011 (UTC)

[1] --ĈÞЯİŒ 1ооо 18:45, 11 January 2011 (UTC)

Other honours and awards

Kylie is also an Honorary Member of the Junior Common Room [JCR] of St Edmund Hall [SEH] [ http://www.seh.ox.ac.uk/ ], a College at the University of Oxford. This occurred in 1989 when Members of the SEH JCR, somewhat cheekily, wrote to Kylie inviting her to accept the award which she duly did by turning up in person and posing for photographs! The photograph of her being hugged by a couple of our rugby-playing undergraduates can still be seen displayed on the wall of "The Well" (one of the College's two student bars).

Drseuk (talk) 10:44, 28 February 2011 (UTC)

Not sure if this is Wiki material? --BwB (talk) 11:07, 28 February 2011 (UTC)

Other Activity section

I note the information about her book and perfumes is placed in the Cancer section, should we have another section for these other ventures? RoyalBlueStuey (talk) 12:28, 28 February 2011 (UTC)

That seems to make scents!. --BwB (talk) 12:41, 28 February 2011 (UTC)

Very good *cap doffed* RoyalBlueStuey (talk) 13:32, 28 February 2011 (UTC)

Linking

The page Kylie (disambiguation) is getting quite large, my question is, when is it large enough to directly link the page Kylie to it? Or is it always going to point to this page, because it's the most probable reason someone searches for Kylie? 93.125.198.182 (talk) 16:27, 27 June 2011 (UTC)

Edit request from , 6 October 2011

{{edit semi-protected}}

Dr Kylie Minogue.

Article should be mentioned under the "Cancer" section of her Wikipedia. http://www.dailymail.co.uk/tvshowbiz/article-2045707/Kylie-Mingoue-accepts-honorary-doctorate-Essex.html

Jenjanex (talk) 01:13, 6 October 2011 (UTC)

The reuqest is not specific; what do you mean by "Article should be mentioned"? Please elaborate, and make a more specific request. This template may only be used when followed by a specific description of the request, that is, specify what text should be removed and a verbatim copy of the text that should replace it. "Please change X" is not acceptable and will be rejected; the request must be of the form "please change X to Y".. Thanks,  Chzz  ►  00:24, 14 October 2011 (UTC)

points of intrets

Loves Riding horses and she loves pets especially Kittens. Has a love for Taking photos she has so many poses she could use!

School At school she loved maths and converting lengths — Preceding unsigned comment added by 61.8.97.122 (talk) 02:20, 21 March 2012 (UTC)

Songs recorded or written by Kylie Minogue, but never released.

Is there anything of worth at User:Tlogmer/Kylie? Consider commenting at Wikipedia:Miscellany for deletion/User:Tlogmer/Kylie. --SmokeyJoe (talk) 04:44, 6 April 2012 (UTC)

Signature for infobox

Does anyone have one to add to the infobox? It can be added to the bottom as an image just like in the Beyoncé Knowles article. Thanks Jenova20 15:03, 23 May 2012 (UTC)

Shoes

In 2007, German band Planetakis had a rather successful song (in German and English) called "Pogo in the Shoes of Kylie Minogue" (or "Pogo in den Schuhen von Kylie Minogue"). I can't help but feel that this should be mentioned... somewhere. Any suggestions? DS (talk) 01:12, 15 June 2012 (UTC)

"highest selling single of the decade"

Someone with editing rights please fix the grammar by adding a hyphen: "highest-selling". It is not any "selling record" that happened to be at the top of a hill. 86.182.10.94 (talk) 22:03, 18 June 2012 (UTC)

 Done. DS (talk) 13:11, 20 June 2012 (UTC)

Showgirl

I know she uses that description. But has she ever really worked in form that fits that description ? As opposed to using that style in her performances as a singer ? -- Beardo (talk) 19:13, 16 September 2012 (UTC)

I think "Showgirl" is more of a nickname or a stage name and it was the name for two of her tours. I don't think Kylie is a "showgirl" because of her tours and performances as a singer because if she is, then we should call the other female artists a showgirl too. --SuperHotWiki (talk) 05:11, 17 September 2012 (UTC)

Personal Life?

Hey! I was looking through many other artists including Celine Dion, Madonna and such, and I didn't come across any article citing "Personal Life". I thought it would have been more better if information in that "Personal Life" article (e.g. her relationship with Andres Velencoso) would be spread out in the primary Kylie Minogue article. And plus, I noted that most of the "Personal Life" article is only information about her cancer diagnosis. Should this be changed or keep it as personal life??? Please answer, need some help. (GirlsAlouud (talk · contribs} 01:22, 16 November 2012 (UTC)).

Abbey Road Sessions

Abbey Road Sessions should not be referred to and categorized as a compilation album. It's KM's 12th studio album, consisting of all new recordings. "Compilation album" denotes a collection of previously recorded/released material (such as her Best Of collection released four months prior to Abbey Road Sessions). — Preceding unsigned comment added by Ananda62 (talk • contribs) 12:21, 8 November 2012 (UTC)

It is not a studio album. A lot of music websites consider the album as a compilation album. --SuperHotWiki (talk) 11:09, 30 November 2012 (UTC)

The Goddess of Pop

Hi. "The Goddess of Pop" shouldn't be in this article, unless it's referenced by reliable sources; clearly that's not the case. The first ref refers to her as a "Pop Goddess", and the second ref is a comment box-it is wrong in so many levels. Lordelliott (talk) 17:30, 24 November 2012 (UTC)

First: there are appropriate templates, to determination dubious sources. Second: your editing is controversial (delete of text and sources), you must first discuss it. If by consensus, content and source must be removed, will be removed. Thirdly: Google shows thousands of results (for Kylie Minogue "Goddess of Pop"), just find the respective sources. Fourth: one source describes the term "Pop Goddess", this is a different situation, in this case is can not be removed the text and the sources. Fifth: for you, this source can be a non reliable, for other users this source can be a reliable - therefore it must be earlier discussion and consensus, later - changes. Subtropical-man (talk) 18:42, 24 November 2012 (UTC)

A bit late on the name ..used for decades to describe Cher in real publication like rolling stone - Time life etc... got any refs of this caliber for Kylie Minogue? Moxy (talk) 18:58, 24 November 2012 (UTC)

The sources should be reliable for Wikipedia criteria, not for "other users". You should "find the respective sources", not me, because you are the one who's keeping the info on the article. This is a Featured Article, and these sources aren't acceptable even for a good article. Lordelliott (talk) 19:02, 24 November 2012 (UTC)

Source no.1 meets of requirement of Wikipedia policy. Besides, I'm not alone on Wikipedia, if google shows thousands of results, everyone can find to add new sources. There just takes time and a willingness - no more. Subtropical-man (talk) 19:08, 24 November 2012 (UTC)

That's common sense: if YOU want to add new info, YOU should present the sources, not give the work to other users just because the sources can be found on Google. Also, the first ref calls her "a real pop goddess", NOT "The Goddess of Pop". Lordelliott (talk) 19:14, 24 November 2012 (UTC)

This text existed a long time and I did not add to the article. Yes, the first ref calls her a "pop goddess", not "The Goddess of Pop" but this is reliable source and you have called it differently. Otherwise, I'm not alone on Wikipedia, if google shows thousands of results, everyone can find to add new sources. There just takes time and a willingness - no more. I do not write directly to you, I write to each other users. Subtropical-man (talk) 19:25, 24 November 2012 (UTC)

What you're trying to say doesn't make any sense. This text was added to the article after it was promoted as a FA (obviously|, with unreliable sources. The first one is reliable, but is not a source to "The Goddess of Pop" claim actually. The latter is unreliable in all meanings. If you want to keep the information, go on and find reliable sources yourself. I tried to search for reliable sources and I just found blogs and gossip sites. Lordelliott (talk) 19:30, 24 November 2012 (UTC)

So i see an edit war over talking ...not good - 3 revert blocks may be forth coming if others see this war. That said we need to remove the guess work added = quote "indicating her presence and longevity in pop music." ..pure speculation - guess work - any-source for this bold statement.Moxy (talk) 19:55, 24 November 2012 (UTC)

I think the book is a self-published source, and I also think that it takes more than 2 references to actually "give" someone a title like that, but I will not discuss anymore, since this article was promoted as a FA six years ago and now it clearly doesn't meet FA's standards. Anyway, I've made a little adjust. Lordelliott (talk) 19:56, 24 November 2012 (UTC)

"I also think that it takes more than 2 references to actually "give" someone a title like that" - meanwhile, sufficient number of sources (2+1). New sources will be in the future, according to what I wrote earlier "I'm not alone on Wikipedia, if google shows thousands of results, everyone can find and add new (adjective) sources". In the meantime, thank you for cooperation. Subtropical-man (talk) 20:04, 24 November 2012 (UTC)

"In the future", because today there's not many reliable sources on the web calling her the "Goddess of Pop", as opposed to Cher, or MJ as the "King", etc. Since there's also not many users who are interested in maintaining the quality of this article, there's nothing I can do. Good edits. Lordelliott (talk) 20:08, 24 November 2012 (UTC)

Kylie is indeed in the Goddess of Pop but this is coming from a big time Kylie Minogue fan and her Wikipedia page should be neutral as possible.--SuperHotWiki (talk) 11:10, 30 November 2012 (UTC)

Suggest

I suggest add "Teen pop" to the article, her first albums and singles it was also teen pop. Subtropical-man (talk) 15:39, 25 January 2013 (UTC)

I disagree I think she is barely thought of as Teen Pop and the current genres listed are more then adequate. Ridernyc (talk) 16:35, 25 January 2013 (UTC)

You are wrong. Teen Pop is genre which formerly was done by the artist, should be this information in the article. And also, on Wikipedia not exist words "are more then adequate". If the singer has for example 20 occupations/jobs, 20 occupations/jobs should be written in article, if the singer has for example 8 genres of music, 8 genres of music should be written in article. Wikipedia is encyclopedia, encyclopedia is base of knowledge. Kylie Minogue is (mainly) singer, you delete information about acting? because singer is more then adequate. Subtropical-man (talk) 17:08, 25 January 2013 (UTC)

Edit request on 4 January 2013

Please remove 'Showgirl' from lists of occupations or epithets in this article. As discussed, Kylie Minogue has not worked as a 'showgirl' per se (eg. in the Moulin Rouge or at Caesar's Palace) as her chief occupation - it's an affectation or persona she took on at a particular point in her career. If there is a source or reference recording her work as a professional showgirl, it should be included and further expansion on this work included in the article. Shiniqa (talk) 23:25, 4 January 2013 (UTC)

 Done Pol430 talk to me 22:38, 14 January 2013 (UTC)

Thanks Pol430, but 'Showgirl' still appearing in the list of occupations in the 'Background Information' sidebar. Can it also be removed, as in main text? Sorry to go on, but this kind of thing really lessens Wikipedia! - important that a 'featured article' is the very best it can be.

Y Done MadGuy7023 (talk) 23:44, 4 February 2013 (UTC)

Kylie's sexuality?

OK, so I was doing some research, I came across this article Kylie Minogue: I'm bisexual!. Because there is a personal life part in the article, do you think it will be appropriate to add this point it? She has stated: "I fancy girls", "I have been attracted to some women. I am a sexual exhibitionist and part of me is a natural flirt [...]." GirlsAlouud (talk · contribs} 02:49, 24 December 2012 (UTC)

I've seen the interview and all comments and articles about her sexuality are totally out of context. --212.23.103.66 (talk) 22:29, 7 February 2013 (UTC)

Life and Career

Suggestion for change:

2013: Upcoming twelfth studio album

In January 2013, Minogue and her manager Terry Blamey, who has worked with her since the start of her musical beginnings, have parted ways.[120] The next month, she was signed to Roc Nation for a management deal while her label Parlophone was finally sold to Warner.[A] Minogue is currently recording on her twelfth studio album since the spring of 2012 and the lead single is slated to be released soon.[121] She will also play a lead role in the upcoming musical film Walking on Sunshine alongside English actress Gemma Arterton.[122]

A - Warner Music buys Parlophone label - http://www.guardian.co.uk/business/2013/feb/07/warnewr-music-parlophone-record-deal --212.23.103.66 (talk) 22:40, 7 February 2013 (UTC)

Filmography (Film & Television)

Why are so many films missing in her filmography? It should be give all movies IMDb has. -> http://www.imdb.com/name/nm0001541/?ref_=fn_al_nm_1 --212.23.103.74 (talk) 21:52, 10 February 2013 (UTC)

Error in 1.2

Where is says Minogue's debut album, Kylie was released in July 1998 -- should be 1988.

218.82.109.177 (talk) 23:08, 13 February 2013 (UTC)

Y Done MadGuy7023 (talk) 16:59, 15 February 2013 (UTC)

Edit request on 28 May 2013

There is a problem with this part: "On May 28, one of the producers of the album, Nom De Strip revealed a new track by Minogue entitled "Skirt", which was released on her 45th birthday. The song is rumored to be on her studio album."

The last sentence is too much of a fanboy reaction than a rational info. I would expect more of a semi-protected page! The protection should insure fact quality instead of being a rumor mill.

It's not clear if the song is part of the new album or if it is an early rejected song who the producer has the liberty to release without him being sued.

The easiest way to fix this is to delete the last sentence: The song is rumored to be on her studio album.

212.23.103.74 (talk) 16:45, 28 May 2013 (UTC)

Done --ElHef (Meep?) 18:47, 28 May 2013 (UTC)

It should also be known that the released song is actually a club mix by Chris Lake. This has not been directly verified but has been suggested and should be noted ErdoS (talk) 19:01, 28 May 2013 (UTC)

No, please stick with the facts. Chris Lake played a club (dub?) mix in a Ibiza club on Saturday and on Tuesday the producer Nom de Strip released the orignal version on his Soundcloud account. Chris Lake tweeted the proof:

@<a href="https://twitter.com/muumuse">muumuse</a> that's the original ;)

— Chris Lake (@chrislake) <a href="https://twitter.com/chrislake/status/339247694130335744">28. Mai 2013</a>

<script async src="//platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script> BTW, the song "Skirt" is based on "Shake & Bake" by Bones & Nom the Strip. --212.23.103.74 (talk) 21:21, 28 May 2013 (UTC)

References

Update main picture

The main article picture needs to be updated to one from 2013. Might I suggest this one? http://www.zimbio.com/photos/Kylie+Minogue/Arrivals+Unforgettable+Evening/2psLF3l3gM9

Let's go through the ritual... (talk) 05:26, 24 May 2013 (UTC)

Go for it!--SuperHotWiki (talk) 06:50, 24 May 2013 (UTC)

Yes, please! The one used right now is at least 6 years old. Artists like her, Rihanna or Katy Perry change their look way more than 3 times a year. --212.23.103.74 (talk) 21:28, 28 May 2013 (UTC)

This is the file http://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:KylieMinogueEIF2013.jpg could someone please check that everything is correct and then put it at the top of the article. Thanks. Let's go through the ritual... (talk) 07:27, 24 May 2013 (UTC)

I like that the picture will be changed but is there some other picture options we can look into? ErdoS (talk) 15:25, 24 May 2013 (UTC)

Perhaps we should wait until the new album era begins? Let's go through the ritual... (talk) 03:44, 26 May 2013 (UTC)

Nah you can just change it again. I think some images here explain her new situation well https://www.google.com/search?q=kylie+roc+nation&source=lnms&tbm=isch&sa=X&ei=jqehUeOmFYOW0QHLhYGwAg&sqi=2&ved=0CAcQ_AUoAQ&biw=1366&bih=634#imgrc=_ ErdoS (talk) 06:12, 26 May 2013 (UTC)

This is a nice picture http://www.zimbio.com/pictures/JFjOBSQnXEv/Roc+Nation+Pre+Grammy+Brunch/rMz1GpZiI7f/Kylie+Minogue - could someone do it for me because I did it incorrectly last time as I'm not sure of the correct rights and licences so that it isn't deleted. Let's go through the ritual... (talk) 00:54, 28 May 2013 (UTC)

I did it, not sure if correct. Please correct it if there's any issues [[2]] Let's go through the ritual... (talk) 07:35, 31 May 2013 (UTC)

Photographs from photo agencies like Bauer Griffin are almost always under copyright and not released under free licenses. This is true for pretty much any image you'll come across through a Google image search. --Mosmof (talk) 04:10, 2 June 2013 (UTC)

Record sales

The 68 million figure, regarding her record sales, is often noted whilst describing her. The figure has been used for at least the past five years as this 2009 article from four years ago demonstrates. As a result, the figures do not seem to take into account subsequent worldwide sales, and considering that Minogue released a studio album (Aprodite) in 2010, a live album (Aprodite Les Folies: Live in London) in 2011, and two compilation albums (The Best of Kylie Minogue) and (The Abbey Road Sessions), both in 2012; judging by this, and her numerous singles sales, the figure therefore seems slightly redundant.

Music magazine Billboard in June 2013 described her as "more than 70 million records" [3] which, for obvious reasons, is more accurate. This needs to be updated.

Patyo1994 (talk) 00:02, 17 July 2013 (UTC)

Photo restored to 2007 version

Hello chaps, I've taken the liberty of restoring the 2007 photo as the lead image in the old infobox what! The one of her in the gold dress was blurred and out of focus and made it dashed hard to see what this rather tiny (though perfectly formed!) young lady actually looks like! For reference here are the three images we've had recently and my assessment.

• 
  Current image. Pros - Clear, face shot. Cons - out of date, not the highest resolution
• 
  Pro - higher resolution. Cons - INCREDIBLY unflattering (possibly to the point of a WP:BLP problem?), not a face shot.
• 
  Pro - again higher resolution. Cons - blurry, out of focus and hard to make out facial features which is the point of the principal image as I understand it.

A quick gander at [4] suggests the 2007 image is still the best visual representation of the lass in my book! We could possibly use a more up to date image, but only if it's going to be of comparable quality and composition methinks!. Quintessential British Gentleman (talk) 01:56, 19 November 2013 (UTC)

I've changed it to File:Kylie Minogue (6805219672).jpg, as it is clear, not unflattering, shows her full face, and is the most recent photo in a decent resolution.—Ryulong (琉竜) 16:44, 28 November 2013 (UTC)

I reverted this change, to infobox not add pictures of people in unusual costumes, Wikipedia is encyclopedia, not freakshow (no offense to anyone, especially for the wonderful Kylie :). Besides, the picture has many drawbacks: poor quality, too dark and also in the frame there are other people. Please not change pictures, before consensus (Wikipedia:Consensus). Subtropical-man (talk) 17:31, 28 November 2013 (UTC)

I searched all photos in the Commons. Generally, today - 28 November 2013, only two pictures are suitable for infobox (below). Both pictures has the advantages and disadvantages:

• 
  Clear, face shot. Cons - out of date, not the highest resolution
• 
  Current, higher resolution but out of focus

which better? Subtropical-man (talk) 17:51, 28 November 2013 (UTC)

I have no idea what the hell you mean by "to infobox not add pictures of people in unusual costumes". As an encyclopedia, we should provide a photo that most accurately depicts the subject in the infobox, and Kylie has in her career donned several strange costumes as part of her performances, as have other artists such as Lady Gaga, Nicki Minaj, Kesha, and Little Boots, all of whom feature non-standard wardrobes in their infobox photos. And no one participated in this discussion and I found a suitable alternative.—Ryulong (琉竜) 19:34, 28 November 2013 (UTC)

The Cannes shot is so much better. The quality of picture looks better. The subject can be seen clearly, not like the Nobel Prize Concert (orange dress) photo. It's to blurry and her actual facial expressions seem distorted slightly. The Cannes photo is old but by far the better of the two, and the subject has not changed in appearance to much over the elapsed time. Alternatively, this photo might be of use:

• 
  Minogue, 2009

Personally however, I still believe the best and most accurate photograph is the Cannes photo. The 2012 photo is from afar and seems like one that would be used in lieu of the availability of any photograph actually documenting the subject's face. Patyo1994 (talk) 01:53, 29 November 2013 (UTC)

Ryulong,

1. pictures of Lady Gaga and Kesha has good quality, Nicki Minaj slightly worse, your picture of Kylie is poor quality, too dark and also in the frame there are other people

• 
  good quality, good pose, I see very small objections
• 
  average quality, apparently there was no better pictures, clothing consistent with their style
• 
  average quality, apparently there was no better pictures, clothing consistent with their style
• 
  your picture is poor quality, too dark and also in the frame there are other people, 1/3 of picture is panache, some flowers or something like. Definitely the worst picture of these four.

2. also Lady Gaga style is 100% cosmic/freak disguise, Kesha and Nicki Minaj is bitc* style, this is normal for them. Kylie is not, Kylie use non-standard wardrobes only in concerts (not all); in film, TV, life etc - not. For Lady Gaga, Kesha, Nicki Minaj non-standard wardrobes is standard, so photos in infobox no one is astonished. Moreover, the clothes of Lady Gaga, Kesha, Nicki Minaj are not tragic but Kylie in panache (1/3 of picture) is scandal in infobox.

3. also, nearly whole Wikipedia use standard pictures, only few scandalous stars has in infobox non-standard wardrobes.

Patyo1994, also User:Quintessential British Gentleman support Cannes shot, I support both: Cannes and "orange dress", so - restore to 2007 (Cannes) version, until done better images and a new consensus. Subtropical-man (talk) 14:41, 29 November 2013 (UTC)

Just wondering if it's possible to use a photo from The Voice UK launch under any sort of licence? Is it possible someone has a free use one? Let's go through the ritual... (talk) 04:46, 7 January 2014 (UTC)

Natalia Jayden

Does anyone know this young lady? She is a Dutch-Polish singer-songwriter, and you can find information that she wrote some songs for Kylie. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 46.215.26.185 (talk) 18:25, 7 January 2014 (UTC)

Reception content

I have reinstated a statement from Guardian critic Michael Cragg, in accordance with the "Reception" content of other artists' pages.--Soulparadox (talk) 01:31, 20 April 2014 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 17 April 2014

Article refers to Sir Tom Jones as a "pop singer" I think he is a bit more than that :)

Cymplecy (talk) 23:09, 17 April 2014 (UTC)

Not done: it's not clear what changes you want made. Please mention the specific changes in a "change X to Y" format. (t) Josve05a (c) 23:16, 17 April 2014 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 18 August 2014

On Friday, August 15, PWL announced that it would be reissuing special editions of Kylie Minogue's first four albums, in tandem with fellow UK independent record label Cherry Red. Each release will be digitally remastered from the original studio tapes - Kylie (1988), Enjoy Yourself (1989), Rhythm Of Love (1990) and Let’s Get To It (1991) - and will be reissued on October 27.

Journovampire (talk) 10:33, 18 August 2014 (UTC)

Where in the article should this go? (Please change the "answered" field back to "no" when you've replied). Stickee (talk) 02:49, 5 September 2014 (UTC)

Australian or Australian-British?

My understanding is that Minogue has British citizenship through her Welsh grandmother, which makes her Australian-British. I can't find a cite, but she has received an OBE, which I think is reserved for British citizens, isn't it? Though she's usually identified as Australian, I think her British-ness is at least as notable as Australian-ness: She's considered a "national treasure" in Britain, and she's received an OBE. Her music is a product of the British pop music scene (SAW, etc.), and she's often perceived as being a British artist by Americans. I don't mean to belittle the importance of Australia in Minogue's career, as Australia has been vital to her career (Neighbours, Michael Hutchence, Nick Cave, Intimate & Live, Mardi Gras, Olympics), and Australia also considers her a "national treasure". But she really belongs to both countries, and the lead sentence should say that. 96.45.196.227 (talk) 20:33, 7 September 2010 (UTC)

WP:MOSBIO says "In most modern-day cases this will mean the country of which the person is a citizen or national, or was a citizen when the person became notable." Minogue became notable first in Australia. It is her mother who is Welsh, by the way. If Americans perceive her as a British artist, that is not enough justification to refer to her as such here. The media, even in the U.S., refers to her as Australian. I think it should remain as is. Rossrs (talk) 22:41, 7 September 2010 (UTC)

During promotional duties for Aphrodite, Kylie was quizzed about the then upcoming Australian 2010 election, she revealed in her response that she possesses dual citizenship for Autralia and Britain, and hence still had to vote. Also an OBE can be awarded to anyone who is a resident and/or citizen of a member nation of the Commonwealth of Nations, the former British Empire, of which Australia is, being a former colony. She's also been awarded a French cultural order, sort of an equivilent, though not being French herself. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 101.170.145.239 (talk) 17:08, 8 October 2011 (UTC)

An OBE can be given to anyone of any nationality. However, a full OBE is reserved for those who are citizens of commonwealth realms - a nation where Queen Elizabeth II is head of state. As Australia is currently one of these Kylie's OBE is a full OBE. If the recipient is not a citizen of a commonwealth realm (which includes the majority of the Commonwealth) it is termed an honary OBE (e.g. Henry Winkler). So Kylie can write Kylie Minogue OBE, Henry will need to put Henry Winkler OBE(hon) to show the difference between the two. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 78.149.161.232 (talk) 14:32, 31 December 2011 (UTC)

Generally, Kylie live in UK, also work here. That settles the matter. This not only British citizenship, Welsh grandmother and full Order of the British Empire. In the media (depending on the state) is identified with both the Australian and/or British. I support the solution (Australian-British). Subtropical-man (talk) 15:08, 31 December 2011 (UTC)

Definitely not. Kylie is an Aussie, probably the most famous Aussie in pop. As a Brit living in the UK, i have never come across Kylie referred to anything other than an Aussie.Chie one (talk) 20:12, 10 March 2012 (UTC)

Actually OBE's are not available to Australians anymore. Unlike New Zealand which recently returned British honours, Australia, like Canada have their own honours system. Britney Speres has a British grandmother, is she British? America is a former British colony, are they British? I think not.60.224.160.192 (talk) 07:39, 22 November 2012 (UTC)

Generally, Kylie live in UK, also work here. That settles the matter. This not "only" British citizenship, Welsh grandmother and full Order of the British Empire. Please see another example: Arnold Schwarzenegger. Arnold was born in Austria, but lives and works in the United States. So, please see intro about Arnold: "Arnold Schwarzenegger (born July 30, 1947) is an Austrian and American former professional bodybuilder, actor, businessman, investor, and politician". Rightly. Subtropical-man (talk) 17:58, 22 November 2012 (UTC)

No matter what the lead-in should be, shouldn't the article mention British citizenship somewhere?--Prosfilaes (talk) 03:41, 15 October 2014 (UTC)

Legacy

Should the "Legacy" section be renamed something like "Influence"? "Legacy" makes it sound like Minogue has died or that she's no longer influential. – Acdx (talk) 04:01, 10 January 2015 (UTC)

Request

Please can we have a PERSONAL INFO section for Kylie with info about her family life. Thx —Preceding unsigned comment added by 85.210.54.199 (talk) 18:46, 25 December 2010 (UTC)

It was decided not to have a Personal life section in this article. The Early life and career beginnings section mentions her parents and siblings. For over two years, she has been in a relationship with Andres Velencoso, which is stated and sourced on his article. It should be included in this article, but I can't work out where best to include it with the article structured as it is. Jim Michael (talk) 16:14, 29 December 2010 (UTC)

Dude that is bullshit. Why do you have one for every other signer and actress but not Kylie? You should write one up there.

This article absolutely needs a personal info section. Who 'decided' that it was not needed? There is no mention of her relationship with Jason Donovan which was huge at the time or Michael Hutchson from INXS which, again, was huge - or the French model that she went out with for ages. Not having a personal section seriously compromises this article. You can't find a place to put in something about her current relationship - because there is no personal info section - which is the best place for it! Is there no personal info section because Kylie has never married and doesn't have children? If so, that is really unfair.

Even if you don't write anything else about personal life, then the title "personal life" should be changed to "cancer" or something of that kind as that section does not speak much of anything else212.93.105.33 (talk) 07:24, 13 April 2012 (UTC)

That section looks odd to me starting at 2002. Other artists have fuller sections on their personal lives. There is a big gap there. -- Beardo (talk) 17:41, 16 September 2012 (UTC)

There should be a mention of her relationship with Jason Donovan and the other popular celebrities that she dated in the past.--SuperHotWiki (talk) 05:08, 17 September 2012 (UTC)

The word "most" should be removed from the phrase "most catchiest" it is a redundancy. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 108.72.31.24 (talk) 15:31, 15 February 2015 (UTC)

Leaving Label Parlophone and Management Roc Nation

After only a couple of years Kylie is leaving her management at Jay Z's Roc Nation. In like manner Ms. Minogue parts with Parlophone, her label of 16 years. Kylie Minogue LEAVES Jay Z’s label after 'two years of professional disappointment' --46.114.130.28 (talk) 14:08, 19 March 2015 (UTC)

Young & Hungry

Kylie Minogue will be on two episodes of the US comedy series "Young & Hungry". The upcoming second season will premiere on March 25, 2015. "Minogue will guest star as 'Shauna', a charming and quick-witted tech reporter who hits it off with Josh (Jonathan Sadowski)." Kylie Minogue to Guest Star on ABC Family's 'Young & Hungry' --46.114.130.28 (talk) 14:20, 19 March 2015 (UTC)

Thank you for the information. The information was entered into the table in Kylie_Minogue_filmography#Television. Subtropical-man talk
(en-2) 19:06, 19 March 2015 (UTC)

Thanks for adding the guest appearance. She did 2 episodes though. Her 2nd episode "Young & Ferris Wheel" is missing. --176.0.77.155 (talk) 19:32, 30 May 2015 (UTC)

Discography page needs to be protected too.

There's an IP who infalted Kylie's sales all the time. I can't stand him anymore!--88marcus (talk) 16:21, 10 June 2015 (UTC)

Crystallize; 4 July 2015

Ok, I just wanted to add a link to Crystallize (Kylie Minogue song) right here:

• Member's of the public are asked to donate money by buying a musical note from eBay site from Minogue's charity single "Crystallize".

As her last single, I think it would be right to add link like this: Crystallize. What you say?

Sueño1989 (talk) 09:22, 4 July 2015 (UTC)

 Done - Arjayay (talk) 15:17, 5 July 2015 (UTC)

Trivial info and neutrality issues in lead

The current lead is an absolute mess. There's a lot of trivial information that doesn't belong in an introductory section, peacock wording, and puffery. It's pretty obvious that this was written by a fan. I'd try to clean it up, but I don't know enough about Minogue to determine what should stay and what should go. Can a more knowledgeable editor please take a look at this? In the meantime, I will be adding a neutrality tag until these issues are addressed. Chase (talk | contributions) 04:54, 20 July 2015 (UTC)

I'm not convinced this meets the FA criteria based on neutrality and lead concerns from a glance. Sourcing also needs work. Let's see if anyone can fix it up. Snuggums (talk / edits) 02:21, 21 July 2015 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 6 August 2015

Spelling mistake - please change "desert" to "dessert".

Timinuk (talk) 23:29, 6 August 2015 (UTC)

Done Stickee (talk) 23:36, 6 August 2015 (UTC)

Des nouvelles de Kylie Minogue

Bonjour Je suis Crescent15. Je suis française aussi. S'il vous plaît ajouter "Kylie On Stage" - l'exposition au Arts Centre Melbourne ( artscentremelbourne.com.au) et aussi les nouvelles de sa nouveau film "Flammable Children" qui va filmés bientôt en Australie avec Guy Pearce ( 9news.com.au 29 septembre 2016) Merci beaucoup Crescent15 (talk) 13:02, 29 September 2016 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 16 December 2016

I would like to change the information about Kylie Minogue being known simply as Kylie and replace it with her using it as a pseudonym which has become her stage name in recent times. LobsterLover (talk) 22:43, 16 December 2016 (UTC)

Not done: please establish a consensus for this alteration before using the {{edit semi-protected}} template. - Mlpearc (open channel) 22:47, 16 December 2016 (UTC)

Prince Andrew

She is reportedly now dating Prince Andrew. Section on relationships thus requires update. 87.205.240.168 (talk) —Preceding undated comment added 11:27, 26 May 2017 (UTC)

Paralympics

This is incorrect: Minogue during the opening ceremony of the 2000 Sydney Summer Paralympics, where she performed a cover of ABBA's "Dancing Queen" and her single "On a Night Like This".[69]

She actually performed Waltzing Matilda, Spinning Around and Celebration. The songs stated were performed at the Olympics Closing.

Sources:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xikt4Fo2EsU

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CNnJ6-MBHdQ

60 million records

She's sold much more than this, could somebody source and update it? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 91.49.38.228 (talk) 16:26, 3 April 2011 (UTC)

I was thinking the same, until I went through and added up all the sales from her individual album and single pages and found that it is right about 60 million records. Anyway, your request has been answered by somebody, as it has been updated to 68 million. --ĈÞЯİŒ 1ооо 20:51, 17 June 2011 (UTC)

There's been various figures that has been bandied about in the media regarding her record sales. At the 2008 Brit Awards, it was announced that she had sold 68 million records. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 14.192.212.148 (talk) 22:15, 13 August 2017 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 8 November 2017

Please add the following info below by adding a trivia section:

• Kylie Minogue’s body mass index (BMI) is calculated to be 20.
• Her weight is at a marginally lower level; in http://smartbmicalculator.com’s view, it still should still be fine for her health. By classification of the WHO, she is "normalweight". KylieStarzz (talk) 13:46, 8 November 2017 (UTC)

Not done: please provide reliable sources that support the change you want to be made. Eggishorn (talk) (contrib) 16:14, 8 November 2017 (UTC)

Cancer

According to this article as it stands, Kylie still has cancer as of 2019.... She was diagnosed with it in 2005, and apart from getting treatment, no further pronouncements have been made... according to this article 81.153.82.140 (talk) 18:45, 30 June 2019 (UTC)

Name

"Kylie" is the singer's mononym. It's not a pseudonym, nickname, stage name or pen name; hence in the lede it should be mentioned by known simply as or known mononymously as not Aka. Bionic (talk) 10:53, 27 September 2019 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 14 December 2019

Please consider adding Kylie Minogue to the category 'Australian Emigrants to England' https://wiki.riteme.site/wiki/Category:Australian_emigrants_to_England 77.101.240.188 (talk) 19:38, 14 December 2019 (UTC)

 Not done for now: please establish a consensus for this alteration before using the {{edit semi-protected}} template. Article is currently in Category:Australian_emigrants_to_the_United_Kingdom, and it is not clear whether it should be in the suggested category also (or instead). RudolfRed (talk) 23:42, 14 December 2019 (UTC)

DOB unwise

I think it's quite unwise for us to include the full DOB of Kylie Minogue, especially when the reference is Hello Magazine. It's also a violation of WP:DOB, which is a part of WP:BLP and inviolable. - Chris.sherlock (talk) 05:49, 19 April 2020 (UTC)

• What is wrong with the reference? Which part of WP:DOB says to removed DOBs from articles? DOB has been on this article since 2003, how come it out of sudden became a BLP violation? It says, Wikipedia includes full names and dates of birth that have been widely published by reliable sources, or by sources linked to the subject such that it may reasonably be inferred that the subject does not object to the details being made public. Mymis (talk) 05:57, 19 April 2020 (UTC)
  • You should read the policy, which can be found here. And it doesn't infer anything of the sort. - Chris.sherlock (talk) 06:05, 19 April 2020 (UTC)
    • I did and I referenced it already in my previous reply. It says, per WP:DOB: "Wikipedia includes full names and dates of birth that have been widely published by reliable sources, or by sources linked to the subject such that it may reasonably be inferred that the subject does not object to the details being made public." It then says it could be removed if the person specifically objects to it or if the person is borderline notable which is NOT the case here. Mymis (talk)
      • So if you read it then why didn’t you provide a reliable source? - Chris.sherlock (talk) 08:02, 20 April 2020 (UTC)

The sourcing is agreed that her DOB is 28 May 1968, and there isn't much point in hiding something that an average person can find out within 30 seconds in a web search. There is also a problem with making an exception for Kylie, as it isn't usually a problem to give the full DOB of pop stars. How is someone going to misuse this information? Or will Kylie be upset if we point out that she is 51-52 years old?--♦IanMacM♦ ^{(talk to me)} 06:15, 19 April 2020 (UTC)

I added a number of sources. Complete non issue.Rain the 1 20:24, 19 April 2020 (UTC)

I agree, complete non-issue, and so I've removed the sources. We don't need five sources for the DOB (especially in the lead), as it's not controversial. Chris, with all due respect, you are WP:CRYBLPing here. Levivich ^{[dubious – discuss]} 23:14, 19 April 2020 (UTC)

I see your WP:CRYBLP and raise you a WP:CRYCRYBLP. I cannot consider you have given me any due respect. - Chris.sherlock (talk) 07:59, 20 April 2020 (UTC)

Thank you. I did attempt to do the same thing to other articles. Then I noticed the editor made mass changes to Australian females from a category and opted for ANI instead.Rain the 1 23:20, 19 April 2020 (UTC)

There is nothing wrong with the mass changes, they are quite correct. I've even discussed this on WP:AWNB. - Chris.sherlock (talk) 06:24, 20 April 2020 (UTC)

I'm not actually. It's quite clear that a tabloid magazine like Hello is not in any way a reliable source. You both need to stop violating BLP and reread WP:DOB. - Chris.sherlock (talk) 06:23, 20 April 2020 (UTC)

+1 on Hello magazine not being an ideal source; it should be better in a WP:FA. However, I'm not in any way seeing a BLP violation when countless articles about pop stars give their full DOB without this type of complaint. There has to be consistency here. Madonna (entertainer) says that she was born on August 16, 1958. Is this a BLP violation?--♦IanMacM♦ ^{(talk to me)} 06:29, 20 April 2020 (UTC)

I can’t speak for the reliability of the reference for that article - I don’t know if AllMusic is a reliable source. If they quoted a tabloid or gossip magazine, then the answer would be the same. I removed BLP violations as I saw them, I didn’t go out of my way to find them. - Chris.sherlock (talk) 07:56, 20 April 2020 (UTC)

It's a WP:SOFIXIT problem, as other people have pointed out CNN agrees that Madonna's DOB is August 16, 1958, so this could be used instead. BLP is being used as a red herring here.--♦IanMacM♦ ^{(talk to me)} 09:20, 20 April 2020 (UTC)@

Dear god, you brought up that article, not me. Fix it yourself! - Chris.sherlock (talk) 09:26, 20 April 2020 (UTC)

This thread came about because you started removing the full DOB from various Australian BLP articles, eg Ada Nicodemou in this edit, claiming that it was a BLP issue. As a general rule, it isn't a good idea to make the same edit to multiple articles without getting a WP:CONSENSUS first. As I said at WP:ANI, I'm not an expert on Australian privacy law, but a DOB in reliable mainstream sources is unlikely to be removed.--♦IanMacM♦ ^{(talk to me)} 09:34, 20 April 2020 (UTC)

Which I fully stand by. If there is unreliable sourcing around the DOB, then it clearly violates WP:DOB. The BLP policy is such that anything found violating BLP must be removed. If someone wants to come along later with a reliable source and fix this, fine. This, however, is one of the few cases where the responsibility to do so is not on the editor removing the violation. It is literally not my responsibility in terms of the BLP for me to add material but to remove violations when and where I see them. I have done so, and will continue to do do. I have taken it to the talk page, however, as there are cases where consensus is to keep the DOB. But consensus doesn't trump the policy. If the source is not reliable, then the material will be removed if it violates the BLP. I will not be adding in a full DOB myself, but then I don't have to. If editors want the full DOB and consensus is to include it due to the person being sufficiently famous or a public person, then they still have to use a reliable source. So - go do so!

One more thing - I won't be discussing other articles here. There is an AN/I thread on this issue already. I'm not going to clutter this talk page up with debates about other articles. If you wish to discuss my wider conduct, do so in the appropriate forum. This talk page is not such a place. - Chris.sherlock (talk) 09:54, 20 April 2020 (UTC)

In which case, Kylie's full DOB can be restored in this article, as there is a consensus that it is available in reliable sources.--♦IanMacM♦ ^{(talk to me)} 10:54, 20 April 2020 (UTC)

If a reliable source is used. - Chris.sherlock (talk) 20:32, 20 April 2020 (UTC)

Which I see has now been provided. - Chris.sherlock (talk) 20:35, 20 April 2020 (UTC)

Too early for Disco album

In its current format, Disco is not notable for its own article. Aside from WP:CRYSTAL, this is a future topic. The full track listing isn't known yet. There is no purpose to having the article as the information from the "background" section has already been succinctly added to the relevant section on the Kylie main article. Additionally, as the track listing isn't known yet and could change it serves no purpose. ≫ Lil-Unique1 -{ Talk }- 08:58, 4 August 2020 (UTC)

We have a release date given and a title, which do help per WP:FUTUREALBUMS, but only one confirmed song title (at the time of this writing) isn't very promising. I suppose we could incubate at draft space until more track names are given. SNUGGUMS (talk / edits) 13:33, 4 August 2020 (UTC)

I say just let the current article snowball. ---Another Believer _(Talk) 13:42, 4 August 2020 (UTC)

Looks like a lot of verifiable information, not violating CRYSTAL, even if some of it may change in the future. Develop in place. Binksternet (talk) 14:33, 4 August 2020 (UTC)

I do agree the track listing looks weird and could be removed. But there is concrete information about the title, the release date and the recording... given the artist's profile I think redirecting this could be a waste of time as it is likely to be recreated very quickly unless some protection is put in place, and I'm not sure it's worth the while. This is certainly less WP:CRYSTAL than some articles for future albums. Richard3120 (talk) 14:54, 4 August 2020 (UTC)

The interesting thing is this information is already included on the Kylie Minogue page. ≫ Lil-Unique1 -{ Talk }- 15:36, 4 August 2020 (UTC)

I know, you have a valid point. But I just think this is one of those cases where the artist is a major worldwide star and you'll be battling against repeated recreations for the next three months unless you get some protection against recreation, and I don't know if personally this is a battle I would spend my time fighting... she may not be so popular in North America but this is clearly going to be a top ten album in numerous other countries around the world and every chance of reaching number one in the UK and Ireland, there's no doubt about its eventual notability. Richard3120 (talk) 14:25, 5 August 2020 (UTC)

I’m generally supportive of an article as long as you’ve got a few RS’s, and an actual name, and enough to write a paragraph or two. This squeaks by. I’d hide the track list until a real one is announced though (unless the songs are all actually called things like “Track 9”). Sergecross73 msg me 15:41, 4 August 2020 (UTC)

• Oppose to merge. The article should remain, though I agree that the song section should be removed. Subtropical-man (✉ | en-2) 17:43, 4 August 2020 (UTC)

• Oppose to merge as well. An artwork, release date, lead single, partial track listing (credits, but not titles) is more than enough to have its own article. — Tom^(T2ME) 09:37, 6 August 2020 (UTC)

years active

According to IMDB she on-screen debuted in 1976, which'd mean that when it should say she's been active since.

IMDB is not entirely reliable per Wikipedia:Reliable_sources/Noticeboard/Archive_201#IMDB_for_some_things,_but_not_for_others?. ≫ Lil-Unique1 -{ Talk }- 17:35, 18 November 2020 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 11 November 2020

Change ‘the murdered woman’: 3] The music video for their song was inspired by John Everett Millais's painting Ophelia (1851–1852), and showed Minogue as the murdered woman, floating in a pond as a serpent swam over her body. To: ‘The dead woman’. She was NOT murdered (unless you call Hamlet’s treatment of her ‘murder’ as he was the cause of her madness, but I don’t think that would stand up in court!). Ophelia went mad, climbed onto a willow branch which broke, and she drowned ‘singing all the while’. The sexton suggests that she committed suicide but this is not definite. 2A00:23C7:3112:FB01:B4DE:3ABD:89D1:18EE (talk) 19:22, 11 November 2020 (UTC)

 Not done: please provide reliable sources that support the change you want to be made. P,TO 19104 (talk) (contribs) 19:28, 21 November 2020 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 6 April 2021

Add nick cave to associated acts - she sang on nick cave’s “murder ballads” lp 2603:7080:A341:C200:1D02:8ADE:B587:511E (talk) 04:41, 6 April 2021 (UTC)

 Not done: See here. Associated acts are not for one time collaborations.--♦IanMacM♦ ^{(talk to me)} 06:51, 6 April 2021 (UTC)

Artists who've Influenced Kylie

Kylie has had a very successful career and on multiple occasions across it, she has cited many people who've influenced her over the years from ABBA to Prince. But none more so than Madonna. Why is this fact blatantly ignored? It was at one time on here, but it has oddly been removed. I appreciate there are some on planet Kylie who refuse to admit this, but facts are facts. Without Madonna, Kylie would not exist. She is integral to who Kylie is today. Madonna's page acknowledges Chrissie Hind & Nina Simone as an influence, i think Kylie's page should reflect how her idol Madonna, has influenced her. Youtube, the media is littered with examples and interviews where Kylie herself acknowledges the impact Madonna has had on her, and how she continues to be a fan. From music choices, touring styles, writers, producers, Kylie has used many people from Madonna's inner circle in a bid to elevate her career and give it greater credibility Amacth (talk) 06:35, 30 May 2021 (UTC)

The article already references Madonna's influence and impact on Kylie. Was there a specific change you wished to make? Shoestringnomad (talk) 07:23, 30 May 2021 (UTC)

Best-selling artists

In the introduction to Kylie's page, it mentions how she has sold over 80 million records worldwide. And yet, whenever I go to the page "List of best-selling music artists", which lists the artists who ahve sold 75 million or more, Kylie's name never appears. It might be because enough references can't be found to back up the claim for a biography page, but I think both pages need to be updated for Kylie's inclusion. — Preceding unsigned comment added by GillettD (talk • contribs) 20:02, 1 July 2018 (UTC)

There's a real problem with the Locomotion sales bit as well - I took it out and added it back in, but not 100% sure Locomotion WAS the biggest 'selling' single of the 80's in Australia - definitely wasn't elsewhere (hence adding the clarification), but the ARIA charts weren't collated before 1988 - the top 50 was the 'Kent Music Report' https://wiki.riteme.site/wiki/List_of_top_40_singles_for_1980%E2%80%931989_in_Australia

Yet these figures don't put Locomotion anywhere near the top seller of the 1980's, or combined AMR/Kent and ARIA, e.g. https://www.top100singles.net/2011/12/amr-top-singles-of-1980s.html#show - who to believe? Timbearcub (talk) 00:26, 15 July 2021 (UTC)

Past Relationships in Infobox

I've removed the one relationship that was listed in the Partner(s) field of the infobox, as well as all the others I'd previously added. Which relationships were most publicly commented on, and should be added to the infobox? Ex: she had a four-year relationship with actor Olivier Martinez in the early 2000s, and I think people were interested in her early relationship with Jason Donovan, before she left him for Michael Hutchence. Dog Starkiller (talk) 22:23, 20 September 2021 (UTC)

Also known simply as Kylie

Is there any real need to add this sentence? It’s a very clunky opening sentence and doesn’t add any useful information. “Kylie Minogue” is her WP:COMMONNAME. The extra sentence is absolutely useless.--Caleb M. 21 (talk) 21:10, 16 September 2021 (UTC)

WP:COMMONNAME is a policy about article titles. Shoestringnomad (talk) 03:38, 19 November 2021 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 24 October 2021

Change '70 million records' sold to 'over 80 million records sold' 82.132.217.26 (talk) 12:55, 24 October 2021 (UTC) 82.132.217.26 (talk) 12:55, 24 October 2021 (UTC)

 Not done: please provide reliable sources that support the change you want to be made. ScottishFinnishRadish (talk) 13:21, 24 October 2021 (UTC)

Kylie Minogue singles discography says 80 million with cites, but these figures should always be taken with a pinch of salt.--♦IanMacM♦ ^{(talk to me)} 13:46, 24 October 2021 (UTC)

The 70-million figure was quite dated. The number of albums and reissues she's sold in nearly a decade surely must count for something. Shoestringnomad (talk) 04:03, 19 November 2021 (UTC)

 Done 70 million was a figure from 8 years ago at this point. There were several reputable sources to go with here to support 80 million, including Reuters most recently at the end of 2020. Entertainment Weekly cited the same figure in 2018. The National Film and Sound Archive of Australia also says over 80 million have been sold, in a piece published in 2020 or 2021. Shoestringnomad (talk) 04:03, 19 November 2021 (UTC)

Mononymous?

I’m not convinced that Kylie Minogue is truly a mononymous person. She is credited as Kyle Minogue (her full name) and although she’s often referred to by her first name, she has never formally dropped her last name and it’s as known as her first name. I would also argue that most people these days would associate the name Kylie with Kylie Jenner than Kylie Minogue. I think that “often known simply as Kylie” is more accurate.— Preceding unsigned comment added by 82.132.186.201 (talk) 01:40, 21 February 2021 (UTC)

Disagree. Fortunately, Wikipedia articles rely on building consensus. This change should have been discussed in the talk page before being made. I'm reverting back to use of mononymously. Shoestringnomad (talk) 02:54, 9 March 2021 (UTC)

@Shoestringnomad: If you type “Kylie” into Google then Kylie Jenner comes up first and then Minogue which I think is based on Jenner becoming known worldwide in the last 10-15 years. Despite that, I still think mostly older people will assume someone first means Minogue if he/she says “Kylie”. Kylie was a common name and is still a fairly common name in Australia, America and elsewhere, but in recent times it was Minogue who popularised it. However, it’s arguable whether or not Kylie Minogue is a truly mononymous person, her last name is as well known as her first name and she never formally dropped it.--SNOODLES4 (talk) 13:52, 6 April 2021 (UTC)

Formally dropping a last name is not a requirement for someone to be known mononymously. That would be quite rare. Regarding Minogue's last name being well known, Elvis Presley is another mononymous person, and his last name is also very well known. Finally, if I perform a Google search of 'Kim' from the U.S., Kim Kardashian appears first in results, but that hardly supports the assertion that Kardashian is a mononymous person. Google search results are not a placeholder for consensus. Shoestringnomad (talk) 23:37, 6 April 2021 (UTC)

Minogue has been using both 'Kylie Minogue' and 'Kylie' throughout her career, meaning yes, she is a 'mononymous person' as well. And as Shoestringnomad already commented, that has been built based on reliable sources and Wikipedia consensus. — Tom^(T2ME) 14:57, 6 April 2021 (UTC)

I mean, my friends ad coworkers call me by my first name, and in fact I usually introduce myself just by that first name — I would say "I have used that throughout my career". But that doesn't make me "mononymous". I'm not saying it's not true for Kylie Minogue, but if this is actually "reliable sources and Wikipedia consensus", it shouldn't be hard to actually source the claim. And in line with Wikipedia standards, something more than just "that's what she uses on her own websites", but actual reportage. I mean, ideally by a big mainstream source, but, even, like, some listicles from well-known websites. Compare with e.g. https://www.mentalfloss.com/article/31244/full-names-26-one-name-celebrities or https://www.ranker.com/list/full-names-of-mononymous-people-v2/celebrity-lists. As it is, it feels like this is more "some super-fans feel like it's really important that this be recognized, for some reason" than actually real. --Matthew Miller (talk) 16:13, 18 November 2021 (UTC)

While your friends call you by your first name, something tells me headlines written about you wouldn't use only your first name, but I could be wrong. I started reviewing media by watching videos, enjoyed them, and then felt satisfied with the list of video footage alone. But then I threw in articles for good measure. How's 19 for a start?

• BBC interview where she's introduced as Kylie[5]
• Performance on The Voice UK where she's introduced as Kylie[6]
• Performance on The Paul O'Grady Show where she's introduced as Kylie[7]
• Interview by Molly Meldrum, who intros her and then only refers to her as Kylie[8]
• Interview on The One Show where she's introduced as Kylie[9]
• Interview on The Jonathan Ross Show where she's introduced as Kylie[10]
• Performance on The X Factor UK where she's introduced as Kylie (twice)[11]
• Appearance on The BRIT Awards for an award where her title card just reads Kylie (while Alicia Keys' full name is used), and she's referred to as Ms. Kylie[12]
• Video segment (that admittedly isn't the greatest) shows headlines that exclusively use her first name, a common sight in tabloids especially[13]
• Article in The Brag Media's Tone Deaf about her concert, never once using her surname[14]
• Article in The Guardian that uses only her first name[15]
• Article in Cambridge Independent using only her first name[16]

Then there are articles that refer to her being known as just Kylie or monomously as Kylie.

• The BBC wrote, "Since the 1980s, Kylie Minogue has never had to go by any other name but Kylie".[17]
• Billboard wrote that she "has been performing as 'Kylie' since before Jenner was born".[18]
• Paper Mag wrote that she is "unusually unpretentious for a mononymous pop star".[19]
• i-D wrote that she is "known mononymously as Kylie".[20]
• i-D later wrote, "she has earned herself a mononym: KYLIE."[21]
• Some Fashion Journal refers to her as "the first mononomous Kylie".[22]
• A page by Glastonbury Festival about her performance there highlights her first name, even headlining the page Kylie.[23]

Shoestringnomad (talk) 03:34, 19 November 2021 (UTC)

Just so I can close these tabs, here's:

• A page by Live Nation Entertainment with reference only to her first name[24]
• An odd article by The New Statesman that references Kylie 5 times and never with her surname[25]
• A stock photo on Alamy that doesn't mention her last name.[26]
• Another intro, this time from The Voice Kids, using only her first name.[27]

Shoestringnomad (talk) 04:47, 20 November 2021 (UTC)

Yes. Some of those (like where the title has her full name but the video itself is more informal) are dubious, but others are clear.

Please put one or two of those references (particularly the ones that specifically mention mononyms) as references — I think ideally right in the place in the article where I requested a citation?

If something keeps getting discussed, the answer shouldn't be to complain about that — put the references where people like me will see them and go "huh, today I learned!" Matthew Miller (talk) 06:53, 30 November 2021 (UTC)

I don't recall ever seeing such a fact cited in a lede, so I don't understand why it's needed here. But I wouldn't want to get the sourcing wrong. Since you find some of these dubious, despite asking for dubious sources, please choose your favorite. Then add where you feel it's appropriate. Shoestringnomad (talk) 05:54, 1 December 2021 (UTC)

Kylie Step back in time album 2019

Hi guys could someone please add to Kylie discography her UK number 1 greatest hits 2019 album step back in time

Kylie Minogue Editor Request

Hi. I was reading the Kylie Minogue Wikipedia entry as research for something and feel the personal life section needs to be edited. In the section it is broken down into segments dealing with specific areas of her personal life, specifically Philanthropy and Health.

It begins with the Philanthropy segment, however the very first sentence of it does not deal with anything even remotely relating to Philanthropy, instead it reads as follows "Minogue has never married and has no children".

Even if we're going by the broadest of definitions available you would have to agree that this sentence does not belong in this segment. I feel that either creating an additional segment or removing it entirely would be appropriate. 2A02:C7E:163E:C600:3415:6050:C214:492F (talk) 15:24, 3 December 2021 (UTC)

I agree. I removed the random sentence and moved it to the top of the section, but I also added a template requesting more information. That sentence alone is a sad excuse of an intro for the personal life section. Something about it also just feels wrong. Shoestringnomad (talk) 23:40, 3 December 2021 (UTC)

Shoestringnomad, you need to chill out. I'm not sure what "it [...] just feels wrong" is supposed to mean; but at any rate, nothing about that blurb was inaccurate because among other things, it was well-sourced. What is inaccurate is your claim that other editors removed it; in fact, the only other editor who seemed to have a problem with it was an IP whose only edit was at the beginning of this very talk page section. Erpert ^{blah, blah, blah...} 13:02, 22 December 2021 (UTC)

Erpert, Rhodes00 is another editor that reverted your edit, not an anonymous IP address. Shoestringnomad (talk) 17:49, 22 December 2021 (UTC)

I didn't see that at first; but frankly, edit summaries like that don't even deserve a response. Anyway, are you going to honestly say that you have never seen another BLP on here that mentions marital status? More than that, your main issue seems to be that that didn't fall under philanthropy; that's debatable, but it certainly falls under her personal life. If you think it doesn't, please explain how. Erpert ^{blah, blah, blah...} 18:45, 22 December 2021 (UTC)

Rhodes00's edit summary pretty much gets to the point. Shoestringnomad (talk) 22:12, 22 December 2021 (UTC)

People who search at Wikipedia look for facts and things that DO happened. Being childless and unmarried says absolutely nothing about her. Marriage and motherhood aren't innate goals of a woman, of anyone, really. However, I think it's worth mentioning her past desire to have children and how she learnt to cope with it after her breast cancer diagnose. Rhodes00 (talk) 22:57, 23 December 2021 (UTC)

So you agree with incivility? Anyway, no one addressed the point that plenty of articles mention the respective subjects being childless and unmarried (for example, Patricia Clarkson, Debra Jo Rupp, Martha Wash). Do y'all plan to remove the blurbs from those respective articles as well simply because you don't want it there? Erpert ^{blah, blah, blah...} 13:43, 12 January 2022 (UTC)

(←) Who was being uncivil? As it was written, stating she was married and childless lacked context for why it could be considered noteworthy. Rhodes00's suggestion to provide such context is not a bad one, but that has not been attempted. Perhaps you just want it there. Shoestringnomad (talk) 00:37, 13 January 2022 (UTC)

Re-asking questions that were already answered goes nowhere (as well as trying to reuse an argument against me that I already used). Anyway, I find it interesting that you are avoiding addressing the simple point that I made. Unless you plan to go the respective articles of every person who mentions being unmarried and childless and removing them all, my point is valid. A vote does not equal consensus. Erpert ^{blah, blah, blah...} 13:46, 14 January 2022 (UTC)

Joshua Sasse

Joshua Sasse should be added to the relationships section since they dated for 3 years and he has a Wikipedia article 2A00:23EE:1490:FA2E:D531:611F:714E:4A04 (talk) 16:46, 15 March 2023 (UTC)

"Kylie Sasse" listed at Redirects for discussion

The redirect Kylie Sasse has been listed at redirects for discussion to determine whether its use and function meets the redirect guidelines. Readers of this page are welcome to comment on this redirect at Wikipedia:Redirects for discussion/Log/2023 May 2 § Kylie Sasse until a consensus is reached. CycloneYoris ^talk! 04:59, 2 May 2023 (UTC)

"Love Kylie" listed at Redirects for discussion

The redirect Love Kylie has been listed at redirects for discussion to determine whether its use and function meets the redirect guidelines. Readers of this page are welcome to comment on this redirect at Wikipedia:Redirects for discussion/Log/2023 May 3 § Love Kylie until a consensus is reached. CycloneYoris ^talk! 01:03, 3 May 2023 (UTC)

Bio Dome

don't forget Bio-Dome, as much as some people may want to. I love that flick. 174.251.135.167 (talk) 01:46, 5 July 2023 (UTC)

Opening paragraphs

@Tomica: for your information, I was the one that added the #1 albums in five consecutive decades info in the Disco section back in 2020. You can look it up in the edit history of the article. That info was merely copied/pasted in the top of the article by another editor later on. I gave a valid reason for removing it in the opening section. Her other achievements in the charts such quantity of number one hits in Uk/Australia and record of top 10 hits in 5 consecutive decades both in Australia and the UK aren't mentioned as well in the opening paragraph. I made a Valid point about "Especially for You", "Timebomb" and "Santa Baby", you gave ZERO reason for adding "Timebomb" and "Santa Baby" back in the opening paragraph. "Santa Baby" is not a Kylie Minogue single. Timebomb peaked at 32 in the Uk and didn't enter top ten in Australia. Both songs aren't more successful than Especially for You which is a #1 hit in the UK and #2 in Australia. If you wanna edit war, probably best to take it here in the talk page so we could discuss it more. You've pretty much reverted everything I did in the opening paragraphs, and only restored I Believe in You and Padam Padam, when you were called out for editing without using the edit summary. I don't appreciate this behavior. TheHotwiki (talk) 14:27, 28 July 2023 (UTC)

@Hotwiki: First things first, calm down and stop being passive-aggressive about it. Neither you nor I own ANY article on Wikipedia. I was called out only by YOU for actually just merging the sentence into the paragraph. And yes, those things should be mentioned because guess what? She is a singer foremost, and then everything else. Her movie career can be omitted from the lead tbh, because it is merely notable. However, her music records and achievements should be present there. Also, I don't know if you've noticed, but this is a featured article, so any changes should of high quality and not break-up the prose like it is the state of the lead right now. — Tom^(T2ME) 14:49, 28 July 2023 (UTC)

She achieved so much more than #1 albums in five decades. Her achievements such as top ten hits in five decades, quantity of number one singles both in UK/Australia aren't mentioned in the opening paragraph, as well sales figures. Yet #1 albums in five consecutive decades is mentioned? I didn't remove it again as a way to compromise. Also, me mentioning that I was the one who added the same info in Disco section back in 2020, is just me showing that I don't disregard the #1 albums in 5 decades achievement. @Tomica: I just don't appreciate every recent edit I did in the opening paragraph were reverted for absolutely zero explanation, and I wouldn't have gotten an explanation if I didn't call you out. TheHotwiki (talk) 14:59, 28 July 2023 (UTC)

Then add what else she has achieved music-wise, not just the album thing. Still, we need to focus on her music achievements and highlights in the lead, not some minor roles she had or some books with 0 impact she wrote. Where is the mention of Kylie Wines in the lead? That itself is more important than her movie roles or the books we are trying to mention. At the end of the day, I am not saying you don't care about UK #1 album in 5 decades' information, but still, it is a really big feat, and it should be mentioned. — Tom^(T2ME) 15:08, 28 July 2023 (UTC)

Your concerns about her film appearances/books and the wine business are another issues though, which have nothing to do with my recent edits. I am aware of the success of Kylie Minogue Wines and I'm in agreement that it should be mentioned as well next to her other endeavors.TheHotwiki (talk) 15:14, 28 July 2023 (UTC)

Tension Tour 2024

@T929212: Kylie Minogue hasn't OFFICIALLY announced a Tension Tour for 2024. The press are merely assuming it that she would have a tour in support of her forthcoming sixteenth studio album. The Word is Out she may have a tour for it, but it ISN'T OFFICIALLY announced. There is no start date, no locations, no any announcement coming from the 10 Out of 10 singer herself, Kylie Minogue, in her official website and any of her official social media accounts about a Tension tour. Please stop edit warring and wait until Kylie Minogue officially announce and Say Something about a Tension Tour in 2024. I started this discussion Especially for You, to prevent more edit warring and disruption towards the article. Feel free to reply. Thank you for cooperation! TheHotwiki (talk) 01:28, 10 August 2023 (UTC)

UK records

"This week's result means Kylie sets a new Official Chart record, becoming the first female artist to score a Number 1 on the UK’s Official Albums Chart in five consecutive decades - in the ‘80s, ‘90s, ‘00s, ‘10s and ‘20s."[28]

"With Top 10 hits in the 1980s, ‘90s, ‘00s, 2010s and ‘20s, Kylie becomes only the fourth female solo artist to score Top 10 hits in five consecutive decades. The other enduring chart queens are Cher, Diana Ross and Lulu, who each scored Top 10 hits in the 1960s, ‘70s, ‘80s, ‘90s and 2000s."[29]

The sources are right there in the article.TheHotwiki (talk) 11:08, 17 October 2023 (UTC)

Article says fourth, but your edit says "only" female artist. While the former source may be valid, daisychaining the second one into it is WP:SYNT and is therefore original research. To be very clear again; what I am critiquing is that the source did not say "She is the only female artist to score number one albums and top ten hits in 80s to 2020s. There is no mention of the top ten hits in the first source; that is only paid attention to in the second source. Putting both sources in one sentences is WP:SYNT. PHShanghai | they/them (talk) 11:17, 17 October 2023 (UTC)

What is exactly you are pointing out here. Is there another female artist that have scored a top ten single in the Uk from the 80s to the 2020s? She achieved this mark last June 2023. Its not outdated. Also didn't you claim that all of her PWL albums were teen pop albums, only to claim here in this talkpage, you actually haven't listened to those albums in a long time, therefore you were just using your own opinion by labeling those Teen albums before you were reverted. We should we wait for the opinion of other editors, before you make another change in the lead section.TheHotwiki (talk) 11:52, 17 October 2023 (UTC)

I'm pointing out there's no source that mentions the album record and the top ten single record. While that observation is true, there is no singular source that mentions it, which is OR PHShanghai | they/them (talk) 14:39, 17 October 2023 (UTC)

I just posted two different articles from Official Charts Company. So what are you talking about? There's a reference for the #1 albums in 5 consecutive decades and there's another reference for the top ten single in 5 consecutive decades (80s to the 2020s). Also this external link [30] which is currently posted in this Wikipedia article as a reference, clearly stated both her album/top ten single record. Go read the links I posted. Even though 1 article was enough (since it stated both records), I gave you two different links. Its that not complicated.TheHotwiki (talk) 15:25, 17 October 2023 (UTC)

WP:SYNT PHShanghai | they/them (talk) 15:32, 17 October 2023 (UTC)

"With Top 10 hits in the 1980s, ‘90s, ‘00s, 2010s and ‘20s, Kylie becomes only the fourth female solo artist to score Top 10 hits in five consecutive decades. The other enduring chart queens are Cher, Diana Ross and Lulu, who each scored Top 10 hits in the 1960s, ‘70s, ‘80s, ‘90s and 2000s. Back in 2020, when her Disco album debuted at Number 1, Kylie became the first female artist to score a Number 1 on the UK’s Official Albums Chart in five consecutive decades - in the 1980s, ‘90s, ‘00s, 2010s and ‘20s."[31] I already posted that and it clearly mentioned the #1 album/top ten single in 5 consecutive decades achievement under 1 article. Go read the link. Are we going in circles here?TheHotwiki (talk) 15:36, 17 October 2023 (UTC)

Still no source supporting the claim you're making, which is: "Kylie Minogue is the only female artist to achieve a top 10 hit in the 1980s to 2020s."

The source you linked says she is the fourth.

You also don't have to be WP:RUDE to make your point. PHShanghai | they/them (talk) 01:42, 18 October 2023 (UTC)

Again, Kylie Minogue is the only fourth female artist to earn a top ten hit single in the Uk in five consecutive decades. The other three have it done in different decades (60s to the 2000s), whereas Minogue is the only one out of four female artists to have it done it from 80s to the 2020s. That is self explanatory right there, if you read the article/reference. The fact that you are trying to question, that information is just mindbogggling to me. No other editor has an issue about that statement since it was posted in this Wikipedia article since June 2023. @Drmies:, I would like to hear your thoughts about this, as I felt like I kept repeating myself to PHShanghai.TheHotwiki (talk) 01:58, 18 October 2023 (UTC)

PHShangchai saving a version of their edit towards the lead section of this article

I discovered through the contributions page of @PHShanghai:, that they saved a copy through their Wikipedia page, of their edit in the Kylie Minogue article, that was already reverted.[32] It looks they are appearing to save it, so they could come back to this article later on and revive their reverted edit. I made a separate section for this, as the last two sections are already too long. @Drmies:, I would like to read your response about this, as you've said, the edit I made[33] was fine enough. Thank you. TheHotwiki (talk) 02:25, 18 October 2023 (UTC)

Are you seriously trying to police userspace now? And stop spamming the admins. They've already been called, they will read everything. PHShanghai | they/them (talk) 02:36, 18 October 2023 (UTC)

It is related to this article, which is currently having an issue that involves you. I find it quite suspicious. If you can explain, what is the intention of you posting that in your userspace? Also tagging another editor for response, isn't spamming.TheHotwiki (talk) 02:39, 18 October 2023 (UTC)

Lead section

This is a note to the editor who has been drastically changing the lead section. First of all not all her PWL albums are teen pop albums. Rhythm of Love and Let's Get to It aren't and I can provide several references to back that up. "Padam Padam" is a hit but its not a cultural moment (this isn't even referenced anywhere in the article) when it only charted at the top ten in 2 major English speaking markets (Uk/Ireland). Having #1 albums and a top ten in five consecutive decades in the UK, are backed up with real official data and isn't some made up claim, unlike "cultural moments". If I remember correctly, I removed the "#1 number albums in five consecutive decades" only to be reverted back. So I'm taking consideration of that revert into this scenario as well, that it should remain here. TheHotwiki (talk) 23:36, 16 October 2023 (UTC)

I will add more, once the recent editor drastically change the lead section again.TheHotwiki (talk) 23:39, 16 October 2023 (UTC)

@PHShanghai: Instead of dropping edit warring warnings in my talk page, you should be discussing things in the article's talkpage like I've suggested earlier. Not all her PWL albums are teen pop albums. "Padam Padam" isn't a cultural significant moment, especially when that claim from yours is unreferenced. Those are just some of my issues with you drastically changing the lead section.TheHotwiki (talk) 08:20, 17 October 2023 (UTC)

quite frankly you are edit warring though PHShanghai | they/them (talk) 08:58, 17 October 2023 (UTC)

Insignificant (but productive) lead changes contested by one editor

@Hotwiki: Remember that WP:BURO and WP:BATTLE. That being said, all of the changes I am making to the lead are simple facts reinstated from their respective lead sections:

Confide in Me: "Confide in Me" has been recognised by authors as an important period of Minogue's career and musical "re-inventions".

Can't Get You Out of My Head: "The song reached number one on charts in 40 countries worldwide."

• This holds more long-lasting weight than the "most successful 2000s single" line, however truth be told there is space for both records to be mentioned in some form.

Say Something / Magic: Truth be told, in the version you blindly reverted, you would see that the "critical praise" comment was removed from the sentence mentioning her notable singles released in the BMG era. I simply added the two as they were her lead singles from Disco.

• You may have assumed that I just simply reverted, however you did not see that there were changes made to accommodate some of your feedback.

Padam Padam (song): "Since its release, Padam Padam [...] has been recognised by notable publications for its cultural significance in pop culture."

• Why are you saying my claim is unreferenced? It's right there in the third paragraph of the lead section and it's been there for months now.

Tension (album): "Tension received critical acclaim from music critics. On Metacritic, [...] the album scored 86 [...] indicating universal acclaim, making it Minogue's highest-rated album on the site."

• This is Kylie's highest acclaimed album according to critics; why do you insist on removing it? It is a massive achievement for a woman of her legacy to still release some of her best albums late in her career.

Re: UK Record: Please provide a source from the Official Charts Company that specifically highlights that Kylie "is the only female artist to have no. 1 albums and top ten singles in the 1980s and 2020s in the UK." With that specific phrasing.

• So far, the only source I can find from OCC is that she is the fourth solo artist to achieve top 10 hits in 5 decades; which is however different from what the article is saying. Unless proven otherwise, this source lacks verifiability.

Rolling Stone Australia: "[Kylie] is an icon, a living legend and is in a league of her own."

• I don't even know why you want to remove this one. See articles like Beyoncé. These big Rolling Stone listicles have weight; they're not just throwaway mentions of artists impact.

Furthermore:

• You added back the Billboard reference next to her birthday, which does not mention her birthday nor anything regarding the other Kylie. What purpose does it serve?

• The Vice fashion icon article doesn't seem to be any more lead worthy than the Rolling Stone article which you keep removing. There is a seperate section for "public image."

I will concede that the PWL albums may not all be "teen pop" genre; I have not listened to those and I have no judgements on them yet whatsoever.

Lastly: there is no rule against making "drastic changes" to the lead section (changes I have shown that are backed up with proper information and sources). There are, however, rules against being rude (WP:HOSTILE) and rules against preventing other editors from making changes to an article. (WP:OOP) PHShanghai | they/them (talk) 08:57, 17 October 2023 (UTC)

Only Cher, Lulu, Kylie Minogue and Diana Ross have scored a top ten hit single in 5 consecutive decades in the UK. Per Official Charts Company. Cher, Lulu and Ross have done it from the 60s to the 2000s, while Minogue achieved it from the 80s to the 2020s. Kylie Minogue is also the only female artist to have a number one album in five consecutive decades (from the 80s to 20s) in the UK. Have you read the references attached to the article? The sources for those are included in the achievements section. Now feel free to point out if there's another artist that have scored a top ten single in the UK from the 80s to the 2020s, that will make the statement in the article false. These are significant achievements that aren't made up or based on someone's opinion, compare to you claiming that "Padam Padam" is a culturally significant moment".TheHotwiki (talk) 10:33, 17 October 2023 (UTC)

Also there's no need to mention every lead single that Minogue have released, in the lead section (hence why Into the Blue", "Word is Out" and "Some Kind of Bliss" aren't mentioned and this isn't a discography article or an albums article). "Say Something" and "Magic" didn't chart in the top 40 in her main markets (Australia and the UK). No sales certifications as well. Only mention the truly significant singles in the lead section. "Dancing" is mentioned because it was the first single under BMG Rights Management and have been certified Silver in Australia and the UK. You cannot claim that to "Say Something" and "Magic".TheHotwiki (talk) 10:40, 17 October 2023 (UTC)

As for Rolling Stones Australia commentary towards Minogue, there's simply no need to use it as a lead section material. Minogue has been critically well received by a lot of journalists. There's no need for you to single out what Rolling Stones Australia have published, and place their commentary in the lead section of this article. There are other sections in this article where a journalist's commentary would be necessary.TheHotwiki (talk) 10:46, 17 October 2023 (UTC)

Replies:

• Yes, OCC stated that Kylie achieved this from the 80s to the 2020s. My issue is that they only stated the record for the albums. The record for the singles isn't mentioned in the former article, while the latter article claims she is the fourth female studio artist to achieve the corresponding top-ten record. You daisychained the two sentences together; that is WP:SYNTH, so I'll be removing the latter record now.
• You are also claiming once again that I claimed that Padam Padam is a culturally significant moment which is extremely disingenous. The reference that I am using is from the article's lead section where it says that notable publications have come up with a consensus that Padam Padam is culturally significant. Very different
• Those are mentioned because they were popular with critics and made significant noise. While Some Kind of Bliss is one of my favorite Kylie songs of all time, Impossible Princess is already known for not being a hit with the public, and the other singles are from her PWL era which is known to be an era that she lacked creative control over her work.
• Yes, my point is that Minogue has been cited as one of the greatest Australian artists of all time- what's exactly your issue with removing that again and again when it's true?

As for everything else, I think there's no contest on the edits for Tension and Can't Get You out of My Head. PHShanghai | they/them (talk) 11:16, 17 October 2023 (UTC)

No need to point out that Can't Get You Out of My Head was number one in forty countries because if I were to ask you to specify to mention those forty countries, would you able to back up those forty countries with reliable sources? As for Tension, its not the only Kylie Minogue album that has been reviewed well and not every Kylie Minogue album has a Metacritic score. Wait for other editors to chime in.TheHotwiki (talk) 12:00, 17 October 2023 (UTC)

Also what is the significant noise of Say Something and Magic? No awards, both didn't chart in the Uk/Australia top 40 singles, both singles have no certification. Those aren't significant noises.TheHotwiki (talk) 12:06, 17 October 2023 (UTC)

Those two aren't even in the version you reverted anymore... PHShanghai | they/them (talk) 14:44, 17 October 2023 (UTC)

Apologies for stepping in here, but with several reverts over the past 24 hours, it seems the entrenched positions here could be the potential for causing difficulties. That's perhaps something none of us want to see. I have contacted the chart expert Ss112 on his talk page to review the above. I think those insights would be a great benefit here. I will also ping Binksternet for any insights and Drmies to review the above. Thanks!Karst (talk) 12:31, 17 October 2023 (UTC)

User:Karst, all this is very hard to follow. These editors' way of indenting is confusing; in that first set of comments of the "Insignificant" section, I can't tell if it's one person talking or if one person responded and wove their responses in. I've lost the forest for the trees already. Drmies (talk) 15:54, 17 October 2023 (UTC)

Insights and suggestions from other editors are definitely needed in this case.TheHotwiki (talk) 12:38, 17 October 2023 (UTC)

Oh, I can't look over everything right now, but I agree with this edit (and we should never use the word "spawn"). Drmies (talk) 14:27, 17 October 2023 (UTC)

@Drmies: Drmies, see my comment below PHShanghai | they/them (talk) 14:32, 17 October 2023 (UTC)

cc @Drmies:, For some reason Hotwiki keeps replying to himself instead of creating only one reply; I tried editing it for readability but yeah even so this editor replies to themself to make more points even if no one responded PHShanghai | they/them (talk) 01:35, 18 October 2023 (UTC)

Just defending myself here to prove a point; Hotwiki has been accused of OWN issues on this page by another editor above, @Tomica: and already broke WP:3RR restoring to the same exact version.

I have used proper references and sources from those articles to argue for my changes which currently he is the only one who has criticized (quite in a rude manner might I add.)

Meanwhile, the edit that he is restoring to has multiple spelling issues and inconsistencies (in a *featured* article mind you)

• "In 2017, she partned up"
• Dancing (2018) [no other singles have this year suffix btw]
• mentioned SYNT issue already
• sales in the introductory paragraph of the lead

Where is the constructive editing? PHShanghai | they/them (talk) 14:31, 17 October 2023 (UTC)

Again I'm not the one that claimed that her PWL albums were teen pop albums, and later admitted you haven't listened those albums in a long time. This is a featured Wikipedia article to begin with. You were clearly writing the changes in your own perspective of things, instead of actually using reliable sources.TheHotwiki (talk) 14:42, 17 October 2023 (UTC)

I also haven't broke 3RR yet. As my most recent revert was the third revert. There's no consensus yet in this talk page for you to be making changes when clearly another editor (yours truly) is having issues with your recent contributions in this article. I literally had to ping you for this to conversation to happen in the first place, didn't I?TheHotwiki (talk) 14:52, 17 October 2023 (UTC)

Revert 1

Revert 2

Revert 3

My only revert PHShanghai | they/them (talk) 15:04, 17 October 2023 (UTC)

Based from Wikipedia rules "An editor must not perform more than three reverts on a single page—whether involving the same or different material—within a 24-hour period." I haven't reverted more than 3 times in this article for the last 24 hours. You are making a false accusation by saying I broke 3RR, which I don't appreciate. Drmies was fine with my most recent edit. And that should tell you, the lead section was fine as it was, before you made unnecessary drastic changes into the lead section. If I were you, I'd let this go and i have no intention to make another revert as I'm completely aware of the 3RR guideline.TheHotwiki (talk) 15:11, 17 October 2023 (UTC)

I don't think going right to the line of breaking 3RR is something to brag about. PHShanghai | they/them (talk) 01:41, 18 October 2023 (UTC)

Okay so I am now bragging about 3RR when you falsely accused me of breaking 3RR, when I was merely explaining that I am aware of 3RR, I haven't broke the 3RR rule and I have no intention of breaking 3rr. TheHotwiki (talk) 02:04, 18 October 2023 (UTC)

WP:GAMING PHShanghai | they/them (talk) 01:11, 23 October 2023 (UTC)

Years Active

In the biography box, the line stating Years Active should say "1979-present" instead of "since 1979" to match all other English Wikipedia articles with living people who are currently active in their career. Nickioutsold82 (talk) 01:49, 20 December 2023 (UTC)

Fixed now. RJ4 (talk) 02:07, 20 December 2023 (UTC)

January 2024

There are grammatical errors in the content of the lede. The lead image change I am willing to discuss on but there is no actual content being removed that could be contentious, besides the aforementioned image change @Hotwiki: PHShanghai | they/them (talk) 14:45, 20 January 2024 (UTC)

You didn't really just do grammatical errors. First you added Confide in Me which isn't a grammatical fix. Second Love at First Sight/In Your Eyes didn't have the same similar chart success as Cant Get You Out of My Head. Third, Spinning Around is a Uk number one single, so no need to mention it as an Australian #1 single. Fourth, no need to remove the year after Padam Padam. Once again, you are drastically changing the lead section in your own preference which is a big issue. Are we going to do this again in 2024? You were pointed out many times (in the past) by questionable changes to the lead section (some of it, you admitted you were wrong) so lets not this start again. Also no need to change the lead picture of Minogue squinting, what kind of improvement is that for? TheHotwiki (talk) 14:52, 20 January 2024 (UTC)

Need I remind you that you kept a blatant grammatical error for months and you immediately reverted back to it two minutes after I made an edit. Wow. The pettiness of WP:OWN editors is unbelievable. There is not collaborative energy at all, shame. PHShanghai | they/them (talk) 14:57, 20 January 2024 (UTC)

Where is this pettiness? I am only discussing your edits in this article which I don't find helpful. I forgot to say, Cant Get You Out of My Head was #1 in the Uk and a top ten hit in the U.S. Love at First Sight and In Your Eyes didn't achieve those. TheHotwiki (talk) 15:01, 20 January 2024 (UTC)

I suggest you discuss things first before you drastically change things in the lead section to avoid edit warring. That includes changing the picture, comparing the singles to her most successful single, removing years, adding other singles, etc. TheHotwiki (talk) 15:03, 20 January 2024 (UTC)

RfC

The following discussion is an archived record of a request for comment. Please do not modify it. No further edits should be made to this discussion. A summary of the conclusions reached follows.

There was consensus against the proposal as written. TarnishedPath^talk 10:37, 13 March 2024 (UTC)

---

Should the lead of Kylie Minogue's article be changed to this lead section I rewrote to include some pertinent, missing information? There is a list of specific changes, with sources to back them up. PHShanghai | they/them (talk) 16:53, 18 October 2023 (UTC)

Old lead section

Kylie Ann Minogue AO OBE (/mɪˈnoʊɡ/; born 28 May 1968) is an Australian singer, songwriter and actress. Minogue is the highest-selling female Australian artist of all time, having sold over 80 million records worldwide. She has been recognised for reinventing herself in music as well as fashion, and is referred to by the European press as the "Princess of Pop" and a style icon. Her accolades include a Grammy Award, three Brit Awards and seventeen ARIA Music Awards. Born and raised in Melbourne, Minogue first achieved recognition starring as Charlene Robinson in the Australian soap opera Neighbours (1986–1988). She began her music career in the late 1980s, releasing four bubblegum and dance-pop-influenced studio albums under PWL. By the early 1990s, Minogue had amassed several top ten singles in Australia and the UK, including "The Loco-Motion", "I Should Be So Lucky", "Especially for You", "Hand on Your Heart" and "Better the Devil You Know". Taking more creative control over her music, she signed with Deconstruction Records in 1993 and released the albums Kylie Minogue (1994) and Impossible Princess (1997). By joining Parlophone in 1999, Minogue returned to mainstream dance-oriented music with Light Years (2000), including the number-one hits "Spinning Around" and "On a Night Like This". The follow-up, Fever (2001), was an international breakthrough for Minogue, becoming her best-selling album to date. Its lead single, "Can't Get You Out of My Head" becoming one of the most successful singles of the 2000s, selling over five million units. Follow up singles, "In Your Eyes" and "Love at First Sight" became hits as well. She continued reinventing her image and experimenting with a range of genres on her subsequent albums, which spawned successful singles such as "Slow", "I Believe in You", "2 Hearts" and "All the Lovers". In 2017, she partnered with BMG Rights Management, with "Dancing" (2018) as their first release. In the following years, Minogue became the only female artist to have a number-one album and a top ten single, from the 1980s to the 2020s in the UK charts, with Disco (2020) and "Padam Padam" (2023) respectively. In film, Minogue made her debut in The Delinquents (1989), and appeared in Street Fighter (1994), Moulin Rouge! (2001), Holy Motors (2012) and San Andreas (2015). In reality television, she appeared as a judge on The Voice UK and The Voice Australia both in 2014. Her other ventures include product endorsements, books, perfumes, charitable work and a wine brand. Minogue's achievements include being an ARIA Hall of Fame inductee, Officer of the Order of Australia (AO), Officer of the Order of the British Empire, Chevalier (knight) of the Ordre des Arts et des Lettres and an honorary Doctor of Health Science (D.H.Sc.).

New lead section

Kylie Ann Minogue AO OBE (/mɪˈnoʊɡ/; born 28 May 1968) is an Australian singer, songwriter and actress. Referred to by the European press as the "Princess of Pop", she has been widely recognised for her reinvention in music and fashion. Her accolades include a Grammy Award, three Brit Awards and seventeen ARIA Music Awards. Born and raised in Melbourne, Minogue first achieved recognition in the Australian soap opera Neighbours (1986–1988). She began her music career in the late 1980s, releasing four studio albums under PWL. By the early 1990s, she had amassed several top five singles in Australia and the UK, including "The Loco-Motion", "I Should Be So Lucky", "Especially for You", "Hand on Your Heart" and "Better the Devil You Know". After taking more creative control over her music, she signed with Deconstruction Records and released the albums Kylie Minogue (1994) and Impossible Princess (1997), the former holding the number-one hit "Confide in Me". Minogue returned to mainstream dance-pop after joining Parlophone with Light Years (2000), including the number-one hits "Spinning Around" and "On a Night Like This". Her next album, Fever (2001), was an international breakthrough and became her best-selling album to date. The lead single, "Can't Get You Out of My Head" topped the charts of over 40 countries and sold over five million units. It became one of the most commercially successful singles of the 2000s. Follow up singles include "In Your Eyes" and "Love at First Sight" which both peaked in the top-five. She continued reinventing her image and experimenting with a range of genres on her subsequent albums, which spawned successful singles such as "Slow", "I Believe in You", "2 Hearts" and "All the Lovers". She later partnered up with BMG Rights Management, with "Dancing" as their first release. After releasing Disco (2020), she became the only female artist to have a number-one album from the 1980s to the 2020s in the UK charts. Her sixteenth studio album Tension (2023) received widespread acclaim from critics, with the lead single "Padam Padam" noted as her recording comeback. Minogue is the highest-selling female Australian artist of all time, having sold over 80 million records worldwide. In film, Minogue made her debut in The Delinquents (1989), and appeared in Street Fighter (1994), Moulin Rouge! (2001), Holy Motors (2012) and San Andreas (2015). In reality television, she appeared as a judge on The Voice UK and The Voice Australia both in 2014. Her other ventures include product endorsements, books, perfumes, charitable work and a wine brand. Minogue's achievements include being an ARIA Hall of Fame inductee, Officer of the Order of Australia (AO), Officer of the Order of the British Empire, Chevalier (knight) of the Ordre des Arts et des Lettres and an honorary Doctor of Health Science (D.H.Sc.).

References

Specific changes list:

• A mention of her 1994 number one single, Confide in Me
• Extra sources calling her the "Princess of Pop"; some of which are not European but American sources, so the "European press" phrasing is null
• Can't Get you out of my Head topping the charts of over 40 countries; source from The Guardian
• Removed year attached to "Dancing" as the other links to her other notable songs don't have years attached to them
• Removed "the only female artist in the UK that has achieved a top-ten single from the 1980s to the 2020s"; this is WP:SYNT as the source linked says "She is the fourth female artist to received a top-ten single across 5 consecutive decades." Not the same thing.
• Tension, her latest album, is her highest scoring album on Metacritic and the first of her albums to receive a "widespread acclaim" score since Metacritic was established in the 2000s. A woman with such a long career as hers achieving her best scoring album 35 years into her career is unheard of, therefore this deserves its mention.
• Moved "highest selling artist of all time" to the first sentence of the last paragraph, as is done on many other female entertainer articles like Madonna and Beyonce.

Agree as proposer. PHShanghai | they/them (talk) 15:11, 18 October 2023 (UTC)

Comment: Malformed RfC. Please clearly indicate what changes are being proposed and what corresponding sections of the article body support the changes to the lede. --Hipal (talk) 15:55, 18 October 2023 (UTC)

@Hipal: Done, I added a more descriptive sentence to the question. Additionally, more specific changes of what I'm proposing can be found in the above section of the talk page under "Insignificant but productive lead changes." PHShanghai | they/them (talk) 16:17, 18 October 2023 (UTC)

I'm afraid I have no idea what changes are being proposed. You might want to put both the current and the proposed together so people can see them both, or create a version showing the changes via <del>...</del> and <ins>...</ins>. --Hipal (talk) 16:41, 18 October 2023 (UTC)

cc @Hipal: Should I blank this section and start over? The RfC short sentence isn't showing up on the list no matter what edits I make to it. I asked for help in the Teahouse about it.

As for del & ins, I didn't know that code, thanks. I'm very noobish at templates. PHShanghai | they/them (talk) 17:00, 18 October 2023 (UTC)

Disagree, the current lead section is fine as it is, as Drmies already pointed out in this talk page. Also once again, you omitted her achievement for having a top ten single in five consecutive decades (80s to the 20s) in the UK chart. Your proposed lead section is also way too long.TheHotwiki (talk) 15:59, 18 October 2023 (UTC)

Comment: the claim for "Can't Get You Out of My Head" hitting #1 in forty countries is unreferenced within the lead section, and the entire article itself. A big no for the lead section of a featured Wikipedia article.TheHotwiki (talk) 16:10, 18 October 2023 (UTC)

First of all, the admin (that you've pinged four times already) did not support nor advertise your reverts. Reread the actual message again. You also cannot "Decline" rfcs.

Second of all, as I've already pointed out many times, that achievement does not have a direct source and your reasoning for including it is SYNT. According to Wordcounter, the proposed lead section only adds 10 more words, most of which are around adding the mention of "Confide in Me". Which you also keep removing with no reason.

Re CGYOMYH: The Guardian - The single [...] reached No 1 in around 40 countries. PHShanghai | they/them (talk) 16:11, 18 October 2023 (UTC)

Comment: Your claim of SYNT is false though. The article itself has a reference (from The Official Charts Company) that Minogue has achieved a top ten hit in the 80s to the 2020s, which so far, she's the only female artist to achieve that feat. The other female singers – Lulu, Cher and Diana Ross have achieved their top ten singles in different five consecutive decades compare to Minogue, as pointed out several times in this talkpage. Your reasoning of removing her achievement in singles chart, isn't justified. "Padam Padam" is also not a recording comeback, as she never retired from recording/releasing music, for you to label it as a "recording comeback". Also removing certain mention of specific years, in the current lead section is a big no.TheHotwiki (talk) 16:22, 18 October 2023 (UTC)

• Did the OCC say specifically that "Kylie is the only female artist to achieve a top ten single from the 80s to the 2000s"?
• The Guardian described it as a recording comeback; why do you keep using "you" pronouns as if I am the one who wrote these sources?
• The other singles don't have years attached to them as per MOS

Still also haven't given any good reason for removing Confide In Me and Can't Get You out of My Head's records PHShanghai | they/them (talk) 16:27, 18 October 2023 (UTC)

You keep asking if she's the only artist to have a top ten single in the 80s to the 2020s. Well other than Kylie Minogue, which female artist managed to score a top ten single from the 80s to the 2020s then? You cannot even argue that there is someone else that managed to achieve, that in the same five consecutive decades. You can clearly google if there is someone else right? The Official Charts Company didn't state Cher, Diana Ross and Lulu had top ten single during the 80s to the 2020s. It is very clear in the reference provided, those three other artists achieved theirs in the 60s to the 2020s, in a different time period as Minogue. The fact that you keep an making an excuse of this in order to remove it from the lead section, is just wild to me.TheHotwiki (talk) 16:35, 18 October 2023 (UTC)

WP:OR PHShanghai | they/them (talk) 16:39, 18 October 2023 (UTC)

Just because it wasn't copied and pasted, doesn't make it an original research. I'd like to see someone else making a comment about, that its original research. TheHotwiki (talk) 16:41, 18 October 2023 (UTC)

Oppose I am unsure the lede needs a list of here most popular songs (fOr a start). No this does not look like an improemwnt. Slatersteven (talk) 16:43, 18 October 2023 (UTC)

Even without this RfC, the lead already has her popular songs... what? PHShanghai | they/them (talk) 16:50, 18 October 2023 (UTC)

Here from the notification at WP:NPOV. I would suggest actually showing what is going to be changed, rather than just showing what the new lead will be. It's far to much detail to be working it out by flicking back and forth from the current lead to the proposal. -- LCU ActivelyDisinterested ∆transmissions∆ °co-ords° 21:16, 18 October 2023 (UTC)

@ActivelyDisinterested: Done. Thoughts? PHShanghai | they/them (talk) 06:08, 19 October 2023 (UTC)

Also please refrain from speaking/writing a different language in the talkpage. We are in English Wikipedia. Speaking/typing in a different language in this talk page, to release your frustration isn't a good look. TheHotwiki (talk) 08:04, 19 October 2023 (UTC)

Sidetracked discussion

The single "Confide in Me" added in the lead section, "Can't Get You Out of My Head" charting at #1 in forty countries being mentioned (questionable, since the reference didn't state which those 40 countries were), Minogue being the only female artist to achieve a top 10 single in 80s, 90s, 00s, 10s and 20s in the UK Singles Chart, being removed in the lead section, "Padam Padam" being called as a "recording comeback", which is false as Minogue released new music in 2020 and 2021, just a few years before "Padam Padam" and had number one albums in 2018/19/20 in Australia and the UK. Several mentioned of specific years being removed from the lead section. Its not an improvement, in my opinion. TheHotwiki (talk) 01:39, 19 October 2023 (UTC) And what exactly is your argument for omitting "Confide In Me" as a mention? What part of WP policy states that the specific countries need to be mentioned? The source is from a world famous newspaper with high integrity. Unless you can prove that The Guardian is a bad source. Removed because SYNT from source. "Hung Up" by Madonna is frequently cited as a comeback for her despite that she was releasing singles from 2000-2005, so that argument is null. Like I said, prove that The Guardian is a bad source and I'll be happy to remove it. Wikipedia:Reliable_sources/Perennial_sources#Sources I don't see you arguing to add specific years to all of her singles like Love at First Sight and Slow?? Ano problema mo?? PHShanghai | they/them (talk) 06:16, 19 October 2023 (UTC) "Padam Padam" isn't a recording comeback when she released new music in 2018 to 2021. Also, you keep bringing up SYNT, when you couldn't even argue that there is another female artist other than Kylie Minogue, that managed to have a top ten single in the 80s, 90s, 00s, 10s and 20s in the Uk Singles Chart. Your continuous dismissal for that achievement really shows how you are only basing these changes in your own preference only. TheHotwiki (talk) 06:22, 19 October 2023 (UTC) Also, the only change I am okay with is mentioning "Confide in Me". It still needs better wording. The rest of the changes, don't really improve the lead section in any shape of form. "Padam Padam" being called a "recording comeback" whether its from a respected magazine, is still an opinion from a single journalist. That shouldn't be written in the lead section. While Kylie Minogue achieving a UK top ten single in the 80s, 90s, 00s, 10s and 20s, isn't based on an opinion from someone else, but a fact published by the The Official Charts which are based from the music industry results coming from public sales/streaming. As for Tension's "critical acclaim", Minogue's previous album Disco was well received by critics as well, which was included in several year-end lists for albums, but its not highlighted in the lead section. So Tension shouldn't be as well. TheHotwiki (talk) 07:59, 19 October 2023 (UTC) 1. Extra sources: Queerty: Kylie Minogue’s comeback with summer anthem “Padam Padam” shows no signs of slowing up. News24: Padam Padam is the pop pixie’s banger of a comeback single that has everyone from nine to 90 hooked and it’s thrust her firmly back into the charts. Evening Standard: Kylie Minogue is officially back! Her comeback single Padam Padam arrives as a first teaser to newly announced album Tension – and unsurprisingly, it’s a dancefloor-ready gem. PinkNews: Kylie’s comeback appears to mark a similar shift. With “Padam Padam”, she is looking likely to have her biggest British hit in nearly a decade. 2. OCC says that she is the fourth female artist to receive a top ten hit in five consecutive decades; that is all the source said and to change the context (which you are arguing for) would be WP:OR. 3. Disco has a MC score of 72, indicating "positive reviews". Tension has a MC score of 86, indicating "widespread acclaim". It is objective truth Tension is objectively scored way higher than Disco and currently Kylie's only "universally acclaimed" album on Metacritic. It is boggling me how you want to remove her critical success; there is a difference between positive reviews and critical acclaim. PHShanghai | they/them (talk) 10:19, 20 October 2023 (UTC) At this point, no one is agreeing with you. Time to give it a rest. TheHotwiki (talk) 14:10, 20 October 2023 (UTC) Personal attacks instead of actually countering my points that I've based in policy and have given references to. Maybe when you stop your clear WP:OWN issues that many people have complained about; you actually could be doing anything constructive and not resorting to petty, insignificant attacks. PHShanghai | they/them (talk) 14:18, 20 October 2023 (UTC) You're accusing me of attacking you, when you yourself accused me of so many things (please read your comments towards about me). Also you can clearly see in this talk page that I wasn't the only one who didn't see your proposed changes as an improvement. We've been discussing about this for more than 48 hours, and no one has agreed with your proposed changes. Let it go. TheHotwiki (talk) 14:25, 20 October 2023 (UTC) It isn't an accusation when several other editors have confronted you of WP:OWN issues on this particular article specifically. That isn't an accusation that's just the plain cold truth. Speaking of which, why are you still avoiding actually responding to the facts I've listed? (Tension is her highest, most acclaimed album.) Additionally, that isn't how RfCs work. The only other person who's opposed the argument is someone whos mainly edits talk pages; and consensus isn't determined based on numbers, but the strength of arguments. It seems more like you want to avoid constructive consensus and you keep resorting to ad hominem attacks. Other editors have called out your passive-aggressive rudeness; it isn't just me. PHShanghai | they/them (talk) 14:36, 20 October 2023 (UTC) I haven't been blocked or warned about owning an article. So you suddenly making this about me and personally attacking me, are both inappropriate and not healthy towards me. TheHotwiki (talk) 15:35, 20 October 2023 (UTC) Also I think I am done with communicating with you. I think we've exhausted this topic. I don't agree with your changes and thats that. And since I've been personal attacked several by you in this talk page, I think my next step, would be to file a report against you. TheHotwiki (talk) 15:44, 20 October 2023 (UTC) Talk:Kylie_Minogue#Opening_paragraphs: "First things first, calm down and stop being passive-aggressive about it. Neither you nor I own ANY article on Wikipedia." You've been a passive aggressive editor this entire time. Not only that; Wikipedia is built on consensus. Literally admitting "I don't agree with your changes therefore you cannot make any changes" straight up violates WP:OWN. And are we even going to talk about that WP:INTIM statement? PHShanghai | they/them (talk) 00:18, 21 October 2023 (UTC)

I am not going to meddle in the lead changes (although, I think PHShanghai has some points); however, I can confirm that I have felt that Hotwiki has been rude and passive aggressive towards me in the past when it comes discussing/reverting some changes on the Kylie articles. Reading this conversation, I cannot help but feel he has some WP:OWN issues with the content he is contributing on Wiki. Let's not forget that Wikipedia is a joint collaborative project that must be respected and discussed. — Tom^(T2ME) 09:27, 21 October 2023 (UTC)

Slight oppose - (Brought here from WP:RFC/A) - I do think the proposed new section runs a little long. I don't like that the fact she was the #1 highest selling female Australian musician was omitted form the lead paragraph. However I do see you're putting a lot of work into the new section and think there is promise if you can trim it down and keep some of the key points. MaximusEditor (talk) 23:47, 10 November 2023 (UTC)

The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.