Talk:Bini (group)

WikiProject for Bini

Hello! I have thoughts here or a suggestion too, I was planning a WikiProject that dedicated only for Bini last month but the proposal for WikiProject are on hold (WP:WPPRO), but they stated that If your group can't wait for the new process, please only create group pages in the userspace of one of your members.. Any thoughts should I continue? Royiswariii Talk! 04:41, 23 November 2024 (UTC)

Hi, didn't know you proposed something like this for Bini last month. Can you directly link to the proposal? AstrooKai (Talk) 05:04, 23 November 2024 (UTC)

I didn't propose a Wikiproject because they're changing the process of the proposing of WikiProject, I bet that it will take longer to return of proposing a Wikiproject. But I'm planning to create a Wikiproject using my userspace since it's not allowed to propose a wikiproject. In their statment In 2024, we are changing the proposal process. We are trying to reduce the number of failed attempts to start groups. Royiswariii Talk! 05:12, 23 November 2024 (UTC)

I see. Although, I'm not quite familiar with a userspace WikiProject. How does it differ from mainspace WikiProjects? AstrooKai (Talk) 06:04, 23 November 2024 (UTC)

As far as I know, there is no difference on WP mainspace and userspace, they just recommended to create a WikiProject if you are impatient to create (like me), maybe a limited to do in userspace i guess? But I think it's just same as WP mainspace. It's just a limited small group and can formalized if the proposal for WikiProject was okay.Royiswariii Talk! 06:41, 23 November 2024 (UTC)

Oh okay. Though, I'm not quite sure if Bini needs a WikiProject right now. I mean, SB19, another P-pop group, has relatively the same stardom as Bini right now, but they don't seem to have a dedicated WikiProject or group of editors here. As far as I know, only a few of us editors regularly maintain Bini-related articles (me, you, and @Borgenland). @Orojackson56 was active before, but they stopped contributing in August. @Indo360 on the other hand, is active in improving other Philippine entertainment articles.

Though that is my opinion, I don't know about the others. It's up to them whether they agree with forming a Bini WikiProject since I'm okay with whatever the outcome of this. I pinged them for their feedback about this proposal. AstrooKai (Talk) 08:29, 23 November 2024 (UTC)

I don’t think the time is ripe for an independent WikiProject. I think the best solution for now is helping the Music Task Force in Tambayan, but I do wish a Bloom badge is available for display in user pages. Borgenland (talk) 08:36, 23 November 2024 (UTC)

I agree. The music task force is active, but we need additional participants who are active and able to address those items in the to-do list. In addition, Bini is already under this task force, so I think having a separate WikiProject for the group alone is too much.

For the Bloom userbox, I have been planning to create one for a long time now, but I just can't find any images or logo of the group that I can use without violating any policy or guidelines. AstrooKai (Talk) 09:00, 23 November 2024 (UTC)

There's a logo of File:BINI logo.svg, I will upload a new clearer logo. Royiswariii Talk! 09:06, 23 November 2024 (UTC)

Yea, but I'm concerned since it's a trademark of ABS-CBN. AstrooKai (Talk) 10:58, 23 November 2024 (UTC)

Hello AstrooKai!

It's possible to use a logo is in the public domain but also trademarked in a userbox on Wikipedia provided certain conditions are met

Since the logo is in the public domain, there are no copyright restrictions on its use. However, trademark law still applies.

Since we're on Wikipedia and it's a Nonprofit organization, userboxes on logo are allowed on Wikipedia policies to use public domain logos even it's have a trademark, but it's essential to ensure that the use

• Does not imply affiliation, sponsorship, or endorsement by the trademark holder.
• Clearly identifies the logo's public domain and trademarked status using proper tags (e.g, {{PD-textlogo}} and {{Trademark}})

While using the logo in a userbox may allow, it's important to note that decorative or improper use of userboxed of trademarked material userboxes can lead to deletion or violating the Wikipedia policy. Royiswariii Talk! 11:16, 23 November 2024 (UTC)

Any flower would be fine on my part. Borgenland (talk) 11:48, 23 November 2024 (UTC)

User:AstrooKai/Bini. I've come up with this, just basic text but associated with Bini's colors. It can be used with {{User:AstrooKai/Bini}}. Let me know if you guys have any suggestions. AstrooKai (Talk) 13:32, 23 November 2024 (UTC)

That's great! I will add this on my userpage later. Royiswariii Talk! 13:35, 23 November 2024 (UTC)

Update: Hi everyone!

As the discussion on WikiProject council, they gave us a month of trial if we maintain the activeness of a WikiProject, the WikiProject will be under of WikiProject Musician for a month, and if we gather and maintain the activeness, the WikiProject Bini will be separated on Musicians.

If you wanna join, you can reply on the discussion Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Musicians#Proposal Collaboration of Bini. Royiswariii Talk! 12:54, 17 December 2024 (UTC)

GA Review

The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

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This review is transcluded from Talk:Bini (group)/GA1. The edit link for this section can be used to add comments to the review.

Nominator: Royiswariii (talk · contribs) 06:04, 27 August 2024 (UTC)

Reviewer: Dxneo (talk · contribs) 14:19, 29 November 2024 (UTC)

Hello mates, coming from this review, I was like why not check this out too. Truth is I have read the article before even initiating this review so let's see what happens from here. dxneo (talk) 14:19, 29 November 2024 (UTC)

At first glance

I realised that the lead kind of go against WP:CITELEAD. The first paragraph is not referenced but the others are. Mind you, this is not that big of a deal, but the lead is often repeated in the body of the article so it already gives me the impression that the prose is not up to GA standard.

• This is a very long article, to make it easy and simple, make sure that the lead is free of citations. Make sure the lead only summarize the body of the article to prepare readers and grab their attention.

• Consistency is key. If you say the website is Vogue, you cannot move on to say others are grammy.com or x.com. Preferably, use domain name, not URLs.

• Wiki link each and every |website= were possible.

• Make sure every single reference is archived, to avoid linkrot. This is gonna be a problem since Wayback Machine is under cyber attack. You should use Archive.today or ghostarchive.org to archive websites.

• Add alt text to each and every media file.

• Why is there a non-free magazine cover on this article?

• Primary sources such as YouTube, Facebook, or more social sites are very discouraged. I suggest you reduce the use of such sites unless stated otherwise.

• That See also section is not necessary. Imagine doing that for someone like Lil Wayne who has been in the game for decades.

• Merge short paragraphs.

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Verdict

Honestly, I think this article must be taken to WP:PR for a thorough review in terms of prose, media and citations (there are lots and lots of social sites here). Opinions from multiple viewpoints will definitely lead you into the right direction. A quick fail will do here. dxneo (talk) 14:19, 29 November 2024 (UTC)

Courtesy ping:AstrooKai and Borgenland. dxneo (talk) 16:09, 29 November 2024 (UTC)

Acknowledged. It is indeed a running battle to minimize WP:FANCRUFT not just here. Borgenland (talk) 16:13, 29 November 2024 (UTC)

Thank you. Please check out lint errors (here), scroll to the bottom and you'll see that bots have detected 21 duplicate errors, fix them. Royiswariii, AstrooKai and Borgenland, wish you all the best. I'll see you at WP:PR. You may request peer review now. dxneo (talk) 16:30, 29 November 2024 (UTC)

The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

Billboard Philippines Women in Music

Billboard Philippines Women in Music is an annual event that "honor the most influential women in Filipino music".

In the "Awards and nominations" section, should the result for the Rising Star Award be retained as Won, or change it to Awardee or Honoree? Because the accolade is not a competition, where a vote system is implemented to determine the winners of the award. And as far as I know, each term is different:

• Won – The recipient secured first place among other nominations.
• Awardee – The recipient of an award, not always through competition.
• Honoree – Someone recognized or celebrated for achievements.
• Nominated – The recipient was nominated but did not win.
• Pending – The recipient has been nominated and is awaiting final result.

I also want to take this opportunity to develop a consensus on the terms that should be used for future accolades of the group to ensure consistency. AstrooKai (Talk) 09:14, 1 January 2025 (UTC)

If there was no evident sign of competition then won shouldn’t be used. Borgenland (talk) 09:15, 1 January 2025 (UTC)

Should it be Awardee or Honoree? AstrooKai (Talk) 09:20, 1 January 2025 (UTC)

I’m leaning to H as A is too competitive. Borgenland (talk) 09:38, 1 January 2025 (UTC)

Alright. I will wait for other editors to take a look into this discussion for consensus. AstrooKai (Talk) 09:45, 1 January 2025 (UTC)

Listicles

@Royiswariii recently added the listing of "Salamin, Salamin" on Billboard Philippines' 24 Standout Songs of 2024 and The 50 Best Music Videos of 2024 at Bini (group) § Listicles. Bini's other songs also received various listings on listicles in 2024 that is not yet added. Should we:

1. Maintain this practice—adding listings of Bini songs to the group's main article
2. Only add the listing of the group themself in the section and place the listings of the songs to their respective articles (if any)?

AstrooKai (Talk) 07:55, 3 January 2025 (UTC)

Pinging the article's recent significant contributors (@Borgenland, @Bloomagiliw, @Royiswariii) for feedback. AstrooKai (Talk) 07:57, 3 January 2025 (UTC)

Do you mind testing how many bytes that would entail? Borgenland (talk) 07:58, 3 January 2025 (UTC)

When Roy added the The 50 Best Music Videos Of 2024 listing, it added 426 bytes to the article. The addition of 24 Standout Songs Of 2024 added 347 bytes.

A rough estimate is that it would add around 300–600 bytes to the article, considering the length of the publication and listicle name of other publishers, and table formattings. If an archive of the references would be considered, it might add another 200–400 bytes per reference. AstrooKai (Talk) 08:10, 3 January 2025 (UTC)

At this stage I don’t think it would do harm, though it should be reviewed in the event of a critical mass. Borgenland (talk) 08:42, 3 January 2025 (UTC)

Requested move 29 January 2025

• Bini (group) → Bini
• Bini → Bini (disambiguation)
• Gwen (singer) → Gwen
• Gwen → Gwen (disambiguation)
• Mikha (singer) → Mikha

– This following requested move pertains to a member of the Filipino girl group Bini (group). I believe that all these requested moves are passed on WP:PRIMARYTOPIC. Please read the following explanations:

• Bini (group)
  • Bini are passed on PRIMARYTOPIC because, the pageviews from January 1, 2024 until yesterday (January 28, 2025) nearly 1.2 Million pageviews.

• Gwen (singer)
  • Gwen is a member of Bini and she's have 54, 140 pageviews.

• Mikha (singer)
  • Mikha was also a member of Bini, she's have 110, 715 pageviews since the creation of the article. Not to be confused on Mika (singer).

• Maloi (singer)
  • Maloi was also a memeber of Bini, her article have 84, 562 pageviews since the creation of the article. ROY is WAR Talk! 02:42, 29 January 2025 (UTC)

Note: WikiProject Women in Music, WikiProject Southeast Asia, WikiProject Asia, WikiProject Pop music, Tambayan Philippines, WikiProject Musicians, and WikiProject Biography have been notified of this discussion. ROY is WAR Talk! 02:48, 29 January 2025 (UTC)

Note: the Maloi (singer) → Maloi proposal had to be removed from this request because it conflicted with a proposal at Talk:Maloi (singer). P.I. Ellsworth , ed. ^{put'er there} 13:48, 29 January 2025 (UTC)

• Support Bini related moves and Maloi per notability. As for the members I am uncertain given commonality. Borgenland (talk) 04:14, 29 January 2025 (UTC)

• Oppose Gwen for the singer. The purpose of pageviews is to see how it compares with the other listings, and looking at more articles and all time, instead of just the last year, this singer doesn't appear to be the primary topic. I would honestly suggest moving her to Gwen (Filipino singer) seeing as most people would probably thinking of Gwen Stefani as a more prominent singer with the name Gwen [1].

Support moving the group to Bini as all time page views for them is clear enough. Also Support moves for Mikha and Maloi; Mihka redirects to Micah where there is no one (not even this person) listed there under the name, and there is no article for anything else under Maloi so I'd be happy for her to take that article space. orangesclub 🍊 03:56, 29 January 2025 (UTC)

• Support Bini as the primary topic. Support Mikha, Maloi; unambiguous. Oppose Gwen, who is not the primary topic. 162 etc. (talk) 04:28, 29 January 2025 (UTC)

• Support for Bini (indeed a WP:PTOPIC), Maloi, and Mikha (unambiguous) while oppose for Gwen as per above. 𝙳.𝟷𝟾𝚝𝚑 (𝚃𝚊𝚕𝚔) 05:36, 29 January 2025 (UTC)
• Support for Bini, Maloi, and Mikha. Oppose for Gwen. All are per above. AstrooKai (Talk) 06:03, 29 January 2025 (UTC)
• Oppose moving Gwen, the others seem to have no other significant competition for primary topic. older ≠ wiser 12:13, 29 January 2025 (UTC)

• This sounds like peak WP:Recentism, but I don't want to be entirely prejudiced against it. Per WP:DPT, let's have a look at some stats.

WikiNav for Bini does show a large amount of interest. At the same time, it's not necessarily clear what the long-term significance situation is. All-time mass views for the base title and for the surname doesn't show a lot of reader interest in the other topics. It seems to be a fairly common Italian surname, and the Nigerian people are fairly prominent as well, though it's not clear how common the specific moniker Bini for the Edo really is. It would definitely improve the efficiency of navigation for these fans if we moved this, but I'm not sure if this would give the wrong impression to the average reader that this is a worldwide definition of what "Bini" primarily is. It's hard to be particularly bothered by the idea of inconveniencing hundreds of fans a month - they know what they're after, it's not actually hard for them to pick out their favorite item out of a short list.

With regard to Gwen, WikiNav for Gwen and for the given name actually show more people are being detected manually navigating to unlinked Gwen Stefani than there are looking for this other person, let alone all the other traffic there. This proposal is just plain nonsense.

I don't have time right now to go over the rest, but I'm guessing there's also marginal value in doing this. It's safe to say that the long-term significance aspect of WP:PTOPIC wasn't considered here, and we're instead looking at the encyclopedia more from a fan point of view, which is misguided. (Oppose) --Joy (talk) 15:06, 29 January 2025 (UTC)

• Are we really to believe that a a Filipino girl group known almost primarily in the Philippines is primary topic over a village in Burkina Faso, a language and a whole goddamned the ethnic group? Really?

"Jhoanna", an alternate spelling of Joanna (given name), changed its subject since one of the members of Bini is named "Jhoanna". As per WP:POFR, that should not have been the case, but I was outvoted by Bini fans and their WP:PRIMARYTOPIC argument that people fell in line for. Now, "Mikha" is an alternate spelling of "Micah", and again, just like on the ill-fated RM that totally disregarded WP:POFR, it has to give way to a member of this girl group.

Gwen has been opposed by pretty much everybody here save for the Bini fans, I won't have to elaborate on that.

There's also a separate an ongoing RM for Maloi at Talk:Maloi (singer)#Requested move 27 January 2025 that people on this RM should know about. I don't think her "Maloi" (which came from "Mary Loi") is an alternate spelling of "Maloy", however Maloi can either be clan of an ethnic group or a village. A whole goddamned village.

WP:AGF and all, but there's something nefarious about these RMs. Royiswariii User talk:Wikishovel#Conflict on "Jhoanna" and "Joanna" asked Wikishovel about the Jhoanna RM, arguing "it can be confusion on Google algorithms too especially there is a Google Knowledge Panel for Jhoanna Robles". Are you guys being paid? If not, ABS-CBN should pay you guys; work is not free. Also, how can we trust you guys you'd follow WP:NPOV? Google Knowledge Panels are absolutely none of our business, and we should name articles based on third party websites.

As this stands, oppose all as proposed as per my explanation and as per Joy, support these moves:

• Bini (group) stays there.
• Gwen (singer) move to Gwen Apuli or "Bini Gwen" (this is the appellative Bini members go by these days, "Bini" <nickname>". Imagine "Blackpink Lisa"), or "Gwen (Filipino singer)".
• Mikha (singer) move to Mikha Lim or "Bini Mikha".

I'd comment about this on the Maloi RM, and while we cannot overtturn Jhoanna, or advocate reopening, I'd support for a similar naming convention for her in the future. Howard the Duck (talk) 23:49, 29 January 2025 (UTC)

(Apparently, the stricken words offended someone; obviously, it was not a personal attack as it was never directed to any specific person, real or imagined, from within or without this discussion, but I have stricken it nonetheless. Howard the Duck (talk) 00:49, 30 January 2025 (UTC))