This is an archive of past discussions with User:Keeper76. Do not edit the contents of this page. If you wish to start a new discussion or revive an old one, please do so on the current talk page.
I wish to insert a photo of the Joffrey Ballet reproduction of the Rite of Spring into the article. I can not figure out how to determine if it is OK, copyright, etc. Or figure out how to take a snapshot of a You Tube video clip, if it is allowed. In particular, I want to get a still of inward pointing feet up to the knees, on You-Tube, to illustrate a point. Where to go for help? EricDiesel (talk) 22:11, 18 September 2008 (UTC)
I'm actually impressed
Now that most of the Sarah Palin threads have disappeared (but I could always start one if you like), I see what you do around this place. And you have that Minnesota patience thing going. I can't believe that. By the way, did you see my punishment for attempting to bait SandyGeorgia? I have to review German women's national football team. I actually read the damn article (it wasn't bad, for example, the GDR banned the team for some reason). Just be aware, SG is a bit tense about her BoSox. Something about a fat lady singing. OrangeMarlinTalk•Contributions22:37, 18 September 2008 (UTC)
Wait, what??? What are you impressed with? My SU edits? Hot damn, I need a good "review" from an article builder. Hot damn. Keeperǀ7622:43, 18 September 2008 (UTC)
Thank you
Hi Keeper76. I would like to thank you for your support in my RfA and the confidence expressed thereby. It is very much appreciated. :) The RfA was closed as successful with 73 supports, 3 opposes and 4 neutral. I would especially like to thank WBOSITG for nominating me. Best wishes and thanks again, —αἰτίας•discussion•23:15, 18 September 2008 (UTC)
Update: I am in the process of expanding the article. It's a little bit better, but it won't be up to par to submit to WP:GAC for a few days at the least, probably a week. But in any event, at this point I believe I have demonstrated coverage and book reviews in multiple secondary sources. Cirt (talk) 03:44, 19 September 2008 (UTC)
Okay I've done as much as I can for the time being, here are some interesting facts: Separate reviews in the San Francisco Chronicle, the San Francisco Examiner, and Associated Press each characterized Raven as the "definitive" book on Jonestown and Peoples Temple. The book was recognized with the Thomas Thompson PEN Award for nonfiction in 1983. Unfortunately because there is an ongoing AfD I cannot nominate this article at T:TDYK, and as AfDs run for at least 5 days even if after that period of time the consensus were to be "Keep", the time window in which the article would be eligible for WP:DYK would have elapsed already. So I'd appreciate your previously suggested notion of retracting the AfD nom, it'd give us more flexibility in the article potentially becoming a DYK. Thanks for your understanding, Cirt (talk) 05:40, 19 September 2008 (UTC)
Copyedit request
Hi, I'm looking for a copyeditor for Homer Simpson. I've been working on the article for a while and although I was hoping it would be longer than it is, I've pretty much hit a wall and I doubt there is a lot more I can add (other than some analysis). So in order to get it ready for a FAC (probably in late September), it needs some copyediting and I would appreciate it if you could take a look. Thanks for your time, Scorpion042204:48, 14 September 2008 (UTC)
D'oh! (this isn't any worse than the last one that I CE-d on it's way to being a featured list). Scorpion, I'll give it a read through this week. Keeperǀ7614:04, 15 September 2008 (UTC)
If I may be so bold, and knowing OM's tendency to only edit the most serious of articles, that he meant that he felt that bringing Homer to FA was a bit unimportant as related to the non-fiction articles that he considers worth editing. Don't worry about O-marlin, Scorpion. He like what he likes, and edits what he edits. He's also a Florida Marlins fan, one of seven to be confirmed. His opinion isn't worth much. :-) Keeperǀ7623:06, 15 September 2008 (UTC)
If that's true, then I find it really insulting. Just because I choose to edit one set of articles that some don't consider a "core topic", it does not make my contributions any less valid. -- Scorpion042200:08, 16 September 2008 (UTC)
I don't see where anyone suggested that your contributions were any less valid valid than any other. It's a big world, room for all of us, and rue the day that we all agree. ;-) --Malleus Fatuorum (talk) 00:19, 16 September 2008 (UTC)
My tolerance of lacking a sense of humor is only exceeded by my tolerance of POV-pushing. My comments were about Keeper76's interest level in real editing. I read Vampire articles on this project (though I don't edit them), which is no different than a Simpson's article. I work mostly on science articles, which I consider important only to keep out the cruft, but no more or less important than having an encyclopedia that has articles on motorcycles, which I've edited, sports teams, which I've edited, and who knows what else. Scorpion, my suggestion is twofold: get a thick skin, and laugh at Keeper76, who is clueless about baseball. The Marlins have 10 fans. But Keeper is missing 3 fingers, so he can't count very high. OrangeMarlinTalk•Contributions22:45, 16 September 2008 (UTC)
So many insults, so little time. Scorpion, I completely misinterpretted what OrangMarlin wrote. He wasn't insulting you, or the Simpsons, he was insulting me. I shoulda guessed. Looks like I need to chew off anyother finger as punishment. The marlins now have 6 fans Keeperǀ7617:26, 17 September 2008 (UTC)
Ack, I forgot I said I'd do this this week. Scorpion, I'll be online a bit here and there this afternoon, less frequently tomorrow, gone Sunday, back Monday. Editing this thread so this doesn't get archived over the weekend (then I'd really forget :-) Keeperǀ7619:18, 19 September 2008 (UTC)
Content dispute questions
Imagine, if you will, that you wrote an article that's about 90% FA quality, and you're waiting for a few small adjustments before you nominate it. Another editor, however, is insisting that a passage is included that appears to your sources to be synthesized non-notable information, POV pushing, and borderline fringe theory. A clear record of explaining policy to this insistent editor, some edit wars, some input from a dozen other editors all do nothing in persuading him that it does not belong in the article. No matter how you try to work with the passage, it continues to be reverted, and reads badly. The insistent editor appears to be a single-purpose account who refuses to read the sources you provide, and responds with badly formatted posts that obfuscate logic and exhibit he has no clear knowledge of any policy other than 3RR - to threaten you. Imagine that you are the main editor and an admin. What are your steps after threads at ANI, RfC, and a voluminous one at WP:Fringe? Would it be abusing your power to block him? Who do you go to for help? At what point is action against the user warranted in a content dispute? What is there already in place for content editors (and why is it so much easier for an editor to be blocked for calling another a douchebag, than it is for him to be blocked for the aforementioned behaviors?) --Moni3 (talk) 13:31, 17 September 2008 (UTC)
Assuming this is a question for the AN/K crowd, and not just Keeper, I'll throw in my opinion.
Dear God no, don't block them yourself. The wailing and gnashing of teeth at the subsequent WP:ANI thread will be audible from space.
If you've been to ANI, RFC, WP:F, and there's still no relief, I'd suggest another ANI thread, this time specifically requesting that a neutral admin review and block.
The reason it's easier to get someone blocked for namecalling than being a POV-pushing SPA is that investigating namecalling takes a minute or two, but investigating a long, involved conflict takes time. For example, if I saw someone just now calling someone else a douchebag, I'd block them, and then go off to deal with real life for a while, then return later. But I can't look into your situation (sorry), because I'm going offline in a few minutes.
Well, I knew enough not to block on an article I had been working on, but I'm completely confounded. Consider me lucky or so sheltered I haven't had to deal with this kind of behavior before. I don't know how it happened either. All noses are welcome on this issue. I've gotten such a wide array of advice, that it's not apparently clear that content disputes are easily addressed and seen. --Moni3 (talk) 15:53, 17 September 2008 (UTC)
I hate admitting it, because I hate when Barneca gloats, but he's right (the douchebag). It's so much easier for an editor to be blocked for callnig another a douchebag precisely because it's so cut and dry. It's easier. Compounds frustration for sure though, because technically, calling another editor a "name" doesn't "damage" the encyclopedia (other than perhaps driving away an editor). Have you gone to ANI yet with a plea for help? Keeperǀ7616:02, 17 September 2008 (UTC)
An ANI thread was started before I rewrote the article. Since I've rewritten it, however, there's an incomprehensible thread on WP:Fringe on the advice of SandyGeorgia. I then got advice from itsmejudith that it should probably be at WP:NPOV. Or WP:OR. Because that tiny section seems to encapsulate the heart of all three policies. Now the insistent editor has received a 3RR warning. So this tiny passage could inspire a thread on all four pages. After another 100 admins and other editors see it, what then would be done about it? And again, why is it easier to deal with name-calling than a clear-cut content dispute? Is there nothing in place because it's too much a hassle? When Wikipedia was accused of killing off Sinbad and declaring Ted Sorenson one of the murderers of JFK, the BLP project was created. When Wikipedia was accused of having shoddy research, standards for citations at GA and FAC raised considerably. In my experience with this editor, what's in place is not effective. I don't plan on just complaining, I think a new system can be made. --Moni3 (talk) 16:15, 17 September 2008 (UTC)
I'm all for that. There's nothing more frustrating then being told to "take it somewhere else", however well-meaning. I hear you. Name-calling is easier than content disputes, because name-calling is generally one-sided. There is no dispute. Someone called someone else a name, the former gets blocked/sanctioned/warned/"dealt with", the latter moves along. It isn't a dispute. Content disputes are complicated. An admin needs to know the content. The irony of course, is that if the admin knows the content, and edits it, now they are "involved." Total asshattery. I know why you are frustrated, and our current system would frown on you blocking the other editor. I'll dredge up some things to read, the article, the different "boards, boards boards" you were told to go to, I'm sure I'll find it in your contribs. Keeperǀ7616:23, 17 September 2008 (UTC)
I found what I need to read Moni, I'll be reading threads all afternoon today, perhaps I'll say or do something wise at the end of it. -- Keeperǀ7616:49, 17 September 2008 (UTC)
Of course, I can use all the input I can get. But I actually approached this as a hypothetical on your talk page because of the confusion and apparent shrugs of "What are ya gonna do?" from other experienced editors. I'm familiarizing myself with the dispute resolution realm. May take me a while, but I'm pretty well convinced that content should be watched more vigilantly than name-calling. I'm curious to know where the system needs to be improved, or even if there is a system at all. --Moni3 (talk) 20:42, 17 September 2008 (UTC)
The "content dispute" system is broken, and nobody wants to fix it. Why? Because it's hard, I presume. None of us are paid enough to "fix it" definitively. Case by case is the best we can do I'm afraid. I didn't know who HM was prior to today, so I can at least say I'm just a little bit smarter, and just a little bit more well-rounded, for a Midwesterner anyway...I'm looking for BB's RFC that has been alluded to, link the RFC on your talkpage for me? Keeperǀ7621:07, 17 September 2008 (UTC)
Wouldn't say it's completely broken, or I'd have stopped editing Wikipedia quite some time ago! ;) An article RFC often helps, but it needs to be conducted in a certain way (I think) in order to be even slightly effective. If this isn't resolved by next week (remind if so), I'll see if I can help. Ncmvocalist (talk) 00:42, 18 September 2008 (UTC)
You are in excellent company with Xavexgoem. One of Wikipedia's most fair mediators, knows how to sift through the rubbish. Keeperǀ7615:07, 18 September 2008 (UTC)
I choose to interpret this as "feel free to encourage me to 'hang in there', even though I just had to repeat essentially, everything I've already said somewhere else, but this time for a new audience of one". It'll work out. Hang in there. The subject matter is worth the grief and effort, I know you agree. Keeperǀ7615:14, 18 September 2008 (UTC)
We take three out of four, hope that helped you some. Moose's ovation tonight was wonderful. I think Bugs is going to hate me more now -- or maybe he's a Cubs fan. Can't remember. Great series, although by halfway through tonight and up 8-1 it was a spring training game with lots on both sides making their debuts. Was great to see Griffey again live, can't remember the last time I saw that. Got some wonderful pics and video. Glad the bridge wasn't part of your commute as that would have been a nightmare. Had planned to go to Mall of America between flights last time I flew through MSP but I was delayed inbound from Calgary. TravellingCari03:29, 19 September 2008 (UTC)
Twins win, sox lose. The world is right again. I won't be nearly as nostalgic when my boys move across town in 2011. Keeperǀ7614:45, 19 September 2008 (UTC)
Heh. I'm a Minnesotan that frequently goes to Illinoisy on business. I've been to Comiskey (new and old, and I refuse to call any baseball field "cellular") almost as many times as I've been to HHH. Haven't made Wrigley yet. Love cheerin' for whoever is beating up the Pales on their turf though :-) Saw the sox throw a no-hitter once. Still lost 4-0 (on walks and errors). The other pitcher threw a 2-hit, got the win. Keeperǀ7614:40, 19 September 2008 (UTC)
Throwing a no-hitter and losing is kind of the ultimate insult. I've often thought that the Cubs would be the only team with the possiblity of pitching a perfect game and losing. I'll let you ponder how that could happen. You need to get to Wrigley someday. It's baseball Mecca. Or Mecca west, since Fenway and Yankee Stadium could be Mecca east. If you're in Chicago and the Cubs aren't at home, just park somewhere near the field and just walk around the outside of it. That alone is worth the trip. I used to go to the old Comiskey also. It was quite a different atmosphere from Wrigley. When the upper deck was full, that joint rocked. The new one you don't have to call "Cellular", just call it "The Cell", which is a good metaphor in several ways. Baseball BugsWhat's up, Doc?14:51, 19 September 2008 (UTC)
I want to point out that my "meanness" or sarcasm is typically to try to get people to think - to think about what they're saying - to think outside of the box, or the linear, dogmatic philosophy, that they've put themselves in. Sometimes it works, sometimes it doesn't, but I keep trying. 0:) Because for all the nannyistic comments like "you're not helping", once in awhile someone will say, Hey, he's onto something. Baseball BugsWhat's up, Doc?14:56, 19 September 2008 (UTC)
Next time I see it, I'll be sure to reply with "Hey, he's onto something. I'm not sure why he thinks that's helping..." Keeperǀ7615:08, 19 September 2008 (UTC)
Yep, that should help. Now, about South Dakota, the one good thing about it is that it's not North Dakota. Once in awhile an ND governor will suggest that they rename themselves just "Dakota", and the governor of SD will fire back with the idea that they should instead name it just "North". As far as the God's country thing... a line from Groucho Marx in Animal Crackers, in the days before the Hays office was in full control: "Africa is God's country... and He can have it!" Or substitute the Dakotas, or Indiana, or anyplace of no recognizable merit whatsoever. Baseball BugsWhat's up, Doc?15:22, 19 September 2008 (UTC)
The Vike fans (Minnesota nice is a blessing, a curse, a disease and a lie all wrapped up in a pretty smile) don't boo their own. They booed T-Jack everytime he threw the ball (didn't help that whenever he threw it, it would land harmlessly out of bounds 10 yards away from the "intended receiver". I like Gus. He'll find new and interesting ways to lose. How long is AD out? I haven't heard anything. Keeperǀ7614:55, 19 September 2008 (UTC)
In case you haven't seen the mess on my talkpage—as the Emperor of Griefy XfDs, can you take a look at this thread and the resulting AfD and see if you can see any glaring things I've missed among my "five options", or if there's anything else I've missed that ought to be said. (Note to the Wikilawyers; this is most definitely not canvassing, as I myself have no idea what my preferred resolution to this particular can of worms is). – iridescent16:02, 19 September 2008 (UTC)
Ew. Thanks a lot. I just removed a bit from the article that was a BLP problem without a reliable source (actually, it didn't even have an unreliable source). Let the AFD hounds go at it. Keeperǀ7616:30, 19 September 2008 (UTC)
ZOMG, sexism! For what it is worth, I'm glad this person was on FOX when she blurted out the (hopefully) obvious about Alaska's governor. Otherwise FOX would never shut up about it. Protonk (talk) 17:38, 19 September 2008 (UTC)
Just watched that clip. Priceless. And presumably intentional and not Freudian, a la the infamous Shepherd Smith "BJ" comment a few years ago (whose mug, ironically, appears at the end of this clip). Baseball BugsWhat's up, Doc?18:21, 19 September 2008 (UTC)
Haven't had a Palin thread in a while...? Let me know if you want, and I can go do an edit on one of the Palin church pages... guaranteed to result in not just a thread, but a whole tapestry. EricDiesel (talk) 17:41, 19 September 2008 (UTC)
Talking about Sarah Palin's physical attributes on FOX is not sexist. Questioning her foreign-policy experience or credentials is sexist. Try to stay with the program, Protonk. MastCellTalk17:43, 19 September 2008 (UTC)
Ooooh, yeh, baby. There's nothing much sexier than a hot babe with a hot gun. As far as Palin's attributes, keep in mind that we've had plenty of boobs in the White House in the past. Baseball BugsWhat's up, Doc?17:49, 19 September 2008 (UTC)
<LOFL. Damn, I needed this thread, it's been a bad day. Once again, Palin rescues me from utter (udder?) dispair. Arrr, me thinks me'll vote for the dame....Keeperǀ7618:01, 19 September 2008 (UTC)
No worries Protonk. Minnesota hasn't gone republican for prez since Nixon (we learned our lesson then). We were the only Mondale state in '84. (and egads it was close... Keeperǀ7618:10, 19 September 2008 (UTC)
Precisely; he's only "considering" voting Republican. That's not the same thing as actually doing it. It reminds me of when Garrison Keillor pointed out, in a similar type of discussion, that a large percentage of Americans said they would "consider" eating squirrel. Baseball BugsWhat's up, Doc?18:12, 19 September 2008 (UTC)
I'm put off by Garrison Keillor's ostentatious downhominess; I feel it detracts from the elitist liberal superiority that I derive from listening to NPR. As far as I'm concerned, your state's finest products are The Replacements, Prince, and The Hold Steady. I'll give you credit for the Violent Femmes too; I know they were from Milwaukee, but I seem to recall they came up largely in the Minneapolis scene (though I could be wrong). Maybe with F. Scott Fitzgerald thrown in, but he was always ashamed of the fact that he came from St. Paul, so he doesn't really count. MastCellTalk18:23, 19 September 2008 (UTC)
I have not been able to take Robert Bly seriously ever since Martin Amis hilariously and pointedly savaged Iron John. Dylan is fine, I didn't mean to rob your state of credit for him. I have Rookery Blues by Hassler as a book-on-tape (!), but have never gotten around to listening to it. MastCellTalk18:41, 19 September 2008 (UTC)
Happiness is a warm gun, Mama ... bang-bang, shoot-shoot. Wow, does anyone remember an old Comedy Channel show, the Allen Havey Show or some such? He used to have clips of babes in bikinis firing automatic weapons. That was hot. And not just because they were shooting in the middle of the southern California desert. Baseball BugsWhat's up, Doc?18:33, 19 September 2008 (UTC)
If McCain wins, he ought to use Palin for his "diplomatic" missions. Them mid-eastern loonies might mess with Bush, Clinton, and Bush again, but they dare not mess with... The Soccer Mom from Hell! Coming soon to a Fox News theater near you. Baseball BugsWhat's up, Doc?18:38, 19 September 2008 (UTC)
Which bolsters my support for Palin. We're seccessionists. "The United States of America shares a land border with the countries of Mexico, Canada, Quebec, and Minnesota." Anyone wanna go edit war with me in the lede here?Keeperǀ7618:58, 19 September 2008 (UTC)
(edit conflict) It's like smoking weed but not inhaling not enjoying it. (Politicians can now admit they inhaled, as long as they didn't enjoy it). In another 10 years, a politician might actually be able to say, "Yes, I smoked weed, I inhaled, and not only that, but it made Psychocandy sound awesome!"MastCellTalk19:35, 19 September 2008 (UTC)
Yeah that would be great - except the Libs that I know are really staunch conservatives at heart - so liberty for all, but drugs are still bad...19:45, 19 September 2008 (UTC) —Preceding unsigned comment added by 72.92.117.232 (talk)
They're only "moderate" libertarians - that is, they only agree with a particular plank on the libertarian platform when it also agrees with the GOP platform. Or when they think it will get them more votes. Baseball BugsWhat's up, Doc?19:48, 19 September 2008 (UTC)
One of my lib buddies (yes, I have those - buddies that is) put a Nader sticker on his car, to, in his words, "help drag down the dem vote 2-5%". Keeperǀ7619:52, 19 September 2008 (UTC)
Nader might win the vote of the folks who appreciate perpetual candidates. Nader gets what I call the William Jennings Bryan award, previously held also by Harold Stassen and Norman Thomas. Sometimes it's better to have the other party's candidate in office when a disaster happens. Although I'm thinking if Gore were in office in 2001, he might have defeated Bin Laden by boring him to death. And with the economy tanking, maybe it's better to have McCain in there. He'll die in office from trying to tear his hair out, and Palin will get the USA and the banks out of debt by holding the mother of all garage sales. Baseball BugsWhat's up, Doc?19:59, 19 September 2008 (UTC)
Hopefully having the right person in office will help to avoid some of the disasters. I don't think McCain can reach his hair - with all due respect. The idea of Palin as pres - just scares the hell out me. 72.92.117.232 (talk) 20:07, 19 September 2008 (UTC)
Oh, you're right. He's physically unable to raise his arms very high, or some such; something to do with his treatment while a POW, I think. Hey, don't worry. I've lived through LBJ, Nixon, Carter, Reagan, etc. Nothing scares me anymore. We'll muddle through. Meanwhile, something just occurred to me when I read that Palin supposedly played Tina Fey at Halloween once. Have they ever been seen together? Could it be... that SNL has managed to infiltrate the GOP? That they convinced the GOP that Tina Fey is the governor of Alaska? And that the entire citizenry of Alaska (all 1,700 of them) are in on the joke? Baseball BugsWhat's up, Doc?20:10, 19 September 2008 (UTC)
Sarah waving to a friend: "Hi, Sig!"
Luckily, Sarah Palin has demonstrated her ability to raise her arm high, so that's alright. the urge to add a "seig heil" caption to this picture is very strong – iridescent20:14, 19 September 2008 (UTC)
Excellent! Not unlike the current crew, the Plain/McCain ticket keeps making me think of the famous last scene from "Planet of the Apes" - remember Charleton Heston on horseback on the beach? 72.92.117.232 (talk) 20:18, 19 September 2008 (UTC)
What's with all the "IP" posts? Do you two have accounts? You should get them if you don't, otherwise I won't be able to abbreviate your usernames inappropriately (like b-bugs, etc). Keeperǀ7620:31, 19 September 2008 (UTC)
e/c ::::::::All in a days work. The Palin kids were grooming one another during her RNC speech. I didn't make it up - actually it was quite cute. 72.92.117.232 (talk) 20:31, 19 September 2008 (UTC)
At any rate, OJ has been playing a lot of golf in the FL sun, he put on a few pounds and it has been over 10 years since "the trial of the century" - I think he's 61. I would have thought that if you got away with a double-homicide, you'd kind of a keep a low profile - but that's just me. 72.92.117.232 (talk) 21:10, 19 September 2008 (UTC)
My understanding is that there are prenups in the UK but they are not legally binding - they are taken under consideration by the court. In any case, I know at the time it was mentioned and McCartney said it was out of the question. By US standards, prenup or not - he did very well. The judge was not not at all impressed with Mills, but thought Paul was a straight shooter. 22:02, 19 September 2008 (UTC)
It's possible his decision not to pursue a pre-nup might have been taken into consideration - to imply he did not expect the marriage to fail, i.e. that he never suspected she was a peg-legged pirate. Baseball BugsWhat's up, Doc?23:59, 19 September 2008 (UTC)
Meshuggah copy-edit
Good day Keeper76! I need some small help from you. Could you, please, have a look on Meshuggah and make a copy-edit of the article? I can't do that, because I am not a native speaker. There won't be lots of errors, because it was already copy-edited some time ago, but I want to be sure that the text is good. I want to go with it to FAC and you would help me very much if you do that. Have a nice day!-- LYKANTROP ✉ 12:20, 20 September 2008 (UTC)
Hi Lykantrop. I probably won't be able to get to this in the near future, maybe one or two weeks from now. Real life just got really stupid and seems to think it's more important than wikipedia. My time here may be severely limited very soon. Also, I'm pretty backed up with requests that I haven't completed yet. You might to better to "shop around" and find someone else. I did just read the article, looks pretty decent :-) Keeperǀ7617:04, 20 September 2008 (UTC)
Allright, thanks for answering anyway. I understand you very well - I know that :) Thanks for kindness, have a good luck in your real life!-- LYKANTROP ✉ 12:47, 21 September 2008 (UTC)
The Twins had a nice comeback against the Devilish Rays last night, but it's hard to do that every time. The Twins just need to stay close enough to where the upcoming series with the Sox will mean something. Meanwhile, if the Reds lead holds against the Brew-hahs, the Cubs magic number is down to 1 and they could clinch against the Cardinals at Wrigley tomorrow, which would be delicious. Hey, if anyone gets WGN-TV, they're supposed to replay Carlos Zambrano's no-hitter tonight at 11 eastern, 10 central. Baseball BugsWhat's up, Doc?00:05, 20 September 2008 (UTC)
I'm thrilled about Sunday. They announced we'll be able to walk the warning track and... Wow. Going to be one hell of a day. I think this game is going to be amazing regardless of the outcome. Is it disappointing that they're not going to the post season? oF course/ Do I hope like hell they're eliminated tomorrow or Monday? Definitely. Will either one affect my enjoyment of Sunday? No way. Bugs, good luck to your Cubbies. TravellingCari01:54, 20 September 2008 (UTC)
I recall when they tore down Comiskey Park in 1991; and they wrecked Tiger Stadium just this summer. Like the man said in Field of Dreams, American history is a steamroller - building, tearing down, building again. There will never be another (real) Yankee Stadium. This is like tearing down Lambeau Field - or Ebbets Field - only worse, and it's a real shame, but politics prevailed. Enjoy. Take lots of photos. :) You'll really have to wrestle with whether to visit while it's being demolished. Just understand that it will be very painful, like watching an old friend die slowly. You might want to come back only after it's gone to baseball heaven. Baseball BugsWhat's up, Doc?02:31, 20 September 2008 (UTC)
The problem with the end of Yankee Stadium, at least for me, because I hate the Yankees, is that I now have to add back another stadium to visit. I once got as close as 27 out of 30 stadiums back in the 90's, but I'm back down to around 19. In 2009, it'll be 18. I'm going to have book some flights. And I actually never got to the Humpdome, but I did see a game at the Metrodome. I wonder if Keeper is old enough to have gone to the Metrodome.OrangeMarlinTalk•Contributions02:25, 20 September 2008 (UTC)
You can hate the Yankees and still appreciate the Stadium's history. And I'm guessing you mean the Old Met. The Humpdome and the Metrodome are the same thing, still standing for another season after this. Baseball BugsWhat's up, Doc?02:31, 20 September 2008 (UTC)
Bugs, there's no way I'm going to watch them demolish it. I conscientously avoid a good chunk of the media on 9-11 because I've never seen the Towers come down (was living in Japan at the time) and I will avoid the wrecking ball hitting the stadium. I couldn't do it. I just read the SI article written from the POV of the stadium -- the ghosts getting hit with the wrecking ball. That's what's getting me. It's not the walls, it's the stories that live there. Jeter's line to Aaraon Boone in 2003 about the ghosts coming out although he thinks they'll make the trip. I agree re: history/teams -- I don't care much for the Red Sox or Cubs (though I don't truly hate either), but you can't not be awed by Fenway or Wrigley. I've been to Shea a couple of times but to me a stadium built in the 60s doesn't have the history that one from 1923 does. Not that I'll watch the wrecking ball there either. I'm glad they're bringing Munson's locker -- that's only appropriate. The politics is the worst of it. I wish the idea of it being a museum had come to fruition.
OM, wow. That's impressive. I've not been to that many. Games at Yankee and Shea, whatever Joe Robbie Stadium was called in 2004 for a Marlins game; tours of Skydome, Dodger Stadium; and visits to Candlestick Park, Camden Yards (only from the outside). I think there are more but I'm half asleep at the moment. Yankee stadium- the current one-- will always have a special place in my heart because it's where I learned baseball. I'll go to many games at the new stadium, but it won't be the same. My father passed away in July 2006, I plan to leave the ticket stub at his stone along with whatever else from Sunday -- scorecard and photos. I think that's what's making it hardest for me. TravellingCari04:16, 20 September 2008 (UTC)
Business trips all over the US for 20 years allowed me to get to a lot of baseball games. I could never make it every stadium, because in about 92 they started to tear down old stadiums and build new ones. But I have some amazing experiences. I saw Ken Griffey, Jr play his first game for Seattle. I watched Koufax pitch a dozen times. I've seen three world series, all of the home games. I watched Bonds hit his 72nd home run. Baseball is life. :) OrangeMarlinTalk•Contributions04:21, 20 September 2008 (UTC)
Wow! I saw Griffey last night -- that was awesome because prior to this series I didn't know he'd been traded. Last time I saw him live, I think, was Doc Gooden's no hitter in 96. At least I think he was still with the Mariners then. I had a run of good luck. Doc's nono, ALCS Game 1, Coney's Perfect Game in '99 (I'm apparently good luck for ex-Met pitcers) and a number of great other days. I love Old Timers Day and I'm glad Sunday is going to be one of a sort. I'm not old enough to have seen Koufax pitch; the 80s were my baseball coming of age. Went to a great panel at the 92nd Street Y called Shea GOodbye with Straw, Ron Darling and Keith Hernandez. The '86 Mets were one of my first baseball memories since the Yankees were the Stinkees at that point. That was always my line through losing streaks -- if I got through the Stump Merril years, I can get through this. It's easy to be a fan when they're winning. I love baseball period, I adore it when it's my Yankees. And now headed offline. Possibly reappearing in the morning but otherwise will be entertaining those arriving for Sunday and the logistics of same. Catch up following the final game. May all your respective teams win, or at least beat another team for whom it matters. Beating the 1st place ChiSox was fun. Beating the Birds, less so but a win is a Win and only with the Yankees can 83-71 be a "bad" year. Oh and I decided who I'm wearing. My dad's #7 t-shirt with "no name of course" written on the back TravellingCari04:34, 20 September 2008 (UTC)
(outdents) (gives a long, luxurious yawn-and-stretch) yup...see, I live here in Chicago. You might have heard of one of our little teams....the "Cubs"? or some such?? And then...well, I won't mention the Sox til they pull themselves together, but all I have to say for the matter is: Cubs Magic Number?? Is less than two. Yep, yep, yepyepyep (ala Don Knotts)...life is good here in the Chi. (for the first time in a FRICKIN' CENTURY!!!!! Seriously, if the Cubs blow this, the rate of El-train jumpers, defenestrations, and auto-da-fe will go through the ROOF here. Everybody's so het-up about the whole 100-years, Team-of-Destiny thing that people will seriously EXPIRE if the Cubs eff this up.)Gladys J Cortez20:41, 20 September 2008 (UTC)
I don't think it's WP:FRINGE. Any proportionate representation of expert opinion in the field would conclude that the Cubs are either cursed or just consistently inept. MastCellTalk16:28, 22 September 2008 (UTC)
Please don't leave threats on my user page. If you have a formal complaint to make, please use the appropriate process and reply in the correct place (in this case Jehochman's page where the discussion was taking place). I consider the matter closed anyway, so just drop it please. Mojo-chan (talk) 21:11, 20 September 2008 (UTC)
Seriously? I had a complaint about you, what more appropriate place would there have been if not your usertalk? Let's replay events, I'll fill in the diffs if you don't believe the chronology here. 1/Jehochman nommed an article for deletion in good faith. 2/At the AFD, you called the nominator a moron. 3/Jehochman posted to your talk saying "don't call me (or others) morons". 4/You posted to his talk saying, but you are a moron. (at this point, other admins would have simply blocked you, but Jehochman has the patience of Job). 5/Instead of blocking you for WP:NPA, Jehochman deleted your trollish thread on his talk, and posted a warning (again) on your talk. 6/You deleted Johochman's warning from your talk, and then went to Jehochman's talk lecturing him not to delete things from his own talk that you post there. 7/I went to your talk saying don't lecture, don't call others' morons. 8/Jehochman said you were working things out. 9/I said "That's good news" and added a smiley face. 10/You deleted my post, and then came here to tell me to "drop it?" Are you for real? Did I miss anything? Where is the "threat" from me? I threatened nothing, other than to inform you of the consequences of (twice) calling another editor a moron. Get real or get gone. Keeperǀ7616:12, 22 September 2008 (UTC)
Help with watchlisting, (some of us would like to make something of this article...)
Sorry for the late reply, I'm assuming that since MOP semi protected, all is well in Realist-world at the moment? Keeperǀ7616:06, 22 September 2008 (UTC)
I'm a bit confused myself. According to the deletion log, it was deleted 4 times today (earlier this morning UTC, last night in USA-land). The last three times were "per author request, author blanked page" (G7). Not sure what you want me to do. Is Visceral Carnage (I'd bet a paycheck that that's a band name) notable? Do you have sources for them? Keeperǀ7616:02, 22 September 2008 (UTC)
You were right Re- Palin Articles
You were right about editing elsewhere. Almost everything I wrote was deleted, but after arguing my point, and thier suggestions, I either altered things a little, or the person deleting agreed with my argument, and everything was restored. And, I had fun backing up what I wrote, and made new and interesting friends in the process. I even learned a basic thing about a field I am supposed to be an expert in (The expression "statistical proof" occurs in almost every branch of knowledge... except Statistics). EricDiesel (talk) 03:00, 22 September 2008 (UTC)
I guess I could turn this into a question if you want, like "what is the difference, between editors and deletion arguments at an article and talk page at a Palin church article, and a 'normal' article?" But I think I already figured out the answer, or had it figured out "on me". EricDiesel (talk) 19:32, 22 September 2008 (UTC)
Question re: Multiple accounts
Perhaps a dumb question, but is it permissable to have a second account that is only used for situations (like with this post, for example) where one may be editing from a BlackBerry or other cellular device? I.E., could I create an account called Winger84BlackBerry or similar? --Winger84 (talk) 06:21, 22 September 2008 (UTC)
Yes, perfectly fine. Nobody minds about alternate accounts where it's clear who the owner is and separate accounts for public computers, different places etc is fine. Tombomp (talk/contribs) 06:34, 22 September 2008 (UTC)
Keeping a similar name is good, and also stating on your main page that you have this other alternate account would also be good. I should point out that there is no rule against multiple accounts as such. The rule has to do with abuse of multiple accounts, such as using both of them to try to add to consensus in a given discussion - or using one of them to evade a block of the other one, or to commit other kinds of sockpuppetry. Baseball BugsWhat's up, Doc?07:05, 22 September 2008 (UTC)
Welcome to Wikipedia. Although everyone is welcome to contribute constructively to the encyclopedia, we would like to remind you not to attack other editors, as you did on User talk:Orangemarlin. Please comment on the contributions and not the contributors. Take a look at the welcome page to learn more about contributing to this encyclopedia. Thank you. This edit constitutes a threat. Stop it. Or I'm going to have to buy the Twins and move them to Winnepeg.OrangeMarlinTalk•Contributions16:54, 22 September 2008 (UTC)
I like Winnepeg! I hear it's beautiful in the fall. And thanks for the link the the welcome page, I have no idea what I'm doing here, and it's about time someone showed me around the place :-) Keeperǀ7616:59, 22 September 2008 (UTC)
Actually, it's more like, "Winnipeg: Blink, and you'll wish you kept your eyes closed." I sometimes wonder if the 'Peg was settled by folks who ran out of gas trying to get somewhere else. ;) - Arcayne(cast a spell)18:00, 22 September 2008 (UTC)
Never been to Winnipeg? No problem! Just think Tulsa, add permafrost and perma-windchill, a dash of universal healthcare, and some hockey sticks. Keeperǀ7618:28, 22 September 2008 (UTC)
I love those old EA Sports games. ESPN had a show about how video games had changed, and they had an NHL 91 or something on a Sega. It looked like Pong. Anyways, my son is now addicted to NHL '09. I'm paying 50K to send him to a respectable university and he's playing Xbox. And since I know he watches my edits, STUDY!!!!!!. LOL. OrangeMarlinTalk•Contributions18:33, 22 September 2008 (UTC)
Looking for a reality check, but I don’t want to post in Wikipedia space and get anyone in trouble or anything, so I’m asking it here
Sorry, this isn't Palin or baseball related. I’ve got a general question, but in case you're curious, it’s based on what's going on at Talk:Sawston.
In general, what's the WP:AN/K Cabal's opinion on talk page discussions that would have BLP issues if they were put in the article, but were nevertheless part of the discussion that actually took place on the talk page? The way I see it, the options are:
Leave the talk page alone, as is. This shows a record of a conversation that went on discussing the article, so should be preserved as a record.
Put it in a collapse box
Like this.
Archive it, even though the talk page is quite short.
Blank the conversation.
Delete the talk page and restore only the first two wikiproject banner edits, since this is the only thing that's been discussed, and it has BLP overtones, which is a Bad Thing.
I must admit I'm torn, I started out advocating #2 but I'm starting to move down the list, currently at #4. Am I missing some ultra-clear directive from BLP-central that doesn't give me any options? --barneca (talk) 18:12, 22 September 2008 (UTC)
Once the discussion is over, hide it and use the {{Discussion top}} and {{Discussion bottom}} (or whatever local variant is cool) to note that. I would also include a brief discussion of the issues raised so that a quick perusal will (hopefully) stop future redundant discussions. As for ongoing discussions, I favor just letting them run unless the material inserted into the talk page is blatantly unacceptable. The virtue of discussing an issue overrides (IMO) the value of immediately removing bordering BLP violations in the talk page. Protonk (talk) 18:18, 22 September 2008 (UTC)
I personally tend to err on the side of caution with BLPs and delete revisions (even on talkpages). The convo on that talk page seems (overall) civil. Maybe I'm missing some of the context, but why would anyone think that a church's pastor should even be mentioned on a page about a town? At the very least, it should be put in a "show" box. Archiving would look silly on a short page like that. Yeah, my vote is for the "show" box. Keeperǀ7618:26, 22 September 2008 (UTC)
I thought you deleted all non-Palin, non-Baseball, and therefore useful posts. Seriously, I am opposed to censorship, and I would disagree with Keeper. I would "keep" all conversations, unless they were uncivil, or irrelevant. But Keeper is an all-powerful admin, and I'm a nothing around here. OrangeMarlinTalk•Contributions18:35, 22 September 2008 (UTC)
I'm all for keeping things that aren't gonna get the foundation sued. (Not that this is even close, it's a borderline BLP vio at best), hence, where I said "keep" it and put it in a "show box." Read the whole thread, OM, sheesh :-) Keeperǀ7618:38, 22 September 2008 (UTC)
(redundant-ask) Is there a mathematician-phycisist-engineer-CSist joke posting board? (Seriously.) If so, with the wider readership at Wikipedia as compared to the departments at Caltech and UCLA, I might finally be able to find someone who will actually LAUGH at one of my jokes for the first time. 19:28, 22 September 2008 (UTC)
I dunno. Road test the joke here. Some are funny. Some really depend on delivery. Some (like the e^x joke) depend on actually knowing why it is funny. Protonk (talk) 19:45, 22 September 2008 (UTC)
(Logical Analysis of "delivery" is the subject of one.) You want me to road test a math joke on a talk page filled with normal people?EricDiesel (talk) 21:02, 22 September 2008 (UTC)
Ignore Mazca, he's an elitist :-). No invitation necessary, but be forewarned, you will likely be severly abused if you join any given conversation. Don't believe me? Call Orangemarlin a name, or better yet, tell him the Florida Marlins suck, as do the Orange. That should be a good introduction to Keeperpedia...:-) Keeperǀ7619:53, 22 September 2008 (UTC)
lol! Well, the Marlins do suck, but I suspect that he doesn't want to talk about their record, only that "ohh their payroll is too low, they shouldn't have traded Beckett, they are purposely tanking to get a better draft pick"...
And who cares if they won the WS in '03? The RAYS are better then them. The RAYS!!!!! (And, so are 3 of the other 4 teams in the AL East, by the way...) Please tell me that OrangeMike is not one of the '01-'02/'02-'03 Green Bay Packer fans who said that "we're going to the Super Bowl"....xD Like that rant? -talk-the_ed17-contribs-20:04, 22 September 2008 (UTC)
Ok, some Keeperpedia N00b lessons in order for ed17...First, its OrangeMarlin, not OrangeMike, though he'd be welcome here as well. Second, Orangemarlin doesn't like football, or at least, pretends not to. Third, be careful there about bashing the Fish too hard, you're playing with fire. Who's your team that we may reciprocate your razz? Keeperǀ7620:17, 22 September 2008 (UTC)
Lol =). 1st, oops, that was stupid of me. =/ 2nd, I meant that he better not be like one of those Packer fans in his steadfast devotion to the Marlins. =) 3rd, unfortunately, is the Indians/Red Sox close second...with the Jags for football. (Boy oh boy, here comes about 12 hammers to clock me....) -talk-the_ed17-contribs-22:20, 22 September 2008 (UTC)
I added my snotty Misza13 comment to WP:ANI at the exact same time that you added yours to WP:AN. great minds think alike (or, at least, at the same speed). --barneca (talk) 21:51, 22 September 2008 (UTC)
So, I've been away for awhile, classes, life, a new boy toy :D lol j/k but i do have a new bf, and all that jazz. I'm finding some free time every now and then, and I think I'll be coming back for a bit. Life's changed a little bit for me, and I need a hobby to keep me occupied while my better half is out where ever he goes lol. Better not be cheating or I'll cut him lmao.... Hope all is well, and I'll be seeing you on my RC patroll :) DustiSPEAK!!19:05, 20 September 2008 (UTC)
Dusti! Let me be among the first of Keeper's TPSers to welcome you back. You've been missed--and are you aware that you've been quoted in the Laws of Keeperpedia? (Scroll up and you'll see...) Glad you're here. Gladys J Cortez20:43, 20 September 2008 (UTC)
A few audio highlights... "I might have caught a bad break, but I've got an awful lot to live for" ... "The only game in the world, I think - baseball" ... "Joe, Joe, DiMaggio, we want you on our side!" ... "I'll guarantee that nobody, but nobody has left this ballpark; and if someone did manage to leave early, man, he's missin' - the greatest! Two strikes, ball one, here comes the pitch - Strike three! A no-hitter, a perfect game for Don Larsen!" ... "HOW ABOUT THAT!" ... "Holy cow, he did it! 61 for Maris!" ... "OH! WHAT A BLOW!" ... "Reggie! Reggie!" All this from somebody who has never cared much for the Yankees, but admires their history and tradition. This didn't have to happen. This is the house that George R. built, and the house that George S. demolished. Boo! Baseball BugsWhat's up, Doc?00:46, 22 September 2008 (UTC)
I might post my thoughts here later, good thread to start Shap. I'm feelin' kinda bad for TCari right now, and I'll admit that I watched the game and all the pomp. Everyone knows my feelings about the Yanks, but that was a special night on ESPN. I almost, I say almost, got choked up a few times. Hope you enjoyed the night for what it was Carianne, I'm thinking about you and your dad... Keeperǀ7616:04, 22 September 2008 (UTC)
Thanks all. It was an amazing evening. I wish I was less tech-dumb because I'm still fighting with videos but it was an amazing evening. In all I was at THTRB for 13.5 hours yesterday. I walked the warning track, leaped at the wall... It was amazing. The ghosts were there last night - baseball and family. I'm still trying to tally the number of games I've seen there, last one was 20+ years ago. I think what made it special was it wasn't about the Yankees so much as *all* the baseball memories that happen in such a place. It was a phenomenal night. Here's one pic for you. I think you'll recognise it. I swear I'm never washing the jeans. TravellingCari02:40, 23 September 2008 (UTC)
Excellent. To trod where saints have trod, or Hall of Famers, anyway. When you get really close to the field, any major league field, see how beautiful the grass is? And teams that install blue and red and orange seats are missing the boat. The seats should be dark green, to complement the grass, as in the old days. A "green cathedral", to coin a phrase. Baseball BugsWhat's up, Doc?03:23, 23 September 2008 (UTC)
Dark green would be pretty. Until then the only field I'd walked on was SkyDome, which is a travesty (albeit a necessary one) of artificial turf. What I found doubly interesting was that for all the hype about missing the playoffs for the first time since '93 -- the last time I went to the last game was '93 and I had some fun pics from the players' exit. Amazing to think how much has changed in 15 years. And yes, I feel old. PS: Rooting hard and without question for your Cubs this series. TravellingCari17:59, 23 September 2008 (UTC)
Too late. I used my magic crystal ball to look into their heart, decided there was no way in hell they were going to be productive in the next 31 hours, and blocked accordingly. --barneca (talk) 16:26, 23 September 2008 (UTC)
Not only does Barneca have piercing vision, he also punches like a 8 year old girl. My arm doesn't even hurt a little bit (he "punched" me yesterday). I'm willing to bet he couldn't fight his way out of a wet paper bag. Keeperǀ7618:16, 23 September 2008 (UTC)
If the same person has the same IP the next day (24 hours later), their editing habits are predictable that they will return to edit the approximate same time the next day. So an arbitrary additional 7 hours are added on to stymie the ritualistic driveby - block them until after bedtime, in other words. Keeperǀ7618:21, 23 September 2008 (UTC)
Actually, I just made that up. Is that really why its 31? I figured it was always just to piss someone off as a ridiculous number. :-) Keeperǀ7618:25, 23 September 2008 (UTC)
I was actually thinking about the "31 hours" thing the other day; in the end I came to roughly the same conclusion that Keeper did, as that does sound pretty logical. That said, I don't know if that was the real reason either. ~ mazcat | c18:34, 23 September 2008 (UTC)
Keeper's explanation of 31 hours is why I do it. Someone mentioned it once at WT:AIV and it seemed like a good idea. I wouldn't block a 3RR violation for 31 hours because, what I'm basically implying with a 31 hour block is "I don't expect you to be productive tomorrow, either, you punk", whereas with a typical 3RR block we hope/expect/pretend to expect them to have cooled down and not resume edit warring immediately.
And Keeper, the slight pain you felt was just me psychically hitting you with my mind. Trust me, if I were to hit you for real, it would definitely feel more like an 11 or 12 year old girl hitting you. --barneca (talk) 18:35, 23 September 2008 (UTC)
I use 31-hour-blocks because of their potent theological and numerological significance. 31, or 3-1, is of course a reference to the Holy Trinity. It's also a lucky prime. MastCellTalk18:51, 23 September 2008 (UTC)
Apologies for the intrusion (just looking at people's contributions here), but I think a signature ought to reflect the user's account name. While I don't dislike the signature, it doesn't really reflect your username. -- how do you turn this on19:49, 23 September 2008 (UTC)
It's fine, anyone's welcome to comment :) But the thing is, Sam's my name, and i prefer that over Shapiros, Sharpios, Shaprios and many other manglings of my name :) SamBlab19:52, 23 September 2008 (UTC)
Yeah, I do prefer peoples signatures to broadly reflect their username, having to mouseover names just to figure out who it is is a little irritating. Personal preference, though, the number of people with unrelated signatures suggests many disagree with me! ~ mazcat | c20:03, 23 September 2008 (UTC)
I'll be rooting for your Twins tonight. They have to pretty much take all 3 against the Sox, or at least 2 of 3, to have a shot at the post-season. I'm just trying to figure out where the odd game is. The White Sox must have a rainout to make up. The Cubs do, too, but only if Houston is still in the race after Sunday, which looks doubtful at the moment, but it depends on what the Cubs do to the top two NL wild card contenders this week. They've already clinched the best record in the league, so they might tend to coast through their final two series. Baseball BugsWhat's up, Doc?21:15, 23 September 2008 (UTC)
The sox have a rainout to makeup with Detroit if it has any playoff implications. Go Twins! that account is blocked, btw. Keeperǀ7621:24, 23 September 2008 (UTC)
Thanks for blocking. Wknight94 usually puts the stamp on the blockee's user page that he's a Liebman sock. Liebman has a distinctive style and is also pretty much a broken record, so he's easy to spot. Baseball BugsWhat's up, Doc?21:25, 23 September 2008 (UTC)
Done See User:Baseball Boogies. Cheers! The twins are 5-1 against the pales at the metrodome this year. Either the pales are overdue, or the twins will be 8-1. (keeping in mind that they had a healthy crede and quentin when they lost 5 of 6)... Keeperǀ7621:28, 23 September 2008 (UTC)
Thank you again. The Sox are ripe for the pickin', if the Twins are up to the task. I recall a series in late May of 2007, in which the Twins swept the Sox at the Dome and basically sent them into a tailspin from which they never recovered. I recall Hawk Harrelson's comment when the final out was made: "It will be a long flight to Toronto." And for the season, as it turned out. Oddly enough, that was the same week the Cubs also looked like they were headed for the 2007 dustbin, but then the Piniella cap-kicking incident happened, and the Cubs caught fire after that. Little things can mean a lot. But be honest: Don't you wish you had A.J. back on your side? >:) Baseball BugsWhat's up, Doc?21:38, 23 September 2008 (UTC)
They also got Joe Nathan for A.J., so they came out OK. That deal made up for the Ortiz fiasco a little bit. It was ultimately the Giants who got "Ortized" in this case - they lost both Nathan and A.J. over time, and got little in return, and look where they are now. Baseball BugsWhat's up, Doc?21:55, 23 September 2008 (UTC)
Not only did we get one of the best closers the last 4 years (check the stats, he's so damn consistent its laughable), but we got Boof Bonser and Francisco Liriano. Boof is good, struggled this year. F-Lir will win the Cy within 5 years. I read somewhere (I'm sure I could find the link) that it was by a mile one of the most lopsided trades in MLB history. Go Twins! Keeperǀ7621:57, 23 September 2008 (UTC)
I remember that trade well. I thought at the time it was a mistake. But I was only a kid, what did I know? The Cubs' GM was surely a lot smarter than me. So Brock goes on to the Hall of Fame and Broglio eventually goes on to be a shoe salesman or something. This is a little different, though. This is kind of like a two-level version, say if it were Brock, Santo, and Williams for Gibson, and then Gibson for Casey Wise. Baseball BugsWhat's up, Doc?22:22, 23 September 2008 (UTC)
(outdents) (does that "yepyepyep, I'm from the Chi" luxuriously-arrogant stretch-and-yawn, ph33r-m3-th0u-p30nz thing...) did someone mention "Cubs"? Oh--you DID? Or did I only miss it b/c you failed to add the honorific "NL East Champion, Kindly-Piss-Off-All-You-Goat-Worshipping-Bartman-Lovers, Chicago Mutha***kin' CUBS"???? Yeah, that was it. Oh, and now about those White Sox.... (Seriously. I'm thinking about arranging for emergency airlift privileges in case we find ourselves in a crosstown Series. That would be..."bananas" doesn't even cover it. I live on the South Side, about 5 miles from the Cell (that would be "Comiskey", for those non-heathens/over-30's among us) but my heart belongs to Wrigley--as such, I am in mortal danger should the unthinkable/AWESOME come to pass.) This is not a safe place to be a fence-sitter, I'll tell you what. But oh, shouldn't EVERY fan have such a difficult choice to face??? Gladys J Cortez01:14, 24 September 2008 (UTC)
JColton, you fool. That's an inactive project. Do I need to go change my RFA vote for you???? You obviously don't know what the hell's going on with Wikipedia.... :-) Keeperǀ7622:10, 22 September 2008 (UTC)
I am both comforted and astonished that the word "shower" has in no way figured into this conversation. However, all of you are hereby disqualified from EVER working in my current department--all these perfectly-good comments and NOBODY came up with that??? Lame, y'all...just lame. ;)Gladys J Cortez06:04, 24 September 2008 (UTC)
but you know what, I'm not disappointed. I mean I am. I always want to make the post-season but that said, we've currently won 9/11 and going out on a strong note will make the off season more palatable. Glad to see Moose get his 19th and glad to see the team is coming together, 100 games too late. 15 games above .500 as of now is not a bad season, no matter how the media intends to spin it. On another note, it's like A-Rod, his stats look pretty until you look at the underlying issues. Me now? I'm crossing my fingers for the Dodgers so Torre can nyah nyah to Steinbrenners. Keep - the Sox are falling. You can overtake them. TravellingCari03:50, 24 September 2008 (UTC)
Yep, if the Yanks had played as well all season as they have recently, they would have been right in it. The 1921 and 1922 seasons were disappointing, and 1923 the Yankees came on like gangbusters. So maybe the new arena will revive the club, as they make it their own and maybe not worry so much about the ghosts across the street. About the Sox and Twins, it's only one game, but when Rich King referred to the "hated Metrodome" this past Saturday night, he wasn't kidding. The Sox are on the brink of their nearly-annual choke. It would be funny if the Dodgers made it, with an ex-Yankee manager and an ex-Red Sox Manny. Baseball BugsWhat's up, Doc?03:57, 24 September 2008 (UTC)
What the White Sox does only matters to me as far as keeping our host here happy ;) They didn't look like a first place team last week and I'm not just saying that because we took three of four, they just didn't play you'd expect. Me? I'm enjoying watching the Mets with their second implosion. It's odd for me because I generally root for the Mets so long as they're not playing the Yankees and I enjoyed the '86 series, but the media will get off the Yankees if the Mets implode. What irked me with the Yankees all season is shown in this last 10 days. "Injuries" has been the blame word but we haven't gotten anyone back in the last 1o days: Wang and Jorge still out - no major pitching changes although it's nice to see what Coke and Aceves are capable of. They're getting the clutch hits, Jeter is .300+, Abreu and Giambi are playing better. There's no reason they couldn't have done this all season. Manny-wise, I wouldn't be surprised if he landed back with the BoSox this Winter. Hope Sabathia doesn't become a Yankee, I really do. TravellingCari04:28, 24 September 2008 (UTC)
I don't want to say much about the Mets, as Wknight94 might take it the wrong way. :) But have you noticed they're not making nearly such a big deal about the impending destruction of Shea? Admittedly, it doesn't have the history that the Big Stadium does, but it has some history. I remember when it opened, covered with its cute and very 50s/early 60s-style blue-and-orange panels that made it look like a gigantic glitter-globe. It looks rather more mundane now. It's interesting that of the 4 wild card contenders in the NL, the Cubs face 2 and possibly 3 of them in the remaining games, a rare opportunity to affect who you're going to face in the post-season... as well as to study them up close (and they you, of course). As long as the Cubs don't have to go to Houston on Monday, they should be OK. I wonder, about the Yankees, is Girardi in any trouble? Are the Steinbrenners going to do a massive back-up-the-truck, or will they just tweak? The Yanks are still a pretty good club, just not quite good enough this year. Baseball BugsWhat's up, Doc?04:38, 24 September 2008 (UTC)
Go Twins!. Heh. Yankees win, and they're out. Cubs lose, giving the Mets one last grasp at hope. Same with the Brewers. How'd the Marlins do last night, Orange? Keeperǀ7618:13, 24 September 2008 (UTC)
I think 40 odd years isn't the same as 85 and Mets have always been the second team. When I lived in Osaka it was the same -- Hanshin Tigers were the powerhouse team that won and had history -- the Osaka Buffalos were a fan favorite but tended to get lost in the overall noise. Yankee Stadium also hosted a larger varirty of events, I think. According to Hank, he'll be back but I'm not so sure I believe it. I think it's another "I'm not my father" blustery statement like Joba in April. I hope Joe's gone -- but then again I didn't want him hear in the first place. You need a veteran manager and coaching team - we had neither this year. That said, I don't wholly blame him and the coaches. ARod, Andy, Jason.. They don't need coaches to know what to do. TravellingCari19:07, 24 September 2008 (UTC)
The only thing I can think of that Shea had on Yankee Stadium was the Beatles. Shea also had lots of jets flying overhead, a tradition that I assume will continue at the new ballpark, being as how it's next door. I find it interesting that they have built a supposedly Ebbets Field-like rotunda in Citi Field or whatever it is. I only know two things about the Ebbets rotunda: (1) It was said that it looked a lot better on paper, and didn't really work so well in practice, as it tended to interfere with traffic flow in the concourse; and (2) we have to take that critic's word for it, because apparently no one ever bothered to actually photograph the interior of that rotunda; so the architects of Citi Field would have to have come up with their own design. Baseball BugsWhat's up, Doc?21:28, 24 September 2008 (UTC)
True on the Beatles. I'm in two minds re: the jets. On one hand it's part of the atmosphere on the other, it's a racket. Especially during the tennis. It's interesting on the concourse in the new Yankee Stadium the ceiling is at least in part glass which will be a lot lighter. THat's one thing I won't miss about the stadium -- it was dark and dingy at times. I'll have to read up on the Ebbets rotunda. PS: 9-6, nice win. TravellingCari03:58, 25 September 2008 (UTC)
I know they did substantial remoding of the Stadium during 1974-75, but some parts they didn't do much with, and the concourses might have not gotten much attention. I was only outside of Yankee Stadium once, never inside, but I would guess those corridors smelled like the accumulated spilled beer since 1923. The Yanks are the hottest team in baseball now. Too late. :( Meanwhile, it seems like the Mets are intent on playing themselves out of it again this year. The Brewers were on the ropes for the wild card, yet here they are tied with the Mets now. The Phillies don't seem to want it either, as they lost tonight. Hard to believe the Astros are still in it, albeit by a thread. The disturbing thing about the Cubs game, though, is the second consecutive poor outing by Mr. Z. If he's still hurting, it will be a rough post-season. A "racket" during the "tennis"? How appropriate. :) I would imagine the novelty of jets going over kind of wears off after a few hundred. I wonder if they even thought about that when they built it? I'm vaguely reminded of when they were building Candlestick Park, and the winds were really whipping up one afternoon. The owner or the GM or somebody asked, "Is it always windy here?" and the local guy said, "No, just during the afternoon." And the club official sighed, "Great, that's when the games are!" Baseball BugsWhat's up, Doc?04:14, 25 September 2008 (UTC)
Aaron Eckhart
Hi Keeper, listen, if you have time, do you think you can copy-edit Aaron Eckhart's article? The reason I ask, I am trying to aim the article to FA status. I would appreciate it if you can, if not, its still cool. :) -- ThinkBlue (HitBLUE)17:38, 24 September 2008 (UTC)
Hi thinkblue! Thank You for Smoking is one of my fave movies, go see it if you haven't. I probably won't be able to do much copyediting, I'm waist deep in requests, and my time on wiki is about to get extremely limited for an unknown duration because of real life changes. I'll read it through for any glaring problems, but I recommend asking at least 1 or 2 other CE-ers. Cheers! Keeperǀ7617:41, 24 September 2008 (UTC)
Has nothing to do with bias. I'm not biased, I'm Wikipedian. I ooze neutrality. Calling any BLP a "pussy", (especially one that was in a POW camp for 5 years) is beyond reproach and hugely disappointing. Keeperǀ7619:33, 24 September 2008 (UTC)
This isn't a blog or forum, 72, except for meaningless things like sports and other loosely related things, like the "florida marlins". Your "special contributions" are getting a bit alarming, being that they are 100% to this page, similar to when you had a username. Find something to do other than post to my talkpage please? Keeper needs a break. I won't post your retired username here out of respect. Keeperǀ7619:38, 24 September 2008 (UTC)
I don't hide my identity nor pretend to be neutral or bias-free - nobody is. You should be flattered that I check out your talk page on my Wiki rounds. I was just blowing off steam after getting the CNN News update re McCain/debate. Kek 72.92.117.232 (talk) 19:45, 24 September 2008 (UTC)
Except your wikirounds are only this talkpage, one only has to click on your IP to see that. Some earlier messages to EricDiesel, a talkpage, then exclusively here. I am not trying to be discouraging, I've told you before you are welcome to post here. In moderation though please? You're gonna catch up to my edit count here if you're not careful Kek. :-) Keeperǀ7619:47, 24 September 2008 (UTC)
Columbo asked dumb questions that he already knows the answer to in order to get the other person to admit something. Tell me Kek, where else have you posted, and under what username? Keeperǀ7619:54, 24 September 2008 (UTC)
(Outdent for old fogies) Kek is probably not his name. It's a World of Warcraft neologism spawned from the fact that different factions couldn't communicate with each other, anything "said" in public would be garbled. "K e k" was garbled to "L o L". Hence, kek. Protonk (talk) 19:56, 24 September 2008 (UTC)
My Wiki life is an open book. They just announced Olbermann will replace McCain on the Letterman show tonight - not exactly an even swap. And SOS means save our ship - at least that's what they taught us in the Boy Scouts. Now, Keeper - on the Swiftboaters - how much can we put you down for? 72.92.117.232 (talk) 19:59, 24 September 2008 (UTC)
(e/c)Kek, you are borderline trolling. I've asked you kindly to find something else to do and refrain from forumizing my talkpage with politics. I'm Wikipedia. Switzerland. I've been called a lefty for protecting Palin's page, and also a righty for the same action. I'm neutral. And Protonk, this is User:Kek15, a user that asked for his user/usertalk to be deleted, which was obliged, in april I believe. As far as I know, he only edits as an IP now (usually starting with 72...). Kek, please find something to do elsewhere, or talk about sports, or make fun of something not political. I'm asking you nicely. Keeperǀ7620:03, 24 September 2008 (UTC)
<--- 72. This is not borderline trolling as Keeper rather generously puts it. It is trolling. Stop now, or I'll block you. Pedro : Chat 20:06, 24 September 2008 (UTC)
Thanks Pedro, and I'll add here that I really hope that isn't necessary (nor has that even crossed my mind at this point). Kek and I had or differences, we kissed and made up, moved along our ways. I don't mind him (or anyone) posting here, just not posting here exclusively. It's creepy. Keeperǀ7620:08, 24 September 2008 (UTC)
I don't think that I need to be blocked - but then again I could be biased :) However, were I to be blocked, it would neither surprise me nor have a big effect on my life. I stopped editing here a long time ago when the dynamics became clear "Stop saying something I/we don't like or you will be blocked." I know and you all know that Wikipedia has lost many good editors over this sort of thing and less. (And I actaully have 10 years of real world copy editing experience.) I see that kmweber is back in the news. This is kind of where Keeper and originally locked horns. And I see that weber is still being attacked for voicing his opinion of individual liberty. Disagree with him, block him, get rid of him - you guys win. But Wikipedia loses. Wikipedia content will continue to be referred to as Wikiality wherein when lots of people think something is true - Wiki says it is the truth. And when someone writes me a note or calls me or whatever - I don't immediately start thinking about who ELSE he is writing/calling. I don't really get that. Mr Creepy signing off. 72.92.117.232 (talk) 20:36, 24 September 2008 (UTC)
The only thing you've missed in your little diatribe here about how much better you are than wikipedia is that Weber and I have come to terms with each other. I respect Kurt, and ignore him. He doesn't post here (and I don't post there). I had no part at all in his recent escapade with blocks/bans. Your paranoia beyond that is your own (who else is calling? I don't know, how many accounts do you have? You say you edit here and there, but your IP contrib list is exclusively here, no where else.) I don't have time for this. Kek, you can post here whenever you want if you have a question that you feel I can answer to better Wikipedia. Calling JM a pussy is not appropriate, I don't care what the hell side of the political spectrum you are on. You did it to rouse my talkpage participants, and you know it. I removed it, and will continue to do so if you feel you need to make this page your personal forum for political partisanship. Keeperǀ7620:41, 24 September 2008 (UTC)
I don't think that the editors who have left Wiki think they are "better" than Wiki - they just don't enjoy the environment (I don't enjoy Florida but I don't think I'm "better" than Florida). I also never said that you and Weber were currently engaged in any disputes. I edit only under this IP address - do you have reason to believe otherwise? JM doesn't need your help - he's been in the public eye for a long time and can handle the heat. How is that I know your politics very well? I could only have learned that here. 72.92.117.232 (talk) 20:57, 24 September 2008 (UTC)
If you say you only edit under this IP, I believe you. As far as "knowing my politics", there is no way you could, seeing as I've never shared (my real) politics on wiki. I've bluffed and smokescreened different things, you could likely find diffs that led you to believe me to be libertarian, liberal, conservative, and everything in between. My personal politics are completely irrelevant to my wiki editing. Keeperǀ7621:05, 24 September 2008 (UTC)
A lot of people don't even know what their own politics are. I have met several people who call themselves Libertarians - who upon futher questioning reveal themselves to be Conservative Repulicans who simply don't want to pay taxes. There's a little more to being a Libertarian than that - I went to a Lib meeting in 1976 - McBride was the pres candidate - I was in high school - too young to vote. But Keeper, I would bet the rent that you lean towards conservative/GOP/Lib. There isn't a doubt in my mind. Say it ain't so Keep. No one can write so much in public and not reveal things about himself. You have traditional values and are a patriotic American - and I mean that in the nicest way. 72.92.117.232 (talk) 21:16, 24 September 2008 (UTC)
I've been called a lot of things, including GOP/Lib/Conservative. I've equally (on wiki) been called as far left as you could possibly go. Meh. I'll never tell. In fact, I'll even add a [citation needed] tag. Prove it, Kek. Keeperǀ7621:19, 24 September 2008 (UTC)
True libertarians have little regard for either major party, or for any law that tries to tell them what to do - which means most of them. I once heard someone refer to true libertarians as "anarchists". I think there's a lot of truth in that. I wonder how the Republicans-who-don't-want-to-pay-taxes regard this $ 700 billion invoice that Bush wants to send to the American public. Instead of raising taxes, maybe they'll just have the mother of all garage sales. Baseball BugsWhat's up, Doc?21:22, 24 September 2008 (UTC)
No but neither do all dems believe in...let's just say "Monica." Keeper, your comment on true americans reminded me of the founding fathers. Many Libs consider Jefferson the father of the party. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 72.92.117.232 (talk) 21:50, 24 September 2008 (UTC)
Just to give equal time to all sides, I've heard "Conservative" defined as someone who saves his money - even before women and children; and "Liberal" defined as someone with both feet planted firmly in the air. Baseball BugsWhat's up, Doc?21:42, 24 September 2008 (UTC)
"A wise and frugal government which shall restrain men from injuring one another, which shall leave them otherwise free to regulate their own pursuits of industry and improvement, and shall not take from the mouth of labor the bread it has earned. This is the sum of good government. – Thomas Jefferson (1801)" 72.92.117.232 (talk) 22:00, 24 September 2008 (UTC)
There isn't any venting. I need to clear up something, and I don't want it dramatized out here in the world of Wikipedia, where drama is a full-time profession. See....oh hell, just take a look at ANI for a day. :) OrangeMarlinTalk•Contributions23:17, 24 September 2008 (UTC)
Bring it here if you want, I ain't worried. Don't bring it here if it brings drama and attention towards yourself, only if it is a criticism of something I've done that you have a problem with. Does this have anything to do with an editor initials ML? (Tap your monitor three times if so, I have my ear on my screen). Keeperǀ7614:14, 25 September 2008 (UTC)
Monitor banged three times very loudly!!!! I didn't mind your comments. His were patently unfair. And his off-wiki criticism of me is bullshit. And he confuses football with baseball, which is unforgivable!!!!!! OrangeMarlinTalk•Contributions17:05, 25 September 2008 (UTC)
I just posted on your talk about this, too funny :-). I read about half of the 5.5K response, got tired, took a nap....need to go back I suppose. AFA off-wiki stuff, I couldn't care less really, neither should you. I don't do off-wiki stuff related to wikipedia for a reason, including email. Much more peacefuller. Keeperǀ7617:07, 25 September 2008 (UTC)
Yes, but the Arbcom just said, off-wiki uncivil comments are the same as on-wiki. I'm just saying, the editor cannot be two-faced, and you should be aware of the underlying tenor of his commentary. OrangeMarlinTalk•Contributions17:13, 25 September 2008 (UTC)
True, I see that side as well. Getting flanked from the side is I suppose just as unnerving as getting a full frontal attack. I choose to stay on-wiki with things, there's just too much secrecy to not. I think a large majority of wikipedia's problems could be vanquished if we were the only website that allowed editing/posting comments :-). I don't blog (or read them), I use email for business and personal, but not for wiki (go ahead and click "email this user" if you haven't tried yet, it won't work). I'm better for it. I think you should disable your email, personally. Specifically to this situation, I agree the editor should not be one thing on-wiki and another off-wiki (about the same wiki issue). Definitely hurts the credibility of the motivations of the edits and I would even add the credibility and integrity of the editor. I'm sorry you are dealing with it, really I am. What about his remarks that he felt your approach to him was less than civil? I don't know the history (I haven't read the AD talkpage other than what you linked on your talk about "football"). Keeperǀ7617:23, 25 September 2008 (UTC)
Iridescent, with our powers combined, there is no limit to the evil we can accomplish... and now with our talk pages preserved for all of eternity, among the immortal, our legacies shall be carried on forever! Jennavecia (Talk)05:05, 25 September 2008 (UTC)
I don't think it was intended as sarcasm or as a dig, but as Keeper said it only provides half the picture. You've listed that the book's been reviewed by reliable sources unrelated to the subject, and bluelinking those sources helps to show that, which is great. What you didn't do is link to the actual reviews or references themselves, which would have been even more useful as others would then be able to verify the quality of the references you found. Keeper had already mentioned that he'd had difficulty finding sources, so adding direct links to them directly would be a huge help in this AfD. He even says that he'll remove the nomination if these detailed refs are provided, so I think he's being reasonable and fair in his approach. Hope this helps, Gazimoff10:45, 25 September 2008 (UTC)
My neighbor is famous. He wrote a book. It's been reviewed in The New York Times, Chicago Tribune, The Wall Street Journal, and The Washington Post. He got a whole column write up in USA Today. His book is for sale on Amazon.com and at Barnes and Noble. The Star Tribune also loves it, but they're local. "Halfway to helpful", isn't it? I wasn't being sarcastic. My comment was direct and civil. Your bluelinking had the appearance of helpfulness, but was not entirely helpful, because clicking on any of your bluelinks would do nothing to help me or anyone else make an informed decision. I did however withdraw the nomination (with the comment Nomination withdrawn based on User:Cirt's work. Slinking away slowly no less), apparently I needed to grovel a bit more? Sheesh. Keeperǀ7614:11, 25 September 2008 (UTC)
I apologize, I guess you were actually thanking me for bluelinking the Wikipedia articles for different periodicals as you say, and it was not an attempt at sarcasm. In relativelyquicksearches I was able to find coverage in multiple secondary sources, and from there used other archival databases to find the full text of some of those sources. I guess I assumed incorrectly that you had done the same research before starting the AfD nomination. The drawback of communicating by text is that sometimes some things get misinterpreted. I am sorry about that. Cirt (talk) 15:16, 25 September 2008 (UTC)
I understand that you have speedily-deleted by proposed page about the Argentinian company Epidata Consulting.
I can see why given that I display statistics about its performance, but stating that it is the market leader in Argentina and stating what it does/provides should be OK, right?
If I delete what is deemed to be advertising material, may I proceed with the page? I will of course not publish it until it is approved.
Thanks very much for the help. I guess you could tell I am a novice! One more thing though, the reason why it was on my user page and not as an actual article was because I read on the 'how to create your first article' page that you can write something on your user page then copy it onto a 'create article' template when it is ready. I was planning on doing this. I will work on the reliable sources etc and continue making edits to try and create an impartial, informative article. Thanks again for the help,
I'm coming to you as about the least involved editor I know for Intelligent design. Two editors are, more or less, threatening to make some massive POV changes to the article. I don't think that's wise, because they'll get reverted quickly, and then there's going to be massive drama. I really think that it would be best if the article is protected, and the editors take my suggest of sandboxing it, so that a consensus can be arrived. I can predict that using the main article as a testing ground for a new POV is not going to end up well. I think heading off the wiki-drama may be best for all involved. And since you have never once exhibited a POV on the article, it could be a healthy decision. What do you think?OrangeMarlinTalk•Contributions17:12, 25 September 2008 (UTC)
Where's the convo with the "threats"? Are you asking for full-protect on a high visibility article to prevent drama? Have you not been reading arbcom lately?. If someone editwars, or 3rr, or verbally attacks (and accusations of cabalism are definitely in the category of verbal attacks) another editor, they get warned and/or blocked. Black/white. Less drama. Keeperǀ7617:16, 25 September 2008 (UTC)
Yup. There are plenty of folks looking for any excuse to ratchet up the drama with respect to the "ID Cabal" so it's better to exercise self-restraint. Let the POV pushers dig themselves into a hole -- such people invariably self-immolate if given free rein, and when they do it will be straightforward to deal with the matter. Short Brigade Harvester Boris (talk) 17:32, 25 September 2008 (UTC)
Well, I thought it was a good idea. I guess not. Maybe with ID, there's no safe ground. This is not going to be fun. I've already had someone try to move the drama to my All-baseball, All the time, talk page. OrangeMarlinTalk•Contributions18:13, 25 September 2008 (UTC)
Maybe it will stick, who knows. But thanks :-). Just don't want to see anyone getting caught up in an edit war over one sentence :-) Keeperǀ7620:14, 25 September 2008 (UTC)
HAHA, ya, like my last summary said, if you, or someone would have deleted it, I would have gotten over it, and been fine...but looks good! Looks like we might have to PP it soon...if this vandalism continues. Ctjf83Talk20:16, 25 September 2008 (UTC)
Heh, while you were posting here, I was posting a new thread at Talk:Clay Aiken with those exact sentiments. We'll see. I very reluctantly use the protect button, I think it does more damage than the block one personally. Keeperǀ7620:18, 25 September 2008 (UTC)
Eh, maybe sometimes, but a "new" gay, will get a bunch of vandalism I'm sure. You already have 2 supports for it :). Also, do we not usually begin leads with "is a gay American musician"? Ctjf83Talk20:30, 25 September 2008 (UTC)
You must have a faster browser and/or ISP connection than I do. You keep beating me to the punch (referring to the soapboxing on the Aiken talk page you deleted) — Becksguy (talk) 20:53, 25 September 2008 (UTC)
To show how big a news item this kind of thing is anymore, it didn't even make the front pages of the online newspapers. Now, if he were to follow this up with an announcement that he intends to join the Marines, that could get some headlines. Baseball BugsWhat's up, Doc?22:46, 25 September 2008 (UTC)
Fix the watermelon? Face the weatherman? Fondle Three Wisconsinites? All equally reasonable possibilities. You're like my son for saying "you're like my dad".... Keeperǀ7620:58, 25 September 2008 (UTC)
The rays suck, they will fold under the pressure, and they'll lose to the Twins, who ironically have much more postseason experience, in the "best of 5" first round of postseason. Just sayin. Keeperǀ7621:55, 25 September 2008 (UTC)
Yep! Dodgers/Twins world series. Been calling it since the Dodgers were 4 games behind the lackluster d-backs. The Twins have a vengeance to defeat the Dodgers (the D's are the only team to beat my boys in a WS contest, back in 19-sixty something). AL has homefiled, the twins are unbeatable on their "home field. Twins in seven, just like '87, lust like '91. Callin it. Keeperǀ7622:03, 25 September 2008 (UTC)
Sam is taking a short wikibreak and will be back on Wikipedia after his Orchestra trip to New Hampshire where he will be fiddling and hiking (specifically Mount Pierce) until late Sunday the 28th of September.
Hi, you speedily deleted my Malwarebytes stub. I don't understand what I could've done differently, it was criticized as being both unimportant and blatant advertising. It's notable because it produces the only free program I could find that could kill a browser hijacker that was hounding me for weeks - I tried Ad-aware, hijackthis, AVG, and the Kaspersky free-trial. I didn't say this specifically in the stub, just some general "it cleans germs other brands can't" stuff. On retrospect, not very encyclopedia-ey. So I got a BA warning and I removed that bit. Then it got deleted anyway (as unimportant I guess, although I never heard). I read all the requirements and started on the talk page, but no one ever responded to me. The deletion was, indeed, speedy, but also uninformative, and frankly, alienating. What's up? Why should I contribute?
Huh, so you have the time to delete my article...twice...less than an hour after it's marked for SD, but you won't answer me in four hours. Fredgoat (talk) 07:05, 26 September 2008 (UTC)
Sorry bout that. I'm actually allowed to go offline anytime I want to, being that the Foundation keeps losing my paychecks. Sorry to sound so bitey, but Malwarebytes is not notable. Your personal experiences with them notwithstanding, there are no independent sources that I can see or find that talk about them. Keeperǀ7614:29, 26 September 2008 (UTC)
Wasn't criticizing the offline time so much as the deletion without response to the talk page, or any comment at all. Here's a source. I put in on Malwarebytes' Anti-Malware after it was threatened with SD, and someone listened to me when I asked for a break. WP:DBN --Fredgoat (talk) 02:28, 27 September 2008 (UTC)
Most humbly I ask for reconsideration ;)
Hi Keeper76,
My name is Janette Smith and you deleted my page today. I'm not at all bitter, but I am asking to re-establish it because I am an on-air personality for the DIY Network and also do specials for HGTV.
Because of my 22 year career in news I'm already named in 4 Wikipedia pages under NOTABLE ALUM
WAFF-48, WCPO, WFAA-8, and WAGA... many of my counterparts have clickable links on these pages to their own
page and I would like to follow suit. The only reason I started trying to build a page was because I had
several people ask for my Wikipedia and IMDB links.
So, perhaps I need some advice in formatting or content and will gladly receive guidance in these areas...but I'm notable, relevant and really nice. ;) lol
Truly, any assistance you could give me in this would be most appreciated.
Nick Punto, one of the original "piranhas" on Ozzie Guillen's list of those munchers in 2006, scored the game winner tonight. Guillen may never live that comment down. One thing a manager should never do is give the other team a rallying cry. Back in 1983, Texas manager Doug Rader said the White Sox were "winning ugly". That became the team's motto that season. I've still got a T-shirt somewhere with that slogan. Back in 1951, Brooklyn Dodgers manager Charlie Dressen made the statement, "The Giants is dead," and the New York Giants went on to prove him slightly wrong. Going back to the early 1900s, John McGraw, no less, ridiculed the American League in general and the Philadelphia Athletics in particular, as "white elephants". A century and two franchise shifts and several World Series wins later, the A's still use that elephant as an icon. And having learned nothing from that, McGraw went on to say that the Yankees should move to "Long Island or some other out-of-the-way place." Instead, they went just across the river, built Yankee Stadium, and eventually sent the Giants to an out-of-the-way place on the left coast. Open mouth, insert spikes. Baseball BugsWhat's up, Doc?04:34, 26 September 2008 (UTC)
One of the interesting side stories when we go to Tampa for Round One will be the Punto/Bartlett Piranha reunion. Keeperǀ7615:53, 26 September 2008 (UTC)
Mmm which is exactly why I think it is worth "planting seeds" for this encyclopedia. I started some stubs ages ago on Danish actors and half the ones I started are now at least start class articles. By starting articles en masse (which I know have the potential to be highly resourceful articles that can be expanded immediately) I think I am maximising the possibility of getitng others involved at building this encyclopedia. If I just stuck to writing a few articles to FA standard I wouldn't feel like I was being as productive. I would try to expand a few of them myself but I don't know Danish. Another reason why Jimbo Wales should think about installing a supreme translation system for over 100 languages for wikimedia if he is serious about breaking down language barriers and allowing knowledge to "flow". The Bald OneWhite cat13:44, 27 September 2008 (UTC)
It's just one game. But never underestimate the ability of the Sox to choke in the stretch, as they have in several recent years. They tried to in 2005, also, but that year they were too good not to win. Baseball BugsWhat's up, Doc?18:28, 24 September 2008 (UTC)
The Pales have 2 left in minnie, then host Cleveland for 3. The Indians ain't know slouches, they still wanna win. The Twins host the Royals, who I don't believe have one a game at the metrodome in several years (certainly haven't won a series). If Minnie sweeps the pales this week, its over. We will have a half game lead on only need to win 2 against KC. Callin it. Keeperǀ7618:33, 24 September 2008 (UTC)
Attendance was a little light. 35 grand give or take. I'd have thought a sell-out, or close. I mean it's not like everyone is holding their breath for the Vikings or the U going to the Rose Bowl. OrangeMarlinTalk•Contributions19:07, 24 September 2008 (UTC)
Not bad attendance for a weeknight. Better than the 6 or so fans that show up on a weekend marlins game. And the U is 4-0, playing Ohio State, who are weaker than they think. Don't be too shocked if there is an upset in the making. I'm not a gopher fan though, I follow the Fighting Illini for basketball/football, go figure. Hockey isn't a sport, its just a bunch of Canadians and eastern european white guys skating around with sticks hitting each other. Keeperǀ7619:13, 24 September 2008 (UTC)
"...with sticks hitting each other." Yep. So how is that not a sport? >:) Better watch out for the Gophers this year, though. They're 4-0 against the high school teams this year, vs. 1-3 last year. They're ready for a big year in the not-so-Big-Ten. Baseball BugsWhat's up, Doc?19:37, 24 September 2008 (UTC)
Let's just say the Pac-10 and Big-10 are bit weak this year. Maybe Notre Dame can join up to make it worse. And I'm hereby ignoring all Marlins attendance comments from you know who. OrangeMarlinTalk•Contributions21:16, 24 September 2008 (UTC)
No worries. I'm hereby ignoring all comments from Marlins fans as well. As far as I can tell, I only have to ignore you, and potentially five others...Keeperǀ7621:18, 24 September 2008 (UTC)
Did you say something? I'll be posting inning by inning updates here on the Twins/Palehose scores. Because you so much want to record the game and skip the endless commercials about snow shovels, snow blowers, snowshoes, and snow boots.OrangeMarlinTalk•Contributions22:57, 24 September 2008 (UTC)
There's not really a lot of ads about winter stuff; just stuff about the Twins, of course, and local merchants like the Warners-Stellian appliance store ("I feel free ... ba-ba-ba, ba-ba", etc.) and for Second Wind exercise equipment, featuring a guy (the owner) who looks like he could use it. In my favorite Twins ad this year, there are 3 former players dressed like asian monks - Killebrew, someone else, and in front is Tony Oliva. Delmon Young, the "apprentice", comes to them asking for the secret to hitting. Oliva simply says (imagine Hispanic accent here): "See ball. Hit ball." Baseball BugsWhat's up, Doc?04:21, 25 September 2008 (UTC)
P.S. Twins win as Sox continue annual El Foldo. Season-breaker tomorrow night. They had 40,000 there tonight. With the chance to move into first place, they might even fill the place tomorrow. Baseball BugsUser talk:Baseball Bugs|What's up, Doc?]]04:22, 25 September 2008 (UTC)
Straw Poll
Who thinks that the Twins can/will pull it out? (or look at it as "Who thinks that the Sox can/will pull defeat from the jaws of victory? (7/0/2)
Nobody likes a loser. :-) BTW, separate topic, your signature is ridiculously long in the edit window. Not that mine is 8 letters or anything, but you should consider shortening that up. Keeperǀ7619:30, 25 September 2008 (UTC)
Not that I like the Sox—remember, I'm a Indian fan. (And Brewers, if only for CC being there!)
Not even close, the Twins will do it at home, in the ugliest dome ever...scares the crap out of opponents. But honest, I don't care all that much. I'm pulling for the Rays. OrangeMarlinTalk•Contributions 06:28, 25 September 2008 (UTC) --> Which raises the burning question: Who is the team of destiny this year? Is it the Cubs? Will another Florida team do the Cubs (or someone else) in? Is it the Angels, who are ignored by everyone east of the Sierras? Or is it one of the dark horses? Baseball BugsWhat's up, Doc?06:48, 25 September 2008 (UTC)
I've been going back and forth on this, and have decided to pull for the twins. Heh. Go Twins!!! (and if they win OM, they get tampa first. We just split a series with a healthy tampa on their turf this weekend.....beware!) Keeperǀ7614:38, 25 September 2008 (UTC)
Now that the Red Sox are safely in, I can resume rooting for the Twins (well, not so much rooting for the Twins as against the White Sox, but the result is the same). --barneca (talk) 14:55, 25 September 2008 (UTC)
The redsox are far from "safe". They are the wildcard, and will play the Angels. How have they fared against the angels this year? (*cough* (1-8). Keeperǀ7617:37, 25 September 2008 (UTC)
First, being a wildcard counts as being "in", AFAIC, so they are too "safely in". Second, we are currently the wildcard, but I expect us to pull it off right at the end (you know how that spark of hope feels). And third, anything can happen in a best of 5 series. I'd love to see an upset; I like the Sox OK, but my true team is the *mumble mumble indistinct sigh try to distract attention Mariners mumble some more, sigh some more, first 100 losses don't count mumble mumble*, and I want to see the Angels lose almost as much as I want to see the Red Sox win. We hates them; more than the White Sox, not as much as the Yankees, but close. As you can tell, my baseball allegiances are driven more by irrational hatred of some teams than by love of others. --barneca (talk) 17:51, 25 September 2008 (UTC)
One of my favorite Twins games was against the yankees, and the crowd chanting the (slightly offensive) EEE-CHEE-ROW!!! whenever Hideki Matsui was in the outfield or up to bat. So shameful, so funny. I wish I could have back a few of those Twins/Mariners games this year, the submarines had our number it seems. Keeperǀ7618:06, 25 September 2008 (UTC)
Midwesterners typically want all coastal teams to fail. But as a lifelong Cubs fan, no team approaches the Mets for hatred. Not even the Yankees. 1969 lives forever in our vengeful hearts. (Hopefully, Wknight94 will understand.) Baseball BugsWhat's up, Doc?18:29, 25 September 2008 (UTC)
I'm often fascinated by the reasons people choose to love/hate particular teams. I mean, rooting for your hometown team is obvious, or your alma mater, but people develop these weird, complicated, gloriously inconsistent patterns where they have an opinion on almost every team, but with a different rationale for each one. I moved around a lot as a kid, so mine are even more complicated than maybe others. Where you were born, where you grew up, where you lived when you started caring about baseball, who your parents rooted for, what team beat your favorite team 39 years ago, who your ex-finacee liked, what college your graduate school roommate went to for their undergrad, who was on TV most of the time, whether you like underdogs or not, who has ugly uniforms, who traded for/away your favorite player, who your divison rivals are, who the rivals to the team your Dad hated because they were rivals of the team that he attached himself to when he went to college... It's cool. --barneca (talk) 18:52, 25 September 2008 (UTC)
A lot of it is situational, like if your team doesn't make the playoffs, or loses early. Like in 2002, I rooted for the Angels, because although the Angels smoked the Twins, I hated Barry Bonds, so I wanted his team to lose. If you think about, the owners don't care, as long as you're rooting for somebody. Owners love rivalries. Rivalries bring money in. Maybe you've heard the story about Bill Veeck and the St. Paul Saints of the 1940s or so? Baseball BugsWhat's up, Doc?21:36, 25 September 2008 (UTC)
I've never followed the Saints, although I can say I've been to a couple of Duluth Dukes games, including one where Darryl Strawberry was killing the ball for the Saints in one of his myriad attempts at a comeback...Keeperǀ7620:01, 26 September 2008 (UTC)
That's the modern Saints, and yes, much of Strawberry's career was a comeback attempt. In the heyday of the American Association (20th century) there were minor league clubs in both Minneapolis (the Millers) and St. Paul (the Saints) and also Milwaukee (the Brewers). Very imaginative nicknames. Anyway, Bill Veeck owned the Brewers, late 1930s or so. The St. Paul owner contacted Veeck and told him he was cash-strapped and might miss his payroll, and was there anything he could do. Just before the Brewers next visit to St. Paul, Veeck got on a Twin Cities radio station and talked about what a lousy city St. Paul was and what a lousy team they had. Lo and behold, Lexington Park had standing room only for the Milwaukee series, and the St. Paul owner was able to meet his payroll. And Veeck wasn't being entirely selfless, as the next time the Saints were in Milwaukee, Borchert Field was also SRO. That's what "rivalries" are about. :) Baseball BugsWhat's up, Doc?20:22, 26 September 2008 (UTC)
Oh, yah - but us Twins fans tend to keep a low profile, dontcha know. But you betcha we're gonna win that Series again. :) Kellyhi!19:15, 25 September 2008 (UTC)
I've been accused of a lot of things in my time on wiki, "keeping a low profile" certainly isn't one of them, eh? Are you still a native? Northburbs me-self. Keeperǀ7619:27, 25 September 2008 (UTC)
Grew up in east-river South Dakota...no teams of our own, so we were all Twins/Vikes/North Stars/Gophers fans by default. (I do have family in Minnetonka and get through there to visit every once in a while.) I left there when I enlisted but my heart will always remain there. :) Oh, just to show my age, I don't think the Vikings have been the same since Fran retired. Kellyhi!19:32, 25 September 2008 (UTC)
Yikes! I had tickets to that game, gave em up about a week prior. I would have been driving south from the northburbs to the dome at around 6 pm. I still get shivers. Keeperǀ7619:15, 25 September 2008 (UTC)
I left the restaurant to walk to the dome at 6:00; thought the sirens on the walk over were for a fire. Not so much. Glad I live west. Эlcobbolatalk19:22, 25 September 2008 (UTC)
Boooo Twins/Love Sox
No One Cares 'Cause the Yanks Ought to Be in Instead
Support going out on one hell of a high note. 16 games above .500 is like Arod's stats. Need context. Still one hell of a September. Honestly, to me, the season ended Sunday. Very little now could top it. TravellingCari22:38, 25 September 2008 (UTC)
Sure! What topic are we banning them from? Although, Tcari, a lifer-yank, has decided to cheer for the Twins, so she can stay. Seriously, who else would you cheer for if not for who would be the most underrated underdog in the playoffs? the rays don't count... Keeperǀ7618:35, 25 September 2008 (UTC)
I haven't announced anything yet. I'm not RTV-ing, I'm not desysopping my account, and I'll poke my head in once and awhile, there's just some real life stuff that is seriously gonna get in the way of Wiki-editing. (better for me and Wikipedia I surmise)....Keeperǀ7621:31, 25 September 2008 (UTC)
LOL! I'm not scrambling my password or anything, or desysopping for that matter, just required to go away by RL events. I wish it weren't true, but it is. I'll be around tomorrow, a bit on Saturday, I'll be gnoming around maybe monday and tuesday of next week, then "poof!". No more keeper....Keeperǀ7621:57, 25 September 2008 (UTC)
Semi -serious. When you first started reading or editing (forget which it was) when your bridge went boom, did you ever think you'd become an exyclopedia in and of yourself? TravellingCari22:21, 25 September 2008 (UTC)
OM, you'll never be an admin. You have been here too long and gotten dirty on too many articles, and have earned too many (powerful, right or wrong) enemies. And, frankly, you are better off. Enjoy editing, and dear god, enjoy not being an admin. Admins are burn-out city. (Malleus, are you reading this?). To TCari, I've been very reflective lately about my "journey" on wiki. Egads, no, I never ever saw myself contributing nearly as much as I have in the last year. I came to Wikipedia as a resource (who didn't?), and was incredibly impressed with the thorough and accurate "report" of what was happening in my backyard. I was blown away, and I had to add my two pence here and there. I think, ironically, my first posts were baseball related, something with Barry Bonds, some stuff added to the Torii Hunter article. I'm totally hooked, and if I had my way, I'd stay here. Wikipedia is a profoundly successful project, and as with every success story online, it has it's heartburn and heartache and detractors and naysayers. This is a successful project. A work in progress yes, but undeniably a world changing one. Wikipedia is not going away, it will not die, it will survive. I'll be cheering for it, and its editors, from a distance, from the sidelines, starting next week. (Maybe one or two posts, total, per week, but nothing substantial). Keeperǀ7600:59, 26 September 2008 (UTC)
← I hope you're leaving for good reasons Keeper, like you're going to be too busy making loads of money to support your family to be bothered about this web site. Whatever, be lucky. :-) --Malleus Fatuorum (talk) 00:57, 26 September 2008 (UTC)
Everyone needs luck. I was lucky in not becoming an admin, as you were suggesting above. But if you won't let me wish you luck, then at least let me wish to be well. I know how ferociously expensive medical bills can be in the States. :lol: --Malleus Fatuorum (talk) 01:05, 26 September 2008 (UTC)
I don't need luck. I'm anti-luck. Luck is for losers and Wisconsinites. I don't gamble, I don't buy lottery tickets. Luck is poor man's faith. I have skill, which trumps luck. I will however, accept your "wish for being well". I hope I'm well, and will continue to be so. I'm not disappearing altogether, just disappearing from any substantial contributions here. I'll be lurking I'm sure, when I can. And seriously, when have any of my contribs ever been substantial anyway? I'm a myspacer, and proud of it. I helped a few editors along the way, but show me even one article that looks better because of my efforts, and I'll give you a pound/dollar. Keeperǀ7601:15, 26 September 2008 (UTC)
Well, I suspect you're just fishing for compliments like always, but looking here, I can name Clay Aiken, University of Toronto, ROSI, Bohater, Ryan Miller (musician)... all are "better" than they were before you touched them. Minor edits to lots of articles, admin actions like protecting and blocking, and patiently explaining deletion policy to newbies, and deleting vanicruftisment, all make the encyclopedia better. You haven't saved the world or anything, but you should be proud of your contributions; they most certianly are not insubstantial. --barneca (talk) 01:26, 26 September 2008 (UTC)
Shit. I owe Barneca, like, 5 bucks. Dammit. You aren't supposed to look at my contribs, unless you sort them by "User talk". Keeperǀ7601:38, 26 September 2008 (UTC)
Don't sell yourself short: the Keeperpedia wouldn't exist without you. Sure we helped build it, but you gave us a home. On a ligther topic. Bugs! What happened to your boys? Ugh. I was rooting for them. TravellingCari02:34, 26 September 2008 (UTC)
Keeper, I wish you all the best with you new gig. Your page (as you well know) has always been one of my favorite places here in Wiki land. I think that's true for many of your TPSers. People like your traditional values :) and folksy Minn. ways (think the film Fargo - filmed in Minn). I'm sure we'll be in touch - but will miss your lightning-fast responses to my calculatingly annoying posts. Be well. Kek 72.92.117.232 (talk) 12:51, 26 September 2008 (UTC)
Keeper, as a going away present, I can giftwrap Sam and have him sent to you via Priority Mail (though getting him into the mailbox might be a bit tricky). So can I use “Keeper76, c/o Minnesota Central Post Office” as a mailing address? :) Ecoleetage (talk) 15:05, 26 September 2008 (UTC)
Keeps, I'll miss not having you around. Partly it's because you're a great voice of reason and partly it's because I guess I thought you'd always be around to tell me if I start going rogue off the rails. Besides, who will I blame for taking the King's Shilling now? Anyway, I wish you all the best for you and yours, both now and in the future. And should you hever happen to venture to old Blighty, drop me a note and I'll do my best to introduce you to our range of beers. Take care, Gazimoff15:15, 26 September 2008 (UTC)
You're one of the good guys Gaz, and I wouldn't dare visit the Queen's land without hooking up with the locals to get the real beer. Although there might be a language barrier....Keeperǀ7615:50, 26 September 2008 (UTC)
Keeper, I've only had a few days to enjoy Keeperpedia....and I've found it to be quite entertaining. Oh, I'm having a bad day...so I come here, laugh my heart out and suddenly, the day is no longer bad. =) Thanks for the memories, and I hope that your RL events aren't too serious...make sure that you come back to us eventually! —the_ed17— 15:45, 26 September 2008 (UTC)
Lol, no you're not. And surrrre "auto-operational"...whatever. What are we gonna do w/o your stupid, smart-alecky comments? I mean, there's always Sam, but that's not the same. =) —the_ed17— 16:11, 26 September 2008 (UTC)
If you must go, let mine be the first signature on the "best wishes on your departure" card.
At the very least, I do hope you'll pay us the occasional visit? It's unfair on Lara to make her shoulder alone the burden of keeping my talkpage longer than Jimbo's and Abd's combined. – iridescent16:13, 26 September 2008 (UTC)
LOL, great pic. I'll poke my head in once and a while. (you are free to decide whatever level of inuendo I was intending with that last sentence...) Keeperǀ7616:16, 26 September 2008 (UTC)
DUDE! I'm seriously going to miss you. Consider stopping by my talk page anytime. And make sure you leave a committed identity for when you forget your password (I know you too well :)) MBisanztalk19:31, 26 September 2008 (UTC)
I'm going to miss me too! :-). If I forget my password (12345), I have bigger problems than whether I'll have time for wikipedia.....Keeperǀ7613:34, 27 September 2008 (UTC)
Hey Keep,
Looks like I'll be offline when you do your wiki swan song. I suspect WP:AN/K will continue in your absence, and I suspect you won't be able to stay away as much as you want to, so I'll just say "see you around here, albeit less frequently". Cheers. --barneca (talk) 22:16, 26 September 2008 (UTC)
Impressive sweep. They now have to take the Royals, a difficult prospect!!!! Well, if it's an LA Minnesota World Series, I'm going to have another case deja vu. That's my earliest memories of baseball. Sandy Koufax. Maury Wills. Willie Davis. Don Drysdale. John Roseboro. I won't recognize a single Dodger except Nomar and Manny--and SG will tell us that that's the reason the Dodgers are in. OrangeMarlinTalk•Contributions06:51, 26 September 2008 (UTC)
By my count, the Twins are 11-4 against KC this year, while the Sox are 10-5 against Cleveland. Looking forward to that "bonus baseball" on Monday and Tuesday. Dodgers and Twins, eh? It could happen. A chance for some revenge, 43 years later. Baseball BugsWhat's up, Doc?06:57, 26 September 2008 (UTC)
God, that was a fun game last night. Down 6-1 in the 4th, knocked my starter out (literally, hit by ball). I told my wife, "we're winning this, just watch", and I willed it to happen, knowing what my talkpage here would look like if they didn't pull it off, lol...Twins/Dodgers, been calling it since late august,[9] when neither team was even being talked about as a wildcard... Keeperǀ7614:17, 26 September 2008 (UTC)
It's all in the spin. I don't recollect where I said Dodgers, but I did say dodgers, somewhere on this wikipedia, in July. Or my name's not Keeper! (ps, my name's not really Keeper)... Keeperǀ7618:05, 26 September 2008 (UTC)
He lies. LIES I tell ya. His name is Keeper T. BigCheese. He told me I was trying to out him so I must be right. It's in the archives somewhere. TravellingCari19:03, 26 September 2008 (UTC)
Zing! So true, so true...but srsly OM, do you really want to start talking about potential oppose rationales? heh....Keeperǀ7613:31, 27 September 2008 (UTC)
Your sense of humor is lacking these days. The doctor suggests two Leinies and call me in the morning. :) If I were to ever run, the opposes would be classic. I mean, it would be worth it for the drama and humor value. So Wikipedia gets humor, drama, political intrigue and some pretty good articles. Citizenpedia gets....bad articles? OrangeMarlinTalk•Contributions19:08, 27 September 2008 (UTC)
Ummm since when is this "...extremely rough in nature with deadly violent incidents considered not worth more than a moment's attention by the clientèle" ???? —the_ed17— 23:08, 26 September 2008 (UTC)
So true. Let me show my age here abit. I do not like Star Wars, and did not enjoy the "first three" when they were in theaters. Overrated. I've never bothered to watch the "Second Three", seeing as the reviews (and everyone that stood in line to watch them) said they were sub-standard to the quality of the first three. I didn't like the first three, making my decision much easier... Keeperǀ7613:52, 27 September 2008 (UTC)
As long as I'm losing friends, I've never "got into" star trek either. Although I've seen enough of it to get the humor in Galaxy Quest, which is a terrifically quirky/funny little movie that doesn't get a lot of respect (except from the Star Trek actors, ironically)...Keeperǀ7615:22, 27 September 2008 (UTC)
You won't lose friends for telling me that you didn't like star trek. I was...um...a fanatic until I was about 15. And then, for some reason, it just stopped being interesting to me. The dialogue was creaky, the plotlines were morality plays and the technology was just a word salad or a deus ex machina. I've come back a bit to the point where I can watch 1-2 episodes and see them for what they were (television), but I'm no longer a great fan. Galaxy Quest, on the other hand, was brilliant. Every bit of it. I love the old star wars movies now because I see them as "happy accidents". George Lucas literally didn't have enough money and clout to fuck up his basically decent ideas and the result felt good. Not polished or nuanced, just good. Part of this is the glow of growing up with it. But part of it is hard to explain away. Protonk (talk) 15:47, 27 September 2008 (UTC)
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Welcome to Wikipedia. Although everyone is welcome to contribute constructively to the encyclopedia, we would like to remind you not to attack other editors, as you did on User talk:Orangemarlin. Please comment on the contributions and not the contributors. Take a look at the welcome page to learn more about contributing to this encyclopedia. Thank you. This edit constitutes a threat. Stop it. Or I'm going to have to buy the Twins and move them to Winnepeg. OrangeMarlin Talk• Contributions 16:54, 22 September 2008 (UTC)
Done See User:Baseball Boogies. Cheers! The twins are 5-1 against the pales at the metrodome this year. Either the pales are overdue, or the twins will be 8-1. (keeping in mind that they had a healthy crede and quentin when they lost 5 of 6)... Keeper ǀ 76 21:28, 23 September 2008 (UTC)
. MBisanz talk 19:00, 24 September 2008 (UTC)
