Talk:Victor Daniels (weightlifter)

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On 10 January 2024, it was proposed that this article be moved to Victor Daniels. The result of the discussion was no consensus.

Requested move 10 January 2024

The following is a closed discussion of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. Editors desiring to contest the closing decision should consider a move review after discussing it on the closer's talk page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

The result of the move request was: no consensus. There is no consensus to move Victor Daniels (weightlifter) to Victor Daniels. Based on guidelines such as use commonly recognisable names guideline, disambiguation guideline, and choosing between disambiguation pages and hatnotes guideline, it seems that a disambiguation page would be more appropriate than a hatnote for the name Victor Daniels, since there are at least two topics that could reasonably be called by that name. (closed by non-admin page mover) Vanderwaalforces (talk) 08:37, 18 January 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Victor Daniels (weightlifter) → Victor Daniels – The subject of this three-sentence stub has the sole Wikipedia entry bearing such exact main title header. An actor who used the stage name Chief Thundercloud was purportedly born under this name, but his origins are shrouded in uncertainty and, in any event, he was never credited or known to the public as "Victor Daniels" and used the name "Victor Vasquez" in his early years. A hatnote atop the weightlifter's entry — For the actor whose birth name was "Victor Daniels", see Chief Thundercloud — would suffice if consensus decides that a hatnote is even needed. — Roman Spinner (talk • contribs) 04:32, 10 January 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Note: WikiProject Biography has been notified of this discussion. Vanderwaalforces (talk) 06:36, 10 January 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Oppose. The British weightlifter, whose article averages about 10 clicks per month, is not the primary topic. I'd consider making Victor Daniels a disambiguation page, but that's a discussion for WP:RFD, not here. 162 etc. (talk) 17:06, 10 January 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Oppose the real name of "Chief Thundercloud" is "Victor Daniels" and Chief Thundercloud has 2,002 views compared with only 8[[1]] for the weightlifter meaning even if Chief Thundercloud was called Victor Daniels rarely its unlikely the weightlifter would be primary. Crouch, Swale (talk) 17:29, 10 January 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Comment. It needs to be emphasized that this nomination does not posit the weightlifter as the primary topic — it posits him as the only topic. Although his Wikipedia entry consists of a three-sentence stub, those three sentences do confirm that he "...represented Great Britain in the 1976 Summer Olympics. He represented England in the 60 kg featherweight division, at the 1978 Commonwealth Games..." Born in 1951, the 72-year-old Olympian used the name "Victor Daniels" throughout his life.

On the other hand, the primary topic grab, as of this writing, of the name "Victor Daniels" by Chief Thundercloud, does appear to be counterintuitive. The character actor who adopted the stage name "Chief Thundercloud" has 82 credits on IMDb, with 31 of those being unbilled. Even the actor himself, at the start of his career, did not use the name "Victor Daniels" but instead presented himself as "Victor Vasquez" or "Victor Vazquez", although he never received on-screen billing under those names.

Almost all of his roles were minor or bit parts, with the notable exception of two serials in which he played Lone Ranger's sidekick Tonto. As a result, it is indeed true that "Chief Thundercloud has 2,002 views compared with only 8 for the weightlifter". However, all those thousands of views are for "Chief Thundercloud" as Tonto, not for "Victor Daniels" as Tonto. Granted, that if a user prompts a search engine for "Chief Thundercloud", the search may return a mention that he was born "Victor Daniels", but that fact would be of no help or of no use to anyone researching Tonto.

It would seem a safe assumption that no one interested in Tonto would even think of typing "Victor Daniels" and the only users who would type "Victor Daniels" are those researching the history of weightlifting at the Olympics or at the Commonwealth Games. —Roman Spinner (talk • contribs) 23:55, 11 January 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Victor Daniels (weightlifter) is certainly not the "only" topic - it is undoubtedly ambiguous with Chief Thundercloud. 162 etc. (talk) 01:37, 12 January 2024 (UTC)[reply]

The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.