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Talk:Stronger (Kanye West song)/GA1

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GA Review

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Nominator: Kyle Peake (talk · contribs) 14:00, 18 May 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Reviewer: Jolielover (talk · contribs) 00:00, 1 January 2025 (UTC)[reply]

Right, ready to review this one! I'll spend the next day reading and making notes for this nom :) it's about time! jolielover♥talk 00:00, 1 January 2025 (UTC)[reply]

GA review (see here for what the criteria are, and here for what they are not)
  1. It is reasonably well written.
    a (prose, spelling, and grammar): b (MoS for lead, layout, word choice, fiction, and lists):
  2. It is factually accurate and verifiable, as shown by a source spot-check.
    a (reference section): b (inline citations to reliable sources): c (OR): d (copyvio and plagiarism):
  3. It is broad in its coverage.
    a (major aspects): b (focused):
  4. It follows the neutral point of view policy.
    Fair representation without bias:
  5. It is stable.
    No edit wars, etc.:
  6. It is illustrated by images and other media, where possible and appropriate.
    a (images are tagged and non-free content have non-free use rationales): b (appropriate use with suitable captions):
  7. Overall:
    Pass/Fail:

Infobox and lead

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  • Add the American English template
  • Infobox looks great!
  • Lead is too long, per MOS:LEADLENGTH, lead is over 600 words, far above the recommended maximum of 400. I would cut out & shorten:
    • "The song's production process was arduous, with various engineers and 75 different mixes, even having the drum programming redone with Timbaland after its release." - cut out entirely, is elaborated on in the "Writing and recording" section
    • Cut out "A maximalist hip hop song also based in electronica with varied elements of electronic music, it relies on a slowed vocal sample of Daft Punk's Harder, Better, Faster, Stronger" due to redundancy and reptition.
    • "The song received generally positive reviews from music critics, who mostly highlighted the sample of "Harder, Better, Faster, Stronger" → "The song received generally positive reviews from music critics, who praised the sample" (removing repetition)
    • "Focus was often placed on West's innovation through the sample and combination of genres, while critical assessments of his rapping were somewhat mixed." → "Focus was placed on West's innovation through the combination of electronica and hip hop, while critical assessments of his rapping were somewhat mixed."
    • Trim and condense information on the music video - I would reword "An accompanying music video was largely shot guerrilla-style in Tokyo and Los Angeles, going through reiterations from West's attention to detail. The video juxtaposes shots across Tokyo with scenes of him either rapping or being operated on in a laboratory and it was inspired by the Japanese anime film, Akira (1988). The visual was well received by most critics for the special effects, and it won Best Hip-Hop Video at the 2007 BET Hip Hop Awards." (76 words) to "The music video, inspired by anime film Akira (1988), juxtaposed shots of Tokyo with West rapping, and won Best Hip-Hop Video at the 2007 BET Hip Hop Awards." (28 words)
    • Similarly, shorten "West performed "Stronger" live throughout 2007 and 2008, including on his Glow in the Dark Tour and a rendition with Daft Punk at the Grammys. He later delivered performances at numerous festivals from Wireless in 2009, up to Glastonbury in 2015." to "West performed the song live on his Glow in the Dark Tour, with Daft Punk at the Grammys, and at several festivals, including Wireless and Glastonbury."
    • Cut out "The song has been used for numerous songs, sports games, and films, such as The Hangover Part II (2011). It was covered by Thirty Seconds to Mars in 2007, six years before Allison Williams performed the song in the series Girls."
  • I think that's about it for the changes I would make for the lead; the rest of the content seems necessary to give the reader an adequate summary of the song's history.

Background and development

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  • The prose is generally clear and follows a logical flow of pattern.
  • I like the image! Makes the article look appealing while providing background to the song and Daft Punk in hip-hop sampling.
  • For the citation for the artwork, I'd suggest changing the name of the website from "Kanye West Blog" to something else; blog implies a fan site, while the website was his official site. Maybe change it to 'kanyewest.com'

Writing and recording

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  • This sentence: "West mentioned he worked his recent mistakes into the songwriting for the song, having swum "in wack juice" that he needed to escape, such as blogs making fun of him." sounds far too informal and may not be understandable. I'd change to "West reflected on his past mistakes, admitting he had become caught up in criticism and negativity; he channeled his frustration into the song's first verse to express his frustration."
  • Cut "Marroquin and West got past the challenge of mixing the song through strong communication" out, does not seem necessary. Section is great otherwise!

Reception

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  • Some critics were less enthusiastic towards "Stronger". → The song also received mixed reviews from some critics. (more formal, neutral)
  • In a mixed review for Cokemachineglow → In a review for Cokemachineglow (avoiding redundancy)

Music video

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  • Williams explained to SOHH that the decision to work with West again as a friend of his was natural after hearing "Stronger" and stated he thought he "could kind of dive in with him on it", feeling it made sense completely with how the song connected with him. → Williams explained to SOHH that after hearing 'Stronger,' working with West again felt natural, as he thought he could easily collaborate with him. (clarity)
  • Despite West's attention to detail, he felt at ease without a strict setup when working with Williams and the collaborators mostly came up with the concept together. → West felt comfortable working without a strict setup, allowing him and Williams to collaborate on the concept freely. (clarity)
  • West was not satisfied when going over the footage back in the United States and abandoned the storyline in favor of "the hottest shots possible", relocating to NYC for footage at the Jacob K. Javits Convention Center after struggling to find improvements following 10 weeks of filming that almost led to a "brain aneurysm". → After reviewing the footage in the U.S., West abandoned the initial storyline in favor of 'the hottest shots possible.' He moved filming to NYC, specifically at the Jacob K. Javits Convention Center, after struggling for 10 weeks to improve the footage. (brain aneurysm comment is too hyperbolic)
  • ...it was boring due to the "pretty-lady-in-da-club" throughout. → it was boring due to the repetition of scenes throughout. (clarity)

Final comments

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For the sections I haven't mentioned, I wasn't able to find any issues with them. Overall, great job! I particularly liked the images accompanying most sections, really great use of them. I hope these issues can be rectified soon; they are mostly just rewordings and cutting off excessively elaborate information. I can't tick the "focus" part yet because of this, however this article is really close to GA status with a slight changes. Great work, @Kyle Peake:!

@Jolielover: Thank you so much for this review and your very detailed notes these are as constructive as one can get, I highly appreciate you having taking such a long article on after I've waited too long and can be assured a lot of effort must have gone into looking through all of this one! I have implemented all of your improvements to the best of my knowledge, with the exception of the cropping out of the usage and cover versions sentences in the lead. My reasoning is these provide key context into the song's usage which is covered extensively in the body, although if the lead is still too long should I try to crop these down or would it be better if we looked harder at the rest to see if any sentences could be re-worded somewhat please? --K. Peake 13:03, 1 January 2025 (UTC)[reply]
No problem! I'm fine with your reasoning for keeping that sentence for context, but I'd change "The song has been used for numerous songs, sports games, and films," to "The song has been featured in several pieces of media, such as..." for clarity, and cut out "while it has appeared on various lists of the best workout songs." Though the lead is a bit long, ultimately there is no strict limit on the word count as long as everything is relevant and not needlessly elaborate, which I believe this article covers. Just work on these minor changes and the article should be good to go! jolielover♥talk 13:20, 1 January 2025 (UTC)[reply]
@Jolielover: Thanks for being so good to work with especially on these final comments, I have now implemented this change please let me know if the article is ready to go! --K. Peake 14:33, 1 January 2025 (UTC)[reply]
@Kyle Peake: No problem! Seeing as I can't find any other issues, the article is good to go! :) Congrats! jolielover♥talk 15:01, 1 January 2025 (UTC)[reply]

Spot-check

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@Jolielover: you need to add a spot-check- basically list which 5-10%+ of the references you checked to see if the ref verified the text. Also, wow, you read and reviewed all of the article, all 9000 words, this fast? DoctorWhoFan91 (talk) 17:10, 1 January 2025 (UTC)[reply]

Apologies, here it is:
Hope this works!
And yes, I did :) holidays with nothing much to do. Typically I make 100-200 edits per day on Wikipedia but as you can see from my contribs today I don't have many since I spent the day reviewing the article. jolielover♥talk 17:43, 1 January 2025 (UTC)[reply]
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