Talk:Self-replicating machines in fiction

First sentence

I question the last part of the first sentence, "thus exhibiting self-replication in a way analogous to that found in nature." That doesn't sound quite right. "Nature" can duplicate plenty of inert things, like molecules, solutions, rocks, etc. In fiction, I believe what is most disturbing to the reader is machines (made initially by humans) that self-replicate in a way similar to living beings--particularly robots. In particular, the fear is that the duplication is "out of control" as seen in Autofac. I am not relying on the WP:RS to claim this. I would need to look more carefully about how the WP:RS describes it. I support a rewrite there. --David Tornheim (talk) 11:21, 6 April 2024 (UTC)

Well, what do the sources say? TompaDompa (talk) 13:19, 6 April 2024 (UTC)

Relevant excerpts:

1. "During this period, the exploration of potential futures of humanity in a world shared with self-reproducing, evolving machines was attracting a wider audience." "we discuss novels, sci-fi and other literature that explored self-reproducing machines in the early twentieth" "The growing popularity of the dystopian genre in early twentieth century literature was fuelled in part by a fear of how technology might negatively influence the development of human society [24]. Here we highlight works from the genre that involved ideas of machine self-reproduction and evolution" [1]

2. "As have writers of science fiction, who have been also quick to warn of the dangers of unleashing such a powerful technology upon the world. But for both sets of thinkers, the reality of a self-replicating machine has lain somewhere just beyond our reach."

"The idea of a self-replicating machine can be traced back to remarks made by the Queen of Sweden to René Descartes, but they were more seriously explored in the 19th century by Samuel Butler, who described a machine that could mimic the biological process of plants in his novel Erewhon.

Science fiction writers have kept pace. Phillip K Dick, Arthur C Clarke and Nobel-nominated Karel Capek have all toyed with the idea, before John Sladek based his 1968 satirical novel, the Reproductive System, on a self-replicating machine that goes wild. It set the scene for movies like the Terminator to tap into fears of robots capable of reproducing and taking over."[2]

3. Title: "Rage against Self-replicating Machines: Framing Science and Fiction in the US Nanotechnology Field"

Abstract quote: "First, our study shows that peripheral, popular movements open up avenues for scientific fields by generating understanding and receptivity for novel ideas through story-telling, which gives rise to their cultural embeddedness." [3] I don't have access to the full article.

I don't see much mention of "nature", except for "described a machine that could mimic the biological process of plants in his novel Erewhon." If anything, the theme of fear of the machines and the possibility of them taking over seems more prevalent.

--David Tornheim (talk) 00:33, 7 April 2024 (UTC)

Based on those excerpts, it seems that most of the current first sentence (A self-replicating machine is a type of autonomous robot that is capable of reproducing itself autonomously using raw materials found in the environment, thus exhibiting self-replication in a way analogous to that found in nature.) needs to go. A plain Self-replicating machines are a recurring motif in fiction might suffice. TompaDompa (talk) 20:12, 7 April 2024 (UTC)

Okay by me. --David Tornheim (talk) 20:46, 7 April 2024 (UTC)

2001: A Space Odyssey

This is potential WP:RS, which says:

I’m not sure if these threads had come together by the time 2001 was made, but certainly by the time of the 2010 sequel, Arthur C. Clarke had decided that the black monoliths were self-reproducing machines. And in a scene reminiscent of the modern idea that AIs, when given the directive to make more paperclips, might turn everything (including humans) into paperclips, the 2010 movie includes black monoliths turning the entire planet of Jupiter into a giant collection of black monoliths.

--David Tornheim (talk) 02:52, 7 April 2024 (UTC)

Another possible source re Butler

Another source, in the section "Darwin Among the Machines" (article by Samuel Butler 1863) "incorporated that idea [human dependency on machines] a decade later into a satirical novel called Erewhon, expounding for several chapters on self-replicating machines...." --David Tornheim (talk) 03:03, 7 April 2024 (UTC)