Talk:Mosaica Education

This is the talk page for discussing improvements to the Mosaica Education article.
This is not a forum for general discussion of the article's subject.

Put new text under old text. Click here to start a new topic.
New to Wikipedia? Welcome! Learn to edit; get help.

Article policies

Find sources: Google (books · news · scholar · free images · WP refs) · FENS · JSTOR · TWL

Education

	Education portal This article is within the scope of WikiProject Education, a collaborative effort to improve the coverage of education and education-related topics on Wikipedia. If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join the discussion and see a list of open tasks.EducationWikipedia:WikiProject EducationTemplate:WikiProject Educationeducation articles
???	This article has not yet received a rating on the project's importance scale.

Schools

	Schools portal This article is related to WikiProject Schools, a collaborative effort to write quality articles about schools around the world. If you would like to participate, you can edit the article attached to this page, or visit the project page.SchoolsWikipedia:WikiProject SchoolsTemplate:WikiProject Schoolsschool articles
???	This article has not yet received a rating on the project's importance scale.

Severe NPOV

This is probably the most biased article I've ever read on wikipedia. I know noting about Mosaica so I'm not going to attempt to fix it myself, but pretty much the entire of the opening section should be moved to a "Criticism" section. Typically in a wikipedia article, the initial section is purely descriptive. The whole article looks like it was written by someone with an axe to grind against Mosaica (e.g. a competing school provider)? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 94.174.41.228 (talk) 19:52, 18 May 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Totally disagree. To move everything that sounds negative to a "this section is negative (ie. Criticim)" section would be a completely biased and POV move. It's best just to take what's out there in the notable media and make an article of the available material. If all the material in the news is negative that's not your fault, it is what it is. 68.43.53.208 (talk) 20:22, 1 July 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Contested deletion

This page is not unambiguously promotional, because...it's simply information about the company and what it does, put in place for people who are curious about its identity.

Agree. WP:POTENTIAL justifies keeping.--S. Rich (talk) 14:26, 19 August 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Wholesale removal of info?

Every month it seems that someone comes and removes all negative info from the page. Rather than check citations, improve grammer and what not, it's just removed. This page could use some serious editorial help from experienced editors before this thing gets back into "advertisement mode". 69.245.73.235 (talk) 00:53, 5 April 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Reinstated deleted material. IT NEEDS HELP. Experienced Editors, please check it out. 69.245.73.235 (talk) 01:03, 5 April 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Editing the Page

Hello Wikipedia Editing Community, I would like to introduce myself as a representative of Mosaica Education. First of all, on behalf of our team, I would like to thank all of you for your work in creating this page to help inform the public about our organization. Prior to me writing this page, I do not think there have been any other Mosaica employees who have edited the page...and you've put together some great information! Secondly, in taking time to review the information, there are a number of places where I can provide more detail or correct information that is inaccurate. I'm wondering how you would like me to proceed. Shall I make the edits directly? Would you like me to put them up on the Talk page for review first? Other thoughts? Looking forward to working with you, and thanks again for all of your help! Courtney

— Preceding unsigned comment added by CourtneyEdu (talk • contribs) 21:32, 5 August 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Hi! Welcome to wikipedia! There are a ton of rules to learn about editing articles like always citing info from reliable and notable news sources, not POV pushing, not doing your own research, etc.. etc.. but you'll get all that in time. :) If you post in discussion before the article (or better yet since you're an employee letting others make the actual changes) that would probably be a good thing. Also, you may want to cut your teeth on some articles that you don't have a personal invested interest in just to be able to learn the ropes and make your mistakes without being accused of POV pushing. :) Have fun! 67.58.218.90 (talk) 13:58, 6 August 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Check your user page now for some helpful links. http://wiki.riteme.site/wiki/User_talk:CourtneyEdu 67.58.218.90 (talk) 14:03, 6 August 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Thank you for the early guidance. If the editors are willing to continue helping with our page, my preference would be to respect the ethos of Wikipedia and follow your advice to put the changes here on the Talk page for our page editors to move forward with. However, if no one volunteers, it seems best that I will go ahead and begin making the edits myself and await feedback. With that being said, I'd like to start with a few suggestions.

DIVISIONS - Global Educators is not an active division of Mosaica. I would suggest this be removed. - Mercury Online Education is now known as Mosaica Online, website = www.mosaicaonline.com - Mosaica American Schools is no longer a division of Mosaica. I would suggest this be removed. Under the Mosaica Education umbrella, Mosaica does have one international private school which is called Mosaica International School of Hyderabad. It's website is: www.mosaicahyderabad.com - Mosaica Turn Around Partners has a new website which is www.educationturnaround.com

Before I get too far along, could you give me some feedback on whether this is the type of feedback that is helpful and if I'm on the right track with providing it in the most helpful manner?

Thanks again! — Preceding unsigned comment added by CourtneyEdu (talk • contribs) 18:16, 6 August 2013 (UTC)[reply]

That all makes sense except for the "Mosaica American Schools" part which is tricky. The news articles don't seem to make a distinction between the international branch and the American branch. Seeing as how the notability of Mosaica activities is not all that strong (not meant pejoratively, just observing that there are relatively few citable notable sources discussing Mosaica) it might be best to make one article for the whole thing and make distinctions within the scope of that article. 67.58.218.90 (talk) 20:51, 6 August 2013 (UTC)[reply]

The rest of the changes seem pretty straight forward and as long as cited materials is not being removed and uncited material is not being added it should work just fine. 67.58.218.90 (talk) 20:52, 6 August 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Courtney, a quick overview of http://mosaicaeducation.com/ shows that the American Schools and 3 international schools are still part of it. Did I miss what you were saying? 67.58.218.90 (talk) 20:56, 6 August 2013 (UTC) HyperText Markup Language nevermind, yeah. The proposed changes look good. 67.58.218.90 (talk) 20:59, 6 August 2013 (UTC)[reply]

I did a few of them for you, please take a look and see if it needs changing. Also in googling Paragon I found a bunch of things that seemed notable that I included in that section. 67.58.218.90 (talk) 22:06, 6 August 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Thanks again for your help. I went ahead and made a few factual corrections--hopefully they are easy for you to spot and maybe you can give me some feedback? In the Paragon section, Dawn and Gene are both co-founders. In the American schools section I removed the Guragon and Bradenton Prep references which were not cited, like you said. I will be able to find some citations for things that are currently uncited--I just need to pull them up and figure out how to insert them the proper way. For the Mosaica American Schools, what do you think about combining it with the Mosaica International Schools section and just say the following: Mosaica International Schools (formerly known as Mosaica American Schools) is Mosaica's division of private international schools. While a school was once slated to open in Guragon, Mosaica currently operates only one private international school in Hyderabad. Or something like that? I'm feeling a bit more like I have the hang of things, but felt I wanted to stop in check in with you for now. Let me know your feedback at this point. Thank you! — Preceding unsigned comment added by CourtneyEdu (talk • contribs) 18:09, 7 August 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Your changes and proposals look good. Keep it up. When you find sources, just make sure the cited sources are notable and reliable. 76.112.8.146 (talk) 13:58, 9 August 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Okay, thank you! I'll keep actively checking the Talk page in case you or anyone else has any feedback. I really appreciate your help. Speaking of reliable sources, personal blogs should not count, right? If someone is citing from a personal blog source, it would be best to remove the citation I'm guessing? — Preceding unsigned comment added by CourtneyEdu (talk • contribs) 19:25, 9 August 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Good edits. I have a qualm with the removal of the one line though. I think the info cited in the news specifically speaks of teacher dissatisfaction and needs to receive prominence because it is prominently covered in the news. It seems to be a theme covered in the news about Mosaica frequently. I'd be interested in seeing your opinion about how to make sure it's prominently reflected in the wiki article as well. 76.112.8.146 (talk) 04:49, 10 August 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Thank you! Could you let me know what article you are referring to that speaks about teacher dissatisfaction? I did not see that reference but would be happy to research it more. Also, in the Paragon section the Guardian article is misquoted several times. I removed the part about Arizona State University, but rather than removing all of it, maybe you want to take another look at it? I'm not sure how you would like to reframe it. Here are a few comments. The quote about 1 in 5 pupils not knowing who Churchill is, is Gove speaking about all pupils in England. It is a larger context than the Mosaica school in England and Paragon. Paragon is intended to help with correcting that--it's a tool for education reform. Also, the article quotes without citation a study done by the American Federation of Teachers--shouldn't that be quoted from the study itself is the Guardian paper enough of a quote on its own? Also, technical question, is there some way to condense citations of articles? If there is one particular article that continues to be cited is there a way for it to show up once in the links section or is the proper way for it to be repeated? Thank you!

I think it would be a good idea to review the claims of paragon one at a time to make sure each statement is accurate and appropriately cited. Synthesis and personal research like if I take a bunch of articles that quote unhappy teachers and I write the statement "There is a high level of teacher dissatisfaction", would be inappropriate here as I am not a notable expert being quoted in reliable media. So let's start a new section for parsing this info below. 76.112.8.146 (talk) 16:10, 14 August 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Reports on Paragon

I propose a review of news and journal reports of the paragon curriculum here for an accurate representation on the page. Here's a start. More later when I have time. Please fill in the blanks as you can. 76.112.8.146 (talk) 16:10, 14 August 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Mosaica statements

"Michael J. Connelly. "One of the keys to achieving strong academic gains for students - who are typically 1.5 years behind grade level when they start at one of our schools -- is our proprietary Paragon curriculum. It teaches rich content through hands-on study..." Lots of good info here including awards.. http://www.businesswire.com/news/home/20050422005499/en/Mosaica-Education-Ranked-Number-City-100-York-Based 76.112.8.146 (talk) 16:10, 14 August 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Paragon effectiveness

Anyone have a journal article pointing to the effectiveness of Paragon at teaching social studies? 76.112.8.146 (talk) 19:02, 14 August 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Teacher satisfaction

"Craig Oliver has been a social studies teacher for decades. He left his longtime teaching job to work in Muskegon Heights' new charter school district. But he quit by October. He was not a big fan of Paragon or Mosaica’s scheduled lessons throughout the day. “I compare it to the procedures at McDonalds. You only do things a certain way,” Oliver said. The desk arrangements, in clusters instead of rows, were required in each class, he said."" http://www.michiganradio.org/post/many-muskegon-heights-students-dig-charter-company-s-curriculum-it-s-fun 76.112.8.146 (talk) 16:10, 14 August 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Arizona State University

American Federation of Teachers

Commentary on it http://columbia.news21.com/2009/indexee0c.html?p=1364 76.112.8.146 (talk) 16:10, 14 August 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Actual report http://eric.ed.gov/?id=ED497914 76.112.8.146 (talk) 16:10, 14 August 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Other Mosaica references in the news

I'm not sure how to go about categorizing these but they could potentially help in filling gaps on the main page. 76.112.8.146 (talk) 16:10, 14 August 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Philly

This article discusses difficulties between Mosaica and a public school board near Philidephia http://articles.philly.com/2001-04-18/news/25332433_1_mosaica-education-mosaica-academy-charter-school-charter-board 76.112.8.146 (talk) 16:10, 14 August 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Michigan PR series

These, for the most part deal with with the Muskegon school, teacher dissatisfaction, scores, public reaction, etc.

http://www.michiganradio.org/post/investigation-uncovers-non-certified-teachers-muskegon-heights-new-charter-school

http://www.michiganradio.org/post/despite-state-takeover-special-education-problems-linger-muskegon-heights-schools

http://www.michiganradio.org/post/grading-michigans-first-fully-privatized-public-school-district

http://www.michiganradio.org/post/1-4-teachers-muskegon-heights-schools-quit-during-first-3-months-school-year

76.112.8.146 (talk) 16:26, 14 August 2013 (UTC)76.112.8.146 (talk) 16:28, 14 August 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Profile of leaving Mosaica

"the company hopes to be renowned for its signature Paragon curriculum, a hands-on social studies program that crosses several disciplines... Critics, however, say Mosaica is instead known as the company most often fired by its clients. " http://columbia.news21.com/2009/indexee0c.html?p=1364 — Preceding unsigned comment added by 76.112.8.146 (talk) 19:07, 14 August 2013 (UTC)[reply]