User talk:Sandstein/Archives/2021/November

Question

Hello, hope you're having a good day. I'd appreciate if you could check Orbit Culture page and see if the template message can be removed now? BlackSiren77 (talk) 09:21, 2 November 2021 (UTC)

I don't have a view about that, sorry. I've never edited that article. Sandstein 10:36, 2 November 2021 (UTC)

Short descriptions

Hi, I saw that you removed the short description from Colleges of the University of Oxford. I couldn't find any guidance on when a short description is not needed, please could you link me to it if it exists? TSventon (talk) 14:45, 5 November 2021 (UTC)

@TSventon, sure: WP:SDNONE. Sandstein 14:53, 5 November 2021 (UTC)

Proposed deletion and redirect

Hey Sandstein,

Since you're a prolific AfD closer, I thought I'd ask you this question. I see that WP:ATD-R recommends AfD as a possible venue for making a page into a redirect (assuming lack of agreement). What happens if I see a WP:Proposed deletion that I think would be more suitable as a redirect? Should I support the PROD (as I did here) but mention my support for a redirect? Or should I remove the PROD and blank the page and redirect, and if someone disputes me then start a new PROD? Thanks VR _talk 03:27, 3 November 2021 (UTC)

@Vice regent: My understanding is that both approaches are possible. Sandstein 11:12, 6 November 2021 (UTC)

Ok, thanks.VR _talk 11:13, 6 November 2021 (UTC)

SndrAndrss

SndrAndrss (talk · contribs) would like talk page restoration-- UTRS appeal #50492 --Deepfriedokra (talk) 23:09, 5 November 2021 (UTC) My feeling is he has no more insight than he did 14 ya. (sigh) --Deepfriedokra (talk) 23:27, 5 November 2021 (UTC)

@Deepfriedokra: Thanks, but without knowing the reason for the request, I can't assess it. Without further information, I'm opposed to restoring talk page access. Sandstein 11:11, 6 November 2021 (UTC)

Oh, don't you UTRS? You should try it sometime! It opens up a whole new world. --Deepfriedokra (talk) 11:13, 6 November 2021 (UTC)

I had access once, but it was removed for inactivity. I don't think that I'm motivated enough to reapply right now... Sandstein 11:15, 6 November 2021 (UTC)

Huh! Anyway, they've twelve more hours to fashion a response to my questions that makes sense, or they get a decline template. All these years, and still clueless. --Deepfriedokra (talk) 11:18, 6 November 2021 (UTC)

A beer for you!

With reference to a difficult AFD Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/David Oliver (magician). Your carefully considered decision seems to be the most appropriate. Theroadislong (talk) 10:27, 7 November 2021 (UTC)

Pls revert tulu script page

This a unilateral decision to delete that page. If some information looks like a copyright ed content then pls delete part. But not the full article. There page needed for tulu script. Even I am also learning and researching tulu script. Pls it's my humble request. Even before publishing this article we have placed discussion on talk page. Where most of the people agreed to create this page. Mr anonymousMr (talk) 13:14, 13 November 2021 (UTC)

No, consensus among experienced editors at the AfD was otherwise. Sandstein 15:00, 13 November 2021 (UTC)

Edward Wild

I was going to create a wiki page for Edward Wild who wrote a book with Charlotte Raven on Huntington's disease - I found a deleted page from 2016 - here is the discussion - Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Edward Wild - and was told to contact the person who deleted it, namely you.

That discussion seems to say it was too soon. Since then Professor Wild has been made a Fellow of the Royal College of Physicians, Professor and an Associate Director of the UCL Huntington’s Disease Centre along with Professor Tabrizi.

What do you think about recreating the article? Is there a procedure for deciding if it is now notable? Thanks

References

Respectstherights (talk) 16:58, 15 November 2021 (UTC)

Sorry, I don't have the time to look into this right now. Sandstein 14:35, 17 November 2021 (UTC)

List of currently erupting volcanoes

Could you please provide me a copy of this in draft or userspace? I would like to expand it to 21st century eruptions/recently active volcanoes as was discussed to avoid the need for such regular updating. Reywas92^Talk 16:15, 19 November 2021 (UTC)

Sorry, I'm not undeleting articles, but you can try WP:REFUND. Sandstein 17:11, 19 November 2021 (UTC)

Not a happy camper

So, in my opinion this was certainly not an excellent edit. You actually came out with the result that I myself wanted (overturn), but there's a lot more here than that, and my objections are:

• "I'm discounting the opinion of the appellant, Supermann, because their 24(!) contributions to this DRV have been disruptive." I'm not seeing that as true at all and, echoing to your dismissal of the thread above (happened to see it when I came here), "Is there a policy or guideline that says that 'Commenters who make excessive posts [or "...24 or more posts", whatever] in a thread should have all their comments ignored'"? This seems a cogent kind of point to you, so... is there?

• "Because of the walls of text, any good arguments on either side are not easily discerned"... An unfriendly person could interpret that as devolving to "I personally lack the time, ability, and/or interest to properly judge the complex points made" which isn't a good look. Describing arguments where one writes a good amount of material but to to good effect -- vetting individual refs in detail, finding new sources and describing them in sufficient detail to be useful, that sort of thing -- as a "wall of text" (visualizing eye roll and hair flip up the reader) is pretty anti-intellectual and is not a good look I don't think.

• ...and I'll have to do with the headcount" No, I don't think so. Let's see... I wrote about 2,300 words, plus another 600 which didn't address the question at hand directly but dealt with meta-issues. I'm not perfect, but the great bulk of that was not repeating myself but delving into and describing important details. And I hatted most of it with an executive summary for reader convenience, and also some of these were responses to other editors' comments. In contrast, ScottyWong wrote 16 words, all of which were useless at best: "close was an obvious delete..." [poor analysis, since it looks like it's going to be kept after the relisting -- ed] "...not sure why we're wasting so much time discussing it" [casual disdain of established process -- ed]]. And you counted us the same? That's... not even wrong, colleague. I dispute your right to even do that. I hope you never do that again.

So, for instance, I spent 880 words on describing one role alone, trying to make a best guess if Hogan's role there was a lead role (since the nom and supporters were averring that he had no lead roles). I was laying down detailed facts, hoping to convince other editors of my interpretation but willing to let them interpret them differently. I could have dumbed it down to "His role in Dracula: The Dark Prince was probably a lead role according to my analysis" which could have been gainsayed with "Nuh uh was not" and would that have been better. Is that the level of discussion you want to encourage and require. I stand by my right to do rigorous vetting, analysis, and argument and I won't back down on that nor accept that as a bad thing.

I could say more and we could look at Supermann's contributions and see if they really were useless and to be discounted. But I'm sure I'm in your TL;DR zone already and maybe you haven't read even this far.

Anyway, all this matters because other editors are holding up this poor close as a paradigm. You're spreading this anti-intellectual attitude. Don't. I will repeat myself this once: I know you guys are super busy. That's a good reason for doing nothing, but not for doing non-excellent things. Herostratus (talk) 23:57, 17 November 2021 (UTC)

Sorry that you're disappointed, but: life is short, we are all volunteers here and we need to respect each other's time as a matter of collegiality. Brevity is key to effective collaboration. I'll continue to disregard logorrhoeic contributions. Sandstein 07:35, 18 November 2021 (UTC)

OK. Yes, brevity is a good thing when it's functional. Sometimes it's not. Depends partly on what kind of response it gets.

I think there's a difference between "this is really long and detailed, and I haven't time do do more than skim or even skip it" and "this is really long and detailed, and that's a behavior problem. What we need is off-the-cuff soundbites here, and people coming here with buckets of facts and cogent points are uncollegial and maybe need to be shown the door."

Yeah its a hobby. But if you're doing model trains and don't have the time or skill to make a model right, don't make it. Same with this hobby. Can't do it right, don't do it. There's plenty other things to do here. That'd be my suggestion.

Also, with this link, you're suggesting that the editor in question is mentally ill or brain damaged. Me too I suppose. I don't care for that, in fact I think its filthy, and probably not true, and even it it is true, speaking harshly of people's disabilities is not a good look. I mean, if you had a double-digit IQ (I'm saying if; who knows?) I wouldn't make fun of you for that. If that's the kind of environment you want promote here I'll hinder it if I may. Herostratus (talk) 22:10, 19 November 2021 (UTC)

In Kemelet AfD

Hi Sandstein, Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/In Kemelet also included In Isendjef and In Oudad, but those two are still up. Can you delete them? Thanks! Lennart97 (talk) 12:38, 20 November 2021 (UTC)

Done, thanks. Sandstein 16:43, 20 November 2021 (UTC)

DRV

I would object to your closure of the DRV request as "No Consensus".[1]

What I know is that DRV is supposed to give more weight to the argument by the uninvolved observers who were not the participants of the AfD.

Counting those who were entirely uninvolved, it seems that there was only 2 support for "Endorse", by Nomadicghumakkad and Enos733, but there was support for "Overturn" from 4 editors: Hobit, Alalch Emis, Jclemens and DGG.

Looking at the contribs, I can say that Hobit, DGG and Jcemelns clearly seem far more experienced at DRVs.

What is more striking is that there was one "Endorse" for the AfD closure, but the user later struck their "Endorse".[2] Clearly because the BLP1E argument still does not hold water. TolWol56 (talk) 07:11, 17 November 2021 (UTC)

Is there a policy or guideline that says that "DRV is supposed to give more weight to the argument by the uninvolved observers who were not the participants of the AfD"? Sandstein 14:35, 17 November 2021 (UTC)

WP:DRV say "Some consider it a courtesy, to other DRV participants, to indicate your prior involvements with the deletion discussion or the topic," obviously so that the obvious bias can be easily observed, but this wasn't seen in any of the 3 bolded "endorse" who participated in the DRV as they failed to reveal their prior involvement with the AfD. As earlier discussions show, it is a pretty established fact that DRV is supposed to uphold the views from uninvolved editors over the involved editors because it is 100% predictable that those who participated in AfD would only rehash their already posted views. This is same with any other venue where the original closure is disputed. TolWol56 (talk) 00:12, 21 November 2021 (UTC)

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Unblocking

Hello! Is it possible for you to unblock my user account?. It has been blocked for four years now. It will have many benefits if the user account is unblocked it will be easier to reach me. I think i have learned for the previous four years. I am frustrated that my user account can be used. I know that i have used multiple IP-adresses and accounts. I think it would be more beneficial that my user account can be used again. Yours sincerely, Sondre --88.88.103.30 (talk) 11:52, 27 November 2021 (UTC)

The account Sondre (talk · contribs · deleted contribs · logs · filter log · block user · block log) does not exist. Sandstein 12:06, 27 November 2021 (UTC)

Unblocking my user account

Hello! Can you unblock my user account User:SndrAndrss. The reason is that my account has been blocked for four years now. And I think i have learned during the course of that period. It will be much easier to communicate with me when i have an account. I know that i have one. It is very beneficial with an account because I have always edited with an IP-address. I have used several IP-addresses to evade blocks in the past. Socking is a bad thing and I have admitted to have done so. Yours sincerely, Sondre --88.88.103.30 (talk) 12:17, 27 November 2021 (UTC)

This is an inadequate unblock request because it does not adress the reasons for the block, and at any rate unblocking is not possible because of the existing community ban of SndrAndrss (talk · contribs · deleted contribs · logs · filter log · block user · block log). I'm blocking this ban-evading IP. Sandstein 12:22, 27 November 2021 (UTC)