User talk:Ipigott/Archive 7

• Archive 1: January 2007 to January 2010
• Archive 2: January 2010 to January 2011
• Archive 3: January 2011 to June 2011
• Archive 4: June 2011 to November 2011
• Archive 5: December 2011 to August 2012
• Archive 6: September 2012 to December 2012

Danish woodcarvers

Good start on Hans Holst, Abel Schrøder and Lorentz Jørgensen. Unfortunately, I can't find en lang refs in order to add content. As you mention several buildings in these woodcarver articles, I got started on them (St Martin's Church, Næstved & Vester Egesborg Church & Undløse Church & Kongsdal. --Rosiestep (talk) 03:31, 5 January 2013 (UTC)

I have a question regarding naming convention. Can you look at these categories? Sometimes Saint is St and other times it's St. so what would be better? Sometimes the city differentiator is in parentheses and sometimes it precedes a comma; which would be better? I may have added to the problem. :) Thx, --Rosiestep (talk) 17:18, 5 January 2013 (UTC)

Coordinates of Undløse Church are wrong, see the coordinates for Undløse (which you might add to..) Also started Bibliography of Danish architecture which you might nurture..♦ Dr. ☠ Blofeld 11:49, 7 January 2013 (UTC)

Yes, late in the night I fixed the wrong references but the text is right. I have now fixed the correct references in Dutch and both belong to the official site of the Church. In the lead section, there is some text related to a farmer donating a ship which is suspended in the church. I could not locate the reference for this and hence I have given two imags of the ship, one is as built and another as suspended. The text in the commons images have some detail if it can be incorporated. The editing done by you on Undløse Church is very nice. There is plan of the church with a legend with numbers and some descriptions. That could be used to elaborate on the layout plan of the church. The article in German is very good which could be used. I tried one reference there is Pdf, but the google translation was so poor that I got totally confused. This is the reference [1]. You may like to use it to expand the text as the German article uses it. I have also added some text to the estate article. --Nvvchar. 17:34, 7 January 2013 (UTC)

An FYI that I nominated Abel Schrøder (you're the only one credited for this one; it was started 12/5 so this is last day to nom), plus Undløse Church, St Martin's Church, Næstved, and Vester Egesborg Church. --Rosiestep (talk) 00:39, 8 January 2013 (UTC)

Thanks for the message regarding the German version of the article. Since the artciles have already been posted on DYK, it may not be wise to add anymore text. I did google translation of the names given in the layout plan and they are fairly clear to me. However I will try to add an extra para on the layout this evening. The churches in Denmark are so beautiful and very well decorated inside. --Nvvchar. 08:24, 8 January 2013 (UTC)

I have now added the layout plan and a section explaining the features of the layout, duly referenced. Three items are not translated properly as google did not provide any equivalent English words. I would appreciate your adding to it and also editing the text I have added now. If you consider it inappropriate you can delete it.--Nvvchar. 15:03, 8 January 2013 (UTC)

Bibliography of Danish architecture

Happy Not-So-New Year.:) I wondered if maybe the list should include a section on urban planning - especially to cover Jan Gehl's bools such as Life Between Buildings (maybe also a section on landscape architecture or the two subjects could perhaps be combined. I also wondered if it would perhaps be an idea to split up the section about castles and houses in a section on historic architecture and a section on modern/contemporary architecture. Some publications or publishers which may be worth considering for inclusion:

• The New Wawe in Danish architecture
• "Super Danish
• Danish Architecture Press, some of their titles here
• Realdania Byg has made a lot of piblications about buildings which have been graced with their attention and at least some of them are available in English.
• The Architecture at Carlsberg in both English and Danish and with beautiful photographs.
• Danish Architecture Centre has also made various publications which might be relevant.

Ramblersen (talk) 11:27, 10 January 2013 (UTC)

Good to hear from you Ramblersen. I was going to contact you in connection with the bibliography but you got to me first. We have only just started compiling it so there is indeed a lot more to do. I agree with all your suggestions and would encourage you to implement them with any other additions you find appropriate. If you can handle the changes yourself, it would give me more time to spend on other articles. All the best for 2013. --Ipigott (talk) 11:38, 10 January 2013 (UTC)

Happy New Year! Hope you noticed Architecture of Denmark is the featured article for January. I agree that as long there is no specific list for urban design, is perfectly fine to include it in the scope of the same list. Another distinction for the 20-21st centuries is between academic books, manifestos, monographies and coffee table books. But have no experience with bibliography lists on wiki. Life Between Buildings might deserve its own article. --ELEKHH^T 11:57, 10 January 2013 (UTC)

A very happy New Year to you too, Elekhh. I will of course be happy to start adding books but unfortunately I will be tied up the next few days so progress will probably be quite slow. I am really in doubt as to which sections to go with - as Elekhh points out there are so many possible criteria and if it is a muiture of typology, period, genre etc it seems to get rather untidy. So for now I will just add books under 'other' if they don't seem to fit into an existing section and then we can always decide on systematics later.Ramblersen (talk) 13:29, 10 January 2013 (UTC)

Thanks Elekhh for your interest. I had noticed there had recently been increased interest in the Architecture of Denmark article and now I understand why. Thanks for promoting it. As for the bibliography list, I personally think it is quite a good idea to have sections on the various types of building but also agree with Ramblersen that it may be better to use the "General" heading when in doubt. There is in fact an enormous amount of "local history" emerging in Denmark at the moment, also of interest to architecture, but unfortunately mainly based on reproductions of old photographs with little attention to the architecture per se. Unfortunately book coverage of notable architects before the 20th century is rather limited, particularly in English. But let's just see how it develops. Ramblersen seems to have some excellent suggestions and once again we have to thank Dr. Blofeld for the initiative. --Ipigott (talk) 16:15, 10 January 2013 (UTC)

Noticing a strong group of editors particularly interested in Danish architecture I was wondering if it would be of any use at all to you if we set up a taskforce within WikiProject Architecture? That would mean setting up a wikiproject subpage and a specific parameter added to the talkpage banners (can be done by bot). This would allow generating the usual cleanup and monthly popular pages lists for Danish architecture article. --ELEKHH^T 21:47, 10 January 2013 (UTC)

I think the whole problem with the WikiProject is one of defining priorities rather than tidying up the project pages themselves. I think we should start by establishing which articles need the most attention. I started working on the Acropolis of Athens but was disappointed to see that no one else took up the challenge. I have a feeling a new task force might turn out the same way. Sorry to be rather pessimistic on this. --Ipigott (talk) 21:59, 10 January 2013 (UTC)

There used to be a "collaboration of the month", which went to sleep around 2009. Do you think advertising it as such on the WikiProject/Portal page could help? Or maybe could be the collaboration of the year, considering the low level of activity. --ELEKHH^T 22:15, 10 January 2013 (UTC)

Maybe the collaboration of the month idea would work if we could establish clearly defined goals. You could at least try it our for one month on an experimental basis. How about setting up a list of five important articles (like the Acropolis of Athens) requiring improvement up to B class? But if you really want it to work, I think you would have to alert people personally rather than just announce it on the portal or the talk page. --Ipigott (talk) 10:45, 11 January 2013 (UTC)

Ian's recent suggestion sounds reasonable. Started Hans Christian Amberg (architect) BTW, can you translate?.♦ Dr. ☠ Blofeld 14:12, 12 January 2013 (UTC)

I'm frantically trying to get the Danish Culture Canon into shape. I'll look at Amberg when I've sorted it out. --Ipigott (talk) 14:22, 12 January 2013 (UTC)

Danish Culture Canon

When I looked at it, I felt bedazzled by all the article possibilities. I'll do a little research regarding where I'd like to start and then get back to you. --Rosiestep (talk) 16:20, 12 January 2013 (UTC)

Wouldn't go quite that far but it is indeed an excellent article choice and one which is of course very productive for routing out missing notable articles which I'm always keen on..♦ Dr. ☠ Blofeld 17:00, 12 January 2013 (UTC)

Sure, architecture first. I started Hover Church and will continue with it later today. --Rosiestep (talk) 20:10, 12 January 2013 (UTC)

From the en version of Danish Culture Canon, I followed the link to the da version, Kulturkanonen, and clicked on their wl for Hover Kirke, and translated it. --Rosiestep (talk) 16:44, 13 January 2013 (UTC)

This one? --Rosiestep (talk) 17:07, 13 January 2013 (UTC)

Mosconi (restaurant) may interest you when you have a moment from canonizing! ♦ Dr. ☠ Blofeld 17:45, 15 January 2013 (UTC)

I will work on those, but broke my foot so taking a little break. --Rosiestep (talk) 03:20, 16 January 2013 (UTC)

I think Mosconi is more or less OK now. His first name is in fact Illario with two Ls, but seems to be misspelt in all the references! Just added a rather nice picture. You might like to look over Vilhelm Klein from the canon. --Ipigott (talk) 11:04, 16 January 2013 (UTC)

Thanks, yes indeed, a quaint spot, ideal for painting!♦ Dr. ☠ Blofeld 12:22, 16 January 2013 (UTC)

I know you're busy but if you have some time and feel like fleshing out a few in Category:Buildings and structures in San Fernando, Cádiz with translation, especially the churches, I'd be grateful.♦ Dr. ☠ Blofeld 20:16, 17 January 2013 (UTC)

Couldn't find any churches -- perhaps they're coming. Found quite a bit of work was needed on La Carraca. There's a plan of the site here is you feel it's worth including. Also did a short c/e on one of the castles. Let me know if there's another important article you need help with in the series. --Ipigott (talk) 13:09, 18 January 2013 (UTC)

Thanks. one of the claims in the Arsenal article though I find dubious, that it was the first shipbuilding yard. If you think Spanish Armada and Francis Drake that was late 16th century, so those big ships had to have been made somewhere..♦ Dr. ☠ Blofeld 12:01, 19 January 2013 (UTC)

You are absolutely right of course. I have now given a more literal translation of the Spanish: "With its docks and workshops, it was the first naval construction centre to be built in Spain", which is probably OK. --Ipigott (talk) 13:05, 19 January 2013 (UTC)

That's better, thanks. I did start St. Peter, Syburg a few days back which looks an interesting place. There's a bit more in German, might find enough for a DYK, if not, no worries.♦ Dr. ☠ Blofeld 13:33, 19 January 2013 (UTC)

Shouldn't it be "St. Peter's Church, Syburg"? That's the usual style in English. I'll have a look at it. --Ipigott (talk) 13:44, 19 January 2013 (UTC)

I agree, but Gerda moved it, and I think she knows the church.♦ Dr. ☠ Blofeld 14:53, 19 January 2013 (UTC)

Well Gerda may be a great expert on music but she is German and is not always familiar with English usage. I know she believes there is a trend to use original German names for churches, etc., but while this might be acceptable for some buildings, it is certainly not natural in this case. We have St. Peter's Church, Vienna, St. Peter's Church, Hamburg, St. Peter's Church, Munich, etc., etc. The only other instance of St. Peter for a church is St. Peter, Zurich which I also find strange. At your suggestion, I was in fact doing quite a bit of editing on the article but I'm afraid both Gerda and you started editing at the same time, so I ran up against two copy edits in a row (on more or less the same sections that were added) and decided to abandon the work I had done apart from a few additions to the history section. These now need to be sorted out with the other additions. But I'll wait until everything has quietened down and then try to copy-edit all the changes. --Ipigott (talk) 15:26, 19 January 2013 (UTC)

Sorry about the edit conflicts. Started Ved Vejen.♦ Dr. ☠ Blofeld 16:09, 19 January 2013 (UTC)

These things happen. Glad to see you are making such strong progress on Ved Vejen. It has been translated as Katinka (like the film). When you've finished, I'll probably have a few bits to add too. Now back to Syburg. --Ipigott (talk) 16:22, 19 January 2013 (UTC)

If you have a feeling that there will be an article edit conflict add Template:Inuse to the top.♦ Dr. ☠ Blofeld 17:58, 19 January 2013 (UTC)

That's a good idea but in this case it was the other way round I think. I should look more carefully at the history before I start adding large chuncks of text. It's partly the way I work, I think. I like to get entire sections, even articles, in order before I add to the main space. Maybe I should just add one sentence at a time which would reduce the risk of edit conflict (but would not necessarily improve the quality). By the way: Do you know what "no ec" means in Gerda's last message? --Ipigott (talk) 18:20, 19 January 2013 (UTC)

Got a start on the Canon's visual arts with Frederik V on Horseback and Jason with the Golden Fleece (Thorvaldsen). --Rosiestep (talk) 18:39, 19 January 2013 (UTC)

Good start. I'll get back to them tomorrow. --Ipigott (talk) 22:03, 19 January 2013 (UTC)

Copyeditor needed

Rightnow, I am working on an article on Bhadra fort in Ahmedabad, India. It is still in Sandbox, will be soon moved to AfC. Have a look and please do copyediting as I am not so good at English. Here: User:Nizil Shah/sandbox3 --Nizil (talk) 20:45, 17 January 2013 (UTC)

I'll try to get to it tomorrow. --Ipigott (talk) 21:34, 17 January 2013 (UTC)

Danish poet

Viggo Stuckenberg may interest you. --Rosiestep (talk) 00:00, 21 January 2013 (UTC)

Viggo looks good; I'll nominate the article on 1/24/13. --Rosiestep (talk) 03:39, 23 January 2013 (UTC)

Thanks for your work on Viggo Stuckenberg, Jason with the Golden Fleece (Thorvaldsen), and Frederik V on Horseback; I nomed them today. --Rosiestep (talk) 04:16, 25 January 2013 (UTC)

Danish Culture Canon 2

Thanks. It doesn't take that long. The longest part is checking all the links. You might want to check out the Danse i måneskin section in the popular music. According to the article, and the reference, it was co-written by Per Nielsen but he is a retired footballer. On the Danish article, Kulturkanonen it says Niller Skovgård but it's a red link. There is Per Nielsen (musiker) on the Danish Wikipedia but I couldn't figure out if he was the correct one either. CambridgeBayWeather (talk) 12:14, 21 January 2013 (UTC)

Glad it got sorted though. CambridgeBayWeather (talk) 22:29, 21 January 2013 (UTC)

DYK for Mosconi (restaurant)

KTC (talk) 00:03, 22 January 2013 (UTC)

DYK for Abel Schrøder

 — Crisco 1492 (talk) 08:04, 25 January 2013 (UTC)

DYK for Undløse Church

 — Crisco 1492 (talk) 08:04, 25 January 2013 (UTC)

DYK for St Martin's Church, Næstved

 — Crisco 1492 (talk) 08:05, 25 January 2013 (UTC)

DYK for Vester Egesborg Church

 — Crisco 1492 (talk) 08:06, 25 January 2013 (UTC)

Yeshe-Ö

Hi, Can you translate this from Dutch?♦ Dr. ☠ Blofeld 17:49, 26 January 2013 (UTC)

Also, Rio Grande da Serra history needs improving/proofing from here. Can you look into it? Let me know if you want help on any of the Danish articles.♦ Dr. ☠ Blofeld 19:33, 26 January 2013 (UTC)

I can certainly "translate" Yeshe Ö but I see all the sources are English books. Strange that we have to go back to Dutch for them. I'll have a look tomorrow. On RGdS, I can translated the basic history but I don't feel up to handling the long list of dates. --Ipigott (talk) 22:06, 26 January 2013 (UTC)

Oh, OK, don't worry then about Yeshe.♦ Dr. ☠ Blofeld 22:08, 26 January 2013 (UTC)

An img certainly does seem to boost readership of dyk articles, so whenever possible, it's good to include an img. But it doesn't bother me if there is a low reader count on a particular article; I'm just glad the article exists. I started on Marie Gudme Leth, but am not finding much in en on Gertrud Vasegaard. --Rosiestep (talk) 23:14, 26 January 2013 (UTC)

I've looked to see the visiting history of some of my obscure Burmese village and African villages entries and surprisingly they mostly get daily hits. Very few articles actually get 0 hits daily, so as long as several people are looking for info in them we're functioning as an encyclopedia should. I think we have to remember potentially how many visitors wikipedia could have and what the people of the world will be looking for, we need to be as broad and as comprehensive as possible to better ourselves as a resources, regardless of what is popular or not with most of the viewers. That's what excites me as a resource is that we get better every day, even if a lot of the new articles are crap, the amount of decent work coming in every day is continuing to build us. The problem is that the task needed to improve most of our existing articles is too tremendous. For me a decent verifiable sourced stubs with clear facts are more valuable than unsourced long ranting articles devoid of clear focus and structure and needing a good scrub.. ♦ Dr. ☠ Blofeld 00:31, 27 January 2013 (UTC)

Thank you both for your philosophical comments -- which I basically share. It's just that I always looked on DYK as a means of bringing attention to items I would consider deserve wider dissemination. I sometimes have a feeling more people look at my user page and the articles I am preparing in my sandboxes than at the articles created on the main page. Anyway, as you say, it is certainly satisfying to know that topics are being covered for those who need to research them. As for the improvement of older articles, it is indeed a huge problem. It's not an easy job to do either, particularly in cases where a string of sources are included but without any inline references. I've spent hours on Acropolis of Athens, trying to resource the article as I do not have the books used as a source years ago. It frequently takes me far longer to try to add missing inline references in such cases than to write a comprehensive new article from scratch. I think one of the reasons the standard of new articles is improving is that the online resources are also getting much better -- and it is easier to access them than it used to be. --Ipigott (talk) 07:33, 27 January 2013 (UTC)

Yes, back in 2006 and 2007 the lack of sources available was terrible on developing world topics, most of my new articles were unsourced actually. Sources will continue to improve, google to date has scanned about 22 million books I think out of an intended 130 million. We'll definitely continue to see more hits in google books on topics in the developing world.♦ Dr. ☠ Blofeld 11:24, 27 January 2013 (UTC)

Thanks for the Rio edits. Can you proof Tesker from German when you have a moment?♦ Dr. ☠ Blofeld 19:41, 27 January 2013 (UTC)

I know you spent time in Canada so maybe John Treadwell (miner) would interest you. No worries if you're working on other things. --Rosiestep (talk) 05:24, 29 January 2013 (UTC)

DYK for St. Peter, Syburg

Casliber (talk · contribs) 00:02, 28 January 2013 (UTC)

Thanks for your input on this, hope you enjoyed it. Thanks for you additions to Tesker too. Tenhemad I think is GA worthy, I must get around to nominating Marrakech this week too. ♦ Dr. ☠ Blofeld 13:23, 28 January 2013 (UTC)

The church of St Peter (I mustn't say St Peter's Church) was indeed interesting. One of these days, I might get around to Syburg which has quite an interesting (if related) history too. You really do seem to have done a pretty good job on Tenhemad. I'll take a closer look later. You should of course nominate Marrakech too. On Tesker, it might be worthwhile expanding on some of the tribes. It took me some time to find English equivalents for those mentioned in the German article which were certainly taken from French. It's always exciting to see where you are going next while I keep wandering around Denmark or Luxembourg! "Broadening the mind", as they say. --Ipigott (talk) 18:28, 28 January 2013 (UTC)

Thanks. Well, my goal of course is high quality article coverage anywhere on google maps. Like you zoom in on some village in the Sahara desert and we have a decent article on it, that's always been my goal. Douz certainly looks an interesting place. Unfortunately the task is tremendous to get even existing articles up to scratch let alone the missing content. But we're doing pretty much as well as we can. Marrakech could do with trimming some of the landmarks I think before nom. Can you check Corubal River from French, history is from Portuguese. ♦ Dr. ☠ Blofeld 20:26, 28 January 2013 (UTC)

All this tomorrow. See also my comments on your translation initiative. I think the comments are generally pointing in the right direction. --Ipigott (talk) 22:38, 28 January 2013 (UTC)

I have a visitor on my talk page which might interest you.♦ Dr. ☠ Blofeld 23:04, 28 January 2013 (UTC)

As far as I can see, it is usually written Ten Hamadi (rather than Tenhamadi). Also wonder whether the tribe should not be Ulad Nasser in English. I've done a quick ce. --Ipigott (talk) 10:12, 29 January 2013 (UTC)

The official document spells in Tenhemadi I think, I'll see what Aymatth thinks. When I mentioned the article I wasn't asking you to copyedit it or improve it, it wasn't intended as a hint! Neither was Douz. Just to alert your attention to the type of article! Thanks though! Corubal on the other hand is a request!♦ Dr. ☠ Blofeld 10:27, 29 January 2013 (UTC)

Went through Corubal but could not find your source for the hydrometry section. --Ipigott (talk) 15:08, 29 January 2013 (UTC)

[2]♦ Dr. ☠ Blofeld 17:01, 29 January 2013 (UTC)

N'Guelbély

You created an article at this title yesterday, but I have deleted it because it was a redirect to itself. Letting you know so that you can do whatever it was your really meant to do there. Regards, JohnCD (talk) 19:52, 29 January 2013 (UTC)

After some coffee, I am slightly more awake, and realise you probably meant it to redirect to N'Guelbely, so I've done that. JohnCD (talk) 19:58, 29 January 2013 (UTC)

Thanks for your patience, JohnCD. I probably could have done with more coffee myself at the time. --Ipigott (talk) 21:43, 29 January 2013 (UTC)

Can you proof :N'Guelbély. It is customary to redirect to diuretics actually.♦ Dr. ☠ Blofeld 23:08, 29 January 2013 (UTC)

Hello there. There is a citation tag on Frederik V on Horseback. Can you please add an inline citation in its place so that the dyk nom process can continue? Thx --Rosiestep (talk) 02:22, 30 January 2013 (UTC)

Grønningen led me to starting Den Frie Udstilling. --Rosiestep (talk) 05:02, 30 January 2013 (UTC)

Agree... if you can't find a ref to support content translated from a foreign language wiki article, then removing the content is best. I just nomed; Jais Nielsen. Thanks for the citation fixes for Frederik V on Horseback. --Rosiestep (talk) 03:31, 31 January 2013 (UTC)

Hello again. I nomed Den Frie Udstilling and started Harald Slott-Møller. No worries if you're busy with other things. --Rosiestep (talk) 06:42, 1 February 2013 (UTC)

Did you proof N'Guelbely afterwards? Can you check Kollafjørður?♦ Dr. ☠ Blofeld 11:35, 1 February 2013 (UTC)

Hi there. There's a lengthy comment at the Ved Vejen dyk nom page. If you can address some of the issues, that would be great: "An interesting article. I'm okay on the nomination slippage, someone once gave me a similar break on one of my DYKs. Article length, neutrality okay. Image in public domain, I guess (US law versus Danish?) Sourcing had some issues with careless misattributions from Google Books - don't credit editors alone, find the writers of individual chapters and entries! I've fixed up the English ones, but one of the article editors needs to double-check the Danish ones. Hook length and interest point is okay, if a bit awkwardly worded to my ear, but the article text behind it is problematic: "It is not just Bang's portrayal of a bygone provincial world that seems so typically Danish but his mastery in making the hidden pain of loneliness so meaningful to today's readership." When is the story set, compared to when it was written? Is it typically Danish to portray bygone worlds, or to write in a way that readers a century later find the work meaningful, or both? Is this a direct quote (translated) from the Culture Canon text, or a looser paraphrase?" Thx --Rosiestep (talk) 17:21, 2 February 2013 (UTC)

Medical translation efforts

Blofeld mentioned you might be interested in this effort [3] Doc James (talk · contribs · email) (if I write on your page reply on mine) 20:14, 30 January 2013 (UTC)

Grundtvig

You've moved him to a typo! Not sure what's the best way to disentangle this now: too late at night for me. PamD 23:51, 30 January 2013 (UTC)

Further: I had wondered how, as a non-admin (I think) you'd managed to make the move, given that there is an incoming redirect with edit history at the version I'd proposed to move to (N.F.S. Grundtvig) and also at the variant of that with extra spaces between the initials: I see now that you managed to do the move because you were moving it to a misspelled version. I think if we now just wait for the move discussion to formally close, then an admin who watches WP:RM will move it for us. There are incoming redirects from all variant forms of forenames/initials. I had proposed it as a "possibly controversial move" because there had been previous discussion about the page name - around 6 years ago it seems to have swapped between various versions - so by the letter of the rules wasn't just an "uncontroversial move" (although I don't expect anyone to oppose it). PamD 00:03, 31 January 2013 (UTC)

Sorry about this. Looks as if we are both guilty of misspelling the name. In my case I was trying to do too much late at night. Let's hope it will be sorted out during the day. The whole business of Danish names is quite a problem as many are in fact used with full Christian names in English, even in cases where they are just initialled in Danish. Sorry too that you found the cultural canon such as mess. I based it on the Norwegian and Russian versions (both FAs) in the absence of a similar illustrated list in Danish. --Ipigott (talk) 07:32, 31 January 2013 (UTC)

We aren't there yet - Maunus said "Fixed", but didn't move the article page! I've dropped them a note.

My point about the being an admin (I read it before you deleted) was that it wasn't possible just to move the page to my chosen new title because that was already occupied by a redirect, and although a non-admin can move a page to a title occupied by a redirect which has not been edited since it was created, any redirect which has an edit history cannot be overwritten like this except by an admin. But, as I said, I also read the rules at WP:RM and concluded that this wasn't officially eligible to be moved as an uncontroversial move without discussion, as there had been past discussion about the page name, albeit 6 years ago.

I hadn't noticed that you were the main editor of the Canon piece. I found the treatment of the Anthology confusing, and think I've clarified it. I'm not sure the illustrated list works very well - it means that the list entries are very spread out vertically, so it's difficult for anyone to see the contents of any one section without a lot of scrolling: the Danish version seems clearer perhaps? But the Featured Article folk obviously disagree! PamD 08:29, 31 January 2013 (UTC)

There is also the template Template:Danish Culture Canon but some have found this equally confusing. Personally I think an illustrated list (especially for architecture and the visual arts) is much more informative than text alone. No doubt substantial improvements could be made to the design of the list but I'll leave that to the experts. I am actually more interested in developing the content and am glad to see we have a new participant in Ujkiol. BTW Lyrikantologi simply means Anthology of lyrics -- it is not a published work in its own right. I am not sure, however, that we use "lyrics" for folk songs and hymns in English. --Ipigott (talk) 08:45, 31 January 2013 (UTC)

I've had a look at the template - perhaps there again the 24 items in the anthology need to be treated somehow differently to show their status, rather than having equal weight with each of the 12 items in other sections? Otherwise literature gets undue prominence, with 35 choices compared to the 12 for each other area. On music, I don't think "Score music" is an English term (well, not in my personal version of UK English). "Classical music" perhaps? I certainly use "lyrics" for folk songs and hymns, the only alternative being "the words" ("Where can I find the words of Jerusalem?" - but I'd Google "Jerusalem lyrics"). PamD 09:12, 31 January 2013 (UTC)

I used "score music" as a translation of their "partiturmusik" which actually means sheet music or music that has been written down. I think they chose it so that they could include folk songs and more modern compositions as well as the striclty classical pieces. But maybe "classical" (at least as an explanation) would assist the English reader. And from what you say, we could have an "Anthology of lyrics".

As for giving undue weight to the anthologies (in both the literature and music sections), I suppose it would be possible to used downsized subtables (perhaps with narrower columns and small text). In the original canon, the lyrics were just listed in a box from 1 to 24 with the name of the piece and the author, while the 12 individual Højskolesange (Folk High School Songs) and the 12 evergreens are included as footnotes at the end of the document. (For details see here.) If you are good at frigging around with tables and nav boxes, by all means go ahead and make the changes you feel are necessary. In the meantime, I have split the literature table into two. --Ipigott (talk) 10:43, 31 January 2013 (UTC)

Yes, been George and I we soon whipped it into shape, a pity more info isn't available on local customs and buildings though. First GA on Mauritania to my knowledge..♦ Dr. ☠ Blofeld 21:22, 2 February 2013 (UTC)

DYK for Arsenal de la Carraca

 — Crisco 1492 (talk) 16:03, 2 February 2013 (UTC)

Re: A well deserved barnstar

Thanks very much for the barnstar! The metadata that Google Books shows is often incorrect or misleading, so it is always worthwhile to check the title pages of the book (which are usually available) and see the real thing.

The sourcing issues notwithstanding, I did like the Ved Vejen article. I used to work for a Danish company and went there several times so I have a fondness for Danish subject matter.

I also responded to your separate point at Talk:Hillary Rodham Clinton's tenure as Secretary of State#Improve the lead. Wasted Time R (talk) 02:09, 3 February 2013 (UTC)

Harald Slott-Møller

Hi there. Actually, it was I who created this one... think I left you a note about it a few days ago. :) --Rosiestep (talk) 17:07, 3 February 2013 (UTC)

LOL. Can you proof Postage stamps and postal history of Mali?♦ Dr. ☠ Blofeld 17:59, 3 February 2013 (UTC)

Sorry about that, he was literally in too much of a frenzy.♦ Dr. ☠ Blofeld 23:49, 3 February 2013 (UTC)

I think I managed to get it back to where it should be. Have a look. Maybe it needs more refs and wls. Can you handle it. Quite busy at the moment. I'll see what I can do with Brattingsborg. --Ipigott (talk) 11:11, 4 February 2013 (UTC)

Thanks, dug out my stamp catalogues to help source! I could probably add a bit more look at issues by year up to 2004 and try to mention more notable ones, we'll see. I nominated the Faroes article Kollafjørður. although could use a few more sources, can you find a source to support the nave 25 year old drowning hook?. just stub sorting and noticed Priory Church, El Puerto de Santa María which might interest you, can you translate from Spanish wiki?♦ Dr. ☠ Blofeld 17:20, 4 February 2013 (UTC)

Try Brattingsborg.♦ Dr. ☠ Blofeld 23:57, 3 February 2013 (UTC)

In my day, it was Stanley Gibbons I think. Will look again at Kollefjord, etc. --Ipigott (talk) 20:50, 4 February 2013 (UTC)

Still is yup, I have the 2004 edition, in total the 4 volumes are almost 5000 pages.♦ Dr. ☠ Blofeld 21:53, 4 February 2013 (UTC)

Started Whalsay Parish Church, zoom in at google street view level here. That's a great location for a church! It looks like an islet on satellite view but at ground level it seems more a point, I think it is more an islet and the road was built across shallow water. Not sure if that land is called Kirk Ness or the sea around it, can you look into it? ♦ Dr. ☠ Blofeld 11:48, 5 February 2013 (UTC)

They seem to call it an isthmus. I have seen it referred to as Kirk Ness and North Ness. Shetlopedia calls it Kirk Ness (here). The church is sometimes called Ness Kirk. Your friends at Geograph have uploaded several good photos including one of the interior. Perhaps you can transfer one or two of them to commons for use in the article. I think the one of the interior certainly deserves inclusion. --Ipigott (talk) 13:54, 5 February 2013 (UTC)

Yes, I had already uploaded one, just seeing your message now. Great job! The interior photo should also be uploaded and perhaps the memorial image. Will DYK nom tomorrow. Started Gossabrough on Yell, really valuable this sort of content I think, and having so many images available is amazing, if only we had this sort of thing on a world scale and for Denmark etc!♦ Dr. ☠ Blofeld 18:52, 5 February 2013 (UTC)

Wow, I like the Panton chair, all it needs now is a Danish blonde sitting seductively on it a-la Sharon Stone hehe!! Torre de los Adalides might interest you, final paragraph on Spanish wiki needs translating about destruction in 1898, could use more sources. Siege of Algeciras and Battle of Rio Pulmones I think are very notable but not yet covered.♦ Dr. ☠ Blofeld 23:19, 5 February 2013 (UTC)

Maybe I should include a section on "Exotic appeal" based on this, this or this? Unfortuntely all the images are copyright but perhaps the first source could be listed under External links. Then you could develop an appropriate DYK hook?? I'll work on it. --Ipigott (talk) 09:44, 6 February 2013 (UTC)

It's a sexy chair!♦ Dr. ☠ Blofeld 11:35, 6 February 2013 (UTC)

Think I've spent enough time on it now. I'll move on to something else. --Ipigott (talk) 11:38, 6 February 2013 (UTC)

Try Museo municipal de Algeciras, can you proof?♦ Dr. ☠ Blofeld 15:04, 6 February 2013 (UTC)

Proof is a euphamism. Translate was probably what you meant. I have not researched the citations - no more time, I'm afraid. Can't understand why the link to the Spanish wiki is not displaying (it works the other way round). --Ipigott (talk) 17:54, 6 February 2013 (UTC)

Tomorrow, I'll follow-up on Ujkiol's articles, which you mentioned a few days ago. --Rosiestep (talk) 06:10, 8 February 2013 (UTC)

I looked at Ujkiol articles last night and added an EL to one, but couldn't find much in en language for the others. I nomed Gedser wind turbine; interesting article‎. --Rosiestep (talk) 16:55, 9 February 2013 (UTC)

I have added an infobox and some text to this Torre de los Adalides. If it is to be nominated can you kindly suggest a hook which is well referenced.--Nvvchar. 17:24, 9 February 2013 (UTC)

Adalid: The translation to "counter" came by way of the es wiki article; I'll remove it. --Rosiestep (talk) 00:42, 10 February 2013 (UTC)

I read some articles you recently started, The Great Relief, Sommerdag ved Roskilde Fjord, Støvkornenes dans i solstrålerne, and Efterårsmorgen ved Sortedamssøen and wanted to say good job. --Rosiestep (talk) 03:24, 10 February 2013 (UTC)

Please this Museo municipal de Algeciras. May be ready for nomination for DYK.--Nvvchar. 17:39, 10 February 2013 (UTC)

I do not remember to have mentioned it as a listed monument. The coordinates need to be checked as the site appears to be lying in the sea. Thanks.--Nvvchar. 02:34, 11 February 2013 (UTC)

Thanks for correcting me and letting me know the correct infobox for museums.--Nvvchar. 07:25, 11 February 2013 (UTC)

Thank you so much for your kind note; much appreciated. Regarding Ved Vejen: I've never put through a GA by myself, but Dr. B has. However, if you aren't interested in giving it any more attention, you aren't obligated to put out the effort for expansion/translation. Hope this helps. --Rosiestep (talk) 03:24, 12 February 2013 (UTC)

Sorry for the misunderstanding on my part. --Rosiestep (talk) 15:27, 12 February 2013 (UTC)

Nommed Ved Vejen.♦ Dr. ☠ Blofeld 16:41, 12 February 2013 (UTC)

Thanks. Let me know if I need to do anything about it.--Ipigott (talk) 16:50, 12 February 2013 (UTC)

I've stubbed Niels Ingwersen ‎and Det Schubotheske Forlag, you might add a little flesh to them, I have a fair few Nvv-Rosie articles to catch up on.♦ Dr. ☠ Blofeld 16:53, 12 February 2013 (UTC)

Every little helps. Will look at them later. Now working on the tea service.--Ipigott (talk) 16:56, 12 February 2013 (UTC)

Milk, two sugars and a Digestive biscuit please.♦ Dr. ☠ Blofeld 17:13, 12 February 2013 (UTC)

Can you pl find some text to add to this Harhoog from German book sources. Thanks.--Nvvchar. 10:39, 15 February 2013 (UTC)

Yes, mostly these two urls [4] which has many links on the left side which I translated and used. and also from this [5]. Book references have snippets which I used after translation.--Nvvchar. 16:34, 15 February 2013 (UTC)

Thanks. The text is now reduced and can not be posted on DYK. If more text can not be found it is fine. At least the article is now complete.--Nvvchar. 16:57, 15 February 2013 (UTC)

As I have posted it on DYK then I will withdraw it in view of your observations. What do you suggest. I think I should not venture into translated versions of articles. I don't remember to have keep a record of the translations in file as I can not even find the file of the article.--Nvvchar. 08:46, 16 February 2013 (UTC)

Thanks. As your interest is also in Architecture, you may like to add to this Musgum dwelling units. If you feel the article title could be changed to Musgum mud architecture. I will be adding more in the evening.--Nvvchar. 09:15, 16 February 2013 (UTC)

• Thank you very much. I find that you have deleted the legend aspect about Turkish war and the Roman knights. I have added your name to the credit list. The article has been reviewed and I have cropped the img as suggested by the reviewer and also accepted the Alt hook.--Nvvchar. 16:15, 16 February 2013 (UTC)

DYK for Ved Vejen

Nyttend (talk · contribs) 08:02, 5 February 2013 (UTC)

DYK for Corubal River

Nyttend (talk · contribs) 08:06, 9 February 2013 (UTC)

DYK for Cheche Disaster

Nyttend (talk · contribs) 08:07, 9 February 2013 (UTC)

DYK for Viggo Stuckenberg

Lord Roem ~ (talk) 16:05, 9 February 2013 (UTC)

DYK for Jason with the Golden Fleece (Thorvaldsen)

Carabinieri (talk) 16:02, 10 February 2013 (UTC)

DYK for Frederik V on Horseback

Materialscientist (talk) 08:21, 11 February 2013 (UTC)

DYK for Jais Nielsen

Materialscientist (talk) 03:44, 12 February 2013 (UTC)

Acropolis

What you describe has happened to a number of articles. Possibly the Architecture article is the most significant. Someone wrote it very early and didn't bother to reference it. By the time I came on the scene they had gone. I inherited it in a state where it was well conceived and mostly very well written apart from additions by other writers that didn't fit at all. I re-jigged it to make it consistent and have attempted to maintain it, which has been difficult.

I am of the opinion that articles of that sort need to be covered by a grandfather clause. It is now almost impossible to reference because of the way it is nuanced. If it was a straightfoward architectural history, it would be easy.

A few years back, some lecturer of architecture decided to give his students the job of rewriting the article, as practice. was pretty annoyed. It's fine to do this with an inadequate article, but not with one that is extremely concise, to the point, well-written and balanced. The students, of course, saw only what was missing. Instantly each of them added a paragraph on their favourite architect. Frank Lloyd Wright nearly took over the article, plus whatever green project they were studying in their assignments.

I tried to head them off in the direction of History of architecture which was in a deplorable state, and suggested that he allocate a section to each student.

Anyway, every now and then, some useful person comes along and tweak the article in a manner consistent with the way it was written in the first place. But almost all the edits, even those that add solid material, have a negative effect, because of the way the article is balanced. If you check out the ratings on that article, you'll find that it scores very much higher than most articles do. All over 4.

Another case in point is Cathedral. It was well written, but then over-balanced by info about the church in England, which I carved off into a new article (and left for others to deal with). It is mostly consistent and useful, but seriously under referenced. Part of it is my problem, because there are simply too few articles to draw from that define what a cathedral is and does, in global terms.

As for Acropolis, well, I can take a look. Most of my sources (real books) are rather old. I have a person asking for help over Wells Cathedral and I feel slack about not obliging. Medieval and Early Renaissance are my real thing, although I have studied Classical archaeology. I'm rather proud of this one: Romanesque secular and domestic architecture as it was created out of mere scraps gleaned from numerous sources. I think it may be the only work in English to deal specifically with this subject.

My interest in Denmark all goes back to a girl called Linda Petersen. She migrated to Australia nearly 60 years ago with her parents, and then tragically, her mother died (in childbirth I think). They moved from the village and I never saw her again. However, she had described to me her beautiful city of Copenhagen, the quayside buildings with the long rays of the evening sun glowing on their facades, the statue of Hans Christian Andersen, the Royal palace, the Tivoli gardens and the Little Mermaid sitting on her rock. It must have been a very strange life for her, living in a caravan park in the shadow of the Blue Mountains, with the weird sounds of the Australian bush and an old wooden bridge over the river that rumbled whenever a truck went over it. Anyway, I promised Linda Petersen that one day I would go to Copenhagen, and I did.

But, meanwhile, I was brought up on "East of the Sun and West of the Moon". I inherited a painting of the Danish Golden Age from my grandmother (who got it from a sea captain). And for years looked longingly at Royal Copenhagen ceramics in the window of David Jones. When an uncle gave me money as my 21st birthday present I went straight out and bought the particular pot that I had my eye on.

Anyway, my younger son and I went to Copenhagen for 4 days, when he was 7. It poured with rain for three of them, and we spent those days riding around on the hop-on-hop-off buses, one of which leaked so badly that the floor was awash with inches of water that slopped up to your knees every time the bus stopped at a light. On the third evening, the sun came out most gloriously! The quay was just the way Linda had described it! We never made it to the Tivoli. However, we did the museums in considerable detail, as you can imagine.

I like sorting out new articles that go up for DYK. This particular article caught my eye. Mostly I work on large generic articles, but it can be exhausting. I gotta look at Wells before the Acropolis. Amandajm (talk) 01:17, 13 February 2013 (UTC)

De Tretten

I notice that you use the second person when referring to the person that might work on this topic i.e. "you", rather than "I".

Ipigott, I do not speak even two words of Danish. Well, once upon a time Linda taught me how to count to ten, but I have forgotten. Let me be straight: if anyone is going to write that article, it is you, not I.

Now, I have just got out all my nice books on Medieval England, and I will see what I can do with Wells Cathedral.

Oh, you asked me about putting up Romanesque domestic architecture for FA. It's not worth the process.

With a monograph on a single work or artist, the process is relatively easy, unless the person is as major as Leonardo or Beethoven, or the work is as major as Gone with the Wind or the Eiffel Tower. With something famous, every man (woman and child) and their dog wants to buy into it. They all know at least one fact, so they all think they are experts. The biggest single problem that one encounters is that the editors that buy into the FA process are often "style police". They know the Wikipedia Manual of style backwards, and have great difficulty dealing with anything that doesn't conform to it.

The biggest arguments are over matters of POV (point of view), Original Research, and Peacock language. The problem is that it can be very hard to get these people to recognise appropriate critical assessment. The rule is that one does not use "flamboyant" language. Words like "famous" and "unique" are ruled out. Generally, the ruling is correct. But in describing Leonardo da Vinci, (or Marilyn Monroe), one needs to talk in terms of "fame". A discussion of their fame is essential to an understanding of the role that they play in the culture of our society. But I have had very lengthy arguments with several editors over whether the word "famous" ought to be used in the discussion of Leonardo. It can be hard to explain that he and Michelangelo tower head and shoulders over every other artist that has ever lived, in terms of the fame that they command, or that it is inappropriate to force words like "is considered" into sentences where they don't belong. One must say "The Mona Lisa is the most famous portrait ever painted", not "The Mona Lisa is considered the most famous portrait ever painted". It either is or isn't famous; there is no "considered" about it! Likewise, I have had a lengthy argument with someone who knows nothing about architecture over whether the word "unique" ought to be used to describe the Sagrada Familia.

With a subject like Romanesque domestic architecture, very few people on Wikipedia know anything useful. Editors that are accustomed to dealing with relatively narrow topics have difficulty getting their brains around the requirement of a generic article. The immediate outcry is "Delete all those pictures! They are available on Wikimedia Commons, if anyone wants to look at them." But the fact that one can create such galleries and write careful statements that point out the comparative features is a fantastic bonus that we have in this encyclopedia. It lifts it beyond what one usually finds in a book. (Although my old Larousse Encyclopedia of Medieval Art is illustrated in exactly the same way, with rows of black and white photos, each with substantial text.) Basically, I don't want to have to argue about this sort of stuff! This article: Architecture of cathedrals and great churches is so much enjoyed by people who read it that from time to time they send me messages about it! I really like that!

The other problem is that when you put articles up for FA, well-meaning people come along and do exactly what I did to poor Jais Nielsen, they get it between their teeth and shake it! The most usual thing is that people with real editorial skill, but little knowledge of the subject, try to simplify things, e.g. "You are talking about Leonardo da Vinci's horse here. There is no need to mention Verrocchio's horse or Donatello's horse." Any editor who knew anything about the subject would realise there was a straight-line connection between the three. Not to mention them would be like writing about the dome of St Peter's without mentioning the Pantheon or Brunelleschi.

Actually I have shaken up quite a large number of articles myself, but I try to keep it to simply reorganising sentences, or re-combining facts more logically, so that when the original editor comes back, they can still find the drawer that has their socks. Sometimes the best thing to do with large messy contentious article is to organise them and put in some clear sub-headings so that people can write about the contentious issues without treading on each others toes. See James I and Anglican Diocese of Sydney. These are both potentially contentious articles where things settled down as soon as people had the right sub-headings to contain their arguments.

I might try the FA process with something smaller. Wells Cathedral, maybe?

Amandajm (talk) 11:29, 13 February 2013 (UTC)

OK! On Wells, I have been asked to write about the architecture, specifically, so I'm leaving the history to the locals! Happily!

I adore Wells Cathedral! My first visit was absolutely magical..... sigh! Amandajm (talk) 12:35, 13 February 2013 (UTC)

Notification of discussion

A few months ago, you participated in a discussion on Wikipedia talk:Did you know about Gibraltar-related DYKs on the Main Page. I am proposing that the temporary restrictions on such DYKs, which were imposed in September 2012, should be lifted and have set out a case for doing so at Wikipedia talk:Did you know/Gibraltar-related DYKs. If you have a view on this, please comment at that page. Prioryman (talk) 22:07, 13 February 2013 (UTC)

Triffic!

Can I suggest that you start with the remaining red link in the Jais Nielsen article? I'm busy with Wells Cathedral! Amandajm (talk) 12:55, 16 February 2013 (UTC)

Notification of DYK ban proposal

Following your recent work on Municipal Museum of Algeciras, which has been nominated for the Did you know? section on the Main Page, there is currently a proposal to ban similar articles concerning a large area of southern Andalusia from DYK for a year. If you have a view on this proposal, please see Wikipedia talk:Did you know/Gibraltar-related DYKs‎#Proposal for one-year moratorium on Gibraltarpedia DYKs. Prioryman (talk) 14:54, 16 February 2013 (UTC)

Royal Copenhagen plaquettes

Did you know that on June 7, 2007, my Day4 on wikipedia, I created the article Royal Copenhagen 2010 plaquettes as I've collected them for years but couldn't read about them on wikipedia? Just a piece of trivia I thought I'd share with you. :) --Rosiestep (talk) 22:16, 16 February 2013 (UTC)

I think we should create an article on the annual Christmas plates. As several manufacturers have been creating them, what would you suggest for the article name? I'm thinking maybe Annual Christmas plates but would like your input if you have an opinion on this. --Rosiestep (talk) 04:38, 18 February 2013 (UTC)

Danish Christmas plates - started it. I'm not sure how much info there is on this topic but I think we need an article on it. BTW, my view on article suggestions by others is that I work on the ones which interest me and kindly say I'm busy with other articles (or with RL) on other occasions. --Rosiestep (talk) 03:56, 19 February 2013 (UTC)

DYK for Municipal Museum of Algeciras

 — Crisco 1492 (talk) 23:09, 16 February 2013 (UTC)

And Gibraltar says "hey thanks guys, we had 28 and a third new tourists catching a night flight to Gibraltar last night after seeing this as a DYK"♦ Dr. ☠ Blofeld 08:42, 17 February 2013 (UTC)

In view of recent assertions that it is quite unreasonable to have so many articles on little Gibraltar, I think we should give serious attention to toning down the entire Wikipedia coverage of Disneyland, including the 95 articles included in the related templates: template:Disneyland and template:Disneyland Resort, (not to mention all the wikilinks in the two related main articles). It is quite unacceptable that an area of only 160 acres should have such dense Wikipedia coverage, amounting to some 0.59 articles per acre. Gibraltar, which covers an area of 1,680 acres, has only 743 articles (many of which are not strictly speaking about Gibraltar itself), giving only about 0.44 articles per acre. And most of them are academic (history, economics, etc.); the visitor attractions account for only 20 of them. --Ipigott (talk) 11:03, 17 February 2013 (UTC)

Indeed! Oh, time to ignore it I think, the proposal won't get anywhere, I've made my point but unlikely Andreas will change his view.. The museum article went through with no problems. Can you proof Plaza Alta (Algeciras)?♦ Dr. ☠ Blofeld 13:30, 17 February 2013 (UTC)

Thanks. The article in now in the lead. --Nvvchar. 17:38, 17 February 2013 (UTC)

Plaza Alta now finished, I think. Maybe Dr. B would like to reintroduce the refs -- they are the same as for the Spanish article. Quite a detailed history for a square in the provinces. I imagine many similar Spanish avenues and squares have been through similar processes of name changes. --Ipigott (talk) 14:20, 18 February 2013 (UTC)

Super, thanks for that, good job on the Austrian article too!! I've started Iglesia de Nuestra Señora de la Palma which could be DYKed with the square, seems natural. I did look to start Jorgen Rasmussen from the culture canon, googling him I came back to the article on the engineer with, please correct if it isn't him and is a different chap.‎ ♦ Dr. ☠ Blofeld 14:49, 18 February 2013 (UTC)

You've started an article on another famous Jørgen Rasmussen. Ours is a designer/architect born 26 April 1931 and probably still living. If I can find a few minutes today or tomorrow, I will at least make a start on his biography. Like you, I noticed work was needed on Iglesia de Nuestra Señora de la Palma but I am pretty busy will all kinds of other things at the moment. Can't you get help from all those Gibraltarians who should not only be fluent in Spanish but familiar with the place itself? If not, I'll try to help out in a day or two. If I had had more time, I would have expanded on the Slovene aspects of Feistritz. As in many villages in the south of Austria (which I know quite well) the population is ethnically Slovene, some 7% of them actually speaking Slovene. There's probably quite a bit from Slovene sources. Perhaps I'll get back to it when we are not so rushed.--Ipigott (talk) 18:13, 18 February 2013 (UTC)

The thought had occurred to me but as it's a church and architecture I thought you'd be more enthusiastic...♦ Dr. ☠ Blofeld 21:55, 18 February 2013 (UTC)

Can you look into the reviewer's comments here Template:Did you know nominations/Kollafjørður as it is a translation issue.--Nvvchar. 07:46, 22 February 2013 (UTC)

Thank you. I have posted the alt hook.--Nvvchar. 12:16, 22 February 2013 (UTC)

I nomed Iglesia de Nuestra Señora de la Palma and Plaza Alta (Algeciras). --Rosiestep (talk) 03:32, 23 February 2013 (UTC)

I added your alt. I've got WikiProject Women's History watchlisted and I will participate. --Rosiestep (talk) 16:23, 23 February 2013 (UTC)

Awesome! I'll look at it later this weekend then. --Rosiestep (talk) 20:46, 23 February 2013 (UTC)

If you can think of an ALT, please let me know as a reviewer on the nom page states there are issues with this hook: ... that the first exhibition of Den Frie Udstilling (pictured) featured artists such as Peder Severin Krøyer and Kristian Zahrtmann who were among the greatest painters of the period? --Rosiestep (talk) 00:27, 24 February 2013 (UTC)

• Thank you for your alt suggestions. I suggested both as both are <201 characters, in case the reviewer fancies one over another. I looked at List of women photographers and my first thought was "this list is way too short... let's expand it!". --Rosiestep (talk) 18:27, 24 February 2013 (UTC)

You're a funny guy. The other day you were moaning about not having the time to edit Danish articles. I back off and you venture into women photographers of all topics..♦ Dr. ☠ Blofeld 20:10, 24 February 2013 (UTC)

It wasn't so much the Danish articles, it was the Spanish. When you were asking me to do three of four Spanish translations in quick succession, I was actually trying to get through the red links on De Tretten. Before that I had been ploughing through the red links on Danish Culture Canon. When I had completed most of all that, I was ready to start on something else. I have always been supportive of the role of women in the arts. Last year I spent a couple of months contributing to women in architecture, this year it's women in photography (my choice). So it's not really so surprising. If you look back over my contributions to Wikipedia, you'll see that I've spent quite a bit of time trying to assist worthy causes, like your translations, and quite often encouraging bright young women to assert themselves on Wikipedia. One was Sarah Sierch a year or two ago with her early biographies. As a result, thanks to Sarah, I also became involved in Women's History Week last year and, partly as a result of Sarah's recent appearance in DYK, I decided to do the same this year. I used to spend quite a bit of my Wikipedia time on photography but haven't done much recently. So that's why I thought Women in photography would be a good cause this year. Feel free to join in. You'll see the red links appearing in the "List of women photographers" over the next few days and weeks. If you know of any editors you think might be interested in helping out, let them know too.--Ipigott (talk) 21:57, 24 February 2013 (UTC)

Depends on how notable they are, I could add any female photographer from another wikipedia but i wouldn't know how notable they are.♦ Dr. ☠ Blofeld 14:48, 25 February 2013 (UTC)

Seems to me you can judge the notability of photographers in much the same way as anyone else. If the articles are well-referenced, you can usually check things quite easily. One of the main problems, as always, is that many articles are not referenced and are often no longer than a line or two. Let's just see how it all progresses over the next few days.--Ipigott (talk) 14:59, 25 February 2013 (UTC)

I think the best thing is to start with finding entries, non notables can be routed out over time.♦ Dr. ☠ Blofeld 16:19, 25 February 2013 (UTC)

DYK for Feistritz an der Gail

Carabinieri (talk) 08:02, 18 February 2013 (UTC)

DYK for Gedser wind turbine

Orlady (talk) 16:03, 21 February 2013 (UTC)

A bowl of strawberries for you!

Thank you for your help - if I was looking for a place like Gib then I would say its like Luxembourg. Luxembourg was my first business trip and I enjoyed all the fortifications where (like gib) you could hide an army. Cheers Victuallers (talk) 10:47, 24 February 2013 (UTC)

Greatly appreciated. Just as I like them without sugar and cream. Luxembourg City would be a great place for QR-pediation. And just think of all the language opportunities. Also lots of museums and soon a new national library... --Ipigott (talk) 10:54, 24 February 2013 (UTC)

DYK for Torre de los Adalides

Carabinieri (talk) 16:04, 24 February 2013 (UTC)

DYK for Kollafjørður

Carabinieri (talk) 00:04, 25 February 2013 (UTC)

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Dodgy articles on women photographers

I was so amazed at the potted description within your list of Tuija Lindström that I had to click on the link and take a look.

The article has two "references". One is to a photo, and one appears to be to a non-existent page.

I don't deny that Tuija Lindström is a photographer of some note. But the article doesn't credibly say that she is. (It doesn't credibly say anything.) As I look at the article, I've no particular reason even to think she even exists.

As you may have guessed, I've been clicking on "Category:Whereverian photographers" and looking for female-sounding names and clicking on those articles. The dodgiest of all, I've sent to AfD. (Here, you'll find one or two things of interest, one way or another.) Many more, I've just skipped: the unsourced, the models (etc) who've done a bit of photography on the side, the people whose claims to notability are very minor, etc. I don't think it's a good idea to have this list every person who has an article, no matter how terrible, claiming that she was or is female and a photographer. -- Hoary (talk) 15:01, 25 February 2013 (UTC)

Lindstrim is actually notable.♦ Dr. ☠ Blofeld 15:14, 25 February 2013 (UTC)

Yes, I've found quite a few supporting references such as [this]. My problem at the moment is that I can't do everything myself at one and the same time: update the list, enhance the individual articles, write new articles for the red-listed entries and scan on-line sources at every stage. Maybe some of the articles on female artists are indeed candidates for afd, but our work in connection with women's history month is also an opportunity to check things out and make additions and improvements where necessary. As for references, I have a feeling that when they were originally added, they actually pointed to useful sources. Over the years, they've become dead links.--Ipigott (talk) 15:23, 25 February 2013 (UTC)

@Sorry Dr. B -- we both seem to have found the same recent ref on Lindström.

@Hoary: May I suggest you add the ones you think are dodgy to the talk page of the list. This will provide an opportunity for people to enhance the relevant biography where appropriate or, if not, to remove the names from the list. And btw, I am sure you will be interested to see that Sirkka-Liisa Konttinen has photographed the Coal Coast between Seaham and Hartlepool! I believe you alerted me to her work on Byker some time back.--Ipigott (talk) 15:32, 25 February 2013 (UTC)

Oh yes: here with me right now, I have a copy of her book The Coal Coast. (I think it's quite a rarity, though I should only whisper this within parentheses, in order not to encourage the rapacity of dealers in photobooks.) -- Hoary (talk) 01:40, 26 February 2013 (UTC)

Ved Vejen

Talk:Ved Vejen/GA1.♦ Dr. ☠ Blofeld 16:01, 25 February 2013 (UTC)

I had forgotten all about this. In view of your reply to the reviewer, I am not quite sure how to proceed.--Ipigott (talk) 16:06, 25 February 2013 (UTC)

Emailed.♦ Dr. ☠ Blofeld 16:13, 25 February 2013 (UTC)

If I understood correctly, Ipigott had intended to review the article before I jumped in. If that is the case I will remove that page and Ipi may start reviewing it. Regards.--Tomcat (7) 16:28, 25 February 2013 (UTC)

Ipigott is my co writer of it, I did ask Pyrotec to review it but he was busy. OK let's roll with it, your review seems fair of it. Will try to address over the next few days. ♦ Dr. ☠ Blofeld 16:38, 25 February 2013 (UTC)

Ian, can you find anything more on reception of the novel by critics?♦ Dr. ☠ Blofeld 16:59, 25 February 2013 (UTC)

I'll lool into it.--Ipigott (talk) 17:01, 25 February 2013 (UTC)

Done. The section on the book's reception is now by far the longest in the article! Hope it now makes the grade. Anything else to be done?--Ipigott (talk) 18:17, 25 February 2013 (UTC)

Excellent, surprised you could access papers that old from Denmark online. I've split themes and reception again now. Can you find anything more on the plot?♦ Dr. ☠ Blofeld 18:21, 25 February 2013 (UTC)

Mañana. --Ipigott (talk) 19:00, 25 February 2013 (UTC)

I have added a couple of additional details to the plot. However, the book is only a short novel (some call it a novella), and it really does revolve around the plot as I have described it. I have also added a couple of comments on the review page on the other issues. I don't think it would be a good idea to change the title of the article to Katinka. Any views of your own on this?--Ipigott (talk) 17:51, 26 February 2013 (UTC)

How about getting that sexy chair to GA status?♦ Dr. ☠ Blofeld 20:46, 26 February 2013 (UTC)

Maybe in a week or two. But I really do want to cover women in photography first.--Ipigott (talk) 21:21, 26 February 2013 (UTC)

Palace Hotel

I know you have your hands more than full at the moment but Elekhh has been kind enough to nominate my article on Palace Hotel (Copenhagen) for a DYK. Any chance you might have something to add? If so, as always, don't hesitate to make whatever changes you might find relevant.Ramblersen (talk) 20:07, 25 February 2013 (UTC)

Good article. Nice hotel. I've stayed there myself once or twice.--Ipigott (talk) 21:14, 25 February 2013 (UTC)

Thumb up or down?

He's a bloke, but he's a Dane: Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Peter Lind. Thoughts? -- Hoary (talk) 01:49, 26 February 2013 (UTC)

Looks to me as if he's just publicizing himself under the pseudonym "Fa bene si" (who appeared on both the English and Danish wikis in December to write just these two articles). Fa bene si also produced the image File:Peter lind with Photographic work..jpg. His talk page too is devoted only to Peter Lind and the article we have now is his third attempt. On the more positive side, he does indeed seem to have exhibited at the venues mentioned. See for example this. So perhaps we have to give him the benefit of the doubt although I am usually against including "autobiographies" of artists who are not particularly notable.

When I googled for him, I found two other photographers called Peter Lind, one in the States, the other in Australia. What about those female Japanese photographers you thought were candidates for afd?--Ipigott (talk) 10:50, 26 February 2013 (UTC)

Whatever other charges can be leveled at Fa bene si, an exclusive interest in Peter Lind isn't one of them. See this. (Oh yes, this is a female photographer. But when I contemplate the "gallery", I wish I were instead looking at stuff by, say, Helen Levitt.) Female Japanese photographers (or not) who are eligible for AfD? One's already there: Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Kaoru Yamaoka. But any surplus time and energy for AfD matters I think I should devote to [[6]]. -- Hoary (talk) 00:32, 27 February 2013 (UTC)

DYK for Rio Grande da Serra

Carabinieri (talk) 08:03, 27 February 2013 (UTC)

Women photographers

I'll see what I can come up with. Amandajm (talk) 08:05, 27 February 2013 (UTC)

This site has photos by Norah McManus [7]

Norah lived at Wallacia most of her life and must have been about 90 when she died. Wallacia was a popular tourist destination as it was on the Nepean River and had lots of guest houses, a golf club, riding school, bowling club and a beautiful Mock Tudor style hotel. Norah took photographs all around the area for sale, and also processed photos for other people. In the 1990s her house burnt out, but i believe that all her photos and photographic equipment were in a room adjacent to the veranda on the other side to the blaze.

Amandajm (talk) 09:22, 27 February 2013 (UTC)

Hedda Morrison, big collection in the Powerhouse museum [8]

Kate Geraghty, SMH [9]

Ruby Spowart, [10]

Nicole Jackson [11]

Alice Bennett [12]

Amy Magnisalis [13]

Janet Craig [14]

Amandajm (talk) 09:42, 27 February 2013 (UTC)

There is some written information on Norah somewhere. I can't locate it online. I wonder where it is. Amandajm (talk) 13:29, 27 February 2013 (UTC)

By coincidence I just saw this docu about Polly Borland, [15] [16], which might be of interest to you. --ELEKHH^T 23:02, 27 February 2013 (UTC)

Excellent suggestion, Elekhh. I've put together a short piece about her. Please let me know of any other "coincidences".--Ipigott (talk) 13:47, 28 February 2013 (UTC)

Ruby Spowart

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"In" or "on"?

You can by down AND out in Paris and London but are you in OR on Falster and Bornholm? I excavated and uploaded the list of churches on Falster which I had deleted from my sandbox a while back since I thought you had already uploaded it. However, I did so as List of churches in Falster while I placed the similar list on Bornholm under List of churches on Bornholm. Obviously one of them should be redirected but which one?Ramblersen (talk) 14:47, 28 February 2013 (UTC)

Thanks for your efforts, Ramblersen. I had indeed intended to upload the list after I had completed articles on most of the churches but must have forgotten. Strictly speaking, you should say "on Falster", just as you say "on Skye" (because it's an island) but I'm afraid English usage is not always grammatically correct. If you take Manhatten, for instance, you'll see that nearly everyone says "in Manhatten". As you know, the Danes and Germans always say "on Falster" (på Falster, auf Falster), so I think we should encourage the English to do so too. So it should be "List of churches on Falster".--Ipigott (talk) 15:19, 28 February 2013 (UTC)

Thanks. The reason for my doubts is that the categories consistantly seem to be using "in" for all islands. When it comes to Manhattan, I guess "in" can be justified by the fact that it is referred to as a district rather than an island (although it obviously is both). We have the same issue in Danish where the point is often made that it is called "i Grønland) since it is a country and not "på Grønland". But "on Falster" it is!Ramblersen (talk) 16:48, 28 February 2013 (UTC)

Lots of the categories are strange. Don't use them as a basis for article titles. Just look at all those starting with Luxembourgian rather than Luxembourg. I once tried to have them corrected but came up against huge objections. But for titles of articles, I think we should change them when they are wrong.--Ipigott (talk) 16:56, 28 February 2013 (UTC)

DYK for Den Frie Udstilling

 — Crisco 1492 (talk) 16:02, 28 February 2013 (UTC)

DYK for Musgum mud huts

Graeme Bartlett (talk) 00:02, 3 March 2013 (UTC)

Thanks for the observation on my talk page on the above article. I have changed the sentence in the Morro Solar article to give it a historic context.--Nvvchar. 16:47, 3 March 2013 (UTC)

DYK for Whalsay Parish Church

 — Crisco 1492 (talk) 08:02, 3 March 2013 (UTC)

You might find more sources for Erik Gabrielsson Emporagrius, if not, no worries.♦ Dr. ☠ Blofeld 16:21, 5 March 2013 (UTC)

I've looked into this. The article could be greatly expanded on the basis of this biography in the Dictionary of Swedish National Biography but it seems to me that the shorter version we have now presents a better overview. Most of the other sources come from his own works. Perhaps we should just leave things the way they are. The translation seems to be quite good.--Ipigott (talk) 17:37, 5 March 2013 (UTC)

Would definitely be the easier option..♦ Dr. ☠ Blofeld 18:52, 5 March 2013 (UTC)

I see you edited Fatimid architecture after all, I was rather afraid to bring it to your attention myself.♦ Dr. ☠ Blofeld 11:48, 11 March 2013 (UTC)

Great article. Made very interesting reading. There was very little needing attention.--Ipigott (talk) 11:51, 11 March 2013 (UTC)

Leads needs work, but I think it has GA potential. First though Marrakesh really needs my attention for GA.♦ Dr. ☠ Blofeld 12:11, 11 March 2013 (UTC)

Women photographers in the ODNB

Here are some from the ODNB which might interest you:

• Cecilia Louisa Glaisher / Cecilia Glaisher (1828-1892), English photographer. Oxford Dictionary of National Biography (online ed.). Oxford University Press. doi:10.1093/ref:odnb/59885. {{cite encyclopedia}}: Missing or empty |title= (help); Unknown parameter |name= ignored (help) (Subscription or UK public library membership required.)
• Frances Griffiths (1907-1986), English photographer. Only a redirect atm. Oxford Dictionary of National Biography (online ed.). Oxford University Press. doi:10.1093/ref:odnb/58057. {{cite encyclopedia}}: Missing or empty |title= (help); Unknown parameter |name= ignored (help) (Subscription or UK public library membership required.)
• Alice Hughes / Alice Mary Hughes, English photographer. Oxford Dictionary of National Biography (online ed.). Oxford University Press. doi:10.1093/ref:odnb/65306. {{cite encyclopedia}}: Missing or empty |title= (help); Unknown parameter |name= ignored (help) (Subscription or UK public library membership required.)
• Susan Jellicoe / Susan Jellicoe (1907-1986), English landscape architect and photographer. Oxford Dictionary of National Biography (online ed.). Oxford University Press. {{cite encyclopedia}}: Missing or empty |title= (help); Unknown parameter |name= ignored (help) (Subscription or UK public library membership required.)

Cheers! Dsp13 (talk) 22:26, 10 March 2013 (UTC)

Nice one doing Alice H. I'll do caroline Glaisher. These from Luminous-Lint:

• Gertrud Arndt (1903-2000), German photographer
• Laure Albin-Guillot (1879-1962), French photographer
• Claude Batho (1835-1981), French photographer
• Mary Dillwyn (1816-1906), Welsh photographer
• Nell Dorr (1893-1988), American photographer
• Vera Elkan (1908-2008), Spanish photographer
• Emma J. Farnsworth / Emma Justine Farnsworth (1860-1952), American photographer
• Lady Mary Georgiana Filmer (1838-1903), British photographer
• Trude Fleischmann (1895-1990), Austrian-born American photographer
• Caroline Haskins Gurrey (c.1878-1927)
• Marie Hansen (1918-1969), American photographer
• Ergy Landau (1896-1967), Hungarian photographer
• Nina Leen (1914-1995), Russian-born American photographer
• Margaret Michaelis-Sachs (1902-1985), Austrian photographer
• Helen Messinger Murdoch (1862-1956), American photographer and aviator
• Caroline Emily Nevill (1829-1887), British photographer
• Mary Paraskeva (1882-1951), Greek photographer
• Nata Piaskowski (1912-2004), Polish-American photographer
• Margaret Watkins (1884-1969), Canadian photographer

Dsp13 (talk) 08:15, 12 March 2013 (UTC)

You've done such a nice job on the Nata Piaskowski article; I'll see about a photo. --Rosiestep (talk) 14:52, 15 March 2013 (UTC)

Great! You might be interested in some of the ladies in the above list. All very recent articles.--Ipigott (talk) 17:16, 15 March 2013 (UTC)

Nikkor camera (not)

Borland was born in Melbourne where her father gave her a camera, a Nikkor, when she was 16.

There's never been a "Nikkor" camera, as far as I know.

That would have been around 1974. Though there had been a Nikkorex camera (here and here), it would have been a most unlikely gift in 1974. Far more likely would have been a Nikkormat. (The name is actually rather meaningless as different Nikkormats available new in 1974 had less in common with each other than with cameras from other companies.

A tempting fix for "Nikkor" would be "Nikon SLR". But this would be an anachronism at best, as Nikon was at the time not a company but merely a brand name used by a company (and not used by it for either the Nikkormat nor its Nikkor lenses).

Over to you! -- Hoary (talk) 09:03, 16 March 2013 (UTC)

Yes, the same occurred to me when I was writing the article. I've researched it a bit and I think the new ref in the article provides the answer. Always useful to have you around, Hoary. Thanks.--Ipigott (talk) 09:25, 16 March 2013 (UTC)

Just looked a bit more into dates. Perhaps it should just be a "Nikon" camera?--Ipigott (talk) 09:31, 16 March 2013 (UTC)

One company -- whose current name is Nikon but was then instead Nihon/Nippon Kōgaku in Japan and I think Nippon Optical outside Japan -- made Nikon cameras, Nikkor lenses, and Nikkormat (aka Nikomat) cameras. In 1974, a "Nikon" camera would have been one that the company chose to name "Nikon".

The brand really doesn't matter, and Nippon Kōgaku then only made SLRs. So how about a "SLR camera"? -- Hoary (talk) 09:42, 16 March 2013 (UTC)

Isn't that a bit too specific. Maybe just a "camera"?--Ipigott (talk) 09:46, 16 March 2013 (UTC)

Yes, that's fine. -- Hoary (talk) 10:04, 16 March 2013 (UTC)

Ursula Richter

She has left some 225 photographs of theatrical and dance performances in Dresden as well as 350 private plates and a large collection of negatives and prints.

What would "private plates" be? -- Hoary (talk) 09:37, 16 March 2013 (UTC)

I took it simply to mean they were photographs of friends, family, etc., rather than of the theatre. It the term used in the original reference. Maybe it would be OK to change it to "plates of her own" if you don't like the term.--Ipigott (talk) 09:42, 16 March 2013 (UTC)

Now fixed (I hope). -- Hoary (talk) 10:04, 16 March 2013 (UTC)

Generation gap

Gamble was given a camera in 1904 by an uncle from Truro, Nova Scotia. Part of the first generation of amateur photographers [...]

Nooooo! No way was somebody who started in 1904 part of the first generation of amateur photographers. That's more than a decade after the introduction of the "You press the button, we do the rest" Kodak, which itself was half a century or so after the actual first generation of amateur photographers. -- Hoary (talk) 09:37, 16 March 2013 (UTC)

Fixed. I should have made it clearer that we're talking about Prince Edward Island. Always has been a rather primitive place!--Ipigott (talk) 09:51, 16 March 2013 (UTC)

Colan Church

Thanks for starting the c/e on Colan Church. --Rosiestep (talk) 02:51, 17 March 2013 (UTC)

It's turned out to be a nice article. --Rosiestep (talk) 18:31, 17 March 2013 (UTC)

Good point; I've weeded it out. --Rosiestep (talk) 00:04, 18 March 2013 (UTC)

I researched the Gerhards and like you, couldn't find anything substantial in another ref. I'll research some of the other names tomorrow. --Rosiestep (talk) 05:56, 19 March 2013 (UTC)

Pioneering

I see you're adding Category:Pioneers of photography. It's a decent enough idea elsewhere, but I've always thought it was a terrible match for WP. If I remember right, people used to add it to their promotional articles on fashion/celeb photographers and the like, claiming pioneering uses of Photoshop, and gods know what else. I haven't noticed much of that recently, but here's what it now says:

19th century photographers who were among the first in developing the medium; generally this means people working prior to 1880. The category should not be used for later photographers who help to advance particular aspects or genres of photography

Does this include somebody pioneering this or that in the 1890s, or doesn't it? Just what does it include from 1880 or thereafter? If nothing, then why not have it renamed to "Category:Photographers active before 1880"? (What's so special about 1880, anyway?) And for Friedrich's sake, why is Category:19th-century photographers a subcategory of it, and not vice versa?

I think that the category cries out for deletion. -- Hoary (talk) 10:12, 19 March 2013 (UTC)

You may be right that it should be deleted. I simply noticed there were already a fair number of people in the category and simply tried to extend it to a few women. I'll go back over my additions and delete those who do not coincide with the definition.--Ipigott (talk) 11:05, 19 March 2013 (UTC)

I've been looking at some of the Japanese bios. I was wondering if you would like to add a few lines to the substubs on Michiko Kon, Tsuneko Sasamoto and Ruiko Yoshida? It would be interesting to learn why they are "notable".--Ipigott (talk) 11:44, 19 March 2013 (UTC)

Pioneers of photography, while useful, some were pioneers, I think it is difficult to gauge exactly and is a little subjective.♦ Dr. ☠ Blofeld 12:46, 19 March 2013 (UTC)

DYK for Gertrud Arndt

The DYK project (nominate) 16:04, 19 March 2013 (UTC)

DYK nomination of Margaret Michaelis-Sachs

Hello! Your submission of Margaret Michaelis-Sachs at the Did You Know nominations page has been reviewed, and some issues with it may need to be clarified. Please review the comment(s) underneath your nomination's entry and respond there as soon as possible. Thank you for contributing to Did You Know! Amandajm (talk) 08:58, 20 March 2013 (UTC)

DYK for Fatimid architecture

Graeme Bartlett (talk) 16:03, 22 March 2013 (UTC)

DYK for Margaret Michaelis-Sachs

Casliber (talk · contribs) 00:02, 24 March 2013 (UTC)

DYK for Iglesia de Nuestra Señora de la Palma

The DYK project (nominate) 08:02, 24 March 2013 (UTC)

DYK for Plaza Alta (Algeciras)

The DYK project (nominate) 08:03, 24 March 2013 (UTC)

DYK for Colan Church

The DYK project (nominate) 16:04, 24 March 2013 (UTC)

I thought you might be interested in translating St. Severin, Keitum from German?♦ Dr. ☠ Blofeld 14:05, 4 April 2013 (UTC)

OK. I'll try to tackle it tomorrow. Unfortunately the German article is poorly referenced but I'll try to find authentic German sources myself. Still not quite finished with the women photographers but it'll probably do me good to have a change of focus.--Ipigott (talk) 14:50, 4 April 2013 (UTC)

Thanks. Wow coverage has come on dramatically on the women photographers, you've certainly kept at that!! A well-deserved award. I did see some on Estonian wikipedia, not sure whether you'd consider them notable.♦ Dr. ☠ Blofeld 15:30, 4 April 2013 (UTC)

Severin looking good!!♦ Dr. ☠ Blofeld 22:13, 5 April 2013 (UTC)

Thanks. More could be added on the paintings, etc., but I think I'll leave it the way it is.--Ipigott (talk) 07:46, 6 April 2013 (UTC)

Nommed Severin. Wolfgang Meuslin, mm Church of the Holy Cross, Augsburg, doesn't exist on here?♦ Dr. ☠ Blofeld 22:05, 9 April 2013 (UTC)

I see from de:Kloster Heilig Kreuz (Augsburg) that there are in fact two Holy Cross Churches in Augsburg, one Catholic, one Protestant. Pretty busy today but I may get around to an English article later.--Ipigott (talk) 06:44, 10 April 2013 (UTC)

Women photographers

	Expanded list of women photographers award
	Thanks for adding to wikipedia's coverage with all the new and expanded bios! Rosiestep (talk) 14:20, 4 April 2013 (UTC)

WikiProject Editor Retention in the Signpost

The WikiProject Report would like to focus on WikiProject Editor Retention for a Signpost article. This is an excellent opportunity to draw attention to your efforts and attract new members to the project. Would you be willing to participate in an interview? If so, here are the questions for the interview. Just add your response below each question and feel free to skip any questions that you don't feel comfortable answering. Multiple editors will have an opportunity to respond to the interview questions, so be sure to sign your answers. If you know anyone else who would like to participate in the interview, please share this with them. Have a great day. –Mabeenot (talk) 03:51, 7 April 2013 (UTC)

I'm afraid I'm not very good at responding to multiple-choise answers along these lines. Let me just say that I think that since about 2008 new members have been discouraged by the increasing assertiveness of "experienced" members. There has also been far too little concern for the need for sponsors or general assistance from establishied controbutors. I have tried to encourage several new members along the road, some of whom have developed astoundingly well while others have fallen by the wayside. I think what we need is a far more reliable sequence of support and safeguards against early dismissal based on warning messages often triggered by robots.--Ipigott (talk) 16:14, 7 April 2013 (UTC)

Ichthus

I see you removed the newsletter. Although you did not specifically sign up for it, I included you in the distribution this month because you were credited for relevant article improvements in it. Would you like to continue receiving it in these circumstances or would you like to opt out of it next month?--Gilderien Chat|List of good deeds 18:47, 7 April 2013 (UTC)

Thank you for sending me the newsletter and pointing out that I was mentioned. I would however prefer not to receive it in future.--Ipigott (talk) 10:06, 8 April 2013 (UTC)

Jonglei

Hi, sorry to bother you! Can you check the translation of Jonglei history from German, only a few sentences but the Aayli and Nile border thing is confusing me and I'm not sure the translation is sound. It's currently top of the news on the main page and I'm trying to get it up to a decent level!♦ Dr. ☠ Blofeld 10:53, 13 April 2013 (UTC)

Just received this now. I'll have a look at it.--Ipigott (talk) 12:22, 13 April 2013 (UTC)

Thanks, yes it is only the Upper Nile state thing. The rest I've written. Article was in a shambles, and has already been x2 + expanded. The problem of course is recentism and finding older sources, but the recent stuff needs to be covered first of course. A lot of missing notable county governors and that too.. But sources like this really to a lot to open this region up, when I started on wikipedia there was next to nothing covering this part of the world. I remember sub stubbing lot of towns in Sudan using an old 1970s atlas back in 2006 and there being nothing online about them, my attempt to try to get us working on what was an empty area of coverage. Much of Sudan geographically is still of a similar quality but has definitely improved considerably since the split in 2011. ♦ Dr. ☠ Blofeld 12:41, 13 April 2013 (UTC)

The area of 122.479 km2 under geography does not tally with the figure in the lead. Don't know which one is correct.--Ipigott (talk) 13:23, 13 April 2013 (UTC)

Done. Thankless job this encyclopedia editing! Kai Normann Andersen up for deletion now!♦ Dr. ☠ Blofeld 16:47, 13 April 2013 (UTC)

• You did a great job on Jonglei. As for K.N. Andersen, it's amazing the article could be put up for deletion. At least the AfD seems to have brought the article to a wider readership!--Ipigott (talk) 17:08, 13 April 2013 (UTC)

Thanks. Africa is a part of the world sadly few people really seem to care about. It gets terribly neglected on here and contributions to African topics by a range of people like Aymatth and others few seem to show an interest in them. The Bangui article I felt few people really showed an interest in its expansion too. Anyway, yeah, quite incredulous that somebody would really think Andersen non notable! ♦ Dr. ☠ Blofeld 17:14, 13 April 2013 (UTC)

Unfortunately World Gazeteer.com which was the most comprehensive population data site is closing down in July. I was thinking about putting up a proposal on wikidata to either take it over or to try to start building a world gazetteer on wikidata of population by country. I'm pretty sure that was the intention of wikidata to do so at some point. Perhaps it's worth asking there.♦ Dr. ☠ Blofeld 20:40, 13 April 2013 (UTC)

Seems to me to be an excellent idea - and you certainly have the right kind of background to handle the coordination. Let me know if there's anything I can do to help. I see from this that World Gazeteer is a one man show run by Stefan Helders in Leverkusen. It might be a good idea to get in touch with him and see if he is prepared to share a few tricks and possibly help with a wikidata project.--Ipigott (talk) 07:14, 14 April 2013 (UTC)

Yes, I think if we could compile something on wikidata like that and try to feed as much census data by country as possible into the database it would be a tremendous help for other wikipedias in particular and would make things more consistent. I'll ask on wikidata somewhere I think. This says the website is closing in July and I think it would be a crying shame. He found census data for smaller Gabon towns from 1993 which I could never find and has done an incredible job building it, it's too valuable to lose.

Proposed here.♦ Dr. ☠ Blofeld 09:49, 14 April 2013 (UTC)

Not sure what your Estonian is like but you might find more for Ann Tenno.♦ Dr. ☠ Blofeld 11:08, 14 April 2013 (UTC)

My Estonian is non-existent. It's completely different from the other European languages but appears to have some similarities to Finnish. I have another busy day today but I may see what I can do tomorrow. Glad to see you have some support for your wikidata proposal. Identification of sources seems to be a potential problem though. Maybe it would be possible to provide some kind of support for Helders if he can be encouraged to continue with World Gazeteer?--Ipigott (talk) 08:13, 15 April 2013 (UTC)

Gotcha! Don't speak Estonian tut tut hehe! I've emailed Helders although I'm not convinced he'll respond. ♦ Dr. ☠ Blofeld 08:18, 15 April 2013 (UTC)

DYK for Cape Nome

Panyd^{The muffin is not subtle} 00:03, 19 April 2013 (UTC)

Churches in Faxe Municipality

Hi there. I've started some articles which might interest you: Vester Egede Church, Braaby Church, Faxe Church, Freerslev Church, and Haslev Church. --Rosiestep (talk) 02:43, 19 April 2013 (UTC)

Good to hear from you again, Rosiestep. I'm glad to see you have once again directed your interest at historic churches in Denmark. I have in fact just arrived in Denmark again and all the churches you have been covering are within about 60 miles. I'll try to help out with expanding the articles but I am unfortunately pressed for time. I may be able to devote a couple of hours to them today but am tied up all day tomorrow. Let's see how it goes... --Ipigott (talk) 12:39, 19 April 2013 (UTC)

I hope you have a wonderful visit! No rush to work on any of the articles. --Rosiestep (talk) 14:43, 20 April 2013 (UTC)

I am so glad when I hear an editor has access to a resource which can light up an article such as you have done. Bravo! Funny how I got around to these churches... I was looking at articles on Greenland, a place which fascinates me. Reading the one on History of Greenland, I came across Hans Egede. I googled "Egede", and saw the da wiki article on Vester Egede Kirke. Clicking it, I saw the painting of the church; it was lovely. I checked out the categories for the article and found there were many churches with images that didn't have an en language counterpart. P.S. I thought about including the painting img rather than a photo in the en article but opted for the photo instead. Maybe that was a mistake? --Rosiestep (talk) 15:19, 24 April 2013 (UTC)

Precious again

Danish
Thank you for expanding out knowledge of Danish culture, architecture, art, cuisine, music, showing us that there so much more Danish than sweet pastry, such as Nielsen's Wind Quintet and Utzon's Bagsværd Church, - repeating: you are an awesome Wikipedian!

--Gerda Arendt (talk) 11:21, 20 April 2012 (UTC)

A year ago, you were the 101st recipient of my PumpkinSky Prize, repeated in br'erly style, - with more thanks for all your help since, --Gerda Arendt (talk) 09:32, 20 April 2013 (UTC)

Thank you, Gerda. It's always an encouragement when others show their appreciation.--Ipigott (talk) 06:00, 22 April 2013 (UTC)

Flamenco

Mentioned you here.♦ Dr. ☠ Blofeld

See you've made enormous improvements on Paco de Lucía. As for the definition of "classical", we could debate for years. What is important is not so much the view of the purists but the wider appeal of the genre. Flamenco, like many other musical developments over the centuries, has now generally reached the "acceptable" status. Just as well, as it's about time we forgot our "nice" distinctions which have tended to discard everything from negro spirituals to (what Wikipedia calls) Romani music. But the historical points you bring up are certainly of interest and could perhaps be included in articles such as Flamenco and Flamenco guitar.--Ipigott (talk) 10:50, 22 April 2013 (UTC)

Yes, I quite agree. Traditional flamenco I suppose can sound classical in nature. Segovia and co though would be mortified! Paco is currently at GA. Did you see the Fatimid architecture article passed? Spending a few days away from wikipedia it is easy to lose track of what is going on. I've set up a base for myself, Rosie and Nvv to organize our work from at Wikipedia:Rosblofnari. I hope you don't mind but I've added a section for yourself as Rosie especially and also myself often notify you of mostly Danish articles you might want to expand. A good idea I think would be when her or I start a Danish church we list it there for you to see, or you yourself could list any articles you want me or Rosie to assist with. I just think its a better way of organizing our collaborations without having to notify everybody and dig through talk pages.♦ Dr. ☠ Blofeld 13:42, 22 April 2013 (UTC)

Congratulations on Fatimid. Rosblofnari looks good certainly seems to have potential. I'm flattered to have been included. I'll try to remember to keep looking at it but if you really need urgent help with something, it's probably better to let me know on my talk page anyway. I may also drop by when I have suggestions for the three of you too. --Ipigott (talk) 14:33, 22 April 2013 (UTC)

Yes, OK, but should any articles by nommed for DYK please link the nom page on that page so we can keep track of things! Offhand, what are the best church articles you've produced? I think a lot of them could pass GA with little work as they're smaller churches which have a pretty sound evaluation of them.♦ Dr. ☠ Blofeld 14:56, 22 April 2013 (UTC)

Don't do much nomming myself but perhaps I should make more of an effort to cope with the process. Most of my church articles have been fairly brief and to the point and are therefore probably not material for GA in their present state. Most could be considerably expanded, even in the case of smaller churches. As far as the last three I have expanded for Rosiestep, I've been a bit pushed for time so I have really not dug much into the literature. Maybe one of the round churches on Bornholm could be brought up to GA without too much effort. I'll think about it.--Ipigott (talk) 15:15, 22 April 2013 (UTC)

Best to pick the small churches which you think are pretty comprehensive and can't really be expanded much I think. Those which won't involve much work; I understand you are busy with other things, so am I! If you view some of the small church articles in places like Anglesey like St Ceidio's Church, Rhodogeidio, a lot of them are pretty short but concise, with an adequate basic overview. I think that sort of length and coverage would suffice.♦ Dr. ☠ Blofeld 15:27, 22 April 2013 (UTC)

DYK for St. Severin, Keitum

Casliber (talk · contribs) 08:04, 26 April 2013 (UTC)

DYK for Vester Egede Church

Casliber (talk · contribs) 08:03, 27 April 2013 (UTC)

DYK for Faxe Church

The DYK project (nominate) 00:03, 28 April 2013 (UTC)

WikiProject Christianity Newsletter (May 2013)

Hi, I thought I would drop you a note to say that I mentioned in this month's issue of Ichthus. If you wish to receive the full content in future, please drop me a note on my talk page.--Gilderien Chat|List of good deeds 18:01, 28 April 2013 (UTC)

DYK for Haslev Church

Casliber (talk · contribs) 08:03, 29 April 2013 (UTC)

Pieter Goos

Welcome back. Can you translate from Dutch?♦ Dr. ☠ Blofeld 10:09, 29 April 2013 (UTC)

Now working on Corinne Metzelopoulos. Will look at Goos later.--Ipigott (talk) 10:13, 29 April 2013 (UTC)

Disambiguation link notification for April 30

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A Barnstar For You!

File:MariaJesusAlvarado1.gif	Working woman's barnstar
	For your impressive work on improving coverage of women on wikipedia. ♦ Dr. ☠ Blofeld 13:48, 30 April 2013 (UTC)

Thanks. Very perceptive of you. I have indeed been trying to do my bit in improving coverage of women. But I should make it clear to anyone reading this that I am not a working woman myself - I no longer work (at least not as an employee) and I am not a woman!--Ipigott (talk) 14:01, 30 April 2013 (UTC)

Yup I know! But you've done such tremendous work towards those women photographers and now the women of wine you deserve an award entitled this!!♦ Dr. ☠ Blofeld 14:14, 30 April 2013 (UTC)

Infobox example looks good, if you can make the other Danish churches like that with infoboxes. If you need new regional maps give me a bell.♦ Dr. ☠ Blofeld 14:39, 5 May 2013 (UTC)

DYK for Freerslev Church

The DYK project (nominate) 08:03, 3 May 2013 (UTC)

I started adding from this [17] and there was an edit conflict. It does not matter now. It is very well expanded by you and it can make it to DYK. Thanks.--Nvvchar. 14:52, 4 May 2013 (UTC)

DYK for Pieter Goos

 — Crisco 1492 (talk) 08:22, 6 May 2013 (UTC)

Started Roholte and Gregorian Tower. Can you translate the latter from Italian and German?♦ Dr. ☠ Blofeld 12:11, 8 May 2013 (UTC)

Will do the Gregorian Tower tomorrow.--Ipigott (talk) 21:10, 8 May 2013 (UTC)

Yng did the Italian I think but not the German, thanks.♦ Dr. ☠ Blofeld 21:19, 8 May 2013 (UTC)

Excellent work, thanks, I've restored the Bolivar birthplace and given a warning to the reverter. Sorry if you lost any work.♦ Dr. ☠ Blofeld 16:28, 9 May 2013 (UTC)

DYK for Braaby Church

The DYK project (nominate) 08:03, 9 May 2013 (UTC)

Birthplace of Simón Bolívar

Just in case you hadn't seen the message on my own talk page: apologies for my overzealous editing. I've reverted related edits to the redirects and I promise it won't happen again. Good luck with the article! Qwertyus (talk) 16:31, 9 May 2013 (UTC)

Thanks once again for your interest in the article's development.--Ipigott (talk) 22:02, 9 May 2013 (UTC)

Pointless graphic

Ding! Totally bogus, really. In normal (non-editing) life, I make no distinction between male and female photographers, and I had trouble thinking of which books I had by the latter. Over a few weeks I collected them into a pile on the floor. Once the pile was satisfyingly tall, I removed a chunk of content from a bookshelf, replaced the chunk with the pile, and photographed the result. Self-imposed constraint: No more than one book by any one photographer. Other constraint: No taller than so many centimetres (this eliminated half a dozen or so books). Within an hour of taking the photo, I realized I also had books by Ruth Bernhard, Berenice Abbott.... The whole exercise was pretty silly, but it did bring home to me the facts that (i) only a small percentage of the photobooks I possess are by women, (ii) a surprising number of these are Japanese, and (iii) although I have pairs of books by a number of women, I have four or more by only one (Mary Ellen Mark). So all in all the exercise was a mildly interesting expenditure of my time. -- Hoary (talk) 23:19, 10 May 2013 (UTC) ... tweaked for the sake of intelligibility 00:34, 12 May 2013 (UTC)

That's a very interesting and enterprising approach. A new classification for librarians! Which do you think are most relevant to the general subject of women's photography? Maybe some could be included for further reading. I'm still in the process of writing an article on women's photography (mainly a historical overview) and hope to have it in the main space within a week or so. Maybe there should also be a section on photography books by women? Anyway, thanks for your input.--Ipigott (talk) 06:10, 11 May 2013 (UTC)

Speaking personally (and not editorially), out of that lot I'd particularly recommend Cristina García Rodero, Sirkka-Liisa Konttinen, Helen Levitt, Markéta Luskačová, Mary Ellen Mark, and Rosalind Solomon. In saying this I'm reluctantly omitting two who have been working for Magnum. So the standard here is high. I should also say that three of the books on the shelf (none of them by anybody who's worked for Magnum) are of little or no interest to me: don't take the set as closely indicative of my tastes. I'm not at all sure that there's such a halfway cohesive subject as (A) a "women's photobook"; there are instead (B) photobooks made by (or from the works of) women. That said, there's a subset of (B) that do seem somehow female/feminine. There could certainly be a little history of (B); it would start very early indeed: right here. -- Hoary (talk) 11:17, 11 May 2013 (UTC) ... tweaked for the sake of intelligibility 00:34, 12 May 2013 (UTC)

Good start. I'll try to follow up on it.--Ipigott (talk) 20:54, 11 May 2013 (UTC)

And this history would have elements of (A). Aside from a lot of stuff that's of minimal interest to me, one recent, noteworthy book is Olivia Arthur's Jeddah Diary (though I don't possess a copy): photos that could only have been taken by a woman, of half a nation under virtual house arrest. -- Hoary (talk) 00:34, 12 May 2013 (UTC)

DYK for Roholte

Casliber (talk · contribs) 08:43, 13 May 2013 (UTC)

Yvette Laclé

Hi, can you translate this from Dutch? It's been prodded for deletion. ♦ Dr. ☠ Blofeld 21:23, 13 May 2013 (UTC)

Mmm it seems to be a controversial BLP, if you don't want to edit it don't worry about it, I understand. But deleting articles just because they're controversial above notable I think is wrong.♦ Dr. ☠ Blofeld 21:55, 13 May 2013 (UTC)

Seems to be a very colourful individual. I'll have a go at it but perhaps without covering everything in the Dutch version.--Ipigott (talk) 08:45, 14 May 2013 (UTC)

I think I've probably expanded this sufficiently. Unfortunately, I have not been able to access the latest news reports as they are available by subscription only.--Ipigott (talk) 10:42, 14 May 2013 (UTC)

You've done a great job which I much appreciate. She's notable beyond a doubt. It greatly concerns me that if an individual is "very colourful" as you put it, that people like Alison think deletion "it must go" is the best option. I understand our adherence to BLPs, but if an individual is well-documented in decent sources for something, then the opinion that we are causing great distress to that individual is a far-fetched one. It is possible that some issues in an article will continue to cause distress and they complain about it. A Bulgarian athlete who tested positive for drugs now a coach in the US complained here and while we wouldn't take the article down, I removed the mention of this as it was genuinely causing her distress as a teacher and was barely covered in reliable sources. But I'm not going to delete entire articles because the individual has had a colourful life or because some hyper sensitive editor wants to remove all mention of prostitutes and drug use on wikipedia.♦ Dr. ☠ Blofeld 12:07, 14 May 2013 (UTC)

Laclé shows no signs of wanting to hide her past; on the contrary, she has even written a book about it all. And her failure to win a seat with her new party is also widely documented. You may have noticed I did not mention the Gold Bikini award which she received for being the worst candidate. So I don't expect any complaints.--Ipigott (talk) 13:52, 14 May 2013 (UTC)

DYK for Corinne Mentzelopoulos

Casliber (talk · contribs) 09:09, 14 May 2013 (UTC)

Women in photography

Great article; it's really coming along nicely. And that is a lovely picture, if I do say so myself. :) Also, thanks for your kind words. I was miffed after reading some of the posts at the DYK Talk Page; the negativity just hit a raw nerve. I'm over it now. --Rosiestep (talk) 17:21, 16 May 2013 (UTC)

• Indeed, lovely article. Well done and keep up the good work! Regards, -- Ohc ^¡digame!_{¿que pasa?} 08:58, 27 May 2013 (UTC)

Thanks for your kind comments. I still intend to add quite a bit but the early history is more or less complete from my point of view. Other editors may of course have more to add.--Ipigott (talk) 12:16, 27 May 2013 (UTC)

Looks great, but in my opinion the galleries affect the flow of it, I'd reduce the number of images to double images and format them rather than gallery them, but up to you..♦ Dr. ☠ Blofeld 11:00, 27 May 2013 (UTC)

Thanks for your suggestion. I'm still developing the article and adding images. When I am more or less happy with the full story, I'll try to review the presentation. I'm not very good at double/multiple images and have used galleries with larger image sizes in many of my articles on art and photography. Maybe I should try to do better.--Ipigott (talk) 12:16, 27 May 2013 (UTC)

Sisimiut uses double images quite well I think.♦ Dr. ☠ Blofeld 13:43, 27 May 2013 (UTC)

Petros

Have a watch of this. Pure artistry. If I could own any guitar on the planet it would be an 1890 Torres, closely followed by a Petros, but I wouldn't mind a Lester DeFoe too! Torres is like the Stradivarius of guitars♦ Dr. ☠ Blofeld 21:20, 21 May 2013 (UTC)

DYK for Palacio Liévano

The DYK project (nominate) 16:03, 26 May 2013 (UTC)

DYK for Gisselfeld

The DYK project (nominate) 16:02, 27 May 2013 (UTC)

DYK for Grotta di Lourdes

The DYK project (nominate) 16:04, 27 May 2013 (UTC)

DYK for Roholte Church

 — Crisco 1492 (talk) 00:02, 28 May 2013 (UTC)

DYK for Palacio de San Carlos (Bogotá)

The DYK project (nominate) 00:02, 29 May 2013 (UTC)

DYK for Women in photography

Cas Liber (talk · contribs) 16:02, 29 May 2013 (UTC)

DYK for Palacio Federal Legislativo

Cas Liber (talk · contribs) 16:02, 29 May 2013 (UTC)

Excellent, I'll get working on that probably tomorrow. Recommend watching this. ♦ Dr. ☠ Blofeld 15:18, 30 May 2013 (UTC)

Danish film

Very nice to see your improvements of the Mads Mikkelsen article. Should your interest in vintage photographers extend to cinematographers, Johan Ankerstjerne may have your interest. Has a quite substantial article on German wikiepdia but is neither covered on Danish or English wikiepdia.Ramblersen (talk) 02:31, 31 May 2013 (UTC)

Glad to see you noticed them. I'm actually not too keen on writing about film stars but Mikkelsen happened to be close to the top of the most popular pages for Denmark which you can see at Wikipedia:WikiProject Denmark/Popular pages. Dr. Blofeld and I have decided that in addition to new articles, it is important to ensure that frequently viewed articles are brought up to standard. You are of course welcome to join in. Any improvements you would like to make to important articles such as Lego and Hans Christian Andersen would be appreciated. If you go down the list, you will see that many of the most popular articles are still Stub or Start class. I realize the main problem is often finding authentic references which is time-consuming and not very rewarding but if you could spend part of you time on this work, it would certainly help. Maybe some also need to be reassessed. I'll try to get around to Johan Ankerstjerne sooner or later but I'm pretty tied up with other things at the moment. I've also been looking at your recent work on Danish railways. You are making great headway. Well done!--Ipigott (talk) 06:35, 31 May 2013 (UTC)

That list has indeed crossed my way a few times before but there are generally a little too many pop stars and footballers for more liking. I do understand your decision to focus more energy on the most read articles, though, although I for my own part tend to try to stay away from the most important articles since I think they are better left to native English speekers and people with a special commitment to that subject. I therefore tend prefer little, unimportant topics where poor English, a handful of references and a couple of decent images is more than they could have hoped for. And there is such a terrible lot of articles that I would like to see improved within my main areas of interest, that I should probably concentrate my efforts there. Thanks for looking at the wailway stubs.Ramblersen (talk) 16:28, 31 May 2013 (UTC)

I'll work on that tomorrow, I've been in the sun all afternoon and its rather hot here, plus I've got a new computer chair which absolutely wreaks of paint for some reason and if I stay in the study room too long with the fumes of it gives me a major headache!♦ Dr. ☠ Blofeld 17:17, 31 May 2013 (UTC)

Enjoy the sun. No rush.--Ipigott (talk) 20:37, 31 May 2013 (UTC)

Fortunately the smell of the chair is diminishing.. We've expanded Mikkelsen x 2 now, I think its looking fine now.♦ Dr. ☠ Blofeld 12:08, 2 June 2013 (UTC)

Check out the page views of this!!♦ Dr. ☠ Blofeld 15:47, 5 June 2013 (UTC)

DYK for Palacio Municipal de Caracas

 — Crisco 1492 (talk) 16:02, 31 May 2013 (UTC)

Ichthus

Hi, I thought I would drop you a note to say that I mentioned an article you worked on in this month's issue of Ichthus. If you wish to receive the full content in future, please drop me a note on my talk page.--Gilderien Chat|List of good deeds22:01, 31 May 2013 (UTC)