User talk:Drmies/Archive 59

Bad, bad dog. Told you not to mess with people's infoboxes. Or use dashes incorrectly.

Thanks

"I don't know why, but somehow I am convinced of Memills's good will."

HA! PSYCH!! Fooled ya!  ;-P

Actually, nicest thing I've heard all day. Appreciate the sentiment and your willingness to express it. Memills (talk) 21:39, 3 November 2013 (UTC)

• You know, shit happens. You apparently made some edit that fell foul of this ban and owned up to it, so it's all good as far as I'm concerned. Mind you, I'm following Bbb's lead. Take it easy, Drmies (talk) 21:56, 3 November 2013 (UTC)

Interaction ban

Drmies, I'll ask you to be more specific about who is affected by the iban. Spell it out, please. I cast a !vote in support of a ban affecting both parties equally, because that would end a stream of personal attacks, and provide a measure of natural justice. Should those attacks continue, I'd like a solid basis for seeking redress - as, indeed would the other party. --Pete (talk) 01:12, 4 November 2013 (UTC)

• I hate to be dense, but huh? An interaction ban was proposed between HiLo48 and Skyring, which is you. It was approved unanimously by nine or so editors. I closed the discussion saying an interaction ban between HiLo48 and Skyring, which is you, is decided on and logged. Terms are to be found in WP:IBAN. What's the question? Whether it applies to both sides? That's the very definition of an IBAN, it seems to me, unless one side is forbidden from interacting with the others, which is not what was proposed.

  Now, I will grant you that the initial proposal is a bit unclear in that it blames you, but it does not propose a one-way interaction ban. You could, of course, read through those comments and take them to heart: they all seem to agree that your conduct has been abominable. What you probably don't want is for me to plow through your edits and find the evidence for the disruption spotted by so many other editors, and block you for it. In other words, I really think you should count yourself lucky (lucky that ESL didn't specify more clearly--they may still do so, at WP:AN) and quietly back out of the room. Have a nice day, Drmies (talk) 01:44, 4 November 2013 (UTC)

This is my first look at WP:IBAN ever, and it looks to be entirely one-sided in that editors X and Y are serving different roles in the examples given. Sorry, but I'm not having a go at you, I'm just asking for clarification.

Um, yes, I would like my edits to be ploughed through and scrutinised. That's why I continually asked for diffs to be provided. I don't know about the usual conduct of iban discussion, but I would imagine that diffs would be presented as evidence of the behaviour viewed as needing sanction. Having an iban discussion where zero evidence was presented has got to be unusual. --Pete (talk) 02:09, 4 November 2013 (UTC)

X and Y are variables. In this case, what applies to X applies to Y as well. In other words, you two are generally allowed to edit the same pages or discussions as long as you avoid each other, but are banned from interacting with each other in any way. That means you don't talk about each other unless it's covered by WP:BANEX. As for your next question, evidence was provided in the thread at ANI; for instance, you violated the other editor's request to stay away from their talk page. BTW, your commenting in that ANI thread was seen as badgering (certainly as unhelpful, even by someone as friendly as Kim Dent-Brown), and I suggest you take that to heart as well. No one likes the wikilawyering, and I don't either. If by now you haven't gotten the message, maybe you never will; I hope, though, that you will. Thank you. Drmies (talk) 02:38, 4 November 2013 (UTC)

Thanks for the clarification. The matter of the talk page was discussed and resolved. Maybe I'm being dense myself here, but telling me that I haven't got the message when the message itself isn't specified, is not helpful. If my interaction with another editor is seen as disruptive or abusive or in some other way negative, then it would be good to have that precisely highlighted, especially when I view my own contribution as positive. That applies for everyone: we all make mistakes, we all misunderstand, we all muddle our communications from time to time, and most of us regard detailed feedback in that area as valuable, especially when presented in a civil and helpful manner. --Pete (talk) 02:53, 4 November 2013 (UTC)

You don't need to respond to that last. You've addressed my initial query satisfactorily. And for that, thank you. --Pete (talk) 02:55, 4 November 2013 (UTC)

• Just a general comment -- if what was suggested, and what was imposed, is a two-way ban ... that is certainly appropriate. It is not automatic that bans are two way by any means -- one can impose a ban on one party, where that party is the one causing problems. Society does the same all the time with stalkers and problematic spouses, for example -- they don't put a restraining order or an interaction ban on both parties, but only on the one causing problems. But, from the above, that does not appear to be what was requested or imposed here.--Epeefleche (talk) 02:54, 4 November 2013 (UTC)

Thank you!. Hate to be a pest here, but my understanding is that the iban began the moment that the discussion was closed, and that neither party may address, comment on, or interact with the other party in any way, and that (say) comments on their own talk page would be a breach? Is there any grace period? --Pete (talk) 03:16, 4 November 2013 (UTC)

Yes, there is: I'm going to let HiLo's comment slide, though I will remind them that the party's over for them as well. Drmies (talk) 03:25, 4 November 2013 (UTC)

Thanks. I wasn't going to be a prick over it, but the point needed to be made. Hopefully that's an end to it. --Pete (talk) 04:09, 4 November 2013 (UTC)

Sure thing. Thanks for the reminder. Drmies (talk) 04:23, 4 November 2013 (UTC)

Dashes are lovely things

I love you like a brother from another mother, Drmies, but the niggling lover of print in me can't rook the constant --'s. I assume you're a Mac person: the keystroke for an emdash (—) is Shift+Option+--. If you find yourself on a PC, it's Alt+0151. An endash (–) on a Mac is simply Option+-; on a PC it's Alt+0150. I'll now crawl back into my hotel-dwelling hole. Still weeks before I can return home.  davidiad { t } 01:58, 4 November 2013 (UTC)

• Well...eh...how does one say "kiss my ass" politely? Ha! Go sign some people up for health care and let me take care of matters IN PROPER MLA STYLE from a netbook--on which where you can't do Alt+numbers. And no, this girl is not a Mac person; I thought about it, but I can't stand the way the keys feel on my wife's Macbook. Or the sharp edge of the machine itself. Now, I'll tell you that I have someone on payroll who takes care of such formalities, in return for which I reward them with barnstars and say nice things about modern art. Must be a quiet night there, huh? Not a Colts fan? Then get an early night's sleep. In other news, I'm reading A Time to Keep Silence by Patrick Leigh Fermor; very interesting. Drmies (talk) 03:14, 4 November 2013 (UTC)

All this talk of dashes is a huge turn-on. Davidiad, do ensure that your numlock is off (I can't think of a good reason to have it on, ever, on a PC). Drmies, your remarks are very entertaining! Tony (talk)

I gave up on authority and respect a long time ago; aiming for entertainment value suits me better. BTW, I'm sure I can get those fancy dashes using the pull-down menus with characters and stuff (in the wiki editing screen); that I can't get the Alt+number thing on a netbook is a neverending source of irritation. Davidiad can feel my pain, once he realizes that I occasionally write German and Anglo-Saxon. Tony, an em and an en walk into an Amsterdam hotel room, and they're not married to each other. Who gets the side with the alarm clock in the adulterous bed? Drmies (talk) 03:34, 4 November 2013 (UTC)

Tony, are you joking about the numlock? Having a 10 key pad is my number two consideration when buying a laptop, the first being that it is not a mac. Ryan Vesey 03:38, 4 November 2013 (UTC)

I remember vividly when I was a typist, and finally had memorized the num keys so I could type bills without looking at the keyboard. A glorious moment. Still, I'm glad I don't have that job anymore; words are more fun. Drmies (talk) 03:41, 4 November 2013 (UTC)

The numpad-trick and the option-key-trick are for generating *hardcoded* glyphs. As long as you aren't in VizEd, you can do this: "—" ... and you will get "—" ... hope this helps. -- 74.192.84.101 (talk) 00:39, 7 November 2013 (UTC)

• Two more things about punctuation: a. dogs suck at it. b. my daughter claimed in her "ancestry project" that it was one of the things she learned from her family. WTF? Drmies (talk) 03:50, 4 November 2013 (UTC)

I can imagine what it's like to drive a Trabant. Like this... Hafspajen (talk) 12:58, 4 November 2013 (UTC)

• • Ryan, you have my every sympathy. I can't imagine what it's like to drive a Trabant when a Mercedes is available. :-)

    DrMies, how many en dashes does it take to change a ... oh well, tell me punchline for the alarm-clock joke, then. Tony (talk) 03:55, 4 November 2013 (UTC)

• Ha! The polite way to say "kiss my ass" is "kiss my ass". Yeah, it's a slow night here and I'm getting pretty pissy about my being held hostage in the hotel. The system goes live tomorrow. It passed the necessary testing threshold yesterday and Arkansans will get their healthcare, but there are still tweaks to be made and I miss my cats and the only local I can stomach something awful. Hence, I assume, my punctuation outburst. But, mind you, I've got to type in polytonic Greek half the time and still manage the dashes that get me so hot. My father loves A Time to Keep Silence, by the way. If he could work the email, I'd put you two in touch.  davidiad { t } 04:02, 4 November 2013 (UTC)

Hygiene, please, Davidiad. And this is not Wikivoyage, let's remember. And I'm a Mac–dog guy, not a Windows–cat guy ... I just can't help it. <smile> Tony (talk) 04:53, 4 November 2013 (UTC)

I had a close shave with a Trabbie in Arnstadt only six weeks ago. Driven by a fierce-looking post-Honecker lady, it just wasn't going to give way to me. Tony (talk) 13:43, 4 November 2013 (UTC)

• Prejudice, I suppose. The Honecker lady had them, I mean. Hafspajen (talk) 14:09, 4 November 2013 (UTC)

By the way

Apparently I promoted you to admin. Cheers. I know you didn't mean it about the boneheaded, or at least, you meant stubborn and not stupid. Andrevan@ 03:34, 5 November 2013 (UTC)

Personal info

Although I don't know all the specific rules, this post raised a red flag as something that may need administrative attention, as it identifies a non-notable BLP and accuses them of making false and libelous statements without a source. CorporateM (Talk) 04:19, 5 November 2013 (UTC)

• I've redacted the names. Thanks. Glad I'm not involved with that article: it looks awful. Drmies (talk) 04:38, 5 November 2013 (UTC)

Hello Drmies - I believe there are numerous BLP issues with this talk section: https://wiki.riteme.site/wiki/Talk:Suburban_Express , specifically the repeated use of the name of the owner of the company that is the subject of the article. Example: "Actually, I think this article and the talk associated with it is a shameful display of everything that is wrong with Dennis Toeppen." Arri at Suburban Express (talk) 05:12, 5 November 2013 (UTC)

Another example: "It may be a good idea to mention cybersquatting in the article since Dennis Toeppen uses Suburban Express as a front for his cybersquatting activities" Arri at Suburban Express (talk) 05:16, 5 November 2013 (UTC)

Oops, some of those copyvios aren't if you consider the licenses/permissions in the Conventional Media Sources section. See: https://wiki.riteme.site/w/index.php?title=Talk%3ASuburban_Express&diff=580262236&oldid=580262138#Conventional_Media_Source_List Arri at Suburban Express (talk) 05:20, 5 November 2013 (UTC)

Well, feel free to revert me, and feel free to take care of suspected BLP violations yourself then. I don't feel the slightest urge to match postings with dates, though the Daily Herald release postdates some of the links I removed. I don't know whose side those IPs were on; if they were on yours, perhaps a media strategy should have been thought out before. Thank you, Drmies (talk) 05:25, 5 November 2013 (UTC)

That is a good point. Permission was granted recently and the posts were old. Good catch. Arri at Suburban Express (talk) 05:27, 5 November 2013 (UTC)

It's better to be safe than sorry: note that I said "likely" copyvio. I removed some of the old ones; you are in a better position than I am to judge which ones are OK to keep and which ones are not. I'm really not looking to get involved, but I will say this: I typically have some faith in the judgment and neutrality of CorporateM, even though he sometimes (foolishly) disagrees with me. BLP violations are of course to be stamped out, whichever side they're coming from--but you can do that just as well as I can, and if need be I will be glad to provide a second opinion. As a general rule, be very, very wary of including names (this directed to all sides, of course). Can I say something as a PR novice? Without wanting to meddle into anything, transparency is always the best policy. You can tell I'm a Liberal Arts kind of person. Drmies (talk) 05:31, 5 November 2013 (UTC)

Thanks, I support removal of the BLP violations against the SE owner as well. Hey, hey, I think you are the one that's foolish enough to disagree with me! (*smirk) CorporateM (Talk) 11:56, 5 November 2013 (UTC)

Hrm, there are harassment, personal attacks, outing and battlegrounding issues all over that page. Ok, back to Edelman (firm) where I can edit in solitude the way I like it ;-) CorporateM (Talk) 17:01, 5 November 2013 (UTC)

Good Strangelove quote. Would you please direct me to the relevant rules and policies so that I may endeavor to respect the local customs? Arri at Suburban Express (talk) 17:16, 5 November 2013 (UTC)

More importantly, what is the correct way to induce a COI editor to reveal their COI? The SE article has been repeatedly mutilated by COI editors and what appears to be a paid editor. When a COI is known but is not disclosed, what is the proper course of action? Asking the editor to disclose his COI seemed reasonable to me, but doing so clearly raised the hackles of several users. I don't really understand that. Thanks Arri at Suburban Express (talk) 17:22, 5 November 2013 (UTC)

It is fairly obvious the IP has a coi, and asking about it is fine. However they are not required to reveal who they are, merely that they have a COI. Since they are not editing the article, their duty to reveal anything is very limited. However, your posts on the article talk and that ip talk started to cross the line into outing and other threatening personal attacks Gaijin42 (talk) 17:25, 5 November 2013 (UTC)

My goal was an honest revelation of COI. I felt that IP did not do that. I had no intention of revealing his name or personal information, and none was revealed. I left it up to IP to decide what to do. If you look back in the talk page, you'll see that IP was engaging in harassment. It seemed to me that a COI disclosure by IP was necessary but not undertaken. Arri at Suburban Express (talk) 17:33, 5 November 2013 (UTC)

I believe Gaijin42 is referring to the personal message you sent. Additionally, at no point did I harass or intimidate you with threats or messages insinuated to be threats/intimidation as you did. 24.15.78.1 (talk) 17:48, 5 November 2013 (UTC)

Excuse me, I am having a discussion with others here. Arri at Suburban Express (talk) 17:56, 5 November 2013 (UTC)

The more the merrier. Gaijin42 is correct: you may ask, but there is no requirement that they cough up their identity or the exact nature of their conflict or interest, if they have one or the other. If there is evidence of harassment it should be provided; that's a matter for administrators to handle. And since they said they weren't going to edit the article or the talk page (haven't checked in a day or two) it's not a pressing concern. Now, the COI tag can be added (to an article or an editor) if there is reasonable suspicion that a COI exists and that it affects the neutrality of an article (the latter is a must for the tag to be added in article space--see "When to use" at Template:COI, and it should be accompanied by discussion. If a COI exists (or is deemed to exist) but editors deem that it does not interfere with the article's neutrality, there is no need for a tag. Drmies (talk) 18:52, 6 November 2013 (UTC)

Thanks for the clarification. Arri at Suburban Express (talk) 21:41, 6 November 2013 (UTC)

Hi Drmies. I did want to notify you that I posted on the Suburban Express talk page. I attempted to keep my conversation relating directly to the content by providing sources that refute the assertions made by Arri at Suburban Express. However, my edit was put in a new section without consent. Since the string ended in not adding much value to the conversation, I apologize. 24.15.78.1 (talk) 21:04, 6 November 2013 (UTC)

I would urge you to not take IP user's claim at face value. Rather, I would ask that you have a look at the evidence. IP user stated that he would not participate in Talk:Suburban Express. When he did, I merely pointed out his prior statement. His claim that he has been "outed" or "harrassed" as a result of the link to his prior statement is without merit. If anything, the opposite is true. This user posted a summary/roadmap for any new editors, then IP sort of went nuts on it - despite his publicly announced self ban. Best Arri at Suburban Express (talk) 21:41, 6 November 2013 (UTC)

I believe that Gaijin42 and Drmies have it dead wrong. <crowd gasps> AggressiveHostile: "So how long have you been socking Drmies if that is your real name?" SlimyHostile: "Oh btw Drmies if you really wish to be called that pseudonym perhaps you are not aware that sockpuppetry is considered a banning offense by some." Simply replace sock with coi. There *is* no way, I will assert, to politely ask somebody what year they stopped clubbing puppies to death. We must really really WP:AGF. See also, WP:ROPE, for the harmony-counterpart. But my new favorite is WP:IMAGINE. Having been working the BLP circuit, I've been accused of being for and against this or that or the other, sometimes aggressively and sometimes passive-aggressively, and it never sits very well with me. Not least cause it ain't true. But even if it were true, even if I did have some sort of COI, it's still rubberizing pillar four, to accuse me thereof. Interrogatively, imperatively, rhetorically, or flat out. 74.192.84.101 (talk) 00:51, 7 November 2013 (UTC)

Well, there's asking and asking. Look, you've made a number of edits to 1972 Andes flight disaster, and I want to thank you for improving that article, especially the section on the condor who got hit by a flying suitcase and couldn't work for a couple of weeks--condors are protected species, and I agree with you that this is an important matter. However, as an admin my interest is in keeping the article neutral, and it seems to me that bringing in first-person testimony from the Parliament of Fowls may run counter to some of our policies (see WP:PRIMARY, for instance). In addition, I'm no expert on the Peruvian legal system, but if I read document X correctly it suggests that that particular testimony was sealed since it was given by a bird who was a minor when it was questioned (and the line of questioning was more than a bit leading--"Do you not agree that the condor was on its way to a dead alpaca for a meal that would have lasted it for a week, even though you probably couldn't see it since you were sitting under your mother?"). This makes me think that you have inside knowledge not widely available to the rest of the avian world, and that maybe you may have been a kind of legal eagle (pardon the pun) in relation to some aspect of the case. Now if (only if!) that's the case, it might be wise to disclose this, since otherwise other editors (and we know one of them was working for the now-disgraced judge who filed against the condor, and for the suitcase manufacturer) may take issue with the information you added solely on the basis of a perceived COI (conflict of interest--see WP:COI). I just want to keep a level playing field, you know. Fly on, free bird--won't you fly high? Drmies (talk) 05:30, 7 November 2013 (UTC)

Okay, now that metaphor just flew over my head.  ;-)   Plucking the serious parts of this turkey, though, I agree that voluntary disclosure is good. When I run across people that are doing editing, either on articles close to them personally (relatives or owners-of-a-biz), or on articles they are paid to do (whether as insider-employees that work for the corporation ... or as outsider-employees that work for some PR/marketroid firm), I recommend that they put their COI stuff right on their userpage. Putting the COI stuff into the username is problematic, per WP:CORPNAME, but there's no prob with User:Arri_at_Suburban_Express methinks, and that seems to be a common best-practice for fulltime employees that edit products or the corporate article linked to where they work.

    But that's voluntary disclosure. It's intended as a preventative measure; if the editor someday gets mixed up in some noticeboard, they can point to their userpage (or even username) and say, here I am, being honest, disclosing my paid COI, following the bright-line-rule by sticking to the talkpages where COI is applicable. Involuntary disclosure, is the other end of the spectrum: imagine if nobody could edit, until they sent notarized proof of their employers for the past decade, as shown on their IRS forms, into the WMF.

    Somewhere in between is the questioning-stuff. But there is almost never a way that the question can come out non-offensively, that I can see. If you ask someone, whether they have anything to declare about their COI, you are implicitly assuming that they do... unless you ask that same question of *every* editor you meet, every time. Of course, in some ways the question is less aggressive than the alternative: "I can see by your edits you're a $foo fanboi" is pretty typical trollish-but-not-quite-a-personal-attack. I don't see much difference in asking it as a question, though... "based on your edits, do you have any conflict-of-interest with respect to $foo that you would like to share with us?" Both seem like Assuming Bad Faith. What sort of asking-and-then-there-is-asking are you hypothesizing, that cannot reasonably be taken the wrong way? ^{(n.b. the preceding message sponsored by the government of Uruguay)} 74.192.84.101 (talk) 07:32, 8 November 2013 (UTC)

Hey Drmies. There's another editor that obviously accepted a paid editing offer from Suburban Express. They haven't been disruptive yet, but now that Suburban Express has been blocked, is that a form of block evasion or meat puppeting? I suppose it should be left alone until there's actually a problem, but we can reasonably expect one I would imagine. I don't know... CorporateM (Talk) 18:05, 7 November 2013 (UTC)

Keep me posted. Or, rather, keep someone else posted, haha. Did I mention I have no interest in the article? Who blocked the Express? I mean, there are other editors better equipped in dealing with these kinds of problems--I can't even gain the confidence of an IP editor, and you've disagreed with me before also. But yeah, let me know if there is a kind of disruption that you think I can handle. Thanks Corp, and good luck with it, Drmies (talk) 18:59, 7 November 2013 (UTC)

You shouldn't take it so hard that I've disagreed with you here and there, but for the record YOU are the one that is WRONG each time!!! :-p

Just kidding around. Hey, when it comes to Mrs. CorporateM, I'm always wrong, so I have to feel right somewhere. CorporateM (Talk) 20:08, 7 November 2013 (UTC)

English Prof

File:Novice Puppies.jpg

Olde English Bulldogge Puppies

I believe you and Dr. Bernie Warren are kindred spirits. Your noses look awfully similar. Bgwhite (talk) 05:47, 5 November 2013 (UTC)

• Indeed, that looks fun. Hafspajen (talk) 13:13, 5 November 2013 (UTC)

Your images

Love the dog mug shot above. And am wondering about your user page interest in decapitations in the fine arts, but am not asking for any explanations. We each of us have baggage.

Now, to the subject at hand. I'm growing weary of stemming the flow of COI edits at the autobiography of Soura Pandey, with no response thus far at the COI and page protection noticeboards. My questions are whether an SPI is merited (I hope not), and if the article is a candidate for AfD. I've avoided that as there's a claim to notability, but I'm not sure where the song charted--Bangladesh, perhaps--or if the chart that's cited carries weight. Any thoughts would be welcome. Cheers, JNW (talk) 14:22, 5 November 2013 (UTC)

• ReverbNation is not a reliable source, and I don't see any "charting" there--unless it's the totally unclear "Rank No.7". The IP is probably the author, sure, but SPI doesn't link IPs to accounts, and at any rate it's nothing we can't handle. Why not try AfD? Not notable and purely promotional, as far as I'm concerned. And if trouble persists, the subject can be made to stop editing, as a promo-only account, if evidence warrants it. Drmies (talk) 15:16, 5 November 2013 (UTC)
  • Thanks. I was also thinking of his connection to the blocked account [1]. JNW (talk) 15:31, 5 November 2013 (UTC)

Turkish massacres

Doc, as an acknowledged expert in the area, do you have any pearls of wisdom to drop here? Abecedare (talk) 17:29, 5 November 2013 (UTC)

• Who, me? Drmies (talk) 17:48, 5 November 2013 (UTC)

Of course.

Three reverts and a warning, and it goes onto my CV and my speaker's bureau bio. What are your standards? :) Abecedare (talk) 17:53, 5 November 2013 (UTC)

There was a bit more to it, as you can see in the discussion; note the long list of removed edits from the history. Thanks for the note; always glad to help. I look forward to the check. Drmies (talk) 18:36, 5 November 2013 (UTC)

It is a pet peeve of mine that threads on AN, ANI etc can languish when they don't involve perennial issues/editors, or need someone to take a look at the content of the dispute. I can imagine that if I were in Fatbob5's position, such unresponsiveness would drive me to edit-warring or away from wikipedia altogether. So, thanks for taking a look (and catching the copyvio). The opportunity to stand up for a fellow-Dutch, I assume, is payment enough. Cheers. Abecedare (talk) 18:49, 5 November 2013 (UTC)

You've got mail!

Hello, Drmies. Please check your email; you've got mail!
Message added 11:37, 6 November 2013 (UTC). It may take a few minutes from the time the email is sent for it to show up in your inbox. You can at any time by removing the {{You've got mail}} or {{ygm}} template.

ES&L 11:37, 6 November 2013 (UTC)

Today

Breakfast, has everybody, page stalkers and the Doctor had breakfast Today? I guess people all around the word will eat their breakfast, some right now, some finished for some hours ago. And I suppose that you had no idea what you were doing, right? Breakfast, I think most people since they do eat breakfast every day, know what thwey do. But some editors think that it is time to bucher this article again. For some time ago almost everything (litterally) got deleted. [2] just like that. There were some ideas pioting that way allready. [3] [4]. Who's who? Never mind. And the Deletions happen every day. The tagg is up again, Primary sources! Original original research! Our not so logical friend is on the warpath, claims ownership of this article and removes every sentence added without a ref on. UNSOURCED! Please, everybody who had some breakfast and can prove this with the right kind of references, add references to the article from your part of the world. SOS. Please. Hafspajen (talk) 14:56, 6 November 2013 (UTC)

• I've had breakfast, thanks, and so have all the other mammals in the house. Baby Liam already has mud on his face; I'm home since he has an ear infection and conjunctivitis (and a ruptured ear drum!), so y'all don't hug him too much since it's contagious. Tack for frukkost, Drmies (talk) 15:06, 6 November 2013 (UTC)

• Oh, my God, that's not good. Did you take him to the doctor? Hafspajen (talk) 15:10, 6 November 2013 (UTC)

• Well, Mrs. Drmies took him yesterday. He's had two loads of antibiotics already since last night and is doing much better. It's the coughing at night that's wrecking Mrs. Drmies and me. But today--Warrington, you should see him. Mrs. Drmies and I still can't believe we make such beautiful children. Drmies (talk) 15:22, 6 November 2013 (UTC)
• Mrs. Drmies I guess is really lovely. Hafspajen (talk) 15:10, 6 November 2013 (UTC)

Help

• DRMIES; I cant use my usurped Warrington-Hafspajen account adress (the one with the 10 000 edits). Somebody got in an autoblocked me. Autoblocked because your IP address was recently used by "NoahS24fgtp". The reason given for NoahS24fgtp's block is: "Spambot". Or what is THIS=[5] And take a look at the post I posted om vandlism, my edits on that. I think somebody blocked me away because I did that. (this is the global Sw account, that is still working, there was a difference since the usurpation, the old one was different from the global. ) Elockid I think blocked me. And I was the one to suggest that? Never did that. Crazy. Or what is THIS all about? a joke? Hafspajen (talk) 17:10, 6 November 2013 (UTC)
• No, not a joke--a glitch of some sort. See WP:ANI, "Help. Quick." You're not the only one. Drmies (talk) 17:30, 6 November 2013 (UTC)

• OK, I take the global account off, not to get blocked there too (a different password) But it may give you a hint that it concentrates on English wIKI. sOME PICTURES GOT SUDDENLY DELETED ON THE oLLDE eNGLISH bULLDOGGE ARTICLE, TOO. mAY BE THE SAME STUFF? OOps. I am logging off now, cant make the edit look better. Hafspajen (talk) 17:43, 6 November 2013 (UTC)

This Ip has nothing to do with the mess? Ip talking about programing..? [6] or it is just a coincidence? Hafspajen (talk) 17:56, 6 November 2013 (UTC)

• Nope, and it has nothing to do with you as you, so to speak (or with Sitush--though I have my doubts about him sometimes). Drmies (talk) 17:59, 6 November 2013 (UTC)

• I'm back going, thanks. (Well, obviously). Couldn't edit anything, not even my own talk page to post the message that the autoblock told me to post. Tbh, I'm surprised that the message gave the option since I would assume that an autoblock completely nukes all ability to edit. A weird wired world, and a frustrating one. - Sitush (talk) 17:58, 6 November 2013 (UTC)
  • Cool. Hey, I got my dad's bike cranked up the other day. First stop, Honda dealer, for a brake job. Drmies (talk) 17:59, 6 November 2013 (UTC)
    • I could do that for you. Take one pair of wire-cutters ... - Sitush (talk) 18:06, 6 November 2013 (UTC)

Schwinn dealer won't work on it, for legal reasons--they say.

• Brake repair job, not brake sabotage job. Also, don't you mean Schwinn dealer? This damn talkpage is so confusing. How can a dog's digging-oriented-nails even activate the trackpad??? — 74.192.84.101 (talk) 00:59, 7 November 2013 (UTC)

• Rear brake is so tight I can barely get it out of the shed. Mine is red--shipped from overseas after its previous owner passed. My brother got his Flat Six. Drmies (talk) 05:13, 7 November 2013 (UTC)

• My apologies and sincere condolences; I did not know. (And those are very cool machines. Pretty soon you too will be a Honda innards expert, perhaps.)   — 74.192.84.101 (talk) 07:49, 8 November 2013 (UTC)

Would any of you have a chance to have a quick peek at Olde English Bulldogge (the article Hafspajen mentions above) to throw some light on what might have happened to the images as they were displaying this morning? The article isn't great but we were trying to work towards helping the editor who put the images in improve it. SagaciousPhil - Chat 18:28, 6 November 2013 (UTC) PS: I love the 'convicted' arrested lab picture at the top of your page!

• HOLD ON SPHILBRICK: BLP violation. Arrested, not necessarily convicted. Who made you an admin? (And the photo is courtesy of Hafspajen, of course--who had to bail his dog out after it made a rude gesture to a Norwegian border guard, I'm told.) Drmies (talk) 18:41, 6 November 2013 (UTC)

Whoops ...... SagaciousPhil - Chat 18:55, 6 November 2013 (UTC)

Wait: am I not committing the same violation by posting the dog's mug shot here? Who should I apologize to? I'm dragging my great-aunt Afra's name through the mud here... Drmies (talk) 19:09, 6 November 2013 (UTC)

Right, that's enough, I'm reporting you both at WP:BLP; well I will when I can work out how to type bl*@dy en/em dashes

Thanks for checking the images, Yngvadottir! SagaciousPhil - Chat 19:23, 6 November 2013 (UTC)

Now it works again, and Mies, you got that story wrong. Not made a rude gesture to a Norwegian border guard, Afra bite the Norwegian border guard, of course. He needed immediate medical care and his trousers fall precariously. That is why Afra was sitting in the jail. Now that was a good idea! Why not make SagaciousPhil an admin? I support the idea. She has goodwill and patience of a saint. What happened with those pictures? What does Yngvadottir and SagaciousPhil knows that I don't? ! Hafspajen (talk) 20:54, 6 November 2013 (UTC)

• 
• 
• 

A box of Chocolates! For Dr Mies and for everybody who tried to save us, poor blocked people. Hafspajen (talk) 20:54, 6 November 2013 (UTC)

You've got mail!

Hello, Drmies. Please check your email; you've got mail!
It may take a few minutes from the time the email is sent for it to show up in your inbox. You can at any time by removing the {{You've got mail}} or {{ygm}} template.

Malke 2010 (talk) 19:44, 6 November 2013 (UTC)

• Dont know how to set up my iPhone for email, sorry. Later. And don't you know it's nap time? Liam and I are "watching" Ajax-Celtic. Drmies (talk) 21:06, 6 November 2013 (UTC)

Match report with a sentiment

Hi there MIES, how's it flowing?

See you watched a nice game with a nice kid by your side, can't beat that (or you can, but right now i want to say you can't :)) Ajax managed to scrape a win, and it looks like the club's youth system is as productive as ever (the oldest guy in the defensive sector was the goalie, born in 1989). Tell me, how proud is the dad of the son and which one do you prefer as a player?

Kind(est) regards as always, keep it up EVERYWHEEEERE! --AL (talk) 22:29, 6 November 2013 (UTC)

• And what did Afra do to deserve being busted? Boy, that mugshot sure screams "guilty"! --AL (talk) 22:32, 6 November 2013 (UTC)

Afra made a rude gesture to a Norwegian border guard, than bite the Norwegian border guard, of course. He needed immediate medical care and his trousers fall precariously (the guard's). So the dog got busted. Hafspajen (talk) 22:56, 6 November 2013 (UTC).

Bad-ass indeed... --AL (talk) 01:13, 7 November 2013 (UTC)

Claning up of gun infoboxes.

Heyo! Saw you were doing some much needed cleaning up of gun infoboxes and getting rid of the flags. One request though, when you remove the flag, can you make sure the country gets WikiLinked? So for example United States → United States instead of just United States. Thanks! --Zackmann08 (talk) 05:48, 7 November 2013 (UTC)

• Zackmann, thanks--but that's WP:OVERLINKING. The US don't need to be linked from an article/infobox like that; it's a major geographical entity. Thanks, Drmies (talk) 05:51, 7 November 2013 (UTC)

Patrice Chéreau

You remember the versatile stage director with hook thoughts here, inspired by Mandarax? He was on, pictured on my talk, no statistics yet, he is down to 200 on a normal day, --Gerda Arendt (talk) 11:29, 8 November 2013 (UTC)

Question about blocks

Hey, Drmies,
I was looking at the procedure of blocking vandals and spammers and I had a question. You blocked Jxlathan1 for using WP as a webhost and a script I have installed says that they had 44 edits. But when I looked at their Contributions page to see how they had misused their user space, it appeared that they had made 0 edits. So, in blocking this user, does the Admin have the tools to erase (revdel?) all of their edits?
I ask because I earlier got into a debate with another Editor/Admin about blocking users and I said sometimes Editors were blocked before they had even made one edit, before they had given evidence of disruption or being WP:NOTHERE. They disagreed that an Admin would ever do that, preemptively block an Editor before they had even edited. But now I realize that Admins might be erasing edits as they block users. If I didn't have this script saying Jxlathan1 had made 44 edits, it would appear like they had been blocked before they had made any edits.
So, I'm not debating whether or not this Editor should have been blocked, I'm just inquiring about the side effects of blocking. It would explain a lot although I'm not sure about "blanking" someone's edit history in case they do return to editing. Thanks, in advance, for your patience. ;-) Liz ^{Read! Talk!} 15:06, 8 November 2013 (UTC)

• (talk page stalker) It's a separate thing from the block, but all that editor's edits were to a now deleted page; once the mess with the edit count widget that's linked at the bottom of editors' contributions pages being transferred over from the Toolserver to Labs is resolved, it will again be possible to see how many deleted edits someone has, in addition to how many live, but only admins (and bureaucrats) can see the actual edits to deleted pages. By the way, having deleted edits in no way implies one has misused Wikipedia; among other things anyone who's tried to improve a page that then got deleted via AfD or otherwise, and anyone who's tagged a page for speedy deletion, has deleted edits. Yngvadottir (talk) 17:40, 8 November 2013 (UTC)
  • Liz, I wouldn't call this editor (and their alter ego, User:Jxlathan) a vandal or a spammer. They used Wikipedia as a webhost, at User:Jxlathan1/sandbox, a fantasy reality game (like a TV show, but made up, and with 2014 dates: "The BBC takes seven individual, independent guys who have serious anger problems who move into a Luxurious Bachelor pad who are Dealt With numerous camera crew who films every minute of the guys personal life and relationships and their fights with each other." That sandbox had 117 edits, by the blocked editor and a dozen IP edits. Those games are played with, I believe, off-wiki coordination; sandboxes on Wikipedia are used to tally scores. That's a clear abuse of our resources.

    Typically, I'll see a sandbox edit by a named account with a redlinked user and talk page in Recent changes, and start snooping. I follow the edits made by the editors, and often find a bunch more. In fact, I just now found User:Jxlathan2/sandbox, and I'll leave that up for a bit so you can see. I don't always block the accounts, and as you can see at User talk:Jxlathan I sometimes take it up with the editor in question--who didn't respond, and is about to get blocked as well.

    But to get to your real question: no there is no revdel going on, and if there were you'd be able to see it. (This is not something to be revdeleted.) You simply can't see deleted contributions because you're not an admin; these accounts typically have no contributions in article space, though Jxlathan had a few, and you can tell from what they were doing that they were practicing or at least displaying their particular interest. If such a sandbox is deleted, no traces of it are left in any of the editors' histories, unless you have admin vision. Does that answer the question? So there is no preemptive blocking. And typically I leave the IPs alone since there's little point in it, though 168.31.88.122 just earned himself one. (Through the IP edits, though, I found there is a connection with North Springs Charter School of Arts and Sciences.)Drmies (talk) 18:04, 8 November 2013 (UTC)

    • Oops, I slipped and deleted that sandbox, but I restored it. After I know you saw this, I'll delete it again. Drmies (talk) 18:07, 8 November 2013 (UTC)
• To answer the other part of your question, Liz, I can think of two circumstances in which a user could be blocked before they've saved a single edit. First is if their username is an egregious violation of the username policy (such as being extremely offensive or an attack name). Second, if they've attempted to make blockable edits but were prevented by edit filters from saving them. Such attempts are logged, and could be cause for a block, but I don't know how often (if ever) this sort of block is issued. MANdARAX • XAЯAbИAM 20:30, 8 November 2013 (UTC)

I didn't consider the inappropriate username (does that happen a lot?) and I don't know enough about edit filters. I should look for some WP page that explains that feature. Thanks, MANdARAX • . Liz ^{Read! Talk!} 21:13, 8 November 2013 (UTC)

• Accounts can also sometimes be blocked by checkusers who have identified a spam nest (they tend to have a pattern to their usernames and use a narrow IP range, and are frequently identified as cross-wiki problem accounts). No point in letting them spam our project when we know that's what they are. Checkusers can also block other alternate accounts set up by sockmasters even if they have not yet been used. Risker (talk) 20:35, 8 November 2013 (UTC)
  • Ha, thank you both. Yes, those are all possibilities. I'm not a CU and I rarely look at edit filters, but the username violation that Mandarax signals is something I run into fairly regularly. I pick out the overtly sexual or fecal ones, and those that suggest racist or anti-gay slurs. Plus, on occasion there's a clear company name or something like that. In all cases it's important to check the edit history if they're not new accounts but, yes, it happens often enough that in such cases no edits are necessary before a block. Thanks again, Mandarax and Risker. Drmies (talk) 20:41, 8 November 2013 (UTC)

Yes, I've wonder if some of them were "sleeper" socks that were caught up in a SPI before they had the chance to start posting edits. Liz ^{Read! Talk!} 21:13, 8 November 2013 (UTC)

Some bubble tea for you!

Thanks for being patient and explaining all of this to me. Much appreciated, Drmies! Liz Read! Talk! 19:00, 8 November 2013 (UTC)

• Sure thing. Now I'm going to blow that sandbox into oblivion. Drmies (talk) 19:13, 8 November 2013 (UTC)

That's the thing about you Admins...you like to blow things up! ;-) Liz ^{Read! Talk!} 19:19, 8 November 2013 (UTC)

Assistance

Hot dog Sadie, still alive and kicking.

Am I supposed to eat this? It tastes good. But it doesn't feel quite right somehow...

Sorry to impose again my Dutch friend, but here it goes: can you please provide a Dutch translation for the references #5 and #6 in Romeo Castelen's article? Thought this guy was dead, football-wise that is!

As a bonus (that could take more time, if you can't help there i'll more than understand it), could you provide a ref for his plane crash found in PERSONAL? I doubt it very much we'll find anything anywhere if not in the Dutch web.

Hearing some Soundgarden as i make these edits today, but who are we kidding? Not getting any younger, the rebel is dying... Ah, and what's with you people and dogs lately in WP? My Labrador friend (not a pet, a friend) died earlier this year, took (even more of) a real toll on me...

Thanks again, regards and happy weekend --AL (talk) 15:14, 8 November 2013 (UTC)

• VASCO, why do I like you so much? Are you maybe just a really nice guy? If you'd visited my brother in Amsterdam, years ago, you might have gone to the Soundgarden--it was his favorite club, but closed a while back. I'll have a look. The dogs, blame Hafspajen (whom I refer to by his old name, "Warrington", just as I continue to call you VASCOOOOO!) for that. There's a picture of my hot dog here somewhere; I'll dig it up. Sorry to hear about your dog. Will you get a new one? Can a dog be "replaced"? Can one love another dog after the one has died? My Sadie is my first dog ever and I don't want to live without her; she's lying here next to me, warming up in the November sun on the deck. Ah Sadie. Drmies (talk) 15:58, 8 November 2013 (UTC)

• No you can't ("replace"), yes you can (love the next as much as the previous), love is there aplenty, unfortunately so is hate, but that's something for humans to "enjoy", not the pure animals. Keep it up --AL (talk) 17:04, 8 November 2013 (UTC)

• Best thing is to get into the saddle again and don't wait to much. Puppys are cute and cuddly and if you belive in reincarnation, who knows... For inspiration, see how cute Afra was ( before he got into the life and practice of bandits...) Warrington (talk) 22:00, 8 November 2013 (UTC)

Zack Peter

Hey, Drmies,
I saw the pruning you did to the self-promotional article on Micah Jesse and wondered if you could give the same treatment to Zack Peter which seems to be another self-authored piece (by Zgrep). Most of my editing in article space has been tweaks (tags, typos, grammar, references, etc.) so I'm not sure in an article like this what is considered essential and what is fluff. I'm a little gun-shy about removing large chunks of a BLP but I think this article could use some pruning.
And now, I will stay off your talk page and move on to some other activity! Liz ^{Read! Talk!} 19:53, 8 November 2013 (UTC)

• I got a better one for you: submit it for deletion. Here's what I often do in such cases: look through the lead and the article, start some easy pruning (as I did in one edit), and then assess. I saw a bunch of whining complaining about how supposedly he faces so much unfair criticism, and I had seen the references already--most to his own stuff. Likewise with the complaints: they were sourced to his book, more importantly, to his LuLu-published book. Boom, not notable. At least, a very righteous indication of non-notability, placing the "writer" claim in much doubt; these suspicions were confirmed in a second by Google News which produced nothing. Nominate it, as vanispam for a non-notable person: no significant coverage of the books or the charity work. A picture on a red carpet and a couple of blog or social site hits don't add up to notability. (Confirm this yourself by looking through the references and searching Google--the Examiner "recognition" is nothing, even if he had won something.) Good luck! Drmies (talk) 20:06, 8 November 2013 (UTC)

Sooooooo, what you're suggesting is rolling up my sleeves, getting my hands dirty and getting down to work? Okay. I don't check references often enough unless they look really bogus.

I don't nominate many AfDs because I've nominated 3 or 4 pieces which were in much, much worse shape that either of these articles and they were kept. I still don't get the AfD area, some articles I think are valuable are deleted while an article about some "glamour model" from the 1970s that I nominated is saved. So, I don't trust my judgment there yet. I've had better luck at CfD.

I will say that I'm seeing more and more of these BLPs from folks who are under 30 years old, like bloggers or kids with a YouTube channel, who write their own articles. They are smart enough to collect a lot of references so they don't immediately look like junk. But they are only "notable" to their Twitter followers. Liz ^{Read! Talk!} 21:09, 8 November 2013 (UTC)

Well, create Zack Peter on Twitter! And yes, you're right. Drmies (talk) 21:56, 8 November 2013 (UTC)

Quick Question

This discussion has been closed. Please do not modify it.
The following discussion has been closed. Please do not modify it.
How does making serious allegations agains me without evidence not constitute a personal attack? PantherLeapord|My talk page|My CSD log 22:49, 8 November 2013 (UTC) There aren't quick answers to a loaded question. Drmies (talk) 23:01, 8 November 2013 (UTC) I didn't say you had to respond right away! Take as much time as you need to answer! PantherLeapord|My talk page|My CSD log 23:10, 8 November 2013 (UTC) OK, but I don't think you understood me. It's a loaded question, and I am not going to answer it. If you want some unasked-for advice, you should try making friends here before you get blocked indefinitely. A little birdie was saying that you only have a few hundred article edits and have caused a lot of disruption, and that you're not worth keeping around. That's not my opinion, but I say that only because I haven't looked very closely. If I were you, I'd look again all the things you said about ESL, and all the things you claim they said about you (that is, your interpretation thereof), and think. Drmies (talk) 23:21, 8 November 2013 (UTC) Well then I would like to insist that you DO look closely. Look at the evidence I put up. I don't charge in blindly to a situation as I prefer to get the facts before raising my voice. And this is not a loaded question; just an honest question from someone who is genuinely confused as to how a personal attack is not a personal attack! PantherLeapord|My talk page|My CSD log 23:27, 8 November 2013 (UTC) If you don't understand how your "without evidence" makes the question a loaded question, then I really don't have to be surprised at your being in hot water. I looked at the diffs in that form you filled out (I think it's a silly form, but hey, that's the Panda's thing), and I did not see what you said we were supposed to see there. There are no "facts" here, there are interpretations--although there is perhaps one fact: very few people agree with your reading of events. That should tell you something. You're wasting your time here because you are wrong in the basic premise, that you were not wrong. Drmies (talk) 23:47, 8 November 2013 (UTC) If you don't understand how calling me incompetent without evidence and making personal attacks is bad behaviour (Most likely because BWilkins/ES&L is an admin and that has blinded you from the facts) then I have nothing more to say to you. Until such time as you remove your bias towards admins never being wrong then you are also politely requested to not post on my talk page or alter any pages in my userspace in any way. PantherLeapord|My talk page|My CSD log 23:59, 8 November 2013 (UTC) Now how did I know it was going to end this way? Editor who is in hot water comes here, falsely claims that false claims are made, asks for an honest opinion, is given an honest opinion, doesn't like the honest opinion, and then complains that false accusations are made. You don't have to politely (read, "passive-aggressively") ask me not to post on your talk page, since I have no desire to go there--unless, of course, it becomes my duty to post a blocking template there if the community decides to block you indefinitely, which, given your behavior here, is very likely to happen. Now go away and stay away. (I'm not asking politely, I'm telling you.) Drmies (talk) 00:03, 9 November 2013 (UTC)

A barnstar for you!

	The Resilient Barnstar
	You are the pride and joy of Wikipedia! Without people like you Wikipedia would not move forward! Banaster Giver Extra Polite (talk) 11:37, 9 November 2013 (UTC)

A beer for you!

I'm giving you this just because I want to and I think you certainly deserve it. Kudpung กุดผึ้ง (talk) 13:13, 9 November 2013 (UTC)

• At 8 in the AM, dear Kudpung?? I'm still drinking coffee! I suppose it's already cocktail time where you're at? Thanks, but I don't think I've done much recently--certainly nothing to expand our beautiful project. Drmies (talk) 14:04, 9 November 2013 (UTC)

Attribute synthesis

I think the use of the negative "diatribe" rather than the more neutral "posting" or the more positive "explanation" is a nice use of rhetoric. To whom did I "attribute synthesis"? -- PBS (talk) 16:59, 9 November 2013 (UTC)

• That section, and especially the last sentence ("By the interpretation of syn that of your statement above seems to suggest...") is difficult to parse, but "to the writers of the article" in the most general sense fits the bill. You know what, I'll strike "diatribe"; point taken. The fact remains, however, that there is no reason to expect that anything good can come out of your involvement with that article, and I'll leave it at that. Thank you, Drmies (talk) 17:12, 9 November 2013 (UTC)

I think you have it the wrong way around, I was replying to a comment by PoD "but until then anything we add is mostly synthesis", and pointing out that summarising different sources is not a synthesis. I quoted WP:SYN to explain what synthesis means (as Wikpeida policy defines it) to those who might read the talk page and not be familiar with the NOR policy. So I did not attribute synthesis to anyone -- quite the contrary. -- PBS (talk) 19:07, 9 November 2013 (UTC)

Maybe so. Maybe I need to read it again. Drmies (talk) 23:28, 9 November 2013 (UTC)

List of Bollywood films of 2013

Will you please protect it, indefinitely this time? As you know Indian articles, specially those which are related to films are subjected to heavy disruption as well as addition of unsourced or unreliable if the former is present. IPs are rampant there. Indian film articles Boxoffices collections are updated with the help of Boxofficeindia.com which was chosen by contributors as the reputed source to be consulted through consensus. But with the advent of various info-tainment websites like Bollywoodhungama.com and Koimoi.com which are related to these films as their PR Agents. Now sites like these either out of bias or to simply be popular post inflated collections, now the fans of certain stars try to add collections that are either demeaning to their co-star or opponents in the field. Now this article is being ravaged because of that. Hope my appeal is convincing enough. Thanks,Soham Banerjee 17:30, 9 November 2013 (UTC)

• I've given you six months; indefinite is usually reserved for articles suffering from vandalism, and here it seems to be...well, good--faith incompetence. ("Competence" being defined here as "understanding Wikipedia's guidelines and policies and editing accordingly", or something like that.) And as a side note: I see very little information in edit summaries, even in reverts, to indicate what's going on.

  Now, I don't wish to dive into this topic too much. If you say there is consensus, I hope you are able to point to a discussion on the talk page, on the RS noticeboard, or to some RfC somewhere. (Don't point to it--I don't need to know, I just need you to know.) But if you wish to discredit the sites you mentioned you need consensus as well: if one source is deemed alright, via consensus, that doesn't mean that another source is not. Thank you, Drmies (talk) 17:41, 9 November 2013 (UTC)

Actually WP:COMPETENCE is a issue here. When I first came to here, I too faced the same issue, which source to add? Alas if only you were an Indian, you would have understood the severity. After going through at least 100 or so edits made by IP's and recently registered ones with red links to their talk pages, I just wanted the closet to [Article] be cleaned. Thanks for protecting it. Soham Banerjee 17:51, 9 November 2013 (UTC)

If I were Indian I'd have something much more exciting for lunch, no doubt, than canned soup and a sandwich (again!). Drmies (talk) 17:52, 9 November 2013 (UTC)

(talk page stalker) List of Bollywood films of 2013 is one of the most viewed pages on wikipedia, with 1.5 million visitors/month and yet has only ~50 page watchers to spot and revert the inevitable sub-standard edits. (compare with say Bollywood with 1/10th the views and 5 times the number of page watchers). Semi-protection should work for now, but come January when List of Bollywood films of 2014 inherits the top-spot, it would be a good idea to post a message at WP:FILM, WP:INCINE, WT:INB etc and request regular editors to add it to their watchlist. Abecedare (talk) 18:16, 9 November 2013 (UTC)

• Sure, but what about my lunch? For now, it seems that it'll be ramen noodles. Drmies (talk) 18:24, 9 November 2013 (UTC)

• Here, have something 2.5 billion people came together to invent: . Abecedare (talk) 18:35, 9 November 2013 (UTC)

• Yeah, but which of them actually made the dish? As for your can, Drmies, surely you know how to make something better than a can of soup? Are you being neglected by Mrs. Drmies? In any event, I'm sure it's a legendary can made by a famous Indian celebrity, who is the father of the Indian cinema and has single-handedly revolutionized cinematography as India and the world know it. He comes from a long family of towering figures in the Indian arts and yet has adapted to the contemporary culture with a talent and flexibility that is nothing short of stunning.--Bbb23 (talk) 18:41, 9 November 2013 (UTC)

• I presume that it is not a can of Mulligatawny then? Mmmm-hm. - Sitush (talk) 18:47, 9 November 2013 (UTC)

• Offering cauliflower to a Dutchman "by way of variety" is kind of an insult, but I have to admit, this looks impressive. No can of soup: ramen noodles and Frito Pie. Mrs. Drmies doesn't neglect me so much as she doesn't do the cooking around here, I do. Plus, she's at some training of some sort, leaving me here with three cranky and overexcited mammals (not counting the dogs). Bon appetit y'all, and for tonight, Roll Tide. Drmies (talk) 18:50, 9 November 2013 (UTC)

• I had Devilled kidneys on toast for lunch today - five minutes to cook. I don't care what our article says, I'm convinced that is an Anglo-Indian dish. If Boswell wrote of it then he knew someone who'd been out there. Like kedgeree, the thing tastes better than it looks. I'm still trying to work out Bbb's teaser. (Not really. )- Sitush (talk) 19:37, 9 November 2013 (UTC)

• I wonder if eating devilled kidneys improves one's kidney function, or if one has to eat heavenly kidneys for that, and hopefully not posthmously. As for my "teaser", it's my usual lame humour. In my description of the soup can, I was trying to mimic the superlatives used in many Indian articles.--Bbb23 (talk) 19:52, 9 November 2013 (UTC)

• Not lame. I was just slow on the uptake and realised as soon as I posted (hence my amendment) I've been doing too much WP'ing (Makin' WPee ?) today and I've also recently discovered WP:PINQ - that thing that I sometimes dare to call a brain is fried. - Sitush (talk) 20:05, 9 November 2013 (UTC)

• Bbb, you did fine, but next time make sure to wikilink every other word and include measurements and numbers incomprehensible to the Western mind, like 20 Rs something. Sitush, that's revolting. Why would you want to eak kidneys? Drmies (talk) 23:24, 9 November 2013 (UTC)
  • Why do we like to eat burned muscle (or raw, if you like your steak rare, as you should)? Why is one weirder than the other? Writ Keeper ⚇♔ 16:46, 10 November 2013 (UTC)
    • Without wanting to get too judgmental, Writ Keeper, you're talking about fucking kidneys. Muscle is tasty, offal is not. And I like my steak rare. Besides, I have no doubt Sitush got his kidneys out of a can. Ew. But you got me all hungry for steak now and, as the girls say, "Steak is a fake in a big, big lake." Drmies (talk) 17:00, 10 November 2013 (UTC)

With some small apologies to those who are about to eat ... and a suggestion that you have your anti-emetics to hand. I sometimes dip into Schwabe, Calvin W. (1979). Unmentionable Cusine. University Press of Virginia. ISBN 0-8139-0811-6. Schwabe is, according to the blurb, "a recognised authority on nutrition and a veteran observer of the world food situation ... He presents here a collection of recipes that offer alternative to our narrow-based diet ... The significance of this book is unquestionable. Americans must find more efficient and varied ways to eat if they are to survive." Etc. It is not a cookbook: he has gathered standard eating practices for millions of people around the world that are unknown (or, at least, bloody unusual) in the US. Fascinating, if slightly disconcerting - things to do with cats etc and an entire chapter on "Milk, Eggs, and Sperm". His opening sentence is "Because of prejudice or ignorance, we Americans now reject many readily available foods that are cheap, nutritious, and good to eat." Purely on the grounds of sense, I'd query the "now" ('twas it ever thus?) but any rejections that previously were due to ignorance will certainly remain rejected due to prejudice after reading the damn thing.

And on a different culinary matter, a recent edition of the British QI TV programme said that the jerusalem artichoke is the only vegetable native to North America. Apparently, it does not come from Jerusalem and is not an artichoke, so I guess that bit at least rings true to all of us who have tried to square the marketing circle of where the ham is in a hamburger or the dog may be in a hot dog. Of course, the "devil" in "devilled kidneys" is obvious to any pedant - it is in the detail ;) - Sitush (talk) 00:11, 14 November 2013 (UTC)

And I see that we do not have an article for Schwabe. I might have to fix that, once I've fettled William Beach Thomas. - Sitush (talk) 00:51, 14 November 2013 (UTC)

Indeed

File:Rubber Duck (8374802487).jpg

I saw, professor. Lately, I've witnessed you approach certain contentious situations with tranquility and grace. I'm just taking a page from your book :) Tiderolls 17:57, 9 November 2013 (UTC) Roll Tide.

• Hmmm. Sometimes, tranquility and grace simply results in more work [7]. Oh, well. Tiderolls 18:08, 9 November 2013 (UTC)
  • Tranquility comes with age. I'll never acquire grace, I'm afraid, but thank you for telling such sweet lies, and thank you for trying.

    Hey, I figured it out with this game I'm watching now: I'm rooting for Tennessee. It's my former employer against my current employer, but my current employer refuses let us (on the satellite campus) set our own schedule, with the result that my kids and I (and Mrs. Drmies) never have spring break at the same time. We should go with the schedule of the local school system--obviously. Whoa, Vandy is leading FL 17-0? Is the world coming to an end? Drmies (talk) 18:20, 9 November 2013 (UTC)

  • You can always try acquiring some irresistible grace than. Hafspajen (talk) 00:35, 10 November 2013 (UTC)

• Good luck with that. I've been trying to mimic Drmies humor for ages, but it just comes out as bad jokes. ;-) CorporateM (Talk) 05:02, 10 November 2013 (UTC)

• You know, CorporateM, it's probably because you don't have two lovely children that insist on acting like total assholes, starting at 6:30 on Sunday morning. Kelapstick, is there a train that rides from Montgomery to Canada? I'm not even trying to be funny anymore--it's just a long, dull ride to the end of the line, hoping that I'll reach that final destination before Mrs. Drmies does. (Actually, I'm counting on that.) Drmies (talk) 14:50, 10 November 2013 (UTC)

• Now, now it can't be that difficult, that. You should try to keep up with the Gareth Griffith-Jones / PaleCloudedWhite / Martinevans123 trio, that is what I call difficult! Hafspajen (talk) 21:34, 10 November 2013 (UTC)

• On second thought, were you such a little angel, Mies, when you were a little boy? I wonder... You probably pulled all the cats tails, made a mess with the toothpaste and refused to eat your spinach! And your parents went probably: What to do if todler keeps pulling on cat's tail? And on top of all that, you did blow up your rubber duck with your dad's bicycle pump! Hafspajen (talk) 10:10, 12 November 2013 (UTC)

Hi

Just selecting you randomly for this question as someone who knows what he's doing. I saw an incident of an admin threatening to use then using his tools to block a newbie user over editing an article that the admin him/herself was deeply engaged/involved in. At the time I looked for where the 3rd party (admin by admin?) review takes place and couldn't find it. But then I forgot and of course now it's way too cold and irrelevant, but for my own information could you point me to the place and then I'll note it so I know next time. Keep up all the good work btw. In ictu oculi (talk) 03:17, 11 November 2013 (UTC)

• Hmm. Well, what you're painting is admin abuse, pure and simple. I can't tell of course if you're painting a truthful picture, and there are variables--the biggest one being the depth of engagement you signaled (there are considerable differences in opinion on what constitutes involvement). The proper place, I think, is ANI if it's truly an "incident", and not a pattern of behavior. Well, even if it's a pattern ANI is a good place for initial discussion. But you know, us admins stick together through thick and thin so you should expect to get blocked yourself, haha. Feel free to email me, if you like, and if you think it's worth sharing (cold does not mean irrelevant, in my opinion). What I hate more than clamor about admin abuse is actual admin abuse. Drmies (talk) 04:04, 11 November 2013 (UTC)

I thought there was an actual place, an ombudsman kind of thing - like every other community has these days - I don't think one old cold case is worth digging up, as haven't seen repeats, but then I haven't been looking. What would be more of an issue would be any community which hands out powers, but has no invigilation/compliance mechanism, no "internal affairs" department. In which case that's a structural/cultural issue that should be raised at Village Pump - but the person who raises it should be blocked ;). No worry, as long as its someone else's problem it's their problem. Cheers. In ictu oculi (talk) 06:46, 11 November 2013 (UTC)

Can we start thinking about an ombudspeople kind of thing? - You get restricted by the arbs, your only place to appeal is the same arbs, who didn't understand you in the first place, - I didn't even appeal. --Gerda Arendt (talk) 08:51, 11 November 2013 (UTC)

In octu, in principle ANI is the place to go for such issues, as I said. Our court of public opinion sometimes functions like a court of appeal. But seriously, if this was, in your opinion, a violation of admin privileges I really want to hear it, and perhaps I can do something about it. (Yes Gerda, Securitate-style--without an ombudsperson it's best to have a secret force inside the secret force.) Drmies (talk) 14:29, 11 November 2013 (UTC)

Sockpuppets

After noticing your comment about Blade-of-the-South (talk · contribs)'s bragging about already having another sockpuppet, I did check his account. The following accounts are all  Confirmed:

• Angelica-Dominus-Sabre (talk⁺ · tag · contribs · deleted contribs · logs · filter log · block user · block log · CA · CheckUser(log) · investigate · cuwiki)
• Blade-from-the-Antipodies (talk⁺ · tag · contribs · deleted contribs · logs · filter log · block user · block log · CA · CheckUser(log) · investigate · cuwiki)
• Blade-of-the-South (talk⁺ · tag · contribs · deleted contribs · logs · filter log · block user · block log · CA · CheckUser(log) · investigate · cuwiki)
• Valkyrie 06 (talk⁺ · tag · contribs · deleted contribs · logs · filter log · block user · block log · CA · CheckUser(log) · investigate · cuwiki)

I've blocked the socks, and there's another account I'm still checking. Cheers! Reaper Eternal (talk) 03:26, 11 November 2013 (UTC)

• Thanks Reaper. Did you see my note at Wikipedia:Sockpuppet investigations/Blade-of-the-South/Archive? (I'd file the paperwork if I knew how.) Drmies (talk) 03:48, 11 November 2013 (UTC)

• Reaper provided a diff for your edit to the archive in his opening statement here (see "your comment" above).--Bbb23 (talk) 15:22, 11 November 2013 (UTC)

• Oh. Duh. Yeah. Maybe I got student bus fare on my mind, and Abusive Admin Scandals. Plus, again my naps this weekend were interrupted. Drmies (talk) 18:24, 11 November 2013 (UTC)

Surprise, surprise, surprise. I believe Blade-of-the-South also said he formerly operated an account under User:No_More_Religion, as mentioned on User talk:Valkyrie 06 -- anything coming up there? -Kudzu1 (talk) 04:22, 11 November 2013 (UTC)

Ah, here: No-More-Religion just redirects to User:Blade-of-the-South. -Kudzu1 (talk) 04:23, 11 November 2013 (UTC)

It was renamed. He was also HumusCowboy. I think he was on the run from the intel boys in Langley. Drmies (talk) 04:26, 11 November 2013 (UTC)

I took it upon myself to tag the more recent socks and add the abuse of multiple accounts template to User:Blade-of-the-South. Hopefully that's all good and proper. -Kudzu1 (talk) 04:54, 11 November 2013 (UTC)

A "silent" redaction edit summary is almost as good as a {{hat}} for attracting attention ... irony? NE Ent 14:36, 11 November 2013 (UTC)

• Maybe. Drmies (talk) 16:33, 11 November 2013 (UTC)

IP back for the fourth time

Hi Drmies! I've come to report the dynamic IP Special:Contributions/90.199.99.135 whose other addresses have been blocked three times in the past month. Since Bish is on a Wikibreak, I've come here. Long story short, IP causes mass disruptive pointless changes to articles on films, here's my most recent complaint at Bish's talk page here (which I think also has links to the first and second ANI posts) and also read the ANI post here. As you can see the IP is undoing what User:MarnetteD cleaned-up again. This is a really persistent fellow and do what is needed. Thanks in advance, Ugog Nizdast (talk) 13:53, 11 November 2013 (UTC)

• Well, I blocked them for two weeks which is about all I can do. I suppose a range block has been investigated and found to be impossible? I'll ping Kww; perhaps Kevin has a better idea on what to do. For now it's just whacking moles: thank you for your vigilance. MarnetteD, please feel free to drop me a line here the next time. I hope Bishonen comes back soon: without her, Wikipedia is kind of like a tea party without crumpets. Drmies (talk) 16:40, 11 November 2013 (UTC)

Thanks for the ping. There was some talk about a range block here [8] but I don't remember if anything was decided. Thanks also for letting us know that we can notify you when the next IP shows up and I agree completely with your sentiments about Bish. MarnetteD | Talk 16:47, 11 November 2013 (UTC)

If I'm not mistaken, it was decided there that a full-range block was not feasible since there were also constructive edits made by some of the addresses. Nice work, Bish did say there's nothing more we can do other than play whack-a-vandal and block each of the addresses as they show up. Nice dog, by the way. -Ugog Nizdast (talk) 18:15, 11 November 2013 (UTC)

Thanks. It's not mine. It's pining away in a Norwegian jail, probably without ever having gone to trial. Or maybe you meant Spiffy's dog? That's a National Treasure of Expatriate Tamil Contingency. Drmies (talk) 18:22, 11 November 2013 (UTC)

I could retranslate this but I should turn my attention to Old Norse right now and then sleeeeep ...

From the 12th century the abbey was a rather elitist, aristocratic ladies pen and began to behave like a chapter of canons ash, led by a princess-abbess. ... and etc. in similar vein. Yngvadottir (talk) 19:58, 11 November 2013 (UTC)

• What's the problem? Unless "ash" is an abbreviation for "assholes" of course. Hey, have you read A Time to Keep Silence? Drmies (talk) 20:31, 11 November 2013 (UTC)

United Chinese Duck farms

At least, that loud is the quacking from User talk:Kevinfrombk from the blocked side and User talk:Kevindob94 from the active side. With the tricks and disruption here I think a WP:SPI is a waste of time... The Banner talk 00:28, 12 November 2013 (UTC) Never mind, I go through WP:RPP and WP:SPI because this is a bigger mess than originally expected. The Banner talk 00:42, 12 November 2013 (UTC)

• You do that. In the meantime I blocked one of your Kevins and semi-protected the page. Happy days, Drmies (talk) 01:11, 12 November 2013 (UTC)
  • Thanks! FYI: Wikipedia:Sockpuppet investigations/NYCSlover The Banner talk 01:24, 12 November 2013 (UTC)
    • Yes, I was getting to that. I see Tide rolls blocked one of your Kevins as a NYCSlover sock (BTW, New York City Subway Lover), and I don't see why. No doubt he'll explain once he's over his LSU hangover. Drmies (talk) 02:24, 12 November 2013 (UTC)
• Hi, professor. Hi, The Banner. The connection I saw with NYCSlover was video games, wrestling and the ubiquitous subway edits (and the persistent user talk tantrums). If I've misnamed the socker or stepped on toes, please let me know and I'll do what I can to help with the fix. See ya 'round Tiderolls 03:06, 12 November 2013 (UTC)
  • OK, I looked at all of Kevinfrombk's contributions. There's actually no subway edits--the L is above ground. (It's in their first dozen edits.) No, I don't think Kevin is the subway lover. I don't know if there's CU evidence available from subway kid. Drmies (talk) 03:51, 12 November 2013 (UTC)
    • Hi, User:Tide rolls. It is de mentioned IP that has a lot of New York City Subway service edits. So (s)he fits the NYCSlover-profile. The Banner talk 11:00, 12 November 2013 (UTC)

Regional brewery alert

)

Greetings! Wish you stop grave-talking all the time. Hafspajen (talk) 17:38, 12 November 2013 (UTC)

Do not bother with Cathedral Square (Missouri) Hail Mary Belgian-Style IPA--might as well be Keystone.  davidiad { t } 02:22, 12 November 2013 (UTC)

• Ha, that's a sad statement. I've never had Keystone, and I'm probably going to my grave without ever having it. Wynn-Dixie still has Goose Island on sale, $7 for a six pack; I have the red, Mrs. Drmies the green. Hey, Merry Christmas. The ads are all over TV already. Drmies (talk) 02:48, 12 November 2013 (UTC)

• I've never seen a Wynn-Dixie. You're neck deep in the American South. Hey, do you have access to A. Casanova, "Le nipoti di Atamante nel Catalogo esiodeo", Studi Italiani di filologia Classica 40 (1968) 169–77? My .pdf is corrupt and I want to get an article out. Yale's copy was stolen and I'm up a tree.  davidiad { t } 05:09, 12 November 2013 (UTC)

• Nope. Not through our databases, not in any of the allied Alabama libraries. Back in the old days I would ask Ucucha, but he's gone corporate. Drmies (talk) 05:14, 12 November 2013 (UTC)

• Thanks for checking. You're a real Mensch. Get to a school with a decent library.  davidiad { t } 05:39, 12 November 2013 (UTC)

• davidiad, I put in an ILL request for you and will email you the article if they can get it for me. Drmies (talk) 17:10, 12 November 2013 (UTC)

• That's very helpful of you---Thanks!

Jose Ducos-Bello

Where do I click to contest the speedy deletion of the bio on José Ducos-Bello, the CBP whistleblower who uncovered as much as $300 million in corruption at DHS?Pr4ever (talk) 09:12, 12 November 2013 (UTC)

• Well, it was recreated under Jose Rafael Ducos Bello. Surely you know that. I've again nominated that for speedy deletion. I suggest you try going through WP:AFC. Drmies (talk) 15:23, 12 November 2013 (UTC)

John A. Coleman Catholic High School

Your warning didn't stop PR12477, he reverted again (diff) and commented on my talk page. The entire article has also been blanked once by an IP geolocating to the general area of the school. Thomas.W ^{talk to me} 18:16, 12 November 2013 (UTC)

• I reported them at ANEW. I suppose I could have blocked them, but with such hardheaded editors I'd prefer it if someone else did. Thanks, Drmies (talk) 18:22, 12 November 2013 (UTC)
• Tell you what, I wouldn't be surprised if that IP was our sparring partner, thinking that being logged out (and blanking the article out of spite) would somehow make it right. Drmies (talk) 18:24, 12 November 2013 (UTC)

Here is the sheldon stuff. (wise guy?), or something like that. Hafspajen (talk) 19:48, 12 November 2013 (UTC)

• Ha, maybe he was referring to the second meaning. Drmies (talk) 20:04, 12 November 2013 (UTC)

• Like:Very fit, has an athletic build, will usually be the strongest male in the room? Hafspajen (talk) 20:11, 12 November 2013 (UTC)

• Yeah, and especially what followed. Well, he's blocked now, and with 24h he can count himself lucky. Drmies (talk) 21:32, 12 November 2013 (UTC)

• William Herbert Sheldon? Defined psychology in terms of body type; mesomorph, ectomorph, endomorph, and just plain morph.Xanthomelanoussprog (talk) 16:01, 13 November 2013 (UTC)

A cookie for you!

Thank you for stopping by to close a few long term open discussions at WP:NFCR. We don't see many administrators close there, so some of us non-admins try to do the easy stuff. Your work is much appreciated. -- ТимофейЛееСуда. 04:55, 13 November 2013 (UTC)

• Thanks, that's very nice--though, as the Dutch say, it's a mouse that may still have a tail left. Drmies (talk) 13:11, 13 November 2013 (UTC)

Sluffs

I know that you have previously warned this user about harassing other editors, and I hoping you can do so again. He and I are involved in a dispute at the John Coltrane article, and he insists on voicing his opinions on my talk page, even after I asked him not to, and then again after I removed his messages. Frankly, I am sick of his opinions and belligerent attitude. As I am clearly not getting through to him, can you ask him to stay off my talk page? Anything he has to say can be said on the article talk page. --The Old Jacobite_{The '45} 14:34, 13 November 2013 (UTC)

You may want to take a f*cking look at this g*dd*mn thread here Wikipedia:Village_pump_(idea_lab)#Banning_administrators_from_using_the_word_.22fuck.22_and_all_derivatives, but only if you have a sh*tload of time on your hands.--Obi-Wan Kenobi (talk) 14:48, 13 November 2013 (UTC)

Oh, I glanced at it, but I have less important things to do with my time than read that... ---The Old Jacobite_{The '45} 15:41, 13 November 2013 (UTC)

Jacobite, no good will come from a warning issued by yours truly. The best thing to do is to a. go through the usual talk page, RfC, DR etc kind of thing, or b. if that fails to start an ANI thread. I'm not going to act against this user, not because he doesn't deserve it, but because I don't want to read the drivel that will result from it. FWIW, I agree with your Coltrane edit (that "based on" or whatever is just silly), and I have yet to see whether that editor is a net positive. Sorry. Drmies (talk) 18:06, 13 November 2013 (UTC)

As your unofficial illegal counsel: I advise Sluffs and Drmies to remain at least 500 kilobytes apart at all times. I would go into more details, but it would violate my own restraining disorder with regard to Sluffs. Writ Keeper ⚇♔ 18:13, 13 November 2013 (UTC)

I understand and appreciate your comments, Drmies. I have actually been weighing the costs and benefits of engaging in any further discussion/debate on the Coltrane talk page, precisely because I find his whole approach, as well as his specific edits, and his talk page comments, so off-putting and truly unhelpful. His changes to the Coltrane article have been negative, and I hate letting it stand, but getting into a fight with him will accomplish nothing. Alas... this is a situation in which either choice seems like a bad one. ---The Old Jacobite_{The '45} 01:43, 14 November 2013 (UTC)

Well, engaging with him is no longer really an option; he's been blocked indefinitely with talk page access revoked. Writ Keeper ⚇♔ 01:47, 14 November 2013 (UTC)

That's that, then. ---The Old Jacobite_{The '45} 15:32, 14 November 2013 (UTC)

Language guys

Hey, you're one. Is Errors in Early Word Use‎ as synthy (how's that for language?) as I think it is? My eyes keep glazing over when I try to read it. Writ Keeper ⚇♔ 17:43, 13 November 2013 (UTC)

• That word is fine with me. Yes, you're right. The individual processes are important in early language learning (which is a surprisingly difficult field, and there's still a lot to learn), but to lump them together under the non-neutral (at least unhelpful) word "errors" is erroneous. Drmies (talk) 17:54, 13 November 2013 (UTC)

In searching for copy vios (several close paraphrases found, but nothing horrible), I came across https://www.msu.edu/~mandrews/mary/handouts_lang.htm which implies "Childhood Language Errors" is perhaps a topic. Between the nice overlap in this syllabus, the decently obscure academic sources used, and the article author's username (RealName1022) - my guess is that this article is probably being done as an assignment for a college class somewhere. Gaijin42 (talk) 17:59, 13 November 2013 (UTC)

I thought so too, though without the fancy footwork you did (and thus, without the evidence). Mind you, there's a difference between "topic" (in the sense of "topic in a class") and "encyclopedic subject": in class, we're free to be as synthy as we want to be, Flock of Seagulls and all. Drmies (talk) 18:02, 13 November 2013 (UTC)

We also might be running into a duplicate article issue Regularization_(linguistics) (Im assuming some of the other error types have articles as well. Gaijin42 (talk) 18:03, 13 November 2013 (UTC)

I agree with Gaijin42 in that characterizing these phenomena as semantic errors is widespread and "normal" in the literature and that it also a legitimate and useful topic. In my view it's not synthesis either. It's a pretty straight reporting of the major views in the field. While sourced exclusively to journal articles, the authors are certainly not obscure. Rescorla has published widely in this field, as have Gentner and Eve and Herbert Clark. Many of their studies are classics in the field. It's not a duplicate of Regularization (linguistics) either. It's focused purely on semantic development, and on;y some semantic errors in early language acquisition are instances of over-regularization. Incidentally, the latter article is very poor. Voceditenore (talk) 18:15, 13 November 2013 (UTC)

• I'm no expert in the topic, but I happened to have done quite a bit of reading last semester (prompted by a remark in HEL) and did not come across the "error" terminology. I will gladly stand corrected, and if you're willing to do some work on the article something good may happen. Thanks, Drmies (talk) 18:21, 13 November 2013 (UTC)

Okay, I'll keep it on my watchlist but otherwise leave it be for now. One way or another, it's above my pay grade. Writ Keeper ⚇♔ 18:19, 13 November 2013 (UTC)

Flags Comment

"why this flag? there's two others to choose from, depending on the date. why a flag at all?"

Respnding to a recent edit you made to 7th Arkansas Field Battery. The short answer to why a flag at all is that at this point there are probably 120 articles on Arkansas Confederate units and at least 12 on Arkansas Union units and they have a flag in this field for allegiance. If you look at other simular articles I think it is the common pratice.

The question of "why this flag" is fair and I have changed it back to the 2nd National Flag. . There are well documented accounts of this flag being carried by Arkansas units in the Department of the Trans-Mississippi at the time that the 7th Arkansas Field Battery was operational. I don't know of a documented example of the 3rd National being used in the Trans-Mississippi. Additionally the Army of Northern Virginia battle flag was not used in the Trans-Mississippi. In fact the only Arkansas units that used that flag are the 3rd Arkansas which was assigned to the Army of Northern Virginia and possibly some units of Reynold's brigade (1st and 2nd Arkansas Mounted Rifles, 4th, 9th and 25th Arkansas Infantry Regiment, in the Army of Tennessee, (however none of that pattern have survived from Reynold's Brigade). Most of the Arkansas units in the Army of Tennessee used the "Hardee Pattern" Battle Flags , a few used the McCown's Pattern flag

I concur that the use of the 1912 Arkansas State Flag is problematice, even though I have perpetuated its use in this series of articles. A more appropriate device would probably be the pre civil war state seal. I suppose I could upload that file and find an admin to make the necessary substitutions for me. Aleutian06 (talk) 18:21, 13 November 2013 (UTC)

• Thanks for your detailed response. I can't go into much detail right (at the car dealership!), but the"why" question pertains to MOS:FLAG. See the current ANI thread on ProudIrishAspie.

Mbhiii, Attleboro, Orthogonius, Trift, Dawakin has some new socks team editing at Southern United States

User:Zimtenga, a user created after your last block, and User:Czeczewo, a user created after a previous sockpuppet investigation and Mbhiii's common IP 72.37.249.60 are tag teaming at Southern United States and also picking up Attleboro's edit war at Patient Protection and Affordable Care Act. 72.37.249.60 looks to be Mbhiii since he also added a link to his company at ARA. 108.100.160.158 (talk) 00:59, 14 November 2013 (UTC)

• Nobody messes with the South. Drmies (talk) 01:36, 14 November 2013 (UTC)

• Limburg?  davidiad { t } 01:40, 14 November 2013 (UTC)

• We should have given that back to Belgium. Accounts and IP blocked, filed with SPI with CU request. Thanks IP. I suppose you have an inside line, but sometimes an enemy's enemy is a friend. Drmies (talk) 01:53, 14 November 2013 (UTC)

• No inside line, just tired of his following me around and reverting using a couple of accounts, I think User:Somedifferentstuff is one too, but its not as obvious. The ARA part I knew because his first account that I know of, Mbhiii, has ARA as his employer on the user page. 173.111.23.232 (talk) 03:43, 14 November 2013 (UTC)

• Ha, I never thought to look there. You know, Mbhiii and I go way back; we were probably members of the same Trotskyist youth organization, before he took a turn to the right. Hard to say with Somedifferentstuff, but we'll see. Thanks, Drmies (talk) 04:12, 14 November 2013 (UTC)

• I'm not a sockpuppet of anyone and this IP needs to know that he can get blocked for making false accusations. -- Somedifferentstuff (talk) 00:14, 16 November 2013 (UTC)

Discussion at Template_talk:Bullying#RfC:_Template_links

You are invited to join the discussion at Template_talk:Bullying#RfC:_Template_links. Lord Sjones23 (talk - contributions) 06:22, 14 November 2013 (UTC)

I'm going to be served by a court order

I'm in trouble now, I'm going to get a court order because I hate an Italian actor and trampled on an editor's free-speech, I just don't know what to do, could somebody read User talk:Ross-Novak because I'm too busy laughing and smiling, in another article, I've also been yelled at and accused of hating the chinese because I added a bracket to a broken wikilink, well off to get a lawyer,,, better call Saul Bgwhite (talk) 06:48, 14 November 2013 (UTC) (no periods were harmed in writing this or Italian actor's articles)

I indeffed Ross-Novak for the legal threat.--Bbb23 (talk) 15:41, 14 November 2013 (UTC)

So Bgwhite won't get sued? Seriously, Bg, you had it coming, and I should block you 24 hours for comma splicing. Drmies (talk) 17:58, 14 November 2013 (UTC)

We don't have that kind of power. Nothing stops anyone in this wonderful land of ours from suing (I don't know where Bg is from, and I'm referring to the U.S.).--Bbb23 (talk) 18:17, 14 November 2013 (UTC)

I was interested to see the user mention Arcangeli's huge "mole of work"? That's an expression I've never heard before. Presumably that's 6.02×10²³ units of work, so that is huge. Bgwhite, I pity those who may not get your reference to "better call Saul". MANdARAX • XAЯAbИAM 19:21, 14 November 2013 (UTC)

• Pity me, then. I though Bgwhite was making reference to an immediate conversion. Mandarax, you really need to start watching better TV shows. Or, better yet, none at all. Drmies (talk) 20:19, 14 November 2013 (UTC)

DYK: ...that Avocado's number of something is called a guacamole? --Floquenbeam (talk) 19:26, 14 November 2013 (UTC)

*ba-dum tsh* Writ Keeper ⚇♔ 19:33, 14 November 2013 (UTC)

Those fascinating, and, haunting, horrific, disturbing commas,. Hafspajen (talk) 23:56, 14 November 2013 (UTC)

Warrington, I assume you'll be updating various dog articles? So now the dog is Eurocentric too... globalize! Drmies (talk) 00:07, 15 November 2013 (UTC)

It is really shocking what you did with this article. Mail me your address when you are in jail and I will send you stroopwafels. The Banner talk 01:59, 15 November 2013 (UTC)

Thank you Banner, but I'm not Dutch. My grandparents on one side are from Denmark. How about sending me some æbleskivers with a side of rødgrød med fløde (look for videos on how to pronounce it). Mandarax, Saul hooked me up with Ed. I hear I might relocate to a cabin in New Hampshire. Bgwhite (talk) 06:13, 15 November 2013 (UTC)

Is that where Dr. Who lives these days? And stroopwafels are, like toilet paper, a Dutch invention explicitly designed to benefit all mankind. Thanks Banner--I'll have some, but only the real thing, made with butter. Drmies (talk) 19:16, 15 November 2013 (UTC)

LOL, I was very happy to have discovered something really, really bad as hagelslag (chocolate sprinkles) en chocoladevlokken (chocolate flakes). They didn't taste as good as in the good old days in The Netherlands. The Banner talk 20:16, 15 November 2013 (UTC)

My mom's coming for Sinterklaas. We'll finally have anijshagel again. I ran into a Dutchie the other day, who's been living here for 8 years--and we never met. Then again, he's from The Hague, and them's not good people. Turns out they're going to Atlanta for Sinterklaas, where the goedheiligman apparently shows up every year. No word on Zwarte Piet. (See also "Moorkop" section, below.) Drmies (talk) 18:27, 16 November 2013 (UTC)

Thank you

for the barnstar! Carlossuarez46 (talk) 03:26, 15 November 2013 (UTC)

No Thank you

I did extensive editing, including adding half a dozen sources and addressing the many complaints over the article that have gone unanswered in the TALK section and YOU and Yoblo undid them.

What you didn't do is answer any of the criticisms I made, put anyting in the the TALK section (which you Yoblo told me I should do, or make any edits. Only UNDO bombs. I did UNDOs to continue working on the article.

Now you threaten me with banning. LOL. What a ridiculous joke. Are you really so incapable of arguing your point that you must use childish tactics like UNDO BOMBS and BANNING to maintain this terrible article in EXACTLY THE FORMAT IT IS WRITTEN IN?

That is a discourteous and disrespectful way to treat me.

Maybe you can UNDO this too! — Preceding unsigned comment added by ZeroXero (talk • contribs) 05:07, 15 November 2013 (UTC)

• Maybe you can start signing your name. I left a note on the talk page (and please don't screw up the formatting again: new comments go on the bottom--I didn't even see your lengthy commentary the first time around). The main point is, you're edit warring, and you need to find consensus for your edits on the talk page--it should be clear that they are considered not neutral, and the sourcing below par. You cite a couple of anti-Obama blogs, and you misread an article from the NYT. You need to make a case for inclusion, or you will be blocked if you reinsert again. (Not banned.) Drmies (talk) 05:13, 15 November 2013 (UTC)

No, I didn't "misread" from the NY Times. I acciurately noted that three years after the original controversy over Gov. Palin's use of the term "Death Panels" it was being used by a New York Times editorialist as a general descriptive term. The exact point that my re-write was making.

Another source was The Weekly Standard. Do you consider this and "Anti-Obama Blog"? It's a periodical delivered by mail.

Another source was The New American, which is also a hard-copy published and circulated magazine, published by The John Birch Society. They probably are anti-Obama, but they are not a "right-wing blog" either.

As for me not having consensus, read the comment section on the page in question. People have been complaining about the same lack of NPV and the highly personal attack on Gov. Palin in the guise of an article about a concept - for several years and yet it hasn't been changed. Why? Because leftist guardians of the status-quo are protecting it apparently.

After many complaints (on the "talk" page, where neither you nor the other editor reverting may changes have as yet had the common courtesy to post any details of your critiques) we apparently can not fix the page. No matter how much consensus is reached on the "talk" page. — Preceding unsigned comment added by ZeroXero (talk • contribs) 06:06, 15 November 2013 (UTC)

• I see that ZeroXero is still not signing the messages. Hafspajen (talk) 07:15, 15 November 2013 (UTC)

• Or reading carefully. The Weekly Standard is a neo-conservative opinion publication and talk point generator. The New American is indeed published by the John Birch Society, which sort of automatically means that it can't be cited as a reliable source. That a person in the NYT uses the word doesn't mean shit--and at any rate the way in which the word was used made it clear that there was no endorsement of the existence of death panels. If I say that someone is as dumb as a rock, you should start IQ measurements on the mineral world--I see this kind of misreading all the time in freshman classes; we just don't prepare students well enough. Note, for instance, that debunking the concept of "death panel" (one of the most odious lies spread here in recent years) is taken as a personal attack on Palin. Funny, but the editor seems to have the same set of reading interests as that TV personality. Gotcha. Drmies (talk) 15:47, 15 November 2013 (UTC)

Thanks

for the proposal at an/i -- a firm statement like that is very helpful. DGG ( talk ) 06:41, 15 November 2013 (UTC)

Thank you

	The Defender of the Wiki Barnstar
	For all the good work around here, overwhelmingly high sense of humor, for a big number of edits and constant vigilance! Hafspajen (talk) 07:39, 15 November 2013 (UTC)

House of Artaxiad

Hello, I thought I should inform you about this. User:HouseOfArtaxiad is again doing distruptive tendentious behavior. At the List of massacres in Turkey he removed a large part of the content (-20,575) [9] and wrote on the talkpage "Problems fixed". [10] Can you look at this when you have time? Many thanks. Fatbob5 (talk) 11:57, 15 November 2013 (UTC)

• Talk-page stalking admins, can you have a look? I'm both mobile and tied up, even if that sounds contradictory. Drmies (talk) 17:14, 15 November 2013 (UTC)
  • The fools do not realize it is they who are the distruptive ones. Such a pity. --HouseOfArtaxiad (talk) 18:57, 15 November 2013 (UTC)
    • Vandals and fools, right? Drmies (talk) 19:07, 15 November 2013 (UTC)
      • I tried to report to the Admins first. I tried to discuss the issues on the talk. I even created an alternative version for this particular case that solved the dispute (and it was ignorantly reverted). So yes, that sounds about right. --HouseOfArtaxiad (talk) 19:13, 15 November 2013 (UTC)
        • Please answer the question on the talk page. Drmies (talk) 19:15, 15 November 2013 (UTC)
          • I apologize for "butting-in", but doesn't List of massacres in Turkey fall under AA2? Isn't HouseofArtaxiad indefinitely banned from such articles?[11] And for the record, I believe the "article" List of massacres in Turkey should be deleted. It is nothing but a haven for POV pushing, battleground mentality editors, a fork and coatrack! --Kansas Bear (talk) 19:44, 15 November 2013 (UTC)
            • I think that HOA got his 6-month topic ban from doing pretty much the same thing, on the same article. -- Aunva6^{talk - contribs} 19:47, 15 November 2013 (UTC)
              • I was being mobile today and found it difficult to click around--I did look at AN and wondered what happened to that thread. Thanks for pointing that out; I asked EdJohnston to look at it. As for the article, I have no opinion on coatrack etc; it seems to me that there are a few valid arguments for deletion on the talk page so Kansas Bear, go for it. Drmies (talk) 21:30, 15 November 2013 (UTC)
  • HouseOfArtaxiad's recent edit at 16:17 on 14 November at List of massacres in Turkey wasn't a ban violation because it preceded the logging of the ban. Whether this article is (per Kansas Bear) a WP:COATRACK might be discussed elsewhere, but notice that we have List of massacres in the United States, which records even small events as massacres. Has anyone heard of the Guadalupe Canyon massacre? EdJohnston (talk) 04:46, 16 November 2013 (UTC)
    • I suppose all those articles are a mess--a definitional nightmare. Drmies (talk) 05:20, 16 November 2013 (UTC)

Eh, what?

Don't they eat sea food? And crayfish party, is a very sweet dish? Have you ever had any? It is all salt and no sugar at all, basically. Some Swedish cuisine expert is going halabaloa over there. Hafspajen (talk) 19:44, 15 November 2013 (UTC)

(Talk page stalker comment) I saw this pop up in my watchlist so I corrected the most horrific claims, such as claiming that Swedish coffee isn't strong because espresso is stronger (the IP has obviously never tasted what passes for coffee in the US...), that Swedes don't eat seafood other than fish, and that Swedish crayfish is a sweet dish. Based on my experiences living in Sweden. Thomas.W ^{talk to me} 20:31, 15 November 2013 (UTC)

Kan jog ha påtår? Drmies (talk) 21:24, 15 November 2013 (UTC)

You usually don't ask for it, the hostess/maid/whatever asks "Vill du/Ni ha påtår?" and you answer "Ja tack". While downing cakes and the seven different types of cookies that a respectable "kafferep" requires. Thomas.W ^{talk to me} 21:36, 15 November 2013 (UTC)

Ha, I was taught to ask for it, on Oland, so don't give me no lip, Thomas W.! As for pastries, Hafspajen and I meet weekly at the Konditorei in Lund, across from the church. In my dreams, of course. Drmies (talk) 23:53, 15 November 2013 (UTC)