Template talk:Certification Table Entry

Polish certs

Apparently, the former ZPAV site featuring Polish certs went down and, from now, only the latest one is working. I don't know if there's some way to adjust command for certs before 2023, when the new site was introduced. If possible, I think it would help a lot. LuanCampSouza93 (talk) 17:32, 21 February 2025 (UTC)

@LuanCampSouza93: Many of those pages are available on archive. A list is available here: https://web.archive.org/web/*/http://bestsellery.zpav.pl/wyroznienia/*
This means we may be able to automatically direct to an appropriate archive, the same way we do for old French certifications. It is no small task mainly because we need to find an appropriate archive for each combination of award/type/certyear.
The URL follows this structure: http://bestsellery.zpav.pl/wyroznienia/{{#switch:{{{award|}}}||Gold=zlote|Platinum=platynowe|Diamond=diamentowe}}plyty/{{#switch:{{{type|}}}|album|single|jazz=cd|video=dvd|cd}}/archiwum.php?year={{{certyear|}}}.
For example Gold/Album/2020 is http://bestsellery.zpav.pl/wyroznienia/zloteplyty/cd/archiwum.php?year=2020
Now we need to find an appropriate archive id. The latest archive is https://web.archive.org/web/20241102083949/http://bestsellery.zpav.pl/wyroznienia/zloteplyty/cd/archiwum.php?year=2020 and the archive id is 20241102083949.
This needs to be repeated for every combination, so 3 × 2 × 28 = 198 times, (zlote/platynowe/diamentowe, cd/dvd, 1995-2022).
Once we have that data, I can implement the rest. If this is of interest to you, you can start collecting the data. Otherwise, it will need to wait until someone has free time to do it.
ETA: I created a page for collecting this data: Template talk:Cite certification/zpav archive. Anyone who wants to help can start filling the table. Muhandes (talk) 16:57, 24 February 2025 (UTC)

Just remind, Polish certification updated in January 2025 (see here). --Milkypine (talk) 04:42, 7 March 2025 (UTC)

@Milkypine: Why is this a "remind"? did anyone mention it before? I usually note such things. I notice even Polish Society of the Phonographic Industry wasn't updated yet. I'll add these to my TDL. I notice Edk finished the archive table (thanks!), too bad they didn't let us know. Muhandes (talk) 08:52, 7 March 2025 (UTC)

@Muhandes:Sorry for my poor choice of words. I just notice the certification change, and instead of starting a new topic, it's more appropriate to mention here that ZPAV has been updated. --Milkypine (talk) 13:35, 7 March 2025 (UTC)

@LuanCampSouza93:  Done adding the archives. Thanks Edk for helping on listing the archives. Muhandes (talk) 12:16, 7 March 2025 (UTC)

Break to discuss the new certification levels

@Milkypine: I updated Polish Society of the Phonographic Industry#Certifications and awards with the new data. However, there is no longer a unit threshold for singles, and the template only supports units. The lack of a unit threshold has been the case since March 2017, but we previously overlooked it since there was still some unit threshold available. After reading the guidelines more carefully, it seems misleading to present it that way.

In terms of possible solutions, we could display the revenue, but inflation poses a significant challenge. Perhaps the certification year should also be displayed to account for this. By the way, I believe early RIAA certifications used dollars instead of units too. Looking for more input. --Muhandes (talk) 14:11, 7 March 2025 (UTC)

I don't think this will be a challenge. We can present it in the same way as the Box Office section in movie articles. --Milkypine (talk) 11:36, 9 March 2025 (UTC)

@Milkypine: If you don't think it is a challenge, go ahead and implement some options in the sandbox and testcases. We can discuss which option is best once you are done.
I must admit I am not familiar with the Box Office section in movie articles so I don't know which templates they use and how, but I'm sure you can figure it out. Muhandes (talk) 12:53, 9 March 2025 (UTC)

Just like this「|salesamount=1,000,000zł」, Unless we need to pay attention to the difference between revenue and sales. --Milkypine (talk) 15:18, 9 March 2025 (UTC)

@Milkypine It seems you may have overlooked the core purpose of this template, which is to eliminate the need for manually adding sales figures, sources, or footnotes. Additionally, the purpose of |salesamount= is clearly stated in the documentation: override sales amount with a sales figure from a reliable source, when not based on the certification. (emphasis added). The challenge lies in adapting a template designed for displaying units to correctly reflect sales figures. Also, I had raised a concern about inflation, which I don’t believe was addressed. Muhandes (talk) 15:42, 9 March 2025 (UTC)

@Milkypine and Muhandes: In fact, certification units for singles (until 31st December 2024) were provided by ZPAV: Gold (25k = 50k zł), Platinum (50k = 100k zł) and Diamond (250k = 500k zł). Current levels would be 62,500 for Gold (150k zł), 125k for Platinum (250k zł) and 500k for Diamond (1M zł). France3c0 (talk) 14:40, 24 March 2025 (UTC)

@France3c0 That's until 31 December 2024. We are discussion the 2025 update, which no longer includes certification units. Where do you see 62,500/125k/500k? Muhandes (talk) 08:16, 26 March 2025 (UTC)

@Muhandes: as I previously said, conversion rate for units until seems to be 2 zł:1 unit in Poland. If a track reached 50k zł, the units would be 25k. With current thresholds, 150k zł is 62,500 units. France3c0 (talk) 08:23, 26 March 2025 (UTC) Plus: "KOCHASZ?" by Sobel was certified Gold on Feb 26th, 2025; if we do 62,500x250 (conversion rate for streams), the streaming numbers would be 15,625,000 (which is the case if we look at the Spotify accumulative numbers). --France3c0 (talk) 08:29, 26 March 2025 (UTC)

@France3c0 Can you please provide the source to that conversion rate? I don't speak Polish, so I am using Google translate. The only thing I found is this sentence: 250 szt. streamów (odsłuchów) jest równoznaczna ze sprzedażą 1 singla, o wartości 2 zł. However, this sentence is from the regulations active until 2024 and is no longer extant in the 2025 regulations. If I understand correctly, even in the former regulations, it was only valid for singles before March 2017. Muhandes (talk) 13:59, 26 March 2025 (UTC)

@Muhandes: despite the fact that the regulations do not really mention the conversion rate of 2 zł:1 unit for the new levels (it might be the case to contact ZPAV directly), the best thing to do is to report unit sales as it has always been done (we have kept it this way on it.wiki), and not the revenue. "KOCHASZ?" by Sobel was certified Platinum (125k units) by ZPAV yesterday; again, if we look at its accumulative streaming figures on Spotify, it has over 22,4 plays. With current new levels, platinum stands at 31,250,000 streams (let's not mention the fact that both Tidal and YouTube are pretty big there, so 1/4 of those streams come mostly from those 2 platforms). So yes, 250 streams:1 download/2 zł:1 unit is still valid, even though ZPAV has been certifying songs exclusively on revenue. France3c0 (talk) 14:38, 27 March 2025 (UTC)

@France3c0 Technically, that is the easiest solution to implement, so I do not object. I will leave this open for a week or two, and, barring any objections, I will implement the new certification levels as you suggested. Sadly, none of the former contributors to the ZPAV discussion seems to be active anymore so I will not bother pinging them and I don't expect much. Of course, objections may come later when someone does not understand the new thresholds, at which point we will resume discussion. Muhandes (talk) 06:57, 28 March 2025 (UTC)

@Muhandes: I will try to contact ZPAV now, let's hope they are able to reply. France3c0 (talk) 07:49, 28 March 2025 (UTC)

German certifications

According to this file from Bundesverband Musikindustrie, Coldplay's "Paradise" was certified Platinum for 600,000 units sold, but the current template only shows 300,000. I'm sending this because there was a discussion about it months ago and no one made the correction. GustavoCza (talk • contribs) 20:13, 7 March 2025 (UTC)

@GustavoCza I'm not sure what correction you are waiting for. My suggestion was Perhaps using |salesamount= and |salesref= against their intended purpose in this specific case could be an acceptable compromise. Do you disagree? Is there anything holding you from making this change? Muhandes (talk) 16:47, 8 March 2025 (UTC)

I think I misread your comment back then, my apologies! The Bundesverband Musikindustrie page does mention 600,000 as the threshold for certifications after June 2023 though, shouldn't the template reflect that? I tried to put |certmonth= to adjust this and it didn't worked. GustavoCza (talk • contribs) 19:52, 8 March 2025 (UTC)

@GustavoCza I already answered this in the last discussion, please read it again. Muhandes (talk) 19:59, 8 March 2025 (UTC)

Thank you for your patience and sorry to bother. See you around! GustavoCza (talk • contribs) 20:06, 8 March 2025 (UTC)

Australian certifications

The Australian Recording Industry Association has recently added a Silver award for albums that sold 20,000 units in the country. The criteria are as it follows:

• Only issued in relation to product distributed by ARIA members.
• Only awarded to albums by Australian artists.
• 20,000 unit threshold needs to be achieved within three years of the album’s initial release.
• Only applicable to albums released after 1 January 2021.
• All other details as per the Gold and Platinum Awards below.

GustavoCza (talk • contribs) 20:15, 7 March 2025 (UTC)

@GustavoCza: Do you know of any album which received this award? Muhandes (talk) 16:43, 8 March 2025 (UTC)

Angel in Realtime (2022) by Gang of Youths. It's on the February 2025 list of Australian certifications. I don't think ARIA has published it on their Dropbox yet though, I only found out about this because I'm on a group of chart enthusiasts, keep an eye for it. GustavoCza (talk • contribs) 19:57, 8 March 2025 (UTC)

@GustavoCza So I gather it is not a reliable source, or you would have used it already. Once we have a reliable source of a Silver certification, I'll be happy to implement it. Muhandes (talk) 21:08, 8 March 2025 (UTC)

Well, for Wikipedia's standards, it's not. However, these early reports have always matched what the Australian Recording Industry Association publishes afterwards. I'll keep you informed. Best regards. GustavoCza (talk • contribs) 21:22, 8 March 2025 (UTC)

@GustavoCza I realized how simple it would be, so I went ahead and implemented it.  Done Muhandes (talk) 12:54, 9 March 2025 (UTC)

Cite error

This is producing two errors, from the article Ladies & Gentlemen: The Best of George Michael (video):

! scope="row" | Poland (ZPAV) | Platinum | 10,000^* |-

References

There is a |archive-url= without a |archive-date=. And the archive URL has a malformed timestamp (should be 14-digits). I can't figure out where in the template. -- GreenC 17:42, 17 March 2025 (UTC)

The cause of these two errors is often when someone wanted |url= but made a typo and used |archive-url= instead. -- GreenC 17:49, 17 March 2025 (UTC)

@GreenC Thanks for the note. This happened because the certification fails verification. This is the supposed archive and as you can see it is empty. When we added the archives, we didn't add empty pages like this one. There should be very few of these, but if you find more, I'd be happy to correct them.
ETA: Oddly, I seem to be the one who added this certification, four years ago. I'll look into it a little more.
ETA2: I found my error from four years ago. The CD was certified on that year, not the video, see here. Muhandes (talk) 18:18, 17 March 2025 (UTC)

There is another Morrison Hotel footnote #57 .. I'll be a source finding these, they show up at Category:CS1 errors: archive-url, and I am regularly clearing that category via bot. -- GreenC 19:28, 17 March 2025 (UTC)

Similar issue. I believe this one is vandalism. Resolved. Muhandes (talk) 13:47, 18 March 2025 (UTC)

IFPI thresholds (as of 2019)

I have found a full RIN (Recording Industry in Numbers) report by IFPI for the 2019 year, containing national top 10's for both songs and albums, as well as a table with updated certification levels: https://archive.org/details/ifpi-global-music-report-2020-full-report. This one could be used as a source. France3c0 (talk) 10:16, 27 March 2025 (UTC)

Bulgaria (BAMP) certification levels

According to this Forbes Bulgaria article, the certification levels for Bulgaria according to Bulgarian Association of Music Producers are the following: 1,000 (Gold) and 2,000 (Platinum). These numbers are based exclusively on digital and physical data, and do not include streaming data. There are some certifications released by BAMP online (two are mentioned in the article), so I suggest to add "Bulgaria" as a valid parameter in the template. France3c0 (talk) 14:33, 29 March 2025 (UTC)

@France3c0 Is there an archive of past certifications? Muhandes (talk) 17:25, 29 March 2025 (UTC)

@Muhandes: unfortunately, BAMP has no info regarding certifications on their website. However, there are some certifications handed by them on their Facebook page: one, another one and another one. Also, they have announced their intention to change their criteria and include streaming data later this year. France3c0 (talk) 17:38, 29 March 2025 (UTC)

@France3c0 The purpose of this template is to automate the use of {{cite certification}}, which provides the citation, while also adding award thresholds. Without a database to cite, there's nothing to automate. Besides, I’m not adding code that will be used only ten times—several hundred uses should be the minimum. If you're referring to just four or five cases, use |certref= and |salesref= instead. Muhandes (talk) 08:20, 30 March 2025 (UTC)