Talk:Woji
 | This page was proposed for deletion by The Banner (talk · contribs) on 16 February 2024 with the comment: It seems to exist but is so poorly written that it is hardly useful information. All sources seem to be unreliable. I invoke WP:TNT It was contested by StreetcarEnjoyer (talk · contribs) on 22 February 2024 with the comment: Contesting prod - it exists and is inhabited which is generally enough. You can always rewrite it or take it to AfD. |
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Why removal
[edit]@Marchjulyyou removed my contributions on Woji which is ongoing. I am a Woji son and nothing written about woji is false. Woji houses the stool Eze Oha Evo and it is recognized by the government as first class stool. Notable ikwerre son HRM Dr Frank Eke the first deputy governor of Rivers state was the Eze Oha Evo II, Eze Gbakagbaka of ikwerre land. [1]https://allafrica.com/stories/200310020258.html Miztan9 (talk) 08:13, 24 October 2024 (UTC)
- There were two reasons why I removed that bit of content: (1) it wasn't supported by any citations to reliable sources (as defined by Wikipedia) and (2) it was poorly written so that its encyclopedic relevance wasn't clear. The content might be true, but it needs to be verifiable. It also needs to be written in an encyclopedic tone and understandable English. Whether the link you've provided above is considered to be a reliable source, I can't say at the moment. I will, though, ask someone from Wikipedia:WikiProject Nigeria to take a look at it and also look at the edit you made to see whether they feel it's something worth adding to the article. -- Marchjuly (talk) 08:22, 24 October 2024 (UTC)
- Okay. Well I just added an inline citation, you can also correct the grammar construction. Miztan9 (talk) 09:08, 24 October 2024 (UTC)
- Hi @Miztan9, I am going to be echoing what Marchjuly just said. We could discuss things here, can you please mention here the source that verifies your claim(s)? Vanderwaalforces (talk) 10:32, 24 October 2024 (UTC)
- https://www.vanguardngr.com/2015/01/crisis-looms-rivers-chiefs-battle-evo-stool/amp/
- https://dx.doi.org/10.1163/_afco_asc_1319
- https://allafrica.com/stories/200310020258.html
- https://theportcitynews.com/news/city-news/eze-evo-seeks-sustenance-of-culture/
- These are links to news of Eze Oha Evo of Woji. If you visit the Obio wiki page you’ll notice the ancient history section it states Woji as the residence of Obio and the ikwerre people section of grouping also shows ancestry of Obio to Evo - Oro Evo - Woji and his brothers. Miztan9 (talk) 12:10, 24 October 2024 (UTC)
- https://supremecourt.gov.ng/causelist/archive?page=107 Here again is a dispute for the stool of Nyewe Eli woji (Eze Woji) between HRM Leslie eke who has been recognized as eze oha Evo and HRH Emeka ihunwo who the court affirms as Eze Woji. HRM wants to hold both stools as it was on Apara but now resolved with a new Eze Ekinigbo and separation of the stool. Miztan9 (talk) 12:17, 24 October 2024 (UTC)
- @Miztan9: What does any of the what you added or posted above have to do with a Nigerian town called "Woji"? This is intended to be an article about a town, but it seems as if you've added content about a person named "Woji". How can a town named "Woji" be the "first son of Oro-Evo, a descendant of Obio"? Are you trying to say that the town is named after the first son of a descendent of the same Obio referered to in Obio#Ancient history? Again that might be true, but it's not verifiable, even given the sources you've provided. For reference, Wikipedia articles aren't considered to be reliable sources for any purpose per WP:WPNOTRS. Since the entire "Ancient history" of the "Obio" is unsupported by citations, it's basically nothing but WP:OR and probably needs to be removed. In other words, it has pretty much zero value to this article at all. Finally, you're using the word "stool" in a way the it's not commonly used and would be easily understood by Wikipedia's readers. What do you mean when you say "Ancient Monarchical Stool"? Do you mean throne? -- Marchjuly (talk) 20:18, 24 October 2024 (UTC)
- It seems you you don’t know that in Ikwerre most towns are named after real people. Hence, the term Rumu this or Rumu that hence children of … Woji is the son of Oro-Evo mind you most traditions have been past down as oral and ikwerre at large knows this. If we can have wiki on Greek mythology which is a myth and the stories of shango, why can’t we have real and existing facts that surround you. The fact that Woji exist as a place and the stool of Eze Oha Evo is also recognized by the Government what other proof do you need. Moreover we have general referencing which in this case applies more. I have physical documents of ancient woji courts and dealings which when I host them on a space I can then write the necessary sections of the page. You are free to also make enquiry. Rumurorlu is Oro Evo second son hence children of Orlu which means second son. Again in Rivers State and I believe in traditional Nigeria and Africa, we mostly use the word stool as it was traditional symbol of power to a monarch. You are welcome to google monarchy stool and enlighten yourself more. You don’t know it all neither can all be referenced as wiki recognizes this.
- stools example link :
- http://smafathers.org/museum/resources-ebooks/the-black-stool-symbol-of-power/
- https://www.abuad.edu.ng/the-role-of-traditional-rulers-sanusi-the-genius-a-case-study-1/
- we are Africans and stool is used rather than throne. Miztan9 (talk) 06:12, 25 October 2024 (UTC)
- To help you further to understand stools better read throne on Wikipedia and a clear reference of stools as unique to Africa Wikipedians know this. Again Woji is a town named after the a real person woji. We have palace and museums here to tell these tales and graves of deceased with inscriptions I’ll take pictures and host these on a site which can reference. Meanwhile Woji article is about a town, it’s people, traditions, relevance and much more. You are free to educate me how to go about that I am not rigid, I’m a lecturer in a university and enjoy learning. Miztan9 (talk) 06:24, 25 October 2024 (UTC)
- one more link on stool as an African cultural throne.
- https://www.culturalencyclopaedia.org/african-traditional-stool#:~:text=Among%20the%20Akans%20in%20general,place%20of%20chairs%20as%20thrones. Miztan9 (talk) 11:08, 26 October 2024 (UTC)
- Thank you for clarifying the meaning of Stool (seat)#Royal stools and the etymology of the town's name. I've reorganized the article a bit so that it's consistent with the formating used for other Wikipedia articles about towns cities.As for you're earlier reference to Greek mythology, even Wikipedia articles about Greek mythology are only supposed to reflect what reliable sources are saying and are to do so in an encyclopedic tone. Unsupported content based upon one's personal knowledge, one's own academic research or verbal histories is not, in principle, supposed to be added to Wikipedia articles, unless it can be verified by citations to reliable sources. I understand there might not be a lot of reliable sources writing about Woji per se, but that doesn't change how Wikipedia's policies and guidelines are going to be applied. Anything unsupported by citations to reliable sources is going to be considered Wikipedia:Orginal research, which means it can be removed at anytime. Whatever physical documents you might possess are most be likely going to be treated as WP:PRIMARY sources at best and will have limited use. WP:SECONDARY sources are better, but both primary and secondary sources need to be clearly considered to be reliable sources (as defined by Wikipedia), need to have been published and need to be reasonably accessible for them to have any value to Wikipedia. Pictures of palaces, museums or gravestones have pretty much zero value as a reliable source for Wikipedia's purposes, but they could add some color to the article; you should, however, familiarize yourself with Wikipedia:Image use policy, c:Commons:Licensing and c:COM:FOP Nigeria before trying to upload any photos because Wikipedia is pretty strict when it comes to image copyright.Finally, given that you're a lecturer at a university, you might want to take a look at WP:EXPERT and WP:SELFCITE for reference because those pages contain information that subject-matter experts out in the real world often find helpful when they edit Wikipedia. -- Marchjuly (talk) 11:09, 27 October 2024 (UTC)
- I find your reply helpful and your arrangement pleasant. As the article progresses I will be in contact with you here on the talk page. Post links here, we access them before they added to the article. I will also study the encyclopedic tone of town articles so as to conform with the norm obtainable in this community. Miztan9 (talk) 17:52, 27 October 2024 (UTC)
- You can be WP:BOLD in trying to improve the article. In other words, you don't really need to have your edits approved in advance except perhaps when a really big change is involved. As long as your edits are in accordance with relevant Wikipedia policies and guidelines, you should be OK. Mistakes are OK as long as they're made in good faith because pretty much any mistake that is made can be undone or fixed; mistakes only really become problems when they're made for reasons not really associated with improving Wikipedia or when they are serious violations of important policies like WP:BLP or WP:COPY. If you're looking for examples of other Wikipedia articles about towns and cities which have been assessed to have been written quite well, try WP:FA#Cities, towns and villages; however, even an article like "Lagos" might provide you with some ideas as to how to further improve this article. You can also ask for assistance at Wikipedia:WikiProject Africa or Wikipedia:WikiProject Nigeria since those are WikiProjects where you might find other Wikipedians interested in articles about Africa and Nigeria. -- Marchjuly (talk) 20:39, 27 October 2024 (UTC)
- I find your reply helpful and your arrangement pleasant. As the article progresses I will be in contact with you here on the talk page. Post links here, we access them before they added to the article. I will also study the encyclopedic tone of town articles so as to conform with the norm obtainable in this community. Miztan9 (talk) 17:52, 27 October 2024 (UTC)
- Thank you for clarifying the meaning of Stool (seat)#Royal stools and the etymology of the town's name. I've reorganized the article a bit so that it's consistent with the formating used for other Wikipedia articles about towns cities.As for you're earlier reference to Greek mythology, even Wikipedia articles about Greek mythology are only supposed to reflect what reliable sources are saying and are to do so in an encyclopedic tone. Unsupported content based upon one's personal knowledge, one's own academic research or verbal histories is not, in principle, supposed to be added to Wikipedia articles, unless it can be verified by citations to reliable sources. I understand there might not be a lot of reliable sources writing about Woji per se, but that doesn't change how Wikipedia's policies and guidelines are going to be applied. Anything unsupported by citations to reliable sources is going to be considered Wikipedia:Orginal research, which means it can be removed at anytime. Whatever physical documents you might possess are most be likely going to be treated as WP:PRIMARY sources at best and will have limited use. WP:SECONDARY sources are better, but both primary and secondary sources need to be clearly considered to be reliable sources (as defined by Wikipedia), need to have been published and need to be reasonably accessible for them to have any value to Wikipedia. Pictures of palaces, museums or gravestones have pretty much zero value as a reliable source for Wikipedia's purposes, but they could add some color to the article; you should, however, familiarize yourself with Wikipedia:Image use policy, c:Commons:Licensing and c:COM:FOP Nigeria before trying to upload any photos because Wikipedia is pretty strict when it comes to image copyright.Finally, given that you're a lecturer at a university, you might want to take a look at WP:EXPERT and WP:SELFCITE for reference because those pages contain information that subject-matter experts out in the real world often find helpful when they edit Wikipedia. -- Marchjuly (talk) 11:09, 27 October 2024 (UTC)
- To help you further to understand stools better read throne on Wikipedia and a clear reference of stools as unique to Africa Wikipedians know this. Again Woji is a town named after the a real person woji. We have palace and museums here to tell these tales and graves of deceased with inscriptions I’ll take pictures and host these on a site which can reference. Meanwhile Woji article is about a town, it’s people, traditions, relevance and much more. You are free to educate me how to go about that I am not rigid, I’m a lecturer in a university and enjoy learning. Miztan9 (talk) 06:24, 25 October 2024 (UTC)
- @Miztan9: What does any of the what you added or posted above have to do with a Nigerian town called "Woji"? This is intended to be an article about a town, but it seems as if you've added content about a person named "Woji". How can a town named "Woji" be the "first son of Oro-Evo, a descendant of Obio"? Are you trying to say that the town is named after the first son of a descendent of the same Obio referered to in Obio#Ancient history? Again that might be true, but it's not verifiable, even given the sources you've provided. For reference, Wikipedia articles aren't considered to be reliable sources for any purpose per WP:WPNOTRS. Since the entire "Ancient history" of the "Obio" is unsupported by citations, it's basically nothing but WP:OR and probably needs to be removed. In other words, it has pretty much zero value to this article at all. Finally, you're using the word "stool" in a way the it's not commonly used and would be easily understood by Wikipedia's readers. What do you mean when you say "Ancient Monarchical Stool"? Do you mean throne? -- Marchjuly (talk) 20:18, 24 October 2024 (UTC)
- https://supremecourt.gov.ng/causelist/archive?page=107 Here again is a dispute for the stool of Nyewe Eli woji (Eze Woji) between HRM Leslie eke who has been recognized as eze oha Evo and HRH Emeka ihunwo who the court affirms as Eze Woji. HRM wants to hold both stools as it was on Apara but now resolved with a new Eze Ekinigbo and separation of the stool. Miztan9 (talk) 12:17, 24 October 2024 (UTC)