Talk:Three Witches

Skip to table of contents

This is the talk page for discussing improvements to the Three Witches article.
This is not a forum for general discussion of the article's subject.

Put new text under old text. Click here to start a new topic.
New to Wikipedia? Welcome! Learn to edit; get help.

Article policies

Find sources: Google (books · news · scholar · free images · WP refs) · FENS · JSTOR · TWL

Three Witches has been listed as one of the Language and literature good articles under the good article criteria. If you can improve it further, please do so. If it no longer meets these criteria, you can reassess it.

Article milestones
Date	Process	Result
May 11, 2008	Good article nominee	Listed

A fact from this article appeared on Wikipedia's Main Page in the "Did you know?" column on April 22, 2008.

The text of the entry was: Did you know ...that many of the lines for the Three Witches in Shakespeare's Macbeth are copied word for word from the 1577 work Holinshed's Chronicles?

Shakespeare Mid‑importance

	This article is within the scope of WikiProject Shakespeare, a collaborative effort to improve the coverage of William Shakespeare on Wikipedia. If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join the discussion and see a list of open tasks.ShakespeareWikipedia:WikiProject ShakespeareTemplate:WikiProject ShakespeareShakespeare articles
Mid	This article has been rated as Mid-importance on the project's importance scale.

Fictional characters

This article is within the scope of WikiProject Fictional characters, a collaborative effort to improve the coverage of fictional characters on Wikipedia. If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join the discussion and see a list of open tasks.Fictional charactersWikipedia:WikiProject Fictional charactersTemplate:WikiProject Fictional charactersfictional character articles

Women

This article is within the scope of WikiProject Women, a collaborative effort to improve the coverage of women on Wikipedia. If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join the discussion and see a list of open tasks.WomenWikipedia:WikiProject WomenTemplate:WikiProject WomenWikiProject Women articles

Links

At the article Macbeth the "Weird Sisters" currently redirect to Norns, and a silent link of "Three Witches" among the dramatis personae is the only hint this article exists. A very brief synopsis of this article should find a place at Macbeth, with a hatnbote identifying this main article. The Encyclopedia is built on such interlocking articles. --Wetman (talk) 08:19, 17 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Sorry, but that's not how the Shakespeare play articles are organized, though. There simply isn't enough room on play pages to devote a whole section to one character or small set of characters. See Hamlet. This article does, though, link to every other Macbeth character article out there if you check. Wrad (talk) 15:06, 17 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]

I just went through several articles that apply and added links to this article. I'm sure there are more out there, though. Wrad (talk) 16:54, 17 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Hecate

After a brief appearance in which the witches meet with Hecate... It should at least be mentioned that it's debated whether this scene is a later addition to the play. 91.105.37.190 (talk) 01:39, 22 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Wasn't aware of that. Got a source so we can add it? Wrad (talk) 01:43, 22 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Among the many places I've seen this asserted is our own page on Thomas Middleton's The Witch, the alleged source of the scene. 71.231.197.110 (talk) 04:00, 22 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]

I believe The Witch is mentioned in the article. Wrad (talk) 04:05, 22 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Ah! I found what you're talking about and have added it. Thanks for the help! Wrad (talk) 00:50, 28 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]

A few things

1. It is said in the first para that they "urge him to commit murder and treason". I don't think they do, and later on (Analysis), you say "The witches also never tell Macbeth to kill King Duncan." Further on, they say "be bloody, bold and resolute", which is at best ambiguous.

The bloody line was what I was thinking of, but it does simplify the situation a little much. Should be changed... Wrad (talk) 21:49, 29 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]

2. Origins: "Macbeth's Hillock, an area in Forres". But Forres is a town. Is this hillock in the town? Furthermore, Banquo says (I.iii) "How far is't called to Forres?", which rather implies that he and Macbeth aren't in Forres.

Yep, they are near Forres. Will fix. Wrad (talk) 21:49, 29 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]

3. Also in Origins: "Forres is the traditional living-place of both Duncan and Macbeth, as well", but the Forres article says "Shakespeare's play Macbeth locates Duncan's castle here. Macbeth's castle was located at Inverness." I don't know which article is correct, but they can't both be right (and ought to agree).

Actually, they may both be right. Macbeth, as king, would have taken Duncan's castle perhaps? Wrad (talk) 21:49, 29 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]

In Act V, Macbeth seems to be living on or near Dunsinane Hill -- unless that's near Forres (I don't know, personally), I'd argue against Forres as a "living-place" for Macbeth. And honestly the word "living-place" strikes me as very odd. User:Jwrosenzweig editing as 71.231.197.110 (talk) 07:33, 22 August 2008 (UTC)[reply]

4. When I have a moment, I'll add a bit on Verdi's opera, where the witches are a three-part chorus rather than three individuals. Hecate was added when Verdi included some ballet music for later performances at the Paris Opera.

--GuillaumeTell 21:43, 29 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Thanks for the ideas. I've stumbled across Verdi and some other operas but haven't had time to add. Wrad (talk) 21:49, 29 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]

I've added something about the Verdi opera - let me know if any more (or less!) detail is required. The only other one of the operas I've heard of is by Ernest Bloch, but there's also a rock musical called Nightshriek[1]. There are also symphonic poems and overtures called "Macbeth", but they aren't performed all that often, either, and I have no idea whether the witches are characterised in them. Anyway, I've entitled the section "in music" rather than "in opera" in case you want to add anything else. --GuillaumeTell 16:05, 30 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Parallel or based on

In the lead, the article says that the three witches parallel the Norns and the three fates, but further down, it says that they originate from the Norns and other fates. Which is correct?--Berig (talk) 06:05, 11 May 2008 (UTC)[reply]

GA Review

Righty-ho then...let's get to it. Cheers, Casliber (talk · contribs) 08:11, 11 May 2008 (UTC)[reply]

They tell Macbeth that he is destined - tell just seems a little too casual to me - 'inform'?

are thought to have been written from Shakespeare. - 'are thought to have been written by Shakespeare.' ?

are often said to set the tone for the rest of the play by establishing a sense of confusion. - not sure 'confusion' is the right word here. Thinking of what comes next, I am thinking 'paradox' or 'ambiguity' or somesuch, with the opposite meanings.

For example, by the eighteenth century, belief in witches had subsided in the United Kingdom. - I feel subsided reminds me of a geological disturbance, how about 'waned' instead?

The women in the history utter in many places exactly the same words as Shakespeare gives them in his play - I had to read this a couple of times to figure out what was going on. A rephrase may help this. The word 'history' I find misleading in some ways as the history isn't one but mythological.

In summary, fix these minor tweaks and it is fine for GA. For FA, I'd think of enlarging the ancient mythological sources a little as the current article is a bit scant on the 3 norns/parcae/moerae etc. and they are clearly an antecedent. This will be easy to source and only requires a few lines. The prose might need some more massaging too.

- OK! Think I got them all! Wrad (talk) 13:28, 11 May 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Wierd Sisters in Harry Potter

The three Witches are also mentioned in Harry Potter and the Goblet of Fire, as the band that Dumbledore books for the Yule Ball. When the Wierd Sisters actually make their cameo, Harry (in narration) comments on their hairyness, and ragged clothing, just as Macbeth and Banquo do when they first meet the witches. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Chunky Milk (talk • contribs) 23:13, 12 May 2008 (UTC)[reply]

IMHO, if you mention J.K. Rowling you MUST mention also Terry Pratchett and his book "Wyrd Sisters"Homerata84 (talk) 22:05, 1 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Big removals/merges

I strongly believe that the article is not complete without the film section. I also am against merging origins and role, since I think it is important to clearly separate the role section from the rest in order to keep what is purely a plot section apart from other sections. I'd like to keep Harry Potter in, too. Influencing the Harry Potter series is not small potatoes like other pop culture stuff is. If anything, I think more pop culture needs to be added. Wrad (talk) 21:48, 12 September 2008 (UTC)[reply]

I have no real problem with that (I auto dislike pop culture sections, but thats just my taste) and will revert my self. No worries. Ceoil ^sláinte 22:02, 12 September 2008 (UTC)[reply]

A Wrad, you beat me to it. Was only being bold; nothing more. Ceoil ^sláinte 22:04, 12 September 2008 (UTC)[reply]

No problem. A lot of people (including me) have reactions like that. With Shakespeare, though, there are a lot of legitimate studies on that sort of thing, so I take it a few gears down. Wrad (talk) 00:18, 13 September 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Rimmel image at the head of article

I think the image is incorrectly captioned. The picture depicts Hecate's exit in 3.5, "...my little spirit, see, / Sits in a foggy cloud and stays for me," rather than one of the conjurations in 4.1. ItsLassieTime (talk) 18:53, 11 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Weird Sisters/ Wyrd Sisters

I found this essay, on the connection etymological root of weird.. http://www.theatredatabase.com/16th_century/weird_sisters.html. Any thoughts on inclusion?Oberonfitch (talk) 12:16, 28 September 2011 (UTC)[reply]

"References" and "Sources" sections

All works cited in the notes ("References") are not listed in the bibliography ("Sources"), which is annoying as it makes it more difficult to get an overview of what sources have been used for the article. Is there a thought behind this omission? On the other hand, Bloom, who is listed in the bibliography, has not been cited anywhere in the notes. --Hegvald (talk) 07:16, 20 October 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Orson Welles

(New user here, forgive me for any faux pas!) Just a note on the Orson Welles section of the article: it describes his film as having a voodoo doll, and the witches beheading the doll after Macbeth is killed. This is not true for the film version. Instead, the sisters make a clay figurine --not a voodoo doll-- which upon Macbeth's death seems to crumble of its own volition in an insert shot. (Afalcao26 (talk) 02:30, 24 September 2012 (UTC))[reply]

Manfred Mann

This famous British beat band had a number one hit called "Hubble Bubble Toil and Trouble" named after a quote by the witches.
87.113.178.233 (talk) 10:49, 13 April 2014 (UTC)[reply]