Talk:The Liberals (Switzerland)

On 26 February 2022, it was proposed that this article be moved from FDP.The Liberals to The Liberals (Switzerland). The result of the discussion was moved.

Map and names

Hello, I was wondering about two things. On the website of the Parliament, it's written in English RDP.The Liberals (and not anymore FDP.The Liberals) Shall we change the name as well in English, as the "FDP" is probably a direct translation of German into English? Secondly, it's about the map: it says that in Geneva and Vaud, the RDP is the strongest. It's actually wrong. Although the political parties have been merging on a national scale, 6 cantonal parties are still separated officially on a cantonal scale: that's in Geneva, Vaud and Basle, where the Liberal Party of Switzerland was strong enough or even stronger than the RDP. Today, the 17.09.2010, LPS and FDP have still updated separate websites on internet (http://www.liberal-ge.ch/ and http://www.radical.ch/ for Geneva, http://www.liberal-vd.ch/ and http://www.prdv.ch/ for Vaud, http://www.ldp.ch/ and http://www.fdp-bs.ch/ for Basel City) Therefore, even though the political party claims to be the strongest, the Article 34.2 of the National Status state clearly that there are two different political parties and both have different graphical representation such as in Vaud and Basle. Therefore, as a will of these 6 cantonal parties, Vaud has still 2 distincts political parties and therefore, the Social Democratic Party is still the strongest in the cantonal parliament. Ngagnebin (talk) 13:58, 17 September 2010 (UTC)[reply]

I don't know where on the Parliament's website you found "RDP.The Liberals". Indeed, I only found "FDP.The Liberals". It is maybe a typo (I see no other reason why it could be written "RDP").

Concerning the map, since 2005, the Liberal Party and the Free Democratic Party decided to merge. While it was done quickly in some regions, it took longer in some region where the Liberal Party was stronger. Indeed, there are still two different parties in Geneva, Vaud and Basel-City. However, they are all member of the federal FDP. In the case of Vaud, both party will merge after the Federal Elections of 2011. While I don't know about the cantonal parties in Geneva and Basel-City, many communal parties are merging or have already merged in those cantons. Finally, in all regions where there were two parties, those will merge in the future. However, I don't know how you want to treat this information until the merger really takes place. According to the way those parties work together in Geneva, Vaud and Basel-City, I doubt it makes sense to separate them here. KEX 99.254.64.182 (talk) 21:24, 19 September 2010 (UTC)[reply]

'RDP' doesn't seem to be plausible, although that is a possible mis-rending of the French name of the Free Democratic Party of Switzerland ('Radical Democrats', maybe?). Probably as a typo, it's used in a couple of places. However, it's definitely FDP.The Liberals.

On the second issue, that was already noted on the description of the image. I changed Vaud's shading from red (as I initially made it) to blue for the reason given above. That is, because both parties in those cantons are affiliated to the federal FDP.The Liberals. From the national perspective, which is the intention of the map to convey, there are more members of Vaud's Grand Counsil affiliated to the federal (national) FDP.The Liberals than there are affiliated to the federal PS. In cantons with language divides (such as Fribourg, Bern, and Valais), the major federal parties often have two cantonal affiliates, and this method is consistently adopted. Bastin 23:10, 19 September 2010 (UTC)

Fair enough, then :) It's true that the Swiss Parliament makes typos, I was wondering though as the parliament is the only place where the Swiss-German cantons are translated into official and proper English (Grisons instead of Graubünden, St.Gall instead of St.Gallen and Berne instead of Bern as example) so I wasn't sure about RDP.The Liberals :) For the maps, ok, though... Liberals and Radicals in Geneva, Vaud and Basle-City will compete against each other on the next elections. Which is strange to see parties under one national roof competiting against each other on a cantonal scale. For this reasons, I was wondering. Though on the official cantonal websites, both "parties" are still shown as being different as they are "not" in the same group: [1], [2] and [3] and thus are "not" considered as being one political party. :) Ngagnebin (talk)

Requested move 4 June 2016

The following is a closed discussion of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. Editors desiring to contest the closing decision should consider a move review. No further edits should be made to this section.

The result of the move request was: Not moved. (non-admin closure). Anarchyte (work | talk) 11:50, 20 June 2016 (UTC)[reply]

FDP.The Liberals → The Liberals (Switzerland) – The way that they design their logo should not affect how our encyclopaedia chose its titles. Using 'FDP.The Liberals' as title and is uneasy to ready and generally unclear. I suggest that we use its name without the abbreviation and the it just dot and rename the article The Liberals (Switzerland) (mention of the country to avoid confusion with The Liberals (Greece), Liberals (Sweden), etc.). Board Wesger (talk) 19:59, 4 June 2016 (UTC) --Relisting. Omni Flames (talk) 00:18, 12 June 2016 (UTC)[reply]

Object - "The Liberals" is too ambiguous, and we shouldn't invent party names and translations. Instead, we should use a name that has precedence in academic material and/or official sources; in fact, the FDP's party statutes deems "FDP.The Liberals" as the party's the official English language name.--Autospark (talk) 23:11, 4 June 2016 (UTC)[reply]

Object - It is the official naming. -- ZH8000 (talk) 23:25, 4 June 2016 (UTC)[reply]

The above discussion is preserved as an archive of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on this talk page or in a move review. No further edits should be made to this section.

Right-wing

Why right-wing? Economically or socially? -- Christian aus Schleswig-Holstein (talk) 05:14, 7 October 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Party name

Its called the liberals in every language but French where it has "radical" added to it? https://wiki.riteme.site/wiki/User:EmilePersaud 01:58, 1 May 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Requested move 26 February 2022

The following is a closed discussion of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. Editors desiring to contest the closing decision should consider a move review after discussing it on the closer's talk page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

The result of the move request was: moved. (closed by non-admin page mover) ASUKITE 14:44, 7 March 2022 (UTC)[reply]

FDP.The Liberals → The Liberals (Switzerland) – For the same reasons as the 2016 RM. The two objectors in that discussion seem to have overlooked that WP:COMMONNAME (i.e. WP:OFFICIAL) and MOS:TM are policies. Organisations used non-standard typography in their branding all the time; that doesn't mean we have to follow them. Most recent scholarly literature seems to refer to the party as just "the Liberals"[4][5][6][7] but we could also consider FDR: The Liberals as an alternative title with more natural disambiguation. – Joe (talk) 12:18, 26 February 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Oppose, based on those three references not giving sufficient reason to rename the articles to "Liberals (Switzerland)", in my opinion – if you read them, they refer to the party generically as "the Liberals", and the other Swiss parties in a similar fashion (the "Social Democrats", the "Christian Democrats", etc), not for the most part actually referring to the party titles. I agree that they existing article name could be improved upon, but "Liberals" does not seem a satisfactory choice. (Also, we should base the article title on the German name for the party, as is the case with other Swiss political party articles on en.wiki.)--Autospark (talk) 16:14, 26 February 2022 (UTC)[reply]
I don't follow. According to the article the German name is Die Liberalen. The proposed title is The Liberals (Switzerland) which is a direct translation plus necessary disambiguation to distinguish it from similarly named parties in other countries. As you yourself noted in 2016, the party's official English name is also The Liberals. We're just talking about getting rid of the typographically-styled prefix, which is what we always do according to our article title policy. – Joe (talk) 10:21, 27 February 2022 (UTC)[reply]

On second thoughts, I’ve re-read your proposal more thoroughly, and I’m more convinced of its merits. So I now support a move of the article to “The Liberals (Switzerland)”.—Autospark (talk) 13:31, 28 February 2022 (UTC)[reply]

The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.