Talk:Ralston College

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https://www.savannahnow.com/restricted/?return=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.savannahnow.com%2Fstory%2Fnews%2Feducation%2F2023%2F03%2F29%2Fralston-college-classics-school-for-free-thinkers-faces-closure-from-state%2F69784812007%2F

Some brick and mortar?

He has spoken developing events for Raltson College in Savannah, Georgia. Is this part of a larger attempt to establish an ongoing physical presence in Savannah, i.e., some kind of brick and mortar institution? If so, this needs to be added as part of the article.Dogru144 (talk) 04:08, 24 January 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Name

Why is it named Ralston? After Aron Ralston? Polygnotus (talk) 04:20, 8 May 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Ah, the FAQ explains that it was named after William H. Ralston Jr (1929-2003), who was the rector of a local church. Should that be mentioned in the article? Polygnotus (talk) 19:40, 8 May 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Requested Updates

I have suggestions to improve this page that I will ask other editors to please review. I am an employee of Ralston College and have reviewed all policies related to Conflict of Interest editing. Thank you.

This edit request by an editor with a conflict of interest was declined.

1. What I think should be changed:

Please replace the first sentence of the first paragraph of the Accreditation section:

The college has been authorized for operation and awarded degree-granting powers by the State of Georgia,^[1] but is not accredited.^[2]

Replace with:

The college was authorized to grant degrees by the State of Georgia in 2020.^[1] In November 2023, the New England Commission of Higher Education determined that the college was eligible to proceed with an application for candidacy for accreditation by 2025.^[3]

Why I think it should be changed:

The existing sentence includes a cite to a bad source (“Savannah Morning News Subscription Offers, Specials, and Discounts”) and is written in the present tense. The suggested replacement removes the bad source, and leaves in the remaining valid source, which is all that is needed for that sentence. I also added the month and date, so the sentence will remain true regardless of future events. Finally, I propose adding a critical new sentence to this topic – that the school was formally approved to proceed in the accreditation process.

2. What I think should be changed:

Please replace the first sentence of the first paragraph of the Lead:

Ralston College is a private unaccredited liberal arts college^[4] in Savannah, Georgia.

Replace with:

Ralston College is a private liberal arts college in Savannah, Georgia.^[1]

And add a new final sentence to the lead paragraph:

In 2023, the college was authorized by the State of Georgia to grant degrees and by New England Commission of Higher Education to pursue educational accreditation. ^[3]

Why I think it should be changed:

Removed the misleading word “unaccredited” from the first sentence and added explanation of its accreditation process to the end of the paragraph. Highlighting the word “unaccredited” makes it seem like the school was rejected for accreditation or that it is not even trying to become accredited. This is misleading since the school has formally approved to proceed with the accreditation process and has been formally approved to grant degrees in the meantime.

Thank you for your consideration in reviewing these suggested updates.Fletcher2222 (talk) 17:23, 10 October 2024 (UTC) Fletcher2222 (talk) 17:23, 10 October 2024 (UTC)[reply]

^ ^a ^b ^c Kelly, Jemima (October 26, 2023). "The Reopening of the American Mind". Financial Times. Archived from the original on January 22, 2024. Retrieved January 20, 2024.
^ "Savannah Morning News Subscription Offers, Specials, and Discounts". subscribe.savannahnow.com.
^ ^a ^b Schwartzburt, Joseph (2024-04-11). "Ralston College expands Savannah footprint through lease of former Parker's headquarters". www.aol.com. Archived from the original on 2024-07-31. Retrieved 2024-07-31.
^ Fish, Stanley (November 8, 2010). "The Woe-Is-Us Books". The New York Times. Retrieved August 3, 2023.

Hi, thanks for your request above. I'd be grateful if you could clarify one point for me. If I'm reading you correctly then the college is currently unaccredited, but has been deemed to be eligible to proceed with an application for candidacy for accreditation. If that is correct then the current article text re: the college being unaccredited is accurate, although it could certainly be expanded re: the news about being able to apply for accreditation. It seems to me to be too early to remove reference to the college's unaccredited status. As it currently stands I don't believe that the current inclusion of the word "unaccredited" implies that the college was rejected for accreditation, but I do agree that adding something re: the eligibility to proceed would clarify whether or not the college is trying to become accredited.

Am I being reasonable here? Kind regards, Axad12 (talk) 21:43, 10 October 2024 (UTC)[reply]

@Axad12: Savannah Morning News is a reliable source.

The AOL source proposed is a repost of news published by *drumroll* the Savannah Morning News, see the byline and the published article.

The college is unaccredited, so to call it unaccredited is not misleading at all. Basically all unaccredited institutions are allowed to apply for accreditation, that is rather meaningless, and there is no guarantee that they will receive accreditation. If they do, then the article should be updated to reflect that. Polygnotus (talk) 21:50, 10 October 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Not done: There would appear to be agreement that the college is currently correctly described as 'unaccredited'. If, at some point in the future, the college should apply for and receive accreditation then a new COI edit request will be required at that time with a view towards altering the text.

I had previously suggested that the current text might be amended to include reference to the "eligibility to proceed [etc]", but I agree with Polygnotus' input above that that would not be a helpful addition to the article text. Axad12 (talk) 06:22, 11 October 2024 (UTC)[reply]

It is important to note that unaccredited does not necessarily mean bad, and accredited does not necessarily mean good. Everyone agrees that the accreditation system in the United States is not a perfect system. Polygnotus (talk) 06:58, 11 October 2024 (UTC)[reply]

@Polygnotus: @Axad12: Thanks for taking the time to review my proposed updates. Axad12 asked for clarification around the accreditation issue prior to declining the edits, and I do have another source I hope you’ll consider. An institution must meet certain standards before being declared eligible to proceed with a candidacy for accreditation with the New England Commission of Higher Education (NECHE). The standards are spelled out here:[1] Because Ralston has been declared eligible for candidacy, its accreditation status exists at a point between “unaccredited” and “accredited.” This is an important distinction and one that the article currently doesn’t make. That’s why I proposed adding a critical new sentence to the article noting that the school was formally approved to proceed in the accreditation process. The most recent sources that mention accreditation provide this context, so the article should reflect this information as well.

The sentence I proposed adding was based on reporting in the Savannah Morning News, which stated:

As of Nov. 16, 2023, NECHE authorized Ralston to publish the following statement:
“The New England Commission of Higher Education has determined that Ralston College is eligible to proceed with an application for candidacy for accreditation within two years."

Therefore I proposed adding:

In 2023, the college was authorized by the State of Georgia to grant degrees and by New England Commission of Higher Education to pursue educational accreditation. ^[1]

References

^ Schwartzburt, Joseph (2024-04-11). "Ralston College expands Savannah footprint through lease of former Parker's headquarters". www.aol.com. Archived from the original on 2024-07-31. Retrieved 2024-07-31.

Given the NECHE source provided above and the actual emphasis of the source, which devotes five paragraphs and over 250 words to explaining that the accreditation process is in progress, I think adding the accreditation is warranted. Otherwise it seems one POV - that the college is unaccredited- is being elevated above the other. Thanks for considering. Fletcher2222 (talk) 23:16, 15 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]

If I understand correctly from Polygnotus's previous response, the distinction that you are trying to draw here is an exceptionally trivial one.

The college is NOT currently accredited. Any suggestion that that is a POV statement is nonsensical.

Until such time as the college is accredited I don't see any value in further discussion of this point. Axad12 (talk) 23:28, 15 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]

its accreditation status exists at a point between “unaccredited” and “accredited That is incorrect. Its accreditation status is unaccredited. Polygnotus (talk) 14:42, 18 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]

[Kelly-1] Kelly, Jemima (October 26, 2023). "The Reopening of the American Mind". Financial Times. Archived from the original on January 22, 2024. Retrieved January 20, 2024.

[2] "Savannah Morning News Subscription Offers, Specials, and Discounts". subscribe.savannahnow.com.

[Schwartzburt23-3] Schwartzburt, Joseph (2024-04-11). "Ralston College expands Savannah footprint through lease of former Parker's headquarters". www.aol.com. Archived from the original on 2024-07-31. Retrieved 2024-07-31.

[fish-4] Fish, Stanley (November 8, 2010). "The Woe-Is-Us Books". The New York Times. Retrieved August 3, 2023.

[Schwartzburt23-5] Schwartzburt, Joseph (2024-04-11). "Ralston College expands Savannah footprint through lease of former Parker's headquarters". www.aol.com. Archived from the original on 2024-07-31. Retrieved 2024-07-31.

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