Talk:Pholtus

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Alignment

I read that Pholtus (in the 3E dragon mag article) is Lawful Neutral, and does not tolerate those who harbor evil or chaotic intentions, in the least, and thus would not allow Lawful Evil clerics. 66.189.90.207 08:07, 28 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Citation Complaints

I added this fact to the article, in the section on the song O Blinding Light: "This song comes from the Firesign Theatre album Don't Crush That Dwarf, Hand Me the Pliers." My edit was reverted for not citing sources. So I added the fact again, this time properly citing the album in question. Again my edit was reverted, with the complaint that "the citation references itself". So, what exactly would be an appropriate citation? It's not like this is original research -- anybody who wants to can listen to the album and verify that this song is on there. You wouldn't need to cite the fact that "Come Together" is on Abbey Road. I'm confused! --74.14.37.124 (talk) 15:52, 29 October 2011 (UTC)[reply]

A Beatles' album approaches the threshold of common knowledge, and thus would not have to be cited. The Firesign Theatre is much more obscure, in terms of popular culture, and thus needs a source to verify what you are saying. Citing the album itself as the source is circular--the album is its own source. Simply find a source that says "the song 'O Blinding Light' comes from/is based on the Firesign Theatre album Don't Crush That Dwarf, Hand Me the Pliers". If you learned this fact yourself by listening to the album, that is original research. If you learned it from another source, cite the source you learned it from, and it's all good. Guinness323 (talk) 21:52, 30 October 2011 (UTC)[reply]

I guess I'm just not seeing how this qualifies as original research. I agree that my Beatles example wasn't a good one, so think of it this way instead. Suppose an obscure book called X contains the passage "Blah blah blah". If I want to mention in a Wikipedia article on a related subject that this passage appeared in this book, I don't need to cite an additional source that says "The passage 'blah blah blah' appeared in the book X" -- I can just cite the book itself, can I not? Please correct me if this is not so. But if this is so, then if I want to say that Don't Crush That Dwarf contains the passage "O blinding light, O light that blinds, I cannot see, look out for me", why can't I just cite the album? --74.14.37.124 (talk) 01:18, 31 October 2011 (UTC)[reply]