Talk:Peruvian Clásico

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Peru Mid‑importance

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WikiProject Peru To-do:

Assess and prioritise articles (log)
Check for copyvios at Special:Contributions/Priscilla D, tag as {{Db-copyvio}} where appropriate
Create:
Expand: new articles; top importance articles
FAC / FLC: Peru national football team
GAN:
Merge requests: Amazonas before the Inca Empire, Chachapoyas culture
Review: Shining Path, Universitario de Deportes
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Work on Lima, the current article improvement drive
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This article has been mentioned by a media organization:

"L'Universitario ha vinto il titolo in casa dell'Alianza Lima, che ha spento le luci per non farli festeggiare" (in Italian). Rivista Undici. 9 November 2023. Archived from the original on 9 November 2023. Retrieved 11 November 2023. To everyone who would like to take a closer look at the history of the rivalry – not only sporting, but also political and cultural – between the two teams, here's the Wikipedia page; everybody else can be content with the fact that in Peru, the match is known by two nicknames: "El Clásico Peruano", or the more pompous "El Clásico de los Clásicos del Futbol Peruano".

Incorrect translation?

Is there any source that says that this rivalry is called the "Peruvian Super Classic" in English, or is the title in English a translation of "Superclásico Peruano"? If it is a translation of "Superclásico Peruano", I believe it is an incorrect translation. "Clásico", when it refers to a football rivalry, is translated to "derby" in English. So the correct English translation should be "Peruvian Super Derby". Digirami (talk) 20:51, 6 August 2009 (UTC)[reply]

The word "classic" in English does exist to describe a big game or rivalry. Peruvian Super Derby would sound wrong because that translation is WAY off. Also, when searching on wikipedia, I am sure most people would not include the word derby in their search for this "clasico" --MicroX (talk) 18:04, 1 September 2009 (UTC)[reply]

But in soccer, clásico translates to derby, not classic in the literal sense. Example: El Clásico del Astillero is translated to The Shipyard Derby (although the English translation is rarely ever used to begin with). Even in reference to this particular rivalry, the word derby is used, not classic (same goes for RSSSF). And I'm sure I could very easily find more articles by FIFA on Latin American clásicos where the word is not translated to classic, but rather derby.

But if you have a legit source that says this derby is named so in English, you should consider moving it to the Spanish name. Digirami (talk) 08:21, 4 September 2009 (UTC)[reply]

The reason why I don't like the idea of moving it to the Spanish name is because this is the English Wikipedia and A LOT of people here do not know Spanish. I think it is common courtesy to give them an English name similar to the Spanish name and then when reading the article they find the true name in Spanish. I feel the same way when I see stuff in other languages and I have NO IDEA what is going on. Also, Peruvian Super Derby doesn't exist either. I've seen it been used to name the Argentine "Superclasico" and it just looked wrong. --MicroX (talk) 04:22, 5 September 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Well you should go with the derby is called by. If the most common is in Spanish, the Spanish name should be the title. There is no point in naming the article of this event something it has never been called before, even if it can be translated. This is just basic Wiki naming policy. That's why derbies like El Superclasico and El Clasico kept their Spanish name in their article title: because we use their Spanish name in English usage. Digirami (talk) 20:42, 5 September 2009 (UTC)[reply]

A clásico isn't exactly a derby. A derby is like a cross-town rivalry between two teams. But I see a clásico as a South American tradition, (actually, a Hispanic tradition because it came from Spain) where it could represent a rivalry between two teams from any part of the country (like Real Madrid and Barcelona). However, this is only my opinion. I just found two sources (here and here) that have referred to the clásico as the derby peruano but these aren't primary sources. They are just newspapers sources and they aren't from Peru. If we are to re-name it, the thing that I wouldn't recommend is Clasico Peruano. Peruvian Clásico would seem appropriate or Peruvian Superclásico. Like I said before, It would be weird for someone not familiar with Spanish to see Peruano or Peruana when Peruvian is the appropriate translation. --MicroX (talk) 03:09, 6 September 2009 (UTC)[reply]

A clasico is a derby since it is a rivalry (in the case of Real Madrid and Barcelona, the South American term replaced the previous name of the rivalry). If you rename this, it has to be the most common name of the rivalry, even if every word is in Spanish and if it might be weird. Digirami (talk) 13:45, 6 September 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Torneo Apertura 1940s

In the 1940s there were Torneo Aperturas. Some clasicos were played here. The question is whether they are official or not. According to this source they neither consider them official nor friendly. This is because they were organized by the A.N.A. (organizer of the official championship) but did not contribute to the national championship. The top 4 teams of the previous tournament participated in this tournament and the winner only won a cup. This was more of a friendly tournament that offered clubs to try out players. In one edition of the Torneo Apertura, Alianza split its squad in two; one squad would play in Ecuador for a friendly tournament and the other squad stayed in Lima to play the Torneo Apertura. Winning the Torneo Apertura offered no bonus points in the national championship of the same year or any kind of advantage. Also note that these Torneo Aperturas were nothing like the ones played in 1994 and between 1997 and 2008 where they were part of the national championship. The 1994 Torneo Apertura gave its winner bonus points for the national championship, thus it is directly involved. --MicroX (talk) 19:56, 1 September 2009 (UTC)[reply]