Talk:Mollie Steimer

GA Review

The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

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This review is transcluded from Talk:Mollie Steimer/GA1. The edit link for this section can be used to add comments to the review.

Reviewer: BennyOnTheLoose (talk · contribs) 23:12, 5 June 2023 (UTC)

GA review (see here for what the criteria are, and here for what they are not)

1. It is reasonably well written.

   a. (prose, spelling, and grammar):

   b. (MoS for lead, layout, word choice, fiction, and lists):

2. It is factually accurate and verifiable.

   a. (reference section):

   b. (citations to reliable sources):

   c. (OR):

   d. (copyvio and plagiarism):

3. It is broad in its coverage.

   a. (major aspects):

   b. (focused):

4. It follows the neutral point of view policy.

   Fair representation without bias:

5. It is stable.

   No edit wars, etc.:

6. It is illustrated by images and other media, where possible and appropriate.

   a. (images are tagged and non-free content have non-free use rationales):

   b. (appropriate use with suitable captions):

7. Overall:

   Pass/fail:

(Criteria marked are unassessed)

Happy to discuss, or be challenged on, any of my review comments. Regards, BennyOnTheLoose (talk) 23:29, 5 June 2023 (UTC)

Copyvio check

• I reviewed the top matches found using Earwig's Copyvio Detector. There was a 64.5% match with a spartacus-educational.com site, but this is accounted for by an attributed quote and some phrases that are acceptable per WP:LIMITED. No issues with the three other sources that showed matches above 5% either. No issues with paraphrasing, from the sources I saw.

Images

• Images are PD, and no reason to doubt that. Images are relevant. Positioning is fine.
• The caption "Fleshin; Steimer; Voline 1930" could be improved.  Done
• Not a requirement for GA, but consider adding ALT text. (see WP:MOSALT)  Done

Sources

• Not a long list of sources, but better a few high-quality ones than lots of poor ones, so all good here.
• Magnone (1998) is doctoral-level work from a researcher at a reputable University.

• I'm actually now wondering if I should remove Magnone 1998, as that source is only used briefly for her experiences in occupied France. The only original piece of information in there that's not covered by the other sources is that May Picqueray secured Steimer's release, the rest is covered by Marsh and Polenberg. (Also it's the only source that's not in the English language, which sticks out) --Grnrchst (talk) 09:32, 6 June 2023 (UTC)

• Bluestein, Abe, ed. (1983) isn't used as a supporting source so could (probably) be moved to further reading.  Done
• Marsh, Margaret S. (1981) is the only book that includes a location in the citation; optionally, you could be consistent across books about whether location is included.

•  Done Removed location, as all of the publishers are notable and can be wikilinked to. --Grnrchst (talk) 08:42, 6 June 2023 (UTC)

Yes, I noticed that a lot of the info in the article is verified by citations more than one source, which IMO is a good thing, although beyond what's required. But if Magnone isn't required, then I'd agree with removing it. BennyOnTheLoose (talk) 13:29, 6 June 2023 (UTC)

 Done --Grnrchst (talk) 15:18, 6 June 2023 (UTC)

Biography

• Optionally, as all the main content is within biography, the Early activism/Arrest, trial and imprisonment/Deportation and exile/Later life sections could be brought up a level, as sections rather than subsections, with the into text to biogarpahy either an "Early life" section or combined, with a suitable hearing, with the Early activism section.  Done
• Spot check on On November 21, 1897, Mollie Steimer was born in Dunaivtsi, a village in the south-west of the Russian Empire (modern-day Ukraine) - p.214 in the source gives "Dunaevtsy in southwestern Russia,". I think we need a source to say it's in modern-day Ukraine. I guess this might then give a rationale for the different spelling (Dunaivtsi/Dunaevtsy)

•  Done Honestly I'm confused as to why this would need a source, as it's just a fact that it's in modern-day Ukraine, but I've gone ahead and removed it anyway if it's really that much of a problem. (I thought I was just clarifying something) As for the naming, yes it's a difference between the Ukrainian and Russian names. --Grnrchst (talk) 08:42, 6 June 2023 (UTC)

• Assuming that the birth name in the infobox is correct, can this info be added here, with a source?

•  Done I guess this must have been an artefact from an earlier version of the article, because I can't for the life of me find where this is coming from. None of the cited sources mention her having a different birth name. --Grnrchst (talk) 08:42, 6 June 2023 (UTC)

Early activism

• By the outbreak of the Russian Revolution - is it worth adding the year?  Done
• Spot check on "That government is best which governs not at all" (Yiddish: Yene regirung iz di beste, velke regirt in gantsn nit) - I checked the Avrich source, which has the spelling "velkhe".  Done

Arrest, trial and imprisonment

• Spot check on 15 years in prison and a $500 fine - verified by Avrich p.218
• With support from a wide range of society doesn't quite read right to me

•  Done Clarified per what's said in the cited source. --Grnrchst (talk) 08:42, 6 June 2023 (UTC)

• Spot check on and the entire staff of Harvard Law School - being pedantic, the source says "the whole legal staff at Harvard" which I take to mean the legal scholars rather to include than administrative and support staff as well, but I could be convinced that the current wording is fine.

•  Done That may have been a misunderstanding on my part. --Grnrchst (talk) 08:42, 6 June 2023 (UTC)

Deportation and exile

• What text from the source are you relying on for there were no anarchists left to greet them?

• "Russia was no longer a haven for genuine revolutionaries but rather a land of authority and repression." I've attempted to rework it to bring it closer to the source, let me know if anything else needs changing. --Grnrchst (talk) 08:42, 6 June 2023 (UTC)

• ACLU could be wiki-linked  Done
• they returned to Paris to escape rising antisemitism - maybe add the year?  Done
• Spot check on She remained at Camp Gurs for months before escaping, - Polenberg p.362 says she was released; but Marsh p.38 does say that she escaped.

• Anything I should do here? --Grnrchst (talk) 08:42, 6 June 2023 (UTC)

Maybe add a footnote, if sources differ. I didn't check across other sources. BennyOnTheLoose (talk) 09:01, 6 June 2023 (UTC)

I reviewed the sources and Marsh actually says "Steimer remained in the camp for six months, after which she escaped to the unoccupied part of France." That "after" did a lot of leg work there, so I don't think Marsh is saying she escaped from the camp, more that she escaped Nazi-occupied France after leaving the camp. I have clarified this and fixed up some more of the text based on what I read. -- Grnrchst (talk) 09:25, 6 June 2023 (UTC)

Later life

• Mollie Steimer died and Senya Fleshin died - should use just surnames.  Done

See also

• I think it's out of the scope of a GA review, but I wasn't sure why Anarchist Black Cross and Polar Bear Expedition are included here.

• Anarchist Black Cross is a prisoner support organisation and Steimer herself was very involved in anarchist prisoner support. Polar Bear Expedition was the American intervention in the Russian Civil War that Steimer opposed. Should I remove these? --Grnrchst (talk) 08:42, 6 June 2023 (UTC)

No, that's fine. BennyOnTheLoose (talk) 09:01, 6 June 2023 (UTC)

Infobox and lead

• I put Моллі Штаймер and מאלי שטיימער into a translation site and results seem reasonable.
• Nationality: Ukrainian Jew - looks to me like this needs a source.

•  Done Removed. --Grnrchst (talk) 08:51, 6 June 2023 (UTC)

• Height: 1.42 m (4 ft 8 in) - is this relevant? Either exclude, or add a source.

•  Done Removed. --Grnrchst (talk) 08:51, 6 June 2023 (UTC)

• After settling in New York City, - I think it would be helpful to add when or at what age  Done
• I feel like the lead could be a little longer, but as I'm finding it hard to suggest specifically what else to include, I'll not insist on it being expanded.

• Let me know if you think of anything. --Grnrchst (talk) 08:51, 6 June 2023 (UTC)

Maybe early inspirations ("inspired by the works of the Russian anarchists Mikhail Bakunin, Peter Kropotkin and Emma Goldman")? BennyOnTheLoose (talk) 09:29, 6 June 2023 (UTC)

General

• I made some changes suggested by scripts. Hopefully uncontroversial, but feel free to revert.
• There are a few duplicate links that should be removed per WP:DUPLINKS: Yiddish, Emma Goldman, Russian Revolution (I use User:Evad37/duplinks-alt to find these)  Done
• Emma Goldman should be "Goldman" after the first mention.

• The mentions are spaced quite far apart though, should I still do this? --Grnrchst (talk) 08:51, 6 June 2023 (UTC)

MOS:SURNAME says "After the initial mention, a person should generally be referred to by surname only", but I'm always open to an argument to WP:IAR. BennyOnTheLoose (talk) 09:23, 6 June 2023 (UTC)

In this case I'm leaning towards IAR, as to me it would read a bit weird to have her referred to by her surname when she's not mentioned nearly as often as Steimer or Fleshin. -- Grnrchst (talk) 09:28, 6 June 2023 (UTC)

Thanks for your work on the article, Grnrchst. An interesting read, and I didn't find any significant issues during my review. Regards, BennyOnTheLoose (talk) 00:39, 6 June 2023 (UTC)

@BennyOnTheLoose: I think I've covered everything you brought up here. Get back to me on the final things that need work when you can. :) --Grnrchst (talk) 08:51, 6 June 2023 (UTC)

I'm satisfied that the article meets the GA criteria, so I'm passing it. Good work, Grnrchst. Regards, BennyOnTheLoose (talk) 20:01, 6 June 2023 (UTC)

The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

Did you know nomination

The following is an archived discussion of the DYK nomination of the article below. Please do not modify this page. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as this nomination's talk page, the article's talk page or Wikipedia talk:Did you know), unless there is consensus to re-open the discussion at this page. No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was: promoted by Bruxton (talk) 12:46, 12 June 2023 (UTC)

(

• Comment or view
• Article history

)

• ... that after Mollie Steimer was convicted for sedition, she refused to join a prison escape attempt, as she didn't want to dishonor the workers that had paid her bail? Source: Avrich 1988, p. 220
  • ALT1: ... that Mollie Steimer escaped to Mexico from Nazi-occupied France after being released from Gurs internment camp? Source: Marsh 1981, p. 38
  • ALT2: ... that the Jewish anarchist activist Mollie Steimer was imprisoned by the United States, Soviet Union and Nazi Germany? Source: Avrich 1988, pp. 214-226
  • ALT3: ... that the ACLU's founder Roger Nash Baldwin condemned the United States and the Soviet Union, after both governments had imprisoned and deported Mollie Steimer? Source: Szajkowski 1971, p. 32.
  • ALT4: ... that when anarchists such as Mollie Steimer were convicted under the Sedition Act of 1918, they were defended by the legal staff of Harvard University? Source: Avrich 1988, pp. 218–219
  • Reviewed: Template:Did you know nominations/Carla Monroe

Improved to Good Article status by Grnrchst (talk). Self-nominated at 15:48, 7 June 2023 (UTC). Post-promotion hook changes for this nom will be logged at Template talk:Did you know nominations/Mollie Steimer; consider watching this nomination, if it is successful, until the hook appears on the Main Page.

General: Article is new enough and long enough
New enough: Long enough:

Policy: Article is sourced, neutral, and free of copyright problems
Adequate sourcing: Neutral: Free of copyright violations, plagiarism, and close paraphrasing:

Hook eligibility:

• Cited:
• Interesting:
• Other problems: - one issue

QPQ: Done.

Overall: @Grnrchst: Good article. Though alt3 is worder kind of weird so i'd prefer a copyedit on it. Onegreatjoke (talk) 23:55, 7 June 2023 (UTC)

• @Onegreatjoke: Copy-edited ALT3. How's it look now? --Grnrchst (talk) 07:34, 8 June 2023 (UTC)

Good now. Onegreatjoke (talk) 19:14, 10 June 2023 (UTC)

Earwig 64% due to long blockquote. I liked ALT2 but I could not quickly piece it together. Perhaps the actual hook in the article with a citation? In any event ALT0 is confirmed. Bruxton (talk) 12:45, 12 June 2023 (UTC)