Talk:Liebe ist für alle da

Untitled

What's with this insistence to constantly change the name of the album to Liebe Ist Fur Alle Da? It hasn't even been officially confirmed anywhere 122.107.178.246 (talk) 08:57, 1 September 2009 (UTC)

It has been confirmed in the "Pussy" promotional video, and more recently by Paul Landers in an interview. Ryan-S79 (talk) 12:08, 6 September 2009 (UTC)

Yeah, evidently, but look at the date of my post first 122.107.178.246 (talk) 03:45, 9 September 2009 (UTC)

The date of your first post was the date I created this page; the day it was confirmed in the "Pussy" promotional video. Ryan-S79 (talk) 12:44, 9 September 2009 (UTC)

Okaaaaaaaaaay. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 122.107.178.246 (talk) 12:07, 14 September 2009 (UTC)

Bonus tracks

I'm not questionining their validity (they look legit enough), but can we actually get a source for them? 122.107.178.246 (talk) 09:02, 15 September 2009 (UTC)

Click on the reference link for it. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Heartless4 (talk • contribs) 16:11, 15 September 2009 (UTC)

Redirect

Would anyone know how to make typing in "LIFAD" redirect to the page? After all that is the website domain and imo a lot easier to write out then Liebe Ist Für Alle Da —Preceding unsigned comment added by Rammstein1 (talk • contribs) 18:51, 15 September 2009 (UTC)

I’m on it. — NRen2k5^(TALK), 21:10, 17 September 2009 (UTC)

Done. — NRen2k5^(TALK), 21:13, 17 September 2009 (UTC)

Title

The title is in German, and should therefore be capitalized in another way. "Liebe ist für alle da" is the correct title.

Wikipedia:WikiProject_Albums#Capitalization concurs. — mihhkel (talk) 18:22, 21 September 2009 (UTC)

Love is there for all?

What's up with the translation of the title? I'm pretty sure it means "Love is for Everyone", thought I don't know german very well. Anyone wrote the other title knowing it really?

"da" means there, but in this case refears to "alle da", meaning something like "all (the people) there", which indeed means Everyone.

--Krun00 (talk) 15:08, 20 September 2009 (UTC)

"Love is There For Everyone" would be a translation of "Liebe ist da für Alle" or something...I think the original translation (Love is for Everyone) is the correct one, but I'm not pretty familiar with German either...=P Victão Lopes ^{I hear you...} 15:14, 20 September 2009 (UTC)

The correct translation should be "Love is for everyone there". Where did the one on the page come from? That horrid Babelfish site? I'm fixing it right now. B10Reaper (talk) 00:22, 25 September 2009 (UTC)

"Love is for everyone there" is NOT the proper translation, "Love is for all" is. I understand German well enough & have double checked it with my mother, a native German speaker. 「ɠu¹ɖяy」¤ • ¢  06:19, 25 September 2009 (UTC)

I am a German teacher and I agree with you in the point that "love is for all" would be a secondary interpretation of the title but I personally think that the proper translation of the title should be "Love is For Everyone There" because it is a literal translation of it and it still is understood as the very original title in German is. But for practical purposes and for keeping everybody satisfied and happy we could write both of them separated with a slash and that could be it. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 200.56.191.253 (talk) 16:11, 4 October 2009 (UTC)

ɠu¹ɖяy is right. "Da sein"/"ist ... da" is a set expression and means "to exist". "Es ist genug für alle da" = "There is enough for everyone/to go round". "...for everybody there" is not a proper translation as no native speaker would understand it like that --78.34.152.195 (talk) 18:54, 21 October 2009 (UTC)

I apologize for being blunt, but these are some truly wretched, all-too-literal translations of the title. A more thoughtful approach paying mind to the lyrics of the title track and Rammstein's propensity for wordplay would suggest the title should be "There is love for all" or, more idiomatically, "There's love for all." Please note that this page is the second hit on Google for the album, and can easily set precedents for this translation outside the Wikimedia community. I suggest we forego the translation altogether until a credible one can be referenced as a source. EastOfGingerTrees (talk) 19:26, 23 October 2009 (UTC)

The literal translation is "Love exists for everyone" (with a connotation of "Love is free, there is enough love for all" etc.). The emphasis is on "alle/everyone", not on love and much less on 'there'. Probably "Love exists for everyone" is not how one would say it in English, but every differing translation does not convey the meaning of "Liebe ist für alle da". And, as a rough guide: every translation containing "for all/everyone there" is wrong :) --87.79.146.115 (talk) 09:46, 25 October 2009 (UTC)

The literal translation is "Love is there for everyone" meaning "Love exists for everyone" as the person above just mentioned. By translating to "Love is there for everyone" the original meaning and words are kept. As both languages are very similar this is possible by changing just the grammatical structure. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 187.58.48.226 (talk) 18:11, 26 October 2009 (UTC)

Actually, the 'literal' translation is Love Is For Everyone There. Of course, this makes very little sense in English, as the title is an idiom. In order to accurately translate the title, one must also examine the meaning of the lyrics. The translator who translated the referenced lyrics to Liebe ist fur alle da appears to have translated the greater body of work by Rammstein and is sourced in other articles about the group; we should accept his or her sourced translation, which is "There is love for everyone."EastOfGingerTrees (talk) 16:36, 27 October 2009 (UTC)

As a German very familiar with English I can only confirm what 187.58.48.226 said - "Love is there for everyone" is the most suitable translation. "There is love for everyone" has not much to do with the actual German phrase. Its only meaning is love being a resource simply available to all. While this is one possible meaning of the German phrase, there's another, along the lines of love being an entitiy that makes itself accessible to all without discrimination. Think of the subtle difference between a mother that is passively available to everyone ("there is mother for everyone"), or a mother that actively, indiscriminately offers herself to all ("mother is there for everyone"). The translation "Love is there for everyone" perfectly captures both meanings as they are expressed by the German phrase, while "There is love for everyone" is limited to the meaning of love being a passive resource. The context of the lyrics leaves open the possibility for both interpretations of the phrase. "There is love for everyone" would be "Es gibt Liebe für alle/jeden" in German.

I appreciate the concise beauty of your argument, but as an American also very familiar with German I see two problems with your suggestions. Love is an abstract concept. Mother could be considered a concept, but it is also a singular noun. In English, the sentence "Mother is there for everyone" suggests one concrete mother only. "There is mother for everyone" makes no sense in English; however, "There is a mother for everyone" suggests mother as a concept. "A mother is there for everyone" could possibly suggest mother as a concept, but it is very uncomfortable to say in English. Likewise, "Love is there for everyone" is very uncomfortable to say in English. In the proper English meaning, starting the sentence with the word "there" is an example of a syntactic expletive, and gives "there" a more abstract, existential meaning, which is how English speakers traditionally translate the meaning of "da sein". Using "love is there" implies that "there" is an actual place, like on a table: very concrete and singular, like mother. Additionally, consider the line that immediately follows "liebe ist für alle da" - "nicht für mich" - "not for me", or "auch für mich" - "and for me". Using "There is love for everyone" preserves the meter of the German words. "There is love for everyone, and for me".

The second and most important problem is that I have yet to find a credible source that lists "Love is there for everyone" as the translation. However, many music websites give "Love is there for everyone" as the translation, and I believe it comes from directly from the poor original translation on this page. As I've mentioned before, the source that gives "There is love for everyone" as the translation comes from a speaker who has credibly translated other Rammstein pieces. I assume only a source directly from the band would only be more definitive. Be aware that attempting to change the translation back to "Love is there for everyone" invalidates the reference attached to it, and may force the article to include the ugly "citation needed" next to the translation. EastOfGingerTrees (talk) 16:30, 30 October 2009 (UTC)

I see your point about "mother" not being the best example, but I chose it because "love", while it is an abstract concept, can be personified - and that is one possible way of reading the German phrase, one that is not reflected in "there is love for everyone". But it is in "love is there for everyone". However uncomfortable that phrase might be to you, it's not incorrect, and it reflects both meanings of the German phrase. If you indeed are familiar with German, you will see that there are two possible ways of reading the German phrase, and "there is love for everyone" completely neglects one. When translating an artist's lyrics into a different language, what's better - paying respect to the "linguistic discomfort" of the speakers whose language it's translated into, or the subtleties of the artist's language ? When I as a native German hear "Liebe ist für alle da" translated into "there is love for everyone", it makes me cringe. I'm not gonna change back the phrase in the article though, I don't wanna cause a petty edit war. But anybody familiar with both languages will hopefully see the difficulties with the current translation. I think this, and not the original "poor" translation from this article is the reason for the translations you find on "many music websites". Only thing I can say about the translator's credibility - he's made some unnecessary mistakes in the very lyrics this article links to, some of which are discussed in its comment section. No offense, but again - if you're really familiar with the German language, you should be able to assess that this translator's credibility is not quite what it's held to be here. I agree, only a source from the band would be more definitive - until that happens, I hope the phrase that translates all possible intentions they might have had with that line wins out over the one that loses half the meaning in translation. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 95.116.138.109 (talk) 16:00, 1 November 2009 (UTC)

If you try and understand the lyrics as personifying love, it will give a new meaning to the interaction between the singer and the female in the lyrics, one that doesn't rule out at all the personifying side of the German phrase. Furthermore - like you said, some good sources for the translation "love is there for everyone" should be presented. Well, apart from noting the majority of lyrics sites on the web already using that translation, all I can do is "officially" call into question the credibility of the translator that is your favoured source. He translates the German "feinste Formen" with "fine curves" - which is one-dimensiomal, and above that, blatantly wrong. It literally means finest forms/shapes. Following that right away, "good build" is another glaring mistake - "gut gebaut" means "well built", not "good build". "Good build" would be "guter Bau/gute Form". So other than all the sites using "love is there for everyone", and the reasoning from a German POV in the entries I have made here, I can't present more evidence for "my" translation being the right one - but I think I illustrated why "there is love for everyone" is indeed dubious, and why the sourced translator should not be relied upon. In light of that, you should back up the choice for "there is love for everyone". —Preceding unsigned comment added by 95.116.138.109 (talk) 22:30, 1 November 2009 (UTC)

I've been reading some of the translations from the listed source and i can confirm that there are many mistranslations and that they seem to have been rushed or done by someone with lacking knowledge of one of the two languages. I don't want to start a edit war either and i don't really understand wikipedia policies, so i just hope the person who reverted my edit "love is there for everyone" back to "there is love for everyone" (which is negligent of the actual meaning) or anyone else reverts it back. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 189.115.210.108 (talk) 03:19, 3 November 2009 (UTC)

It was I who reverted the translation to "There is love for everyone", because whomever changed it to "Love is there for everyone" did not update the article to reflect his or her source as well. We are not here to provoke edit wars, obviously, but to keep the article in compliance with Wiki policy. I recognize that the current translation of the title ("There is love for everyone") is imperfect, but it is the only source I have seen thus far that is included as part of an actual translation, rather than based upon speculation or other sources. I encourage other contributors to this article to seek out new translations to include as sources. However, I do not feel the current translation is too far off that it is detrimental to the accuracy of the article, by any means. I also want to point out that this is not "my" translation, and I carry no emotions over whether a new source is found. I would like to encourage the article's contributors not to attach a possession to any such translation, as well. EastOfGingerTrees (talk) 15:41, 3 November 2009 (UTC)

I for my part didn't want to accuse anybody of trying to start edit wars, just wanted to make clear that this wasn't my intention. Also I get your point about the lacking sources - so I did a little search, and it was right under our noses. The very same site on which the lyrics are found gives the title as "love is there for everyone" on the info page about the album. If we accept the site as an authoritative source, then the info page has to be the source for the album title, as the lyrics page nowhere mentions the album title - you pulled it out of the lyrics, but they're obviously not a translation of the title. Hope that's sufficient. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 95.116.179.83 (talk) 16:06, 3 November 2009 (UTC)

As long as "da/da sein" is preserved as some form of "to exist" I think everyone can stay happy. This section is probably longer than the article itself. :) EastOfGingerTrees (talk) 18:35, 3 November 2009 (UTC)

I know - for me though it was always about the preservation of "da/da sein" as a form of "being/making oneself available". Anyway, now we're left with the best source for the translation seemingly being confused about the right translation as well :) —Preceding unsigned comment added by 95.116.179.83 (talk) 23:26, 3 November 2009 (UTC)

Guys, honestly. Why don't you just listen to the native german speakers? I am a native german and a) this discussion makes little sense in my eyes and b) the correct translation is "Love is here/there for everyone". "Love is for everyone there" is just wrong. The album title cannot be translated word by word. You have to consider the context of the phrase. This has nothing to do with source but with basic language skills. --95.131.99.15 (talk) 07:44, 18 July 2018 (UTC)

Personnel?

When do we add the credits to the page? Before or after the album is released? Liquinn (talk) 14:16, 21 September 2009 (UTC)

Album CD info?

I am confused. Will the album be released in a CD form with and without the limited edition tracks? So there will be 2 versions of the album been released in a CD format? Or what? Maybe this info could be added to the article if someone has a source. Thanks. Liquinn (talk) 17:22, 3 October 2009 (UTC)

Release Date

I downloaded the album and I'm listening to it right now. Either the release date here is wrong or the album got leaked. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 76.78.14.117 (talk) 01:44, 14 October 2009 (UTC)

Nah, there's no doubt it was leaked, because if you saw all those promotional videos for the album it definitely said 16/10/09. 122.107.178.246 (talk)

Table?

OK, perhaps a table with release dates could be placed on the page as I'm a little confused myself.

From what I understand the release dates are:

Europe - 16th of October United Kingdom 19th of October USA - 20th of October

Could we get a table up or something? Thanks. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Liquinn (talk • contribs) 16:42, 16 October 2009 (UTC)

Itunes exclusive track?

I tried to search the remix by Rob Flynn on Itunes but could not find it. Does it really exist? If so can anyone direct it to itunes or somewhere ? Thanks. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 68.96.39.48 (talk) 21:51, 17 October 2009 (UTC)

Yes, it does exist, but I don't know if it's on iTunes yet or not, as I haven't checked. But I have heard the song. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 66.177.128.211 (talk) 14:29, 26 October 2009 (UTC)

Scary Translations

Hi everybody i found some translations who are not really right.
1. Rammlied - The Ramm cames from rammen what means to ram or to pile, not of the bandname. so the correct translation would be ram-song or pile-song.
2. The right translation of Liese is Liese. Because the german word for Elizabeth is of course Elizabeth too. Liese is the short version of Elizabeth (like William - Will - Bill) and so it is not to translate in a correct way.
Apart from that, the article is great and shows another time that this is the right wikipedia and not the awful german-speaking wiki. Ever saw this? No pictures, stupid censorship... however. --SwissAirForceSoldier (talk) 13:50, 18 October 2009 (UTC)
I forgot:
3. The right translation of (Orchester version) is orchestra version. orchestral version is the translation of Orchestrale Version. --SwissAirForceSoldier (talk) 17:49, 18 October 2009 (UTC)

I don't agree with your statement on Rammlied. The word Rammlied is a combination of Rammstien and lied (song). If the song title was Ramm lied then you'd likely be correct, but the tile is one word. Rammlied in fact is not even a real word, it's made up word by the band. It is not a song about ram or pile, it's a song about the band.Ximmerman (talk) 15:20, 20 October 2009 (UTC)

Wrong. In German, Words that are build of 2 words, are written in 1 word without space, for example Tennisball (Tennis and ball [needs no translation, i think^^]), Glashaus (Glass and House), Rammstein (rammen [ram] and stein [stone]) and so on. Nobody who understands a bit of German would ever write Ramm Lied. We call this unnecessary space a Deppen Leer Zeichen (Stupid's Space), mainly used by younger people who doesn't know better, reason is the english habit which is copied by younger people here. I'm swiss, german is my mother tongue. So actually, you (and nobody) can really say if it cames from the bandname or from rammen. So or so, Ramm-song with 2 m is wrong. And sorry for my english, i hope it's understandable anyway. --SwissAirForceSoldier (talk) 22:08, 21 October 2009 (UTC)

I'm afraid your English isn't nearly good enough to offer up translations. The word you meant is actually Deppenleerzeichen. I find it pretty ironic that you included two "Stupid's Spaces" in the word that refers to the error itself. Your translation is far too literal, and the most basic understanding of the lyrics completely rules out the words "to ram" and "pile". The song is clearly about the band, which common sense should tell you means the title is also about the band. The title means Rammstein song, and it is, as usual, the band's way of expressing themselves with puns that perhaps you aren't equipped to understand. Furthermore, starting off your response with "Wrong." is a fantastic way to let everyone know that you are emotionally invested in your flawed understanding of the lyrics, and are therefore more likely to be completely incorrect. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Six asunder (talk • contribs) 12:40, 26 October 2009 (UTC)

Easy, gents - they're just words. While the verb rammen does mean 'to ram', Rammstein takes their name from the city and/or airbase Ramstein. An examination of the lyrics for "Rammlied" reveals the title is obviously a portmanteau of Rammstein and lied, and we shouldn't waste any more space discussing an alternate possibility. But, I do agree with SwissAirForceSoldier in that "Liese" should remain translated as Liese and not Elizabeth, as Elizabeth is also a common name in German-speaking areas. —Preceding unsigned comment added by EastOfGingerTrees (talk • contribs) 16:47, 27 October 2009 (UTC)

Yeah right, but one more: It actually is the joke, the gag, the esprit, that you write the word which means Stupid's space with Stupid's space! Too much trees, can't see the forest! --SwissAirForceSoldier (talk) 03:01, 30 October 2009 (UTC)

Too many* trees, can't see the forest! Or, if you want to be totally correct, Can't see the forest through all the trees. Again, you'll have to forgive me for not taking any opinion you have about English and English translations seriously.

Canadian Release Date

The Canadian release date was changed today to October 27th, 2009, as it was delayed by a week. Thanks --gravediggerfuneral —Preceding undated comment added 02:04, 21 October 2009 (UTC).

Reception

Does this article deserve a section? 122.107.178.246 (talk) 06:08, 29 October 2009 (UTC)

"Professional reviews

Not that I have anything against good reviews, but a lot of the reviews that have been put up here are from websites that aggregate user votes. 122.107.178.246 (talk) 05:49, 30 October 2009 (UTC)

Special Edition Cover

I was wondering if anyone could put a picture of the special edition cover on the page also? —Preceding unsigned comment added by Heartless4 (talk • contribs) 23:10, 1 November 2009 (UTC)

Explanation for "Ich Tu Dir Weh" censorship?

Was it ever explained WHY this song was censored? What confused me was that "Ich Tu Dir Weh" didn't stay on the album but "Mein Teil" passed no problem, and it had what seems like a... "riskier" subject in the lyrics. Was it a matter of how explicit and clear the lyrics were(n't) that let "Mein Teil" slip by without censorship? And just to be clear, was "Ich Tu Dir Weh" censored only in Germany or around the world as a result of it being censored there? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 151.203.68.235 (talk) 03:02, 6 January 2010 (UTC)

I am a little bit confused here. But maybe just by the lack of correct wording. This case has nothing to do with censorship as such. Nothing has been censored on the record. There is no authority in Germany to censor anything. It can be pulled from the stores in total (after a court order), yes, but this is not the case. Censorship meaning the omission of parts ist not what we are talking about here. The Authority (BPJM) concerned can classify the album as not to be made available to minors (banning public advertisment, public display etc.). The decision to modify the contents of the album is made by the artist solely in order to keep minors as potential buyers.--92.231.67.151 (talk) 23:40, 22 April 2011 (UTC)

AllMusic 2 star review

Really shits me because myself and many others can definitely vouch for it originally having 4 stars. Doesn't take a genius either to realise that the content of the review wouldn't indicate a 2 star grade, but nothing can really be done to prove otherwise. 110.174.65.202 (talk) —Preceding undated comment added 09:43, 15 January 2010 (UTC).