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Archive 1

Merge

The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section.

Dear Editors, I would like to bring your attention to the recent rush of articles related to the newly formed coalition in India, the Indian National Developmental Inclusive Alliance. It has come to my notice that multiple articles have been created with similar names but with different mistakes and variations. After thorough research and analysis, I have determined that the correct and final name for the coalition is Indian National Developmental Inclusive Alliance. Therefore, I kindly request your assistance in merging any existing articles with similar names, such as Indian National Democratic Inclusive Alliance or any other variations, into the main article Indian National Developmental Inclusive Alliance. Consolidating these articles under the correct name will not only avoid confusion but also ensure accuracy and consistency in our content. By merging the pages, we can create a comprehensive and reliable resource for readers seeking information about the Indian National Developmental Inclusive Alliance. Thank you for your attention to this matter. Your cooperation in maintaining the quality and integrity of our content is greatly appreciated. Best regards, ❯❯❯ Chunky aka Al Kashmiri (✍️) 13:17, 18 July 2023 (UTC)

  • Comment: Wait Even reliable sources look confused. Kharge said Democratic but Rahul Gandhi said Developmental. This the the confusion. Some media houses say Developmental some say Democratic.The Hindu India TV Vs NDTV Shaan SenguptaTalk 13:30, 18 July 2023 (UTC)
  • Support - Official name -> “Indian National Developmental Inclusive Alliance”
  1. https://www.reuters.com/world/india/indian-opposition-parties-form-alliance-called-india-2024-elections-2023-07-18/
  2. https://www.ndtv.com/india-news/i-n-d-i-a-name-being-considered-for-united-opposition-say-sources-4218025
  3. https://www.aljazeera.com/news/2023/7/18/indian-opposition-parties-form-india-alliance-for-2024-election
  4. https://www.bbc.com/news/world-asia-india-66230072
  5. https://m.economictimes.com/news/india/opposition-alliance-named-india-indian-national-democratic-inclusive-alliance/articleshow/101856873.cms
  6. https://www.thehindu.com/news/national/opposition-coalition-may-be-called-india-indian-national-developmental-inclusive-alliance/article67093768.ece
DSP2092 (talk) 13:43, 18 July 2023 (UTC)
Your 4th reference mentions both names. This is what I am saying. Shaan SenguptaTalk 14:23, 18 July 2023 (UTC)
@Shaan Sengupta - checkout this video - link DSP2092 (talk) 14:51, 18 July 2023 (UTC)
The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

Romanised Hindi as "native language"- is that even necessary?

Dear editors,

In this article, I found a romanised Hindi translation of the alliance name, but judging from the sources, it seems like they don't go by this translation in any manner. Therefore, I wanted to know if a foreign language translation on English Wikipedia makes sense. Block345 (talk) 14:19, 18 July 2023 (UTC)

Not any other foreign language but language of the native country. Makes sense quite a bit. Shaan SenguptaTalk 14:24, 18 July 2023 (UTC)

Map errors

Punjab and West Bengal should be coloure as INDIA. There may be others too, but these were major omissions. -- Kautilya3 (talk) 19:58, 19 July 2023 (UTC)

Add 'Legal Troubles'?

The I.N.D.I.A. Alliance has recently got into legal trouble after two police complaints were filed against it for allegedly violating the Emblems Act.[1] Moreover, a BJP minister has also claimed that the alliance should have been named BHARAT because India is a name given by the British colonial government [2] and even changed their Twitter bio to include Bharat instead of India.[3]

Think this deserves a mention? Piotr Heat (talk) 03:06, 21 July 2023 (UTC)

This thing can be added in Reactions and Responses or Controversies section in the article. But, I will wait for a consensus here. ❯❯❯ Chunky aka Al Kashmiri (✍️) 05:59, 21 July 2023 (UTC)

References

  1. ^ https://www.indiatvnews.com/news/india/police-complaint-registered-against-26-opposition-parties-for-improper-use-of-india-name-2023-07-19-881885
  2. ^ https://www.deccanherald.com/national/national-politics/british-named-our-country-india-bjp-for-bharat-says-assam-cm-in-dig-at-oppn-1238363.html
  3. ^ https://www.hindustantimes.com/india-news/himanta-biswa-sarma-deletes-india-from-twitter-bio-adds-bharat-amid-india-vs-nda-101689726080126.html

"Indian National Democratic Inclusive Alliance" listed at Redirects for discussion

The redirect Indian National Democratic Inclusive Alliance has been listed at redirects for discussion to determine whether its use and function meets the redirect guidelines. Readers of this page are welcome to comment on this redirect at Wikipedia:Redirects for discussion/Log/2023 July 23 § Indian National Democratic Inclusive Alliance until a consensus is reached. DSP2092talk 03:54, 23 July 2023 (UTC)

Regional Alliances

Some alliances like Samajwadi Alliance, Secular Progressive Alliance are regional alliance. they're mostly concentrated in Uttar Pradesh and Tamil Nadu. Some parties are common in both the alliances. Indian National Congress in common in both Secular Progressive Alliance and United Progressive Alliance. another national party Communist Party of India (Marxist) is common in Left Front, Samajwadi Alliance, Secular Progressive Alliance. Nationalist Congress Party is common in United Progressive Alliance and Samajwadi Alliance. So, it's not possible that they're formed by merger of this alliances. No please remove Samajwadi Alliance and Secular Progressive Alliance. George Simon Ohm (talk) 11:06, 7 September 2023 (UTC)information Note: Sock Strike

Semi-protected edit request on 7 September 2023

Change the name to INDI ALLIANCE. A stands for alliance. An acronym should also be delimited by DOT. Do you understand? Change it 2406:3003:2005:1476:4CCE:8218:BF2:C0BE (talk) 17:58, 7 September 2023 (UTC)

 Not done: It's not clear what changes you want to be made. Please reopen the request with specifics of exactly what you want to be changed (eg. the article name, specific sentences, etc.). Tollens (talk) 19:29, 7 September 2023 (UTC)
Can't be done. Please read Abbreviation discussion above. Shaan SenguptaTalk 07:01, 8 September 2023 (UTC)

Remove state-level maps and tallies

Is there any indication whatsover that this alliance has any other function than contesting the next Lok Sabha polls? Many of the participating parties are in different alliances at state level, and I don't think there is any indication of state level coordinating bodies being formed? Or any examples of joint legislative groups in Vidhan Sabhas? My understanding is that this alliance only exist at All India level, and thus the mapping of state governments and tally of number of MLAs is WP:OR and should be removed. -- Soman (talk) 14:00, 19 September 2023 (UTC)

left-right position

is the listing of left-right position really necessary or helpful? arguably CPI, CPI(M) and CPI(ML)L are further to the left than most other parties in the alliance, but most readers probably get the gist anyways? The notion that INC would be "Centre to centre-left", DMK "centre-left", AITC "Centre to centre-left", Shiv Sena (UBT) as "centre-right" etc. is quite disconnected. How do we justify for example saying RSP is "far-left", being left-ward of CPI? and so forth. -- Soman (talk) 14:18, 19 September 2023 (UTC)

thumb|Disputed logo thumb|Logo used for Mumbai Meet

The logo File:INDIA Alliance.jpg was uploaded on twitter in July 2023, bit as of earlier September Hindustan Times writes "But thorny issues loomed large over the 28-party bloc, which didn’t name a convener or unveil a logo — an issue that triggered some disquiet among key constituents ..." [1]. I would appear this is not the actual logo? -- Soman (talk) 15:44, 19 September 2023 (UTC)
Logo is removed as no sources are provided. Get a consensus and then add it. Otherwise there shall always be a dispute.— Preceding unsigned comment added by Naveen Sankar (talk • contribs)
The issue is - OneIndia article presents the "Mumbai Meet" logo, on August 29. Per OneIndia the logo will be adapted on the meeting Aug 30-Sep 1. But Hindustan Times writes, 1 September, that contrary to expectations no logo was adopted. So evidently the "Mumbai Meet" logo did not make the cut. --Soman (talk) 18:54, 19 September 2023 (UTC)
@Soman It is clear that there is no official logo of the alliance as all parties are yet to agree on it. So we should maybe add a notice regarding it. Shaan SenguptaTalk 01:38, 20 September 2023 (UTC)

{{Edit request}} Can some of the main points be added to this article?

The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section.

Boycott of Journalist

14 journalist boycott was announced on September 18, 2023, by the Indian National Developmental Inclusive Alliance (INDIA), a 28-party opposition bloc based on allegations that the journalists and channels are biased against the opposition and promote hate speech.[1]

The list of boycotted journalists includes[2]

The INDIA alliance accused the boycotted journalists of spreading hatred and misinformation, and of being mouthpieces of the ruling Bharatiya Janata Party (BJP). The alliance has also alleged that the journalists and channels have used their platforms to attack the opposition and its leaders.[3]

The 14 journalists boycotted by the INDIA Alliance have all denied the allegations against them. They have said that they are committed to fair and unbiased journalism, and that they will not be silenced by the boycott.[4]

  • Arnab Goswami said that the boycott was a "badge of honor" and that he would continue to speak truth to power.[5][6]
  • Navika Kumar said that the boycott was an "attempt to muzzle the voice of the people" and that she would not be intimidated.[7]
  • Sudhir Chaudhary said that the boycott was a "desperate attempt by the opposition to hide their failures" and that he would continue to expose their lies.[6]

Other boycotted journalists have also issued statements condemning the boycott and defending their journalistic integrity.[8]

Critism of boycott

The boycott has been met with criticism from some quarters, who argue that it is an attack on freedom of the press. However, the INDIA alliance has defended its decision, arguing that it is necessary to protect democracy from the harmful effects of biased and hateful media coverage.[9][10][11]

  • The News Broadcasters and Digital Association (NBDA), which represents news broadcasters in India, said that the boycott was a "gag on the press" and a "throwback to the Emergency era."[12][13]
  • The Committee to Protect Journalists (CPJ), an international press freedom watchdog, said that the boycott was a "dangerous precedent" and a "threat to freedom of the press."
  • Reporters Committee for Freedom of the Press, an organization that promotes and defends freedom of the press, said that the boycott was a "dangerous and undemocratic act" and called on the INDIA Alliance to immediately lift it.
  • Amnesty International, a human rights organization, said that the boycott was a "direct attack on freedom of expression" and called on the INDIA Alliance to "immediately lift the ban and allow all journalists to carry out their work without fear of reprisal."

The ruling Bharatiya Janata Party (BJP) has criticized the INDIA Alliance's boycott of 14 journalists. The BJP has accused the alliance of trying to silence the media and of being intolerant of dissent.[14]

  • JP Nadda, the BJP president, said that the boycott was a "dangerous precedent" and a "sign of the opposition's intolerance."[15]
  • Anil Baluni, the BJP's national media head, said that the boycott was "undemocratic" and "an attack on freedom of the press."[16]
  • Gaurav Bhatia, the BJP's deputy national spokesperson, said that the boycott was "hypocritical" and that the Congress party had a history of bullying the media.[17]

These organizations have argued that the boycott is a dangerous attack on freedom of the press and that it sets a dangerous precedent for other political parties to silence their critics.[18]

References

  1. ^ Joy, Shemin. "From Arnab Goswami to Sudhir Chaudhary: I.N.D.I.A bloc boycotts 14 TV anchors". Deccan Herald. Retrieved 2023-09-28.
  2. ^ Goreja, Rahul (2023-09-14). "Arnab Goswami, Sudhir Chaudhary, Aman Chopra: TV Anchors INDIA Bloc Will Boycott". TheQuint. Retrieved 2023-09-28.
  3. ^ "Opposition bloc INDIA announces boycott of shows of 14 TV anchors, BJP compares this with Emergency". The Times of India. 2023-09-14. ISSN 0971-8257. Retrieved 2023-09-28.
  4. ^ Sharma, Nootan Sharma, Unnati (2023-09-15). "'Being targeted, not boycotted' — what 14 blacklisted anchors have to say about INDIA's ban on them". ThePrint. Retrieved 2023-09-28.{{cite web}}: CS1 maint: multiple names: authors list (link)
  5. ^ Arnab's Debate: I.N.D.I Alliance Bans Journalists, Why Is Pseudo Lobby Silent?, retrieved 2023-09-28
  6. ^ a b Sharma, Nootan Sharma, Unnati (2023-09-15). "'Being targeted, not boycotted' — what 14 blacklisted anchors have to say about INDIA's ban on them". ThePrint. Retrieved 2023-09-28.{{cite web}}: CS1 maint: multiple names: authors list (link)
  7. ^ INDIA Alliance Media Boycott News Live | Navika Kumar's 'Fierce' Response | TV News Anchors, retrieved 2023-09-28
  8. ^ Goreja, Rahul (2023-09-14). "Arnab Goswami, Sudhir Chaudhary, Aman Chopra: TV Anchors INDIA Bloc Will Boycott". TheQuint. Retrieved 2023-09-28.
  9. ^ Banerjee, Ruben (2023-09-15). "INDIA alliance's boycott of select anchors dangerously dents press freedom more". thefederal.com. Retrieved 2023-09-28.
  10. ^ "INDIA Bloc's Anchor Boycott List Is a Reality Check, an Opportunity to Cleanse Our House". The Wire. Retrieved 2023-09-28.
  11. ^ "Opposition names, blacklists 14 TV anchors; gag on Press as in Emergency, say media panel, BJP". The Indian Express. 2023-09-15. Retrieved 2023-09-28.
  12. ^ "INDIA bloc's boycott of anchors imperils press freedom, goes against ethos of democracy: NBDA". The Times of India. 2023-09-14. ISSN 0971-8257. Retrieved 2023-09-28.
  13. ^ "INDIA bloc to boycott shows of 14 TV journalists, media panel condemns move". India Today. Retrieved 2023-09-28.
  14. ^ "Opposition bloc to boycott 14 journalists, row erupts". Hindustan Times. 2023-09-15. Retrieved 2023-09-28.
  15. ^ "INDIA alliance blacklists 14 TV anchors, BJP accuses of media intimidation". cnbctv18.com. 2023-09-15. Retrieved 2023-09-28.
  16. ^ "INDIA bloc announces boycott of 14 anchors". Ahmedabad Mirror. Retrieved 2023-09-28.
  17. ^ "'Emergency Mindset, Attack on Democracy': BJP, Media Bodies Slam INDIA Bloc's Boycott of 14 TV Anchors". News18. 2023-09-14. Retrieved 2023-09-28.
  18. ^ Sharma, Vikash. "OTV X poll survey: Over 56 pc people think I.N.D.I.A bloc's decision to boycott journalists against ethos of democracy". OTV X poll survey: Over 56 pc people think I.N.D.I.A bloc's decision to boycott journalists against ethos of democracy. Retrieved 2023-09-28.
103.251.217.210 (talk) 09:02, 28 September 2023 (UTC)
@Shaan Sengupta@Soman@CapnJackSp, Can points from these be added? 103.251.217.210 (talk) 12:31, 28 September 2023 (UTC)
The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

Abbreviation

Votes only in favour of I.N.D.I.A.

The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

Dear editors,

I hope this message finds you well. I wanted to address a recent change made by Shaan Sengupta regarding the abbreviation for "INDIA." While their intention was to avoid confusion between the country and alliance name, it is important to consider the broader consensus and guidelines regarding abbreviations.

According to Wikipedia's policies, it is generally recommended to follow the majority of reliable sources when determining the appropriate abbreviation for a term. In the case of "INDIA," the overwhelming majority of reliable sources use "INDIA" as the accepted abbreviation. It is worth noting that this abbreviation is not the title name and thus is unlikely to cause confusion among readers.

I propose that we engage in a discussion to reach a consensus on the preferred abbreviation for "INDIA" on Wikipedia. This will allow us to consider various perspectives and evaluate the merits of using INDIA versus I-N-D-I-A versus I.N.D.I.A. By engaging in a collaborative conversation, we can ensure that our decisions align with Wikipedia's guidelines and represent the consensus of the editing community.

I invite all interested editors to share their thoughts and opinions on this matter. Let us work together to establish a consensus that reflects the majority stance supported by reliable sources.

Thank you for your attention, and I look forward to a productive discussion.

Best regards, ❯❯❯ Chunky aka Al Kashmiri (✍️) 16:15, 18 July 2023 (UTC)

pinging @DSP2092, @Block345, @HapHaxion, @Arjun Madathiparambil Muraleedharan ❯❯❯ Chunky aka Al Kashmiri (✍️) 16:18, 18 July 2023 (UTC)

  • Support for I.N.D.I.A.: I would support this to be written as I.N.D.I.A. This best explains it. Since this has a full-form I don't think there shall be any issue with it. Shaan SenguptaTalk 16:20, 18 July 2023 (UTC)
  1. https://www.ndtv.com/india-news/i-n-d-i-a-indian-national-democratic-inclusive-alliance-2024-elections-confusion-over-2-different-full-forms-for-opposition-alliance-4219182
  2. https://www.indiatoday.in/elections/lok-sabha-polls-2024/video/opposition-alliance-named-india-indian-national-democratic-inclusive-alliance-2408275-2023-07-18
DSP2092 (talk) 16:36, 18 July 2023 (UTC)
NDTV is not a independent reliable source TheWikiholic (talk) 06:29, 19 July 2023 (UTC)
Comment: That dotted or dashed name have limited citations, the "INDIA" have more reliable citations.
1. Reuters
2. Al-Jazeera
3. BBC
4. The Economic Times
5. The Hindu
6. The Indian Express
Now here are some official sources where "INDIA" is used. Even logo of this alliance didn't used dot or dash.
Official Announcement by Congress who is the founder of this alliance
❯❯❯ Chunky aka Al Kashmiri (✍️) 18:17, 18 July 2023 (UTC)
TheChunky's list makes a good case for INDIA, and we can add Hindustan Times. Don't this group have an official website? Gråbergs Gråa Sång (talk) 15:28, 19 July 2023 (UTC)
The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

Logo of the alliance

No RS point to this as the logo of the alliance. Until then, I am removing the same before it snowballs. Thanks, User4edits (talk) User4edits (talk) 10:47, 14 January 2024 (UTC)

Suggestion: Reorganize "Organisational Structure" & "Member parties"

I propose the following columns from existing tables are rearranged as the following. The goal is to improve readability by making it more intuitive for readers, while retain essential information in all tables, allowing the readers to easily cross reference information. As this seems to be a page for overview as opposed to List of Indian National Developmental Inclusive Alliance members and List of Indian National Developmental Inclusive Alliance candidates for the 2024 Indian general election, I think we should remove things such as Party Logo, Flags and Symbols, and retain only seat information related to Lok Sabha.

Organisational Structure (Containing columns from Member parties & Organisational Structure)
Party Position Presence Leadership Committee Working Group
Party Colour Party Abbreviation Party Name Coordination and Election Strategy Campaign Media Social Media Research
from Member parties from Member parties from Member parties from Member parties from Member parties from Member parties from Organisational Structure from Organisational Structure from Organisational Structure from Organisational Structure from Organisational Structure
Member Parties (Containing columns from Member parties, Seat sharing summary from this list)
Party Position Presence Leadership 17th Lok Sabha 2024 General Election Changes
Party Colour Party Abbreviation Party Name 2019 General Election Results Seats before Election Contested Won Lost
from Member parties from Member parties from Member parties from Member parties from Member parties from Member parties from Member parties from Member parties from Seat sharing summary from Seat sharing summary from Seat sharing summary New

Wiki6995 (talk) 11:02, 14 January 2024 (UTC)

My take is that information about party should be there. Like Party name, symbol, flag, leader and its political position. That's what matters. What they had in previous or current Lok Sabha is present on its page. And this is needed when someone wants to go deep. Now people will say that even name symbol leader and other things tok are in its article so why have them. For this I would say bcoz that's common and most important for a person to know about a party. I have arranged things according to that only. Also seats contesting and seat won are there in other section of the article. It shouldn't be repeated everywhere. ShaanSenguptaTalk 11:51, 14 January 2024 (UTC)

too long to read and navigate comfortably

too many expaned tables, diificult to understand anything. User4edits (talk) 06:19, 8 February 2024 (UTC)

RLD joined INDIA Alliance

ISF of West Bengal and RLD joined INDIA alliance লাল সেলাম কমরেড (talk) 06:35, 5 March 2024 (UTC)

Hanuman's RLP লাল সেলাম কমরেড (talk) 06:35, 5 March 2024 (UTC)

The logo of NCP[SP] is rendered with 800px width

All the other logos and flags are of the usual thumbnail size. The image needs to be embedded at the same size as the other images. Amitkannan (talk) 18:08, 5 April 2024 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 5 April 2024

I would like to change the size of the image of the NCP[SP] logo in this table

File:TableofINDIApartieserror.png

Amitkannan (talk) 18:16, 5 April 2024 (UTC)

 Done I changed this to the same size as the other flags, thanks. Jamedeus (talk) 18:27, 5 April 2024 (UTC)
thanks Amitkannan (talk) 09:02, 6 April 2024 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 9 April 2024

Member parties All India Trinamool Congress 2409:40E0:1037:400A:30AA:15FF:FEF9:B71B (talk) 18:01, 9 April 2024 (UTC)

 Not done: it's not clear what changes you want to be made. Please mention the specific changes in a "change X to Y" format and provide a reliable source if appropriate. Shadow311 (talk) 19:06, 9 April 2024 (UTC)

Is TMC part of the alliance?

There is a debate and a edit war is raging on to decide wheather the Trinamool Congress party is still part of this alliance or not. Although it's chief Mamata Banerjee has declared to contest alone in election in her West Bengal state, the party is still not withdrawn formally from the alliance. Prospective members and editors please solve this deadlock on this matter through input of their valuable knowledge and starting a fruitful discussion with sources to back their claims. Thank you. Kalpesh Manna 2002 (talk) 06:15, 14 April 2024 (UTC)

I think this is the problem. There is no formal entry or exit in alliances like this. For example there was never a "formal" dissolving of Mahagathbandhan (Uttar Pradesh) but it doesn't exist anymore. The Trinamool Congress only really exists in the state of West Bengal and Mamata Banerjee is also the party leader, in fact a party supremo, so when she says "there is no India alliance", it indicates they are not a part of it. Beyond West Bengal, the party has some presence through Mukul Sangma in Meghalaya and even there they are separate. MrMkG (talk) 13:09, 14 April 2024 (UTC)
Support uncertain. It is a valid point that TMC has not formed alliance in Assam, West Bengal and Meghalaya states for this election with others. But it has ties with SP in Uttar Pradesh. As such I will suggest to keep the party in uncertain category for the time being. After the election when more information will became available we can decide wheather they are part of the alliance or not based on that. 2409:4060:2E07:AE4D:0:0:2E09:5607 (talk) 06:03, 15 April 2024 (UTC)
If the party is fighting alone it does not mean that they are not a part of alliance. They tied up in UP. They already announced that they are part of alliance but will fight alone in Bengal as there was a issue in seat sharing between INC and CPIM. ✠ ZenDragoX✠ (contact) 09:56, 16 April 2024 (UTC)
Exactly. Political alliances in India are quite messy anyway. There is no guarantee one's alliance partner is going to support them in every election everytime. But still they can maintain this fragile alliance together. Like Indian National Congress and Communist Party of India (Marxist) alliance in various states and union territories in India. Kalpesh Manna 2002 (talk) 16:00, 16 April 2024 (UTC)

Redundant Sections

I agree with User4edits here. There is zero indication that this alliance would have any other purpose that contesting Lok Sabha elections. There is no coordination in state-level politics, so there is no relevance of listing Chief Minister or MLAs by this alliance. Same applies for NDA and UPA as well. --Soman (talk) 12:46, 19 April 2024 (UTC)

Hindi name

The name in Hindi appears to be completely WP:OR. I find no indication that this Hindi name is used outside of Wikipedia, rather it appears that wordings like "INDIA Gathbandhan" are used in Hindi-language press. -- Soman (talk) 14:08, 20 April 2024 (UTC)

VBA in no more part of I.N.D.I.A

pinging DSP2092, User:HapHaxion, Shaan_Sengupta, Arjun_Madathiparambil_Muraleedharan

Vanchit Bahujan Aghadi maharashtra based party have declared they are not in alliance and decleared their candidates also. but its still there in I.N.D.I.A. please do the needful. Eaglespirit (talk) 11:03, 25 April 2024 (UTC)

Do you have any source? ✠ ZenDragoX✠ (contact) 13:45, 25 April 2024 (UTC)
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