Talk:Il bidone
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English name
[edit]The english translation was listed as The Can, but IMDB has it listed as The Swindle or The Swindlers, so I went ahead and changed it. Estrose 21:29, 23 January 2006 (UTC)
Requested move
[edit]- The following discussion is an archived discussion of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. Editors desiring to contest the closing decision should consider a move review. No further edits should be made to this section.
The result of the move request was: page moved. Andrewa (talk) 05:42, 11 February 2014 (UTC)
Il bidone → Il Bidone – This is the way the title seems to appear most in the United States, Great Britain, etc. with capital B. It's also the way most similar Wikipedia articles and the internet in general capitalizes foreign films that are more distributed in original foreign language. Hihono (talk) 22:35, 2 February 2014 (UTC)
- Support per nom and per usage in distribution. --BrownHairedGirl (talk) • (contribs) 20:42, 9 February 2014 (UTC)
- The above discussion is preserved as an archive of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on this talk page or in a move review. No further edits should be made to this section.
Requested move 15 January 2015
[edit]- The following is a closed discussion of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. Editors desiring to contest the closing decision should consider a move review. No further edits should be made to this section.
The result of the move request was: moved per guidelines. ErikHaugen (talk | contribs) 20:01, 24 January 2015 (UTC)
Il Bidone → Il bidone – Above move request ignores our MOS which states "Capitalization in foreign-language titles varies, even over time within the same language; generally, retain the style of the original", thus Italian capitalisations should apply. See [1]. Italian capitalisation also used in some English-language sources, see [2][3]. Rob Sinden (talk) 11:52, 15 January 2015 (UTC)
- Also, at the guideline WP:NCFILM, all examples of foreign language films are given using the relevant native capitalisations of the title. Previous nominator also makes a false claim that "It's also the way most similar Wikipedia articles [...] capitalizes foreign films", as is clear from a quick scan of Category:Italian drama films. --16:39, 15 January 2015 (UTC)
- Support shows that Bidone isn't a name. In ictu oculi (talk) 03:55, 17 January 2015 (UTC)
- The above discussion is preserved as an archive of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on this talk page or in a move review. No further edits should be made to this section.
Requested move 1 March 2025
[edit]
 | It has been proposed in this section that Il bidone be renamed and moved to Il Bidone. A bot will list this discussion on the requested moves current discussions subpage within an hour of this tag being placed. The discussion may be closed 7 days after being opened, if consensus has been reached (see the closing instructions). Please base arguments on article title policy, and keep discussion succinct and civil. Please use {{subst:requested move}}. Do not use {{requested move/dated}} directly. |
Il bidone → Il Bidone – for consistency with other article titles of Fellini movies like La Strada and I Vitelloni; La dolce vita is also about to be moved to La Dolce Vita. ~ IvanScrooge98 (talk) 16:03, 1 March 2025 (UTC)
- Weak support: All of the other Fellini films are (or soon will almost certainly be) using American-style title case on Wikipedia, as shown in Category:Films directed by Federico Fellini. The film itself displays its title as "Il Bidone" (see here and the full film on YouTube). It is also sometimes presented as "The Swindle" (e.g., by MoMA here, Britannica and IMDb), so The Swindle (1955 film) is another possibility. — BarrelProof (talk) 01:15, 2 March 2025 (UTC)
- The title as shown in the opening credits
of the film is all in capitals......so[see below] [is] not conclusive (at best). Oppose, per MOS:5 -Mushy Yank. 11:49, 2 March 2025 (UTC)- And I would strongly suggest a note to indicate that the capitalisation is not in the original in the pages whose titles are "adapted". -Mushy Yank. 11:52, 2 March 2025 (UTC)
- I support this. But we have to be consistent with the capitalization. See above. Those titles have been discussed very recently. ~ IvanScrooge98 (talk) 12:14, 2 March 2025 (UTC)
- Sure but to be consistent here means not to use it, in my opinion. La dolce vita is a possible exception while the other ones (including this film) are imv (still) questionable. See Cavarrone's comment at Talk:La dolce vita#Requested move 20 February 2025. The main point is that there are reliable English sources using the original form: https://ifi.ie/film/il-bidone/ https://bampfa.org/event/il-bidone for example, but rather than the Internet, books: Kezich, T. (2007). Federico Fellini: His Life and Work, Farrar, Straus and Giroux. does not capitalise; neither does A Companion to Federico Fellini. (2020). Wiley.) etc. -Mushy Yank. 13:14, 2 March 2025 (UTC)
- I support this. But we have to be consistent with the capitalization. See above. Those titles have been discussed very recently. ~ IvanScrooge98 (talk) 12:14, 2 March 2025 (UTC)
- More precisely, the title shown in the opening of the film uses small caps for all but one character. The 'B' is clearly much bigger than the other characters, indicating capitalization. — BarrelProof (talk) 18:11, 2 March 2025 (UTC)
- That is true. But then, if we follow this strictly, the title should be as follows: il Bidone. And we don't want that, do we? Again, I don't think it is conclusive. Other Italian films and Spanish films' opening credits often do the same although Italian and Spanish titles should not be capitalised. And French films (that should use capitals) sometimes do not use capitals in their title sequences. (See Les Diaboliques opening credits: les diaboliques, for example (not even the article is capitalised, just like here). So, I don't think it's conclusive (although for reasons different from the one I've mentioned (erroneously) above). Thanks anyway. -Mushy Yank. 18:25, 2 March 2025 (UTC)
- I never said we should just strictly imitate whatever the opening credits show, and I don't think anyone else said that either. The film's rendering is just one piece of evidence worth considering. By the way, La dolce vita been moved to La Dolce Vita as predicted. — BarrelProof (talk) 22:35, 8 March 2025 (UTC)
- See my comment there. -Mushy Yank. 23:17, 12 March 2025 (UTC)
- I never said we should just strictly imitate whatever the opening credits show, and I don't think anyone else said that either. The film's rendering is just one piece of evidence worth considering. By the way, La dolce vita been moved to La Dolce Vita as predicted. — BarrelProof (talk) 22:35, 8 March 2025 (UTC)
- That is true. But then, if we follow this strictly, the title should be as follows: il Bidone. And we don't want that, do we? Again, I don't think it is conclusive. Other Italian films and Spanish films' opening credits often do the same although Italian and Spanish titles should not be capitalised. And French films (that should use capitals) sometimes do not use capitals in their title sequences. (See Les Diaboliques opening credits: les diaboliques, for example (not even the article is capitalised, just like here). So, I don't think it's conclusive (although for reasons different from the one I've mentioned (erroneously) above). Thanks anyway. -Mushy Yank. 18:25, 2 March 2025 (UTC)
- And I would strongly suggest a note to indicate that the capitalisation is not in the original in the pages whose titles are "adapted". -Mushy Yank. 11:52, 2 March 2025 (UTC)