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Where's the flag of the French protectorate of Morocco?. Regards.--HCPUNXKID (talk) 11:34, 8 July 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Six-pointed star?

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The article mentions the 6-pointed star of David, however there is no 6-pointed star on the entire page. Only the green 5-pointed one, which is on the current flag, and the old 8-pointed one constructed from two squares. --87.123.244.53 (talk) 19:27, 7 May 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Someone removed the 1795 to about 1915 Moroccan flag without any comments or reasons: https://wiki.riteme.site/w/index.php?title=Flag_of_Morocco&diff=849862838&oldid=849673283

The flag with the six-pointed star should be added. Here's an additional source: https://books.google.de/books?id=a8tHDwAAQBAJ&pg=PA81&dq=morocco+flag+six-pointed+star&hl=en&sa=X&ved=0ahUKEwjpuMWrsq7mAhUPTsAKHWksDlQQ6AEIMTAB#v=onepage&q=morocco%20flag%20eight-pointed%20star&f=false (Ideophagous) 20:13, 11 December 2019 (UTC)[reply]

File:Flag of Morocco 1073 1147.svg Nominated for speedy Deletion

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File:Flag of Morocco (780 1070) (1258 1659).svg Nominated for speedy Deletion

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File:Flag of Morocco 1258 1659.svg Nominated for speedy Deletion

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File:Flag of Morocco 1147 1269.svg Nominated for speedy Deletion

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Current Version seems wrong

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Can the current flag be reverted to the old one? It seems wrong to make the current image appear as the regular flag of Morocco, while it isn't.

-On all the pictures and videos I have seen with Moroccan flags, I've never seen the pentagram that small ( http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/e/ef/King_Mohamed_VI_inaugurating.jpg / http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WpoHfvwOSDY ) -We now have 2 unbordered flags with rougly the same hue. ( http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/4/49/Flag_of_Morocco_unbordered.svg/1000px-Flag_of_Morocco_unbordered.svg.png / http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/2/2c/Flag_of_Morocco.svg ). It would seem more appropriate to have the current file to be a version, while reverting it to the past one. Dutchbag1402, 20:29, 31 May 2012 (GMT+1)

Star on Moroccan flag is too small

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Hi guys,

Proportionally the green pentagram star on the flag is way too small. It does not reflect reality. It should be at least 2.5 times bigger than in the current official version on Wikimedia, I propose something like this: https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Morocco_Murakuc.png

--Yezmarasen (talk) 10:41, 24 December 2015 (UTC)[reply]

Also, the lines on the star are too thick, being about 12½× the distance between two non-adjacent outer vertices, rather than the quoted 20×. JDAWiseman (talk) 23:23, 1 July 2020 (UTC)[reply]
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A Commons file used on this page or its Wikidata item has been nominated for deletion

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The following Wikimedia Commons file used on this page or its Wikidata item has been nominated for deletion:

Participate in the deletion discussion at the nomination page. —Community Tech bot (talk) 10:45, 3 April 2021 (UTC)[reply]

A Commons file used on this page or its Wikidata item has been nominated for deletion

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The following Wikimedia Commons file used on this page or its Wikidata item has been nominated for deletion:

Participate in the deletion discussion at the nomination page. —Community Tech bot (talk) 06:41, 27 August 2021 (UTC)[reply]

A Commons file used on this page or its Wikidata item has been nominated for deletion

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The following Wikimedia Commons file used on this page or its Wikidata item has been nominated for deletion:

Participate in the deletion discussion at the nomination page. —Community Tech bot (talk) 21:17, 30 November 2021 (UTC)[reply]

The Design of the Pentagram

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Does anyone know weather the pentagram is supposed to be solid of interlaced? Because most real versions the are flying seem to have a solid pentagram while the coat of arms and static depictions of the flag often show an interlaced pentagram. The official legislation from 2005 says it is supposed to be “made up of 5 continuous branches”, but that could validated either version. A discussion on FOTW seems to conclude that it should be an interlaced pentagram but that was from 2003 and might be outdated. Also, the law from 1915 says it’s supposed to be an interlaced pentagram and all the legislation since doesn’t seem to contradict nor confirm it.2601:647:4800:5700:D15B:8873:F4EE:2188 (talk) 01:07, 24 February 2023 (UTC)[reply]

@2601:647:4800:5700:D15B:8873:F4EE:2188: Having seen online and in person many Moroccan flags/clothing items with the Moroccan flag design using the left-handed interlaced pentagram (and owning one) as well as having seen your comment, I had changed the pic links to chiefly show the interlaced pentagram. @HapHaxion: has now changed the top pic back to the non-interlaced ("solid") pentagram. It appears we need to discuss this. – .Raven  .talk 20:06, 5 May 2023 (UTC)[reply]
Given the sources, It seems the interlaced design is more accurate. Great Mercian (talk) 07:46, 6 May 2023 (UTC)[reply]
Hi, I’m the person that started this conversation a few months ago. The problem with the interlaced pentagram on Wikipedia is that it doesn’t follow the official size for the star. 2601:647:4800:5700:CFA:9B4:EE86:1732 (talk) 19:29, 6 May 2023 (UTC)[reply]
There's a simple solution to that, however. Great Mercian (talk) 21:09, 6 May 2023 (UTC)[reply]
Yes, we need a new version of the flag made 2601:647:4800:5700:CFA:9B4:EE86:1732 (talk) 23:39, 6 May 2023 (UTC)[reply]
That would affect most of the Moroccan flags: Navy, Civil/Commercial ships, Armed Forces, and Royal, as well as the National Flag.
My SVG-code-fu is not strong, which is why I could only adapt and not create the coordinate-codes inside the files. If anyone else can make the star sizes correct, please do. (It might possibly be easier to increase the flag size?) One suggestion, though: I think the outer points of the original green pentagram should lie on that "invisible circle", with the gold fimbriation extending outside it, as that's the border separating green from red, not part of the pentagram itself. (For one thing, the gold isn't interlaced, doesn't break at crossings.) Just a thought. – .Raven  .talk 01:51, 7 May 2023 (UTC)[reply]
A request could be submitted to the Illustration workshop, and if needed there's probably some way to contact a Moroccan official or get the applicable legal texts to verify. HapHaxion (talk / contribs) 03:44, 7 May 2023 (UTC)[reply]
In fact I see that two FOTW users had each done that, contacting the Moroccan embassies in, respectively, Tokyo and London, who confirmed to them that the interlaced pentagram was correct. (The interlaced pentagram depicted prior to that discussion is mirror-reversed, i.e. right-handed.) But here FOTW is not an RS, nor is our own OS of calling an embassy and relaying what we're told (WP:YANARS), so we'd need the embassies to send verification to WP itself somehow. (If even that falls within WP:USEPRIMARY, since it wouldn't be a published work!) I don't know whether we need particular forms for this, or what's the WP address to have them mailed to. Wikipedia:Verification methods doesn't cover this scenario. Me so confused. – .Raven  .talk 05:41, 7 May 2023 (UTC)[reply]
"Published" sources, then:
  • Simmons, Walter (Aug 1, 2009). Morocco. Minneapolis: Bellwether Media. Cover illustration. ISBN 978-1-60014-731-9 – via Google Books. [Cover shows a left-handed interlaced pentagram.]
  • "Flags, Symbols, & Currencies of Morocco". World Atlas. The flag is red with an open green star, which has five points, at the center. The star has five continuous branches, each having a width of one-twentieth its length. [The illustration above the text shows a left-handed interlaced pentagram; notice its size in relation to the flag.]
  • Brahim (December 4, 2022). "Morocco flag history". Morocco Desert Tours, Marruecos Morocco. As a mark of its Islamic heritage, the Moroccan flag has an interlaced green pentagram, which represents the Seal of Solomon. [The illustration shows this; again notice the pentagram's size.]
And so forth? – .Raven  .talk 06:53, 7 May 2023 (UTC)[reply]
It is also important to note that per the law stated, the only colors present on the flag are red and green, meaning if the interlaced version is correct, it would likely be similar to the image posted above (in that case, I would support the change if agreed to). Other versions of the flag containing the emblem would also need to be adjusted (including the construction sheet), with all other measurements other than the interlacing remaining intact. HapHaxion (talk / contribs) 18:46, 7 May 2023 (UTC)[reply]
In SVG code, that could easily be accomplished by changing the fimbriation color from "x000000" to "none" or the same code as the background red – allowing future adaptations to gold, which deletion would deny – since the green pentagram by itself is already interlaced, just overlaid on the fimbriation color.
I should note that I've never seen the UNfimbriated version flown (or worn); possibly due to the edge-visibility effects of red directly against green; possibly because a red break in the straight segments would violate the "continuous branches" rule in a way that breaking by fimbriated overlay does not. Here's Morocco's ambassador to Germany, with a flag showing black fimbriation. Here is the Facebook page of the Moroccan Embassy in Australia; note black-fimbriated star in disc on upper left. Likewise on this button from the same embassy. Is that official enough? – .Raven  .talk 20:50, 7 May 2023 (UTC)[reply]
One more thought: if the pentagram is indeed "woven into the fabric of the flag" as specified, interlacing can be indicated by which direction is woven in the intersections – the overlapping branch will be continuous, the underlapping branch will not. A little bit of darkening as the underlapping branch approaches the break will add to the dimensionality. I seem to recall seeing that effect in photos where (perhaps due to distance) the fimbriation itself was not visible... but then that "darkening" may itself have been caused by a fimbriation overpass. I don't think that we can fairly indicate the direction of silk threads in a small graphic; nor that we should try. – .Raven  .talk 21:14, 7 May 2023 (UTC)[reply]
Oh, and likewise from the Moroccan Consulate in Boston. – .Raven  .talk 21:32, 7 May 2023 (UTC)[reply]
And Facebook page of the Moroccan Consulate General in New York (large pic, highly visible). – .Raven  .talk 22:03, 7 May 2023 (UTC)[reply]
Flip side: from the U.S. Embassy in Morocco, showing that the US also recognizes the interlaced-and-outlined design. – .Raven  .talk 22:23, 7 May 2023 (UTC)[reply]
Note a similar juxtaposition of US and Morocco flags from Morocco World News, again with an interlaced-and-outlined pentagram. – .Raven  .talk 22:35, 7 May 2023 (UTC)[reply]
@HapHaxion, Great Mercian, and 2601:647:4800:5700:CFA:9B4:EE86:1732:
And a flag from the Moroccan website Article27.ma, with an interlaced-and-outlined pentagram. Again, note its relative size. Enough yet to reinstate the interlaced/outlined version on our page? At least pending any resizes? I think so. Do you want it footnoted on that page? – .Raven  .talk 22:58, 7 May 2023 (UTC)[reply]

@.Raven: that was a long read. I'm not entirely sure what side you're on in terms of this issue (looking back at this, I'm not sure why I said side. Maybe I'm seeing this in a binary sense of a debate.), you provided an endless array of sources for both sides which is good, but also utterly confusing and not entirely helpful for a debate like this in my opinion. I am so sorry if that sounded rude. I think I'd probably understand your input better if I knew which side you're coming from. Many thanks, Great Mercian (talk) 21:28, 7 May 2023 (UTC)[reply]

I'm not sure which "both sides" you mean. That the pentagram is interlaced is one point; that it is fimbriated (outlined) in black for the national flag or gold for the royal flag is another. Those pictures from embassies and consulates show both interlacing AND fimbriation – in fact, show the interlacing BY the fimbriation overpass, quite possibly due to the "continuous branches" rule not allowing a "broken by red" depiction. – .Raven  .talk 21:37, 7 May 2023 (UTC)[reply]
I have no idea where the discussion stands now, but I have found other sources where the width of the emblem is not increased, per the CIA and a recent covering of Portugal-Morocco signing with this video at the 0:27 mark, where it's clear that there is no border around the symbol. Callmemirela 🍁 02:53, 15 May 2023 (UTC)[reply]
Thank you for doing this research!
The CIA page shows the pentagram non-interlaced (solid), while the Moroccan embassies/consulates and even the US Embassy in Morocco show it interlaced. Which should we believe? The CIA page also says the flag dates to 1912; our cited source says the flag dates to 1915. (But you can see where the confusion may have originated: "... the sultan signed the Treaty of Fez in 1912, under which the French protectorate officially settled in the kingdom. Three years later, Resident General Lyautey had Sultan Moulay Youssef sign a dahir dated November 17, 1915, according to which the flag of the kingdom would be red, adorned with a green star." [emphasis added]) Which should we believe?
The no-border flag video is set in Lisbon, Portugal, three days ago, and it's not clear who provided the flag or its source documentation: governmental, non-governmental, eager volunteer? For all I know, it was based on the previous version of this page — which wouldn't be the first time an off-WP source trustingly borrowed from Wikipedia. That's why I leaned so heavily on Moroccan embassy/consulate flag photos and pages. – .Raven  .talk 03:36, 15 May 2023 (UTC)[reply]
That's actually a very good point. I am unsure if this is the country's government website? Callmemirela 🍁 03:42, 15 May 2023 (UTC)[reply]
Yes. Interesting that the big picture doesn't show interlacing, while the design on the banner at the top (see upper-left corner) does show interlacing. Both ways on the same page! – .Raven  .talk 04:16, 15 May 2023 (UTC)[reply]
I've emailed them to ask which is correct, and suggested they make the designs consistent to reduce confusion on that point. – .Raven  .talk 04:21, 15 May 2023 (UTC)[reply]
By them you mean? Callmemirela 🍁 18:16, 15 May 2023 (UTC)[reply]
maroc.ma has a "Contact Us" page, which I used to send a message. (I called that an "email" because it asked my email address for a reply... which I have not yet received, BTW; I assume such a site is busy.) – .Raven  .talk 01:47, 16 May 2023 (UTC)[reply]
It seems the image on maroc.ma was taken off Wikipedia. The General Secretariat of the Government's website showcases it as interlaced. The 2020 Tokyo Olympics flag manual shows a non-interlaced flag, while it's slightly interlaced in the 2012 London Olympics flag manual. The logo for Morocco's Olympic committee also has an interlaced flag. This is getting confusing very fast, you could request a consulate to provide you with a copy of the flag and upload it w/ VRT -- not sure how that would work though.
p.s. the Minister of Industry, Ryad Mezzour, is shown with a different flag showing the coat of arms on a red background rather than a pentagram. Perhaps this is a flag for the government? NAADAAN (talk) 12:16, 20 May 2023 (UTC)[reply]
> "It seems the image on maroc.ma was taken off Wikipedia." –
Ouch. This is why we have to get things right; our errors get repeated in the real world, and eventually get cited from there as evidence. Meanwhile, the Permanent Mission of Kingdom of Morocco to the United Nations Office and other international organizations in Geneva shows an interlaced pentagram on the flag. – .Raven  .talk 08:12, 21 May 2023 (UTC)[reply]
based on the relevant law, the star is described as "ouverte" (open), although I'm not sure if that means it's interlaced or that the inside of the star is not fully filled in with the green color. HapHaxion (talk / contribs) 16:41, 26 May 2023 (UTC)[reply]
French « ouverte » equates to English heraldry's "voided", or as you put it, "not filled in" — which by itself is unfortunately vague enough to also cover a hollow mullet (star) without the lines crossing that open space... thus the accompanying insistence on "continuous branches" to make that distinction. Why not just use the clear term "pentagram"? French renders that as "pentacle", which to us is a pentagram inside a circle, and to them is « Étoile à cinq branches (en occultisme) ». Oh dear. I suspect devout Muslim Moroccans would not enjoy that last association for their flag and seal, thus the avoidance of that word. – .Raven  .talk 00:12, 27 May 2023 (UTC)[reply]
Has there been any success in contacting a representative of the Moroccan government in any capacity? HapHaxion (talk / contribs) 14:01, 2 June 2023 (UTC)[reply]
No. No email reply, and (as you can see) no change to the file. – .Raven  .talk 09:36, 3 June 2023 (UTC)[reply]
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