Talk:Camp Hero State Park

Fort Drum
Fort Drum
Watertown, New York
	Sniper training at Fort Drum
Type	Army post
Site information
Controlled by	U.S. Army
Site history
Built	1908
In use	1908-present
Garrison information
Garrison	10th Mountain Division

Van Cortlandt Park
Van Cortlandt Park
	Van Cortlandt Mansion, the oldest house in the Bronx
Type	Municipal
Location	The Bronx, New York City, NY, USA
Coordinates	40°53′52″N 70°53′02″W / 40.89778°N 70.88389°W
Area	1,146 acres (4.6 km²),
Created	1888
Operated by	New York City Department of Parks and Recreation

New York (state): Long Island

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Military history: Aviation / North America / United States

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Montauk Air Force Station

Montauk Air Force Station was a SAGE radar site, many of which have WikiPedia pages (see Category:SAGE sites). Creating a seperate page for just this topic seems appropriate. Please comment or provide other guidance. Conrad T. Pino 04:08, 5 August 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Park Infobox

Yes, none of the recent infobox templates in this article have been appropriate. How about this one? Jim.henderson 01:08, 2 September 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Consistent with my "Article focus problem" proposal (see below), I support this proposal. Conrad T. Pino 03:21, 2 September 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Thank you, but having seen your Mill Valley AFB article, I'm inclined to abandon my own proposal and make this article strictly a military one with a military name and the military structure infobox template. It already has only a section at the end about post military use, and no great reason to add to it. Incidentally, I am familiar with both places, having kin a few miles from each, though I haven't been in California since the MV base was demilitarized, though I climbed cliffs and stared at the bunkers in Camp Hero last summer. Much more interesting to do, than write about. Jim.henderson 03:36, 2 September 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Consider the risk that capturing the military history won't be completed as locating sources is difficult and interest often wanes. I believe future relevancy lies with it's new use. Before leaving please document what you learned during your site visits on the talk page and I'll help integrate that into the article. Conrad T. Pino 17:48, 2 September 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Article focus problem

IMO this article has a focus problem:

content is mostly "Montauk Air Force Station" history sufficient to warrant an article
however current usage as "Camp Hero State Park" lacks content to stand alone

which begs the question of what to do until seperate articles are justified. My interest is military history and Mill Valley Air Force Station shows the possiblity for seperate "Montauk Air Force Station" article. I propose the following:

This article shall focus on the site's current "Camp Hero State Park" use. Please contribute relevant content.
The military history content shall be organized toward a split into a seperate "Montauk Air Force Station" article.

I welcome other proposals. Conrad T. Pino 03:19, 2 September 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Oh, I'm not leaving this bone for some time yet. When I bite off more Wikibusiness than I can chew, which is usually, I just visit each article less frequently for another chomp. Lately, for no fault of my own, I have had a life and been neglecting my hobbies. This will go away and in the autumn there will be more time for historical and geographical fun, umm, I mean, business.

Me, I still think this fort infobox more applicable than the park one but won't insert it in the article myself until there's either agreement or more time for me to fuss with it. All right, as for my visit a year ago or possibly two years, the single emplacements for the 16" guns were a couple hundred yards apart, each maybe a quarter mile from the beach and perhaps a mile south of the modern Montauk Highway. Inside the grounds, below the bunkers, is the 19th or early 20th century Montauk Highway, some four or five yards wide, apparently last paved more than half a century ago. Many internal military roads are in better condition and several are wide enough for two lanes.

The beach is rocky and narrow; I was there for a few hours and the tide didn't change that fact. It is bordered by cliffs some twenty yards high and the girl team beat us on the downward race, our team being burdened by one member too young and wise and another too old and foolish for such activities. I saw pillboxes elsewhere (but not near the bluffs) suitable for heavy machineguns, and concrete foundations that could have held AA machineguns, but no accomodations for light or heavy artillery other than the big ones for the 16" guns. I did see a map indicating other "batteries" but sometimes that term represents an orginization rather than a bunch of guns.

Placards explained that the big guns were originally intended for battleships that were never completed due to an arms limitation agreement, and after Pearl Harbor they were put here for coastal defense. There was a photo of a similar installation in Virginia but merely sodded rather than overgrown with trees decades old. Presumably, such nudity was the wartime condition for Montauk as well. The question of why the guns weren't put in Fort Hancock or other place more obviously relevant, was not mentioned.

So, that's all I remember, this time around. I might visit the park again before autumn frosts arrive. The radar tower was as described. Except, being in Montauk it can't be a very good landmark for Long Island Sound. For Peconic Bay and the open ocean, yes. Jim.henderson 22:02, 5 September 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Acreage

I've changed the acreage from the previously reported 415 acres to 754 acres. The old acreage figure can be sourced to the park's official webpage, however, the updated figure comes from a NYS statistical manual (p. 671, p. 9 of the .pdf) published by the Rockefeller Institute of Government, which I have used to supply acreage and basic location information for nearly all New York state parks articles. I am using it here for consistency with other articles. It has also been my observation that acreages (when reported) on NYSP webpages do not appear to be pulling from a consistent source, or are inconsistently rounded, etc. Typically the difference in reported acreages between sources is small, however as this one is quite large I am writing this note to make anyone curious aware of the discrepancy. (My theory is that the smaller figure does not account for underwater acreage, or does not include areas not accessible to the public, but that's just a guess.) Antepenultimate (talk) 00:32, 10 April 2016 (UTC)[reply]