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Untitled

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I thought this deserved a bit of tidying up so...I did so. C i d 12:46, 21 December 2005 (UTC)[reply]

Current Don?

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Is there any factual evidence suggesting that "Michael Mancuso" is the current Don? What is this statement based on?--203.173.176.212 05:52, 23 December 2005 (UTC)[reply]

Good point - a news report naming the current boss of the Gamino family appeared three days after you questioned that point so I have posted that alongside what had best be termed an allegation. If further news arises I shall edit again. C i d 13:15, 28 December 2005 (UTC)[reply]

I read in the daily news today the new Don is a Sicilian immigrant named Joe Montagno, from Castellamere67.87.66.254 02:04, 20 November 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Huge clean-up needed

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This article has been destroyed in terms of style and grammar. The spacing is all wrong with missing spaces after commas and periods, there are spelling mistakes, and the writer has decided to link every name on the page instead of just the first instance of it as is the norm. I am in two minds as to whether to revert the recent edits as some of the new information is interesting enough, but has taken on a problematical POV slant. If the writer, Little Joe Shots, could please contact me on my talk page with regards to how best to fix this I would be very grateful - if I don't here from the writer I will set about fixing it in a few days. C i d (Talk) 11:30, 25 October 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Verify: Narcotics

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The article says: "The main topic of discussion (at the Hotel des Palmes meeting in 1957) between the Bosses was to determine whether or not the North American and Italian Families would begin joint narcotics operations. This was the beginning of the one the biggest heroin and cocaine manufacturing and distribution networks ever set up."

Narcotics, or to be more precise, heroin was smuggled to the US from Sicily (and Marseilles) before the talks of Bonanno and Sicilian mafiosi. It is incorrect to say "whether or not to begin joint narcotics operations" because there were already several joint heroin trafficking operations. Maybe some restructuring has been discussed - but we don't know. Moreover, heroin trafficking was not organised top down by any Mafia Commission, but rather bottom up by traffickers in Mafia families who relied on protection from the family. The article relies too much on the book Octopus by Claire Sterling, which is considered not very reliable by many academics. I quote:

(...) the works of the late Claire Sterling. She achieved a degree of fame by peddling nonsense about a global cartel of terrorist groups taking their marching orders from Moscow (1981), and as perestroika killed the market for anti-Communist hyperbole she deftly switched to portraying the Sicilian Mafia as the new alien threat to Judeo-Christian Civilization (1990). Then, with the fall of Communism and the disintegration of the Soviet Union, the new theme became the rise of a Russian Mafia made up of black-marketeers, ex-KGB agents and old apparachniks in league with Colombian "cartels" and Mafia families to carve up the whole world into criminal spheres of influence (1994). [1] Mafia Expert 16:00, 18 October 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Furthermore, the article claims that "This was the beginning of the one the biggest heroin manufacturing and distribution networks ever set up", and "Joseph Bonanno was the father of a future narcotics epidemic that still exists today due to his efforts in Palermo, Sicily and Montreal, Canada" without any references. Seems to me this is the personal opinion of one of the writers and does not fit the verifiability standards WP:VERIFY. Mafia Expert 12:29, 27 October 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Disputed

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This article is incomprehensible. Too many unreliable details. It is very personal interpretation by one contributor who is claiming facts from sources that are nowhere to be found in those sources. I changed it from "verify" to "disputed". If reliable references are not added I recommend this article to be reverted to the version before it has been trashed. -Mafia Expert 17:51, 1 November 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Just to give an example: the revelations of Tommaso Buscetta to judge Giovanni Falcone are given as a reference for the so-called 1957 Palermo summit between the US and Sicilian Mafia to set up one of "the biggest heroin and cocaine manufacturing and distribution networks ever." According to Buscetta the so-called "summit" never took place !!! -- Mafia Expert 13:09, 2 November 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Reverted to previous version

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Folowing a number of messages left for the individual who had been repeatedly editing this page in a fashion incompatible with Wikipedia standards - messages that have not been responded to - I have reverted this to a previous version to remove a massive number of dubious, unverified and disputed comments. I have been in contact with Mafia Expert about this and it's been agreed that this is the way to go given that Little Joe Shots has not replied. If this is disputed then I will move to take a vote on this discussion page about whether we stay with the version I have reverted it to, or allow Little Joe Shots' edits to stand. C i d (Talk) 12:08, 13 November 2006 (UTC)[reply]

I agree with reverting it to the previous version. The article, as edited by Little Joe Shots, had become incomprehensible and was loaded with too much names and unreferenced details. -- Mafia Expert 10:41, 15 November 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Removals

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I have removed material from this article that does not comply with our policy on the biographies of living persons. Biographical material must always be referenced from reliable sources, especially negative material. Negative material that does not comply with that must be immediately removed. Note that the removal does not imply that the information is either true or false.

Please do not reinsert this material unless you can provide reliable citations, and can ensure it is written in a neutral tone. Please review the relevant policies before editing in this regard. Editors should note that failure to follow this policy may result in the removal of editing privileges.--Docg 14:32, 26 March 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Possibly unencylopedic language

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Is the line "If they had expected Bonanno to take this lying down, they were wrong." appropriate? It seems like an overly dramatic choice of words for an encyclopedia article to me. 67.204.24.190 (talk) 08:28, 15 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]


I agree "If they had expected Bonanno to take this lying down, they were wrong." sounds just plain wrong, it may be something like "Bonanno did not take this lying down." if you want to keep the gist of it but it could be removed or changed completely, as long as it convey the sense that he didn't agree and actively opposed his exclusion 64.235.219.50 (talk) 10:01, 2 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Peter Panza? Made up mobsters I think. Bill Bonanno was married to Rosalie Profaci, according to his book. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 75.82.248.7 (talk) 17:56, 19 December 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Unsufficient citations

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This article contains a huge amount of factual statements but only 8 footnotes. There is really no way of verifying most of what is stated in the article.Mtsmallwood (talk) 11:59, 29 June 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Nonsense

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This article id full of blatant nonsense. It is poorly written and poorly sourced. It needs to be checked on deliberate vandalism and needs to referenced properly. Peter Panza? Does not exist. - DonCalo (talk) 17:04, 30 March 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Says you.

File:Vincent Basciano.jpg Nominated for speedy Deletion

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File:Joe Bonanno cropped.jpg Nominated for speedy Deletion

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deletion of cited text

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Nothing changes the fact that you are deleting cited text that is located nowhere else in WP. The fact that you went about doing this to several articles is no excuse for continuing it. Hmains (talk) 18:52, 30 December 2017 (UTC)[reply]

I agree; there is no reason to delete massive amounts of fully-cited text from any article without a discussion and consensus. Arbitrary deletion is not valid.
@User:ThePlane11, feel free to begin a discussion of the reasons you want to delete such a large amount of text here. Peter K Burian (talk) 21:18, 30 December 2017 (UTC)[reply]
@User:Vaselineeeeeeee ... what are your thoughts on this? (I ask because you have done a great deal of work on other Crime Family articles, so you are an excellent resource here too.) Peter K Burian (talk) 21:22, 30 December 2017 (UTC)[reply]

I saw the template on another crime family page and decided to add it to the rest. Some of the sources do not exist and the informants/witnesses section has not been updated with past and present names. ThePlane11 (talk) 21:28, 30 December 2017 (UTC)[reply]

So, the article needs a bit of work, a few updates and better citations. If we deleted huge chunks of every article that needed a bit of work, then massive amounts of useful info would disappear from WP. As Users (editors), we fix problems as necessary to improve articles. Peter K Burian (talk) 22:14, 30 December 2017 (UTC)[reply]
Yes, I don't agree with the mass removal of cited text, especially because it provides good information that the table did not. Also, from what I saw, the new informant additions were not well cited. If cited, I don't see why you couldn't just add their name with a little blurb to the rest of the list. Vaselineeeeeeee★★★ 22:08, 30 December 2017 (UTC)[reply]
OK,thanks User:Vaselineeeeeeee. I won't have time until Tuesday to work on this article. Perhaps Hmains can do so earlier. Of course, ThePlane11 could give us a list of problems; that would certainly make it quicker to do the fixes. Cheers! Peter K Burian (talk) 22:14, 30 December 2017 (UTC)[reply]

The Genovese crime family page originally had the table so I thought I would follow suit. I can work on the problems. Recently I've been updating the hierarchy, capos and current status of crime families. All of the pages need a little freshen up. Some pages had information down that was relevant 8-10 years ago such as Frank Cali being listed as a capo while he was promoted to boss almost 3 years ago. I will be working on the pages and appreciate any help given ThePlane11 (talk) 15:40, 31 December 2017 (UTC)[reply]

If you wanted, you could probably just add the table on top as a summary of the written stuff below. Since the written text is already there, there's no need to remove. Vaselineeeeeeee★★★ 16:19, 31 December 2017 (UTC)[reply]
I agree with ThePlane11 the Govt Informant section needs to be cleaned up. Most of the names on the list have there own WP articles. For the informants with no WP articles keep the references and add the information to the table detailing there involvement in the crime family and information to there turning informants. Vic49 (talk) 16:32, 31 December 2017 (UTC)[reply]

Obviously you have difficulty understanding. The Genovese crime family, which I've now said twice, had the template for a while. The Chicago Outfit has had the table for a while aswell. When I say a while I mean years. From my view it looks disorganized. If some are going to have text then they all should. ThePlane11 (talk) 16:23, 1 January 2018 (UTC)[reply]

and he accused me of "vandalism" hahaha. I'm going do to some work on this page ThePlane11 (talk) 04:37, 10 January 2018 (UTC)[reply]

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"Night of the Sicilian Vespers"

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I took out the reference to the so-called "Night of the Sicilian Vespers", which has been fairly thoroughly debunked. See https://wiki.riteme.site/wiki/Mustache_Pete.Zeno Cosini~enwiki (talk) 22:44, 10 November 2021 (UTC)[reply]

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A Commons file used on this page or its Wikidata item has been nominated for deletion

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Wiki Education assignment: Crime and Violence

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This article was the subject of a Wiki Education Foundation-supported course assignment, between 28 August 2023 and 15 December 2023. Further details are available on the course page. Student editor(s): 34adel (article contribs). Peer reviewers: P!neapp13.

— Assignment last updated by Ruby2017 (talk) 15:27, 26 November 2023 (UTC)[reply]

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