Talk:Andre Geim

Oposses Boycott on Israel

Important to add - this honest man opposes the shameful boycott on Israel.

http://www.worldjewishcongress.org/en/news/9657 http://www.antisemitism.org.il/eng/struggle/49378/DozensofNobelPrizelaureatescondemnboycottcampaignagainstIsrael — Preceding unsigned comment added by 132.66.181.115 (talk) 05:38, 9 November 2010 (UTC)

Home Page of Dr. Andre Geim in University of Manchester: Andre Geim is Jewish

another scam/spam webpage is www.andregeim.com. Someone obviously bought the address and now makes advertisements using Geim as bait. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Ordeal66 (talk • contribs) 21:52, 29 March 2011 (UTC)

In official Home-Page of Dr. Andre Geim in University of Manchester: http://www.condmat.physics.manchester.ac.uk/people/academic/geim/, there are only 3 standard references regarding his personal life: 1. http://sciencewatch.com/inter/aut/2008/08-aug/08augSWGeim/

2. http://www.scientific-computing.com/features/feature.php?feature_id=1

3. http://www.condmat.physics.manchester.ac.uk/images/people/geim/physworld.jpg

In 2nd reference he stated that he is Jewish. —Preceding unsigned comment added by OceanPeal (talk • contribs) 15:46, 29 November 2010 (UTC) Redacting comment by one of the many banned sockpuppets of Russian.science. betsythedevine (talk) 01:40, 1 December 2010 (UTC)

No, he didn't. We've seen that source already, it narrates he was discriminated against because the authorities in Russia regarded him as Jewish. I hardly think we can follow a report like that and say "hell, well if the Russians, who discriminated against him, said that, he must be Jewish"! We've recorded he suffered anti-Semitic prejudice, and that's all the source claims.--Scott Mac 15:52, 29 November 2010 (UTC)

"As he was Jewish he was regarded by many as someone who would simply leave the country after he received his education." Bus stop (talk) 17:48, 29 November 2010 (UTC)

Perhaps, but it's better not to assert anything when we have the subject's own words to report. Passing mention in a bio in some scientific magazine isn't really a great authority. It is much safer to use the subject's own self-description, which is what we are currently doing.--Scott Mac 18:02, 29 November 2010 (UTC)

Agree w/Bus Stop. We have RS support for the proposition. That is what wikipedia is built on. It's much safer to stick with the core wikipedia RS proposition.--Epeefleche (talk) 18:24, 29 November 2010 (UTC)

This is a biography of a living person. Here, self-identification is required. Yworo (talk) 18:30, 29 November 2010 (UTC)

We've had that source for some time. It was discussed above and consensus reached. Basically, that one source describes someone as something is not indicative of much, and the subject's self-description carries more weight. But as I say, this has already been discussed at length.--Scott Mac 18:31, 29 November 2010 (UTC)

There is no self-identification that conflicts with the RS-supported statements. If an RS reports that x is a rapist, that y had sex with a goat, or that z has a venereal disease, that is reportable. So, it is in accord with the core wikipedia approach of relying on RSs to rely on them here. Judaism is not only a religion, but Jews are an ethnicity and a nation, and it seems unlikely that we would be more concerned with reflecting their religion than their criminal or other behavior -- such as conditions that are at the core of what led to the laws of libel and slander.--Epeefleche (talk) 18:38, 29 November 2010 (UTC)

This source confirms what other sources are saying. No source is at odds with any other source. If we had a source for instance saying that he converted to another religion or that he disavowed Jewish identity we would be expected to exercise caution in using this source. But several sources are pointing to Jewish identity for Geim. I don't think we could be faulted for relying on this source. Scientific Computing World seems like a reliable source to me. I don't think we need a quote from him saying that he is Jewish. Bus stop (talk) 18:44, 29 November 2010 (UTC)

You two both need to give it up. The term "Jewish" is ambiguous and can refer to religion. BLP instructs us to err on the side of caution. Therefore we assume that people will read it as religion. Geim's exact statement is included in the article and that is all that is going to be included. Yworo (talk) 18:46, 29 November 2010 (UTC)

Actually, you need to stop telling people engaged in pointing to legitimate facts and principles to give it up. BLP concerns obviously are greater as to the issues I raised in my above post. Your "give it up" comment, intellectually incisive as it was, notwithstanding. This isn't a case of BLP concern at the level of the examples given, and even in those examples we would rely on RSs. Plus -- note, this is not a category discussion, but an article discussion. As such, the reader has the benefit of reading the ref. As to "consensus", consensus was earlier reached on this page to reflect that he is Jewish. As the RSs reflect. Why anyone should "give it up" for Yworo's view, and the view of a sysop who flips back and forth between acting sysop and acting editor on the same article in violation of wp:admin, is not clear to some of us.--Epeefleche (talk) 18:53, 29 November 2010 (UTC)

Yes, it's a BLP issue. Geim makes it clear in his statement that he does not identify as Jewish, that he does not want to be identified as Jewish, and that he has suffered harm from being misidentified as Jewish. That clearly invokes the BLP maxim "Do no harm". I don't know what your motivations are, but Wikipedia is not "Jew Watch". Continue in this vein and I will take further action to have your behaviour over the issue examined and evaluated. Yworo (talk) 18:57, 29 November 2010 (UTC)

Since when was "Scientific Computing World" an authoritative source on who is a Jew anyway? I doubt I could get away with using the "Jerusalem Post" editorial as a source for an article on particle physics. That one journalist describes someone as Jewish is simply one person's estimation. It does not provide evidence that he considers himself, or is widely considered to be, or is, Jewish. But, as I say, we've already discussed this. Stop flogging dead horses.--Scott Mac 19:06, 29 November 2010 (UTC)

When some names are transcribed from the Cyrillic alphabet into the Latin alphabet, we often find that some do it with an H, some with a G. Russian does not have an H. It depends on the preference of the bearer when his/her name is first transcribed and especially the country because its pronunciation rules are usually followed. Geim is not a particularly German name and if transcribed as Heim or Haim it would appear Jewish. Bayer is more German. The use of the patronym suggests that there was identification with Russian - but what does it matter? 2001:8003:A0D2:A100:3881:5A4:C6EF:60CD (talk) 04:34, 6 April 2017 (UTC)

Scott, would you be willing to join in opening a user conduct RfC against these two over the issue. This is not the only talk page they are disrupting in this manner. Yworo (talk) 19:08, 29 November 2010 (UTC)

Hm, I suspect it is just a case of letting them be. Consensus on the article has been reached, if some folk want to keep flogging dead horse on the talk page, let them. As long as the article isn't disrupted there no real problem.--Scott Mac 20:04, 29 November 2010 (UTC)

I agree with Yworo and Scott. It strikes me that all Jews, and areligious grandchildren of Jews, can apply for Israeli citizenship. If Geim or any of his grandparents were Jewish, he would have had an easy route out of Russia, but he took a more difficult path instead. From his citizenship and residency history, it looks as though he was not eligible for Israeli nationality and had to find another way out of Russia. DrKiernan (talk) 19:10, 29 November 2010 (UTC)

• Who said he wanted to emigrate to Israel? And of course, that's a completely OR comment, replete with assumptions that are questionable -- we don't weigh OR/synth over RSs.--Epeefleche (talk) 20:00, 29 November 2010 (UTC)

• Well, he's the most reliable source available for this, and he says his great-grandmother was Jewish and that his name sounds Jewish. You would only say that if you were a Gentile. Jews would just say "I'm Jewish". Also, as he refers to Jews in the Globe interview as "you", that is fairly indicative that he does not think of Jews as "us". DrKiernan (talk) 09:51, 30 November 2010 (UTC)

Reference: http://www.scientific-computing.com/features/feature.php?feature_id=1, is a double standard source, because it’s been chosen and put in official home-page of Dr. Geim by himself. It is quite enough for proving Jewishness of Dr. Geim. --OceanPeal (talk) 14:59, 30 November 2010 (UTC)

We have additionally this in the Jewish Daily Forward:

"As of press time, Russian Jew Andre Geim shared this year’s Nobel Prize in physics with Konstantin Novoselov." Bus stop (talk) 15:40, 30 November 2010 (UTC)

This is getting tedious, Bus stop. I must note that you were previously banned for this sort of obsession, that prior to being banned, you were under a restriction not allowing you to edit anything having to do with Jewish ethnicity, and that part of the conditions allowing you to come back to Wikipedia were that you "may not edit any articles having to do with cultural or religious identity of individuals, living or dead. This should be construed broadly. Should you try to WP:GAME the edges of this ban, you will be blocked again." I've reviewed the actual discussions on WP:AN, and it is clear that those proposing these restrictions intended them to be permanent. There may have been some confusion conflating this restriction with the general probation which lasted only six months. But you are clearly returning to the previous behavior which got you banned and I will be taking this to WP:AN to have your ban reinstated. Yworo (talk) 16:18, 30 November 2010 (UTC)

I agree with Bus and Ocean.--Epeefleche (talk) 16:31, 30 November 2010 (UTC)

Yworo—you posted this here which I guess is your prerogative. But this is the Andre Geim Talk page. It is not a place to discuss me, is it? Bus stop (talk) 17:42, 30 November 2010 (UTC)

I have long believed that my maternal grandmother Maria was Jewish, but according to my brother's recent research into family history, her father was also German. Therefore, to the best of my knowledge, the only Jew in the family was my great-grandmother, with the rest on both sides being German.93.218.190.145 (talk) 20:20, 26 October 2014 (UTC)

References

Personal life

I found the sentence on Geim's current marriage a bit strange. I removed the " for 5-6 years already.", and I also checked online for any reference to this marriage, but couldn't find any. If someone can add a citation, would be great, otherwise I think this should be seen as unverified. Similarly for the sentence on Geim's children. RomQuant (talk) 08:40, 19 January 2021 (UTC)