Talk:75 (album)/Archive 1

Sources

To include:

I see a couple reviews refer to the album as "75th"... should the article be moved accordingly? --Another Believer _(Talk) 03:33, 6 May 2011 (UTC)[reply]

The album cover appears to say "75" in some instances and "75th" in others, unless my eyes are just playing tricks on me! --Another Believer _(Talk) 03:34, 6 May 2011 (UTC)[reply]

All of the sources are 75. J04n(talk page) 03:50, 6 May 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Oh, I see what you're saying. J04n(talk page) 03:52, 6 May 2011 (UTC)[reply]

They are all British reviews, it was probably released by Birdjam in England with the slightly different title. J04n(talk page) 03:54, 6 May 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Should that detail be included in the article, along with the reviews? --Another Believer _(Talk) 15:29, 6 May 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Yes, pondering how to do it without introducing OR. Great catch on your part. J04n(talk page) 16:33, 6 May 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Doesn't seem to be original research to me when you have sources referring to the album as 75th. Perhaps a clause like "also released in XXX as 75th" in the lead or release history would work. --Another Believer _(Talk) 16:37, 6 May 2011 (UTC)[reply]

The problem is that I can't find exactly where it was released as 75th, it looks like GB because British newspaper reviews refer to it as 75th and American as 75. J04n(talk page) 17:19, 6 May 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Hmm. His official discography displays "75th" and BHM. Tricky. --Another Believer _(Talk) 17:35, 6 May 2011 (UTC)[reply]

We should be in good shape with this. --J04n(talk page) 17:47, 6 May 2011 (UTC)[reply]

This should be good, what do you think? I'll incorporate the other reviews tonight. J04n(talk page) 18:03, 6 May 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Works for me! We will see if the GA reviewer has another idea. I would just recommend Googling a bit more to make sure there are other sources that could be integrated into the article. I found the ones above very quickly and I am thinking as many sources as possible (without redundancy) should be included if you are attempting GA status. --Another Believer _(Talk) 19:51, 6 May 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Crossing my fingers, thanks for the help. J04n(talk page) 22:25, 6 May 2011 (UTC)[reply]

GA Review

The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section.

This review is transcluded from Talk:75 (album)/GA2. The edit link for this section can be used to add comments to the review.

Reviewer: Belovedfreak (talk · contribs) 16:20, 30 October 2011 (UTC)[reply]

GA review (see here for what the criteria are, and here for what they are not)

It is reasonably well written.
a (prose): b (MoS for lead, layout, word choice, fiction, and lists):
Some (mostly minor) prose/style issues
It is factually accurate and verifiable.
a (references): b (citations to reliable sources): c (OR):
Querying one source
It is broad in its coverage.
a (major aspects): b (focused):
Covers all major aspect and stays focused
It follows the neutral point of view policy.
Fair representation without bias:
Fair and balanced
It is stable.
No edit wars, etc.:
No recent edits, no evidence of edit wars or content disputes.
It is illustrated by images, where possible and appropriate.
a (images are tagged and non-free images have fair use rationales): b (appropriate use with suitable captions):
One image is non-free (low resolution and has appropriate fair use rationale); other two images are free and have appropriate licenses. One caption query.
Overall:
Pass/Fail:

No links to disambiguation pages found
No dead links found
Spot checks of sources and google searches of article fragments showed no obvious issues with copyvio

Prose etc

Lead

Perhaps a word or two could be added to provide the context of who the artist is for those readers not already familiar with him. Perhaps something like "...is a live album by Austrian-American jazz musician Joe Zawinul and his band the Zawinul Syndicate"?

Done. --Another Believer _(Talk) 15:35, 31 October 2011 (UTC)[reply]

I think in this context, linking Switzerland and Hungary is overlinking. They should be familiar terms to the vast majority of readers, and those articles don't add any understanding to this one.

Done. --Another Believer _(Talk) 15:35, 31 October 2011 (UTC)[reply]

"It was recorded live..." - following "live album" and preceding a mention of the performances, I think "live is redundant and would go with something like "It was recorded in 2007 at two of bandleader Joe Zawinul's final performances..."

Done. --Another Believer _(Talk) 15:35, 31 October 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Overview

The dates here (and in the references) are not consistent with those in the infobox - go with either day month year or month day, year.

Done. --Another Believer _(Talk) 15:35, 31 October 2011 (UTC)[reply]

"This would be Zawinuls penultimate performance" is slightly vague, positioned after mention of his death. Perhaps something like "The Veszprém concert was Zawinuls penultimate performance" (notice I prefer the simple past tense, but I leave that up to you. :) )

Done. --Another Believer _(Talk) 15:35, 31 October 2011 (UTC)[reply]

penultimate is a fairly common word isn't it? Not sure it needs a wiktionary link.

Done. --Another Believer _(Talk) 15:35, 31 October 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Composition

Not sure disc needs to be linked

Done. --Another Believer _(Talk) 15:35, 31 October 2011 (UTC)[reply]

"The "In a Silent Way" Shorter Zawinul duet ..." - this looked slightly odd until I remembered who Shorter was. Perhaps "Shorter–Zawinul duet" or "Shorter/Zawinul duet"? I must admit I'm not sure about the MOS here, but I think it could do with something.

Done. --Another Believer _(Talk) 15:35, 31 October 2011 (UTC)[reply]

"...while the album closed ..." - we've suddenly changed tense for some reason.
I'm not sure if I'm being stupid but I can't seem to parse that final "The "In a Silent Way"..." sentence. Can it be clarified a little?

Better? I separated the sentences, added a detail to the first (re: Miles Davis), and adjusted punctuation accordingly. --Another Believer _(Talk) 15:35, 31 October 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Critical reception

While using short qoutes from critics tends to be the usual way of doin this section, I'm a little concerned that there might be a bit too much quoting here and I think that there should be a bit more paraphrasing. Could you cut down some of he quotes a bit so that there's a higher proportion of original prose? Just as an example, the very first sentence of the section could easily have its quotes cut down by paraphrasing "perfectly exemplifies" and "before he suddenly passed away".

I restructured this section a bit, combining paragraphs, removing the Berryman review, and removing non-essential quotes. Let me know if more needs to be done. --Another Believer _(Talk) 15:35, 31 October 2011 (UTC)[reply]

"In All About Jazz...", "In JazzPolice..." - it seems strange to see in when referring to a website. "In Wikipedia..." doesn't sound right to me. Could these be reworded, eg. "In a review for All About Jazz..." or something?

Done. --Another Believer _(Talk) 15:35, 31 October 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Other

I'm guessing the album is titled 75/75th because it was his birthday. I'm also guessing that you haven't found anything in the sources that confirms that? Kind of obvious, but if it is mentioned, might be nice having that in there somewhere.

This is mentioned in the first sentence of the Overview section. --Another Believer _(Talk) 15:35, 31 October 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Sourcing

Could you talk me through what makes Jazz Police a reliable/notable source, or who Don Berryman is - is he recognised as an expert in jazz?

I removed the source from the article and included the link in the External links section. This way, readers can still access the review but it is not incorporated into the article. --Another Believer _(Talk) 15:35, 31 October 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Images

The caption under the image in the "overview" section doesn't quite make sense to me. Remember to put a period/full stop if it's a full sentence. I was going to add one, but realised I didn't quite understand what is there. To be honest, I think you could make it something simpler like "Joe Zawinul died shortly after 75 was recorded."

Done. --Another Believer _(Talk) 15:35, 31 October 2011 (UTC)[reply]

On the whole, a well-written article that is very close to GA. I'll put it on hold to allow you to address the above concerns. As usual, feel free to argue any of the points raised and let me know if you have any questions. I'll give it a final once-over when you're done. --Beloved Freak 19:45, 30 October 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Thanks so much for your time and assistance. Please let me know if there are any additional concerns which need to be addressed. --Another Believer _(Talk) 15:35, 31 October 2011 (UTC)[reply]

I added "Category:Live albums published posthumously" since it was released following Zawinul's death. Please let me know if this is incorrect. --Another Believer _(Talk) 15:40, 31 October 2011 (UTC)[reply]

The category seems fine to me. Thanks for addressing the points raised. I apologise for the delay, but life has caught up with me; I meant to get to this sooner. I should be able to give it a final chack through tomorrow. --Beloved Freak 00:13, 3 November 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Good work, I'm happy to list it as a good article. Thanks for putting in the work. If Berryman is not considered notable by WP standard, I'd personally question even including the review as an EL, but that won't hold up listing as a GA and I'll leave it up to you. --Beloved Freak 10:25, 3 November 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Thanks for taking the time to offer the thorough review. No worries about the delay--I totally understand and was not bothered. I will leave the Berryman review for now. Thanks again! --Another Believer _(Talk) 14:58, 3 November 2011 (UTC)[reply]

The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.