Wikipedia:Reference desk/Archives/Humanities/2008 April 25

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April 25

belly button

Hi i was just wondering, how come some people's navels r ticklish? im wondering this because some people claim it hurts when u poke them there.Jwking (talk) 04:25, 25 April 2008 (UTC)

I fail to see how this fits under "humanities" but anyway... I would venture a SWAG that the belly button probably has quite a few nerves in the general vicinity due to the fact that the umbilical cord attaches there during gestation. With all those nerves, ticklishness and pain are no surprise. Dismas|^(talk) 04:33, 25 April 2008 (UTC)

Humanities = "traits of human nature" (OED)? Anyway it seems to me there is a significant difference between tickling someone and poking them in the belly button. Trust and friendship normally precede such acts of intimacy, otherwise people who are happily ticklish with their loved ones may well experience discomfort on being poked by you.--Shantavira|^{feed me} 07:21, 25 April 2008 (UTC)

If it hurts, you're overdoing things. My guess is someone will likely deck you, so take notice when they're being polite and only saying that it hurts. Julia Rossi (talk) 07:44, 25 April 2008 (UTC)

Study abroad scholarships

A while ago I heard about a monastery in Europe where scholars can apply to live for a year. If you get it you get room and board and can work on whatever you want in peace for a year (sort of like a Rhodes Scholarship or Fulbright I guess). Any idea where/what this program is?

Another similar but unconnected question: Are there any scholarships to live/study in Jerusalem (non religious scholarships that is)? Thanks, --S.dedalus (talk) 06:22, 25 April 2008 (UTC)

Until someone who knows arrives, and since the categories for monasteries, Greece, Spain, Belgium etc sub cats Cistercian, Benedictine etc are an infinity, I'd get in touch with leading music schools or go to an arts portal for the answers to musician in residence type leads. Fellowship gets better hits than scholarship as you've probably found since scholarship+monastery are a dyad of their own. Good luck, Julia Rossi (talk) 08:19, 25 April 2008 (UTC)

This website might be of help. WikiJedits (talk) 13:00, 25 April 2008 (UTC)

Wasn't there a religious establishment in Britain that does the same thing? Scholars had to sign up to relatively few rules, but one of them was not to write anything that would undermine the Church of England - -that counts out a lot of people! BrainyBabe (talk) 08:57, 26 April 2008 (UTC)

Erasmus in Spain

was the work of the humanist Erasmus greeted with as much initial enthsiasim in Spain as it was in northern Europe? Was it perhaps seen as a challenge to Catholic orthodxy? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 217.42.98.155 (talk) 08:26, 25 April 2008 (UTC)

There were certainly some who welcomed the work of Erasmus but the general reception was muted. The clergy were particularly resentful of his attacks on the mendicant friars. Under pressure from the religious orders, the Grand Inquisitor, Alonso Manrique de Lara, held a debate in Valladolid in March 1527 to decide if Erasmus' writings were heretical or not. The conference was suspended without decision, which was taken for a victory for the Erasmians. The following December King Charles wrote to him, assuring him that his honour and reputation 'would always be held in great esteem'

It was not to be. In 1559, the year following the death of Charles, some sixteen of Erasmus' publications were placed on the first Spanish-produced Index of forbidden books, including the Enchiridion. By this time the Inquisition had a hold on most aspects of Spanish intellectual life. The reaction against Erasmus, and Humanism in general, was one of the features of the ideological crisis that beset Spain in the second half of the sixteenth century. Clio the Muse (talk) 23:55, 25 April 2008 (UTC)

I read this as "Erasmus in Spam", wrote he was very unwelcome indeed , then saw my mistake,*facepalm* ..hotclaws 11:50, 27 April 2008 (UTC)

Red Hat society?

What is the Red Hat society? What are their aims? What do they stand for? —Preceding unsigned comment added by Quidom (talk • contribs) 09:04, 25 April 2008 (UTC)

They are a sinister organisation attempting to infiltrate Western society in order to ensure its collapse by undermining it from within... No, wait, that's another sort of red... Here is the Red Hat Society's own web page. SaundersW (talk) 12:52, 25 April 2008 (UTC)

and the Wikipedia article: Red Hat Society WikiJedits (talk) 12:53, 25 April 2008 (UTC)

Not to be confused with The Red-Headed League. --Major Bonkers (talk) 17:03, 25 April 2008 (UTC)

And here I thought they were a political front for propagation of Red Hat Linux. Corvus cornix_talk 17:06, 25 April 2008 (UTC)

Socializing across social classes

How do different social classes socialize? For example, in America different social classes meet through sport activities (like baseball) or a pub but perhaps go to different colleges and restaurants. I would like to learn more systematically how it works (especially in America and Europe). 217.168.1.182 (talk) 11:45, 25 April 2008 (UTC)

We can't say there's a system, people get to know each other all over the place, on trains, at work, goodness knows where. Supermarkets and libraries can be full of those moments of possibility. Xn4 22:24, 25 April 2008 (UTC)

I do believe there is some sort of system. Libraries are inherently public and open, so different people get to know each other there. Fine restaurants and first-class trains on the other hand are not open. 217.168.3.246 (talk) 23:54, 25 April 2008 (UTC)

Returning to fox hunting, if I may, that is where I have met the greatest cross-section of people from different classes and backgrounds. In my experience not an awful lot of socialising goes on in libraries...or in supermarkets! Clio the Muse (talk) 00:01, 26 April 2008 (UTC)

What kind of classes do you find in fox hunting? I expected only to find upper-middle class ãnd upward. 217.168.3.246 (talk) 00:20, 26 April 2008 (UTC)

On the contrary. Please glance over the points made in the fox-hunting thread above. Clio the Muse (talk) 00:28, 26 April 2008 (UTC)

← Social class is such a fluid concept, I don't see how we can generalize in this way. People meet in all different ways, for different purposes. -- Kesh (talk) 01:55, 26 April 2008 (UTC)

Partly because in the UK one of the things that goes into what class someone is is how they socialise. It is indeed a fluid concept. 79.66.99.37 (talk) 02:00, 26 April 2008 (UTC)

For those who go to church, churches are often places to meet people from a wide range of backgrounds. If someone lives in an area with a good comprehensive schooling system and few desirable private schools, school can be a place for mixing across class barriers. The Post Office queue is another. If the young members of the higher middle classes take menial holiday jobs that can also be a time of mixing with difference classes, although not necessarily representative slices of the various classes.

If fox hunting is where Clio has met the greatest cross-section of people from different classes and backgrounds, I think that says more about Clio's life than about fox hunting itself. Seriously, if the impression she has given in her answers and user page is accurate, I would regard her comment above as accurate but not necessarily indicating that fox hunting attracts a wide range of classes and backgrounds. She went to a private boarding school, I doubt she's taken menial holiday jobs, and it sounds like her churchy experience is generally high Anglican to anglo-Catholic. Universities, particularly the sort of university I imagine Clio is at, tend not to carry the full range of classes in a representative manner (I was shocked when I started at the number of people I met who went to what I think of as 'weird schools'. Rarely do I meet a fellow product of a state comprehensive). Where else is Clio going to meet people who aren't like her? And thus we see the relevance of the original question.

I'm afraid I've just realised this has come across as a little personal and attack-y. I really don't mean it like that, but as a way of understanding what has been said in this thread and approaching an answer to the question (for the UK). But I'm tired, and so possibly not exercising good judgement. Feel free to delete anything about Clio from this post. 79.66.99.37 (talk) 01:58, 26 April 2008 (UTC)

Ha-ha-ha! I certainly went to a weird school, that much is true! [1] We are the best, so screw the rest! Clio the Muse (talk) 22:18, 26 April 2008 (UTC)

Answering your question: "Where else is Clio going to meet people who aren't like her?" In the Wikipedia Ref. Desk.? 217.168.1.161 (talk) 23:16, 26 April 2008 (UTC)

Well indeed. And if we all met up over drinks (or possibly tea and cake) to discuss what was up in our lives, I'm sure it would be fascinating. I'm not sure how well our current activities approximate socialising :) But in other ways we are all quite similar here on the desks, all sharing a love of learning for its own sake. But that isn't linked too strongly to social class. 79.66.99.37 (talk) 00:08, 27 April 2008 (UTC)

I recommend Watching the English: The Hidden Rules of English Behaviour (Hodder and Stoughton, 2004) by social anthropologist Kate Fox. BrainyBabe (talk) 09:01, 26 April 2008 (UTC)

Buying drugs, the classes really mix there.I'm being serious....hotclaws 11:53, 27 April 2008 (UTC)

Not in South Ken, Hotclaws, not in my experience, anyway! Clio the Muse (talk) 22:23, 27 April 2008 (UTC)

Philosophy

I am trying to establish which philospher ( Descartes ???) indicated that the mind is similar to a blank piece of paper and that all experiences are imprinted onto the mind. In other words, the mind obtains it's thoughts through the element of experience. I read the article some time ago and cannot recall who the philospher was---can anyone assist me? Thank you in advance.--96.245.70.110 (talk) 12:33, 25 April 2008 (UTC)

According to tabula rasa (which may have been the article you read) it was Aristotle. SaundersW (talk) 12:46, 25 April 2008 (UTC)

You might also want to take a look at John Locke. Deor (talk) 13:36, 25 April 2008 (UTC)

Sorry, apparently I and Lord Foppington edited at the same time. Read his comment below. Deor (talk) 13:39, 25 April 2008 (UTC)

Great minds Deor... Yours, Lord Foppington (talk) 13:58, 25 April 2008 (UTC)

It is sometimes (wrongly) attributed as a creation of John Locke. If the OP was think about modern philosophers like Descartes then perhaps it was he who was being thought of... tabula rasa is more central to Lockean empiricism and ideas of rights than it was to Aristole's philosophy. See An Essay Concerning Human Understanding for more on this, it's a great read too if you're inclined! Yours, Lord Foppington (talk) 13:36, 25 April 2008 (UTC)

Stalin's blindness

Why was Stalin so reluctant to believe, in the face of all of the evidence, that Hitler was about to launch an attack on the Soviet Union in 1941? John Spencer (talk) 13:15, 25 April 2008 (UTC)

Stalin himself was not reluctant to belive that Hitler would invade the USSR, for he only signed away a partioned Poland to give himself time to build up the Army. He was reluctant to belive however that the invasion was imminent since he was mistrustful of England and The USA. He also did not listen to his front lines when they were first attack and was said to have run around the Kremlin telling nobody to do anything. Stalin was paranoid and possibly schizophrenic, he and Hitler had two such differing ideologies that the conflict was inevitable but Stalin beleived he was always in control. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Quidom (talk • contribs) 22:10, 25 April 2008 (UTC)

John, I should like to make it clear that the outset-though I suspect you are as aware of this as I am-that the suggestion that Stalin was 'possibly schizophrenic' is absolute rubbish. As a politician, and as a tactician, he took a highly rational view of events, subjecting everything to precise calculations. He assumed that Hitler took the same rational and calculating view; and therein was his greatest error.

You see, Hitler was, unlike Stalin, a dilettante dictator and a dreamer. But Stalin imbued in him all of his own calculating qualities. After all, a successful invasion of the Soviet Union, with its sprawling frontier and vast army, would require at least a two to one advantage for the attacker, which Hitler did not have. More than that, why would he embark on a two-front war, the very thing that had contributed to the destruction of Germany in the First World War? Why, moreover, would he begin an invasion in mid-summer, which gave him only a few weeks of combat weather? He simply could not entertain the idea that Hitler could undertake an assault against the grain of all military sense. He misjudged Hitler; it's as simple as that. Clio the Muse (talk) 00:26, 26 April 2008 (UTC)

Didn't Stalin know about Hitler's astrologer? Julia Rossi (talk) 07:22, 26 April 2008 (UTC)

That's a myth, Julia; Hitler did not have an astrologer. He was altogether contemptuous of the practice, and astrologers were among one of the many groups persecuted during the Third Reich. There were, however, some among the leadership prepared to take the practice seriously, either for political ends or out of simple superstition. Heinrich Himmler and Rudolf Hess were most notable amongst the latter. The man who came closest to being the 'court' astrologer was Karl Ernst Krafft, who was arrested in May 1941 following Hess's flight to Scotland, when Hitler, in his fury, ordered a fresh purge of occultists and astrologers of all kinds. Goebbels joked at this time that it was odd that not one amongst the group was able to predict what was about to happen to them! Clio the Muse (talk) 22:41, 26 April 2008 (UTC)

It was tongue-in-cheek for his "unpredictability" but also a bonus to have the facts on the myth. Thanks, Clio! Julia Rossi (talk) 23:42, 26 April 2008 (UTC)

Sorry, Julia; your irony escaped me. I thought it was a genuine question. I shall have to stop being so literal-minded! Clio the Muse (talk) 03:12, 27 April 2008 (UTC)

Christianity and the dead in the middle ages

Hi. I expect some of you have been watching the fascinating series on BBC 4 on aspects of medieval thought and experience. I've become particularly interested in the impact of Christianity, especially in relation to death and the fear of death. I think it possible to say, on the basis of my limited understanding, that Christianity at this time was in many respects a cult of death? It was also based, it might be said, on an ever present struggle between good and evil? Is this a reasonable view? 86.153.161.63 (talk) 13:28, 25 April 2008 (UTC)

Yes and no.

In my paltry understanding, Christianity is and always has been a cult of both death and life. The Bible has many lessons on how to live well, but ultimately it is a book for those preparing to die. The central event in the Christian mythos is of course the death of Christ, who met his end, as Nietzsche says, in "exemplary" fashion. Despite the great shame and suffering in cruxifiction, he went to the cross unflinching, dignified, with (near) total acceptance of the proceedings. You may contrast this with a common criminal denying his actions, cursing his persecutors, and in general doing a lot of gnashing and wailing. Jesus may have met his end, but he did so with dignity and grace, which is the best I presume he could have managed back in 0 A.D. Vranak (talk) 17:47, 25 April 2008 (UTC)

One thing to keep in mind is that pre-Industrial life was a more tenuous existence than today: everyone living in Medieval times, both the wealthy & powerful & the poor & humble, were well aware that Famine, War & Pestilence were always lurking just around the corner. Death was constantly in mind, & the culture of the time reflected this. (Consider the trope of "The Wheel of Fortune".) The emphasis of Christianity was hope not death -- despite the morbid obsessions of many martyrs' Vitae -- that despite material setback or loss there was a better existence for those who lived a moral life. (Which I admit oversimplifies the message.) -- llywrch (talk) 19:07, 25 April 2008 (UTC)

A few words on hope:

Hope. Pandora brought the jar with the evils and opened it. It was the gods' gift to man, on the outside a beautiful, enticing gift, called the "lucky jar." Then all the evils, those lively, winged beings, flew out of it. Since that time, they roam around and do harm to men by day and night. One single evil had not yet slipped out of the jar. As Zeus had wished, Pandora slammed the top down and it remained inside. So now man has the lucky jar in his house forever and thinks the world of the treasure. It is at his service; he reaches for it when he fancies it. For he does not know that that jar which Pandora brought was the jar of evils, and he takes the remaining evil for the greatest worldly good--it is hope, for Zeus did not want man to throw his life away, no matter how much the other evils might torment him, but rather to go on letting himself be tormented anew. To that end, he gives man hope. In truth, it is the most evil of evils because it prolongs man's torment. — Nietzsche

Vranak (talk) 20:26, 25 April 2008 (UTC)

Yes, the BBC series is excellent! Anyway, death, as you must be aware, had a powerful immediacy in the Medieval consciousness, and contemporary Christianity reflected this in a manner of ways. Death was both a threat and, though it seems odd to say so, the dead a living presence. There is no better illustration of this than in one of the most common folk tales of the era-the Legend of the Three Living and the Three Dead. This tells of three men, wealthy and well-dressed; three men in the noon of life. Entering a forest they come across three rotting cadavers, who chide their living counter-parts for their vanity and complacency, saying:

Such as you are so were we

Such as we are so will you be.

This encounter was to be found on wall-paintings throughout Medieval Europe. Here is an example from Charlwood in Surrey - 5k. It's an allegory, yes, but it is firmly based on the belief that the dead did roam the land. William of Newburgh, the twelfth century English chronicler, found it difficult to keep up with the numerous stories of the walking dead: "One would not easily believe that corpses come out of their graves were there not so many cases supported by such ample testimony."

So, the boundaries between the two worlds, that of the living and that of the dead, were fluid and porous. They were constantly being crossed by hordes of spiritual beings-the angels on one side, the demons on the other, locked together in combat over the souls of the living; and this is where the Church was at its most important. It offered the only defence against the abyss, guiding the living through the uncertainties, all of the traps of life. As for the struggle between good and evil Orderic Vitalis, a monk writing about 1100, was to describe monasteries as castles built against Satan, one "where the cowled champions engage in ceaseless combat." Clio the Muse (talk) 01:02, 26 April 2008 (UTC)

Other tropes are Memento mori and Danse Macabre. Another example is that people "celebrated" (in the sense of keeping in their memory) death dates, not birth dates. Psalters created for a particular person would include all the major feast days, but also dates on which family members had died. Adam Bishop (talk) 02:48, 26 April 2008 (UTC)

What is MAOISM?

I have read the article, wishing to know what would make Maoism or Mao Zedong Thought a distinct form of communism. While I came away with the idea that perhaps Deng Xaiopingism might be said to be a pragmatic form communism, I still don't really know what makes Maoism special. I pray the Muses here might enlighten me. --Czmtzc (talk) 13:35, 25 April 2008 (UTC)

Speaking as a layman, it really seems to be a cult of personality (insert guitar riff here). While other communist nations are primarily based on Marxism and Leninism, the Chinese had their own cultural icon to influence their interpretation of communism. -- Kesh (talk) 22:05, 25 April 2008 (UTC)

Czmtzc, I've attached below a slightly amended answer I give to a similar question last October. I think it covers all you are looking for. Clio the Muse (talk) 01:07, 26 April 2008 (UTC)

The text you should look for, if you are looking for a text, is The Political Thought of Mao Tse-Tung by Stuart Schram. It was Mao's belief that there was a specifically Chinese road to socialism, though in pursuit of that road he effectively turned the classic doctrines of Marxist materialism inside out, with quite disastrous consequences for China and the Chinese people.

You see, in terms of economic development and industrial resources, China of the mid-twentieth century was about as far removed from that stage of advanced historical development that Karl Marx had believed to be the essential precursor of a successful revolution. Short of many natural resources it possessed one thing in abundance-people. And it was people who were to be the raw material in Mao's great experiment. Now, though Lenin had always stressed that there was a subjective element to the whole revolutionary process, that it was an act of political consciousness, Mao took this subjectivity to what might be described as an anti-materialist extreme. Distrustful of experts and obstacles, distrustful of bureaucracy, he placed his greatest intellectual emphasis on achieving goals by an 'act of faith' alone; that even the most difficult things were not beyond the power of will. In other words, it was the will of the people, the power of the masses, that would enable the Chinese to catch up with the Soviets and the advanced industrial powers of the west.

This, in essence, is the key to the Great Leap Forward. By this Mao hoped that steel production would increase if the energy and will of the whole nation could simply be directed towards that particular end, regardless of technical and practical objections. Revolutionary zeal would be enough. Of course it was not. The steel that was produced was of poor quality and the neglect of other areas of the economy, agriculture in particular, was to create one of the worst man-made famines in the whole course of Chinese history. Despite this Mao did not abandon his belief in revolutionary spontaneity, which was to emerge once again, with equally disastrous consequences, in the Cultural Revolution.

In thinking of the deleterious effects of these forms of anti-materialist and, it might be said, anti-Marxist voluntarism you might also wish to consider the actions of Pol Pot, Mao's greatest and most murderous disciple. Clio the Muse 23:19, 13 October 2007 (UTC)

Saying that Maoism is the Chinese flavour of Communism doesn't seem entirely accurate, considering how influential the ideology has been outside of East Asia. Groups as diverse as the Party of Labour of Albania, the Shining Path of Peru, and the Black Panther Party for Self-Defence in the United States have all been influenced by Mao Zedong Thought... He must have been saying something universal. 89.213.79.245 (talk) 17:14, 26 April 2008 (UTC)

One could make exactly the same observation about Leninism or Stalinism. It does not make the doctrine any less original, or the imitators any less barbarous, a point I was under the impression I had made in reference to Pol Pot. Clio the Muse (talk) 01:50, 27 April 2008 (UTC)

On the question of why many groups outside China have turned to the Maoist variety of Marxism-Leninism, the answer is mainly in the third-worldism of the Maoists. As stated above, Marxism (i.e. historical materialism) traditionally postulated that societies move through stages from feudalism to capitalism and only then on to socialism. The Maoists broke with this idea to say that less-developed countries could move directly to socialism. (Guevarism was a similar tendency.) Hence revolutionary movements in India (the Naxalites, in Nepal, and other places were more attracted to Chinese than to Soviet communism, especially when the Chinese were actively courting those movements and promoting the notion of people's war and the Soviets were pursuing peaceful coexistence.Itsmejudith (talk) 20:09, 27 April 2008 (UTC)

Population of Palestine prior to the Arab/Muslim Conquest of 640

Would anybody know what the population of Palestine (roughly today's Israel, Gaza and West Bank) was just prior to the Arab/Muslim conquest of 640, as well as its composition in terms of Jews, Arabs, Christians, Romans and others? 70.51.23.55 (talk) 18:14, 25 April 2008 (UTC)

'Palestine' was part of Roman provinces named Judea and Arabia, and contained a predominantly Jewish population, with a sifnificant Christian minority, but this was 200AD. By 640 it was part of the Eastern Roman Empire or Byzantium. This would have left it changed very little, however it was this area which was weakened so much by the Seluciad Roman wars earlier in the century which left it practically undefended, leaving it susceptible to a Muslim attack. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Quidom (talk • contribs) 22:15, 25 April 2008 (UTC)

You forgot about the Plague of Justinian, which struck circa 540. One of the regions it ravaged was Palestine. -- llywrch (talk) 22:29, 25 April 2008 (UTC)

Thanks. But to be clear, should I take it then that prior to the Arab/Muslim conquest of 640, Palestine was populated predominatntly by Jews? If so, would you have any rough idea of the proportions of the different groups at the time.

Also, the expulsion of the Jews from ancient Israel, renamed Palestine, is for the most part attributed to the Romans, long before the Arab conquest. Would anyone have an estimate as to what proportion of Jews had already been expelled by the Romans by 640 compared to how many remained and were later expelled by the Arabs? 70.51.23.55 (talk) 00:10, 26 April 2008 (UTC)

I don't think that you will ever get precise figures, 70.51, though I should point out that the Jewish population of Palestine had declined steadily as a result of the various Jewish-Roman Wars, particularly from the Bar Kokhba Revolt in the second century AD onwards. The proportion that remained came under serious threat in the wake of the seventh-century Revolt against Heraclius. By the time of the Arab conquest it seems likely that the majority of people living in Palestine were Christian, Monophysite probably. You should also have a look at the Jewish Diaspora. Clio the Muse (talk) 01:19, 26 April 2008 (UTC)

I poked into my library, & found a possible reference on population for this period -- J.C. Russell, "Late Ancient and Early Medieval Population", Transactions of the American Philosophical Society 48 Part 3 (1958), pp. 88+ As for the form of Christianity in this area, don't underestimate the presence of Jerusalem, & other significant religious sites: there was enough interest from Constantinople & parts of Europe to encourage through money & favoritism the existence of a significant Orthodox/Catholic community. (I also would not be surprised if there still sizable pockets of pre-Nicean Christian groups, such as Ebionites.) -- llywrch (talk) 04:37, 26 April 2008 (UTC)

Take a look at our article Palestine, particularly Early_demographics, which incompletely cites this paper by Sergio DellaPergola,"Demographic Trends in Israel and Palestine: Prospects and Policy Implications" (PDF). see [2] for earlier version wi his email. Some of DellaPergola's publications listed at his university site [3] could be useful. Roberto Bachi Population of Israel, 1974 and Population Trends of World Jewry Jerusalem: Hebrew U., 1976 are (the?) standard works on the historical demography of Israel/Palestine, used along with a few others by SdP for his table used in Palestine. Don't have Bachi's books but there's also this book, America and the Founding of Israel: An Investigation of the Morality of America's Role, Fr. John W. Mulhall, (Christian, somewhat pro-Arab POV, but with an account based on Italian/Israeli demographer Bachi.) It's on the web [4] and particularly [5] section IV and V, except unfortunately for the notes, which IIRC go into more detail on this. Have the book but can't find it at the moment. The area had a Jewish majority until ca. 300 or earlier, the Romans didn't expel all Jews by any means. There was a slow, partially economic migration largely to Mesopotamia and conversions/intermarriage with Christians. Another group which was important then was the Samaritans numbering perhaps in the hundreds of thousands, but which repeatedly revolted unsuccessfully against the Romans/Byzatines, sometimes along with the Jews, and had a more serious demographic catastrophe. Mulhall: "During the sixth century Christians became the majority in Palestine. Arabs moved into it from surrounding areas" So "By 638 Palestine was perhaps only one-tenth Jewish." The not too numerous Arab conquerors didn't do much expelling; many saw them as a lighter hand than the Byzantines; they revoked the prohibition against Jews going to Jerusalem generally in force before. Estimates of the 100AD population vary widely, centering about 2.5- 3 million, while the population around 4-500 AD before wars and revolts was the highest it had been before the 20th century.John Z (talk) 05:18, 26 April 2008 (UTC)

I'm mostly trying to make some sense of the Palestinian position that in returning to Palestine, Jews are in some way "stealing" Palestinian land. If Palestinians are Arabs, and if Arabs originate from the Arabian peninsula and only conquered Palestine in 640, I just don't understand how and why the Palestinian people have any logical basis with which to entirely reject the return of Jews to Palestine. Palestine being a land that only fell within Arab "Palestinian" hands due to a conquest that occurred only several centuries after most Jews were expelled by the Romans from a territory before there even existed a Palestinian people. But I suppose I'm just making trouble here by asking a question that actually challenges this great RefDesk's well established bias, and for that I apologize. A good pun would seem to be in order here, unfortunately I possess no doctorate in puns. 76.69.249.230 (talk) 03:36, 1 May 2008 (UTC)

Frederick and Adolph

Frederick the great was one of Adolph Hitler's personal heroes, even having Thomas carlyle's biography of the Prussian king read to him in the final days of the Third Reich. But how close does he really correspond to the qualities hitler imbued in him of a german national hero? While I'm here is there any more information on the fate of Menzel's portrait of the king, last seen in Hitler's bunker in 1945? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 81.156.3.103 (talk) 18:43, 25 April 2008 (UTC)

Frederick the Great was Adolph von Menzel's favourite historical subject, and Himmler gave Hitler one of Menzel's many portraits, Frederick the Great on a Trip, for the Fuehrer's 49th birthday in 1938. I can't tell you what happened to it, but it's less interesting than what happened to the remains of Frederick himself. After spending the Second World War in an underground mine for protection, they were liberated by the US Army in 1945, then travelled to Burg Hohenzollern, and in 1991 were finally buried (for the first time in accordance with Frederick's Will) with his greyhounds on a terrace at Sanssouci, "ohne Prunk, ohne Pomp, und bei Nacht". Xn4 22:09, 25 April 2008 (UTC)

Well, to begin with, Frederick is better seen as a Prussian rather than a German hero. He was also a rationalist, an admirer of the French (it upset him to see them so easily routed at Rossbach), one who despised native German culture, thinking it impossible to create any worthwhile literature in the language. More than that, he was almost certainly a homosexual. So, not all that close to the Hitler ideal!

On your second question, 81.156, Hitler left instructions for Hans Baur, his pilot, to smuggle Menzel's portrait to a 'safe place in Bavaria.' Baur's attempt to break out of the Bunker failed. The fate of the painting is uncertain, but it was most likely destroyed at that time. Either that or it is hanging on the wall of some cottage deep in the Russian steppe! Clio the Muse (talk) 01:36, 26 April 2008 (UTC)

Argument to the best explanation

What does Bertrand Russell mean by this exactly? —Preceding unsigned comment added by Jet Eldridge (talk • contribs) 18:57, 25 April 2008 (UTC)

You will find a discussion of this in his 1912 The Problems of Philosophy. It's his response to the sceptic argument, which says we can claim no knowledge beyond sense experience, to even think that physical objects exist at all. It goes further than that; for as Russell points out, from a pure sceptical perspective we ought not to think that there are other perceivers beyond ourselves. After all, if we cannot refute scepticism about objects, how are we to refute scepticism about other minds?

Russell offers the 'argument to the best explanation' as a way through this difficulty. It is simpler, he argues, to adopt the hypothesis that, first, there really are physical objects, and, second, that our perception corresponds to them in a reliable way. Clio the Muse (talk) 02:02, 26 April 2008 (UTC)

Sounds like Inference to the best explanation. Llamabr (talk) 17:31, 29 April 2008 (UTC)

German Army - World War II

I was reading my father's WWII memoirs and came across the word "Fbak" which is used in the context of a German Army Unit in Greece in 1943. Can anyone tell me what the "Fbak" was? I have Googled it and got nowhere. Custodi (talk) 21:07, 25 April 2008 (UTC)

That'd be Flak, anti-aircraft guns. Angus McLellan (Talk) 21:38, 25 April 2008 (UTC)

Thank you, but I don't think that is correct. I will give the entire quote from the memoirs, which indicates a Unit of the German Army, perhaps Supply or Administrative. Saturday, September 11, 1943 "The Germans have arrived here to sequester our materiel. Several FBAK officers and military staff arrived in the morning to requisition our automatic weapons, the Fiat 1100, the Guzzi, and all the SPAs except one so that we could haul provisions." —Preceding unsigned comment added by Custodi (talk • contribs) 18:22, 28 April 2008 (UTC)

Genealogy of Lucien Wolf

What is the genealogy of Lucien Wolf (born 1857 in London; died 1930)? What is his parents names? What is his Jewish name? I doubt Lucien Wolf (i.e., "Light Wolf") is his birth name. Thank you. Shearzar (talk) 22:12, 25 April 2008 (UTC)

Lucien Wolf was his real name. He was the son of Edward Wolf, a London pipe manufacturer, and his wife Céline (born Redlich). Wolf's father was a Bohemian Jew who came to England after the trials and tribulations of 1848, his mother Viennese. Xn4 22:30, 25 April 2008 (UTC)

Thanks for the reply. Please provide reference. My google and yahoo searches did not verify your information. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Shearzar (talk • contribs) 03:15, 26 April 2008 (UTC) Shearzar (talk) 03:17, 26 April 2008 (UTC)

Conjecture regarding this individual's Hebrew given name: "Lucien" may be a vernacular rendition of "Meir" (מאיר; who gives light), or otherwise any Hebrew or even Yiddish name with the initial letter L. -- Deborahjay (talk) 06:43, 26 April 2008 (UTC)

Try this search[6] Julia Rossi (talk) 07:20, 26 April 2008 (UTC)

My search of the reference you provide does not mention Lucien Wolf's parents by name. 24.126.255.229 (talk) 15:24, 26 April 2008 (UTC) 24.126.255.229 (talk) 15:25, 26 April 2008 (UTC)

No trouble, Shearzar, see the article Wolf, Lucien (1857–1930), journalist and lobbyist by Mark Levene in the Oxford Dictionary of National Biography (Oxford University Press, 2004) and Levene's Jews and the new Europe: the diplomacy of Lucien Wolf, 1914–1919 (1992). Levene's sources include Lucien Wolf: a memoir by Cecil Roth in Essays in Jewish history by Lucien Wolf, ed. Roth (1934), pp. 1–34, and Lucien Wolf: a life, by David Mowschowitch, which is the draft of a biography of Wolf by one of his advisors, now in the archives of the YIVO Institute for Jewish Research, New York (Mowschowitch collection). Xn4 10:20, 26 April 2008 (UTC)

Since I am not a paying subscriber to the Online Oxford reference you directed me, I am still unable to verify the names of Lucien Wolf's parents. If it is a historical fact that Lucien Wolf's parent's names are Edward and Celine (born Redlich), please edit the Wikipedia article about Lucien Wolf to include those facts and provide references that can be substantiated by others. Thank you. 24.126.255.229 (talk) 15:24, 26 April 2008 (UTC)24.126.255.229 (talk) 15:25, 26 April 2008 (UTC)

The Online Jewish Encyclopedia article about Lucien Wolf (http://www.jewishencyclopedia.com/view.jsp?artid=240&letter=W) does not mention his parents names. Shearzar (talk) 16:38, 26 April 2008 (UTC)

I've edited the Lucien Wolf article and added the references to Levene. I can't add the Roth and Mowschowitch ones, as I have only Levene's citations of them. Xn4 19:34, 26 April 2008 (UTC)

Jobs in Rural Areas

What would be a job that I could do on my own land? I have lots of forest and I'm in a rural area. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 64.119.61.7 (talk) 23:57, 25 April 2008 (UTC)

Lumberjack. --Major Bonkers (talk) 08:39, 26 April 2008 (UTC)

Clear the land and plant crops? Dismas|^(talk) 13:58, 26 April 2008 (UTC)

Carbon off-setting? Get guilt-ridden jet-setters to pay you money in return for not cutting down any of your trees. 89.213.79.245 (talk) 17:20, 26 April 2008 (UTC)

Make charcoal. --Karenjc 19:39, 26 April 2008 (UTC)

Forest preservation has it's attractions – you could connect with special interest (birds etc) and wildlife groups to see if your forest has special features – you could use these to invite others as visitors to appreciate them and charge entry fees. If you're interested in any area yourself, you can arrange guided tours, put special markers around, create walks – or make a wildly "hazardous" mini golf course; a camping ground? Artists' camps? Musicians' camps? Look into small business advice bureaus online. Julia Rossi (talk) 23:34, 26 April 2008 (UTC)

Green graves,I remember an organisation once that allowed people to be buried without coffins by trees or with a sapling over them.The pagan rite of your choice could be held there.hotclaws 11:56, 27 April 2008 (UTC)

Manage the woodland by coppicing and run workshops for people to learn about coppicing. They cut your wood, they pay to do it. You could have a team of working horses to shift the wood and also charge people to learn about managing working horses. Do all the other things mentioned as well. Itsmejudith (talk) 19:26, 27 April 2008 (UTC)

Do you think you might get away with a nudist colony? --Major Bonkers (talk) 17:39, 29 April 2008 (UTC)

Green woodworking [7]? See pole lathe and bodging. BrainyBabe (talk) 16:56, 30 April 2008 (UTC)