User talk:Harout72/Sandbox
Observation
[edit]Just as an observation, I should point out that you have to be careful when you say "[Michael] has sold at least 50 million records posthumously". What you actually mean is that he has been certified that amount (or near that) after his death. Let's take as an example the first item on your list, Off the Wall: it was certified 7x Multi-platinum on 6 December 1995 and 8x on 21 August 2009. That does not mean, by any chance, that he sold 1 million records after his death (25 June 2009). He had almost 14 years to do that (1995-2009). He was only certified with that amount after his death. That's one of the reasons we can't be sure how many records the artists actually sold. All we can do is estimate. Clausgroi (talk) 03:15, 12 August 2016 (UTC)
- I agree that for example the Off the Wall may have had passed the 7 million (7x Platinum) mark after it received its 7x Platinum in 1995, but had it managed to ship anywhere near the neighborhood of 8 million (8x Platinum) within those 14 years, it would have received its 8th Platinum. Let's bear in mind that Jackson was not selling much records before his death. But that immediately and naturally changed after his unexpected death. We should also consider one other important fact with the US certification levels. They are quite high, 500,000 for Gold and 1 million for Platinum, and unless the album or single reaches the 2 million mark for example, it won't be certified. That said, all of his albums that got certified after his death, may have easily now stand between the certified Platinum level and the next Platinum level. Which can easily be hundreds of thousands of units. --Harout72 (talk) 03:51, 12 August 2016 (UTC)
- Well, he could have sold 500,000 units from 6 December 1995 to 24 June 2009 and another half-million from 25 June to 21 August 2009. Or it might have been 800,000 and 200,000 or any other proportion. That's the problem: we don't know and we can't make inferences because that compromises the reliability of the data. We do know, however, he sold millions of records after his death because some albums, singles and videos were only released after he died. That means all of those sales are posthumous, and those ones we can count as certain. Clausgroi (talk) 19:48, 12 August 2016 (UTC)
- While we don't know the exact amount of sales standing between the Platinum award levels, the re-certification process by the RIAA provides a clear evidence of sales. This method we use on the talk page of the list when upgrading claimed figures, isn't meant to focus on exact sales amounts, but rather evidence of sales. Those albums, however, that have received multiple levels of Platinum awards after June 2009, including Number Ones, provide a clearer picture as to how additional millions in sales we're looking at. Number Ones clearly has sold over 2 million units, as it's been re-certified from Platinum in 2005 to immediately 3x Platinum in August 2009 and then 4x Platinum in 2013. Had it reached 2 million in sales before 2009, it would have received its 2x Platinum. Jackson's death literally resurrected his records sales, at least for a while. Anyways, since we're not going to re-insert the 400 million-which is something I also agree with, by the way-is pointless to take this any further.--Harout72 (talk) 00:46, 13 August 2016 (UTC)
- Well, he could have sold 500,000 units from 6 December 1995 to 24 June 2009 and another half-million from 25 June to 21 August 2009. Or it might have been 800,000 and 200,000 or any other proportion. That's the problem: we don't know and we can't make inferences because that compromises the reliability of the data. We do know, however, he sold millions of records after his death because some albums, singles and videos were only released after he died. That means all of those sales are posthumous, and those ones we can count as certain. Clausgroi (talk) 19:48, 12 August 2016 (UTC)