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Recent images of EastEnders actors

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Hi! I recently noticed that you have been adding images of multiple actors' EastEnders characters in their infoboxes. This should not be done as these files are non-free. The only exception is if the actor is deceased and there is no free images of them. FishLoveHam (talk) 20:39, 9 August 2024 (UTC)[reply]

I apologise. I thought because they were already on the character pages, they must already be free. If you could explain more about it to me, that'd be greatly appreciated as I do want to try be a good editor on the EastEnders part of Wikipedia. EEfamilytrees (talk) 23:19, 9 August 2024 (UTC)[reply]
All I can really encourage you to do is read WP:Non-free content for a better understanding. FishLoveHam (talk) 23:33, 9 August 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Hello again, I just want to know where to start with making new EastEnders articles. Preferably the easiest to help me improve. You seem like a good editor to teach me. EEfamilytrees (talk) 06:08, 13 August 2024 (UTC)[reply]

IMBD

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Hey, I hope you are doing well. I saw that in your edits that you are adding information from IMBD in actor biographies. IMBD is not considered a reliable source and should not be used (though it is permisable for external links), but also the information you are adding (specifically the names of the actors' parents and children) should not be included in the infobox unless it is particularly notable or they have their own Wikipedia article. Please let me know if you have any questions! DaniloDaysOfOurLives (talk) 02:27, 26 August 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Fictional character images

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Hi EEfamilytrees. When you updating fictional character images like File:Tracy Barlow.jpg, it would be a big help if you could also (1) update the file's non-free use rationale to reflect the new image and (2) add Template:Orphaned non-free revisions to the top of the file's page. If, for example, you replace an existing file with a new screenshot you take, adding the name/number of the episode to the |source= parameter of the file's non-free use rationale can help let others know where the image comes from. In addition, revisions of non-free files that are no longer being used are eligible for speedy deletion per WP:F5; so, tagging such files as such just saves a bot or another user from have to do so later on. -- Marchjuly (talk) 01:44, 22 September 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Claudette Hubbard (EastEnders)

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Hi User:EEfamilytrees great work so far! could you please make Claudette Hubbard her own page? Her section is detailed enough for an article. You may have to create it at Claudette Hubbard (EastEnders) due to the page being locked. Thanks!2A00:23EE:16A8:AC55:6064:5D23:B8A9:B7CC (talk) 15:13, 24 September 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Penny page

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I will look at your Penny Branning sandbox later, and I'll leave you feedback here. I'm already unsure about her notability as she has only had one storyline, but I'll keep an open mind. FishLoveHam (talk) 07:36, 25 September 2024 (UTC)[reply]

I did consider that. That’s why I’ve started it early so I can slowly edit it through time before it’s ready. Then that way, my experience can only increase. EEfamilytrees (talk) 15:44, 25 September 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Hello, I hope it's a good time but I'm just reminding you about this just in case you've forgotten as it's been a week. Thanks. :) EEfamilytrees (talk) 11:24, 2 October 2024 (UTC)[reply]

It's been a busy week, but I can now comment on it for you!

Lead
  • The lead of the article is written very in-universe and is not understandable for a general reader. This article should begin with: Penny Branning (any other names) is a fictional character from the BBC soap opera EastEnders. She was played by Mia McKenna-Bruce in 2008 and Kitty Castledine since 2024. Then say she was introduced as Jack's disabled daughter, the timeline of her first stint and return, her storylines, etc.
  • There are excessive citations in the lead, usually citations are only used in the lead if it is to support a quote.
  • This article has a huge problem with original research, and it hampers its quality.
    • "plot device" is not backed up in the article.
  • When introducing a character with an apostrophe, it is better placed after the character's name, not the actor's. Example: "Whitney Dean's (Shona McGarty)", not "Whitney Dean (Shona McGarty)'s"
  • "given a recent management job" the inclusion of "recent" will age like milk, and somewhat violates Wikipedia's policy of in-universe information. "the crowd crush" is written as if the reader knows about it, when that isn't how Wikipedia articles should be written. It isn't a wiki, this should be understandable to a broad general audience.
  • "including" is odd word choice.
Storylines
  • For a character with very few storylines, this section is somewhat inflated. The 2008 can be trimmed to one paragraph, as she appeared in five episodes, and the 2024 section is excessively detailed and full of fluff; namely how the first two paragraphs can be merged and trimmed, how she and Lauren bought their house, her activities at work (especially since it rarely matters to her narrative), giving Eve relationship advice, Lauren's 30th party, visiting her mother, and getting Avani into trouble, these may be semi-enjojyable character moments, but they are not storylines. Generally trimming things appropriately, you only really need France and her arrival, her helping Amy with relationships and relationship(?) with Harry, and her feud with Chelsea and the crush. Additionally, the article begins new paragraphs in odd places, the crush can share a paragraph with the feud with Chelsea.
  • Citation usage here is inconsistent, per MOS:PLOTSOURCE, citations are unnecessary.
  • Easy traps to fall into are introducing characters who aren't important to Penny's narratives, detailing unnecessary encounters, and writing things with a biased perspective.
  • The grammar is rather poor, and this isn't a formal review, so I won't get into it, but it is looking at a start-class rating at best.
Development
  • The creation and casting heading isn't very appropriate for the section, as it fails to delve into her creation and her casting. It also doesn't discuss her new actress, so the heading would more appropriately be named "Original stint" or "2008 stint". It also looks very short, so expansion is possible. I also don't see the necessity to list her appearances here.
  • Outside of the lead and storylines section, you need a citation to back everything up. If not, it could be treated as original research.
  • The block quote is very long, consider cutting parts of it and paraphrasing.
  • Quote marks aren't good, read MOS:CURLY.
  • Again, new paragraphs are taken when unneeded, the last two of the "return" section can be merged.
  • Try to expand the "personality" section.
  • The relationships section isn't great, just repeating storylines. The Jack Branning heading is particularly blatant, as it is original research. The Chelsea Fox section at least has a quote, but even then it isn't substantial commentary on their relationship. My advice would be to remove the Jack Branning section.
Reception
Other

At the bottom of the page, add: template:reflist, template:EastEnders characters, and any appropriate categories.

Hello, Juliette Dubois repeatedly called her Penelope. And yes, I'll do the category thing now. Thanks for all your help. :) EEfamilytrees (talk) 14:59, 5 October 2024 (UTC)[reply]
No worries, if her full name is Penelope, it's better to put that in the infobox next to the "alias" parameter.
add
| alias = Penelope Branning
to the infobox, and change the lead to "Penny Branning is..." Generally, it's not great to use two names in the intro unless the character frequently goes by both. (eg. Tom "Rocky" Cotton and Fatboy) FishLoveHam (talk) 15:03, 5 October 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Yeah, that's fair. It'll just confuse the audience. EEfamilytrees (talk) 15:50, 5 October 2024 (UTC)[reply]

November 2024

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Information icon Please do not use styles that are nonstandard, unusual, inappropriate or difficult to understand in articles. There is a Manual of Style, and edits should not deliberately go against it without special reason. Suggesting you check-out MOS:DATETOPRES and MOS:SINCE. Wikipedia has an ever-evolving style manual for their articles to follow. livelikemusic (TALK!) 23:45, 25 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Lee and Vinny

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Have you considered making pages for Lee Carter and Vinny Panesar?

Lee Carter especially his section is getting VERY long and could do with a dedicated wikipedia entry. With his depression storyline i believe there's enough there to warrant one.

With Vinny, i find it surprising he hasn't received one but characters like Aaron Monroe, Mila Mawa and his brother Jags have?

Outside of the presentation of duration, your work on the pages has been fantastic. GuyFromEE (talk) 17:11, 16 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Thanks, but yeah, of course, I could do that. There's a few characters who have been here years who I think only don't have pages because they're disliked, mainly Vinny and Bernadette. EEfamilytrees (talk) 17:20, 16 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]
That could be reason. Not sure that should be the barometer for who gets a page (not accusing you of that at all) personally.
If you could that would be fantastic. Keep up the good work! GuyFromEE (talk) 18:57, 16 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

@EEfamilytrees: @GuyFromEE: I read this thread as I was writing another message on this page. I just wanted to give two points:

1.) I currently have an offline draft for Lee Carter that I started a few weeks ago, I am hoping to publish it some point in 2025.

2.) Guys, I think you have seriously misinterpreted about characters being "disliked". Editors are able to make pages for whoever/whatever they would like, as long as it meets notability guidelines and is well sources, neutral and not plagiarised. I have many EastEnders character and episode drafts but some I have prioritised over others for various reasons, not because they are "disliked" - for example, I have had drafts for Donna and Carmel for ages (among many many others) just because I have been so busy and I have known that they would take me a long time. I have seen 3 editors who started drafts for Bernadette but it can get a bit overwhelming when there is so much info. I also disagree with the criticism about Aaron, Mila and Jags having pages - they are characters who received significant coverage and the pages show that, especially Mila with her FGM storyline which was a first of a kind for soap operas and the far right storyline for Aaron. You are of course welcome to request pages (on the basis that you know that editors are allowed to say no and/or take their time), but criticising pages that have already made that already meet GNG can be seen as rude towards editors that have put the hard work in. DaniloDaysOfOurLives (talk) 05:05, 21 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

I think you've misinterpreted the energy of this conversation. No one was accusing you mate. Just naturally commenting. It wasn't criticism of Aaron, Jags etc more surprise that long term characters like Lee, Bernadette etc haven't received one.
Keep up the good work. GuyFromEE (talk) 12:53, 21 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Yeah, I apologise for that. If anything, it shows that the WikiProject improving if recent characters are getting pages faster than ever. For example, Nicola Mitchell's page being made a 'good' article which is great. EEfamilytrees (talk) 14:45, 21 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Sections

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Hey, I hope you are doing well. I wanted to let you know that I have reverted some of your recent changes as the storyline sections do not need to be set up per each stint, especially very short ones - some only had two sentences - so they should be merged if they are relatively short. They should only have separate sections if they are very long. I understand that you were just trying to help, I just wanted to let you know. Also, could you please use an edit summary to explain your changes? Please let me if you have any questions. DaniloDaysOfOurLives (talk) 04:55, 21 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Yeah, course. I understand. EEfamilytrees (talk) 14:45, 21 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]
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