Template:Did you know nominations/Cistern of Pulcheria
- The following is an archived discussion of the DYK nomination of the article below. Please do not modify this page. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as this nomination's talk page, the article's talk page or Wikipedia talk:Did you know), unless there is consensus to re-open the discussion at this page. No further edits should be made to this page.
The result was: promoted by PrimalMustelid talk 17:44, 17 April 2024 (UTC)
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Cistern of Pulcheria
... that the Cistern of Pulcheria in Constantinople has been used by weavers until the beginning of last century?Source: "Elle etait encore utilisee par des tisserands au debut du XXe siecle..." Janin (1964), p204ALT1: ... that the Cistern of Pulcheria is one of the best well kept byzantine water reservoirs in Istanbul?Source: "La citerne...est une des mieux conservees." Janin (1964, p. 204- Reviewed: Template:Did you know nominations/Maggio di Accettura, Template:Did you know nominations/William O. Raymond
Created by Alessandro57 (talk). Self-nominated at 14:02, 17 March 2024 (UTC).
Number of QPQs required: 2. DYK is currently in unreviewed backlog mode and nominator has 79 past nominations.
Post-promotion hook changes will be logged on the talk page; consider watching the nomination until the hook appears on the Main Page.
New enough, long enough, within policy. The hook is nice and supported by an inline citation (off-line source AGF). No image. No QPQ has been done, once two have been made this should be ready. Yakikaki (talk) 20:24, 18 March 2024 (UTC)- @Alessandro57: A second QPQ is required because we are in backlog mode.
- @Alessandro57: A second QPQ is required because we are in backlog mode. (Forgot to sign.) Sammi Brie (she/her • t • c) 03:41, 31 March 2024 (UTC)
- @Sammy Brie:, second QPQ done. Alex2006 (talk) 10:10, 4 April 2024 (UTC)
- @Alessandro57: A second QPQ is required because we are in backlog mode. (Forgot to sign.) Sammi Brie (she/her • t • c) 03:41, 31 March 2024 (UTC)
Good to go. Yakikaki (talk) 14:08, 4 April 2024 (UTC)
- @Sammi Brie and Alessandro57: In my opinion ALT0 is confusing and incomplete in the way it was written. ALT1 also needs some copyediting. I am wondering if it is a machine translation because it sounds redundant "one of the best well kept". Some other sentences in the article that may need to be copyedited "The main reason for the identification is the position of the cistern within the quarter" or "Its main facade is pierced by 4 windows". Also I cannot access the references to check. Bruxton (talk) 16:54, 13 April 2024 (UTC)
- @Bruxton:, Sorry, this is mainly on me as a reviewer. For ALT1, I actually had in mind correcting the grammar/asking the nominator to fix it, but somehow it slipped my mind. Apologies for that; it should be easily enough fixed, though. I cleaned up the article a bit concerning the language. It is certainly awkwardly written, but generally I found it to be acceptable, given that the DYK criteria are quite weak on language/grammar. As for the concerns about ALT0, I don't quite see the problem, could you please explain what you find problematic? Two of the sources are AGF, the other one I can access. Happy to discuss this review further, of course. Best, Yakikaki (talk) 20:49, 13 April 2024 (UTC)
- @Bruxton:, @Alessandro57: Now that Bruxton brought it up, I did a quick comparison with the Italian version of the article. As it happens I understand Italian reasonably well, and it appears that this is a clear copy of the Italian language version, written by the same user. This was not clear either from the nomination nor from the talk page of the article. I am unsure whether or not it impacts the review process, but for transparency's sake I think it should be addressed. Yakikaki (talk) 21:00, 13 April 2024 (UTC)
- I have added a translation tag and have someone who's going to clean up the prose. Let's try rewritten ALT0 and ALT1: Sammi Brie (she/her • t • c) 04:03, 14 April 2024 (UTC)
- @Sammi Brie: sorry for the ping, I now see that you were not the reviewer. Bruxton (talk) 20:54, 14 April 2024 (UTC)
- I have added a translation tag and have someone who's going to clean up the prose. Let's try rewritten ALT0 and ALT1: Sammi Brie (she/her • t • c) 04:03, 14 April 2024 (UTC)
- @Bruxton:, @Alessandro57: Now that Bruxton brought it up, I did a quick comparison with the Italian version of the article. As it happens I understand Italian reasonably well, and it appears that this is a clear copy of the Italian language version, written by the same user. This was not clear either from the nomination nor from the talk page of the article. I am unsure whether or not it impacts the review process, but for transparency's sake I think it should be addressed. Yakikaki (talk) 21:00, 13 April 2024 (UTC)
- @Bruxton:, Sorry, this is mainly on me as a reviewer. For ALT1, I actually had in mind correcting the grammar/asking the nominator to fix it, but somehow it slipped my mind. Apologies for that; it should be easily enough fixed, though. I cleaned up the article a bit concerning the language. It is certainly awkwardly written, but generally I found it to be acceptable, given that the DYK criteria are quite weak on language/grammar. As for the concerns about ALT0, I don't quite see the problem, could you please explain what you find problematic? Two of the sources are AGF, the other one I can access. Happy to discuss this review further, of course. Best, Yakikaki (talk) 20:49, 13 April 2024 (UTC)
... that the Byzantine Cistern of Pulcheria was used by Constantinople weavers until the start of the 20th century?Source: "Elle etait encore utilisee par des tisserands au debut du XXe siecle..." Janin (1964), p204- ALT1: ... that the Cistern of Pulcheria is one of the best-conserved Byzantine reservoirs in Istanbul? Source: "La citerne...est une des mieux conservees." Janin (1964, p. 204
- Hallo @Yakikaki: @Sammi Brie: I removed the translation tag since it is the other way around. How you can see from the time stamps, the article in English is older than the article in Italian. Since I am Italian, and my English is far from perfect, in order to improve my proficiency I usually write my article in English (it was written on User:Alessandro57/sandbox3) and then I translate it in parallel into Italian. However, my origin is betrayed by the many italianisms and italian calques and constructs which clutter the article, which is definitively "awkwardly written". Thanks for copyediting it, the article definitively needs it!
- Regarding the hook, I don't understand the problem. Why is it confusing? Anyway, if it has to be changed, I would prefer this, which is slightly different:
ALT2 that the Byzantine Cistern of Pulcheria in Istanbul was used as a weavers' cottage until the start of the 20th century?Source: "Elle etait encore utilisee par des tisserands au debut du XXe siecle..." Janin (1964), p204
- @Sammi Brie:, I had a look and it seems the article has been copyedited a bit now. Shall I consider the review again with the new ALTs now? Or are we waiting for more copyediting? @Alessandro57:, thanks for your explanation, I don't think this is a very big problem in the end. It's great that you're contributing also to English Wikipedia, and I found the article interesting, so don't worry to much about it. Best, Yakikaki (talk) 19:03, 15 April 2024 (UTC)
- @Yakikaki: You are the lead reviewer with the call to approve the nomination. Sammi Brie (she/her • t • c) 19:22, 15 April 2024 (UTC)
- @Alessandro57: There are now two tags ("clarification needed" and "contradictory") in the article. Do you think you could address those? I'm ready to take a fresh look at the nomination. Yakikaki (talk) 19:32, 15 April 2024 (UTC)
- @Yakikaki: You are the lead reviewer with the call to approve the nomination. Sammi Brie (she/her • t • c) 19:22, 15 April 2024 (UTC)
OK, it seems the issues raised by @Bruxton: have been resolved as far as possible. I'm giving the green light for the adjusted ALT1 above (the one without strikethrough), although I still don't get what was wrong with the original hook about the cistern being used by weavers. ALT2 is misleading since a weaver's cottage was a particularly British institution. Thanks again to @Alessandro57: for your patience and for contributing with an interesting article - I hope to see more of them on English Wikipedia in the future! Yakikaki (talk) 15:30, 17 April 2024 (UTC)