Talk:Zuni fetishes

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To do to improve

Format so that the very first line introducing the article is more clear.
Establish stronger ties between this article and maybe the "Zuni mythology" article
Break into smaller, more digestable sections
citations, citations, citations!

CJLippert 21:56, 24 September 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Fair use rationale for Image:Zuni1.jpg

Image:Zuni1.jpg is being used on this article. I notice the image page specifies that the image is being used under fair use but there is no explanation or rationale as to why its use in this Wikipedia article constitutes fair use. In addition to the boilerplate fair use template, you must also write out on the image description page a specific explanation or rationale for why using this image in each article is consistent with fair use.

Please go to the image description page and edit it to include a fair use rationale. Using one of the templates at Wikipedia:Fair use rationale guideline is an easy way to insure that your image is in compliance with Wikipedia policy, but remember that you must complete the template. Do not simply insert a blank template on an image page.

If there is other fair use media, consider checking that you have specified the fair use rationale on the other images used on this page. Note that any fair use images lacking such an explanation can be deleted one week after being tagged, as described on criteria for speedy deletion. If you have any questions please ask them at the Media copyright questions page. Thank you.

BetacommandBot (talk) 03:24, 12 February 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Fair use rationale for Image:Zuni2.jpg

Image:Zuni2.jpg is being used on this article. I notice the image page specifies that the image is being used under fair use but there is no explanation or rationale as to why its use in this Wikipedia article constitutes fair use. In addition to the boilerplate fair use template, you must also write out on the image description page a specific explanation or rationale for why using this image in each article is consistent with fair use.

Please go to the image description page and edit it to include a fair use rationale. Using one of the templates at Wikipedia:Fair use rationale guideline is an easy way to insure that your image is in compliance with Wikipedia policy, but remember that you must complete the template. Do not simply insert a blank template on an image page.

If there is other fair use media, consider checking that you have specified the fair use rationale on the other images used on this page. Note that any fair use images lacking such an explanation can be deleted one week after being tagged, as described on criteria for speedy deletion. If you have any questions please ask them at the Media copyright questions page. Thank you.

BetacommandBot (talk) 03:24, 12 February 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Fair use rationale for Image:Zuni3.jpg

Image:Zuni3.jpg is being used on this article. I notice the image page specifies that the image is being used under fair use but there is no explanation or rationale as to why its use in this Wikipedia article constitutes fair use. In addition to the boilerplate fair use template, you must also write out on the image description page a specific explanation or rationale for why using this image in each article is consistent with fair use.

Please go to the image description page and edit it to include a fair use rationale. Using one of the templates at Wikipedia:Fair use rationale guideline is an easy way to insure that your image is in compliance with Wikipedia policy, but remember that you must complete the template. Do not simply insert a blank template on an image page.

If there is other fair use media, consider checking that you have specified the fair use rationale on the other images used on this page. Note that any fair use images lacking such an explanation can be deleted one week after being tagged, as described on criteria for speedy deletion. If you have any questions please ask them at the Media copyright questions page. Thank you.

BetacommandBot (talk) 03:24, 12 February 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Fair use rationale for Image:Zuni4.jpg

Image:Zuni4.jpg is being used on this article. I notice the image page specifies that the image is being used under fair use but there is no explanation or rationale as to why its use in this Wikipedia article constitutes fair use. In addition to the boilerplate fair use template, you must also write out on the image description page a specific explanation or rationale for why using this image in each article is consistent with fair use.

Please go to the image description page and edit it to include a fair use rationale. Using one of the templates at Wikipedia:Fair use rationale guideline is an easy way to insure that your image is in compliance with Wikipedia policy, but remember that you must complete the template. Do not simply insert a blank template on an image page.

If there is other fair use media, consider checking that you have specified the fair use rationale on the other images used on this page. Note that any fair use images lacking such an explanation can be deleted one week after being tagged, as described on criteria for speedy deletion. If you have any questions please ask them at the Media copyright questions page. Thank you.

BetacommandBot (talk) 03:25, 12 February 2008 (UTC)[reply]

New title?

Kewa Pueblo, Hopi, and Navajo all carved fetishes prior to the non-Native market for fetishes that began in the 20th century. Unsure of the best new name to reflect the reality, perhaps Fetish carving? Ahalenia (talk) 16:54, 15 December 2020 (UTC)Ahalenia[reply]

Does the historical representation need the caveat "may not be accurate"

I challenged the addition "may not be accurate" [1] because I didn't think it was necessary (edit summary "should be sourced if it's beyond the normal anything-could-be-inaccurate"). To elaborate, it seems that any 2D drawing of a 3D clay fetish will be inaccurate, and a suggestion that it may be inaccurate is only appropriate if there is some unusual suspicion of the attempt (e.g. the sketch artist did not seem to know what horns were, and routinely depicted them as large ears).

The reader will likely view, on an electronic display device, a scanned capture of a drawing presumed to document the clay figures depicting various objects and ideas. There's some serious multi-layered Ceci n’est pas un pipe going on here. In my opinion it's not informative to say "may not be accurate" unless there's a special reason to do so. _signed,Willondon (talk) 23:55, 8 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Hi @Willondon, and thank you for your note here. It's not a big deal to me if the sentence is removed (I didn't notice it was you who removed it the first time, I figured I forgot to hit "publish".) You are right that because the statement is unsourced, it could be considered original research.

The photographs I am looking at are of older, historical Zuni fetishes are not so idealized as the ones depicted in this report from 1880. Some of these are in the collections of the Smithsonian Institution, and the BIA's Zuni Archaeological Project (some of these objects date from circa 650 A.D. - ancestral to the modern Zuni). For example, see here for what some of these objects looked like: [2]

To be honest, I guess I'm not a huge fan of Cushing and the Stevenson's work, as between the three of them, they removed ("looted") over 20,000 objects from the Zuni and other Puebloans - see: ^[1]

Nevertheless, I will not restore the sentence in the caption again unless I find an independent source to back up the specific claim. Best regards, Netherzone (talk) 00:23, 9 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

References

^ Clemmer, Richard O. (2011). "Museum Collections and the Search for "Authentic Historical Consciousness" in the Age of Nationalist Imperialism" (PDF). Anthropos. 106: 69–85. doi:10.5771/0257-9774-2011-1-69.

Netherzone (talk) 00:23, 9 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

I leave it to your judgement. I may have been triggered by those product instructions that tell you to heed, but not why. "Do not place the rocking chair where it will be exposed to extensive periods of direct sunlight." Why, will it eventually burst into flames? More likely the finish will fade from its original colour. Thanks for telling me. The "may be inaccurate" just struck me as something that needed further verification. It seems the sources you have might do that. _signed,Willondon (talk) 00:44, 9 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Thank you, and thanks for the laugh...do not place the rocking chair in the sun...for it might burst into flames.

I'm not 100% convinced the objects in the illustration are Zuni, they look much more like they were made by the people of Cochiti Pueblo. I am finding very little about clay/ceramic Zuni fetishes rather than carved and ornamented stone. In Rodee and Ostler's book "The Fetish Carvers of Zuni" (Maxwell Museum, U. of New Mexico and the Pueblo of Zuni publishers) I find a single photograph of a simple, no detail nor surface paint, fetish of a turkey on page 19. Everything else is stone. Nevertheless, it's nice meeting you here, and thanks for your interest in these fascinating little sculptures. Netherzone (talk) 01:03, 9 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

[Anthropos-Clemmer-1] Clemmer, Richard O. (2011). "Museum Collections and the Search for "Authentic Historical Consciousness" in the Age of Nationalist Imperialism" (PDF). Anthropos. 106: 69–85. doi:10.5771/0257-9774-2011-1-69.

[1]