Talk:Yarri (Wiradjuri)/Archive 1

Archive 1

Murder of Baxter

No cite in the article shows the link between this Yarri and the Yarri who murdered Baxter. Withoutout this link this article is not verifiable by the reader. 124.171.71.98 (talk) 05:22, 11 October 2015 (UTC)

More Yarri/Yarry/Yarree

Which actions does Yarri park celebrate? The murders of young girls and their immediate replacement? The Hargreaves reference is not a good one. The Horsley sundial was in the main Gundagai Park but Gundagai Council wrecked that park all the time wasting a lot of public money to do so, and banished the sundial to elsewhere. Re the Eyre expedition, Yarri and Joey are recorded at Gundagai by Eyre but that paper also defines the route from Gundagai early explorers took, i.e. down the right hand bank of the Murrumbidgee post Gundagai and that route is significant. Sturt also took that same route in 1829. Sturt and Eyre were neighbours. People map where the explorers went without considering time of year, Aboriginal activity in some areas and Aboriginal sites that must be detoured around. Johneen Treanor Jones, Gundagai - cousin of Dr Vallack from the Rattlesnake Kennedy Relief Expedition and cousin of one of the Antarctic Explorers. Get the routes correct! — Preceding unsigned comment added by 144.139.225.157 (talk) 04:49, 13 September 2013 (UTC)

Johneen Jones is not a cousin of Dr Vallack of the Rattlesnake Kennedy Relief Expedition!! A total fantasy!! — Preceding unsigned comment added by 59.101.68.163 (talk) 09:49, 6 February 2016 (UTC)

Yarri/Yarree/Yarry

Yarree was not from Brungle at all. He was from Adelong/Tumblong/Grahamestown area south of Gundagai. His father was Robert King of Adelong. Yarree was part Aboriginal. So was the young girl he murdered. Neither were "half Caste" which is a fully ridiculous term especially in 2013 and this is not the sub continent. Descendents of these people are still around this general area. J. TREANOR JONES, WHAT IS YOUR SOURCE OR REFERENCE TO MAKE THE STATEMENT THAT YARRI'S FATHER WAS ROBERT KING FROM ADELONG? YOU CANNOT JUST MAKE A STATEMENT ABOUT WHO HIS FATHER WAS, WITHOUT EVIDENCE. CITE YOUR SOURCES!!

 J. Treanor Jones

Gundagai (direct descendent of 1852 Gundagai Flood survivors Samuel and Maryanne True and the person who outed Yarree the murderer of several young women replacing them as quickly as he did away with them, and his Eyre expedition antics.) — Preceding unsigned comment added by 144.138.154.157 (talk) 08:51, 3 September 2013 (UTC)

This comment is totally incorrect. There is no proof that Yarrie, the hero of the 1852 flood at Gundagai is the same person who was alleged to have murdered Sally McLeod in 1852. The 1852 flood hero was not the son of Robert King of Adelong and the 1852 flood hero was a full blooded indiginous man and he has no known descendents in the Gundagai district. None of the footnotes on the Yarri (Wiradjuri) page are relevant to the text. I thought that any entries on Wikipedia had to quote a source? Why is "sub-continent" mentioned? That is the term for India. Gundagai is not in India!! — Preceding unsigned comment added by 59.101.68.163 (talk) 09:54, 6 February 2016 (UTC) CITE YOUR SOURCES!!

GaryVines(English)

Gary Vines, was Yarri a Wiradjuri speaker? He may not have spoken Wiradjuri at all as the Gundagai/Adelong/Tumblong area was the meeting point of several language groups. There was likely a type of pidgin spoken that was a mixture of Aboriginal dialects and English given the location, and the time since invasion first happened plus cross cultural aspects. The only locational descriptors I have seen for one Yarree/Yarri/Yarry of the Eyre Expedition, of the 1852 flood and of the murders of young women was that "he was from the Murray and Murrumbidgee Rivers" and that "he was from the Sydney District". Gundagai in those days was in the Sydney District as opposed to being in the Port Phillip District. Johneen Treanor Jones. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 144.139.225.122 (talk) 03:03, 23 September 2013 (UTC)

Why is "Johneen Jones" suddenly "Johneen Treanor Jones"?. Is it an alias? Gundagai was never in the Sydney district. Why is Yarri the Gundagai flood hero, mentioned in the same sentence as the Eyre Expedition, and some murder, as the flood hero had nothing to so with any murder anywhere!! — Preceding unsigned comment added by 59.101.68.163 (talk) 10:00, 6 February 2016 (UTC)

The Treanor in my name above is my real surname. It was changed in the 1840s to Jones likely as my great grandmum did not want an Irish surname when she married as she was from Devon/Cornwall. I am almost ready to insert the Treanor into my name as above by deed poll but have been using it in preparation for that as the Gundagai Court House and Gundagai Council well know. I now have the proof, context and correct spelling of the Treanor part of my name. 'We' always knew we had another surname but did not know the context or the correct spelling but it is recorded now in one of the official World databases. My aunt even used the Treanor middle name when she married and all her uncles were baptised with Treanor/Trainor as their middle name. My aunt's husband husband fought at Gallipoli so that might indicate our generations are a bit out of kilter with my own dad being born in the 1880s. I am not an incognito who blogs here with anything but my legal name or with no name unlike you. Gundagai once was in the Sydney District. Yarri who saved lives in the 1852 Gunbagai flood was a drovers boy on the Eyre expedition but when he got out of his own country he and Joey got the willies so murdered Baxter and returned back NE. My family who came to Gundagai in 1848 knew that story so if you are just a not knowe, please be aware of your own insufficiency re specialist Gundagai knowledge. and go try your vitriol elserwhere. Johneen Treanor Jones — Preceding unsigned comment added by 101.190.224.92 (talk) 07:51, 21 June 2016 (UTC)

Hi Unsigned; Not sure what you are getting to - My previous edits on the Gundagai article were just to clean up some of the more irrelevant bits - hence the separate Gundagai Lore article. It is not a subject I am particularly familiar with, but if you think there is material needing correcting, why not just have a go at it.Garyvines (talk) 02:01, 7 February 2016 (UTC)

Baxter

The nameless contributor again above. It is recorded in the NLA Digitised newspapers that Eyre picked up Yarri at Gundagai. I have other records but the NSW Southern Aboriginal Heritage Unit at Queanbeyan (Paul House son of Matilda), tell me I can only use material that is on public access, I cannot put that reference as it is in a NSW Southern Heritage unit publication that is not on public access but was given to me by a genuine Gundagai local Aboriginal Elder as opposed to a Gundgaai area Aboriginal person not from this area. There is another published reference also too but that is for my research and I do not really care if it is never put here for the belligerent fisherman to weezil access to as I know what is what and basically, that is why I research this content i.e. for my own information so I know this highly significant country of mine as well as I can. My very old dad also had the story of Yarri and Eyre. In his era, it was well known content about Gundagai unlike the many around Gundagai these days who know little abotu anything much that is local Gundagai content and who try to grab it from those who do know. I am intending posting photos of the Gundagai Aboriginal burial ground at Gundagai in the next few weeks. Gary Vines, would that be OK? I am really concerned re what the former Gundagai Shire Council and new merged Gundagai Council are doing to Aboriginal sites at Gundagai, (wrecking them), so need to post images of some places so they go on the public record as existing where they do. Gundagai Council is going to erect a statue of the paedophile and murderer Yarrree (Coonong Dennamundinna) in our main street and are applying for a Cross of Valor for Yarri that will be presented to some ring in claimed relatives. I know whose Yarri's direct descendents at Gundagai are and I am betting it wont be who Gundagai Council comes up with. I won't say who the direct desacendents are as it is up to them to say and now I am told they have no proof but I sent proof to the senior family member a few weeks back but it was not passed on. It looks like I may have to do a genealogical tree on that family though the fmaily should do it. I may not though as why should I bother, really. My grandad Edward True - (look him up on Trove digitised newspapers), won two bravery awards in the 1800s and if they had ever been coveted to be used as a tourist attraction for the nutcase former Gundagai Shire Council as a tourist attraction it would have been a disgrace. As it was the Gundagai Museum stole one award that had been loaned to them by my mum but I eventually got it back. Gundagai town is doing Yarri as a tourist attraction and want that Cross of Valor as a tourist attraction. So much for the integrity of all other Bravery Awards made by Australia. Johneen Treanor Jones - Gundagai — Preceding unsigned comment added by 101.190.224.92 (talk) 08:12, 21 June 2016 (UTC)

Yarree Descendents

Yarree does have direct descendants at Gundagai. My Mum used to say sometimes when they drove into the Gundgaai football park that"they are Yarree's family". Then in 1988, the senior member of that family told me he was a direct descendant of Yarree. I did not say to him "I know that" but I did think it. Then when Gundagai Council began hustling to get a bravery award re Yarree to use as a tourist attraction I came across documents relating to Yarree. Before that though I saw a record at the Gundagai library about Yarree visiting his daughter. I have long known of Yarrees Tumblong Luff link as one of the Tumblong Luffs was my siblings close friends so my Mum mentioned their connection (Issacs), but I was not to say. As well, another of my sister's friends married one o the Lindleys who was also a cousin many times removed from Yarree. That Lindley has been pushing this Yarree the disgusting biped glorification at Gundagai. Also, a very eminent Australian notes some of the genealogy of Yarree's family. There are also photos. It is slightly convuluted but very very provable so the little silly claim here re no proof, is totally silly and designed to try to get me to put proof here. The people who have to say who they are if they want to, are Yarrees direct descendants but that is up to them. I think the Awards people at Canberra need verification of connection re any award. Any bravery award cannot just be handed to anyone or to Gundagai Museum as given that establishments record, they will steal it. It is not up to me to 'out' Yarree's direct descendents. I really only came across the Yarree content as I have been researching some of the young Aboriginal guides who guided the explorers through this Gundagai area and it was the brother of Jacky Jacky, another Gundagai 1852 Flood rescuer, (There were several of them, not just two), that I was following up. I have no real interest in the 1852 Gundagai flood even though my grandparents survived it, but were not rescued, nor do I have any real interest in paedophilic and murderous Yarree. I do not like lies and deception though or damage to Aboriginal sites and that seems to be what Gundagai Council and a few others in Gundagai, run on. That 1852 flood was so bad as there was a dam built near Brungle (to create waves to push harvested kara pines downstream), and it collapsed which is why the water level was so high at Gundagai and that just gets ignored totally. Lies get told about the 1852 Flood in some tourism quest to have it beat the Lockyer Valley flood. Its all very sickening. Also, the Gundagai burbung ground is where the Old Gundagai site is and Gundagai Council have been letting the Nowra Mud Wallowers (Mud Sweat and Beers) dig that highly significant and documented Aboriginal site up in recent years which is a total disgrace. Johneeen Treanor Jones - Gundagai — Preceding unsigned comment added by 101.190.224.92 (talk) 08:48, 21 June 2016 (UTC)

IF YOU THINK THAT YARRI HAS DESCENDANTS, YOU MUST HAVE PROOF OR EVIDENCE  -  CITE YOUR SOURCES!!  YOU MAY BE CORRECT, BUT YOU CANNOT JUST MAKE A STATEMENT ABOUT POSSBILE DESCENDANTS, UNLESS YOU HAVE EVIDENCE, OR PROOF. I THOUGHT WIKIPEDIA DID NOT ACCEPT INFORMATION UNLESS SOURCES WERE CITED? 

I thought this person"s name was "Johneen Jones". Why has she suddenly changed her name to "Treanor Jones"? Is it an alias? How can she "out" Yarrie the flood hero as a murderer, when he clearly was not a murderer, but a hero!! — Preceding unsigned comment added by 59.101.68.163 (talk) 09:56, 6 February 2016 (UTC)

Also A Book

There is also a book with many entries for Yarree's family in it. I have a copy of that book. Johneen Treanor Jones - Gundagai. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 101.190.224.92 (talk) 08:56, 21 June 2016 (UTC)

Photo

Several months ago, one of the Gundagai Council lackeys was inappropriately hassling me re a photo of Yarree that was reputedly at the Gundagai Museum. I used to volunteer at the Gundagai Museum. I told that hassler that there was no photo of Yarre at the Gundagai Museum when I was there which is correct. I just had a brainwave. That photo was likely of a descendant of Yarree, the 1852 Flood rescuer and had been misidentified as being a photo of Yarree the 1852 Gundagai Flood rescuer. My reply to that person who was giving me the third degree re a photo was "would anyone in Gundagai have had a camera in 1852?" and"had cameras been invented by then?" That photo if it is it, is online. The name Yarree is about 'red' and or redgums. It is a property name but is also relevant to a red mark. As with nicknames in rural areas, sons sometimes get the nickname of their dad and grandad etc. As one of the restricted access documents show, there were several Yarrees around Gundagai and elsewhere in NSW in the 1800s. if that photo I know was at the Museum, it was of someone born in the Lachlan area, not of anyone born at Adelong/Tumblong or the Coonong. Yarree the flood rescurer was a total sex maniac who is recorded as having had several 'wives' plus used to run around exposing himself and stealing. When his wives would no longer oblige his attentions he used to kill them and bury them along the Gocup Rd which the Lindleys still hold a lot of property along. Along there is called Doctors Hill and one farmer told me that was named for a cow that got lost up there but the name refers to the Aboriginal Clever Men's hill. It is part of a very special area along there that the moths used to travel to, from the plains to the west and the big moth feasts used to happen there. I hope you are all watching 'Cleverman' at 9.30pm on the ABC on Thursdays. The first three episodes are also available on ABC iView. Johneeen Treanor Jones - Gundagai. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 101.190.224.92 (talk) 09:30, 21 June 2016 (UTC)

Descendants

I now know descendants of Yarree, the 1852 Flood rescuer, and they live at Gundagai. It has already been substantiated that they are the descendants of Yarree. If you know better re the already substantiated direct descendants of Yarree then produce it. I notice in the last Gundagai Council Meeting Minutes they claim that AIATSIS claim they have material. NB There was more than one Yarri around Gundagai as that word is a nickname not a traditional name and as with nicknames, they can get passed down or the meaning of that nickname used for someone else with similar elements. As a Gundagai local who is a direct descendant of 1852 Gundagai Flood survivors, when the word "Yarri" is used in my hearing it refers to the 1852 Flood rescuer and the murderer of an explorer and a person who "interfered with children", i.e. Coonong Dennamundinna aka Yarree.

I mentioned the sub-continent as that is where the 'caste' system operates. Someone used 'caste' in the article. Its an inappropriate term when referring to Australian Aboriginal divisions. The caste system does not and has never operated in Australia. Divisions are via skin/moiety and totem. Johneen Treanor Jones - Gundagai — Preceding unsigned comment added by 101.190.46.74 (talk) 09:02, 22 June 2016 (UTC)

Eminent Australian Identified Yarri's Family

The person in the photo above, a copy of which may or may not have a been at the Gundagai Museum, and which is also online, is the same person noted by a very eminent Australian as being the son of the Gundagai Flood rescuer. I only found that identification a few years ago, many years after the senior member of Yarri the 1852 Gundagai Flood direct descendant told me in 1988 that his family were direct descendants of the 1852 Gundagai Flood rescuer known as Yarri. What that eminent Australian stated, totally supported what I was told in 1988. Johneeen Treanor Jones - Gundagai — Preceding unsigned comment added by 101.190.224.92 (talk) 10:12, 21 June 2016 (UTC)

Please provide a source for "The Eminent Australian who identified Yarri's family or descendants". You cannot just make statements with no source or no references. Who is this eminent Australian? This statement is valueless until a source is named. What is your proof that Yarri has present day descendants. What proof is there that the Yarri who killed Baxter in the Eyre expedition of 1841 is the same Yarri/Yarry/Yarrie who was the hero of the 1852 Gundagai flood? These names were common indigenous names in the 19th century. I have found references to various people named Yarri/Yarry/Yarrie etc. across Australia. Also the 1852 flood hero was supposed to have been a youth in 1852. So eleven years earlier in 1841, I would guess that Yarri of Gundagai may have only been a very young child. And very unlikely to have been a part of the Eyre expedition! CITE YOUR SOURCES!! — Preceding unsigned comment added by 210.10.135.129 (talk) 09:49, 22 December 2016 (UTC)

Eminent Australian

I do not have to provide that source to you, the anonymous blogger here, (if you cannot identify yourself then you could be someone from outer space), or wikipedia. I have only noted that content here in 'Talk' as background on Yarree's descendent family, not on the article page. I have though provided who that eminent Australian is to Yarre's descendent family and I have also told the Australian Public Service guy in Canberra in charge of Australia's Honours Awards, that I have that source. Some Gundagai people are after my research without having any right to access it. They want it for tourism purposes. They are trying to bypass the fact that Yarree's descendent family live in Gundagai perhaps to get access to bravery awards that are not theirs? Would that not be misappropriation? They imagine I will just hand my research over to them. I won't as the information in it is not theirs unless Yarrees actual family release it. They do not have a right to know who that eminent Australin is unless Yarree's descendent family release it. I will also amend my description of that "eminent Australian" to it being a VERY,VERY eminent Australian. Johneen Treanor Jones - Gundagai — Preceding unsigned comment added by 121.212.55.139 (talk) 07:29, 18 March 2017 (UTC)

Not much Sense of Australian History

"Also the 1852 flood hero was supposed to have been a youth in 1852." Didn't you belong to Girl Guides or Scouts? We used to play a game about repeating False Truth and Rumours. It was recently guessed by the former Gundagai Council GM, a former mayor and several Brungle Aboriginal people that Yarree was a youth in 1851. That was published in the Statue Committee's meeting document in the former Gundagai Council Business paper in I think, 2015. I always read those Business Papers. They would be available from the new merged council. I likely have that Business Paper here but am not going to go find it. So, that Yarree was a youth in 1851 was a guess and that is published by the delusionals. You seem not to have much of a grip on the colonial contact story at all so why are you here trying to get parts of my research. If you do not have historical research skills maybe you should give up. These days we do not let our young children go wandering through the undiscovered wilds of Australia with overlanders droving large heads of stock down to Melb and Adelaide. In the 1840s, given that Gundagai was such an important point for those overlanders and the road from Sydney and the coast already discovered so the track well known, the overlanders did not need guides to guide them through the Australian bush till they got to Gundagai - WOULD THEY HAVE! Young Aboriginal boys were then hired on to the overland teams - AT GUNDAGAI. They were hired to show the way, to lead the pack horses and to likely share the adult drovers swags of a night time as those bipeds were scant on women to pleasure their nights. Ted Egan wrote a song about it called the Drovers Boy who was really a girl in that instance. Thus, Gundagai was the place for adults to hire young children to take them out in the wilds of the Australian bush and to do whatever, whenever it suited them Paedophilia happened in Colonial Australia as it did in many other places and times, and still happens in 2017. You need to take your blinkers off I think. You appear to assess 1840s Australian history from today's perspective, not from the 1840s. I have an eyesight issue at the moment and am waiting for a second operation so am not going to drag out my research till eye 2 is fixed so there won't be any reference put here re that but you can find it out yourself instead of trying to prompt me to provide it for you. I am not your private unpaid researcher. Johneen Treanor Jones Gundagai - direct descendent (great granddaughter), of 1852 Gundagai Flood survivors, Samuel and Maryanne True. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 2001:8003:3512:8600:101E:F418:C6DE:173B (talk) 08:05, 18 March 2017 (UTC)

Age of Yarri

Someone is posting on here that Yarri was 31 years of age when he killed Sally McLeod. What is the reference for that alleged age Lesley? Johneen Treanor Jones - Gundagai. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 2001:8003:3934:6900:5C59:7C85:D310:1E1F (talk) 05:21, 18 June 2017 (UTC)

My name is Peter Smith, proud Wiradjuri man and member of the Riley/Schipp clan. I am the chairperson of the committee concerned with the erection of the Great Rescue of 1852 sculpture and subsequent nomination of and awarding of a posthumous bravery awards. I am very proud of this achievement and the committee I am chairperson of for making this happen. I have called Gundagai home for all but a few years of my entire life, and I am not from "down the river" as stated below, just one of a lot of falsehoods by Ms. Jones that have not been substantiated, just her twisted view of events and have no credibility.

I get Yarri as being around 8 when he was first collected by overlandeers near the Murray R. It was my dad first told me that Yarrri was the killer of Baxter on the Edward Eyre Expedition in 1962 just before he died after being bashed for no reason by the cowardly 42 year old, Jack Goodsall. My dad was telling me content knowing he was dying. He also told me re Marco Polo and Australia and another Gundagai murder. I now have a Marco Polo map (on my wall immediately adjacent to where I was told that content in 1962). I was told about Yarri/Baxter in 1962 but it was only maybe 15 years ago I found content online re itthat backs up what my dying, 76 year old dad, told me 55 years ago. My dad was a very close relative of the Deputy Colonial Secretary of that era.

The Gundagai Yarri Statue Fundraising Committee that was under the auspices of the former Gundagai Shire Council, reckoned that Yarrri was "approximately 30 years old and Jacky an older man" at the time of the 1852 Gundagai Flood. They guessed Yarri's 1852 age.

This Gundagai Yarri Sculpture Fundraising Committee was the peak Gundagai group for the the Yarri and Jacky sculpture that cost about $130,000+ of public money via The Member for the Riverina who was the Minister in Charge of the last Federal Census. That committee comprised two former mayors, Aboriginal people from Brungle,an Aboriginal settlement area and where the Brungle Aboriginal Mission used to be, chaired by an Aboriginal from down the river and a couple of other community representatives. The committee guessed that "Yarri was approximately 30 years old and Jacky an older man" in 1852. That set of meeting minutes of that committee can be found online on the Cootamundra-Gundagai Regional Council website under 'meeting documents' for the meeting closest after Wednesday 24 June 2015. That meeting was meeting No 2 of over 20 meetings of the committee.

I am a direct descendent of the 1852 Gundagai flood my great grandparents living immediately next to the large Aboriginal circle on the Gundagai Flood Plain. They got out after the first upriver warnings, so did not need to be rescued unlike other idiot residents who refused to evacuate despite the warnings.

Gundagai has poorly educated people some with some secondary schooling and no tertiary qualifications messing with the local story. Some have no idea of Aboriginal history or other content. They have no idea that by messing up the veracity of Gundagai's story they are vandalising Australian history. They do not like me as I wont give them my research plus they just delete anything to do with the terrible Coolac Massacre as it might mess up their idea that Gundagai is the beginning of Reconciliation in Australia as a tourism attraction to get people to come into the town off the Hume Hwy and spend money at the silly shops in the town. I come at history from a different perspective to that and Cooktown has a far earlier positive relationship between one James Cook and Aboriginal people that happened 80 years before the 1852 Gundagai Flood.

Why would anyone change the Dog on the Tuckerbox monument story as told on its inscription to a Greyfriars Bobby fairy tale? That is what the silly Gundagai false history people do as a means of whitewashing the murk for tourism purposess.

I will recheck my Yarri dates in a couple of months. I cannot see well at the moment and am due for another eye op in a few weeks so a few weeks after that hopefully my sight will be a lot better and I can pull my research out again.

Johneen Treanor Jones - Gundagai

A Lieing Great Grandaughter of the Trues

A Marcia McIntyre is online in some effort to get a Yarri the paeophile and murderer bravery award, saying her great grandparents were saved from the 1852 Gundagai Flood "by Aborigines". She claims that this is what her family claimed. This is a total lie from a person who I know tells terrible lies. MMcs family was also my family. Our Mum never said that her grandparents were saved from that flood by Aboriginal people. Instead, our Mum said that "they got out before the flood made escape impossible".

Who said what and when can become impossible to verify but MMc and I both have one of the tin luggage trunks that our great great grandparents bought with them from the Uk. If Samuel and Maryanne True were rescued from the 1852 Gundagai Flood by Aboriginal people then there would not have been room in the canoe or boat for any tin trunks and as a result, MMc and I would now not have one of those tin trunks each. Samuel and Maryanne's shack next to the large Aboriginal circle at Gundagai was very humble, and it fell over from the 1852 flood so anything in it such as tin trunks and other belongings would have been washed downstream if MMc's lie was correct. As it was my ggrandad lost all his tools and as he was a stone mason they would have had some weight to them but they were washed away. The tin trunks are not heavy at all. Johneen Treanor Jones - Gundagai — Preceding unsigned comment added by 2001:8003:3931:2D00:AC57:11C4:16AF:8280 (talk) 03:10, 6 November 2017 (UTC)