Talk:William Baker (colonist)

Multiple William Bakers

In passing, and in order to avoid confusion in the fairly fragmentary early colonial records, there were three William Bakers (and another Marine called Baker) in Australia's early history:

• William Baker -- the subject of this article -- the Marine, storekeeper, superintendent and court crier, after whom the fish is named;
• William Baker -- a convict who arrived on Neptune in the Second Fleet, lived in Windsor and died in 1829;
• William Baker -- a sergeant of the NSW Corps, an early settler on Norfolk Island, died 1824; and
• Corporal Baker -- James Baker, a Marine corporal and contemporary of the subject of this article (but in Campbell's company, not Tench's), who was executed in 1789 for robbing the storehouse.

There were also two convicts - Martha Baker and her husband Thoams Baker, on the First Fleet, but Martha left for India in 1793 and Thomas died in 1788 from scurvy, so they are rarely mentioned or confused with the above.

All this noted here because there are records referring to "Baker," particularly in the 1788-92 period, which need some checking before they get added in case they relate to namesakes. Euryalus (talk) 04:39, 24 November 2013 (UTC)

Addition re civilian life and other William Baker's

Adding to this 11-year old note, I've moved the following paragraph from the article to the talkpage for discussion:

The history of William Baker at the Hawkesbury has been confusing for many, unaware that there were two William Bakers residing in the district at the same time, and within a short period of time owning the same land in Windsor and at Bakers Lagoon at Richmond Bottoms, also known as Cornwallis. The first William Baker was the Storekeeper at Green Hills, to avoid confusion he was known as Mr William Baker or William Baker Storekeeper. The second William Baker was the ex-convict from the Neptune 1790, proprietor of the Royal Oak Inn in Baker Street, Windsor. He was known as William Baker Settler or William Baker Junior. The storekeeper was granted the 30 acre Whitehouse Farm which was separated from the government precinct at Green Hills by Baker's Line. Over time the storekeeper sold off much of his farm and was dismissed by Governor Macquarie in 1810. In 1810 William Baker Settler purchased a portion of Whitehouse Farm on Baker's Line from Matthew Everingham, this became the location of his Royal Oak Inn. When Governor Macquarie establish his Windsor town he incorporated the Green Hills domain into his new town and renamed Baker's Line as Baker Street. By this time the storekeeper had been dismissed and left the district, it was William Baker Settler who had his Royal Oak Inn on Baker Street. As both William Baker Storekeeper and William Baker Settler had a connection to Baker's Line, which became Baker Street, it is fair to acknowledge it was named to commemorate both gentlemen.

Problems with this paragraph:

• While added in good faith, it is unsourced.
• With appropriate respect it reads like personal genealogical research. That doesn't make it false, but it does make it challenging to include in a Wikipedia article. To quote from the relevant policy: "Wikipedia does not publish original thought. All material in Wikipedia must be attributable to a reliable, published source. Articles must not contain any new analysis or synthesis of published material that reaches or implies a conclusion not clearly stated by the sources themselves.". In its present from this paragraph fails this test.
• It is not about the subject of this article. If there were other notable people called William Baker in early NSW, they should be the subject of their own articles rather than shoe-horning their details into this one

Hence the move of this material to this page until/if it can be accurately sourced and address the issue that it is largely peripheral to the article topic. It was clearly added in good faith, but these issues need fixing before it is retained. -- Euryalus (talk) 01:07, 7 April 2024 (UTC)

Royal Marine category

@JMilburn: Agree Baker needs at least one category to mark his military service. One overly fussy issue: the Royal Marines only received that designation in 1802. Baker was technically a British Marine, or most correctly a member of "His Majesty's Marine Forces," but the name "Royal Marine" didn't exist while he was in the service.

Does this matter? i don't think we should call him a Roysl Marine in the article text as he plainly wasn't - I also raised this at MILHIST at some distant time ago, and got the same answer. But categories are just navigation aids, so there may be a lower standard of precision required in order to keep them useful to readers. Views welcome - I've been idly working on a few other NSW Marines articles so how we categorise one might reasonably be done for the others. -- Euryalus (talk) 20:17, 12 August 2015 (UTC)