Talk:Warminster/Archive 1

Archive 1

Name believed to have once been 'Minster-on-the-Were'

Any evidence for this beyond the cited web page? —Preceding unsigned comment added by Steve De (talk • contribs) 01:06, 22 June 2008 (UTC)

http://www.wiltshire.gov.uk/community/getcom.php?id=233 - this mentions the minster on the were theory —Preceding unsigned comment added by 82.46.57.21 (talk) 22:17, 8 October 2008 (UTC)

Hi - the Community page only mentions that the minster is on the were, not that the name was once Minster-on-the-Were. There's little argument that the town's name is derived from it having a minster, on the Were - the disagreement is whether the town was at any time called Minster-on-the-Were. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 82.195.166.195 (talk) 15:25, 23 December 2008 (UTC)

Picture

Wouldn't a picture of St Denys be more appropriate? Actually, wouldn't a picture of the town centre be more appopriate? But if we must have a church, surely St Denys? That is the church located at the putative site of the minster after which the town is named... Steve De (talk) 21:12, 24 October 2009 (UTC)

UFO section

I believe that the UFO section is given undue weight within the article and should either be re-written to make it much shorter or split into a separate article. I also believe the section to be largely unencyclopaedic, relying too much on too few sources - most of which are themselves POV and therefore not reliable sources (see WP:RS). What do others think? --Simple Bob (talk) 13:39, 12 February 2010 (UTC)

I'm amenable to it being a separate section. As to the POV problems, the sections quotes the main primary sources - which are, after all, the AS books, which inevitably have a POV - and a skeptical book or two. We could go back to the contemporary criticism (centred around the MUFORG/MUFOB nexus) and other skeptical comments in other roughly contempraneous books (Chapman's UFO for example), although Warminster's weird position in UFO history/myth means that there was *little* comment/criticism outside of the UFO mainstream at the time. In essence, it would make the article longer. As the author of In Alien Heat - and thus one of the few people with the knowledge to handle this section - I'm willing to either make this section shorter and leave it where it is, or make the article longer and move it somewhere else.

Mind you, if we moved the section, this whole Warminster entry would be predominantly about churches ;) (hey, why isn't this indented?) Steve De (talk) 12:46, 13 August 2010 (UTC)

Isn't there a lot about churches here?

Following on from the comment about the section on UFOs being rather long, isn't this whole Warminster article rather church-o-centric? What about the Wren architecture? What about Cley, Battlesbury, and Scratchbury as Hill Forts? What about the army presence - there must be more to say than there is currently in the article? What about the golf course? What about... err.. there must be more to Warminster than a bunch of churches and some UFOs?

And did I notice some church advertising creeping into the church of St Lawrence section? Steve De (talk) 13:01, 13 August 2010 (UTC)

Name believed to be derived from the name 'Wylye-Minster'

I thought it was derived from the stream that rises near the Minster and goes through the town park and meets the Wylye at Smallbrook. The stream is called the "Were" or the "Swan", I believe, and at least one derivation I have seen has the name of this stream as the first part of the town's name. Were is believed to derive from "Worian" which was Anglo-Saxon for "wander".

John Jeremiah Daniell, in his History of Warminster points out the problem with this theory, which is that the first record of any version of the name Warminster is in a document dating from about the year 900, in the form 'Worgemynster', and there is no evidence of any minster or monastery anywhere in the neighbourhood at that time. The Domesday Book has 'Guerminstre'. Daniell concludes: "...the conjecture is admissible that WORGEMYN or GUERMIN is the name of an ancient Wiltshire chief, and that as Biscop-tre (Bishopstrow) means "the place of the bishop", so Warminster means "the head-quarters of Worgemyn, or Guermin". Moonraker2 (talk) 01:49, 25 October 2009 (UTC)

I read a second placenames book only recently that follows the Worian --> Wandering etymology, and gives x-refers to cognate place names with similar derivations. The evidence for a minster would be in the place name, no? :) No doubt, though, that place-name etymology is tricky, so it might be worth adding Daniell's conjectural etymology to the article. Steve De (talk) 13:10, 13 August 2010 (UTC)

Oops - I see you have added this conjecture. I'm a bit dubious about "The town's name is sometimes claimed to refer to the River Were" - at least two reference books I've read refer to that derivation. It is the etymologists' preferred derivation, as it were. And even Wikipedia defines "minster" as "although... correspond[ing] to the Latin monasterium or monastery[1], it then designated any settlement of clergy living a communal life and endowed by charter with the obligation of maintaining the daily office of prayer." So a monastery is not important. And anyway, this very page says about the Minster that it "dates back to the 12th century when it was built by the Normans to replace the earlier Saxon minster." So, isn't that evidence that there was a Saxon Minster? Or should you also dispute that section?

If you want to get really freaky, perhaps you should add Arthur Shuttlewood's conjecture for the placename ;) Steve De (talk) 14:14, 13 August 2010 (UTC)

Lack of references for much of the history

Apart from the huge amount of unencyclopaedic church information there is a disappointing lack of references which reduces the credibility of the Warminster article. There was also some self advertising on the part of some churches which has been removed as per WP policy on self-promotion and advertising. Richard Avery (talk) 14:36, 17 August 2010 (UTC)

Salisbury cathedral "myth"

"The bottom step of the town hall in the centre of the town is said to be at the same height above sea level as the top of Salisbury cathedral.(This is, regrettably, an "Urban Myth". The Close where Salisbury Cathedral sits is 157 ft above sea level. Warminster town centre is around 390 ft above sea level. The cathedral spire is 404 ft tall. The maths do not add up."

This is unsatisfactory on several levels. Unsourced anecdote, internally contradicted by equally unsourced OR. It's not clear which is correct: it might refer to the top of the tower without the spire, for example, which seems to give about the right height. Best short-term fix would seem to be to delete the "rebuttal", and ask for a citation for the original claim. 84.203.42.42 (talk) 01:43, 12 November 2013 (UTC)

Roman villa find

A Roman villa was recently uncovered near the village, one of the largest in the country and extraordinarily well preserved. Perhaps someone with antiquities knowledge could add something? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 129.67.68.53 (talk) 10:53, 17 April 2016 (UTC)

Is Brixton Deverill the village in question? Subsection added there today. Wire723 (talk) 18:55, 17 April 2016 (UTC)

Church Entries

These are supposed to be encyclopedic entries, not mission statements and endorsement of particular faith communities ;).

Note: As nobody else has been moved to change them - has a contributor looked in the last few months :) - I've changed them.

Warminster Baptist Church

Is the entry for this church really anything more than an advert for the church? There's no information about its age, history, architecture, what have you.

Threat of an edit war

I have received an email from Warminster Museum committee threatening to start an edit war if the church section isn't reinstated - I have made it clear that unless it is sourced (which it wasn't previously) it will be removed. Note to other editors: Don't ever try to collaborate with historians or groups outside of Wikipedia - they are impossible! ツStacey (talk) 17:06, 18 September 2016 (UTC)

As there are 18 current or former churches & chapels according to Wilts Community History, a separate article 'Religion in Warminster' could be justified. Wire723 (talk) 17:18, 18 September 2016 (UTC)

I completely agree. But as it was, there were multiple complaints on the talk page about the churches section advertising, being unsourced and dominating the article (along with the UFO stories). Myself and User:Worm That Turned have planned to put in a sourced section about the religious sites - we have been without internet so didn't get round to it. We shall put it in soon. Would you like to take on the task of the Religion in Warminster article? ;) Good luck! ツStacey (talk) 17:31, 18 September 2016 (UTC)

Sorry, although I suggested the separate article I'm not motivated to write it. Too many more interesting tasks. Wire723 (talk) 09:01, 20 September 2016 (UTC)

I know the feeling - so much to do, not enough hours in thee day! ツStacey (talk) 11:08, 20 September 2016 (UTC)