Talk:Unforgiven (Le Sserafim album)

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Albums

This article is within the scope of WikiProject Albums, an attempt at building a useful resource on recordings from a variety of genres. If you would like to participate, visit the project page, where you can join the project and/or contribute to the discussion.AlbumsWikipedia:WikiProject AlbumsTemplate:WikiProject AlbumsAlbum articles

About Eve, Psyche & the Bluebeard's Wife

Since the song has promoted heavily, had an MV. We should include it on the singles section. Xnopzx (talk) 07:32, 29 July 2023 (UTC)[reply]

@Xnopzx, promotion and MV does not equal single. Did Source Music announce it as a single? Lightoil (talk) 10:13, 29 July 2023 (UTC)[reply]

When we using US music industry term, it equal as a single. Xnopzx (talk) 03:34, 31 July 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Well K-pop is not the US music industry is it. Furthermore, do you have source(s) for this claim. Lightoil (talk) 05:39, 31 July 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Misleading usage of the word/term "Debut"

As per WP:BRD. "Debut" implies first recording released by the group in which Fearless is their first recording, and the fact that Unforgiven was released 1 year after the group's actual debut further reinforces the inaccuracy. — Paper9oll (🔔 • 📝) 05:45, 13 September 2024 (UTC)[reply]

@Paper9oll: Please read Wikipedia:WikiProject Albums/Album article style advice — it states It is generally accepted to refer to albums in chronological order in discographies where this would be applicable (Nirvana's debut album, Bob Dylan's fourth album, etc.). This is the groups debut album, doesn’t matter if they released EP's before it. Many artists release EP's before their albums such as My World (Justin Bieber EP) and My World 2.0, Extended Play (Austin Mahone EP) and Dirty Work – The Album, Room 93 and Badlands (Halsey album). Clearly you're going by your preferred style which is not how this works. Pillowdelight (talk) 09:09, 13 September 2024 (UTC)[reply]

@Pillowdelight Please assume good faith and also redact your accusations of "preferred style". My rationale is logical reasoning not personal preference. While OTHERCONTENT uses "debut", this doesn't make it an accurate and unambiguous term in this case. Even though it isn't an official policies and guidelines, the essay doesn't mention that overzealous adherence should be accorded, requiring editors to use "debut" exclusively, even though example were provided. By using "first" instead of "debut" in this case, we are still aligned with the essay's recommendation to "refer to albums in chronological order" is met while ensuring accuracy and avoiding ambiguity. — Paper9oll (🔔 • 📝) 10:49, 13 September 2024 (UTC)[reply]

@Paper9oll: I can ping many editors who are familiar with Wikipedias album style and they most likely will agree that all albums released first are always "debut" doesn't matter if they released any EP's before or after. You created the page and added the note before it was even published, it's not "misleading" at all — I mean maybe to you it is? Saying " While OTHERCONTENT uses "debut", this doesn't make it an accurate and unambiguous term in this case." How exactly does it not? I provided many examples. I will not redact my statement either, you're just moving around the template to your preferred version. Pillowdelight (talk) 11:08, 13 September 2024 (UTC)[reply]

@Pillowdelight Instead of trying to communicate and finding "agree to disagree" middleground, I'm interpretating your reply as refusing to discussed hence I don't see why I should communicate further in this rather "personal attacks" discussion. This isn't a battleground hence you're free to do whatever you want "debut" or "first" however this doesn't means that I agree with you nor does this means that you won the battle, and also you're free to ping whoever you want, but I won't reply further not under such rather "personal attacks" circumstances. — Paper9oll (🔔 • 📝) 11:34, 13 September 2024 (UTC)[reply]

I'm not attacking you in any way. Pillowdelight (talk) 19:33, 13 September 2024 (UTC)[reply]

While writing "debut album" doesn't necessarily imply that it's also the debut release, I also see no reason why it's better or clearer than the absolutely unambiguous "first album", and given the choice I almost always think the plainest possible word is usually the best.

Is there some reason why "first album" doesn't satisfy both parties here? Popcornfud (talk) 19:51, 13 September 2024 (UTC)[reply]

@Popcornfud: There's a difference between a Studio album and EP. Just because the group released an EP first and then a studio album a year later still counts as their "debut" but their debut album. I'm just following how most Wikipedias albums are styled. Pillowdelight (talk) 19:58, 13 September 2024 (UTC)[reply]

It may be that the way most Wikipedia articles are written is not necessarily the best way. See WP:OTHERSTUFFEXISTS. Popcornfud (talk) 20:00, 13 September 2024 (UTC)[reply]

You've been involved with creating albums, what do you put in the lead regarding this matter? Pillowdelight (talk) 20:08, 13 September 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Looking over the articles for debut/first albums I've worked on over the years, some of them use "debut" and some of them "first". In most cases (perhaps every case) I wasn't even the first person to write the lead sentence and make the choice, and I'm not sure I've ever thought about it before. Popcornfud (talk) 20:31, 13 September 2024 (UTC)[reply]

@Paper9oll: "Debut studio album" is accurate since their previous projects were not studio albums. These are just some "debut studio albums" by other artists who have already released prior projects (such as mixtapes and EPs):

Theknine2 (talk) 09:06, 14 September 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Interesting! Finally. I was wondering if I'd ever see other editors who were of the opinion that a recording artist or group who previously released an EP could no longer be making their debut with a full-length album. The latter therefore becomes their first album, with the EP being their debut; or in other words, the debut of that artist/group on recorded media. Therefore, at least for me, "first [release type]" is the most unambiguous and logical way of writing it. Mac Dreamstate (talk) 20:15, 13 September 2024 (UTC)[reply]

I've never come across any debut albums which also had an EP released before it labeled as its "first". Pillowdelight (talk) 20:23, 13 September 2024 (UTC)[reply]