Talk:Thoroughbreds (2017 film)

"Final role"

Is this accurate? The article for We Don't Belong Here (film) has it coming out in April. Maybe change to "in one of his final roles"? --Boycool (talk) 15:56, 12 March 2018 (UTC)

Full plot summary in lead

@Koavf: I noticed that you changed the plot summary in the lead to be “The plot follows Lily (Taylor-Joy) and her psychopathic friend Anna (Cooke) who scheme to kill the former's stepfather. When they contract low-level drug dealer Tim (Yelchin) to do the job, the backs out at the last minute and Lily kills him herself, framing Anna. The two young women find happiness in the near-future as Lily is courted by a prestigious college and Anna acclimates to prison.” I know we’re allowed to give spoilers but it doesn’t seem to be in line with other articles to give such a complete description of the film’s plot in the lead. Just looking around at a random selection of articles I found:

• Inception (good article) - “The film stars Leonardo DiCaprio as a professional thief who steals information by infiltrating the subconscious, and is offered a chance to have his criminal history erased as payment for the implantation of another person's idea into a target's subconscious.”
• Black Panther (film) - “In Black Panther, T'Challa returns home as king of Wakanda but finds his sovereignty challenged by a new adversary, in a conflict with global consequences.”
• The Godfather - “It stars Marlon Brando and Al Pacino as the leaders of a fictional New York crime family. The story, spanning 1945 to 1955, chronicles the family under the patriarch Vito Corleone (Brando), focusing on the transformation of Michael Corleone (Pacino) from reluctant family outsider to ruthless mafia boss.”
• The Sixth Sense - “The film tells the story of Cole Sear (Haley Joel Osment), a troubled, isolated boy who is able to see and talk to the dead, and an equally troubled child psychologist named Malcolm Crowe (Bruce Willis) who tries to help him.

Even an article like Fight Club (featured article) that has a slightly longer plot summary in the lead doesn’t say anything about the twist or really anything in the third act:

• “Norton plays the unnamed protagonist, referred to as the narrator, who is discontented with his white-collar job. He forms a "fight club" with soap maker Tyler Durden, played by Pitt, and they are joined by men who also want to fight recreationally. The narrator becomes embroiled in a relationship with Durden and a dissolute woman, Marla Singer, played by Bonham Carter.”

I guess my point is that WP:Spoiler or not, the synopsis in this article’s lead seems to put a lot of undue weight on events that happen in the third act with 2/3 sentences being “When they contract low-level drug dealer Tim (Yelchin) to do the job, the backs out at the last minute and Lily kills him herself, framing Anna. The two young women find happiness in the near-future as Lily is courted by a prestigious college and Anna acclimates to prison.” compared to other film articles that don’t touch on the ending at all in the lead. I don’t see why the previous version of “The plot follows Lily (Taylor-Joy) and her psychopathic friend Anna (Cooke) who scheme to kill the former's stepfather.” can’t do the job when there’s already a more complete summary in the section right below it. Boycool (talk) 13:55, 21 March 2018 (UTC)

@Moviemaster8510: seems to have the same thought with this edit. Boycool (talk) 14:14, 21 March 2018 (UTC)

You are mistaken: the original plot summary was complete, actually covering the full plot before someone else remove the latter part of the film from the lead. It's insufficient because it doesn't adequately give a summary of the rest of the article. ―Justin (koavf)❤T☮C☺M☯ 15:58, 21 March 2018 (UTC)

@Koavf: This seems highly unusual. Is there any reason this article in particular needs to give the entire plot summary in the lead when no other articles about films do this? Boycool (talk) 00:38, 22 March 2018 (UTC)

They all should--it's just a huge gap that many of our film articles have. The goal of a lead is to give an overview of the entire article. The plot synopsis is a pivotal part of many of these (the bulk of many!) and having a line like "[X] is a 2017 film about a guy with a truck" is insufficient. WP:SPOILER exists for a reason and we don't selectively hide information for spoiler benefit. ―Justin (koavf)❤T☮C☺M☯ 00:59, 22 March 2018 (UTC)

@Koavf: WP:SPOILERS addresses the use of explicit spoilers in sections such as "Plot" in which the section title provides the implicit spoiler warning and spoilers are expected. WP:FILMLEAD does not explicitly cover how much of the plot to include, however spoilers in the lead section are unexpected, it's reasonable for readers unfamiliar with the film to be able to read the lead without having it spoiled, and a quick scan of films in Category:FA-Class_film_articles shows that common sense is applied and endings and plot twists are not spoiled there. For instance, see Fight Club, Manhunter (film), American Beauty (1999 film), and Star Trek II: The Wrath of Khan. I'd expect that attempting to add a fuller summary to any of these would prove to be an interesting experience. ^~Hydronium^~Hydroxide^~(Talk)~ 04:05, 26 May 2018 (UTC)

"It is not acceptable to delete information from an article because you think it spoils the plot. Such concerns must not interfere with neutral point of view, encyclopedic tone, completeness, or any other element of article quality (e.g., the lead section)." ―Justin (koavf)❤T☮C☺M☯ 04:33, 26 May 2018 (UTC)

The reason to remove it is not because of WP:SPOILERS, but simply because it doesn't belong there. WP:FILMLEAD is quite thorough about what kinds of things belong in the lead, and plot summary is not one of those things. --SubSeven (talk) 01:46, 27 May 2018 (UTC)

And I disagree: the lead is supposed to give an overview of the article and that means that you should say more than just the first sentence of the plot but give an overview of the plot. ―Justin (koavf)❤T☮C☺M☯ 02:32, 27 May 2018 (UTC)

The details of who killed who, who fell in love with who at the end, etc. do not contribute to an increased real-world perspective on the movie. In-universe stuff should be contained to the plot section, period. WP:FILMLEAD is project consensus (established featured/good articles clearly adhere to it as well) so it's probably best to cede to that for now, and if you feel strongly about it, argue the issue on a project level. --SubSeven (talk) 03:34, 27 May 2018 (UTC)

Leads to film articles are a subsection of all articles here and the lead section should give an overview of the entire article. Why not "spoil" who kills Abraham Lincoln in the lead or "spoil" which chemicals are in ibuprofen? The goal is to give an overview of the rest of the article and stating the barest premise does not give an overview of the plot. ―Justin (koavf)❤T☮C☺M☯ 03:57, 27 May 2018 (UTC)

You're ignoring the distinction between real-world and in-universe. Basically you want to get your way in this article by arguing that the project guidelines are wrong, and that the most developed/scrutinized film articles on the encyclopedia are all wrong. Don't you think that's a tad overboard on your part? Again, if you feel strongly about it, address the consensus that has been reached, don't wage a war on individual film articles. --SubSeven (talk) 04:25, 27 May 2018 (UTC)

You're ignoring the distinction between real-world and in-universe." Correct. It's all information and we don't write from an "in-universe" perspective. So, sorry but Romeo and Juliet die and unite their families is a 421 year-old "spoiler" in the first line of the article. We don't keep everyone in suspense to find out until the end what happens. ―Justin (koavf)❤T☮C☺M☯ 05:42, 27 May 2018 (UTC)

Raised at Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Film#Use of spoilers in a film's lead. ^~Hydronium^~Hydroxide^~(Talk)~ 04:38, 26 May 2018 (UTC)

But the article you're referencing is a play. In Romeo + Juliet there is no mention of the death, and seeing as that is about a film, it is so much more pertinent. Its incredibly odd that you've picked this article to wage an edit war. 16:46, 3 June 2018 — Preceding unsigned comment added by 2A00:23C4:3D8D:5C00:BD6F:501C:564:3327 (talk)

So now plays are treated differently than films? Is one unspoilable??? ―Justin (koavf)❤T☮C☺M☯ 19:59, 3 June 2018 (UTC)

Literally every other film article on this website follows the same convention. Why aren't you changing them all? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 2A00:23C4:3D8D:5C00:80ED:9BAE:C878:1C37 (talk) 18:38, 6 June 2018 (UTC)

There are only 24 hours in a day. Lots of articles here have unsourced claims--those need to be changed too. ―Justin (koavf)❤T☮C☺M☯ 18:39, 6 June 2018 (UTC)

i comment on bbfc.

i tell you SnapSnap that British Board of Film Classification is also organization who publish website British Board of Film Classification. i say organization website name is same so i take publisher. IUpdateRottenTomatoes (talk) 02:02, 29 August 2018 (UTC)

"Cory Finley" listed at Redirects for discussion

A discussion is taking place to address the redirect Cory Finley. The discussion will occur at Wikipedia:Redirects for discussion/Log/2020 May 7#Cory Finley until a consensus is reached, and readers of this page are welcome to contribute to the discussion. Robert McClenon (talk) 15:36, 7 May 2020 (UTC)