Talk:Tautirut

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Is the agiarut the same thing?

I've seen some mention of a Inuit and indigenous Quebecois fiddle called the agiarut; is this the same thing as the tautirut? The only reason I'd think they wouldn't be is that a few sources list them sequentially, as in "Acculturated forms such as accordion music, box fiddles, agiarut, tautirut, the 'Eskimo dance' (drawing on jigs and reels of 19th-century whalers), country and western music in Inuktitut..." Thoughts? MatthewVanitas (talk) 06:46, 25 April 2011 (UTC)[reply]

I had a look at the Inuktitut Living Dictionary. Both terms are listed but without a translation but tautirutiqpuq is and translates to "play three-stringed Inuit violin". A search for agiarut gave me this which says it's a violin and this picture (see Tautirut image], but seems to think it is from the west rather than the Hudson Bay area. Both Ronald Lowe's work, Kangiryuarmiut Uqauhingita Numiktittidjutingit (Basic Kangiryuairmiut Eskimo Dictionary) and the Inuinnaqtun English Dictonary list agiraq (fiddle) and aigiraqtuq (plays fiddle). Both dictionaries cover the Ulukhaktok, Kugluktuk, Cambridge Bay area. In addition the Inuinnaqtun English Dictonary lists uluaraut and uluaraqtuq as fiddle and plays fiddle. The interesting thing is that both the dictionaries are Central Arctic meaning that the instrument was known further west than this article would indicate. CambridgeBayWeather (talk) 17:35, 25 April 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Wow, fast response on an obscure article! This is one of my favourite (non-bagpipe) musical instrument articles I've written, so glad someone else likes it. A bit swamped at the moment, but will read your refs later. If we can't get a solid conclusion on this without verging into OR, I'd at least like to somehow add the mention of the term agiarut somewhere to give later folks something to dig into, plus bring any Google hits (however unlikely that might be) to the article. My long-term goal is still to get an actual CC photo for this page; I've almost debated having a luthier build me one; I'd estimate it can't be more than $300, as I could probably get an Appalachian dulcimer maker to build me one since they're pretty similar in structure, though not sure exactly how to replicate a whalebone bow (some kind of synthetic). If I have one built based on the Quebec museum pic, I'll definitely add a photo here. Thanks so much for checking in, and I'll try to get back to you sooner than later to hash this out. MatthewVanitas (talk) 18:28, 25 April 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Edit: not totally clear on WP Image Use for this, but is it generally kosher if I have a friend sketch an image of the instrument based on the Museum photo, and upload it as a quality line-drawing released to CC? MatthewVanitas (talk) 18:30, 25 April 2011 (UTC)[reply]

I think that would be fine but I'm not positive. CambridgeBayWeather (talk) 19:34, 25 April 2011 (UTC)[reply]

I added a photo I took in the McManus gallery in Dundee, of a 19th century Alaskan fiddle described by the label as "agiarut". It is not ideal since it is (a) referred to as agiarut and not tautirut, and (b) has a Western-influenced form, being more like a fiddle than a zither. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Simonchadwick1023 (talk • contribs) 14:37, 31 July 2012 (UTC)[reply]

Just moved this image here and replaced it with the Turner 1894 line drawing Simonchadwick1023 (talk) 19:55, 22 September 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Beverley Cavanagh, in Grove Music Online http://www.oxfordmusiconline.com/subscriber/article/grove/music/L2215013 (subscription needed) says that Agiarut is the name for a European fiddle, while Tautirut is the name for the indigenous bowed box zither. No references or evidence is given. Simonchadwick1023 (talk) 20:12, 21 June 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Another interesting reference.
Lucien M. Turner, 'Ethnology of the Ungava District, Hudson Bay Territory', Eleventh annual report of the Bureau of Ethnology to the Secretary of the Smithsonian Institution,, 1894, p.258-259
http://archive.org/stream/ethnologyofungav00turnrich#page/259/
"The only musical instrument which I observed among these people was a violin of their own manufacture, made, of course, in imitation of those they had seen used by the whites. Its form is sufficiently well shown by the figure (Fig. 82), and is made of birch or spruce, and the two strings are of coarse, loosely twisted sinew. The bow has a strip of whalebone in place of horsehair, and is resined with spruce gum. This fiddle is held across the lap when played.
The old woman of whom I procured the instrument was able to play several airs such as they sing among themselves. I was surprised at the facility with which she made the various notes on such a crude imitation of a violin."
With a line drawing which would be worth adding to this article I think.
Simonchadwick1023 (talk) 19:45, 22 September 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Just created article Agiarut Simonchadwick1023 (talk) 11:20, 24 September 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Questionable reference

Under "Further Reading" we have this text with the following footnote:

The academics Maija Lutz and Susan Kaplan have been noted as having studied the Eskimo fiddle.[7] (7) Llano Estacado Center for Advanced Professional Studies and Research. Liberal and Fine Arts Research Institute (1983). Liberal and fine arts review. Liberal and Fine Arts Research Institute of the Llano Estacado Center for Advanced Professional Studies and Research, Eastern New Mexico University. Retrieved 25 April 2011.

I followed the link http://books.google.com/books?id=YjrhAAAAMAAJ and there is no text displayed - is it available to US viewers? Does it really count as "further reading" to mention the names of scholars who are said to have studied the subject? I would think that either the text needs changed to reflect what these scholars actually have to say about the subject, or removed. Can someone with access to this source comment? Simonchadwick1023 (talk) 18:32, 14 November 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Not available in Canada. I assume the book is still under copyright which means that nobody in any country will be able to view it. As the book is no doubt available off line I don't see a problem with it being there. CambridgeBayWeather (talk) 07:28, 15 November 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Thanks for checking. It was not the unavailability of the text I was querying, so much as the lack of relevant content.Simonchadwick1023 (talk) 18:03, 18 November 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Finally got some text from this reference: "Studies of individual instruments are in progress by Maija Lutz, Susan Kaplan, Ed Wapp, and Tom Vennum. Lutz and Kaplan (n.d.) have studied the Eskimo fiddle, comparing archaeological and ethnological specimens..." (Liberal and Fine Arts Research Institute of the Llano Estacado Center for Advanced Professional Studies and Research, Eastern New Mexico University, 1983, p.30). Lutz published Musical traditions of the Labrador coast Inuit in 1982; I don't see any music studies by Kaplan. Anyone got further citations on this? Simonchadwick1023 (talk) 07:30, 6 July 2018 (UTC)[reply]

External links modified

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