Talk:Samuel Lander

Samuel Lander has been listed as one of the Social sciences and society good articles under the good article criteria. If you can improve it further, please do so. If it no longer meets these criteria, you can reassess it.
Review: October 13, 2024. (Reviewed version).

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A fact from Samuel Lander appeared on Wikipedia's Main Page in the Did you know column on 17 November 2024 (check views). The text of the entry was as follows:

Did you know... that Samuel Lander founded the Williamston Female College in an abandoned hotel?

A record of the entry may be seen at Wikipedia:Recent additions/2024/November. The nomination discussion and review may be seen at Template:Did you know nominations/Samuel Lander.

Wikipedia

Did you know nomination

The following is an archived discussion of the DYK nomination of the article below. Please do not modify this page. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as this nomination's talk page, the article's talk page or Wikipedia talk:Did you know), unless there is consensus to re-open the discussion at this page. No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was: promoted by Theleekycauldron talk 21:54, 8 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]

(

Comment or view
Article history

)

Lander c.1873–74

... that Samuel Lander (pictured) lived in an abandoned hotel with his wife and seven children while a minister in Williamston, South Carolina? Source: https://www.lander.edu/news/2022/04/The%20Educational%20Influence%20of%20Samuel%20Lander%20Continues%20.html
- ALT1: ... that what is now Lander University was renamed to honor its founder when it moved from Williamston to Greenwood, South Carolina, in 1904? Source: https://andersoncountymuseum.sc.gov/rev-samuel-lander-ii-2016-hall-fame
- ALT2: ... that Samuel Lander (pictured) founded the Williamston Female College in an abandoned hotel?
- ALT3: ... that Samuel Lander (pictured) was the founder and first president of Williamston Female College, later renamed for him?
- Reviewed: Template:Did you know nominations/Vincent Darré

Moved to mainspace by PCN02WPS (talk). Number of QPQs required: 1. Nominator has 80 past nominations.

PCN02WPS (talk | contribs) 19:23, 10 October 2024 (UTC).[reply]

Interesting life and work, on fine sources, offline source accepted AGF, no copyio obvious. Sorry I find both hooks not what would interest me about his life, and the second lacks any bold link to his name. The image is licensed and gives a good idea of not only him but his era. How about that he wasn't just some minister with many children, but founder and president of that early place for women's higher education? We women readers would prefer that ;) --Gerda Arendt (talk) 14:20, 12 October 2024 (UTC)[reply]

@Gerda Arendt: thanks for the review. I have added ALT2 and ALT3 per your suggestions. PCN02WPS (talk | contribs) 16:17, 13 October 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Thank you, I like those better ;) I could also imagine to combine to one:

ALT2a: ... that Samuel Lander (pictured) founded in an abandoned hotel the Williamston Female College which grew into Lander University? - Good luck with the GAN! --Gerda Arendt (talk) 16:25, 13 October 2024 (UTC)[reply]

GA Review

Passed. It is a wonderful world (talk) 16:59, 13 October 2024 (UTC)[reply]

The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

This review is transcluded from Talk:Samuel Lander/GA1. The edit link for this section can be used to add comments to the review.

Nominator: PCN02WPS (talk · contribs) 19:00, 10 October 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Reviewer: It is a wonderful world (talk · contribs) 22:29, 12 October 2024 (UTC)[reply]

With the Internet Archive being down this seems to be a good one to review. Not too many archive links.

@It is a wonderful world: thanks for such a speedy review! I think this might be the quickest I've ever had an article go from being published to a GA review. Everything has been addressed or responded to below. PCN02WPS (talk | contribs) 16:09, 13 October 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Since it was quite a short interesting article that didn't use any IA links it was a good evening job. Thank you for writing it! It is a wonderful world (talk) 16:55, 13 October 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Prose clock

Lead

now ~~known as~~ Lander University, in 1872 and ~~was~~ [served as] its first president: Nitpicky points for conciseness and precision, since it is the first sentence.

I removed "known as"; I personally dislike the "served as" construction (I like to follow WP:SERVEDAS even though it's an essay and not policy) so basically all of my college president articles use "was" or "is" instead. PCN02WPS (talk | contribs) 16:08, 13 October 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Makes sense. It is a wonderful world (talk) 16:44, 13 October 2024 (UTC)[reply]

After becoming a Methodist minister in 1866, he got [his] first position in administration

Added. PCN02WPS (talk | contribs) 16:08, 13 October 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Early life and education

Lander enrolled at Randolph–Macon College, in Ashland, Virginia, in 1849 and graduated at the top of his class on June 10, 1852. He earned a Master's degree from Trinity College—now Duke University—in 1855: What exactly did he study?

Unfortunately I haven't found a source that says. PCN02WPS (talk | contribs) 16:08, 13 October 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Career

a civil engineer and a surveyor

Done. PCN02WPS (talk | contribs) 16:08, 13 October 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Wikilink "civil engineer"

Done. PCN02WPS (talk | contribs) 16:08, 13 October 2024 (UTC)[reply]

He went on to teach [at the] Olin Institute in Olin, North Carolina: Link Olin Institute?

Added missing words and redlink. PCN02WPS (talk | contribs) 16:08, 13 October 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Link "Lincolnton Female Seminary"?

Added redlink. PCN02WPS (talk | contribs) 16:08, 13 October 2024 (UTC)[reply]

to take charge of the Methodist circuit: I'm a little unsure what the "Methodist circuit" is. Is it a group of Methodist churches? Also, could you be more specific than "take charge" here?

I was also unsure of the exact meaning of this - I was hesitant to change the wording because basically every source uses the term "circuit". My guess was the same as yours, a group of Methodist churches, but I wasn't sure enough to change that term. PCN02WPS (talk | contribs) 16:08, 13 October 2024 (UTC)[reply]

and he became a Methodist minister in 1866: Shouldn't this be "had become" to emphasize it was before being appointed by MECS?

Changed. PCN02WPS (talk | contribs) 16:08, 13 October 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Link "Grace Methodist Church"?

I don't think the individual church is notable enough for a redlink in this instance, just based on what I saw from doing research. PCN02WPS (talk | contribs) 16:08, 13 October 2024 (UTC)[reply]

so he and his family begam living in an old hotel: "begam" -> "began" typo, also I think "moved to" would be better than "began living in"

Changed wording. PCN02WPS (talk | contribs) 16:08, 13 October 2024 (UTC)[reply]

was ready to graduate -> "graduated"

Done. PCN02WPS (talk | contribs) 16:08, 13 October 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Lander attended the General Conference of the MECS as a delegate in 1890 and 1894: I think this should only be included if the General Conference is notable. If so, redlink?

I don't think the General Conference is notable enough to redlink, so I removed that line. PCN02WPS (talk | contribs) 16:08, 13 October 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Lander took this opportunity to grow the school by hiring more faculty members ~~as well~~: You could change it to "Lander [also] took" if you want to emphasize the meaning added by "as well". It flows much better in my opinion.

Agreed, changed. PCN02WPS (talk | contribs) 16:08, 13 October 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Personal life and death

Lander was a polyglot and was fluent in French, Gaelic, German, Ancient Greek, Hebrew, Italian, and Latin: I feel woefully uneducated only speaking English now...

Yeah, tell me about it. Nothing puts me in my place quite like writing about accomplished people. PCN02WPS (talk | contribs) 16:08, 13 October 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Link "Constructed language"

Done. PCN02WPS (talk | contribs) 16:08, 13 October 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Sources clock

Reliability Y

Sources are from government websites, historical books and a few letters to fill in the details. All look reliable.

Spot check clock

[1aY, bY]

[1c]: Says he studied civil engineering, not that he was paid for it as "began his career" implies.

Corrected. PCN02WPS (talk | contribs) 16:08, 13 October 2024 (UTC)[reply]

[7a, b]: Could you cite more specifically than the whole Lander University collection on him?

All I used from this was the text on this page, so I couldn't think of a better way to cite it. PCN02WPS (talk | contribs) 16:08, 13 October 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Ah you are right! I just dismissed that popup thing without even reading it as I assumed it would be a cookie notice or something irrelevant haha It is a wonderful world (talk) 16:48, 13 October 2024 (UTC)[reply]

[12]Y

[13]: The source says "[Lander] deemed that three of the initial 38 students were ready for graduation" which has been reworded as "assessed students' progress individually with school administration determining when each student was ready to graduate". The text only gives one instance of Lander deciding when students were ready to graduate, but this gives the impression that it was an established practice of the "school administration".

I based that generalization on this line: One of Samuel Lander's convictions was that graduation depended on individual preparation and examination, ... - I figured that the 3/38 number was just an example of this given by the author. If you've got a suggestion as to how to better represent this I'd be open to it. PCN02WPS (talk | contribs) 16:08, 13 October 2024 (UTC)[reply]

That justification makes sense, I think it's a reasonable assumption. It is a wonderful world (talk) 16:49, 13 October 2024 (UTC)[reply]

[8a]: I can't find support for the text, searching for 1859 provides nothing. Am I missing something?

Nope, just misplaced a reference. Ref 7 should have been at the end of that sentence. PCN02WPS (talk | contribs) 16:08, 13 October 2024 (UTC)[reply]

[1d, 9]Y

[1e, 1f]Y

[2] and [3] aren't working due to IA being down unfortunately, and [4] is giving me a 403 error.

Yeah, IA has been offline for a few days unfortunately. As for 4, that's odd, it's working fine for me. I'm happy to provide quotes if you want to check the stuff referenced to that. PCN02WPS (talk | contribs) 16:08, 13 October 2024 (UTC)[reply]

That's strange! It is still 403 for me. I won't worry about checking it, you provided the main part I wanted to check anyways. It is a wonderful world (talk) 16:53, 13 October 2024 (UTC)[reply]

I especially want to check [4] because it is used to support him being fluent in French, German, Spanish and Hebrew, whereas [1] says he could only read those languages, not speak them. Is the site working for you?

Here's the quote that I used for that: He felt he did not deserve this degree unless he could read the Bible in its original languages, so he began learning Hebrew at the age of 45. By the end of his life, Lander was fluent in German, French, Italian, and Gaelic in addition to Greek, Latin, Hebrew, and, of course, English. "This degree" refers to the honorary D.Div. he got from Trinity College. PCN02WPS (talk | contribs) 16:08, 13 October 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Source directly supports the text, no problems here. It is a wonderful world (talk) 16:57, 13 October 2024 (UTC)[reply]

[1g]: Doesn't support that the day of his marriage (December 20)

Changed to [4], which does give the date, On December 20, 1853, Samuel married Laura Ann McPherson who was also the daughter of a Methodist minister.

[1h, 18]Y

[1i]Y

[8b, c, 19]Y

Stable Y

Media Y

Captions Y

Tags Y

Suggestions

Add an image or two of Lander University.

I want to get an image of Laura Lander Hall, named for his wife, so I'll try to get that pic taken and uploaded whenever I'm there next. PCN02WPS (talk | contribs) 16:08, 13 October 2024 (UTC)[reply]

That would be great! I'll pass the article now since this was only a suggestion. It is a wonderful world (talk) 16:58, 13 October 2024 (UTC)[reply]

The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.