Talk:Ross O'Carroll-Kelly

Could someone who knows the story about Ross' son add him as a Character? It would also be nice to expand the core character descriptions, and give more nicknames. RMoloney 22:59, 12 July 2005 (UTC)

Des Dillon

Could you provide a source for this rumour? Also, is it the character of Ross, or the Alan Clarke illustration (or both) that is supposedly based on Dillon? RMoloney 18:11, 8 September 2005 (UTC)

Intersting Note on JP

JP only turns into a born-again christian in "The curious incindent of the dog in the nightdress", but the information has been on this page for quite some time. Has Paul Howard or someone from the publisher secretly added information to this page?

In the newspaper columns, JP's conversion happened shortly after the death of Pope John Paul II, so it was added then. RMoloney (talk) 22:24, 20 December 2005 (UTC)

Origin

I heard somewhere that Paul Howard, was supposed to be writing an article about a southside Rugby playing school, who he followed around for a while. He then wrote an article about the stuff they were getting up to, but the tribune wouldn't print it because they were afraid of being sued for defamation. I don't want to add it, as I just heard this off someone, and don't know if it's true.--Richy 12:58, 9 March 2006 (UTC)

That is true. Theres an article on Oxygen.ie about it.Trevorhay (talk) 01:52, 9 May 2008 (UTC)

References

ROCK a "jock"

Some time ago I heard Paul Howard on RTE One describing ROCK as a "jock". I added this to the "Dublin 4" mention of him and just now to the article itself. Does anybody remember when the interview was? (I don't read the ROCK columns, just have heard him mentioned a lot.) Autarch 15:30, 18 October 2006 (UTC)

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BetacommandBot 11:17, 27 October 2007 (UTC)

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BetacommandBot 22:11, 6 November 2007 (UTC)

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BetacommandBot 08:38, 7 November 2007 (UTC)

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BetacommandBot (talk) 17:08, 29 November 2007 (UTC)

Inspiration for Fr. Fehily

Is Father Fehily based on or a reference to Leonard Feeney (http://wiki.riteme.site/wiki/Leonard_Feeney) or Father Denis Fahey (http://wiki.riteme.site/wiki/Denis_Fahey) who used to teach at St. Mary's, or is this too deep a question? Does it matter? Liamfoley (talk) 17:35, 23 December 2007 (UTC)

Fansite

The Influences section in particular is obsessive in the influence of American Psycho on the ROCK stories. Some trimming in that section is needed. Autarch (talk) 19:36, 16 March 2009 (UTC)

Furthermore, some editors are obsessed with putting the words "ledgend" or "ledge" into the article - they should read WP:ISNOT.Autarch (talk) 21:56, 27 July 2009 (UTC)

Another issue - some parts use slang without explaining it - the case in mind is "one of the goys" - this might seem obvious to someone from Ireland, but remember you're writing for a worldwide audience and words, such as goy, can have unexpected meanings in other countries.Autarch (talk) 21:37, 18 January 2010 (UTC)

Adding plots

Recently some anonymous editors have added material to the character descriptions that contained a lot of plot - WP:PLOT and WP:MOSFICT are good advice.Autarch (talk) 19:35, 19 March 2010 (UTC)

Unexplained slang

The phrase everyone who was on the S in the year they won appears in the part about the funeral of Father Denis Fehily. What does this mean?Autarch (talk) 19:47, 19 March 2010 (UTC)

It means "everyone who was on the Senior Cup team the year they won the Leinster Senior Cup". Fionnsci (talk) 09:31, 20 March 2010 (UTC)

Thank you - I've fixed the sentence in question. Some contributors keep putting in slang from the series.Autarch (talk) 19:37, 20 March 2010 (UTC)

Lists in article and influence

This is taking up a large section of the article - roughly half of it by my reckoning. I can think of a couple of things to do with it:

1. Trim it back to a shorter list - some keep adding character trivia to it.
2. Split it into its' own article - this is covered under WP:SIZE, specifically WP:SPINOUT.

The list of works is also getting long. The title references column may or may not fall under WP:OR.

The section claiming influence of Brett Easton Ellis doesn't cite any references. Is there a reference anywhere where Paul Howard claims such an influence? If not, then this qualifies as WP:OR which is barred under WP:NOR. What doesn't appear to be OR is the description of characters and their portrayal, but the claim of influence is.

Looking at WP:MOSFICT the article could need an overhaul on several fronts:

1. Regarding copyright, the Fair Use section states: It has been held in a number of court cases that any work which re-tells original ideas from a fictional source, in sufficient quantity without adding information about that work, or in some way analysing and explaining it, may be construed as a derivative work or a copyright violation. This may apply irrespective of the way information is presented, in or out of the respective fictional universe, or in some entirely different form such as a quizbook or "encyclopedia galactica". It also states that Information about copyrighted fictional worlds and plots of works of fiction can be provided only under a claim of fair use, and Wikipedia's fair-use policy holds that "the amount of copyrighted work used should be as little as possible". This might affect the character sections which contain a considerable amount of character history. They may also fall fout of WP:PLOT.
2. The Accuracy and appropriate weight section may affect the lengths of the Characters and Language sections.
3. Primary and secondary information are needed - there are only four references in the current version of the article!Autarch (talk) 20:38, 20 March 2010 (UTC)

Rm Influences section as OR

The following unsourced material has been flagged as such for a while, so I'll remove it as OR: Several stylistic traits from The Mis-Education Of Ross O'Carroll-Kelly and later books were borrowed from Bret Easton Ellis's satirical novel, American Psycho. For example:

• Ross describes in exacting detail the clothes those around him are wearing, and their physical appearance only as far as commenting on their attractiveness and in women the case of women describing their posterior and breast size
• Characters deliver detailed vignettes about aspects of popular culture. For example in an early scene the character Christian discusses the incestuous undertones of Star Wars'
• One of Bateman's friends mocks a homeless man by holding out a $1 bill, then putting it back in his wallet. Ross and his friends drive to poor areas of Dublin and throw money out of the car, laughing at the locals who scramble for it

Male and female characters in both Ellis' novel and the ROCK stories exhibit near-identical behaviour for their gender, Ross distinguishing the females only by the posh private school they attended, a post they held at that school (hockey captain, Head Girl, etc.) and resemblance to a celebrity. According to Howard, the major influence on his style in the series is actually Ellis's Less than Zero, which is set in California and about a group of privileged 16-18 year olds. Autarch (talk) 19:20, 22 August 2010 (UTC)

Media franchise

Is it accurate to use the term media franchise in this context? CSI and Law & Order clearly are, but the subject of this article is mainly published in a newspaper, which is then collected in books. Sure, there's a play and a CD, but as far as I can tell the main emphasis is on the column and books.Autarch (talk) 18:29, 3 September 2010 (UTC)

On checking the source used in the sentence where "franchise" is mentioned, there is no mention of any kind of franchise. To avoid WP:OR and keep to WP:V, I've changed the sentence to describe the central character.Autarch (talk) 21:03, 24 October 2010 (UTC)

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