Talk:Rizal Monument (Madrid)

Did you know nomination

The following is an archived discussion of the DYK nomination of the article below. Please do not modify this page. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as this nomination's talk page, the article's talk page or Wikipedia talk:Did you know), unless there is consensus to re-open the discussion at this page. No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was: promoted by 97198 (talk) 07:33, 25 January 2023 (UTC)

(

• Comment or view
• Article history

)

The Rizal Monument in 2023

• ... that while other countries built monuments to José Rizal a century after his birth, the Rizal Monument (pictured) in Madrid was built a century after his death? Source: "In 1961 during Rizal’s birth centennial, countries around the world honored the Philippine national hero with monuments of their own. [...] But Spain refused to give Rizal’s legacy another statue for in the ‘60s, he was still very much considered a rebel and traitor. It wouldn’t be until 1996 that the monument would be built and placed in Spain's busy metro." --Esquire Philippines
  • ALT1: ... that a socialite once outshone a national hero (pictured)? Source: "In December 1996, photographers were milling around Madrid’s Plaza de Santander waiting for the unveiling of the monument and the arrival of Madrid Mayor Josemaria Alvarez del Manzano. When Preysler arrived with then husband, Miguel Boyer, the photographers made a 180-degree turn from the statue and scrambled toward La Preysler [sic]. “The statue is over here, not there,” a Filipino organizer called back, but the photographers had started snapping pictures of La China, a moniker for the almond-eyed Preysler." --Philippine Daily Inquirer
  • Reviewed: Niwar (cotton tape)

Created by Sky Harbor (talk). Self-nominated at 05:21, 4 January 2023 (UTC).

• Hey there, nice article. New, long enough. Well written, no copyvio, sourcing looks solid. I made some copyedits on my own, but here are a few other suggested revisions:
  • In the lead, "an executed Filipino nationalist" sort of understates Rizal's icon status. Consider adding the phrase "national hero" or just making it simpler: "Filipino nationalist Jose Rizal"
  • The sentence "Unlike other countries ..." gets really clunky after "owing to"
  • Also might help to say why attitudes changed in Spain?
  • Specify what country Ramos was president of, and same for other names, including in Cultural significance section
  • The image could be cropped to show up better at small size but otherwise is good.
  • Only other thing to do is QPQ. Either hook works, leaning toward ALT0. Hameltion (talk, contribs) 21:08, 5 January 2023 (UTC)
    • Hi, Hameltion! To address these points:
      • I originally wrote the lead paragraph to match that of the original Rizal Monument's article, and the version that is currently visible is not the version I wrote. I'll rewrite that line to emphasize his national hero status.
      • I'm a bit hamstrung by the source here. I could say "Spain refused to build a monument owing to prevailing negative sentiment against Rizal at the time", but you lose the nuance: this negative sentiment was by and large only limited to Spain itself, and I don't want to confuse people by thinking this sentiment existed elsewhere.
      • There is no source that points to why these attitudes changed, only that they did. Anecdotally as someone who is currently living in Spain, I can say that a lot of it has to do with the Spanish transition to democracy and the death of Franco (Franco was very conservative, he was of the generation that mourned the loss of the Empire, and Rizal up to before his execution was a Mason, whereas Franco was anti-Mason), which was paired with a significant liberalization of Spanish societal norms, but that is something that is not explicitly tied to a source.
      • The president is implied, because Spain doesn't have a president (yes, in Spanish, the head of government is called the president, but in English they're pretty much referred to as the Prime Minister). I don't see why it would be necessary to state that Ramos (or Arroyo, or Aquino) is specifically the President of the Philippines when the subject is about the country of which they were the president.
      • I intend to take a better picture in the summer, or perhaps on a sunny day when I'm in the area.
      • QPQ is done
    • Looking forward to any additional feedback and to closing this nomination. --Sky Harbor ^(talk) 15:16, 13 January 2023 (UTC)
      • Thanks for following up. Made my own edit just to shorten one sentence, hopefully not changing meaning. And I wouldn't expect readers to know that Spain has a PM and not a president but all that's a very minor thing. Good QPQ. Not recommending the photo as is unless you choose to crop it. Hameltion (talk, contribs) 19:05, 13 January 2023 (UTC)
        • Okay, Hameltion, I took three new photos of the monument earlier this afternoon.

• 
  Profile view (similar to the photo currently in the article)
• 
  Close-up view
• 
  Closer-up view

Which of the three here would be the most appropriate for this article and DYK nomination? --Sky Harbor ^(talk) 17:45, 21 January 2023 (UTC)

Wow, fantastic. Enthusiastic to Closer-up view. Hameltion (talk, contribs) 20:07, 21 January 2023 (UTC)

Updated. --Sky Harbor ^(talk) 23:21, 21 January 2023 (UTC)