Jump to content

Talk:Pseudo-anglicism/Archive 1

Page contents not supported in other languages.
From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Archive 1

Swedish words

I removed wrestling and fiction from the list of Swedish words. Fiction as a literary category is called Skönlitteratur in Swedish, and the English translation is not an established word in Swedish. Even if it was it shouldn't be considered pseudo-anglicism since it's a direct use of the English word and meaning. Pro wrestling is called wrestling in English as well and while wrestling in English also means other types of wrestling I don't think any English speaker would fail to recognize or understand the word enough for it to be considered pseodu-anglicism. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 83.251.167.98 (talk) 14:16, 27 March 2015 (UTC)


Definition of Denglish not complete

"When many English words are incorporated into many languages, language enthusiasts and purists often look down on this phenomenon, terming it (depending on the importing language) Denglisch, Franglais or similar neologisms." It is also critizised when German words are simply replaced by (correct) English words. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 165.124.148.191 (talk) 21:15, 24 February 2012 (UTC)


Relation to loanwords

The article has not yet (August 12, 2005) discussed the relationship between pseudo-Anglicisms and other loanwords, or their relationship with false friends, so could I suggest some points?

The pseudo-word phenomenon seems to be a special case of the loanword. Most loanwords undergo some immediate slight semantic change when transferred to the new language, and further semantic drift may then follow over long subsequent periods, so it is not remarkable that the resulting cognates differ in meaning. But a pseudo-word or spurious loanword does not seem to have ever existed lexically in the supposed language of departure, though it is perceived as a borrowing in the receiving language. Whether we call them cod, pseudo, bogus, or faux, these words are entirely constructed in the foreign-language community.

The false friend on the other hand is a specialized phenomenon only known to bilingual people: it is a practical obstacle encountered in translation and language-learning. While false friends may be caused by borrowing, they may also be an effect of coincidence or of divergent lexical development. False friends or false cognates are issues to be dealt with in bilingualism, but need not be a topic in a discussion of language origins: the reference to Parkes and Cornell's book does not seem relevant to the present article.

Cod loanwords and reshaped loanwords (see below) are well known to monolingual speakers, not just bilingual ones. They are one of the components of Franglais, Denglisch, Engrish and so on, but it ought to be pointed out that these jargons also contain many other loanwords that have been only little modified.

What makes a pseudo-Anglicism peculiar is that its users believe, from its style and spelling, that it comes from English, but it is unintelligible to English-speakers because of a shift in lexical context. Mobbing(de) and standing(fr) are pseudo-Anglicisms because of their "ing" suffix and because English monolinguals usually cannot guess what they mean, but Tuning(de) and clearing(fr) have clear points of contact in English.

Unless we use the concept of the pseudo-Anglicism strictly, it is hard to see how it is different from any ordinary loanword.

Strafe is clearly a pseudo-Germanism, but Blitz has a mixture of features (borrowing with the meaning intact, followed by shortening) and is not such a clear case. Karaoke should be removed from this article (its origin as a word is explained under the karaoke headword). Bon viveur is indeed a pseudo-Gallicism, but an extremely obscure one. I doubt that the divergent development of double-entendre and rendezvous qualify them to by called pseudo-Gallicisms. At the time of transmission they were simple loanwords. Pathetic may be a false friend for English learners of Greek (just as pathetisch (overly dramatic) is for English learners of German), but it was correctly transmitted and does not seem to me to be a pseudo-Hellenism. The original meaning in English (S.O.D.: earliest use 1598) was stirring or moving but it then underwent semantic drift.

Could I suggest renaming the article with a suitable head-word that embraces all the instances, i.e. pseudo-Anglicisms, pseudo-Germanisms, pseudo-Gallicisms and so on? One customary term is "cod", which means humorously preposterous. It is applied to words and explanations of words. Cod etymology is a variety of folk etymology that is so outrageous that it appears (or is known) to be invented. More broadly, there is a term cod science. To cod means to hoax (Chambers 20th Century Dictionary). Cod loanword? Spurious loanword? Are there any other suggestions for a term?

This should not be confused with reshaped loanwords, which are altered in transmission but are still intelligible in the lender language. In German usage, standing ovations(de) in the singular ends with an S (in English, only plural ovations have an S). In English, deutschmark(en) (uncapitalized, no space, no inflective e) is part of educated usage, but is wrong from a German point of view. The French shake-hand swaps the word order of handshake. In none of these cases has the lexical context changed.

Nor should they be confused with inept calques, which appear to have been invented by German speakers but have now passed into the English language. Examples: economics ministry (de: Wirtschaftsministerium, an economy ministry in Germany) or traffic calming (de: Verkehrsberühingung, obstacles placed on roads to deter traffic and reduce speeds). --JB Piggin 21:27, 12 August 2005 (UTC)


Hi, JB, I certainly see your point that there should be a keyword that meets all the pseudo's, be it -Anglicism, -Germanism, -Gallicism, or any other, and it is a fine point that needs thinking about.
However, Parkes adn Cornell have indeed either created the term 'pseudo -Anglicism or certainly used it in describing the words Dressman, Talkmaster, Twen, Chesterkäse for "processed cheddar cheese", to name a few.
You mention the word Blitz "as having a mixture of features (borrowing with the meaning intact...)". I fear no, this is not so. The word means 'lightning' or 'flash' as in photography, and was used by the Germans in a particular meaning in relation to war only, namely that of "lightning war", that of overrunning a number of smaller or weaker countries. It was never, at any time, used to refer to air-war, but was picked up as an expression for the "destruction of inner cities" by the British population generally and used in that sense only. Fluent German speaker would have picked up on the 'lightning war' meaning and then only if they were able to lay their hands on German papers. The British quality press, would have certainly featured the 'lightning war' translation at some time or other, but that certainly did not reflect on the popular conception of the phrase.

Dieter Simon 00:19, 13 August 2005 (UTC)


Thank you Mr 131.183.81.100. When you ultimately come out into the open with some kind of name I might even take your point. Actually I hadn't finished and what you were saying was in the nature of typos still to be edited.

Dieter Simon 01:02 Jan 28, 2003 (UTC)

Is this term only used in reference to German? The same thing happens many other languages, e.g. Engrish. -- Stephen Gilbert 03:17 Jan 28, 2003 (UTC)

Yes, there are terms similar which probably apply to all languages where there are words which have been taken over, adapted to new usage in the host language and probably now mean different things. I am about to add "pseudo-Germanism" and "pseudo-gallicism", terms which I haven't been able to find, which however ought to exist to cover the problem. Dieter Simon 21:41 Jan 28, 2003 (UTC)

...If the system weren't so slow... Dieter Simon 21:46 Jan 28, 2003 (UTC)

Yeah, I'm a little confused as to why this article only introduces the phenomenon as occuring to German. The word "smoking", for example, also exists in French, and they also have the word "footing" to describe what I believe is the sport of "jogging" or "runing". soulpatch

No need to be confused. You are absolutely right, as I indicated this probably occurs in all languages. Why don't you input your examples in the relevant language paras, the more examples the better.--Dieter Simon 00:36 Feb 7, 2003 (UTC)

Your turn, Soulpatch, do include your "smoking", "footing", "jogging" and "running". But are they actually pseudo-anglicisms? In other words these words have changed in meaning or morphology in French?--Dieter Simon 22:50 Feb 7, 2003 (UTC)

I am unable to log in on the article "Pseudo-anglicism", but the "Discuss this page" opens straightaway with my user name. How can I get round this little problem?--Dieter Simon 00:39 Feb 15, 2003 (UTC)

Note: the below discussion is copied from what is now the Talk:Pseudo-Anglicism (temp) page after it was moved without its history & talk.

Just a query, Jacquerie, what has happened to the rest of the page history? Is there any reason why it should have disappeared? Would appreciate if you could throw some light on this. Thanks --Dieter Simon 21:53 May 7, 2003 (UTC)

looks to be under Pseudo-anglicism (lowercase a). - Hephaestos 21:56 May 7, 2003 (UTC)

Many thanks, Hephaestos, I should have realised --Dieter Simon 22:02 May 7, 2003 (UTC)

Jacquerie27 ought to have moved it instead of copying it and redirecting the other. I'm going to move this one to Pseudo-Anglicism (temp), delete the redirect that will be created at Pseudo-Anglicism, move Pseudo-anglicism to Pseudo-Anglicism with history & talk intact, and merge edits to Pseudo-Anglicism since its creation into the old one. Whew! So, maybe don't touch for a couple of minutes. -- John Owens 22:05 May 7, 2003 (UTC)
OK, everything should be good to go now. If anyone feels an overpowering need to move it back to the lowercased Pseudo-anglicism, please have the redirect now there deleted and move this one into its place, rather than copying & pasting it into there. -- John Owens 22:17 May 7, 2003 (UTC)
Many thanks, John, for bringing it back --Dieter Simon 22:44 May 7, 2003 (UTC)
Why is pseudo-anglicism capitalized on this page (Pseudo-Anglicism)? That looks out of line with the Wikipedia style of capitalizing only proper nouns in titles and headings, which anglicism certainly is not. I really believe, the term should be spelled pseudo-anglicism and not Pseudo-Anglicism. -- Markus Kuhn 11:32, 24 Apr 2005 (UTC)
It is the result of a slightly skewed previous attempt at redirecting to a lower-case version. So, there should be redirect lower-case version around. If you are going to "have the overpowering need to move it back to the lowercased Pseudo-anglicism, please have the redirect now there deleted and move this one into its place, rather than copying & pasting it into there" (John Owens words, see above). Dieter Simon 00:21, 25 Apr 2005 (UTC)


Sorry about the confusion: I'm still learning how to use things like "move", and the slooooowness of things sometimes gets in the way. Jacquerie27 06:55 May 8, 2003 (UTC)
Slowness? What slown... SQL error while processing... ess? -- John Owens 06:58 May 8, 2003 (UTC)

Ok, understood, thanks, 

--Dieter Simon 20:32 May 8, 2003 (UTC)

IMO the word "Karaoke" doesn't fall into the category of "pseudo-Anglicisms" The latter is defined here to be kind of false friend, with the main trait to be misleading to the native English speaker. There is nothing misleading in Karaoke IMO. There are scores of words in Japanese language borrowed from English and sometimes distorted beyond recognition. But distortion does not make them "pseudo": it happens all the time with words, borrowed or even native ones. One might argue that the literal meaning of Karaoke, i.e., "without orchestra" is misleading, because Karaoke involves recorded accompaniment without vocal, rather than vocal without orchestra. But hardly an average English speaker is aware of that and hence might feel mislead.

Therefore I'd suggest to move the interesting case of "Karaoke" into a more appropriate article about neologisms.

I could propose the following draft.

<<<

Some Japanese neologisms of English origin are worth noticing because they have found their way back into English (as well as into numerous other languages).
  • Karaoke is an abbreviated form of the agglutination kara (empty) + ôkesutora (orchestra, the English version of its Greek original). It stands for the singing of popular tunes by participants to the accompaniment of these tunes recorded with original vocal absent or less loud.
  • Anime is an abbreviation of the Japanese transliteration of "animation"; it denotes Japanese animated video.

>>>


mikkalai 21 Nov 2003

Hi Mikkalai,
Sorry, if I didn't do a better job explaining this particular item. Yes, I do understand that neologisms occur in Japanese as well as any other languages, it is the way they originate that is the point. I have rewritten my original para.
It is not meant to be pseudo from a Japanese point of view. From an English point of view it is the "empty orchestra", when people in a pub, for example, are singing to the accompaniment of pre-recorded music, that is such a beautiful metaphor. The Japanese use of the combination does get close to a pseudo-anglicism. This is not meant as a slight against Japanese speakers of English.
Dieter Simon 22:44, 21 Nov 2003 (UTC)

May I suggest that the useage of the word "strafe" in modern computer games is not as inaccurate as indicated, as were a person to fire while making the mentioned sideways motion they would be strafing the enemy with fire, in line with the mentioned common use as the horizontal yawing component of the original term, merely transplanted to a different context.

aragoto November 8, 2004

I'd suggest removing "hoomu" from the notes on Japanese. This doesn't come from the English "home"; it is simply a Japanese abbreviation of "purattohoomu" ("platform"). I presume the shortened form took over because the seven-character full version is tedious to pronounce in Japanese. You might substitute "abekku" (from the French "avec"), which means either "a (dating) couple" (slightly out of date usage) or "successive home runs hit by the third and fourth batters in a baseball game".

Why don't you have a go yourself, aragoto? I am sure you can make good para of this. Dieter Simon 01:05, 9 Nov 2004 (UTC)

French "parking" isn't equivalent to English "parking" but, rather, corresponds to British English "car park" and American English "parking lot". French "camping" is analogous. French "shampooing" isn't English but thinks it is.

-philia

The suffix -philia does not actually mean "perversion" as such, it means "love of, attraction to, or pleasure in". It is only when it is used in a compound form as a term of disapprobation or censure that it takes on the connotation "perversion", as in paraphilia, paedophilia, etc. The compound term paraphilia actually means "abnormal sexual behaviour or tendency", but not the suffix "-philia" itself. Dieter Simon 7 July 2005 22:35 (UTC)

"Pathetic": Sorry, could you tell us what the Greek antonym of "pathetic" is then and why it means the opposite? (;-) Many thanks. Dieter Simon 7 July 2005 22:56 (UTC)

Pathetic; arousing pitty, miserably inadequate. From Greek pathetikos meaning "sensitive" from pathos meaning "suffering". Not really antonymical so much as semantic shift.

Clarification needed

The heading section features a paragraph regarding Japanese, which includes the following phrases:

“Also, although the expressions are now out of date, "my home" and "my car" (meaning "one's own home" and "one's own car") enjoyed popularity for many years. English speakers were baffled when they heard questions like "Do you have my home?"”

I was unable to infer the intended meaning for "Do you have my home?", can someone clarify this in the article? (You may call me an idiot for not being able to understand it if you wish, but if I can't, then maybe some other people can't either. :-)) --Gutza T T+ 21:49, 10 September 2005 (UTC)

beamer?

"Beamer" is a commonly-used word in the United States for BMW. I believe it's being misinterpreted as a pseudo-Anglicism by British-English speakers (mostly since I've never heard of the word "beamer" being used to mean projector).

In Dutch we do use 'beamer' to mean a projector. It's mostly used for projectors that are fed the picture to project via electronic signals, not for film/slide/overhead projectors. Beamer in the sense of 'car of the BMW-brand' is not used, we call such a car 'BMW' (pronounced bay-yum-way)

Pieter 16:31, 2 October 2005 (UTC)

Do pseudo-anglisisms like 'handy,' and 'oldtimer' also exist in Dutch and the Scandinavian languages? As a matter of interrest, does Scots (as opposed to Englisch spoken with a Scottish accent and a few distictive words such as 'outwith') have them. Do they exist in laguages such as Gaelic, Irish and Welsh.Myrtone (the strict Australian wikipedian)(talk)

"Beamer" also means BMW in the UK. It is correct to call it a pseudo-Anglicism, since its meaning in German/Dutch is completely different to its meaning in English. 20090206

Pathetic

Based on what is stated above, that the term was correctly borrowed but later had a semantic shift, the term should probably be removed. --Dpr 05:42, 31 October 2005 (UTC)


Can anyone explain why "pathetic" can not be called a "pseudo hellenism" in English? The word in the English meaning will certainly not be understood by a Greek. Ben Jamin —Preceding unsigned comment added by 193.71.38.142 (talk) 12:20, 5 February 2010 (UTC)

Barkeeper

i made an update to the page, to insert the word "Barkeeper" which i have never heard in my life before i went to germany. when i explained to the germans that we say "bartender" in english, they were like.. really? anyhow, would just like to know why it was removed. Dentontyndale 06:23, 10 December 2006 (UTC) (just updated this to put my name beside my comment. thanks for the response and clarification by the way. it is an english word though no native english speaker i have met uses it. there is no doubt in my mind now that it is not a pseudo-anglicism.)

If you have never heard of the term "barkeeper" in English, then you haven't been around. See the following websites alone:
However, there are many more anglophone websites, discussing the word (yes, there are a number of German websites as well), but see http://www.searchmash.com/search/barkeeper
I strongly recommend taking it out of "pseudo-anglicism", if an old-timer (no not the German pseudo-anglicism "oldtimer") like Mark Twain can use it in English, then we can all use it in English and it has no business in the Wikipedia article "Pseudo-anglicism". Dieter Simon 00:09, 14 November 2006 (UTC)
Google lists 14 million "hits" for bartender, 1 million for barkeeper — and 300 thousand "hits" for barkeep. — Robert Greer (talk) 00:01, 21 November 2008 (UTC)

disputed pseudo-anglicisms in german

Dieter asserts that (Dunking, Dribbling, Wellness, nick, to chat are used in exactly the same way in English, and have the same meanijng. They are therefor not pseudo-anglicisms) Where have you heard native English speakers say "That was a good dunking!" or "That was a good dribbling!"? Also, where in the Anglophone world do they say "nick" for screenname?

Come, Come now, Adam, you are being funny, aren't you? 'Dunking', 'dribbling', etc. are present participles or nouns of the verbs 'to dunk', 'to dribble', etc. and therefore are fully explained as English words in such worthy (American) English dictionaries as msn. Encarta; Merriam-Webster Online; dictionary.com; and www.onelook.com and explained as perfectly good basketball expressions. 'To dribble' or 'dribbling' is also a British English expression, this time in soccer, which means exactly what it means in German. If you insist to use the words in slightly weird phrases such as "That was a good dribbling!", etc., I can only say that I feel a bit sorry for you. I can assure you that you can hear "That was a nice bit of dribbling" any time on any English football terraces. All you need to consult is any decent English dictionaries and the words will be defined in English as English words. As for 'nick' as a screenname, that derives from and is abbreviated for 'nickname', but is also used in English forums, for example. Just look around. Dieter Simon 01:50, 6 January 2006 (UTC)
"Nick" is certainly used on IRC, but I speak German and I have never heard most of these. "Camping" perhaps, Handy certainly, but most of them I would say are either not used or extremely uncommon. Pw33n (talk) 02:04, 15 October 2008 (UTC)

Swiss made (Swiss-made)

Is "Swiss made" (or "Swiss-made") correct English? I do not believe so. Merriam-Webster has no matches. "Swiss", as far as I know, is an adjective, not an adverb, and thus cannot be combined with an other adjective ("made"). So "Swiss made" could be a pseudo-anglicism, for the term is used in many product labels, e.g. watches. Cf. also [1] and [2] (<-- in window title) as examples. Wkr, --Paunaro 18:02, 8 March 2007 (UTC)

I don't think that's a pseudo-Anglicism so much as a simple hyphenation error. — Gwalla | Talk 07:00, 11 March 2007 (UTC)

Sexdate

This is used all over the place in Germany's largest gay hook-up site, [www.gayromeo.de]. It has since entered the vernacular. Zweifel 08:01, 14 March 2007 (UTC)

Kicker (German) / Foosball (English)

Seems that it gets Anglicized in one direction and Germanized (fußball) in the other. Does this merit a mention? Nof 21:50, 19 September 2007 (UTC)

By the face

What about the Spanish by the face? It's a word-for-word translation of por la cara ("[to do something] shamelessly, [to be given something] absolutely free"). It's not uncommon to hear it as "baideféis". Does it qualify? --Error 22:02, 19 September 2007 (UTC)

Pompom Girl

Despite what the page said, I heard an American from Arkansas (and not one likely to have been influenced by French, if I might say) use this expression. Another confirmed me it was a perfectly acceptable term which he heard interchangeable for cheerleader for his whole life... So does it really deserve to stay as a pseudo-anglicism? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 82.224.148.118 (talk) 18:44, 9 January 2008 (UTC)

Likewise in Ohio west of Cleveland during my childhood, which leads me to a broader problem; some of what are listed as pseudo-anglicisms may have been in use by native speakers of English with substantially the same meaning at the time they were adopted into a foreign language but are not in use any longer. — Robert Greer (talk) 23:58, 20 November 2008 (UTC)

Removal of pseudo-foreign words adapted to English

Mikkalai, your removal of the list of pseudo-foreign because of being "unreferenced"? I can understand the reason why they don't really belong into a list of pseudo-anglicisms (they had been added because there were no other lists for them at the time when I created "Pseudo-anglicism") but because of being "unreferenced"? That's a bit disingenuous isn't it? What are you going to do then with all the "unreferenced" and unsourced pseudo-anglicisms? Are you going to throw them out too? I suppose you'll have one or two left, if you are lucky. Just to chuck them like that without referring to any-one is pretty un-Wikipedian isn't it? Or isn't it necessary any more to have some kind of article about foreign words which have had their meaning changed when used in the English vernacular? Or were you going to create new articles yourself? I have started a German one for the time being. Dieter Simon (talk) 01:39, 6 February 2008 (UTC)

Tagalog

Doesn't Tagalog have a lot of loanwords from English as an American colony?--69.234.211.219 (talk) 17:38, 25 February 2008 (UTC)

Well, why don't you tell us and cite the sources where the facts may be found. All additional material would be welcome. The only thing is that pseudo-anglicisms in Tagalog would have to have their original meanings changed fo make it a pseudo-anglicism. Dieter Simon (talk) 23:16, 27 February 2008 (UTC)
I'm not a big expert on it or anything, but some of the information is already on Wikipedia, just not in this article. If we have editors on the English Wikipedia who also speak Tagalog, I think that more will come. --69.234.183.233 (talk) —Preceding comment was added at 02:26, 13 March 2008 (UTC)

Body?

Well, on German article discussion, the pseudo-anglicism state of "body" is disputed! Yes you do not have it listed in the German section, but you do in other languages! My researches also gave the result that in English the piece of clothing is called body suit, BUT also abbreviated as "body". Hence I'd sugggest to remove the "body" entry from all language sections. -andy 92.227.17.160 (talk) 22:40, 15 July 2008 (UTC)

As a native English speaker (and father) living in Germany, I am also puzzled by Body which I take to be the perfectly normal English word for a baby's all-in-one garment. I never thought of it as a contraction of 'body suit' and I have never heard of the (American English) term onesie. Can this be removed from the Italian section please? - Danbelasco (talk) 21:30, 14 June 2009 (UTC)

Well I am sorry, but do you never google? Or Yahoo? Just enter "onesies" and you will be confronted by hundreds of entries. Most of them websites trying to sell them, granted, but they are there nevertheless. Dieter Simon (talk) 00:29, 15 June 2009 (UTC)

If "body" in English is also used as a a contraction of "body suit", then of course it should be removed from the Italian section. Any other native English speaker could confirm? --Guido71 (talk) 12:33, 15 June 2009 (UTC)

Collins English Dictionary (2007) certainly gives under "body" (16) "a woman's close-fitting one-piece garment for the torso". I think this certainly qualifies for English usage, and any other language using the word in the same sense is therefore using it correctly as a foreign linguistic term (for them) and not as a pseudo-anglicism. Dieter Simon (talk) 22:58, 15 June 2009 (UTC)

Break [fra]

This is English!! Break - Je fais un break = I rest. Nonsensical entry! In English: "I take a break" = "I rest", too! Makes no sense for me to list this here. -andy 92.227.17.160 (talk) 22:44, 15 July 2008 (UTC)

List of modifications

Here a summary of the modifications I applied recently:

- General section: I have removed it as it was only confusing, and useless.

All its entries have been copied into the corresponding languages.

- Dutch language: Added camper and fitness.

- French language: Added basket, body (for infants), box, brushing, dancing, dressing, fitness, mail, penalty, pull, scotch, slip, speaker, ticket restaurant, trench, volley, zapping

Added some IPA symbols to the most bizarre pronunciations

Removed "break" (ex. Je fais un break), as it has the same meaning in English.

Removed "pom-pom girl", as it also exists in English: http://www.webster-dictionary.org/definition/pompom girl

Fixed "Caddy" -> "Caddie"

- German language: Added fitness

- Italian language: Removed anti-doping (same meaning in English, although in English it's only an adjective, and not a noun).

Removed sig (sigh is used actually)

Added bar, basket, beauty (case), beauty farm, body (2 meanings), body rental, box (4 meanings), cargo, custom, dancing, fiction, fitness, golf, jolly, k-way, killer, luna park, mail, mister, montgomery, night, penalty, pressing, recordman, scotch, skilift, slip, speaker, telefilm, ticket, ticket restaurant, tight, toast, trench, tutor, volley, water, zapping

Added some IPA symbols to the most bizarre pronunciations

- Spanish language: Removed telefilm, as it has the same meaning in English. --Guido71 (talk) 09:19, 8 February 2009 (UTC)

"Zapping" removed. Commonly used in English. Furthermore, English dictionary definition of "to zap" includes "to use a remote control to repeatedly change channels on a television." 91.85.135.167 (talk) 21:11, 2 December 2010 (UTC)

Pseudo-anglicisms in various languages (Common section) is useless

Please do not add the common section "Pseudo-anglicisms in various languages", as it does not mean anything. Which "various" languages in particular are you talking about?

The page is much clearer without this section.

Thanks --Guido71 (talk) 09:18, 8 February 2009 (UTC)

Scotch

The word "scotch" in French and Italian (and Russian?) is used to indicate any brand of adhesive tape. In English they use instead "Scotch tape" or "Sellotape": the word "scotch" alone does not have the same meaning as in French and Italian. --Guido71 (talk) 09:15, 8 February 2009 (UTC)

Penalty

Penalty is not a pseudo-anglicism under any circumstances. The term "penalty" is used for "penalty kick" as well as the award itself of the penalty kick. If you only mixed with the people on the terraces you would soon hear them talk in terms of "he scored a penalty" as well as "they were awarded a penalty". Sorry, I shall have to remove this from the list. Dieter Simon (talk) 00:48, 8 February 2009 (UTC)

Well done. --Guido71 (talk) 09:14, 8 February 2009 (UTC)

Bar [ita]

In Italian "bar" should be considered as a pseudo-anglicism, as explained here:

http://wiki.riteme.site/wiki/Bar_(establishment)#Italy

- In English, a bar serves drinks, especially alcoholic beverages such as beer, liquor, and mixed drinks. In Italy you we call that a "pub".

- In Italy, a "bar" is a place more similar to a Café, where people go during the morning or the afternoon, usually to take a coffee, a cappuccino, a hot chocolate and eat some kind of snack like pastries and sandwiches (panini or tramezzini). However, any kind of alcoholic beverages are served. --Guido71 (talk) 09:14, 8 February 2009 (UTC)

Backshop

This is not a pseudo-anglicism, but is just a german word combined with an englich word. --MrBurns (talk) 13:28, 29 March 2009 (UTC)

Micro

This is not a pseudo-anglicism either, but just the short form of the standard German word "Mikrofon", derived from Greek just as the English "microphone". It is usually spelled with a "k" and pronounced as a German word.

--Maribert (talk) 14:54, 16 June 2009 (UTC)

Salaryman

An interesting boomerang case-- the Japanese term for an office employee, or middle-manager, is 'sarariman', from the English salary + man. But I have seen it used, non-ironically, in English to designate Japanese empoyees/middle managers...Rhinoracer (talk) 12:58, 7 July 2009 (UTC)

"Autostop" as a "pseudo-anglicism"?

The word "autostop", which appears in several languages, is out of place in a list of pseudo-anglicisms. First off, the word "auto" derives directly from "Automobile", which is a combination of Latin and Greek and exists in many, if not most languages (see interwikis on Automobile). In many languages, it is shortened to "auto" in everyday language. Thus, there's no reason why Germans or Hungarians should believe that "auto" is, out of all languages, an English word. Similar things can be said about "stop". Although originally an English word (as far as I know), it's become so universal in many languages that it's no longer perceived of as a loanword or an anglicism. There's no reason why a compound of two verbs, one of which is definitely not an anglicism and the other's status as an anglicims is at least dubious, should suddenly be classed as a pseudo-anglicism, i.e., according to the introduction, a word "that appears to be English". Jimmy Fleischer (talk) 14:14, 7 September 2009 (UTC)

"Jingle" in Spanish

removed jingle because it is commonly used in the same sense in American English —Preceding unsigned comment added by 71.58.91.59 (talk) 20:47, 24 September 2009 (UTC)

"Keks" does originate in "cakes"

Although the German word "Keks" is not a pseudo-anglicism, doesn't therefore belong into this article, I must contradict the anon editor who claims it originates in the Old Norse word kaka (see history of this article). "Keks" doesn't sound anything like "kaka", it does, however, sound like a German accented "cakes". It is a German borrowing from English. It is true of course, that all these words as such are related, and therefore all such words as cook, kochen, kitchen, Küche, cuisine as well as "kaka" ultimately belong together, but that doesn't make "Keks" any more similar to "kaka". Dieter Simon (talk) 00:26, 26 October 2009 (UTC) Dieter Simon (talk) 00:28, 26 October 2009 (UTC) Dieter Simon (talk) 01:58, 26 October 2009 (UTC)

Israeli Hebrew

Removing 'fan', (Fan (פן) — blow drying) As this is a mistake (Origin, the german trademark 'Fön', from dry-wind http://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Föhn ). The Israeli Hebrew word is Fen and not Fan, it is probably imported via Slavic languages (Russian, Czech:: http://ru.wikipedia.org/wiki/Фен, http://cs.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fén). The Slavic term is probably imported from German:: 'Föhn' http://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Föhn / http://wiki.riteme.site/wiki/Foehn_wind

Also, I don't see how "Mammy (מאמי) — sweetheart" - is specifically English related (and if so, it's probably original research, or please quote source).

"Tramp" (again, wrong, the Hebrew word is 'Tremp'), is somewhat dubious, but I'll leave it for peer review for now. As for 'On the face' - I don't think comical translations of trendy phrases fit into this list, literate translation of phrases into English, seems common now in spoken Israeli-Hebrew, always for a comic effect, the speaker is aware of the phrase not being (idiomatic) English. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 77.125.97.167 (talk) 23:10, 26 December 2009 (UTC)

There's many 'real-obvious-pseudo-anglicisms' in Hebrew, I'll try to add a few —Preceding unsigned comment added by 77.125.97.167 (talk) 23:21, 26 December 2009 (UTC)

Israel native here, a few things: 1. Tramp טרמפ is indeed to hitch hike but is pronounced 'Tremp'. 2. I have been speaking hebrew all my life, never heard the expression 'On de feys'. 3. Also - 'Cornflakes' is pronounced - 'cornfleks' קורנפלקס. If there are no objections I'll make the changes, Cheers —Preceding unsigned comment added by 79.178.184.211 (talk) 18:32, 20 November 2010 (UTC)

German: Trainings-

Dieter, I'm afraid I don't understand your latest entry:

  • Trainings- — in compound terms such as Trainingsanzug, -hose, and -jacke for tracksuit, - trousers, and - top

A Trainingsanzug is an Anzug (a suit) to wear at training sessions in preparation for sports competitions. How is this a pseudo-anglicism? --EnOreg (talk) 08:02, 14 July 2010 (UTC)

Yes, I know what you are saying, EnOreg, but is the full version of "training suit" for "tracksuit" ever used by native English speakers? I doubt it. What would a "training anzug" or training suit consist of in the eyes of an English speaker, I wonder. A tracksuit or a city suit the manager might be wearing attending a training session of his team? Sorry, I am not really facetious here, I think a training suit would not easily be understood in the U.S. or the UK, it certainly wouldn't be used. Dieter Simon (talk) 22:57, 14 July 2010 (UTC)
Let me correct myself, yes, it might be understood as any suit for training, but a "tracksuit" is a generic kind of thing, isn't it? Would a "training suit" conjure that up in the mind of the beholder? Dieter Simon (talk) 23:27, 14 July 2010 (UTC)
I think I wasn't clear, sorry. As you know, the German term is not 'Trainingssuit' but 'Trainingsanzug', only part of which is an anglicism: 'Training', which is a perfectly acceptable English word for the type of exercise the German use refers to--and that's all that counts. I don't find it convincing to first translate the German part of the word to English to then point out that the term 'training suit' doesn't exist. I just think it's too far-fetched to be a typical example that would help make the point of this article. Keep in mind that the list is not supposed to be complete, just to give some illustrative examples. Cheers, --EnOreg (talk) 09:27, 16 July 2010 (UTC)
The point is, EnOreg, your are talking about the definition of the word "training", not the usage of the word as for "tracksuit" in English. Yes, to know what training means is one thing, however, the word used even as a compound word in English in this context is quite another. It is not the lexical definition we are after, it is whether the the compound "training" is used in whatever combination, "training suit", "training kit", or "training outfit" to actually stand for "tracksuit", and I don't think it is. A "training" combination of that kind could be almost anything, rather than a "tracksuit". Dieter Simon (talk) 23:31, 16 July 2010 (UTC)
Again, I understand you point. I remain unconvinced that it qualifies as a proper pseudo-anglicism as it is so far-fetched. Moreover, even if it were one, it's just too weak an example to merit inclusion in this list. --EnOreg (talk) 07:58, 19 July 2010 (UTC)
What does "far-fetched" or "too weak" mean. Will an English-speaker recognise "training kit", "training suit", or any other combination as meaning a tracksuit? Ask English-speakers what they understand by these compounds. If they don't know what these compound nouns mean then you have a clear case of pseudo-anglicism. There is nothing weak, far-fetched or obscure about this. Dieter Simon (talk) 23:58, 19 July 2010 (UTC)
Take this to include the above-mentioned: what would they think a "Trainingshose" is, or a "Trainingsjacke"? "Training" is irrevocably an English word, but combined with unlikely German words "-hose" or "-jacke", would they mean anything at all? I fear not. In English all of them would need some interpretation to make them understood, similar to "talkmaster" and "showmaster", after all we in English do have "toastmaster" which seems to be the original prototype of them. Having to explain what an English-sounding word means to an English-speaker surely makes it a pseudo-anglicism. Ok, you might say yes, an English and German mixture in a compound does not count, but it needs to be listed somewhere. Where indeed would you list it, if not here? Dieter Simon (talk) 00:32, 20 July 2010 (UTC)

It is time we cited sources with each entry

It is high time we started to only allow entries with accompanying sources cited. These unending additions of examples are all well and good, but how can we be sure that the entries are in fact correct. It takes a fluent speaker of an individual language to ascertain the entry pertaining to that language is correct, and unless each item is strictly patrolled as to its correctness (which is not always possible, is it?) anybody can say anything. Unless there is someone who really knows whether a pseudo-English term is used in their own language, and is on the ball detecting it, any non-speakers of that language would be none the wiser. And yet, all examples might be important in one way or another and therefore there is an absolute need for them to be correct

Another thing is, that we don't always seem to be in agreement about entries, so a citation of sources would help immensely to do away with the ensuing controversies which occur time and time again. Dieter Simon (talk) 01:28, 21 November 2010 (UTC)

German: Cornflakes

In my experience, Cornflakes only refers to this. Anything else would probably be called Müsli/Müesli. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Sbjf (talk • contribs) 10:07, 21 November 2010 (UTC)

No. If anything, it's exactly the other way round. ;) Müsli is a somewhat more specific thing, although certainly not a single one product! Moreover, what is clearly a Müsli, would never be called Cornflakes in German. But Cornflakes really can be _much_ more, than just the product you linked here! As easily put as goes, perhaps, one might say that in German, any breakfast cereal that is not Müsli, will probably and in a generalized sense be called Cornflakes. A breakfast cereal, however, that definitely doesn't fit the rather broad Cornflakes notion, may thus very well be recognized as a Müsli. In fact, and as a German, I can't even think of a breakfast cereal that would not either be called Cornflakes, or Müsli. Yet nothing can ever be both, that's for sure! ;D (Maybe except in the exotic case of mixing flakes and müsli, but who would want to do that?) Zero Thrust (talk) 21:30, 10 October 2011 (UTC)
I, as a native German speaker, never heared Germans use the word Cornflakes for other cereals than those flakes made of corn (cf. de:Cornflakes). The point is that some Germans don't know exactly what cornflakes are made of, because german Korn is any kind of grain. But they do know what cornflakes are. Breakfast cereals are usually called Zerealien, Cerealien (esp. promotinal) or Frühstücksflocken. – Mymykry (talk) 23:12, 21 November 2011 (UTC)
I agree. It's certainly true that many Germans could not translate "cornflakes" back to what it properly means (in German), namely as much as Maisflocken. While this may be the chief reason why many don't know what cornflakes actually are, it's at the same time only compounded by the fact of most Germans having (only) learned British English at school, where corn of course is not a very common way to name the thing in question. As that would rather be maize instead. Terms like Zerealien however are not commonly used other than in advertising, it would sound stilted in normal, colloquial speech--or, at least I never heard it outside of advertising. My contrasting of cornflakes and Müsli meanwhile was due to the trivial fact that I personally don't know of breakfast cereals which aren't either the one or the other.^^ While Müsli naturally consists chiefly of oats (as well as some nuts and the like), Cornflakes are basically (American) corn.. which is, again, maize. Yet, what else is there? As for me, that's pretty much the end of the story. And the current article version, by the way, is broadly correct. At this point, that is. Zero Thrust (talk) 00:18, 25 November 2011 (UTC)
No! Looking it up again--sorry--it isn't correct at all! *g* The current version reads as if you would, or at least could call even Müsli "Cornflakes" in German. Which is very wrong, as we made clear above. Maybe someone likes to remove the whole entry? Because by now I'm unsure why it should be in at all. Once more, whether in German(y) or not, Cornflakes are indeed made of corn (i.e. maize in Britain) and they also (well mostly) come in the form of flakes. Thus not what I'd call a pseudo-anglicism then. Zero Thrust (talk) 00:23, 25 November 2011 (UTC)
Okay, I did not really want to imply that something that is not 'Cornflakes' would be 'Müsli', but what it currently says ("Cornflakes — any breakfast cereal") is most definitely wrong, since Müsli is a type of breakfast cereal but it is most definitely not Cornflakes. Sbjf (talk) 17:58, 5 December 2011 (UTC)
Sure! We fully agree, just see my last post. It all comes down to the entry either being completely unwarranted, or just being misleadingly formulated. In other words, whether the term "Cornflakes" per se has to be considered a pseudo-anglicism at all; while, in my opinion, this solely depends on whether it has originally ever been used in the English language itself. This, indeed, seems to be the case because of..?! It even refers to excatly the same entity! Well, yes, it's given as two words there, but the spacing seems to be arbitrary, and in any case German simply tends to be rather more synthetic in situations like these, than, say, English. This alone, however, doesn't make a pseudo-anglicism? Comparing it with an entirely valid entry like, for instance, "Ego-Shooter": That qualifies as a pseudo-anglicism all right, since it simply isn't used in English, not with this semantics or any other, never has been, nor would it even be known as such in English. And it wouldn't, irrespective of whether given as "ego-shooter", or "ego shooter", or "egoshooter", or whatever. In short, it does not belong to the English lexicon. A fact that evidently doesn't hold for the corn(-)flakes, and.. uh, to cut things short I'll indeed remove the entry just now. This appears to happen in general agreement, so if someone else still objects, please explain why. Zero Thrust (talk) 23:18, 5 December 2011 (UTC)

Czech

  • server — website ("server" is also called "server")
    • Web server. They use it for all WEBSITES, what is not the meaning in English. Not at all. I do not understand why it was deleted. For Czechs any web site is a server. They use it instead of the word "website". Mike, you should not remove it, if you do not speak Czech AND English, because the meaning is different, liker "beamer" in German.
  • bigbyt — rock music
    • It's spelled "bigbít", and it obviously comes from big beat. Not a pseudo-anglicism.
  • travestie — transvestite show
    • "Travestie show" is also used in English.
  • narkoman — drug addict
    • From the international term "narcomania".
  • manchestery — corduroy trousers
    • This one is a good example - but properly, it would be spelled manšestr (meaning corduroy)
  • byznysman — corrupt entrepreneur. Derogatory term
    • Huh? As far as I know, it simply means "businessman".
  • hemenex — ham and eggs
    • Not a pseudo-anglicism.
  • nonstop — late night bar NOT open 24 hours
    • That's a misuse of the term, and not a pseudo-anglicism.
  • reality — realty
    • I don't think this is a pseudo-anglicism, either ("reality" is a plural in Czech; the singular form is "realita").
  • manekinka — female fashion model
    • The word is "manekýn", "manekýna" (meaning male/female fashion model) - mannequin is also used in English.

Removed all. - Mike Rosoft (talk) 10:16, 21 November 2010 (UTC)

Czech/update

I'd say there is a lot of confusion on what is a pseudo-anglicism in here. Only neologisms based on, or misuses of the originally borrowed word could be considered a pseudo-anything linguistically.

  • Deleted Centropen as it has nothing to do with pseudo-anglicims, it is a company name which includes the anglicims pen as a component.
  • Deleted bigbít/big beat as it is simply a borrowing of the original name for Beat music of the sixties.
  • Deleted fix as it is a pseudo-germanism in the meaning of something unchanging (cp. with pencil), ultimately from latin.
  • Deleted luncheon meat. A borrowing from Brittish English which specialised in meaning.
  • Deleted lux as there is simply no justification for it to be there. A specialised use of the company name. The name itself is not proper English but exists there which probably lead to its addition.
  • Deteled magnetophone, first: it is a borrowing from German. Second, it is analyzable as a neologism with both components from Greek.
  • Deleted secondhand. The word is used in the same sense in English, although mostly specialised to only mean used clothes shop nowadays in Czech. A common borrowing. Not a neologism derived from English borrowing(s).
  • Deleted Xerox. Not in common use use anymore but used to be a normal anglicism.
  • Dubious: minimarket. I haven't heard it being used in Czech. The combination Mini Market is used in names of small convenience stores ran by Indian/Pakistani immigrants, sometimes Vietnamese. So while I doubt most would consider it part of the Czech laguage and while I think it is used in the same sense in English, I left it there.

Muflon 83 (talk) 13:28, 24 February 2017 (UTC)

Well done. And I'm deleting minimarket too: Never heard it either, but the point is that the claim is it means "convenience store", which is an English meaning too, cf Oxford Dictionaries online [3]. --Droigheann (talk) 01:46, 25 February 2017 (UTC)

Please ascertain that English terms in other languages really are pseudo-

I have just reverted "Mini Market/convenience store" and "info/information" as being pseudo-anglicisms. They are not pseudo-, either terms are used in either British or American English. Suspect too is "Tip-Ex" for "correction pen", I have certainly used Tip-Ex for correction fluid, and am not sure whether they might have produced "correction pens" as well. You really will have to make sure that the English words used in other languages are deifinitely not used or known by native English speakers. The language spoken by speakers using English as their first language is much more varied and manifold than is thought at times.Dieter Simon (talk) 01:40, 28 November 2010 (UTC)


--from Dutch: "Drugs primarily referred to as drugs for Recreational drug use" Isn't this the primary use in British English as well? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 90.211.122.217 (talk) 21:08, 30 March 2011 (UTC)

new broom

I took out some terms that are used in the same way in (some variety of) English, and moved the repeated entries into a new Multiple languages section.

I also removed

  • Aktualia (אקטואליה) - real-time, current events

because I believe it's unlikely to come from English. The French word for 'current events' is actualités, and I believe German has a similar usage; the cognate of actual in those languages means 'current' (rather than 'real' as in English). —Tamfang (talk) 01:25, 2 May 2011 (UTC)

apple pie de manzana

When my father was learning Spanish, he told me (so it must be true) that apple pie means any kind of pie. Can someone confirm? —Tamfang (talk) 22:11, 2 May 2011 (UTC)

German: Twen

Twen isn't a German word, as far I know it's US slang (with a different meaning). — Preceding unsigned comment added by 93.245.226.92 (talk) 15:46, 13 June 2011 (UTC)

And how it is. It is used in German with (and only with) the semantics given here, while it isn't as such in English, which makes it a proper pseudo-anglicism. Please refer to any dictionary at your discretion before claiming what simply isn't the case. You should also sign your posts... Zero Thrust (talk) 10:33, 22 December 2011 (UTC)

Eastern Europe / Balkans

  • "Non stop" (also "nonstop" and "non-stop") is used in various countries to mean "open 24 hours" rather than "without breaks or pauses". It is mostly used on signs for shops, bars, restaurants, and "terraces". Amazingly, it is even used in Bulgaria in Latin script though everything else there is of course written in Cyrillic script.
  • "Terrace" is used in Romania to refer to a kind of bar/restaurant at a beach, no matter whether it is located on a terrace or has a terrace or otherwise. I haven't figured out its exact scope yet though. For instance whether it also applies to places that only serve alcohol and not food, or only on beaches. (I'm pretty sure it was also used for the bar/restaurants around Lake Malta in Poznan, Poland.) My Romanian friends have excellent English and none of them ever uses another word for it when speaking English to me.

— Hippietrail (talk) 10:32, 7 August 2011 (UTC)

French: Foot in Canada

I have never heard "foot" for Canadian football. That's "football" (pronounced as if it were English). "Foot" meaning soccer is a mark that one has spent a while in France, but it's well understood. Bhudson (talk) 00:00, 15 August 2011 (UTC)

Dubious pseudo-Anglicisms in French

I removed "mail" since the term "mail" in English often means to email.

I removed "look" since the term "look" in English often refers to image / fashion.

I removed "shampooing" since it means "shampoo."

Seeing as "shampooing" has now been put back into the list, with a specification of how it's supposedly pronounced, it should at least follow the standard of Help:IPA_for_French. I suppose what they meant is "[ʃɑ̃pwɛ̃]", but I don't know either if that's the correct pronunciation nor how to use the IPA font.166.137.101.171 (talk) 15:03, 20 August 2014 (UTC)Collin237

I removed "rugbyman" given that it, unsurprisingly, denotes a man who plays rugby. Same for "tennisman". "Recordman" in English would mean a musician, which is not at all the meaning here, so I'm leaving it.

I removed "talkie-walkie" since it is copied from English. The two orderings were used during early press reports, according to http://dlhings.ca/walkietalkie.html . Even if not, it seems inconceivable an anglophone would have trouble recognizing the word.

I removed "black" since it means "black" as in the race. In English, as a noun we usually only use it to generalize over all Blacks. That's the meaning that French has taken and extended to the singular case. That makes it not particularly hard to understand.

I almost removed "zapping" since I have heard "to zap" as in channel surfing, but I can't find it on google. I notice someone else also found it dubious.Bhudson (talk) 00:32, 15 August 2011 (UTC)

I added back "black" and "mail". I can see your point for "black", indeed the meaning is the same, but as you say it has been both restricted ("people with dark skin") and extended at the same time (to designate a single person, whereas an english speaker would say "a black person" or "a black man/woman"), and I guess it makes little sense for an english speaker why french people would use the english word instead of the strictly equivalent french word "noir" (the explanation being : euphemism treadmill). As for "mail" : it may be used in english to mean "e-mail" but only when it's clear from the context, and then it has the general meaning of "sending a written piece of information". If an english speaking person is told to send a "mail" and there's no further context, this person could very well take a piece of paper and a pen and put that in an enveloppe with a post stamp. It's tricky to position the cursor. The rule you advocate seems to be strictly "an english word or expression that is distinctly different from the english original which makes it difficult to understand for an english speaker", which I can agree with, but then it has to be consistent : if "mail" is removed, then so should "fitness", "fashion" and others in the current list. I think all those examples are relevant, provided the list isn't too long as it is.Abolibibelot (talk) 12:06, 18 June 2012 (UTC)
Edit : I removed "mail" again since it's already in the "multiple languages" list.Abolibibelot (talk) 12:18, 18 June 2012 (UTC)

Regarding the entry Compost — compost heap from www.etymonline.com: "compote (n.) 1690s, from French compote "stewed fruit," from Old French composte (13c.) "mixture, compost," from Vulgar Latin *composita, fem. of compositus (see composite). Etymologically the same word as compost (n.)." seems like this is an English loanword from French, not the other way around Draughtmanus (talk) 12:47, 28 January 2013 (UTC)

"Public Viewing" (dubious) in German, and "Happy End" (proposal) also in German

Two points. "Public Viewing" first. At least it has a reference, but as I clicked on the weblink, it lead me nowhere. The site is down. So it rather had a reference. I think it should have one that works, not least because I consider the example dubious. My problem is not that the term "Public Viewing" wouldn't be in use in German, it pretty much is. The semantics given here is correct, too! What I strongly doubt however, has to do with this (from the definition): "...but are used in a way native English speakers would not readily recognize or understand". That, I claim, is hardly the case with "Public Viewing", even when communicated with the meaning exclusive to its German usage. And my suspicion is that it was added to the article by a native speaker of German, who by then was also under the (false, yet in Germany widespread) impression that public viewing, when used in English, always would provoke a connotation with dead bodies or the deceased. But that is evidently not the case, as public viewing in English (although certainly depending on geography) and according to circumstances can mean much more, than the viewing of a dead person. Just as an example (which can easily be verified by way of quick Google search), when someone intends to sell, say, an apartment and runs an advertisement, he or she may then invite interested parties by announcing a public viewing, which would then have quite nothing to do with the dead, but would rather communicate an opportunity for said parties to take a look around the apartment, in order to see whether it is what they might like to buy.

This is not the end of the story, though. Since, as always in a language as flexible as English, there are many more meanings "public viewing" can take on. Hey, what about "showing of football matches on giant screens in public"? 5 seconds using Google teached me...

"In addition to the Official Fan Fests, the City of Johannesburg will boast several public viewing sites for the World Cup. Here, football fans can have the same football fun experience as in the Official Fan Fests."

source: http://www.joburg.org.za/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=5150&Itemid=168

or...

"A football fan reacts as Nigeria misses a goal at a public viewing center in Lagos,.."

source: http://www.boston.com/bigpicture/2010/06/opening_weekend_-_2010_world_c.html

Oh, hold up, Boston?! Since when is Boston in Germany? As I said, this resulted 5 seconds Googling, do it longer, you'll find many more examples. (I know of more myself!) Those are clearly anglophone websites, the context too has nothing to do with either Germany or the German language, and they are using "public viewing" in just the sense considered pseudo-anglicism here. As is by now obvious, unjustly! I will remove "Public Viewing" for this reason. Should anyone oppose this step, please do take a stand on the arguments I provided for doing so.

The other point is a proposal for a new entry instead, although I'm a tad uncertain concerning this one, that's why I'm not adding it myself. This question will be: Is it a pseudo-anglicism? What I have in mind is the "Happy End". That's nothing else but the German rendering of, what is known in English as, the happy ending. It is never used in German with the -ing at the end. And, as far as I know, it is never used in English without it. Considered so far, it seems quite a pseudo-anglicism--one could, however, also find that it's just a sort of misspelling and/or ungrammatical rendering of a term that clearly is (as "happy ending") used in English, again, with the same semantics. It means the same! It would then be "pseudo" only insofar as (in German) it is wrongly spelled--wrongly, of course, from the English perspective only. Yet isn't that what counts? At any rate, it is in my opinion and I thus deem it a proper pseudo-anglicism. Like I said, I won't add it though. The case is too fishy, but if someone knows better, and optimally could even provide a reference, then please feel free to include the "Happy End". Zero Thrust (talk) 10:33, 22 December 2011 (UTC)

Italian use of Mister

I don't think that Italians use the word mister to mean a coach. I think they use the title mister to describe a coach as a sort of honorific because the first football coaches in Italy were British. 82.42.126.68 (talk) 20:55, 31 January 2012 (UTC)

I am Italian and I can definitely confirm that all football players in Italy call their coach "mister". --Guido71 (talk) 15:09, 3 July 2012 (UTC)

That makes it a false friend, and not a pseudo-anglicism; every English speaker knows what "mister" means. This entry should be removed. Mathglot (talk) 00:47, 7 February 2018 (UTC)

Tip(p)-Ex

I am going to remove "Tip-Ex" from the Indonesian section. It's not a pseudo-anglicism, but an example of a generic trademark. The brand name "Tipp-Ex" is not even an anglicism at all. The company is German, and the components of the word are likely derived from German "tippen" (to type) and Latin "ex". Anorak2 (talk) 13:11, 10 June 2012 (UTC)

Why remove entries in German?

Hi guys, the edits here seem to diminish the quality of the entry. While a reference to main entry Denglisch#Pseudo-anglicisms seems appropriate, we're losing a lot of the useful examples that have been painstakingly compiled. Unless there is a good argument for why we shouldn't aim for a comprehensive list of pseudo-anglicisms to help define the complexity and flexibility of the English across different languages, I will reinstall the compilation of Denglish examples. Cheers, Not Sure (talk) 02:31, 26 June 2013 (UTC)

Evergreen

"Evergreen" is standard broadcasting/music jargon and should not be listed here. 24.119.179.110 (talk) 03:36, 9 August 2013 (UTC)

several queries

  • Dutch: Sweater - NOT a sweater, rather a tightly knit version used for sporting activities.

A sweatshirt, or something else?

  • German: Ego-Shooter — first-person shooter (derived from Latin "Ego" = "I")

So it consists of an English word, used as in English, and a non-English word; so does it belong here at all?

  • Thai: Wer or O-wer - Exaggerated or overstated.

This is an English word? —Tamfang (talk) 20:26, 15 September 2013 (UTC)

I removed Ego-Shooter, Queque (muffin, apparently taken from Spanish) and Pants (パンツ, pantsu) (used as in Britain). —Tamfang (talk) 09:46, 19 December 2013 (UTC)

Ego-Shooter is a pseudo-anglicism, though not by WP definition: "Pseudo-anglicisms are words in languages other than English which were borrowed from English but are used in a way native English speakers would not readily recognize or understand.". "ego-shooter" does (and did) not exist in English, thus "Ego-Shooter" can't be borrowed from English, at least not completely but just partly. But pseudo-anglicism don't have to be borrowed from English (at least not completely). They just need to look/sound English (e.g. Handy - though there's handy, so it's not a good example) or be composed of English words (e.g. Showmaster). As English also includes Latin & Greek words and parts of words (pre- and suffixes) "ego-shooter" looks like an English word. Accourding to en.wiktionary.org/wiki/ego#English "ego" is also an English word. So "ego-shooter" might be or look like it's composed of two English words. -80.133.122.202 (talk) 16:46, 20 December 2014 (UTC)

Russian: Экстрасенс (Extrasenseur)

Are you sure it's not from French? It looks all French to me, and I am quite sure that it came from French, supposedky before the first world war when borrowing from French was very common, but I couldn't prove. The same thought about «клозет» («klozet», WC), although I am less sure about this one. - 91.122.9.109 (talk) 21:06, 8 October 2013 (UTC)

I don't have references about their etymologies, yet what is certain is that neither word appears to be English to Russians. Unlike «фитнес» (fitness) and many other words (but, of course, excluding «автостоп» («avtostop», hitchhiking) or «камера» («kamera», camcorder); as for the latter, it looks all Latin, no trace of English). The word «кросс» («kross», cross-country race) enjoys so much of specifically Soviet flavour that I guess hardly many people associate this word with English, too. - 91.122.9.109 (talk) 21:34, 8 October 2013 (UTC)

Spanish: Face

I went to Mexico not too long ago and my cousins where asking "Tienes un Face?" (literally translates to do you have a face) This, of course, left me with a quizzical look , to which they clarified that "Face" means Facebook in Spanish (at least in Mexico). Would this be considered as an Pseudo-anglicism, and if so should it be added?108.200.32.96 (talk) 22:24, 12 December 2013 (UTC)

German: prepaid

Googling for "prepaid phone" shows a lot of hits on American and British sites, with "prepaid" used in the same context as it's used in German. Is the word really a pseudo-anglicism or just an anglicism? 2001:6F8:1C00:1E9:0:0:0:2 (talk) 17:15, 20 March 2014 (UTC)

I'm removing "prepaid". That definitely shouldn't be on this list, as you say it's a common term in English, there's nothing pseudo- about it. It's even the term used in the title of the English-language Wikipedia article (Prepaid mobile phone). 92.225.239.102 (talk) 15:28, 10 May 2014 (UTC)

Greek: jean - denim

"Jean" means denim in English too, so "jean" isn't a pseudo-anglicism in Greek. — 146.179.8.133 (talk) 14:22, 29 May 2014 (UTC)

German

I don't know how editing on this list is handled. But, as a german naitive speaker, I would ask for proof for some of the examples, as I highly doubt regular use.

  • Foil – PowerPoint slide
I second this. The very common way to refer to (presentation software) slides is "Folie" (transparency), as in German, the metaphor used in such software is not a slide projector with slides of photos, but an overhead projector with transparencies. 129.69.215.38 (talk) 09:14, 27 February 2015 (UTC)

No one to be taken seriously would ever use this word. What should it even mean?

I removed that entry --2A02:810C:C7C0:5E68:34EA:625A:C870:D0D8 (talk) 13:13, 5 September 2017 (UTC)
  • Musicbox – jukebox

Is probably outdated in the same way as jukeboxes are ;) Modern people say jukebox by the way. Musicbox was (is?) a brand producing jukeboxes.

  • Punker, Punky – a punk

Punker is the same word in Englisch and German, only that in German it gets the appropriate ending "er". This shouldn't be in this list. Punky doesn't even exist.

  • Shorty – shorts

Really, I doubt usage.

  • Trainer - manager (in sports)

Trainer is more like coach I would say. Or is manager a synonym for coach?

The "Beamer" is missing with the english meaning "projector". --130.149.12.207 (talk) 16:03, 12 August 2014 (UTC)

Let me clarify my comment on "Shorty": the German word for "shorts" is "Shorts". --130.149.12.207 (talk) 16:17, 12 August 2014 (UTC)
Duden knows "Shorty" & "Musicbox": www.duden.de/rechtschreibung/Shorty & www.duden.de/rechtschreibung/Musicbox . | Beamer is present (in "Multiple languages" & in "German"). -80.133.122.202 (talk) 16:26, 20 December 2014 (UTC)

Is the German usage of Fitness distinct from that listed in the multiple languages section? —Tamfang (talk) 19:57, 20 December 2014 (UTC)

  • Multiple languages: "Fitness (Brazilian Portuguese, Danish, Dutch, Finnish, French, Italian, Polish, Romanian, Russian, Serbo-Croatian Spanish, Turkish) – fitness training as a kind of gymnastics"
  • German: "(to do) Fitness – workout in a gym"
I doubt that "(to do) Fitness" or more likely "Fitness machen" is limited to gyms, i.e. one can do Fitness at other places too. Also "(to do) Fitness" might simply be "Fitness" at times, e.g. in sentences like "Do you like Fitness?" ("Magst Du Fitness?" or "Was hälst Du von Fitness?"). So it might be the same. -80.133.100.183 (talk) 15:48, 21 December 2014 (UTC)

So... Roastbeef is a "pseudo-anglicism" for... roast beef?

??? -- megA (talk) 23:52, 23 April 2015 (UTC)

In case of German it's most likely Roastbeef = roast beef and not a pseudo-anglicism. In case of other languages roast beef (just also?) means Brit. [Cristiano Furiassi & Henrik Gottlieb (edd.): Pseudo-English: Studies on False Anglicisms in Europe. Series: Language Contact and Bilingualism [LCB] 9. Walter de Gruyter, 2015, p.11. Quote: "in Romanian (and French, its source) roastbeef is used as a nickname to refer to "the English"] -02:02, 17 June 2015 (UTC) — Preceding unsigned comment added by 80.133.107.138 (talk)

Home office

In Wiktionary it has been regarded as a proper English word by a native speaker (I’m not). Are there any more opinions or even better—sources? --Chricho ∀ (talk) 11:08, 5 May 2016 (UTC)

I removed the German "Homeoffice" from the list because "home office" is widely used in English and has the same meaning. --104.153.230.33 (talk) 18:06, 12 February 2017 (UTC)

Who deleted the "Filipino languages" section here?

Despite that English is one of the official languages of the Philippines, English is never our native language, our native languages are mostly Austronesian-based (Tagalog, Cebuano, Maranao, Hiligaynon, etc.) ! Please restore that section please! To those people who were telling that English is one of our NATIVE languages, good luck! English was brought by the colonizers, especially the Americans!

16BUANG (talk) 07:01, 20 August 2016 (UTC)

Move list to Wiktionary

I suggest moving this list over to Wiktionary, into the appendix. It would make it easier to link to individual entries and provide other features such as automatic transliteration for non-Latin words. See wikt:Appendix:A_Clockwork_Orange for an example of a list moved from Wikipedia (a while ago though). – Jberkel (talk) 21:41, 29 August 2017 (UTC)

Retrieved from "https://wiki.riteme.site/w/index.php?title=Talk:Pseudo-anglicism/Archive_1&oldid=1248743970"