Talk:Priceville, Ontario

Controversy Regarding Founding of Priceville

I rewrote one section of the article because I had a sense that the historical controversy surrounding the alleged racist practices of the incoming 19th and early 20th century Europeans pertaining to black settlers in the area was being deliberately 'down played' in the article, to a certain extent. Although unfortunate incidents like these are never something to be proud of and it is understandable that no community wishes to 'air its dirty laundry' in an online encyclopedia, the integrity of Wikipedia as a reliable source of information demands that obfuscation in exactly these sorts of potentially 'sensitive' issues take a back seat to historical accuracy. Deconstructhis 07:31, 24 September 2007 (UTC)

To be honest, there was no deliberate down playing. As a former resident of Durham, a grew up around an area that is proud of its involvement and participation in the underground railroad. Priceville and its population of roughly a hundred or so people may very well have been an African-American settlement at one point, but most of what is known about the village is purely speculation. One thing I can do, when I head home around Christmastime is grab a very old hard cover text about the founding of Priceville and surrounding area that was owned by my late grandfather (probably published between 1955 and 1970) that focuses on the community and its creation (that is if my parents haven't trashed it by now). I am also concerned about the external link that is linked to the article to be honest, I am concerned that it is a misrepresentation of the truth. Allegations are not proof, that is what I am saying. DMighton 08:17, 24 September 2007 (UTC)

As for the source on the underground railroad, despite physically seeing the sign half a kilometer from where I grew up, I cannot find a photo of it. So, I searched and found an interesting article about a man who followed, by bicycle, a route from Mobile, Alabama to Owen Sound, Ontario (40 KM North of Durham/Flesherton) in an effort to retrace the steps of other African-American slaves. I have added this as a source. I believe this is satisfactory. DMighton 08:29, 24 September 2007 (UTC) -- I must add, the significance of Owen Sound is that other than Hwy #6 through Durham, there is no other direct route North to Owen Sound. Just throwing that out there to you. DMighton 08:35, 24 September 2007 (UTC)

About the Washington Post link. The allegations are kind of weird. At one point they are saying that the white people drove them out... and then at another point they are saying that local blacks and whites participated in enough interracial marriages that no one in the community knows if they are part black. The two points seem to contradict. Also, I am not comfortable with the generalization that because a 1930's farmer (and private land owner) plowed over a black funeral plot... that "The Priceville area was... in some ways the Deep South of the North." Sorry to ramble, but to talk about this unfortunate graveyard incident, then to make such far reaching comment like Priceville people are just like people of the Deep South, and then to talk about slavery as if it was the issue in Priceville is extremely misleading. Yes, slavery was a huge issue in North America... mostly in the South but it did extend into the region that would be later known as Canada... but the issue in Priceville was the destruction of a graveyard in the 1930s and the question as to whether or not current residents have any African-American blood. DMighton 08:56, 24 September 2007 (UTC)

Please don't remove source books that other editors place for reference purposes without at least consulting them first on the discussion page regarding their context and the reasoning behind their addition. The one which you removed (and which I'm going to replace later today) is a book whose topic in general terms is black history in Canada, thus the mention of the 'early years' and Nova Scotia, but it also contains specific information regarding the geographical area we're talking about. Don't underestimate the amount of current academically based historical research thats been undertaken on this topic pertaining to Grey County and the rest of Ontario over the past few years. There have been a growing number of professionally researched books and articles published dealing with this subject. My advice to you is not to put too much store in ordinary newspaper and magazine articles regarding historical matters, the average journalist picks and chooses, a lot of the time based strictly on online sources without much depth. Which doesn't mean that aspects of what they're writing about aren't correct from a historians point of view, but it can sometimes mean that they draw incorrect inferences from their limited sources based on faulty premises they've assumed because of their inexperience with the subject matter. You know, like when history nerds like me try to write pieces on say.......hockey.:) I'm intending on adding more source books to this article dealing specifically with Grey County later today or tommorow. One last thing. It's always a good idea to try and remain as objective as possible with this stuff, it's tough to do when it's your home town that's under discussion, but remember it's nothing personal, I've got no axes to grind here, but I'm not prepared to obfuscate historical matters only because it makes some folks uncomfortable either. Deconstructhis 09:55, 24 September 2007 (UTC)

I only removed the source because it seemed to only be a reference point for that Washington Post article's slavery tie in. If it is relevant to the subject, then I have no qualms with reverting it. I am not attempting to underestimate the amount of modern literature there may be on the subject, but I do contend that the Washington Post article reads more like anti-race propaganda than history. Also, it is never too late to learn about hockey.  ;) DMighton 12:00, 24 September 2007 (UTC)

I'm afraid it actually *may* be too late for me DMighton, I understand the basic game, but unless I personally know at least some of the players involved, it seldom holds my interest. I accept your concerns about the Washington Post article and in my opinion, it should not and will not form the only basis for interpreting the social history of 'race relations' in the area for this Wikipedia article. Emotions run high on these topics sometimes and I think that article reflects the strength of those emotions, but as I said, keep in mind that it's a magazine/newspaper article written by a journalist, not an historian. I fully intend on adding more mainstream history sources over time in order to substantiate a position acceptable to mainstream historians in the field. Deconstructhis 20:20, 24 September 2007 (UTC)

Sounds great to me. It would be nice to have a detailed history of Priceville. Obviously, I am still going to try and dig up that old book about the village, but I won't be able to get to it until probably Jan or Feb. The many different and small communities of Grey County always seem to have neat histories and I hope that one by one they get shared on a more public forum. DMighton 20:36, 24 September 2007 (UTC)

Hills of Glenelg - Ebook

I am the author of a 1200 page history EBOOK for Glenelg & parts of Artemesia where the Durham Road Settlement existed. IMHO it is the most comprehensive history of the area and that group of Black Pioneers. I have documented all Black families who lived in south Grey County, Ontario. The goal of my research is to record local history. It is unfortunate that this Priceville story is so tainted by racial activists from afar who just don't have the story right --- alas the INTERNET could be so useful.

R. Clark www.aberdeendigitalarchiving.com —Preceding unsigned comment added by 216.183.141.42 (talk) 04:41, 7 April 2008 (UTC)

If you wish to, please go ahead and edit the Priceville, Ontario page to fix applicable errors. Because of the apparent sensitivity of the case, please be sure to reference any facts that may go under the microscope. DMighton (talk) 08:07, 7 April 2008 (UTC)