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I had not heard the suggestion that Pengwern was a kingdom (or country) rather than a place. If this has seriously been suggested, can we have a precise reference? Peterkingiron (talk) 16:52, 26 November 2008 (UTC)[reply]
You are quite right. This is the problem with this and a number of other related articles. Pengwern is quite clearly described as the site of Cynddylan's llys (court) in the Heledd poems. Trouble is there are a lot of rather unreliable websites out there which people like to quote. To refer to Pengwern as a kingdom is like talking of the "Kingdom of Aberffraw" or the "Kingdom of Dinefwr"! Enaidmawr (talk) 23:54, 26 November 2008 (UTC)[reply]
As an Englishman, I am not familiar with Welsh literature, and only know of these matters from secondary or tertiary sources. I hope you can prune out the speculative material, as you have so well on Ewyas. Peterkingiron (talk) 15:19, 27 November 2008 (UTC)[reply]
I've taken out all the 'kingdom' stuff until we can find a reliable source. I've researched all this once before and found nothing reliable (well, there is a 'big book of Arthurian stuff' that seems to mention it, but that's not good enough. If anyone can find a reliable source, then by all means put it in. dougweller (talk) 16:05, 27 November 2008 (UTC)[reply]
'Arthurian stuff' is not a reliable source for history. If there is something in it worth including, it should be in a separate section entitled "Arthurian Legend", but I doubt there is anything substantial enough for that. Peterkingiron (talk) 18:09, 27 November 2008 (UTC)[reply]
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