Talk:Patriotic Party (Turkey)

	Politics portal This article is within the scope of WikiProject Politics, a collaborative effort to improve the coverage of politics on Wikipedia. If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join the discussion and see a list of open tasks.PoliticsWikipedia:WikiProject PoliticsTemplate:WikiProject Politicspolitics
???	This article has not yet received a rating on the project's importance scale.
	This article is supported by Political parties task force.

Turkey

	Turkey portal This article is within the scope of WikiProject Turkey, a collaborative effort to improve the coverage of Turkey and related topics on Wikipedia. If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join the discussion and see a list of open tasks.TurkeyWikipedia:WikiProject TurkeyTemplate:WikiProject TurkeyTurkey
???	This article has not yet received a rating on the project's importance scale.

Translation of the name

I am not sure how accurate is the translation of the name. "Vatan" literally means "the nation" and does not imply patriotism on it's own. A literal translation would be "Party of the Nation" OganM (talk) 06:47, 9 April 2015 (UTC)[reply]

I totally agree on that. Vatan translates to Homeland and Patriotic translates to Vatansever. Vatan describes an entity, while Vatansever refers to people. The correct translation of Vatan Partisi should be Homeland Party, — Preceding unsigned comment added by Senocak (talk • contribs) 02:51, 10 January 2017 (UTC)[reply]

Official translation is "Patriotic Party", which you can also see on its website. --Dijkstra (talk) 14:27, 31 October 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Pislikeller (talk) 14:55, 29 September 2021 (UTC)https://wiki.riteme.site/w/index.php?title=Talk:Patriotic_Party_(Turkey)&action=edit[reply]

I totally agree, I find the official translation pretty absurd, "Vatan" means homeland in Turkish and doesn't imply any kind of nationalism and can even be used in ancient contexts, if the party was called "Patriotic Party" then the Turkish name would simply be "Vatansever Parti" Pislikeller (talk) 14:55, 29 September 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Agreed - The name of this article should be Homeland Party (Turkey) 46.69.121.29 (talk) 12:10, 5 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Neutrality of this article is disputed.

Sorry for entering to Wikipedia website but this article has neutrality dispute. Do you seriously think this party is russophile? I think that this edit is subjective. I hope I am not violating Wikipedia Terms of Use. ArgonGolden (talk) 13:44, 5 September 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Sorry. I meant fully russophile because what I know that this party is Eurasianist. ArgonGolden (talk) 14:19, 5 September 2022 (UTC)[reply]

A little late, but yes. The party is openly Russophile, and is basically the only major party (major enough to field a presidential candidate anyway) in Turkey that unequivocally supports Russia's war on Ukraine. Uness232 (talk) 05:30, 22 March 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Ideologies

Mostly for @Helper201, you seem to be suggesting that party programs are unusable as sources since they are not independent. I would disagree with this, but beyond that, here is a source that is already in the article which defines the party as left-wing nationalist/socialist:

from Türkiye’de Partilerin Milliyetçilik ve Din Anlayışları:

Özetle Vatan Partisi tüzüğünde ideolojik olarak ciddi milliyetçi öğelere yer vermiştir. İdeolojik bağlamının Kemalist sol milliyetçiliğe uyduğu da göz önüne alındığında, tüzük ile bağlam arasında güçlü bir örtüşme olduğu söylenebilir. (To summarize, the Patriotic Party has included significant nationalist elements in its statute. Considering that its ideological framework conforms to Kemalist left-wing nationalism, it can be said that there is a strong overlap between the this statute and the party's political context.) Uness232 (talk) 02:13, 21 March 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Left-wing nationalism is an ideology. To use this as justification for the party's political position, I think, falls under WP:SYNTH. We need a reliable independent source that explicitly states the party's political position. Helper201 (talk) 19:14, 21 March 2023 (UTC)[reply]

I would still disagree and say that in many cases political positions are inferred from ideology here on Wikipedia; even more common is, in cases where other sources don't exist, political positions can often be tied to the party's own words. Right or wrong, I don't know. Either way. Here's a source that defines the party as leftist. Is it the best source, probably not. But it is better than most of the sources on this article. Uness232 (talk) 05:26, 22 March 2023 (UTC)[reply]