Talk:Pair skating/GA1

GA Review

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Reviewer: Sportsfan77777 (talk · contribs) 15:36, 29 September 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Made it within a month! (just barely)

Lead

I suggest including the definition in the first sentence, such as "Pair skating is a figure skating discipline defined by the International Skating Union (ISU) as "the skating of two persons in unison who perform their movements in such harmony with each other as to give the impression of genuine Pair Skating as compared with independent Single Skating"."
1908 Olympic Games ===>>> 1908 Summer Olympic Games

Above items done.

Only the first attempt of an element is scored. <<<=== Is this a common enough issue to include it in the lead?

Removed.

I suggest adding the higher injury risk associated with pair skating to the lead.

Added. Christine (Figureskatingfan) (talk) 18:19, 2 November 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Background

1908 Olympic Games ===>>> 1908 Summer Olympic Games
Madge Syers is introduced twice in different ways, and overlinked
continued throughout the 1900s ===>>> continued throughout the rest of the 1900s OR continued throughout the second half of the century
In 1988, The New York Times reported that since the 1964 Olympics in Innsbruck, Soviet pair teams had won gold medals in seven consecutive Olympics. ===>>> Soviet pair teams won gold medals in seven consecutive Olympics from 1964 in Innsbruck to 1988 in Calgary. (This isn't an opinion. You don't need to state who reported it.)

Above points addressed.

Silby estimates that due to the lack of effective communication, there is a "six-fold increase in the risk of national-level figure skating teams splitting" <<<=== I suggest clarifying "[pair] figure skating teams" in the quote. And do you what the six-fold increase is compared to?

The source doesn't compare it to anything, which is one of the reasons why I used a direct quote. I made the clarification as per your request by adding the phrase "among pairs teams" before the comma. Christine (Figureskatingfan) (talk) 18:44, 2 November 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Short program

2014-2015 season ===>>> 2014–2015 season (Note: the dash is wrong.)
In the note, 2018-2019 has the same dash issue.

Both fixed. Christine (Figureskatingfan) (talk) 18:50, 2 November 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Free skating

up to three lifts ===>>> up to three pair lifts
I suggest changing all of the "only"s to "exactly"s here.
highest pairs free skating program ===>>> highest pair free skating program

Done. Christine (Figureskatingfan) (talk) 04:23, 3 November 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Competition elements

Pair skating required elements include lifts ===>>> Pair skating required elements include pair lifts

Done. Christine (Figureskatingfan) (talk) 04:25, 3 November 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Pair lifts

The elements performed by pairs teams ===>>> The elements performed by pair teams
categorized by their level of difficulty ===>>> categorized in order of increasing level of difficulty
2019-2020 season ===>>> 2019–2020 season
Group-Five shouldn't have a dash (There are two instances with a dash.)
and a dance lift ===>>> or a dance lift
only through hand-to-hand ===>>> through hand-to-hand (only is already used at the beginning of the sentence)

Done. Christine (Figureskatingfan) (talk) 04:32, 3 November 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Twist lifts

There are no limits to the numbers of revolutions executed ===>>> There is no limit to the number of revolutions executed

Done. Christine (Figureskatingfan) (talk) 04:34, 3 November 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Solo jumps

Pairs teams, both juniors and seniors ===>>> Pair teams, both juniors and seniors
and any kind of double or triple jump for seniors ===>>> or any kind of double or triple jump for seniors
Note 7 can just be in the prose.
execute a Euler ===>>> execute an Euler
When the Euler is performed separately, it is considered an unlisted jump. <<<=== What is an unlisted jump? (or maybe just call it a "non-listed jump" to assert it is the same as what is described later in the section.)
They are allowed, however, to execute the same two jumps ===>>> Teams are allowed, however, to execute the same two jumps
leaves the ice ===>>> leave the ice

Above points addressed. Christine (Figureskatingfan) (talk) 05:01, 3 November 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Throw jumps

A throw jump is judged as a jump with a higher revolution ===>>> A throw jump is judged as a jump with a higher number of revolutions

Done. Christine (Figureskatingfan) (talk) 05:06, 3 November 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Solo spins

I suggest beginning this section with an explanation of the difference between a "solo spin combination" and a "spin combination".

It's a good suggestion, but the problem is that I can't find a definition anywhere for either spin. The ISU Communications and publications by U.S. Figure Skating don't even define them, probably because they assume that people will know what they are, anyway. Perhaps when I improve the articles about spins I'll find something, but for now, I don't think it's out there. Christine (Figureskatingfan) (talk) 03:58, 4 November 2019 (UTC)[reply]

I think I figured it out. Solo spin combinations are done by just one partner at a time; spin combinations are done by both at the same time. Is that correct? Sportsfan77777 (talk) 06:18, 5 November 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Yah, that's about right. Let's not include it, though, because although the ISU thinks it's self-evident, it obviously isn't, which is why they never define. Perhaps I can find sources for it later, and then I'll add it at that time. ;) Christine (Figureskatingfan) (talk) 23:26, 5 November 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Spins

Okay.

Death spirals

2019-2020 season ===>>> 2019–2020 season

Got it. Christine (Figureskatingfan) (talk) 03:59, 4 November 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Step sequences

and minimum variety at least five difficult turns and steps ===>>> and a minimum variety of at least five difficult turns and steps
The workload between the partners must be even and will help them earn more points ===>>> The workload between the partners must be even to help them earn more points

Above two points addressed.

Both partners must execute the combinations of difficult turns at the same time and with a clear rhythm and continuous flow, although they do not have to execute the same kind of turns, but without the free foot touching the ice. <<<=== It's not clear how the last fragment (but without...) links to the rest of the sentence.

You're right; it wasn't very clear, so I moved the last fragment to after the comma following the word "flow". I think that clarifies it. Christine (Figureskatingfan) (talk) 04:06, 4 November 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Choreographic sequences

when the teams begins to prepare to execute the next element ===>>> when the team begins to prepare to execute the next element

Got it. Christine (Figureskatingfan) (talk) 04:08, 4 November 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Falls

Both members of a pair skating team have received broken noses ===>>> Both members of a pair skating team can receive broken noses

Done.

Pair skaters have 1.83 injuries per athlete <<<=== Is this over a year or a career?

The source doesn't state that information. I could go look at the primary source, but wouldn't that go against WP:PRIMARY? I mean, there are times when we have to for figure skating articles, of course, but in this case, I'm not sure it'd be appropriate.

A study conducted in 1989 found that ice dancers and s, during a nine-month period of time, experienced serious injuries <<<=== I think something is missing at the end here.

I'm not sure what you mean. The sentence doesn't end for a while.

It doesn't makes sense to just say "pair skaters experienced serious injuries" because it doesn't specify for instance what fraction of the skaters in the study experienced those injuries (was it all of them?). It might be better for example to say, "A study conducted in 1989 found that ice dancers and pair skaters, during a nine-month period of time, could experience serious injuries" or "A study conducted in 1989 found that ice dancers and pair skaters, during a nine-month period of time, were at great risk to experience serious injuries" or the opposite, if there is only a low or moderate risk. Sportsfan77777 (talk) 06:16, 5 November 2019 (UTC)[reply]

I understand, but the trouble is the source doesn't specify that. The source just states that ice dancers and pair skaters have serious injuries and that female pair skaters have more injuries than men, but doesn't go into the study's sample size, probably because the authors didn't think it was important enough to mention. If they didn't think it was important enough, neither should we. Christine (Figureskatingfan) (talk) 04:40, 6 November 2019 (UTC)[reply]

They can lose five points if they can resume their program three minutes after the interruption begins. <<<=== Does the clock stop with an interruption? I imagine if three minutes out of a four minute program pass, the team will not have time to do much in the little remaining time.

Isn't that self-evident? When they resume, they have as much time as the rest of their programs allows. IOW, if skaters have an interruption at the three-minute mark, they resume from that point until the remaining time ends. I could refer to the rule in the technical rules (#515, S&IP/ID 2018, pp. 90-93).

Let's say I have a 20-second interruption at 1 minute into my 4 minute program. Does that mean I have until 4 minutes and 20 seconds to complete my program? Or does that mean I have to squeeze the final 3 minutes into only 2 minutes and 40 seconds (accounting for the 20 seconds lost in the interruption)? Sportsfan77777 (talk) 06:30, 5 November 2019 (UTC)[reply]

I assume it means that if I stop my program at one minute, I can resume after my interruption ends and complete the last three minutes of my four-minute program. I have to resume my program at the point of my interruption; I can't redo it from the beginning or start at a later point. However, the source (the ISU) doesn't state that; it just assumes that its readers understand it without explanation. Christine (Figureskatingfan) (talk) 04:40, 6 November 2019 (UTC)[reply]

ISU rules leaves stopping ===>>> ISU rules leave stopping

Done. Christine (Figureskatingfan) (talk) 04:28, 4 November 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Time

If the program's duration is completed less than 30 or more seconds early, skaters will receive no points for any elements performed during that time. <<<=== The wording for this is off. (Which time? Is it after the program is completed?)

It's not very clear in the source, either. I changed the wording, so hopefully it's better now: "The pair team receive no points if the duration of their program is completed less than 30 seconds or more seconds early." Christine (Figureskatingfan) (talk) 04:39, 4 November 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Music

Okay.

Clothing

1994-1995 season ===>>> 1994–1995 season

Fixed. Christine (Figureskatingfan) (talk) 04:41, 4 November 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Overall

Most of the dashes should be this one: –, not this one: -, or this one: —

I believe that I fixed all instances mentioned.

No dab links.
Everything looks sourced.
No real plagiarism concerns (the detector mostly just caught quotes).
No external links.
All of the links work, except this one: Special Regulations & Technical Rules Synchronized Skating 2018

Yes, I fixed the link. The ISU tends to move around documents like this; it's an issue to address in most of the figure skating articles I've worked on for the last 1.5 years. That's what comes from working on articles about a topic in which things (like rules) change regularly, especially each year.

I didn't see the link change, but I switched it for an archived version of the 2018 edition. The current edition for 2019 is easy to find online too. Sportsfan77777 (talk) 06:22, 5 November 2019 (UTC)[reply]

I misunderstood you, my bad. Earlier versions of this article used the source, but currently, it does not. I removed it from the "Works cited" section. Christine (Figureskatingfan) (talk) 04:46, 6 November 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Overall, looks good! The most major comments I think are the first sentence of the lead, and explaining the difference between solo spins and spins. Placing on hold. Sportsfan77777 (talk) 19:48, 27 October 2019 (UTC)[reply]

@Sportsfan77777: And I think that I've addressed all your comments, although we can discuss the spins issue. ;) Thanks for the review. Christine (Figureskatingfan) (talk) 04:48, 4 November 2019 (UTC)[reply]

@Figureskatingfan: I asked for a few clarifications above. Hopefully, that will sort everything else out. Sportsfan77777 (talk) 06:33, 5 November 2019 (UTC)[reply]

@Sportsfan77777: I think I addressed your further clarifications. Christine (Figureskatingfan) (talk) 04:46, 6 November 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Okay, that's fair. I would lean towards saying you can interpret the definitions of "spins" and "solo spins" from how they describe the scoring for each, but I can understand why you don't want to do that. Passing! Sportsfan77777 (talk) 06:02, 6 November 2019 (UTC)[reply]