Talk:Orel Hershiser/GA1

GA Review

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Reviewer: TonyTheTiger (talk · contribs) 06:22, 17 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]

I will do this review although I am now thoroughly disappointed. I had been told at one time that he went to the same Junior High School that I did. This article says he moved from suburban Buffalo as a youth. Hopefully, I will find out some interesting things about one of my favorite pitchers.--TonyTheTiger (T / C / WP:FOUR / WP:CHICAGO / WP:WAWARD) 06:22, 17 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]

WP:LEAD

The LEAD does not summarize the article.
- It omits his youth and minor league career, which both have substantial amounts of prose.--TonyTheTiger (T / C / WP:FOUR / WP:CHICAGO / WP:WAWARD) 04:09, 18 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]
- It also neglects to mention that he is an author.--TonyTheTiger (T / C / WP:FOUR / WP:CHICAGO / WP:WAWARD) 04:09, 18 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]
- It may overstate his poker career. PokerStars has a lot of high profile athletes (Like Rafael Nadal) that know how to play poker on its payroll. He has no WSOP cashes, no EPT cashes, only one NAPT cash. He is not listed at {{Team PokerStars}}. He is a celebrity poker spokesperson in my mind rather than a professional poker player. In truth we should go by the secondary sources. Do you have any sources that describe him as a professional poker player? Also note that January will mark 4 years since his last notable in the money finish, according to Hendon Mob.--TonyTheTiger (T / C / WP:FOUR / WP:CHICAGO / WP:WAWARD) 04:09, 18 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]
- Note that since Black Friday (poker), he may not even be a poker spokesperson any more. (You would need to show he has foreign residences for this to still be a possibility, although recently Nevada residents got back the right to play online.)--TonyTheTiger (T / C / WP:FOUR / WP:CHICAGO / WP:WAWARD) 04:38, 18 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]
- LEAD needs to mention BGSU and Top prospect award.--TonyTheTiger (T / C / WP:FOUR / WP:CHICAGO / WP:WAWARD) 04:41, 18 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Early life

You might not be able answer all of these questions, but maybe I can prompt some further detail.--TonyTheTiger (T / C / WP:FOUR / WP:CHICAGO / WP:WAWARD) 04:38, 18 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]
Hershiser played in Little League Baseball until he was 12. - what age did he start?--TonyTheTiger (T / C / WP:FOUR / WP:CHICAGO / WP:WAWARD) 04:38, 18 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]
Did any of his hockey teammates become professional players?--TonyTheTiger (T / C / WP:FOUR / WP:CHICAGO / WP:WAWARD) 04:38, 18 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]
Freshman, Junior Varsity and junior Year do not need to be capitalized.--TonyTheTiger (T / C / WP:FOUR / WP:CHICAGO / WP:WAWARD) 04:38, 18 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]
Split up "Hershiser received only a partial scholarship from Bowling Green State University, and he barely played his freshman year and was academically ineligible as sophomore."--TonyTheTiger (T / C / WP:FOUR / WP:CHICAGO / WP:WAWARD) 04:38, 18 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]
"He grew and gained some weight" How about some before and after sizes (English and metric with {{convert}}).--TonyTheTiger (T / C / WP:FOUR / WP:CHICAGO / WP:WAWARD) 04:38, 18 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]
Did he play any other position than pitcher in college?--TonyTheTiger (T / C / WP:FOUR / WP:CHICAGO / WP:WAWARD) 04:38, 18 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]
"added speed" give us MPH info with this statement if you have it.--TonyTheTiger (T / C / WP:FOUR / WP:CHICAGO / WP:WAWARD) 04:38, 18 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]
The college section needs to associate itself with years. When was he a frosh, soph, junior, etc. Did the no-hitter come as a senior? Did his return home cause him to lose a year?--TonyTheTiger (T / C / WP:FOUR / WP:CHICAGO / WP:WAWARD) 04:38, 18 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]
Did he play his senior year--TonyTheTiger (T / C / WP:FOUR / WP:CHICAGO / WP:WAWARD) 04:38, 18 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]
Tell us about the no-hitter. Was it a complete game? Shutout? Where was the game played? Did Kent state have any future professional players?--TonyTheTiger (T / C / WP:FOUR / WP:CHICAGO / WP:WAWARD) 04:38, 18 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Minor league career

IIRC 3.71 ERA was pretty good for the PCL in this era. Also given that he was the top rookie, I am wondering if he was ever named to a minor league all-star game.--TonyTheTiger (T / C / WP:FOUR / WP:CHICAGO / WP:WAWARD) 05:02, 18 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Major League career

Need to explain that the 1983 Los Angeles Dodgers season made the post season, but he was not on the post season roster.--TonyTheTiger (T / C / WP:FOUR / WP:CHICAGO / WP:WAWARD) 05:02, 18 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]
Since the 1983 Dodgers only won the division by three games, you should not that he broke into the league during a pennant race.--TonyTheTiger (T / C / WP:FOUR / WP:CHICAGO / WP:WAWARD) 05:28, 18 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]
He led the league in shutouts in 1984 and you don't mention it. Check the black ink at Baseball reference.--TonyTheTiger (T / C / WP:FOUR / WP:CHICAGO / WP:WAWARD) 05:28, 18 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]
You should note that his post season debut was against the Cardinals. That series was memorable. From what I can tell Hershisers first of over 1000 mentions in The New York Times talked about this series. I played dice baseball with the mid 80s Cardinals. Those rabbits were a nightmare for opposing teams. I am not suggesting you read 1000 NYT articles, but more detail is needed.--TonyTheTiger (T / C / WP:FOUR / WP:CHICAGO / WP:WAWARD) 05:28, 18 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]
You don't even mention 1987 and he led the league in innings and made his first All-star team.--TonyTheTiger (T / C / WP:FOUR / WP:CHICAGO / WP:WAWARD) 05:28, 18 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]
I am going to stop checking the prose here. This article can not be GA if you are not even mentioning his All-star seasons.--TonyTheTiger (T / C / WP:FOUR / WP:CHICAGO / WP:WAWARD)
P.S. Hershiser was 15-9 on the 96 Indians who made the post season. You should probably mention any season he played a major role in a team making the playoffs. In fact, for a pitcher of the 80s and 90s you should probably say something about almost every season.--TonyTheTiger (T / C / WP:FOUR / WP:CHICAGO / WP:WAWARD) 05:51, 18 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Records

Although the Dodgers had some great pitchers and good pitchers with great seasons, Hershiser may hold several significant team records.--TonyTheTiger (T / C / WP:FOUR / WP:CHICAGO / WP:WAWARD) 05:07, 18 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]
Hershiser may hold other major league records.--TonyTheTiger (T / C / WP:FOUR / WP:CHICAGO / WP:WAWARD) 05:07, 18 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]
Can you please check into this.--TonyTheTiger (T / C / WP:FOUR / WP:CHICAGO / WP:WAWARD) 05:07, 18 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Images

His main image needs to be reviewed. It seems to be identical to his Hendon Mob photo.--TonyTheTiger (T / C / WP:FOUR / WP:CHICAGO / WP:WAWARD) 04:19, 18 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]
The other image comes from Flickr, but it does not seem to be freely lisenced.--TonyTheTiger (T / C / WP:FOUR / WP:CHICAGO / WP:WAWARD) 04:19, 18 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]

This article needs some Major League Baseball Pitcher of the Month Award succession boxes. (See Barry Bonds' Major League Baseball Player of the Month Award boxes for formatting).--TonyTheTiger (T / C / WP:FOUR / WP:CHICAGO / WP:WAWARD) 04:51, 18 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]
It also needs some records succession boxes (see Bonds again). We know he holds at least one notable record (consecutive scoreless innings). He may hold others.--TonyTheTiger (T / C / WP:FOUR / WP:CHICAGO / WP:WAWARD) 04:51, 18 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]
For a pitcher who has led the league in wins, CGs, Shutouts, and Innings, we need some statistical championship succession boxes.--TonyTheTiger (T / C / WP:FOUR / WP:CHICAGO / WP:WAWARD) 04:54, 18 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]

I am FAILing this as non comprehensive. He is a three-time All-star and you did not even mention the first of these season (a season he led the league in innings pitched). A lot of work remains on this article.--TonyTheTiger (T / C / WP:FOUR / WP:CHICAGO / WP:WAWARD) 05:28, 18 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Man your tough... A few things here... the article actually DOES mention his first All-Star selection, it's in the last paragraph of the early years section... I don't really think his minor league career needs to be included in the lead.. a lot of the info you want on his earlylife i dont think is available, but i'll check into it... the images well.. they were there when i started on the article and i never really checked into them.. I am not a fan of excessive succession boxes on articles and they have gone rather out of style of late. I'll get back around to working on this article after the playoffs conclude. Spanneraol (talk) 16:20, 18 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]

I apologize, but I am a big fan of this guy. For decades, I have thought he went to my junior high school. In terms of the minors, it would be sufficient to say. "He spent X years in the Dodger farm system before breaking into the majors. After his final unsuccessful spring training he was named the top rookie." That would be sufficient. Hershiser is well known for the streak. A lot of it is outlined in stuff you can find here The streak deserves a substantive paragraph. (One could write a good article about the streak). The paragraph would go something like this. Hershiser allowed Joe Doe of X team to score in the Xth inning on Month DD. He then did not allow a run to score until John Doe scored in the Xth inning on Month DD. He faced X batters in this time. He passed (maybe it was Drysdale)'s former major league record of XX innings on such and such a play on Jerry Doe in the Xth inning on Month DD. The streak included 5 (I believe) consecutive complete game shutouts and was part of a streak of (I believe) 8 or 9 consecutive complete games. During the streak X batters were tagged or forced out at home plate. You would possibly want to describe each play. In addition if anyone went over the fence to bring one back, mention that. In the days following that streak there were no doubt lengthy articles about it. Also around the time he broke the prior record, there were also probably articles about it. Note that he ended the regular season with the streak in tact at 59 1/3. You may want to note that since he pitched the last 59 1/3 innings of the season without allowing a run, that there were debates on whether the streak continued (into the post season or next season). Note that he kept the streak alive with 10 shutout innings in what would be a 16 inning game in his last start of the season. I would note that the first run to score on him was unearned with two out in the first the following April 5. Also, note that Joe Doe above will likely be a HOFer before the record is broken and John Doe is one. I lived and breathed that streak. I was actively collecting baseball cards in 1988.--TonyTheTiger (T / C / WP:FOUR / WP:CHICAGO / WP:WAWARD) 09:39, 19 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]

This has my juices flowing. I think I may have asked you for a bit much. I think I will soon do a separate article for this streak.--TonyTheTiger (T / C / WP:FOUR / WP:CHICAGO / WP:WAWARD) 09:46, 19 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]