Talk:Northern Dvina

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Northern Dvina River

Originally (and still) known in Finno Ugrian languages as Vienanjoki (Finnish), Vienajog (Estonian), Vienajug (Komi) etc. On the mouth of Vienanjoki was old commercial settlement which grew to small town during 800s and named Vienankaupunki (Town of Viena). It was here Norwegian Viking Ottar visited during his journey to Perma (Bjarmia). Later Russians renamed it Archangel.

Vienanjoki ended to Vienanlahti (Bay of Viena) which is one of the three bays in Vienanmeri (Sea of Viena). Vienanmeri was renamed by the Pomors to White Sea becouse of the early morning sea fog which made the sea look as white. Sometimes in Finnish literature also mentioned as Valkeameri (White Sea), but the original name is Vienanmeri. The Russian Western Dvina is Väinäjoki (Latvian Daugava) and have nothing to do with name Vienanjoki. The Russians have always had problems with spelling of Finno Ugrian languages, thus this dual name for the Viena and Väinä Rivers.

JN

What does the word 'Viena' mean in Finno-Ugrian languages? `'юзырь:mikka 18:11, 18 June 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Vienajoki

Hei Mikkalai. This is the most trusteable version. Vienajoki = Vienojoki ( Quiet River ). Russian Dvina River might also have been originated from Latin Dividum flumen which appear first in 1200 European sources spreaded there by the Norsemen who traded with the Karelians, Veps and Komi-murts in Vienankaupunki and even by that time important trading center Joensuu (River Mouth) locatad in the confluence of Suhona and Jug Rivers and inhabited by Komi-murts, Veps and Taipaleentakaiset Tshuudit (Savolotshij Tshudj). Thus, if this trade center was mentioned in early Russian chronicles as early as 1207 it must mean this Jug = River suu = mouth.

According to Finnish historical sources the Novgorodians made fur robbary raids to Vienajoki in 1042 (attack against the Jams), 1078, 1123, 1187, 1212, 1217, 1220, 1222, 1265, 1324 when the Novgorodians managed to conquer Joensuu for five year period and it become Ustjug. However, there was a general uprisings and conflicts against Novgorod in 1329, 1333, 1337 and 1342 when Novgorod at last gained control of Joensuu / Ustjug.

JN

Aren't the Finnish Viena and Väinä simply from Dviena? cf. Ranska from France 88.114.41.216 (talk) 17:06, 10 April 2016 (UTC)[reply]